Therapist Reacts to IT and Childhood Trauma

How can you overcome childhood trauma? And how can facing a scary clown help you with that?
Licensed therapist Jonathan Decker and filmmaker Alan Seawright discuss the journey of facing fears and confronting and overcoming trauma in the IT movies. They also talk about Jonathan's journey of learning to love horror movies, especially ones that are dark but still have heart and humanity, like this series. The phenomenal performances from the kids (especially Sophia Lillis, Finn Wolfhard, and Jack Dylan Grazer) in the cast really sell the whole thing, especially with how relatable it feels as they deal with bullying and other real-life struggles and fears, even if facing a psychotic supernatural clown is less realistic. We hope.
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For more of our thoughts about bullying and facing childhood trauma, check out this episode about Harry Potter: • HARRY POTTER vs. Bullies
Cinema Therapy is:
Written by: Megan Seawright, Jonathan Decker and Alan Seawright
Produced by: Jonathan Decker, Megan Seawright & Alan Seawright
Edited by: David Sant
Director of Photography: Bradley Olsen
English Transcription by: Anna Preis

[@CinemaTherapyShow]

The subscription box for Lisa's will be live soon! You can get some popcorn here now: lisaspopcorn.com and a subscription box soon!

[@shinca5044]

Can there be analysis on the following movies?: - The Neverending Story - Other Disney films - Narnia series/the books - Some horror films - Any movies that can show ways of radical positive encouragement that is highly successful - Films showing ways to make positive relationships with other cultures/races and creating peace when there is high misunderstandings Your therapy analysis of films is very comforting for me. I'm wary of revealing anything which I can just reveal in the free therapy session. Thank you for your hard work, encouragements, and etc. Stay safe.

[@Sk8rToon]

Would the subscription mean shipment outside of UT?

[@JonathanDecker]

@@Sk8rToon it would

[@Icanhasacookie]

Yesss popcorn 🍿

[@JaeStories87]

@Cinema Therapy - Can y'all do an episode on Little Shop of Horrors? It has great examples of domestic abuse and manipulation of both Audrey (with her bf) and Seymour (with Audrey II... and him withholding the truth from Audrey and Mushnik). I just watched this movie again after several years and thought y'all could do good things with it. Would also love to see your thoughts on the theatrical ending vs the director's cut "intended" ending.

[@popppy113]

fun fact: all the child actors actually loved the actor playing it, Georgie loved him most. and its just so cute to see a little kid excited running up to a guy in scary clown makeup

[@Xehanort10]

Bill Skarsgard always made sure they were OK and not scared after filming a scene.

[@iclynnx]

@@Xehanort10 That's actually really sweet. I never thought about the filmmaking process of this movie, the fact that they had child actors performing in a horrific scene.

[@FREAKOFNATURE-mb8oo]

Unbelievably wholesome. Anyone have a clip?

[@LarixLyalliiAlpine]

The behind the scenes of Bill Skarsgard checking in with the kids while still in his It makeup and costume is 10/10 wholesome content. The actors who played the bullies also did the same with the younger actors - the whole set just seems like it was a nice one to be on

[@audrareese59521]

awww, that's so wholesome. this honestly just made me feel so happy

[@GenericRae]

"They're gazebo's!!" It's a powerful moment and it's great that he stood up to his mom... But blooming heck that was hilarious

[@trinaq]

Agreed, I burst out laughing the first time I heard the line, because of how seriously Eddie said it!

[@kellyalves756]

Exactly. It was simultaneously the silliest and most empowering thing Eddie said.

[@shelbyb9056]

Best part of the series. I use this line all the time.

[@kellyalves756]

@@carrots7216 For real?

[@HenshinFanatic]

@@billstephens396 oh no, you've awoken the dread gazebo!

[@ChantalOfTheNorth]

Fun fact: the child actors were able to choose, or at least have a very heavy hand in choosing, their adult counterparts. The casting for these films was perfection.

[@RoarTheRapper]

The thing I loved about that was how those adult actors hung out with their kid counterparts, and they all got to know each other.

[@Jah_LEASE_yah]

The adult actor who played Ben was by far the best casting. He looked almost eerily similar to the child actor to the point that they could have been siblings.

[@jajajasputin8927]

The actors for the villains were also super diligent in making sure their young costars were ok

[@Dante2056]

​@@Jah_LEASE_yahThe first time I watched these movies, I honestly had to check if they had digitally de-aged the adult actors, the casting was so good.

[@millartiste2d]

The clown himself is a beautifully done metaphor of trauma. The fact that it becomes powerless as soon as you stop fearing it, as soon as you realize that it's irrational and it's only as real as your brain makes it. After a long journey of self reflection and therapy one day you realize that the clown is powerless to harm you. I'm still fighting my clown, and I hope everyone fighting their own clown will succeed! I believe in you!

[@Mugruncher]

In the book I believe they defeat the clown with silver, because humanity has believed for a long time that silver protects against/hurts evil beings and belief is a powerful thing, especially against a metaphysical being So, one way to fight trauma is with a ritual or process that actively combats it, partly because you believe it will. I have anxiety stemming from trauma and my ritual is drinking water and also watering my garden. I just focus on the water. I think about it’s healing and rejuvenating properties. (Also it’s hard to do two things at once so drinking water helps prevent meltdowns by giving me something else to do). Other rituals to combat trauma might be writing in a journal or doing art or playing music or whatever, but the more you do it and believe in it the more effective it is. So, if you can’t fight the clown by simply deciding it’s not a problem, you can fight it with silver ie with something that actively combats it ✌️💖

[@Mugruncher]

But yes when they’re shouting “you’re just a clown, a mummy, a headless boy” they’re taking the fear/power OUT of their fears by rationalising them. There isn’t anything to fear from each of those things, in reality. None of those things can actually hurt you. So when the fear is rationalised it loses power. And that is also a powerful coping tool. Like, you might be traumatised from a shitty parent who put you down constantly for their own ego, making you feel like you deserved it. But as an adult, you can take the power out of the memory of their put downs by rationally analysing the situation. “A good parent doesn’t do that. Therefore I was not a bad child, they were a bad parent” This is a part of cognitive behavioural therapy, analysing and rationalising problematic thought patterns

[@99sins]

For me the clown aspect hit way harder with Tim Curry's performance. It's not just that it's trauma personified but that it's specifically a malicious clown. My experience with recollecting my trauma is always steeped in malicious playfulness, like a clown poking fun at your wounds. It's all funny jokes and laugh tracks to what is actually horrible shit that happened to me. It really hits home how little it's taken seriously to the point where you gaslight yourself that it's "not that bad" and "others have it worse so who am I to complain". Meanwhile the clown continues to laugh as it haunts you.

[@kieran5152]

Totally agree but I would love to add that the fear is rational but the courage itself is a weapon against it. It can hurt them but the courage to face trauma and not give your life to it is so much more powerful

[@babybug6462]

I used to be in a abusive relationship. And during that time, I had panic attacks and fear that would always linger wherever I would go. My last panic attack happened two years ago. But my worst panic attack was at the public library. It was the worst, crippling fear i had ever experienced. For the longest time, I refused to go to a library. And if I did, I wouldn't stay for long. Until I realized that it's just a library. I moved back to my hometown across the country and I gotten over my fear and my anxiety.

[@seaborgium919]

I wish more people understood that about trigger warnings. It's not necessarily so someone can avoid something, but it's so they can brace for it and be informed when they're moving into it

[@acelovesdiyschristopher7023]

Amen. It should be normalized to have them

[@CordeliaWagner]

🛡🗡

[@graceharney7352]

i understand about trigger warnings, but life doesn't give trigger warnings. you gotta be tough and ready and determined at all times if you want to make it. sometimes we fail or fall, but we have to get back up and learn how to survive.

[@acelovesdiyschristopher7023]

@@graceharney7352 trigger warnings are not just psychological but also for epileptics. And bracing for the trigger is tough. It's a way to get thru it and that's one of the toughest things around.

[@EyeGlassTrainofMind]

@@graceharney7352 so it's not about being tough, but about being warned and life does give warnings that bad things or triggering things are going to happen sometimes and that's often embedded in context. However, when in the course of a presentation, the audience doesn't have the leg up on much context so it's the presenter's job to be aware of that and provide it when possible out of consideration for their audience. Life also isn't about "bootstrapping"; we live in a world where most things are out of our control and if we're so overly self-dependent, then when we do actually need help or support or further context to handle something, we're less primed to ask for it.

[@erin1569]

I see the ending not as "bullying the bully" but "bullying the trauma", they overcome it. The curse goes away because they can remember their memories without feeling _broken._

[@MonyXChan]

Right? Pennywise isn't just a person they are "bullying" back, they are standing up against IT, standing their ground. To me, you can't bully evil.

[@nikksmtey]

@@MonyXChan I completely agree. I don't think you can bully a paranormal creature or something that's pure evil. So my take on that scene is exactly that. They stood up against their fear.

[@neuralmute]

@@nikksmtey Exactly! IT is a manifestation of fear itself, and they are mocking fear. And laughing in its face is one of the best ways to overcome fear.

[@JamaicaZ160R1793010A]

@@neuralmute Yep. It worked in the first movie and that's how they forced IT to retreat.

[@reikun86]

That’s a great way of explaining it. You should be able to remember the good and the bad.

[@bubblesbubbleton2747]

16:50 TW in reference to Bev’s story. My mom is a CSA survivor and dated and married men like her abuser. To her, the “red flags” that these men had were normal bc it’s all she knew for most of her life. Thankfully, she saw the cycle of abuse would continue with me (daughter) if she didn’t stop it. It took her years to face her own trauma, but she moved forward and advocates for other survivors.

[@febbledebble]

Your mother is strong, and so are you. I wish you both happiness and a future of healing.❤

[@Kaye09MNchick]

My paternal grandmother is a CSA survivor. The overall abuse and neglect that was done to my grandmother and her siblings is appalling. Any way you can think of abusing or controlling a person, my grandmother had it done to her by her father while her mother enabled the behavior. My grandmother was even denied an education and had to fight her father to finish high school. She had a full ride to a 4 year University but couldn't go because of her father. The abuse finally stopped when my grandfather and grandmother married and my grandfather told/asked my great grandfather, "When are you going to stop f***ing my wife". She hasn't talked a lot about it and now that I'm about done with my social work degree and have worked with people who have experienced trauma, my close family, myself, and my grandmother are starting to have some healing conversations even though my grandmother is also the cause of a LOT of abuse and neglect toward my father and aunt which continued to me and my sister. My sister and I have gotten about a decade of therapy at least at this point and, with being in the mental health profession myself, it was weird to hear my grandmother reference other types of trauma before the trauma with her father when I brought up the effects of trauma as I was finishing an assignment. I really appreciated this movie because it showed a few families that don't function healthily and, that's how my family was growing up and currently. My mother's side was phenomenal and, was probably the only reason my sister and I survived as well as we did through abuse/neglect and other kinds of trauma. My mother saved my sister and my lives many times over and I'm so appreciative of everything she did for us and our forward movement and growth as human beings.

[@taeaortkc9885]

​@@Kaye09MNchick I wish I could have had someone like your mother. I remember wishing I had an older brother to protect me. And wishing my mother would believe me. The only thing I'm proud of is that I protected my sister from it. And that she didn't have to live with the fear until the day we escaped.

[@alejandracardenas4460]

What's a CSA

[@alaynajohnson2439]

@@alejandracardenas4460 Childhood Sexual assault/abuse

[@avablanc4032]

Stephen king has said actually why he doesn’t like the shinning movie is because “it has no heart”. His book version really delves into the love and care and relationships within the family and then shows how the overlook singled jack out and started to cut at that connection he has to his family. King believes the movie never showed love there to begin with so it felt less tragic when it was lost. He claims that his ability to show love and compassion in his stories is a major part of what makes them so effective.

[@Overseer2579]

I agree. That’s the reason, for instance, that Carrie is such a devastating book and terrifying, bc of his compassion for the characters

[@Lunaxoxo3333]

That's a good reason to for me to buy the book now 😂

[@ReganSkye2010]

That makes a lot of sense. I haven’t read the book, but the movie just wasn’t good imo. I was lost in the plot, I didn’t understand what was causing him to go psycho mode, and I didn’t get the ending. Now I will say for me Doctor Sleep made The Shining make more sense BUT it shouldn’t take a sequel decades later to make the original plot understandable.

[@roseserena4423]

I loved the book, and the ending was a million times better in my opinion. Wendy, Danny & Mr. Halloran get a wonderful happy ending where they live together in a beautiful community by a lake. Jack explodes and is gone forever, along with most of The Overlook. Very satisfying.

[@avablanc4032]

@@roseserena4423 agreed!

[@irongorillafederation1082]

"There can be no horror if there isn't caring and love"- Stephen King (talking about Mike Flannagan's understanding of moviemaking for horror).

[@ScientificallyStupid]

that's what makes King (and I have a feeling that we're going to collectively feel the same way about Mike Flanagan in a decade or so) so gifted- the horror of the story comes from the emotion and care and heart of the characters. It's so far removed from a mindless jump-scare montage where the teenagers are interchangeable and you know they could be strangled with a cordless phone (I admit that I love those, too). You develop attachments to characters and you can see yourself and the people you love in those characters and those situations. It gives so much more weight to the horror and loss.

[@09nob]

Mike Flannagan to me is so self indulgent his horror doesn't work because his dialogue is so stagey and over stretched, I don't feel his characters I feel a man trying to write a college thesis on the screen, total anti cinema to me. But he's a hit with most people and I like the fact that he's doing something different and yet still survives in the mainstream.

[@DerAykac]

@@09nob Give it a few years and his style of horror is going to be the new mainstream.

[@09nob]

@@DerAykac Oh the horror, the horror, it wont be horror anymore it will be Scream without a sense of humour.

[@indiajohnson4149]

Speaking to how people end up in repeated cycles of abuse, it's because our nervous systems are primed through attachment to our primary caregivers and whatever the subconscious cues are that we pick up from those attachments. Those cues become familiar and indicative of "love" because its how our parents "loved" us. Because we are primed for familiarity first, and not actual safety. So when we go into romantic relationships, our nervous systems tune into that familiarity and seek it out. This often prevents us from gravitating towards safe people and places. We have to rewire what safety feels like in our bodies to help us make connections between safety and familiarity in order to help us gravitate towards safety instead of toxic familiarity.

[@janedoex1398]

👏👏👏👏👏

[@stormqueen29]

It's not always our parents that we gravitate towards. For me, it was my molesters and abusers. My parents were great parents. But repeated molestation and abuse over the course of years and years certainly conditioned me and affected my eventual marriage and my relationship with my now ex husband. I've never known a life without abuse of one form or another. Sexual, verbal, emotional. I lived with abuse for 44 years. Starting over, with no idea what a "normal" life looked or felt like? It's been hell. But with help from my internet/KZbin dad's I'm finding out. One day at a time.

[@dietotaku]

not only that, our childhoods are literally when our neural pathways form and those pathways are what our brain gravitates to later on. there's comfort in familiarity, you recognize it, you know what to expect from it, you know how to survive it.

[@sionan7937]

There's a poet named Iain Thomas who has an amazing poem that I cannot think of the name of, but it essentially says that before a child is given to their parents, they are told that their parents will love them no matter what. And so whatever you do, whether you are cruel and mean, or kind and affectionate, they will think "this is love." And that is going to be what they seek out for the rest of their lives. It was such a powerful poem the first time I read it, especially as someone who is trying to break the cycle of abuse within myself. I was taught that pain and cruelty is love and so now I'm trying to teach my son the opposite.

[@laurenphilipp4337]

This, exactly. My counsellor worded it, saying that its "comfortable with being uncomfortable". It really is a horrible thing, and can be hard to recognize.

[@lilythebassetpuppy]

"Violence against children", was necessary in this film to rally the viewers to be on the losers club side, immediately and instantly. Two things most of humanity can get behind...dont hurt children and dont hurt pets. And when anything is evil enough to do that, its an instant number 1 common enemy. King knew what he was doing. Not sure he knows what he is doing, TODAY...but he did when he was good.

[@swaggbunny1502]

What's interesting about Bev's husband is that in the book we read that Bev takes out a cigarette before the fight between the 2. Then we read that what the husband was mad about wasn't really that she was talking to a childhood friend/crush but that she was smoking, something he hates and had previously scared her away from.

[@wewoor]

Yup, abusers can be very observant about any gesture of resistance and they constantly lie about their own mood.

[@devonbennett7216]

Yes! He sees that he is losing his control of her.

[@paramitch]

I agree, *and* I think it's more complicated. Bev's husband Tom hates and fears BOTH things -- her phone call, and that she takes out the cigarette (because as others have commented, it shows he's not in control of her). He then uses the cigarette as an excuse to start the fight, because he knows he can "blame" and "punish" her for that, even though he's just as enraged at the other thing too -- that someone from the outside has reached her despite his keeping her in his cage. But he's cunning enough to know that he needs to keep her on the defensive, so the cigarette is where he starts. The scene in the book is better, but it's also a much longer scene, so that's probably why the movie handled it the way they did.

[@MalakaiXed]

The "human" monsters in these films are scarier than the clown itself omg. My heart pounds when they are depicted in the films

[@chadfalardeau5396]

Humans can be worse than any fictional monster that has ever existed

[@KireiC]

This was my impression in reading the book, as well - yes, the monster is scary, but the sociopathic kids, abusive adults, and the general inability or unwillingness of other adults to do anything to stop terrible things from happening was more horrific to me. I believe the book and its adaptations imply that the adults' ability to ignore bad things happening is an effect of the monster's presence, but it's also just an all-too-common phenomenon of pretending not to see things that are uncomfortable to address. Very scary.

[@cosmicdoggo9296]

Humans make this monster s

[@nabillasalsafahira3366]

Trueee the parents omg

[@xred_ray8009]

@@KireiC That got me as well in the book. I think as adults we all forget how the world feels like from the perspective of a child, how inconceivable large parts of it are at the time, how unpredictable the adults‘ actions and how little control a child ultimately has. Stephen King hasn‘t forgotten and can so brillantly describe it. That‘s what makes him such a marvellous writer in my opinion.

[@mikegould6590]

My father was a drunk and physically abusive. My mom came from an abusive home, and she became an emotional tyrant. I was constantly bullied at school, with zero help from anyone. I have serious anger issues because of all that, and it was up to me to break the cycle. My parent showed me how NOT to parent. My bullies showed me that strength of self is necessary, as well as facing your fears. My wife and kids showed me that there are things worth being better for. Pennywise would be toast.

[@teresaellis7062]

I am so happy for you! I am sad that you went through so much, but I am so happy that you are doing so well now.

[@Pylahskay]

Sorry you had to go through that but I’m glad you got better on your own and made a family 😊

[@BloodBoiling]

Did you get therapy?

[@ayselengin1798]

iv am glad that you learnt sometinhg and better now but just because you somehoe become better, doesnt mean it will be same for everyone.

[@ebebebeb7283]

Huh I just realized why I have anger issues

[@PlehAP]

"Is there a problem woth overcoming bullying by bullying the bully?" I'm not in any way a licensed or trained therapist, but I think the important difference here is that "It" is not a person, but a personification of trauma. It's wrong to bully anyone, including a person who is a bully. But I don't think there's anything wrong with creating an abstract character to fight against. I think that *can be* a healthy way to cope

[@FeministCatwoman]

Sometimes bullying a bully is the only way to defend yourself AND to shame the bad behavior out of someone who will otherwise not learn. Some people are positively affected by compassion and forgiveness. Not all.

[@PlehAP]

@@FeministCatwoman Defending yourself is one thing, but it's always better to remove yourself from the situation if you have the option. But it isn't our place to make a bully learn anything. For one thing, it's not healthy for us to decide how other people should or shouldn't behave. Bullying is about drawing boundaries with regard to how we are treated. We can't take responsibility for how a bully behaves, even as we don't allow ourselves to be victimized by it. A person can and should only be taught by someone they respect and consent to. Bullies are no exception. If they choose to be a bully, there is nothing you can reasonably do to change that. On our end, the best we can do is walk away. Unless we are actually a police officer performing our duties within the jurisdiction of our authority, it isn't our place to tell other people how they ought to behave. Becoming a bully to a bully is not a good thing and whenever we start to use the logic of the ends justifying the means, we've compromised our ethics.

[@FeministCatwoman]

@@PlehAP I was bullied school. Bullying them back was the only thing that stopped them. They would not listen to reason and removing yourself from school wasn't an option. Never got messed with after that and had a peaceful adolescence as a result. Sometimes aggression is the only language an abuser will understand, and passivity only enables and excuses them to continue doing it to someone else.

[@PlehAP]

@@FeministCatwoman like I said, defending yourself is a different story. But the real takeaway shouldn't be, "we need to bully more bullies." The real takeaway from that story is, "our education system is fucked and we need to get better administration so bullies are corrected in healthier manners and kids don't have to stoop to retaliation to have a healthy environment."

[@luis9639]

@@PlehAP Morality is relative and if a bully can do whatever he/she wants without being punished ¿why the victim can't do the same thing?

[@cherusiderea1330]

What really breaks my heart re: abusers is that, so often, the victims think that there's something wrong with themselves (not the abuser) because they repeatedly end up in the same situation. "I must be wrong for attracting such horrible guys", and you can't talk them out of that mindset. "I'm wrong." "It's my fault." Please know that you have a right to be vulnerable and that it's the abusers' fault when they profit from the fact that you hurt. You are perfectly right. They shouldn't do it. It's their fault, and their fault alone. Please love and respect yourself, and if you can't, I'll do it for you.

[@Kaye09MNchick]

Sometimes people who hurt others will also use tools like gaslighting and just outright telling someone that they're wrong or stupid. This can also be why this happens as it can be really difficult to believe positive things in yourself when you're constantly being told that you're the opposite and, especially when this is done at a young age from a caregiver or parent. The attachment-based relationships are SOOOO important for human brain development and, developing skills like social skills.

[@sdfhkm]

😢❤

[@chrissycurtis4152]

As someone who fell into several abusive relationships before I broke the cycle, for me it was because of how my mom was growing up. She was so abusive where nothing I ever did was good enough and everything was my fault, so even if the guy I got with was abusive, if he wasn't as bad as how my mom was I thought it was fine and good. It took a long time to learn that comparisons like that were unhealthy and took even longer to recognise the red flags early so I wasn't already trapped

[@P.gz46]

You are just amezing for been able to overcome all of it. I identified with what you wrote. My relatioship with my mom was (And maybe still is) similar to that. I send you a lot of love from Chile

[@tigereyes2012]

I got lucky in my family. They loved me and did their best to help me through my SA. I can say my SA gave me the same mindset for a while though. "Hey. This guy didn't force himself on me, sure. He yelled and pushed me around, but that's not as bad. So it must be good, right?" It was a horribly skewed view of what i deserved from others, and if wasn't easy to break. I'm glad though you learned what to look out for! No one deserves to go through this kind of thing

[@trinaq]

My condolences, but I think that you're remarkably brave to come through all of that trauma in one piece!

[@CordeliaWagner]

Thank's for opening up. I think you did great to realize what is not good for you! Wish you all the best for your healing journey!

[@Exhausted_Pigeon]

@@P.gz46 wow I share the same sentiments with you and OP. My relationship is (and sort of still is) similar. I'm trying to overcome it while still living with her and it's hard (don't recommend) but I'm seeing progress which I'm happy for. I hope we all find healing and be better versions of our past selves.

[@artemisvenom2282]

This movie is literally the only horror movie where I cared deeply about the protagonists, Beverly especially with how awful her dad is.

[@farookhabeba5398]

I completely agree In most horror movies I don't really care if the characters die but in It I loved these characters more than myself

[@artemisvenom2282]

@northern_skies ive read the whole thing actually- orgy included

[@thebluerobinett2436]

Same. So we’ll written all the way around.

[@JamaicaZ160R1793010A]

@@farookhabeba5398 I have to say so do I. I mean I'll pay attention to the main characters but I won't shed a tear if someone dies. I always look forward to the jumpscares but the murders especially. IT really took it to the next level.

[@bogdanflorin8927]

Then you shouldn't read the book

[@the_radiant_patriot]

I was abused a lot throughout my childhood & young adult years. 2017 I was diagnosed with Complex PTSD. I've come to the conclusion that I must have experienced something so awful that my brain won't let me remember it. It's bittersweet because while I really don't want to remember it, it also feels like it's a huge missing puzzle piece to heal more.

[@KelsoFox]

Right. How do you face something that you don't remember or are not even sure if it happened. I know they are that specialized therapy, I like it's like electric shock, where it somehow unlocks your memories and you relive the trauma, then once you're aware of it you can start to heal from it, but that also sounds horrible and it would retraumatize you.

[@meikisualditime]

I am a survivor of CSA and it didn't "come to me" until my first pap smear... the feeling was so similar... i couldn't tell you who or who... but the memory is there but so vague... and I just get so angry at myself for not knowing and not saying something.. it's what I'm working on ... learning to forgive myself and learning to focus on what i can do moving foward to protect myself and my niece, nephews, and son. But i 100% understand the feeling of a huge missing puzzle piece.

[@givowl2160]

I surprised myself watching this whole episode, I usually skip scenes and movies that include things like SA. But having you two there to talk through the scenes helped a lot- didn’t feel like I was “overreacting” to what was being portrayed. I don’t think I could watch anything that included those scenes without someone understanding nearby. I have never been through what Bev has, I know other’s who have gone through similar. Which makes me furious and deeply sad when I see these scenes, knowing that it’s real. You two approached the topic with kindness and respect. I also appreciated how you mentioned that learning how to process triggers can be cathartic, it’s not something I see acknowledge too often

[@Classicsydzilla]

“We accept the love we think we deserve” was the quote that came to mind when you talked about the cycles of abuse. The School of Life had a speech where they discussed how when we search for love we subconsciously search for the trauma that feels the most familiar to us because it’s the easiest for us to handle which I think is an interesting point. Actually could you guys do a Perks of being a Wallflower episode?

[@jocelynfisher3174]

Yes yes yes!!!

[@n4l9bx]

Perks is such a great movie for both of them to talk about! And that quote lives in my head all days. It shook me to my core when I first heard it

[@sriku1000]

A great Watch on How bad parents are made kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJXag2mpi7eoos0

[@BearlyAwake13]

Perks would be a fantastic movie for cinema therapy to cover!

[@madigreen782]

PLEEEASE

[@saraw8490]

Speaking on the cycle of abuse, people see what the end of the relationship was like and they're baffled why anyone would tolerate it. But it never starts that way. Over the course of YEARS, it builds from "you know, I don't think your friend likes me very much." and "Are you sure you can do that yourself? Maybe you should let me do it." They plant these little seeds, so that when they escalate it to "I don't trust your friend, I don't think they have your best interest at heart" and "God you're useless," it's not a shock. They get you to doubt yourself, doubt your friends and family, and make themselves the center of your entire world. Heck, one of my exes used to go out of his way to do little mundane tasks for me (like fetching a can of soda from the fridge) then tell me "gosh, what would you do without me? You wouldn't survive." He would say it with a half-hearted chuckle as if to pass it off as a joke, but in hindsight he was literally planting seeds in my mind that I couldn't live without him. Fortunately I got out of that before it really escalated.

[@46tearsforyou]

The breaking you down with a chuckle to pass it off as a joke is so common and insidious. Then if you get upset about it, its "wow i was joking whats your problem". Or even just hearing "you're crazy" all the time, passed off like a harmless "funny" statement. But then you start believing you actually are crazy and that the things you do don't make sense and can't figure out why you have such a hard time being "normal" and "functional". When in reality, they intentionally break down your ability to be stable and then blame you for it.

[@tinselPixie]

@@46tearsforyou Yeah gaslighting, which I've lived through and still live with somewhat, totally makes you doubt your own mind. It's horrific.

[@user-vy1co6bq3z]

my god that is so sneaky its scary. its really scary how its so difficult to catch the signs early on >< thankfully you managed to and got out! Please take care.

[@kim7990]

Facts :(

[@poyitjdr]

There’s a metaphor I’ve heard that goes ‘if you put a frog directly into boiling water, it’ll hop out immediately; If you put it in cooler water and slowly crank the heat to boiling, it won’t think to escape’ I’m glad you were able to notice the red flags with your ex and I hope you’re happy, safe, and loved now.

[@lexwithbub]

"You're nothing without me" My abuser had me believing this exact same thing, even if he didn't explicitly say it. Although he regularly told me no one would love me the way he did. And I believed that too.

[@alexandrialeonora6542]

I didn't want to watch this because I can't handle horror, but also because I can relate to Bev's experience. For me, it was my grandfather when I was 8 years old. He might have continued, but he died a year later. I had forgiven him for it back then, because I had thought he must have gone senile given he was already quite old by that time. He had been a hero medic in WWII, after all. But as it turns out - my mother revealed to me later when I was an adult - he had done SO much worse to her. Because he'd had access to her every day. He'd tortured her. And so, I no longer know if he deserved my forgiveness. But more than that, seeing scenes like these, it's not something I can deal with. We already know so many children (especially girls) suffer sexual abuse at the hands of their parents or guardians. So many of us have experienced it. We don't need to see it on-screen... 😞

[@JP2GiannaT]

I've struggled with this too. Also my grandfather, as it turns out. Not a "hero", but quite respected in his community. It's not that anyone deserves forgiveness in the sense that "what you did wasn't actually that bad because it was mitigated by x, y, or z factor", I don't think. It's more, "I'm choosing not to hate you, even when these memories come up. Even if you deserve Hell, I'm not going to waste my mental energy wishing you there or being angry that you're not suffering for what you did." It's something you have to choose over and over again, even while recognizing the full gravity of it. I think you have to recognize the full gravity of it in order to forgive. What makes it worth it is that it keeps you from turning to the inside, from turning bitter. It allows you to keep it from ruling you. It's work, but it has a point.

[@daniellea42]

Forgiveness isn’t about whether or not he deserves it sweetie, it’s about letting go of the emotional hold he has over you; it’s for you. Because forgiveness fills our heart and makes us grow, and holding onto the bad feelings keeps us in place. Forgiveness is something you choose everyday, some days are harder than others and that’s okay, but remember it’s not about him it’s about you and taking back your power and your emotional response.

[@erikapadua1824]

sorry that happened to you and your mom, I hope those abusive people will face consequences.

[@prettybird1978]

I have empathy for what you have experienced. I can relate to a grandfather doing something inappropriate as well. I also have difficulty with this movie for a similar reason. Hugs and prayers for healing for all those who have gone through this. We are more than the sum of our trauma.

[@hortencepauni9704]

Maybe they put it on screen for others to be aware of it. People don't understand trauma and abuse, for some people it doesn't exist, and showing it on screen helps us empathize with people who have similar stories. As Jonathan said, watching it can be healing, it can be a reminder that one still needs to keep on working on it. You'll never know, maybe one day you'll be able to watch it without letting it have a big effect on you. I hope you continue healing and getting better

[@hematite9914]

He might be a shit father but "Ain't nothing like a little fear to make a paper man crumble" is a GREAT quote.

[@shijannefortissimo8856]

fr, it sounds like something out of a western movie

[@AskForDoodles]

I love that it foreshadows how IT is defeated.

[@daniellemusella1594]

@@AskForDoodles I don't know how many people realized that was foreshadowing right away. I know I didn't. (12/12/2021)

[@greywalker505]

Love the message, hate the messenger, I say.

[@Teeny733]

As someone who grew up in a cult, I would REALLY love to see y'all's take on Midsommar if you're doing scary movies this month.

[@gleewhoseline198]

That's one of the best depictions of a cult I've seen. The Harga were so charming i actually quite liked them, even though they were strange. Then the Attestupa scene happened and I was shocked back into reality.

[@rafinha7081]

That's perfect.

[@RealBradMiller]

@@gleewhoseline198 Exactly!! You'd think they'd at least have some berry or mushroom that let you slip into a quiet, never-ending sleep. Nope.

[@nickbell8353]

I call that movie Swedish Wicker Man.

[@RealBradMiller]

@@nickbell8353 That was my nickname in highschool.

[@koolkel00]

Fun fact, one of the things that was the best about these it films, was how they treated the kids on set. Like the kid who played the psycho bully was, in real life, so incredibly nice and respectful to them and everyone took great lengths to make sure the kids were okay and felt safe which I think is just awesome

[@46tearsforyou]

I think the ending of them "bullying" IT was actually the perfect ending for a movie about trauma. I see it more as like, recognizing that your abusers are just small little clowns in a scary mask. All they're doing is putting on a show, trying to make other people scared and feel small, so that they can feel powerful. When you realize that all of the abuse comes from that small and scared place within them, and has nothing to do with who you are, you can finally start to heal and take the power back. Crushing the heart all together at the end, that felt very cathartic to me, like a visual representation of what it feels like to release trauma. To be able to see your abuser as someone small and pitiable, instead of a big scary monster.

[@staceyjayne5]

I haven't experienced Bev's kind of trauma, but I still cannot watch those scenes without feeling physically unwell. Especially since having my own kid, it's so abhorrent to me.

[@auraflores5072]

I remember being excited to see this film not knowing anything about the original series.I am very into horror movies but that scene...had my heart BEATING OUT OF MY CHEST. No other scary movie has done that and I would not watch it again. Or I'd choose to skip past that scene >_

[@blessedcocoa5729]

As someone who has been through s***** assault, I felt my chest tightenning like I couldn't breathe and I was cringing away from the screen. I literally had to curl up in a ball and breath for a bit and my chest still hurts. I literally have no reason to say this but I need to tell someone cause I'm freaking out and shaking. Sorry for pushing my trauma on u .

[@FeministCatwoman]

@@blessedcocoa5729 I'm sorry. I hope you are doing okay

[@user-vy1co6bq3z]

@@blessedcocoa5729 that's exactly what i'm feeling now. i couldn't watch the scenes as well without covering the visual/audio. you're definitely not alone. let's focus on the good people in our life now and how we're standing here despite the past. sending much loves

[@blessedcocoa5729]

@@user-vy1co6bq3zThanks 😊 . U take care as well. I'm gonna just avoid this video for quite a while though

[@itsmainelyyou5541]

No, I wouldn't call it bullying, exactly. IT isn't a person who has feelings we'd recognize. It is an intergalactic parasite. A cosmic tick. What they're doing is giving power to their silence, to their inability to react, to their paralysis. It's gathering the hurt, the pain, the rage and releasing it onto the thing that hurt you. It's the chance to expel those feelings on a valid target. It is a rarity. A truly worthy outlet.

[@moon8520]

I agree. They're reducing their fear to something they can better process, like images of ridicule. They're taking their power back by overcoming their fear of the clown.

[@JamaicaZ160R1793010A]

@@moon8520 Yeah. They weren't bullying it. They were attacking their own fears and taking it down. Not everyone will heal the same way and it may take recreating a situation to win or facing the fears head on.

[@lexwithbub]

Yes, it's the embodiment of writing down your fears, then burning them. That's a metaphorical catharsis, with IT it's a literal thing.

[@pokemonmusiclover5]

I stutter and seeing Bill stutter was one of the best representations of a stutter I've EVER seen in media. Probably one of the only ones in fact. It's not just repeating sounds it's also the prolonged syllables and blocks where you can't physically speak no matter how hard you try. I NEVER knew about those things about stuttering besides repeating sounds until I was about 17. So seeing this is just....liberating and relieving that FINALLY someone gets stuttering right!!!!!

[@Road_to_Dawn]

Same here! I have a mild stutter, it mostly comes out when I’m unguarded or excited, but Bill’s stutter in this movie was JUST like mine (except, you know, more frequent). Seriously probably the best stutter I’ve ever seen acted.

[@sylviasmiley1721]

I had a slight stutter when I was a kid and self taught to slow down or stop to stop the stutter. My family didn't believe in "help" so I don't think it was right but I did get it to mostly stop. It acts up really bad when I hear a stutter that is the same way. Even if I think about it can cause me to start it up again for a bit. His portrayal is spot on

[@BlackFeathers39]

I have to disagree when they say “you’re a mimic” isn’t a good insult. I loved that. To me, it’s says “there’s nothing about YOU that holds any power over me - you are a reflection. You are a copy. You are nothing to me; it’s only the face you wear that causes me fear, but that’s not what you actually are.”

[@hillefoozy]

I hate and admire how much research went into making Pennywise actually look scary, like his facial features and mannerisms

[@prettypleasewithsugarontop4858]

@@agnez4435 I’m going to report every spam you have left in this comment section and every where I see you again

[@thursoberwick1948]

Tim Curry was much better tbh. But the effects in the old one were ropey.

[@Tyler_W]

@@thursoberwick1948 I really like Tim Curry in that role, particularly that there was a greater degree of subtlety than over the top menace like the new movies, but the new one does better in that I find him more intimidating. It would have been better if there was something in between. It knew how to be subtle at times and overtly terrifying in others. The opening scene with Georgie in the miniseries works a bit better imo because Pennywise doesn't seem so obviously malevolent like he does in the beginning of the new ones. Granted, I was a fairly discerning child, so I wouldn't have found myself in a situation where I'd be casually talking to a dude hanging out next to a sewer drain in the first place, but Curry in that scene felt weird, whereas Skaarsgard felt obviously predatorial. There needed to be moments before he actually went psycho where he actually appeared non-threatening in order to believe that he was actually luring innocent victims. I love the first one, and the second one is pretty good, but like a lot of modern horror movies, unfortunately, for all of these movies' merits that make them much better than the average mainstream jumpscare heavy mediocrity, it does try to be a very "mainstream" lowest common denominator sort of thing, and as such, it lacks any and all subtlety whatsoever.

[@thursoberwick1948]

@@Tyler_W I agree with most of what you say. I think the old version is let down by its effects. The new Pennywise costume design is good but Skarsgard... dunno, could have brought something different to the role.

[@Shythalia]

The big forehead is funny tho lol

[@winterfire1097]

Eddie and Beverly both mirror eachother as adults. They both found a spouse that represents their trauma/parent and both are stuck in a cycle still. Also, I wouldn't say that Mrs. Kaspbrak nessicarily just wanted him to take care of her, she's a clear case of Munchausen by proxy. She gives Eddie sugar pills and makes up allergies and illnesses just to keep him only trusting her. His arm being broken probably was one of the happiest days of her life as she was looking for ANY reason to sever the ties with Eddie and his pals. She and his later wife Myra, they both see Eddie as "theirs" and only that. Myra would have done the same to his pals as adults as Sonia did when they were kids, played fake sympathy (in the book she fake cries when Eddie is leaving for Derry). Also Eddie had a huge fear of HIV/AIDS which was running rampant through the country at that time in 1989, so the scene with the "Saw trap" makes even more sense since its blood and needles, both a way of transmission of the HIV virus. I was a bit shocked you guys didn't reference how Richie uses humor as his coping mechanism. Also that scene in the arcade shows just how hurtful that was. Richie is only serious very few times in these films and its only when Eddie dies or that arcade scene he falls completely silent. You can see the terror in his face as he just tries to get out of there. The betrayal of the curly haired kid who was playing with him. Idk, Chapter 2 was indeed messy AF but I definitely think the emotional beats are stronger there. I mean Bill Hader's scene at the Quarry after Eddie's body is left under Neibolt, wow.. just. Wow.. 💙

[@winterfire1097]

@northern_skies When I took psychology I heard that Munchausen by proxy was not just making the person or child ill, it's usually children and their mothers. But instead it's also infantalizing them. It's the complete control that they only look to you for answers and they would never trust anyone else. I mean look at how angry Eddie's mother gets when he dares to question her word on his sickness and then tosses the pills on the floor. He was breaking her control. Then when he's running out of the house, she starts trying to fake crying and sobbing acting like Eddie's independence hurts her. A classic dodging move by abusers.

[@coldestsprite1467]

In Richie's case though, I feel like the source of his trauma that would thus translate over into why he acts the way that he does, couldn't really be picked up from passively watching the movie unless you had the context and background provided in the book. Even with that context, the source i.e. him being neglected at home, isn't really shown in the movies and considering that their focus is solely the movie aspect of it, they may not touch on it. As for his experience with homophobia as a child, I'm pretty sure they may not have touched on that because they felt as though they personally were not equipped to talk on that. Notice how they hadn't delved into Mike's traumas either. It may just be, in those cases, that they felt like it would be inappropriate, as two white heterosexual men, to speak on the traumas that victims of racism and homophobia face.

[@JamaicaZ160R1793010A]

@@coldestsprite1467 It earns them more respect actually.

[@SupaFlyJedi]

Interesting note, and correct me if I'm wrong here, but the same actress played both the mother and the wife, they just had different makeup.

[@JamaicaZ160R1793010A]

@@SupaFlyJedi Yes. I think so.

[@PrettyBoyKii]

Even the portrait of Beverly and her husband shows the dynamic of their relationship. She sits below him while he stands above her with his hand gripping her where her shoulder meets her neck, her back towards him, his face menacing while she looks on solemnly. The portrait is in black charcoal.

[@paramitch]

The portrait pose was a terrific detail because it was such a classic abuser stance by her husband. The picture literally tells us everything we need to know about their relationship.

[@Casy_Bnes_]

Beth's scene gave me chills and I have gladly never experienced that kind of trauma. Powerful movie, powerful messages told through the genre of horror. Stephen King is a master of his work.

[@reneeisaacs4622]

Damn. Ive been ignoring the fact I need therapy for my trauma. This made me realize I definitely do. You have me crying at the end.

[@BunnyMumma33]

I'm getting support from psychologist but I struggle to open up.

[@nichole5652]

I clicked on this notification SO FAST. IT is just genuinely terrifying and I'm so glad yall are reviewing this

[@rowantic6539]

same XD

[@Simonsays158]

I was excited there doing a horror movie

[@fatethegemini]

SAAAAAMEE

[@fatethegemini]

And immediately sharing with the whole crew lol

[@trinaq]

Likewise, both movies were genuinely amazing and terrifying!

[@FruityHachi]

"When you're dealing with trauma, you need a tribe. You need a tribe of safe people who know how to treat trauma and people who are experiencing or have experienced what you have." - easier said than done, the problem is how do you find such people? (i mean a tribe of safe people who aren't professionals)

[@letsrock1729]

My exact question. It's not always easy to find any kind of tribe in life (even non-trauma based ones).

[@ladosis5596]

And there's always us, the CT community. We may have something to contribute from time to time :)

[@eva1585]

Arent there trauma support groups, facebook groups or things like that where people can talk about their experiences and support eachother?

[@FruityHachi]

@@eva1585 i don’t have facebook nor similar social media but trauma support groups is a good idea, haven’t thought about that, will try to look for them the problem is that even if I would find some, i’d be reluctant to post out of fear of my post being ignored

[@eva1585]

@@FruityHachi Im sure if you ask around at a mental health clinic (if there's any available to you) they'll be able to point you in a direction. I got results by simply googling "trauma support groups near me". Though if you'd rather keep it to posts online but, as you say, are afraid it'll be ignored im sure there are loads of other people not posting for the very same reasons. Once someone starts other's may feel safe and more inclined to follow suit. I would highly recommend finding a support group irl. I went to a CBT (Cognitive Behavior Therapy) group meeting for 10 weeks and it turned out to be a very pleasant experience.

[@carrie2469]

In reference to why people end up in cycles of abuse, it should be noted that we unconsciously seek what feels familiar. Abusive relationships change the brain chemistry too, causing trauma bonds which makes it incredibly difficult to leave. There’s a lot of factors, but being a victim of abuse in childhood increases the likelihood of re-victimisation. It takes a lot of unwiring of the brain to escape the pattern, heal, and choose healthy relationships. The best example of re-victimisation I’ve ever seen in film is Mysterious Skin. It’s the most horrific, devastating yet powerful movie ever. It explores different responses to trauma, but I particularly loved the way that re-victimisation was explored as it’s a heavily misunderstood and often stigmatised trauma response that is rarely represented in film.

[@ladygeneveve3805]

The cycle of abuse is perpetuated more by the fact that victims of abuse tend to not be able to recognize red flags and abusers can often be good at finding vulnerable targets kzbin.info/www/bejne/iZCsaXpnd7yXgq8

[@thingusbingus8181]

A little detail I love about the scene with adult Beverly, is that in the painting of her and her husband, Pennywise is behind the husband with his arm slight around him. Even after the losers defeat pennywise, and symbolically overcome their trauma, it still lingers.

[@daniellemusella1594]

@ThingusBingus Wow. I didn't notice that before. If anything, I thought it was a trick of the painting's background, meant to symbolize her husband's own personal demon of being an abuser. I never thought or noticed that it looked like Pennywise. Good catch. (12/12/2021)

[@TheCultureshock101]

Bro I never noticed that! That's amazing!

[@LizzardGirl713]

16:38 timestamp for anyone trying to find that

[@paramitch]

That's a fantastic detail I totally missed! I was too focused on how the husband has his hands forcefully on Bev's shoulders (it's such a classic abuser pose).

[@kamyu-5077]

I relate closest to bev and it's always frustrating to me how people will blame her (and the other losers) repeating the cycle as an adult. So many discussions I had because they feel like since they overcame it in the first movie, it ruins their arc to go back. But recovery is not a straight line - never was. Which is really hard to remember sometimes, especially with people being ignorant like this I'm glad you talked about this movie. It's one of my favorites because these kids are so strong. Stronger than I was back then It's quite healing to witness

[@oooh19]

Well I mean it’s not like they can pick their parents or schoolmates but you choose to be in a relationship with someone. They didn’t choose to be treated like this by their parents or school bullies but if you’re with someone who’s abusive then run! Run far away!

[@stephaniemacfarlane7297]

@@oooh19 People don't freely choose to be with abusers. Abusers don't act like such from the beginning. This is explained in the video, and in other comments as well.

[@vailingbow1068]

@@oooh19 Awfully ignorant of you to say and proves you didn't watch or didn't really listen to the video. Especially Bev's part.

[@lollobello]

That is the reason why the book is not a straight line either, but an interconnection between past and present that shows the adult state of the Losers and then tells about their childhood traumas. The rest of the book is about overcoming the traumas and how (and why) it is different when you are a child from when you grow up

[@KireiC]

"Recovery is not a straight line" is a great expression, and a pretty good description of the characters when we see them again as adults - they've all gone on with their lives, some have become quite successful, but none are completely free of their past issues, and it manifests a little differently for each character. It's a good thing to see, really, because media can often oversimplify the recovery process down to a basic, "and they never (insert damaging behavior here)'d again, and lived happily ever after." Portraying it as more complex, even in fantastical settings, is pretty nice.

[@DianaNacho333]

For me personally what is making my trauma specifically hard to “face” is I don’t remember a lot. I have a lot of blank spaces in my childhood but the not so fun symptoms/side effects, etc. And it’s a constant question of: do I try and remember or not? Will I be able to. Will it do more harm than good. Great episode and yeah, Beverly’s story is very hard for me but I watched it all.

[@robyyyne]

Honestly same here. As a kid, i kinda pushed every single bad thing into the depths of my brain so I wouldn't remember it all. Recently however Ive had some pretty terrible dreams that appearantly allign with whats happened when I was little and to my siblings. I remember mostly fun things with the good sie of my family, but THE bad one is completely pushed back up til now. Im actually considering facing it all cuz my anxiety and depression has gotten worse :') I hope you will be okay tho, no matter what you choose, I'm sure you'll reach success and I'm sorry you suffer consequences for things you cant remember

[@creatingpulsars9979]

I loved watching your break down! Also "scary that man's a cop" for sure but I have to add, realistic too. Just look at the latest studies on the frequency of domestic abuse in cops.

[@richieordeanidc536]

i wish you would have said more about richie and how he uses humour to deflect from his insecurities, he's a character i really relate to as a gay guy with adhd who has the same traumas with regards to bullying and homophobia and uses the same coping mechanisms. i actually named myself after him when i was choosing a new name after i came out as trans.

[@nde375]

Oh, yes, I'd want something like that too! Though I think they didn't touch this topic because they are just careful not to speak for LGBTQ+ people. So I'm waiting for the episodes with LGBTQ+ people they promised^^. And I'm sorry for what you've been through and wish you all the best in life~.

[@MonyXChan]

Yeahh, I am very sad they didn't touch upon Richie's story, since it is SO fucking effective, especially rewatching the first movie after knowing about his feelings and secret, that Chap 2 reveals.

[@EmilyMeola]

I too wish they would've talked about Richie

[@tmystery9505]

As a female, you are not a gay guy

[@MonyXChan]

@@tmystery9505 Perhaps you cannot read. He is a trans guy, aka, a dude. So if he is attracted to men, then yeah he is gay. How about minding your own business or go somewhere else, if you want to be toxic and stick your ugly nose where it doesn't belong. You do NOT get to decide other people's identity.

[@raynathomason2807]

Speaking of childhood trauma, would you guys ever take on The Glass Castle? Like talking about the “parenting” methods and the effect it had on the kids?

[@ayannabranchcomb7535]

I love love LOVE that novel. I need to see the movie

[@jimballard1186]

Wait, they made a movie of that? I gotta look that up.

[@raynathomason2807]

@@ayannabranchcomb7535 me too! I knew about the movie before the book, but I read the book before I watched the movie. What kept my interested was all the fucked up things the dad has done, it made me so mad I just couldn’t stop reading it!

[@thetomlette7720]

Or, on that note, Mommy Dearest

[@literaturegirl2451]

I both loved and absolutely despised that novel at the same time.

[@kickitwithki694]

God. I watched Bev's scene with my dad, twice. Each time we were both just utterly disgusted and uncomfortable. (I'm a closeted trans guy, and my dad is your macho mexican guy) I would say our love language is movies so when scenes like this happen, it just sends shivers down my spine.

[@septicandroid]

I love how you two addressed the trigger warning, not only as "if you don't feel like you're able to watch it, you can skip" but also as an opportunity for you to know something triggering is coming but that facing it is a brave and sometimes healing. I have trauma surrounding Marijuana, drunk people and smoking, and i tend to even avoid looking at social media of people i know upload themselves smoking a blunt or doing funny stuff while drunk; but in movies i find it easier to go through scenes that make me watch that triggering content, it makes me face it through a story and i hope soon i can accompany that with some therapy

[@deannarobinson7136]

"if you need to watch this before your therapy appointment" Sir, that is PRECISELY what I do. Every time. "Ok so I was watching Cinema Therapy and they were talking about..."

[@alexajordan2032]

Same!

[@RoarTheRapper]

I realized over the years that I have gone through some trauma, because I am always looking for the next threat and I’m always worried about something falling apart and I’m always anxious about not being able to handle every new situation. And just even being aware of that, has helped me be able to seek relationships even if there’s part of me that’s always worried that those people aren’t gonna be there for me when the chips are down. It’s like I constantly have to remind myself that their love isn’t going to run out and I can ALWAYS ask for help 😭

[@tomsgrexit]

I love the second movie because it shows how they ended up and specifically it goes into Richie's trauma more (being gay and bullied, trying to repress his love for Eddie, etc..). Wish y'all would've gone into his trauma too!

[@paramitch]

I really liked the movie's added characterization of Richie as gay. It was so much richer than the book (which has some unfortunate clunky gay stereotyping), where Richie was just basically a wiseass.

[@DaniPetkova]

This one always leaves me with mixed feelings. The classic horror things - the clown, the zombies actually made me chuckle. I've always had trouble getting scared by movie monsters. The real-life scenes of abuse on the other hand were triggering to say the least.

[@J-manli]

The former are fantasies where our subconscious realizes those monsters are fake. But the latter is more dreadful because we know deep down there's that small possibility it could happen to us or those we love.

[@sriku1000]

A great Watch on How bad parents are made kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJXag2mpi7eoos0

[@MonkeyJedi99]

Humans can be the worst monsters we can imagine. A shark bites because it is hungry. A virus just wants to replicate. A human can do wrong and KNOW it is wrong, and still do it.

[@neuralmute]

@@J-manli A *small* possibility? Check out the stats on domestic/child abuse and sexual assault, and you'll realise that well over half the people you know have most likely been through at least some of this stuff, more if they happen to be female/POCs/LGBTQ/any mix of the the above. There are a lot of people out there who have been hurt badly, so be kind.

[@reikun86]

The kid who played Henry didn’t look like he was acting. The children’s performances were incredible.

[@angrytheclown801]

As for the bullying Pennywise whose been bullying them; Abuse is ultimately based off power. The abuser uses fear, pain, misery, whatever negativity to make you feel weak and take your power. That's why sometimes you have to use physical force against the bully. As long as you don't press on and become the former abuser's new abuser you're not doing anything wrong, instead, it can become necessary. I say this as a person that exhausted every other peaceful option and only turned to violence when the bullies went to actually Stephen King levels and tried to permanently blind me. There are times where you must become a bully to stop the bullies. The trick is to know when enough is enough on both their end and yours.

[@teresaellis7062]

Oh my goodness. I hope you are okay. I am glad that you were able to stand up for yourself. I was bullied only verbally and I, unfortunately, became a bully to my younger sisters because I never felt I could fight back. Thankfully my sisters and I have good relationships as adults. I am glad that you know how far to go to defend yourself and no further. I wish the best for you.

[@angrytheclown801]

@@teresaellis7062 Thanks. It's been ages. Fortunately my mom raised me saying I could fight back, but when it's finished it's finished. Unfortunately, I was angry for a long time and it was rage and fury for years. But, I've grown and let go of the anger. It's a lesson we all gotta learn someday after all. Rage, anger, ego, revenge, all of it became a slurry. But you know, I don't think of these as unhealthy mindsets except revenge, and even that can be turned to justice, I'm not going to say I didn't get drunk on the dark side for a while though. Still, thanks for the well wishes.

[@Author.Noelle.Alexandria]

That’s not becoming a bully to stop the bullies. That’s self-defense.

[@46tearsforyou]

One phrase that was really important for me to hear in my healing is "reactive abuse is not abuse, its survival".

[@frikkinpenguin]

Even though I normally avoid horror stories and movies, because the frighten the living crap out of me, I was so intrigued by the plot, so I watched the first of the new IT movies and then read the book. Even though I had only seen some clips and the ending of the second movie on KZbin, I talked to many people that have watched it. What I noticed first was the misconception of Stan Uris‘ suicide. They all thought he killed himself out of fear of IT, but that’s not the case. In the book, it‘s written that he did it, because he knew that the Losers Club needed to be whole, that they needed to be a tribe. He knew that he wasn’t able to face IT a second time and by that would’ve been the weak link, putting all his friends in danger. What’s also better explained in the book, is why they came back. They had completely forgotten Derry, IT, their childhood and even the scars they received when they cut their palms during their oath had disappeared, only to return once they were back in Derry and started to remember what happened piece by piece. Of course Mike called them and wanted to gather them again, but he wasn’t the only one. They didn’t just return to defeat IT once and for all, Pennywise called them back. In the book there are only a handful of small chapters written from IT‘s perspective, but they bring very interesting information about how IT sees itself. IT feeds on fear and children are easier to scare, because their fears aren’t as complex as the ones adults have. But for the first time in IT‘s existence, at the hands of the Losers Club, IT itself experienced fear and that made IT furious. IT sees itself as an almighty entity no one can fight against or defeat, but the Losers Club made it vulnerable and fear something for the first time. To put it simple, they made it personal with Pennywise and he called them back to kill them, something he failed 27 years before. Like IT‘s personal vendetta, because these kids made some cracks in IT‘s godlike view of its existence. The book is so much more terrifying than the movies, something I never thought to be possible. I don’t know when or where, but I think Stephen King was once asked if he sees himself as a psychopath. He answered, that he didn’t exactly see himself as one, but if he wouldn’t have had his books and stories, he is sure he would’ve realized this fantasies of his in one form or another. It’s an interesting and thought-provoking question I ask myself every time I look at the cover of my IT book standing in my bookshelf. Is King a genius to have create stories like this and many more, or do his fantasies show the dark depths of a human being we should be deeply worried about?

[@paramitch]

As with many writers, some of King's imaginative gifts came because he had a really difficult, brutal upbringing himself, and stories were his escape. I highly recommend reading his ON WRITING, which is both his discussion of writing as a craft, but which is also equally a really moving autobiography.

[@nhogan84]

There are very few channels that NEED to exist as much as this one. You guys have not only struck gold with a great format, but you've also found an inroad to people who have trauma and issues they don't want to confront with something everyone enjoys: cinema. It's equal parts brilliant formatting and necessary healing for many who may not even know they need it. I honestly hope you two do this for as long as you can, because you are helping so many more people than just me... and you've helped me so much. So so much.

[@abbyh8403]

The one councilor that I felt was more than a venting place said I didn’t have the proper red flags to recognize an abuser because he felt like home. That stuck with me.

[@destinyskiff]

Bev’s story is so powerful for me. I struggled with her story in part 1, and then had a full on PTSD flash back in the theater during that first scene of part 2. That experience was very embarrassing, but it let me know that I wasn’t as ok as I thought I was.

[@celianunn2070]

PTSD flashbacks can suck, especially if the come unexpectedly, but there is nothing to be embarrassed about! My mind had blacked out most of the memories of what happened to me, and it's taken most of my life just to get most of the memories back. The last one I got I literally bawled like a baby in front of alot of people! But! I knew that doing that, letting it out, "releasing" it, would help me more than trying to hide it in.

[@vargavio]

10:25 This is so true. I realized my own trauma through watching a movie, and that allowed me to be able to talk about it (first with friends, then with a therapist). I was able to use the lines of the movie to describe my own experience, which was incredibly helpful to verbalize my own feelings.

[@sharonaandiggypopthecat836]

Can we say wow to the dad? I can’t imagine playing a role like that.

[@irishdc9523]

Fun fact: Tim Curry himself is afraid of clowns, and he had it in his contract that he was never to see his own reflection while in costume. Also, my friend's nine-year-old cousin watches IT and she loves it

[@thursoberwick1948]

That Tim Curry factoid does sound as if it was a bit of publicity for the film....

[@Tyler_W]

@@thursoberwick1948 maybe, but on a similar note, Peter Jackson has arachnophobia amd struggled doing the scenes in The Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit with the giant spiders (which probably explains why he really changed the scene in Mirkwood amd turned it into a spider slaughter scene with the dwarves fighting their former captors). It honestly wouldn't surprise me if Curry felt this way. I think that fear of clowns is a bit more common than you think. Heck, I used to be terrified of them as a small child, and I didn't hear about It until high school (although I loved Batman: The Animated Series and that iteration of the Joker, and perhaps I wasn't terrified of him because it was about Batman beatimg the clown, idk). I can't explain where it came from, but I think there is just something primal about fear of clowns.

[@neuralmute]

My brother in law is *terrified* of clowns, thanks in equal parts to Tim Curry, and the creepy clown doll in Poltergeist. Being the precious little hellspawn that they are, my 7 and 10 yr old nieces have a long list of ways to traumatise their dad with clown pranks... We won't even get into my sister's arachnophobia here and the fun they have with that!

[@TheSolitaryGrape]

@@Tyler_W oh the irony! You couldn't write it

[@justinehercthehuman]

What's so sad about this movie is that these kids all suffered real life trauma. Beverly suffered physical abuse from her own father. Bill blames himself of his little brother's death carrying guilt throughout his life. Richie experienced homophobia leading to alcohol and self-hate. Mike had to witness the deaths that scarred his view on life. Eddie was deceived by his own mother which made him germophobic and grow old with mom issues. Ben had to go through years of bullying cause of fatphobia which motivated him to lose weight. Stanley carried heavy pressure from his family's own religion which little by little affected his life eventually pushing him to commit suicide.

[@brucwert7410]

I tough he suicided bcuz he didn't want to face pennywise again ? i mean they didn't give much about him in s1 or how much strict are his parents or maybe i don't remember the movie very good

[@justinehercthehuman]

@@brucwert7410 Yes, Pennywise has a MASSIVE impact on all the kids but I as a church boy kind of relate to him having to believe in a supreme being who can do anything or even save everyone in a snap while still seeing sad and terrifying shit in life happen in front of my eyes. Years of being forced by my parents to do religious things actually made me an atheist now that I'm older. And I see how his fear of IT exponentially grew compared to the other kids.

[@brucwert7410]

@@justinehercthehuman i mean the experience is different for everyone my childhood friend has always been ok with her religion and didn't seem to have any extreme problems so i don't think its the religion but the way people force it on their children and it didn't seem so bad for stanely as i remember of course bcuz it was from a long time Sorry for your bad experience i can also kinda relate to it cuz i'm in a muslim family and don't feel so connected

[@acelovesdiyschristopher7023]

@@brucwert7410 u can say it contributed to his place in the mental asylum

[@Cocoa_Kalypso]

Stanley committed suicide because of the call. All his memories, trauma, and fear resurfaced when he heard IT was back and he knew he didn't have the courage to face it again. Moreover, he knew if he either avoided IT or went with his friends to confront IT, his fear was going to get them all killed. So he removed himself from the equation. He left this in his note to them at the end.

[@Makiyavel]

I had experienced sexual traumas as a kid and I felt it hard when I rewatched Bev's scenes with you guys, but the thing that got me the most was when Jonathan talked about how we repress memories. I barely remember my childhood, both the bad and good memories of it, because I felt so awful that I didn't want to remember. I just moved on and it's almost like my life only started when I was a teenager. But the thing is, despite of me not remembering specific events of childhood, many times I still act the same as before. It's hard to understand that I'm not that defenseless child anymore and that I have the resources and the support from my friends and family to overcome all those bad things from the past. But therapy is helping me a lot! I really like your channel, and this was a touching episode

[@annadau8612]

I can't help but appreciate how Stephen King made Henry Bower and his cronies more believable than comically over the top with Henry's dad being abusive, ect while also without excusing his horrible and abusive nature at the same time

[@imperviousdonut]

My husband and I went to watch this in theaters. When the scene with bev and her father came up I wasn't expecting it to take the turn it did. I remember gasping and I immediately began to have an anxiety attack during the scene. I had to curl away into my husband while he covered my ears till the scene ended. I don't remember starting to cry but I remember after the scene was over I was able to continue watching the movie no problem. I still think back and think on my feelings throughout and how those related to my life

[@alexandrialeonora6542]

Yeah, I don't think I could have sat through that scene in the privacy of my own home, let alone in a theater. You were brave and strong. - hugs-

[@bravoseh93]

We need a "Therapist Reacts to... FANTASTIC MR. FOX" this November. I feel like there are several themes that could be discussed in that film.

[@sarabartel4285]

Love that movie. I feel like we need a branch of "director therapy" to cover Wes Anderson's work as a whole.

[@sierralovat5498]

Yes

[@kiawe12]

Thank you for encouraging us to confront our triggers. I'm an actress and am currently playing Nancy. It hits so close to home and could be a trigger but the art of musical theatre has been so cathartic and has helped me work through my past through character work, storytelling, and performance art. I love that movies have the power to reach and connect with so many people. Great show!

[@paramitch]

I so agree on how art and theatre can help us overcome those things, but kudos to you for playing Nancy despite your own triggers! That must have been incredibly difficult -- she's such a maddening and heartbreaking character, because she's the textbook example of someone who has bought into their own abuse (she believes she deserves whatever Bill does to her). Has there ever been a more horrible love song than "As Long as He Needs Me?" (The worst part is, it's also beautiful!) Hope the performance went well -- take care.

[@konekaurore]

I really loved how you talk about traumas and how you sayed, before Bev's story, that this moment could be triggering, or healing for some people. The gentleness you had.. It's priceless. Thank you.

[@Firegen1]

This is such a masterful adaptation. It just connected the humanity of the themes and performances. The mini series was great. This was just even better.

[@trinaq]

I agree, a rare occasion were the modern version is better or just as fantastic as the original.

[@Firegen1]

@@trinaq Very much so. :)

[@thursoberwick1948]

@@trinaq The old version was way better, but suffered from bad special effects. I think the main problem with the recent films is the second film is actually pretty boring, and Skarsgard is not a patch on Curry.

[@Fullmetal1890P]

A friend of mine has been in and out of an abusive relationship for years now and I've barely heard from her until the other day. She told me all about how she can't seem to stop going back to this abuser and she asked me why she'd do that. I told her, "You go back to what's familiar, and sometimes even misery is familiar." I've been there, my ex-husband was the epitome of an abuser I never could get away from, especially with all of the people around me telling me that I *had* to stay with him because we were "destined" to be together. He would say things like that all the time, "No one will love you like I do," and, "look what you made me do." He was the most charming person on the planet and no one would've suspected him for being the monster that he became in our relationship, so I kept going back. I said, "well, I won't upset him this time," and, "well, it's not so bad being with him, it's better than being homeless." He was comforting, even in misery, I had become so used to it that I was numb. It took a very long time before I began seeing things clearly, and it coincided with a time that I spent away from him and began seeing value in myself, as well as a future I could have without him. It breaks my heart that my friend is still in this position, that she might never get away, but I know all too well that nothing I say, no words of "you're better than that!" are going to change what she has internalized. She has to learn that on her own, just like I did, just like everyone does (if they do ever get away). All I can do is be there for her and not give up on her.

[@hnichole]

I think you make a really excellent point about how no amount of positivity or words can change, on their own, what someone has been through and that we each have to learn for ourselves how to move forward from our trauma. The best any of us can do for others is to just stick by them through their journey. Thank you for your words of wisdom. :)

[@snxwy3634]

yikes. hearing how you guys talked about Eddie’s relationship with his mom realllyyyy hit home for me- my mom literally turned me into an anxious mess that is terrified of everything. one time I went to a friends house for a school project, she dropped me off and then WAITED OUTSIDE for about 15 minutes, got angry that it was taking so long, and started beating on the door and making me leave. I was extremely embarrassed, humiliated, and felt bad I couldn’t help my friend more with the project. this is only one example, but it reminded me a lot of the scene with Eddie’s mom

[@bullesdemotions]

"I think that sometimes, we recreate the past so that we can win." That hit strongly...wow

[@dbluwlf3596]

I think the whole point of the second film, while it said much of the same as the first movie, is that if something hit you deep enough, you may need to let it go multiple times.

[@mightworth3735]

I love how at the end of the video Jonathan starts going "you'll float, too", Alan looks at him and then he concludes this is a fun idea

[@Hope-fx5pp]

I relate to this on a deep level. All the parents are horrible and you feel like you are all alone. You aren't being protected by your parents or authority figures. Even though this is a horror movie it gives me hope that people that grew up like me will be ok.

[@sshellhorn1]

You two are amazing. As someone who works with people with traumatic pasts, your segue into that scene with parental abuse was respectful, open and still inclusive for victims. Thank you thank you thank you.

[@santos8468]

How do you feel about Stanley's suicide ultimately being presented as a noble sacrifice instead of the extreme reaction to facing a childhood trauma that it actually is? I personally was not a fan of this reveal

[@Tyler_W]

I really hated this. Suicide is not noble. The only way to make anything remotely ressembling noble is if someone, in the moment, either kills themself or allows themself to die/be killed in order to save someone else from the danger of that moment, in which case it's less a suicide and more self-sacrifice. Idk if they could've done this differently in order to make that not awful, but suffice it to say that they failed in this regard.

[@ChinaMo]

@@Tyler_W - As one who has seen the original miniseries (all six hours of it) multiple times, and has read the massive book multiple times, Stanley's suicide is *_NOT_* supposed to be a "noble sacrifice" at all. As a kid, and out of all the "Losers", Stanley had the hardest time believing and acknowledging that *_IT_* was real, and that what *_IT_* had been doing was reality. He was the guy who couldn't reconcile his view of the world with the existence of *_IT._* In other words, even though _all_ of the "Losers" were traumatized by *_IT_* (among other things), Stanley was the only one who was in denial of it the longest as a kid, and repressed it along with that denial as an adult. So, as an adult, once Mike called to remind them of their promise, Stanley was incapable of facing *_IT_* and that everything that happened was, indeed, real. His suicide is a tragic example of how blocking out and denying that a trauma happened means robbing one's self of *_any_* possibility of healing at all, because to him *_IT_* simply 'didn't happen'. And you can't begin to heal if you can't admit there's something to heal from... The other six "Losers" at least acknowledged, and in some way or another (whether healthily or unhealthily (eg Bev)) had spent the 27 years after their promise subconsciously engaging with their trauma. Admittedly, in viewing these recent *_IT_* movies I didn't notice a tone of "noble sacrifice" in Stanley's suicide, but I may be biased due to what I've known of the story all these years... Makes me want to watch them again, to consider whether those who hadn't experienced the book or 90s miniseries are getting "noble sacrifice" from it... 🤔

[@santos8468]

There's some dialogue from Bev at the end of part 2 that basically says that Stan took his own life because he thought he'd be a risk to the group thus making it a "noble sacrifice".

[@JamaicaZ160R1793010A]

@@ChinaMo I also don't see Stanley's suicide as a noble sacrifice. He knew full well that no matter what he did, they'd lose because he couldn't face his trauma and his suicide was shown to cause the rest of his friends grief and I don't think that letter took it away in the end. I think he was telling them to never forget and to live to the fullest.

[@ChinaMo]

@@santos8468 - I'm gonna watch it again and see whether I see that. Still gotta watch part 2 again (finished part 1 last night). But still, it's not supposed to be taken that way at all, because that would contradict the underlying themes and functions of characters in the story (as I understand them). The miniseries does a better job of communicating those themes better, while the book does it best. But *_IT_* is an examination of the sources, cycles, and reasons behind 'evil', violence, and generational trauma, and why such things keep happening. 'Suicide as noble sacrifice' simply goes against the point. But I'll be back once I've rewatched part 2...

[@hdervish2497]

Pennywise is their fear. I don’t know about anyone else, but calling out my fears and shouting them down with derision can be effective.

[@purpleiguana208]

Thank you for talking about "triggers" in the context of trauma. I am so fed up of people who use the word "triggered" to mean just generally upset or angry. Actually being triggered is so much worse than that, and to use the word incorrectly not only makes too much of a sort of smaller emotion (for lack of better words), which sort of devalues it as someone "overreacting," but it also devalues the actual experience of being triggered as being a small thing and something that someone should just get over rather than something that would actually take a lot of hard work to be able to move past.

[@kristinewalberg2938]

I loved what you said about finding your "tribe." I had a pretty intense childhood, followed by tons of bullying in my teenage years, further complicated by the fact that I was struggling with untreated Bipolar Disorder (because "kids don't get depressed," according to my mom) and the after effects of conversion "therapy." Being part of a large group of smart, kind, caring, funny people not only helped me find my courage, it literally saved my life.

[@thetomlette7720]

I'm actually a little disappointed that they didn't cover Stan and his inability to face that trauma all over again

[@rumeemeka-okafor3746]

I really like how they treated Mike especially in the end. In my opinion he was the one in the group holding them together -he was courageous for staying in Dairy and reminding them the importance of remembering in order to overcome something they never wanted to confront again.

[@Pippa87]

I was irritated at the fact that they changed his family life though. In the book he had the most stable loving family out of all of them.

[@moniquesalazar1708]

7:25 Not just his cajones but also the complexity of the relationship. He's furious at her but he still turned back, "Sorry mom, I have to go save my friends!"

[@thealethiaco]

this was so true. they get violent when you realize what they were doing was wrong. they start beating you more until one day you just get fed up and start fighting back.

[@laviniasnow4494]

The only adaptation of a Stephen King novel I've seen is “The Shining” as a kid and it scared the hell out of me. I don't watch horror movies because usually I find them stupid or because they terrify me. I've never been through the kind of abuse Bev has and hopefully manage to stay away from it, but the scenes with her dad made me really uncomfortable and the scenes with her boyfriend literally made that uncomfortable feeling skyrocket. I managed to watch the whole video because I knew that after those scenes your commentaries followed.

[@Christina-xc7on]

I agree. I have no personal history, but those scenes absolutely made my skin crawl and my shoulders tense up. Cinema is such a powerful art.

[@angrytheclown801]

If I may make some Stephen King movie recomendations: The Green Mile, Shawshank Redemption, and Stand By Me. None of these movies are particularly scary, hell, Green Mile has a character scared enough for you and is a gripping drama. Bring tissues to that one. Shawshank Redemption has a really great story of not giving up even as everything around you is trying to actively crush you. Then Stand By Me is about a group of boys learning a bit about life. Now there is a scary scene with a train but it's of the engaging scary not the boo, ahh scary type of scary But if you do decide since their talking helps get you through the movie, you can try Creepshow. It does have some scary scenes, quite a few. But its comedy, zany dialogue, and some scenes are purposely shot like the frame of a horror comic book, it can kill off a lot of scary. But my advice? If you got a fear of bugs, cut out before the final story. It's rather gross and is missing the silliness of the previous stories.

[@justinehercthehuman]

You should DEFINITELY watch the sequel for it called Doctor Sleep. It's a different director so it's a different take on the term Shining while still referencing Stephen King's novels.

[@livsterlove5681]

I feel so deeply for people that even if I haven’t experienced it my body feels like it has, it’s something I’m working on. I have to remember what is MINE and what is someone else’s.

[@laviniasnow4494]

@@angrytheclown801 OK, I'll consider these options.

[@Selachiistopheles]

I've always seen the two IT movies having something of a meta discussion on how fear affects adults vs children. Because with children, when something scares you, it SCARES you. Kids tend to be more emotional, less likely to contextualise things. In the IT movies the childhood fears are effective because they scare child charactets, who are vulnerable. They eventually fight back, certainly, but it takes some getting there. And then in the second movie, trying those same scares on the adults- well. IT gets a jump, IT gets a scream, but they're a bit hardier, they might bolt, be uncomfortable, but they also might do what Eddie did and square up, choose fight over flight or freeze. So IT instead does what it did that made the first movie terrifying for audiences, IT goes after children, which is what scares the characters. Not that IT's going for them, tho that is worrying, but that IT's eating the new batch of children in town. For a kid, a rotting, bandaged mummy might be a nightmare on legs, but for an adult, well. "It's a stupid motherf******* mummy!". The scariest stuff for the adults is not the monsters themselves, but the existential and real fears around them. Death, other people, trauma. And that was just my take on the second film vs the first. It's not as gutwrenchingly scary because the focus of the fear has changed. Love your videos, by the way!! Always love hearing about the psychology in play behind films.

[@snakehandler87]

I found this film relatable, had a horrifically hellish childhood which the daily routine consisted of my dad going into a PCP induced rage and beating me my sister and my mom until neighbors would call the cops. One day my mom managed to knock my dad down picked up me and my sister and her arms ran out the door threw us in the truck she screamed at me to close the door and lock it and as soon as I did my dad broke through the window with a knife and was trying to stab us to death. Thankfully we were in a hotel and it was broad daylight and a bunch of men (one ended up being my stepdad and was just as bad just not physically) jumped my dad and saved us. That memory will always be with me

[@PokemonButcher]

I suffered a series of traumatic events in my teen years. In my adult life, I thought that I had largely worked through that trauma. It turned out that I still have much more I need to uncover, analyze, and accept from a place of compassion and reassurance in myself. I blamed my trauma for my ex-partner and I breaking up, and she blamed me. I felt hurt, unsafe, invalidated, dismissed, and undeserving of being loved. Now, some time later, I am in a relationship with someone who has experienced similar traumas. We always ask gentle curiosities of each other and make each other recognize that neither of us are a burden to the people in our respective lives. The trauma is still there, along with the fear and automatic defensive responses that stem from it. But, it's never a question of battling the fears. It’s acknowledging that we both had to do what we had to in our lives to survive and be safe. I am not in that place anymore --- nor is my partner. We feel belonging without a demand.

[@noellethomas2589]

What happened to Bev (as well as what was implied happened) happened to me. I'm currently a year removed from the incident and I have yet to begin trying to get some control back. Watching this video was very difficult, however it did make me more motivated to get help. I haven't found anyone that will take me yet- everyone has been saying my trauma is too severe- but I'm sure these things take time. Thank you guys for handling topics like these with such grace.

[@sandrakiss8711]

I had an issue of falling into relationships where the other made me depend on them completely. I became overweight and they kept me that way, not helping me become healthier. Now I struggle to get up, to do things as simple as housework and I cannot shower and wash my hair together because my blood pressure goes up and I become dizzy (and I also fell over in the shower because of that, suffering concussion) and we don't have the space to have a bathtub installed. Still working to slowly lose weight and hopefully be able to do the things I was doing 7 years ago. It's a long process. I never watched the IT movies, but I did read the books back when I was 16. I often met people saying Stephen King wasn't good, or he was mediocre in writing, but that's not what I found. I read several books from him simply because of how greatly he could show imperfect humans, trauma, mental issues. Most people I know who watched the movies (but haven't read the books) found the sicklish boy's story a joke too. They didn't seem to grasp at all that his mother made sure he would depend on her by fake illnesses, to be able to control him. And this is an issue I've seen a lot, many people not really understanding the depth of an issue through the movie screen. Perhaps if they read the books (don't wanna be that sort of person though and say the "book is better" or anything. I think it just works the brain a bit more actively) they wouldn't dismiss trauma so easily and tell me to "just get up and do it what's so hard about that". It's a process. I can't do it in a day. But at least I have my tribe who hold out for me and encourage me, as well as ensure me that I am improving and that I'm strong enough to work through it and they are there to help when needed.

[@Star1412s]

I'm really sorry you went through all of that. People shouldn't invalidate you like that. You know what you wen through and you know what your limits are now. They can't tell you how to deal with it. Also, do you have a shower chair? I understand it would fit better in a tub than a shower stall, but it might help with your problem washing your hair.

[@LavenderArts]

What keeps me coming back to these movies, other than thinking they’re very well-made, is what Jono and Alan mentioned, the heroes’ compassion - specifically just how much they *touch* each other. Both as children and adults, they hug and hold and touch foreheads and make all these little physical gestures to reinforce their bonds, often specifically the men touching each other, and that just really stands out to me and makes these movies special. The group hug at the end as children, and again as adults with Bill resting his head on Richie’s leg, or Bill and Mike saying “I love you,” the consistency and focus on that level of comfort with each other and compassion and love I think sets both movies apart from the horror crowd a little bit. Their bond as a group is so critical to defeating It, it only makes sense to make it a focus of the movies, but I like that they remained committed to it. Call me touch-starved but it’s my favorite :’)

[@9elypses]

10:00 its the fact Bev doesn't move while her dad is there. I learned that sudden movements triggered abuse so I would just let things be taken from me for fear of a beating. Her movements are slow and calculated and she watches him carefully.

[@daniellemusella1594]

1] A flashback in the second movie reveals that Beverly's mom committed suicide. In her dad's twisted mind, that gave him the right to begin treating her more like a wife, instead of a daughter. I felt it when I first saw the first film, and I still feel this way (probably always will), that he was the one who spread the rumors of Beverly's promiscuity around Derry. This way, if she tried to tell someone about the abuse, it was highly unlikely that anyone would believe her. 2] Eddie's life reminds me a lot of the Gypsy Rose Blanchard story, with the exception of murder. In a way, there's a slight mirror to Beverly's story, in that, like her father, Eddie's mom treats him more like a spouse. Not sexually, but in the sense of, "I want someone to take care of me, who is also completely bound to me and won't leave." You get the feeling that she, herself, was traumatized as a child. Maybe, her dad left in a dramatic way when she was very young, and/or she later had a boyfriend who used her and abandoned her in a similar way. * Side-note. You know the old saying, "A boy always finds a way to marry his mother"? The second movie took that literally. The same actress who played Eddie's mom also played his wife. 3] Richie's trauma comes in the form of repressing the fact that he's gay, along with having romantic feelings towards Eddie. 4] Like Alan, I didn't entirely agree with how the Loser's Club finally killed off Pennywise, even though I understood and respected why they chose to go in that direction. (10/19/2021)

[@celianunn2070]

1) I dont know if Beverly's mom committed suicide in the books, but I distinctly remember that she was alive, just worked (I believe as a nurse or waitress) alot. There was even a part where she asked Bev if her 'dad' ever "touched" her. Bev thought "What do you mean? He always touches me" but didnt say anything (dont remember) and the mom was just like "Oh yea, he's such a good dad!" 2) I distinctly remember that Eddie's dad was in an accident when Eddie was a baby, which made the mom more paranoid and overprotective than she already was, which i think she had tendencies of before hand.

[@JamaicaZ160R1793010A]

I got the point of how they finished off IT as he represents their traumas.

[@forestgrump4723]

I love that the close captioning at the ends just said "Internet dads: watch movies"

[@KatieVanHelsing]

I experienced emotional and mental abuse at the hands of a family member. Seeing her fight back, it hurt, but it means a lot.

[@vertoatrum]

Our subconscious wants so badly to find a victory amongst the pain so we end up with people who we try to fight out past out with. You will never get the closure from getting that type of person to accept and love you; you WILL get the love and acceptance from the people who care about you

[@kimmeeb]

I read a book recently and there was this quote that really resonated with me that went something along the lines of this: Healing is a misnomer, because it implies that you can be fixed, that you can go back to the way things were before all the bad happened. But you won't, because you've changed as a result of what's happened. What you are is a survivor. You survived the bad, and you keep on surviving every day. You'll never go back, but that's okay, because there's so much more ahead of you than there is behind you. And even though I've never been in an abusive relationship, I have had trauma, and this quote really helped me put a lot of what I'd been carrying into perspective

[@poisonkeyblade]

I would really love y'all to talk about relationships in Fruits Basket. The 2019 since it's the full story. There's so much about childhood trauma, abuse, and overcoming it and finding a family. Aso there's a storyline about a character who says they wish to never forget anything, even the bad things that hurt. It reminds me a lot of what you said about remembering your trauma.

[@celianunn2070]

OMG even just Akito alone 😳

[@bebel9]

Yeees, Furuba is so good! I wish it was recommended more often to non-Anime fans. It is a great story that uses its fantastical element to explore themes of trauma and abuse.

[@sabosage]

Unfortunately, they rarely do TV series. Edit: How does the 2019 series compare to the original? I've been meaning to try it.

[@celianunn2070]

@@sabosage Personally while the newer one follows the manga more and continues onward, I personally like the animation style and VAs from the original.

[@tinesess3521]

Yes..omg..the trauma in that show

[@celiadennis217]

10:47 i am a CSA survivor and i used to be severely triggered by Law and Order SVU. After years of working through it, its now one of my favorite shows. Sometimes i do get more emotional than is "normal", but it helps me. Seeing "the bad guy put away" is cathartic (i think thats the word)

[@dindranew.6808]

IT, the book, and Bev definitely helped me cope with my abuse trauma decades ago. Now the movie is doing it even better, as it doesn't reduce Bev's physicality to a binding force for the boys. She doesn't need to use her body to be of service in the movies.