Biblical Giants | Clans, Sizes, & Supernatural Abilities | Episode 3 with

[@2GunRock]

I'm glad this conversation wasn't suppressed with the death of Michael Heiser. It was a big part of his life's work and his Divine Council Worldview. I came away from it feeling far more enlightened about the supernatural realm. As a result it made it easier for me to understand the most complicated chapters and verses in the OT, but in the NT as well. Thanks to Joel and his colleagues, Dr. Heiser's work is carrying on.

[@jaked8537]

I always found Heiser made terrible arguments based on a completely inside out hermeneutic of viewing the Bible in light of ANE literature as his primary lens. His presentations on the "divine council" are riddled with inconsistent reasoning, not to mention his arrogant dismissal of the doctrines of grace, which he clearly didn't understand at all. I'm personally thankful there are more careful thinkers with sound theology who are now leading the conversation on the very important topic of the supernatural, rather than "carrying on his work."

[@joshuas1834]

​@@jaked8537 just mad that Mike wasn't a calvinist so you're going to call the guys that believe in mermaids, fairies, and creating a global theocracy the "careful thinkers" 😂

[@jaked8537]

@@joshuas1834 I actually had dismissed Heisers rambling polytheism lite long before I ever heard his embarrassing attempt at rebutting Calvinism, but whatever makes you feel better 👍

[@2GunRock]

@@jaked8537 Just the fact that you called him a Polytheist proves you understand nothing about his work. Either that or it's too far above your head to grasp the difference between small g gods (elohim), which are simply disembodied spirits minus the attributes that makes Yahweh (GOD) more than just another elohim, but the one and only eternal creator, including of the lesser elohim, this the one true (TRIUNE GOD) who is omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent etc. I'm sorry you're bitter that he rejected Calvinism, but in THIS SERIES Joel and his colleagues are echoing his work. It would be nice if they admitted it and gave him some credit, but perhaps his not being a Calvinist rubs them the wrong way too, no different than you, obviously. BTW read Psalms 82. who are those elohim or small g gods it refers to in Yahweh's divine council, just some old Jewish guys in the sky with Yahweh? You'll find the same language in Deuteronomy 43 and Daniel, more Psalms & elsewhere. Lastly if they went to use his work that's fine, even complimentary, but it's plagiarism if they don't at least have the decency to give him some credit by name, Calvinist or no Calvinist.

[@jaked8537]

@@2GunRock so you think I'm too dumb to understand Heiser, but your wall of text comment is somehow going to enlighten me? I promise you I understand his work, I just think his arguments for it from Scripture range from misguided to ridiculous. See: quoting the words of a pagan necromancer as if their expectedly broken conception of the supernatural confirms anything I can tell you're anti-Calvinist, because as expected you mention it more than any Calvinist ever would. I could care less about his soteriology, I merely mentioned his refutation of it which was shallow and indicative of his willingness to engage in awful argumentation when it serves his biases. I have of course already read Psalm 82, and a sophisticated mind such as yours is surely aware of the opposing view on who the "gods" are, which is what I hold to. As a former JW that engages in a lot of apologetics with those still lost in that cult, you'll forgive me if I'm not so easily seduced by the creation of the same category that the Watchtower uses to deny the deity of Christ. Good luck sharing Isaiah 43:10 with such people while having to explain which "type of g/God" it's referring to. Heiser wasn't the first believer to discuss the supernatural, and he won't be the last. No one owes him anything, although it's worth mentioning that the Haunted Cosmos guys have mentioned him and gave him his due on their own channel.

[@HartyBiker]

At this point Joel is just an honorary co-host of Haunted Cosmos

[@owamuhmza]

😂now if only he would come out of the closet and declare himself a Presbyterian, our joy would be complete😆😆

[@SilverSeekerCo]

😂😂😂

[@jeffdodson6317]

😂😂

[@ronniewestherly3435]

The Fallen angels had a lot of knowledge so they could have came up with some technology to save the giants.The Bible said They had knowledge of Magic.They could have used this Magic they knew to save some of the gaints.Its possibly they even went in to another time line or dimension.Then came back after the flood waters went down.

[@mikeclement62]

In 2002 the US army sent in a 2nd party to Afghanistan and encountered the Kandahar giant who had 12 toes and 12 fingers and double rows of teeth who was 1100 lbs and 12-15 feet tall and self healed instantly, that's why it was so hard for the army to take him down. He was red haired and stunk.

[@jessicahoyt6357]

The world’s tallest man in modern times, Robert Wadlow was born, weighing an average eight pounds, six ounces. Though Robert was not your average infant, by the time he was six months old he weighed nearly 30 pounds. So Giants could have easily been born slightly bigger than a normal baby and still turn out to be Giants

[@loadingmikke7451]

Thanks, was just thinking of the birth of one of those creatures, and didn't get it to compute.

[@cesarbarrera6557]

no la biblia dice que los hijos de DIos o elohim podian venir a la tierra en forma angelical con tamaño humano,pero en la cruza con esos seres celestiales se engendro gigantes en la tierra,los caidos eran gigantes en la tierra antes de la cruza ya habia otros gigantes caidos

[@jtobi01]

🫣 This is actually a goal that farmers strive for when breeding cattle. Relatively low birth size with exceptional growth in the first year. It was the first thing that popped into my head when they were discussing how human women might birth babies that grow to be so large. 😅 I saw someone on a video saying that humans were MUCH larger pre-flood, as well. I thought that was interesting but I don't have any opinion on it yet as the concept is new to me.

[@GenuineLhachwen]

The whole manatee/mermaid discussion just made me start singing 'Veggie Tales 'Barbara Manatee' sing in my head and imagining a sailor of old singing it to a manatee. 😂 I'm a bit silly 😊

[@andy1-26]

Same😂

[@johnmichaelbullock594]

Thank you, I wasn't thinking of that song, now it's stuck in my head 😂

[@GenuineLhachwen]

@@johnmichaelbullock594 Uh, you're welcome? I think? 😆

[@N8D79]

That’s hilarious 😂I think I love you 😂

[@ralphmouth6943]

Life is a hard mattress.

[@GlennD007]

I googled the height of cedar trees in the Middle East, and it says that the cedar trees of Lebanon grow to heights up to 120 ft!

[@Zaloomination]

You know what grows continually throughout its life? Snakes, and other reptiles.

[@minnixmusic]

I wrote an article years ago about the LXX cubit compared to the Masoretic cubit. And wrote about this exact thing about Goliath's size. I'm happy to see you guys got this right.

[@ronaldtentschert6876]

Thanks for the show, loved it.

[@LintCollection]

Appreciate you guys talking about this subject! The world is not just stuff

[@lalaboards]

Yea it’s lots and lots of stuff .

[@Solar_Craft]

10:50 good to know I am not the only person who mixes up Moses and Noah. LOL also I just found this channel and I love the way you guys make me think!

[@Tirawley13]

I hate to retype my view multiple times, but I believe they are important to share. One is that Noah /Utnapishtim/Deucalion, Uranus/Oannes/Dagon/Dagda/Poseidon, etc. became deified as Uranus among other names, and Ham/Cham became Chronus. The Greek myth about Chronos/Chronus Castrating Ouranos/Uranus is a mythologization of Ham raping his mother or possibly stepmother Naamah/Gaia as a way of usurping his father authority as king. The Sumerians tell us that Noah/Utnapishtim was king of Shruppak, which explains how he had the means to emply people to help build the ark. His sons helped I'm sure, but I think it was more of a supervisor role. It would appear from the archaeologicak record, that very quickly when sites like Golbekli Tepe were built, Noah's descendants had already descended into paganism. By the time City-states like Ninevah were built and assimilated into the Akkadia Empire by Nimrod/Ninurta/Gilgamesh/Dimmuzi/Osiris/Orion, their mythology had evolved further, but the Bible also states Nimrod "began to become a giant." There is a lot of the epic to unpack, but if he was born and then literally, not metaphorically began to become a giant, to me it indicates something ritualistic. If many Christians make the argument that God would not allow the wives of Noah's sins to have corrupt genealogy, then in my opinion, that also implies that something like ritualistic sexual practices involving demonic possession and conception, may have supernaturally been able to corrupt otherwise perfectly normal genes. While it may not be clear in the mythology, it is possible Titea refers to the wife of Shem and he may have been Titan. Simultaneously the Titanomachy wars may refer to intertribal ears between the descendants of Noah. Strangely Japheth/Jupiter(Ja-pater/Prajapati, Zeus) becomes head of the pantheon of deified patriarchs instead of Ham/Chronus, which seems to imply the Titans or line of Shem is who he was at war with. It may also imply that giant Rephaim tribes descended primarily of Shem at he time rather than Ham. It is unclear. Nimrod/Gilgamesh visited Noah, who seems to have moved to the island of Cypress to ask him about immortality, but apparently leaves disappointed. Not because he lost the magic plant, but in esity because Noah probably told him about the gradual decline of their lifespans. Father Martin via Demmon publishing, released his translation of a privately owned text, which seems to be one of the original accounts passed down from the scribes of king Of of Bashan. In it, it talks a bit about the giant wars and many fascinating details that tie into Enochian stories and the war with Abraham. Even in it, we can see a gradual decline of the bloodline which may have lead to the 8 foot tall Native American skeletons described in turn of the century articles, as well as stories from Conquistadors, and the Lovelock Cave giants. There are stories from the Aenid and Odyssey down to the present day Kandahar and Solomon Island giant stories that make us wonder what of the Rephaim bloodline survives today. Personally I believe there are many branches of the Nephilim family tree that are humanoids ranging from lizards and alien greys to hominids like Bigfoot, but it is hard to say. While some encounters are more like a spiritual mirage; allowing spirits to change form without physical restriction, the ones that are tangible, are the ones we need to focus on. Og mentions Anak as his scribe and eventual heir after the death of Og's son Ogias I believe. He also mentions summoning Jotun as a military conscript, which ties back into something else important. Norse and Celtic mythology do not reference those geographic areas or early medieval times. They actually reference a time roughly 3000 years ago before they migrated out of Scythia and the Near East. Jotunheim is in Syria, not Germany. It appears some Rephaim left the Mediterranean and Levant to escape persecution and eventually fade out of public conscience. Juan has to remember that while these books certainly have elements of historical truth, they are not as reliable as canonical texts. Another ancient fragment translated by Father Martin, is the Book of Lamech of Cain which also gives us a bit of insight into that time period. Any ancient texts that comes from a pagan perspective, can confirm some elements of the biblical narrative, but where they disagree one should rely on the Bible. Regarding height, at least in the time of Og, I believe he doesn't describe anyone over 20 ft tall, but I don't have the book with me at the moment. Tell me it seems more logical they would transition from 20 ft at the time of early megalithic sites down to the 8-foot average in the Iron Age, or something along those lines. If the Solomon and Kandahar stories are true than it seems there are however, exceptions to that rule.

[@beverleyhelson8659]

0

[@jessicaapples77]

I just found your channel & I am All In! Right up my alley :)

[@DonaldStrother24]

14 feet is the about size of both the average Autobot and Decepticon from the 80s Transformers cartoon.

[@begie666]

In metric system its same

[@Carnefice]

Coincidence? I DON'T THINK SO!!!!

[@josteincarlsen2905]

😂😂😂

[@MegaDoug]

Roll out ❤️

[@dandathomas6852]

Ironically, Joel Webbon is a Decepticon.

[@barbarapierce7564]

I appreciate your detailing the various theories, explaining where they might come from, and debunking them with scriptures.

[@alanmuxlow7093]

I got 16 minutes in, until you said that Ham had sex with his mother. If you’re going to play that fast and loose with that passage, how are we supposed to trust anything else you say? Ham did not “uncover his father‘s nakedness,” he saw his father‘s nakedness because, as the preceding verse said, Noah was uncovered in his tent. The entire context would indicate that Ham saw his father in a naked, drunken stupor, and went out and mocked him to his brothers. The subject of Biblical giants is interesting, but the Scriptures deserve better treatment than you’re giving!

[@krops2331]

The exposure of genitals is associated with power in the Bible. The angels also cover their genitals with a pair of their wings. This is because procreation is a source of power in those stories.

[@enochsawit8420]

Fair point, folks must " learn not to go beyond what is written." (As Paul says in 1Cor. 4:6 ) Why did Shem and Japheth cover Noah's nakedness by carrying a blanket backwards if the sin was incest with Ham's mother?? Stick to the scripture or drop the subject. The Bible says much on this topic of giants but we do not need the spurious writings of Enoch to extrapolate, or other fantasy. The common danger is that we use myth to form doctrine and can easily end in Oz as opposed to Kansas.

[@steveunger8249]

This has been debated much over the centuries. The most logical explanation is Ham seduced his mother. Do the research thuroughly.

[@ponyjr54]

Great things to be thinking about and studying. I love it. Opening up more of God's word to me is so exciting.

[@rachelmoore1974]

The tallest woman to have ever lived was Zeng Jinlian, who was 8' 1 3/4", was born weighing a little over 7 pounds and was 22" long. Her mother was 5' 4". So it's not a stretch at all to believe a normal human woman could give birth to a baby who would be a giant. My catching point was how a normal human woman could have physically MATED with a giant! That's the difficult part, I would think, assuming everything is proportional. And just to correct something the guys stated incorrectly, the woman who gave birth to the largest baby ever, Canadian citizen Anna Haining Bates, gave birth to her second child, a boy, who actually weighed 23 pounds 9 ounces and was nearly 30 inches tall. Even as tall as she was...yeouch!

[@nerychristian]

Women didn't mate with giants. They mated with angels. And most likely, all humans were taller back then. They lived longer, so they probably spent more time growing.

[@eliasharding3376]

Woman do like a big Johnson.

[@jamescox953]

I have been researching this even before rob skiba suggested looking at mythology from a biblical perspective. Adds to the understanding of history culture, and even what happens today in culture and governments.

[@josephphillips3985]

Awesome discussion gentlemen. Ready for the next one asap!

[@tentoesdownchristianity]

Some bulls are known to throw off seed that is born small-average and grows very large as opposed to ones that are born large and grow large. I've heard people call them good bulls because they don't hurt the cows who carry their children that will eventually be huge.

[@ross-smithfamily6317]

To another comment, it was NOT a local flood. Genesis 7:19-23: Regarding the waters, “They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than twenty feet. Every living thing that moved on the earth perished-birds, livestock, wild animals, all the creatures that swarm over the earth, and all mankind. Everything on dry land that had the breath of life in its nostrils died. Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; men and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds of the air were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark."

[@gailverhoeff]

Sounds like Yahweh created the earth as a Biblical FE not a heliocentric spinning ball that Nasa created to ursurp YAHWEH'S truth

[@geoffrobinson]

that can be interpreted fine in a local flood paradigm.

[@Wookstar27]

If it were a global flood, we'd all be inbred

[@kimberlina68]

​@@Wookstar27 so what about EVERYONE who came from Adam & Eve? Where we not already "inbred" as you call it?

[@Wookstar27]

​@@kimberlina68 Read the Bible. Day 6, God created man and woman and gave them dominion over the earth. Day 7, God created Adam from the dust of the earth and then from Adam's rib, God made Eve.

[@jessieaustin7327]

Look into the “liger” lion tiger hybrid. There’s a gene that tells it to stop growing that is lost in that mixture…. Perhaps similar occurrence in human angel mixture

[@jamescox953]

20:10 breath of life. There are also many depictions of mythological beasts of the sea. Mermaids sirens tritons amd gods such as poseidon or dagon are half fish?....

[@barbaramoran8690]

Maybe the nephillim were born normal human size but unlike regular people they may have continued to grow longer even as adults If someone regular human size at birth grew until they were 35 they’d be giants

[@dazdavis7896]

Well of course they were the size of normal babies when they were born, how do you think they passed through the birth canal of human women??? But they grew insanely rapidly, and one can tell at birth that something is not human with them. Look at Lamech thinking Noah was the offspring of one of the Watchers for example, he thought his wife had been involved in that abomination activity. But his father had to tell him no, he was a prophesied baby and he is yours. They could tell even when they were born if they had characteristics that resembled the angels. They were born normally, and then rapidly grew and kept on and kept on and kept on. But they were definitely born just like anyone else. Thats what MADE them legally able to usurp dominion of the earth from Adam and his offspring: as in us, human beings.

[@emmettrobinson9708]

That is true

[@Carnefice]

​@@dazdavis7896where are you getting all this about Lamech and Noah?

[@TwentyTwoThirtyThree]

@@CarneficeI'm curious as well

[@jamescox953]

Ages. Enoch and noah methuselah living for hundreds of years... the climate or dna oxygen environment may have been more rich. Higher quality. Longer lifespan. More time to grow.

[@Clank_Clank_Im_a_tank]

34:15 or some of the babies were also girls and she grew up to be a giant. Enabling her to give birth even larger babies then the previous woman. The first generation grew to 8 -10 feet as we have seen then breed with other giants to make larger children.

[@ExNewAgeSlave]

I hope you please continue to have a show with the three of you going forward your 3 personalities make for great storytelling great humor love it!!

[@nictwisp]

28:24 Were humans that tall (5’6”) then with that eco system or were they taller? Just thinking. 🤔

[@everydaynine_2282]

Only in the preflood era was everything was gigantic due to the gigantic trees

[@todddecoteau2547]

David cut Goliaths head off in order to prevent him from regenerating from his wound. The Jews understood that The ancient Giants some had healing abilities to self-heal.

[@cosmictreason2242]

You are off in la la land

[@Ab-abovetheFirmament]

I have heard that. I think it is possible.

[@ketoasd]

You got that from the books of 1st and 2nd opinions right?

[@everydaynine_2282]

Nephilms always knew magic and cures especially preflood I doubt the post flood knew how to do it Now I would said post flood there could have evidence they knew How to make hybrid things like for example Israelites was carrying grapes so huge it needed support to be carried Then again it’s hard to say if it’s was gmo grapes or not due to the context

[@katherinewild1599]

In the story of the Kandahar giant from 2001, the giant the military took down was being shot at by the whole group of soldiers but it was not affecting him because they said the wounds kept healing super fast.. one guy yelled for them all to focus on the giants head and they were eventually able to kill it. I have no doubt that they have very long lifespans (compared to us) and that the military is studying the giants genetics in hopes of changing the human lifespan and healing of wounds. Among other things.

[@TheHowellFamilyy]

I appreciate the conversation between you men. I think the whole giants kept growing theory is plausible. The same thing happed to Robert Wadlow who was documented as the worst tallest man. The theory is that he had an abnormal amount of the human growth hormone and just kept growing. He sadly died at 22 but was even still growing at his death.

[@danielpeterson4137]

I would love to hear you guys discuss one of the other common objections to giants. Which is that they would just be too big to even be able too move effectively. You see really tall people these days get joint issues, heart issues, etc. I'd love to hear Ben address the square-cube law objection to giants as well. Love the content!

[@skeemeastwood9075]

Those people have genetic disorders or tumors on the pituitary? gland. Shaq in his prime was what 7'3 300something pounds. Unstoppable. So imo the issue would be musculature. If you have a healthy being with biggers bones w proportianate muscles you have scary giants and it really isnt that far fetched for humans 8' or taller.

[@RobSed55]

I just happened to notice your comment. I have often wondered how grizzly bears, who can weigh up to 1 ton can run up to 35 mph and climb trees. In the case of "giants" it must be remembered that they are a different type of half human. They are not totally human types such as Andre the Giant. Andre's problem was living in a world made for smaller people. Therefore these "giants" who were born as such, had no problem moving or being "effective."

[@rhondahoughton790Canada]

They had long lives and they never stopped growing they would become 60 feet tall.

[@a_forest_walker]

The growth hormone that tells the human when to stop growing comes from the father. So the babies possibly started within a normative range. Within the animal kingdom this phenomena happens with Tigons (male tiger female lion). In Lions the growth inhibitor is in the males. In tigers the growth inhibitor is in the female. So Tigons get huge.

[@antoniobrown8726]

Yes this is true living 800-900 years old some clans kept growng Gen it says it was giants before the sons of God came down. In the Village of the 8, they found 12 ft bones saying that Noah and his wife were 12ft tall

[@dandathomas6852]

Naw bruh, it was 70 feet minimum.

[@melissabourn3538]

I’m 5’3”, 100 lbs (then), birthed babies OVER 9 lbs; naturally. Labor was under 3 hours. Imagine better genetics, better health… my daughter was wearing size 4 toddler clothing at 2 months. Another lady I know had 13 lb babies, but she was 5’6”. My guess is the mothers of giants had the children before 9 months- possibly as early as 3 months. Yes, I have reason for saying 3 months. TY Gentlemen

[@stianthijsen4784]

Wow, very interesting idea... being only 3 month pregnant with a Nephilim child.

[@melissabourn3538]

@@stianthijsen4784 3 months is the time frame that women report being pregnant by ‘aliens’. The people that I used to call crazy- and yes, some are. The more I research, the more aliens and the demonic realm appear to overlap…. My goodness, I sound insane 🤷🏻‍♀️

[@jerryyoung6494]

Let’s say your babies grow to 6 feet give or take a few inches and were 9-10 pounds. Can we say a 30 foot tall giant would then be 45-50 pounds? Is that survivable?

[@melissabourn3538]

@@jerryyoung6494 my guess is that the nephulim were born much earlier than the traditional nine months based on LA Marzulli’s work. His research; I am applying it to this

[@robinbalser6596]

Theres a fossil dragon the size of Florida in the US. There a trail named after it called black dragon canyon head trail. Look it up

[@HusGoose]

This trail is named after the clear ancient pictograph of a pterosaur. As for a fossil the size of Florida… please explain

[@pennyhinton496]

🎉Great conversation guys.God bless.

[@ross-smithfamily6317]

Regarding Goliath's height, 6 cubits and a span is approximately 9 feet 9 inches, according to Google.

[@danielwarton5343]

Depends on which cubit measurement you use.

[@Huckabilly-w7g]

@@danielwarton5343 They explained this in the video at 49:10 . I mention it just for reference for others, not to imply you are suggesting the lesser measurement of 4.5 cubits in later Greek translations found in the Dead Sea scrolls. The Egyptian cubit measures from 523mm to 529mm. The Sumerian cubit was 518.6mm. The ancient Greek cubit was 18 inches, which is what modern cubit converters use. These measurements all existed before the book of Samuel was written in Hebrew, about 6th century BC, but I doubt the Hebrew authors of the Book of Samuel would use the Greek measurement. That was the time of Babylonian and Persian rule. Greece would rule hundreds of years after Samuel was written. 6.5 Egyptian cubits is 11ft 2in to 3in. 6.5 Sumerian cubits is 11 ft tall 6.5 Greek cubits is 9ft 9in 4.5 Greek cubits is 6ft 9in A 6ft 9in man is not going to wear 125 pound armor as well as the weight of helmet, shield, spear and javelin and equipment. He'd be marching and fighting with over 200 pounds of gear. A medieval knights armor weighed around 60 pounds. A modern soldier can carry a little under 100 pounds, and that is a heavy load, but not unusual. Goliath's spear is compared to a weaver's beam. They were wooden rods used to hold the weight of woven material, and kept the fibers taught by attaching weights to the ends. A weaver's beam could be as short as 5ft long, but they were over 2 inches in width. That is not a practical width for a 6'9" man to wield as a spear. Goliath was 9'9" at minimum, and more likely 11' tall, according to the Hebrew translations of the Book of Samuel.

[@chazzz5545]

You trust Google?

[@dannoah1002]

A biblical cubit that Noah used to build the ark was 25 inches per cubit, while Soloman's Temple also used the 25 inch cubit. The modern progressives felt they needed to make it seem more plausible...therefore,the cubit went to 18 inches. The 3rd possibility was the 20.5 inch cubit. Goliath was a 25 inch(royal cubit) cubit at 6 cubits equaled 12 foot 2 with a span(6 inches), so, Goliath was 12ft. & 6 inches , at 12.8. The giant tree stumps, now mineralized, dictate 5 mile high trees, a pre-Adamic race/world. The earth is 6 billion yrs. old. The new creation for Adam & Eve, was a reconstruction of universe/planets. Today, the 'Mark of the Beast'is in part,an injection of Nephilim DNA within the 'Mark of the Beast', which means the people are part Nephilim, Jesus had human DNA only.

[@dannoah1002]

Steve Quayle published a GIANTS book, which had photo of an immigrant couple from Europe in the 1890's husband 8.4, wife 8 ft. They hada daughter who weighed 17 lbs. at birth. While the Son weighed 23lbs. A 16 foot couple birth a 34lb female and a 46 lb male, wherein, we enter obvious problems....however, the fallen angels utilized smaller angel watchers initially. The angels birthed hybrids at 10 ft., then a 12 footer and later 15 footers and so on and so forth... up until the 40 -60 footers were realized. The gradation approach succeeded. Steve Quayle, wrote about European castle diggers unearthing 36 foot giants... God sent 40-60 footers out of Holy Land with giant Asian hornets (foot long). The grasshoppers of 10 spies time were 2 foot long.

[@Zaloomination]

If you wanna push the connection of the giants to serpent worship they allegedly propagated: you know what also continues to grow throughout their lives? Snakes! (and all reptiles)

[@mariagerber6209]

I'm listening to your arguments about the nephilim mothers. Wasn't people in the antedeluvian world larger/taller/robust being nearer to the source because of plenty oxygen (diminished after flood). I refer to the supposed grave of Noah's wive discovered in the mountains of Ararat, the skeleton being 12-15 foot.?

[@christophereddy4517]

Great conversation until Brian said that bodybuilders are ghey. Have you actually ever trained with bodybuilders? I trained bodybuilding for over half a decade, and was made a far more effective fireman than when I trained powerlifting and strongman Because bodybuilding trains for strength through muscular endurance, which also trains cardio. We would frequently work out until we were beyond tired, nauseous and shaking from fatigue, and then we kept pushing past that. It was the perfect training modality for the fire service. I challenge you to find a man who is serious about bodybuilding, and then train with him. Try to keep up. By the way, I’ve really appreciated the Ogden boys don’t fawn over one another in this series on this channel.

[@MegaDoug]

I’m kinda old but work out regularly; took a younger co worker to do my normal workout and he had to stop to throw up 🤔😞👍

[@NeetchianQueen]

Inca say the ancient ruins were from previous civilization and that they found them, if remnants survived that is understandable. Giants were known and documented by many explorers and old cultures alike. Also many mounds and tombs contents of giant skeletons and the later destruction and coverup of their existance is well known (and denied by the quackademics).

[@michaelcarter2314]

I came for the 13 year old girl banter, stayed for the giants

[@MegaDoug]

😆👍

[@brickfoxx1605]

"I like it because it fits neatly into the narrative" is not a good reason to make any decision.

[@ShirleyDiano-rv2mv]

i think they were probably born normal size but grew at an alarming rate considering they were hybrids of human and the heavenly beings called the watchers.The watchers were created by Elohim in the heavenly realm where time days,weeks, mouth, years,hours,seconds don't exist because the heavenly realm is eternal

[@reverendterminator]

21:24 could it be the gods of the nations, that fell? i know you had Heiser on, and he talked about 3 fall, Gen 3, Gen 6 and Gen 11..so could it be the fall in Gen 11, that resulted in more Nephilims?.. It looks like the Rebellion was not a one time event, but gradually over time. that could explain it. (they might not have seen everything that happened to those who fell in previous rebellions). Thanx for the discussion, it is great to hear about alternative possibilities.

[@whatshaploing8256]

One explanation is that when the author(s) of Genesis are talking about nephilim they are referring to all the legendary heroes of old(or at least contemporary with the original audience reading Genesis) who still persisted as 'gods' or demi-gods in lore. Many of the legendary heroes or deities worshiped by the early post-Flood civilizations were based on passed down stories of those figures from pre-Flood history. Literally hybrid angel/human offspring - some were giants but others had other gifts/abilities/power. Nephilim, in my opinion does not have to equal just giants, but is meant to say beings who are like demi-gods and almost never die, who grow to tremendous heights or are very strong, etc. When it says they existed after the Flood too - I believe that these post-Flood nephilim are referencing the Canaanite clans of giants descending from Anak. I believe it is possible that the spies who give the bad report say they saw the sons of Anak there - that it is possible Anak's literal sons were still alive at that time (100's of years old). TLDL - Nephlim were originally angel/human hybrids and some were really big, some very powerful/famous and in general were committing grievous enough sin that God cannot allow it anymore and destroys the earth. After the Flood, there are legendary ones existing too - but likely just the result of genetics passed down (longevity + some giant genes expressed by at least a few like Anak or Og). The first few sets of generations after Noah all lived to be 400-500 years old, and still had a much more robust immune system. These grandsons of Noah were also worshiped as gods (nephilim) by the later generations after Noah's grandsons all the way to the time of the Canaanites who are still in some relationship with the giants (cannibalism, etc). Canaanite giants, grand children of Noah like Nimrod, Anak, Og, etc were all nephlim but not as a result of direct angel/human breeding.

[@dawndakennemer2762]

My grandmother born in 1906 was 4'10" wore a size 4 shoe married at 16 and was in labor 3 days Margaret was 10 lb 10 Oz. And was perfect . But the labor , she only lived a few days.

[@CharlesWilson-e8v]

These guys not be despensationalest is not a deal breaker for me. I still enjoy the insight. Although understanding the despensations is important in order to rightly devide scripture.

[@kimberlina68]

They helped make sense of the 'unseen' realm, which helped seal my belief in God and our Savior Jesus Christ. ✝️🕊️💜 I didn't realize those unseen things were ALL evil . It's normalized in our Secular Society.

[@annamo6927]

That David could effectively wield Goliath's sword is proof that he wasn't 40 feet tall.

[@annamo6927]

@@popiyerby2088 my point was to rebut the notion that some of the Giants did get to be 40' tall. I believe Goliath was. 9' tall and so we're the rest of the Giants. Ancient stories of 40' tall giants were embellishments or exaggerations.

[@scottloutner5253]

Or the giants sword was a very short sword. As the Roman's used

[@scottloutner5253]

A full sized sword to Davis. A bit of a long dagar to Goliath.

[@MrCarpediem6]

​@@popiyerby2088does not depend on which version of the old testament to the two, original is Septuagint is about 6 ft 8 and the later masoretic is greater, at 10..?

[@annamo6927]

@@popiyerby2088 thanks for the sermon!😉

[@loadingmikke7451]

In norwegian folklore we had trolls, big giants that was of the land. With trees and brush on them, thats how big they where. Oh, and they could smell a christian mans blood for some reason.

[@dandathomas6852]

Joel is going to preach a series from the book of Norwegian folklore.

[@exclamationpointman3852]

Just looked up cedar trees: from 120 to 160 feet high! When they said "we seem like grasshoppers" they meant LITERALLY! Either way:if GOD give you the victory, GOD give you the victory.

[@danielwarton5343]

I do like the Christian Whyfiles I just taught 1 Samuel 21 to our Sunday school and David was given Goliath’s sword by Ahimalech when he went to get food and a weapon. David didn’t day that it was too much for him to bear and unusable. He took it gladly and said what a good sword it was.

[@Tirawley13]

There are the giant spearheads of Kfsr Monaash, which seem impractically large and were found in Rephaim territory. It's possible Goliaths sword would not have been unusable because they were one handed short swords, unlike a medieval, two handed great sword or something like a Katzbalger. The other thing to bear in mind is the watering dow of the bloodlines and decreasing height. I always think about Goliath during the scene in Troy, where Achilles slays his larger opponent in single combat .

[@diannemoore1123]

Watching from Wisconsin ❤❤❤

[@Endtimes24]

I believe that after the flood, some of the fallen angels did it again . Mt hermon and thats where king og came from as well.

[@stormhawk31]

Here's another idea: We know that, pre-Flood, ALL animals were considerably bigger than they are today. Perhaps the same was true of pre-Flood humans. Maybe a normal human WAS 8 feet tall or more, which would make the giants SIGNIFICANTLY taller than that, and would enable a normal woman of the time to give birth to what would be considered an enormous baby today. It's a thought.

[@brummiepilgrim2223]

Robert Waldow was the tallest Man in recent times and he was 8ft 11. A man of average height would seem tiny. Mr Waldow had a pituitary gland genetic issue he lived until he was 22. If did live it's possible he could grow more.

[@allenhamby6472]

I seen where people claimed that they found Noah's wife grave and the woman in it was 11 feet tall in turkey

[@stacyspruiell]

What abt the possibility , since the sons of God defiled every living thing including fish the flood did not wipe out, that water wouldn’t wipe out that remnant.

[@ShirleyDiano-rv2mv]

could bigfoot be the nephilim desendants

[@ShirleyDiano-rv2mv]

because there were giants after the flood and lets not forget that Esau Isaac son was described as a hairy man.is it to far fetch to think decendents of giants would be hairy.

[@dandathomas6852]

Obviously. Also Andre the Giant.

[@rafaels.3969]

These Giants spread to north America and were encountered by the HAWILAH, AZAMA- Olomatika, and much latter NOOCHI-Punt, Meshech peoples migrating from south America 3600bc, and Siberia, -until-AD1000.

[@251richardhudson7]

I'm also leaning towards the nephalim, never stop growing theory. How do Crocodile and alligators grow? Small enough to be more then 5 at a time, hiding in theirs mothers mouth for protection, when small.

[@naomiseney9571]

I love this conversation. I have often wondered the same thing about smaller women giving birth to giants. One thing that the Bible does not specify on is whether the women actually survive the births. Just a thought.

[@mikecude4167]

At the 23 minute mark I think of Matthew 3:9 And do not presume to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ For I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.

[@chtomlin]

Giants had reptile DNA... allowing them to continue to grow all during their lives

[@jamescox953]

"Seed of the serpent"

[@Gordysan1]

20:18 In the book of Enoch, the leader of the Watchers negotiated to have I think 10% remain to influence the humans. Additional giants could have been born post flood. It might have been the book of Jubilees but I think it’s the book of Enoch.

[@TonyRomeo9796]

No way on a second incursion. If you read Enoch 13:5 the angels were terrified and even asked Enoch to try and obtain forgiveness. There is no way any angel would fare to do it again but then again would angels learn from others mistakes, or, like humans, they have to make them, themselves.lol. they know it's a eternity of punishment. But you never know

[@hollylc9914]

The author of The Witching Hour, Anne Rice, describes a supernatural birth between a Mayfair woman and a supernatural "stranger" that has been a watcher and helper of her family for many generations to insure their wealth and position.The resulting pregnancy was incredibly short, the unborn infant grew so insanely fast that it forced itself out prematurely; continued to rapidly grow then ran off into the woods moments after. Rice certainly had some insights into the Watcher's.

[@mthnz-xn3ck]

Lasher and the Mayfair Witches

[@dwightmorris2512]

U guys taught me a couple new things I'll tell y'all how the giants survived great deluge ancient submarines. I seen the hieroglyphs

[@dandathomas6852]

No doubt bro.

[@benparker1822]

The comment, 'He's like a tree,' was said of the Daniel Boone tv show actor Fess Parker.

[@MiAboriginal]

The Giants do indeed exist today! I’ve seen them. I’ve recorded them speaking…

[@ShanaJane82]

Can u share? I think they are hiding in mountains

[@dandathomas6852]

Do they sound like Joel?

[@dandathomas6852]

I know, right? They sound so funny….wait, are you high?

[@dandathomas6852]

Everyone knows they are hiding under the bed. I just told my daughter last night. She believes me.

[@MiAboriginal]

@@dandathomas6852 don’t be dumb. Seek first to understand. I speak Truth…

[@tylerbarrett6652]

Okay guys... I've been asking some similar questions... and I noticed that Noah was 500 years old before he fathered his 3 sons... and we don't have exact dates on that. So I'm thinking... what man could resist procreation for 500 years? Or did he and his wife just have daughters up to that point? Strange... seems unlikely... but not impossible. If I remember correctly, the Bible doesn't mention Noah's wife... but we find out through other much less trustworthy sources that he married his sister (Namaah?) IDK... but we don't have a statement that she was perfect in her generations... though if Noah was then she would have been also unless she had a different mother? Neither do we know much about Japheth's, Shem's, or Ham's wives - but it would seem to me that if God intended to cleanse the bloodlines of the living, he would not have overlooked an adulterated bloodline... right? I agree that a second incursion seems unlikely... and I too thought that perhaps there were some fallen who had not yet fulfilled that oath they allegedly took when they all agreed on this course of action. They were stuck... they had to fulfill their oaths at some point - but in the meantime it would seem that many of them tried to repent and atone... but God wasn't having it just then. The watchers were the teachers of mankind if I'm reading all of this right... so there were some who took human form so that they could interact and educate? The other thing that I think I remember is that Lamech was very concerned when Noah was born because he appeared as one of the Angels... and so he went to ask his Dad Mehtusalah and elsewhere we learn that they both consulted with Enoch somehow... before they got an answer that in fact Noah's genes were not contaminated... but I wouldn't put it past God to have some hand in which genes ended up in his DNA and what characteristics or traits were expressed. Perhaps mankind needed a little tune up or something in order to deal with the remainder of the evil that would still be infecting the world after the flood. Anyway... I'm glad someone is having these conversations. The whole divine council worldview has MAJOR implications if it ever becomes widely accepted.... and it seems to me that it makes a whole lot more sense than previously held worldviews. SOMETHING should account for the spiritual warfare... right? So... yeah... thanks for putting stuff like this out there.

[@discoveringsasquatchcrypti8973]

✨I can’t wait to see what you say on ep 5. I am pretty sure that you may know , what I know. Nice work , keep 🙏🏼 we need as many people to wake up as much as possible today ! Our time is getting shorter here . The signs 🪧 are all before us . Stay repentant and truly committed to the word . Jesus Christ is the way , truth and the life❣️ May you all be Blessed 🕊️✨ ✨🫧🌲🦶🏿🌳🧚‍♂️🌲🐕‍🦺😊🕊️✨

[@tentoesdownchristianity]

Also, when you were talking about the strong man and sword, I did some body mass index calculations on Goliath. Now I assumed he would be muscular but not to the point of being immobile. So I compared him to a 5'10 200 pound man who is just naturally farmer strong and if comparable Goliath would weigh about 560 pounds in shape able to walk 25 or 30 miles a day if the army needed to do so not a man who is strong, just so he could be strong and his whole life revolves around it so he can't move hardly. But a man strong simply because he's a giant. But even a skinny and thin person at 9'9 would weigh over 440 and have the ligament and tendon strength far beyond any man alive today.

[@markharris27]

It’ clearly states there were giants in the earth in those days and after insinuating that some survived.

[@RightResponseMinistries]

Or new giants were made once more.

[@markharris27]

@@RightResponseMinistries except that is a larger leap than some survivors. Or it will say that sons of God went into women once more or again and more giants were made. Were I to say to you I had a hornet infestation, then got a guy in and I still had them, is that the same as me saying and then they came back? No hence they remained makes more sense grammatically speaking.

[@sJs78]

Because of their angelic gene traits, they have no growth inhibitors, they where born the size of a large baby birth today, and grew very quick, hence their insaciable appetites.!

[@cortedemico]

32:15 that they died in childbirth is not a good notion. The angels taught them many things which were used in their society. Wouldn’t be a good deal for the women or the angels.

[@JoshxDude92]

52:43 Demolition Ranch!!

[@ma34tn]

Love that channel!!

[@GoogIeSearch-yt7ln]

11:10 As to how the giants survived the flood gentleman, I don't believe they did and I believe that would contradict the Bible. The most logical explanation I believe is found in the book of jubilees when Noah's (grandson or son?) finds ancient writing on a stone from before the flood and is scared to reveal it to Noah so he secrets it away.. This leaves an actual gateway through text to not contradict the Bible at all and allow once again for man to have freewill to choose a path. To sin or not to sin, to becone slaves of sin or remain sons of righteousness.. I would think the abzu(abyss, or portal) was reopened by Noah's descendant and the watchers who were shut out found a doorway back in after being destroyed. I also think the reemergence is a echo of eden, showing mankind always has a free will choice. It also appears to be emblematic of Christ rising and destroying the curse. Because tho the curse lives today it only lives for those who choose to love sin, we who of freewill choose righteousness are risen and rising above the chaos of sin and it's unholy mark

[@gangelo777]

The assumption is that women back then were the same as today from a resiliency standpoint . Whether or not their mothers died or survived is of no consequence; we just know that there were giants.

[@loboferoz4126]

I check on Patreon for the series but it’s locked, wondering if they were free for just that day?

[@abrahamkennedywashington8342]

You guys are cool dudes! I would love to sit in the room and talk with you guys!!

[@dandathomas6852]

Are you bipolar?

[@johnald848]

A black mountain. A lodestone mountain exist where the north winds do not blow. A place beyond the north winds.

[@radroofer]

Nobody knows what kind of tools they had. Theyre technology made ours look like kindergarten

[@DebbieHardingPastelTapas]

So, with the ability to trace genetics, do we see anything in current genes that would point to the giants?

[@dazdavis7896]

Babel. The 3rd divine rebellion. That is how the giants returned; the events at the Tower of Babel. That top of that tower was essentially a giant ouija board.

[@reverendterminator]

thats a good point!

[@timtauber5557]

Anything with breath on the “face” of the earth. Underground caverns are not on the face of the earth. Also some Rephaim had fish like attributes which could have allowed them to survive in a flood. In either case I believe it is quite possible the giants that survived the flood came up out of the ocean and continued their desire of corrupting men’s hearts.

[@WindyGardener]

As for Noah drilling into the ark, he would not have been able to. The Lord sealed the ark.

[@kimberlyharper7551]

Do we have to assume that the first generation of this unholy offspring was the final result? I breed dogs, so I'm thinking sometimes it takes a while to get the result you want and you breed for certain characteristics or physical traits. Couldn't the fallen angels have used that approach? Using larger female offspring to birth even larger nephilim?

[@johnjessey6955]

I don’t think there were any large or let’s say fat people back then. I believe all male and female specimens were nearly perfect, and did not have many of the genetic defects we have today. I’m thinking a world of Swedish swimsuit, models, and Arnold Schwarzenegger‘s. “Without the steroids, of course.” I mean if you think about Sarah Abraham’s wife who the Bible says is so beautiful in her late 80s, that Abraham tells her to lie and say she is his sister. Because Pharaoh is going to see her and make a concubine out of her. you don’t do that with the wrinkled up 80-year-old woman.

[@BenTrotterNZ]

This was a really heavy episode. Definitely has a lot of weight to it. Wasn't a light conversation for sure. Real tall order to cover this topic. No small matter this discussion. Very appropriate having giants of the faith to discuss this. 🤣🤣🤣

[@KilluminatiENG]

Every before the flood would off been gigantic compared to todays life the oxygen was more and things grew much bigger.

[@EarlSimmons-f2n]

“In giant culture…” 🤣

[@klaudiab71]

How about the theory of falling angels using flying machines and leave earth during the flood and inhabit the black side of the moon, and come to earth to experiment with human race again

[@dandathomas6852]

Obvious

[@hgpilott]

My bed is about 7ft and I'm 5'7. I don't think because OG has a 14ft bed that means he is at least 14ft.

[@TwentyTwoThirtyThree]

Okay, but even 12 feet is insane!

[@hgpilott]

​@@TwentyTwoThirtyThreeI actually agree with these guys on the possible size of giants. I just thought the bed thing was poor reasoning

[@LatimusChadimus]

53:27 Strongmen also take certain supplements to compete at an elite level. Folks then did not

[@mbaker8188]

Everyone knows the giants aren't in the NBA guys... They're in the NFL! 🏈 🗽 LOL

[@worldbigfootcentral3933]

There are 3 cubits, standard cubit is 17.5". The others are shorter and longer

[@i.k.8394]

Robert Wadlow?

[@patrickc3419]

8’ll!! 😁

[@fowlplayfunnyfarm1234]

Could it be that the giants might rise again?? 2:57 Especially in the one world government? Could it be that in part that’s why men’s hearts will fail them from fear? That’s a description of a myocardial infarction folks! Heart attack!

[@naomiseney9571]

Still watching don’t know if you guys touch on that or not.

[@cathyrockwell4938]

What if… they aren’t giants but we’re really tiny?!

[@Paul-wm6cq]

They had a yellow submarine 🤣🤣🤣