JD Vance, class in America, and the future of the right - with Christopher Caldwell

[@vicicooper4720]

Freddy is a great interviewer- informed, humble and polite.

[@bristolcorvid8894]

Fella seems kind and sincere. He made an excellent editorial choice in selecting an image for their magazine cover - poor Notre Dame smoldering after the fire. This artistic and determined choice impressed me. And floral ties are ✅.

[@lotus7eater]

This is what the Spectator should be, so very much more conservative than Fraser Nelson who doesn't seem to be a conservative at all.

[@turbolevo8703]

Nelson is Blairism adjacent.

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

​@@turbolevo8703 Both Scots after all & New Labour was a Scottish project.

[@BobSmith-fx9sz]

“In various countries and times, leaders of groups that lagged behind, economically and educationally, have taught their followers to blame all their problems on other people - and to hate those other people.” - Thomas Sowell

[@martinzies2874]

"Polarising figure" is such a generic and lazy term. Not to mention untrue as he was liked universally prior to the medias painting of him.

[@edwardTisk-ix8nj]

1. College grad. 2. War veteran. 3. Businessman. 4. Congressional elected Statesman.

[@megbreezy7543]

@@edwardTisk-ix8nj and young

[@LouRyan-f1u]

Hes a fake hillbilly who’s changed his names multiple times. 😂

[@johnnycactus5140]

First veteran then Ohio State grad

[@LouRyan-f1u]

@@johnnycactus5140 fake hillbilly name changer, what next his pronouns? #OPPORTUNIST

[@brainxtc2171]

@@edwardTisk-ix8nj don’t forget a compulsive liar.

[@lawsonspedding6136]

JDVance is a win win ! An intellectual, and a working class background ! And a true conservative non war-mongering business savy !

[@michaelgalt388]

It is very refreshing to see an intellectual with amazing communication skills in a presidential ticket.

[@alvarobarcala]

Intellectual??? this guy has not read a book in his whole life.

[@gerilynganger3190]

TO THE HOST - VANCE DID NOT GO TO HARVARD. 'THE OHIO' IS WHERE HE GOT HIS DEGREE ... THEN ON TO YALE LAW.

[@scottbuchanan9426]

Thanks for the all-caps. We wouldn't have got the point otherwise...

[@consciouscrypto3090]

I like this Vance guy.

[@Hwillijonl]

Great discussion. Thanks.

[@jozsefnemeth935]

God is not superstition. Devine providence has always been part of Christian faith and teaching

[@skbkelly9779]

I read Hillbilly Elegy a few years ago, never imagining Vance would run for office. I was disappointed when Vance came out as Anti Trump, it never made sense since his background was very much from the left behind people in America, whom Trump wanted to help uplift. Glad he came round.

[@johnnycactus5140]

I did enjoy the book as well. Despite my politics are different.

[@martycrow]

But the conclusion of the book seems to be "we've only ourselves to blame" for rust belt White underachievement and dysfunction. *I'm talking specifically about the Appalacian communities as described in the book

[@gerry4281]

Follow the money. He will do what he’s told.

[@gerry4281]

Hillbillies Scots Irish.

[@michaelgalt388]

Many of us who didn’t like trump in 2015/2016 couldn’t reconcile the image of what was being reported to the reality of what Trump was accomplishing. The media did heavy damage the last 8 years, with the help of social media before Musk bought Twitter.

[@DarkLord-iz7vk]

I don't know why British journalists reporting events in the USA often refer to 'Teamsters', but never explain what a Teamster is, as we don't otherwise use the term in Britain.

[@unblessedcoffee1457]

Freddie in his absolute element over all this Trump drama.

[@toby5904]

Freddy is such a good interviewer.

[@dbiedler]

Thank you.

[@jgrant944]

@Freddy - thank you, brilliant to hear these great American thinkers: Kimball, now Caldwell, talking about current events. Would be fantastic to hear from the likes of Y Levin, O Cass, WR Mead, R Dreher, et al, in addition.

[@jgrant944]

Cass talks to the other Freddie (Sayers, UnHerd) about Vance VP here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jaaudZWlgbqNg5I

[@nuqwestr]

JD Vance's wife is South Asian who grew up in a devout Hindu home.

[@craigr4763]

Lucky bastard.

[@fanthony]

@@nuqwestr looks like she has more or less Christianized now. Vance underwent a very public conversion from Protestantism to Roman Catholicism while being married to her. She played a part in helping him get there. This is another amazing aspect of diversity in America, that the media doesn’t like to talk about. She represents the very best of India’s academic and intellectual elite. She’s a very fine and formidable addition to the Republican arsenal.

[@king.g-l1g]

"Right wing"🇮🇱☭ ✊🤣

[@nuqwestr]

@@fanthony I agree, she clerked for wo Supreme Court Justices and grew up in a very diverse area of Southern California. I'm still learning about her. "How wife's Hindu faith helped JD Vance, Trump's vice-president pick. Usha Vance said her Hindu upbringing led her to support husband JD Vance's own religious quest. Talking about raising their children in a household with two different faiths, Usha said it was important to communicate." - India Today

[@Stoddardian]

@@craigr4763 Why is he lucky?

[@nuqwestr]

JD Vance, Yale no Harvard

[@andytongdee921]

My God! Did you just roll out of bed?! 🤣

[@garypalmer1122]

Not a good look.

[@jez49647]

​@@garypalmer1122 Don't listen to them, Freddy. It's a cool look. Scruffy....Zero F's given...Very based, especially for a Spectator man...

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

Mostly just needs a haircut

[@cpharris41]

Which one? They both look quite rumpled to me.

[@michawill6599]

​@@jez49647What'd I miss?

[@PEGGYFRIESE]

Very informative thank you

[@RichardEnglander]

I wanted Tulsi, I think she has the ability to reach across the aisles and heal, play the good cop to Donnies bad cop. Yin/Yang

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

The Donald will play more good cop now, so Vance will play more of the bad cop.

[@RichardEnglander]

@@GodsOwnPrototype maybe... That would be interesting and probably best for the nation and the rest of us, it would be great to see a mature more stately Donald now.

[@jeannemurray1046]

A VOTE FOR TRUMP IS A VOTE TO JD VANCE. J.D. THANK YOU FOR SERVING IN MARINES FOR 4 YEARS. J.D. IS A WONDERFUL SURPRISE...INTELLIGENT, Younger, OPEN MINDED..

[@richardkut3976]

Vance is a true populist. Anyone who ever read the "Cross of Gold" speech probably would not regard Trump as a populist.

[@Michaelfrikkie]

In Vance, they simply introduced the end of sclerotic post-WWII political thinking.

[@gerry4281]

He’s backed by big money. They are all the same.

[@anavenegas7826]

JD Vance smart & 👍 young

[@DorothyCain-k1i]

Being Catholic is about life. God created life and we as humans need to respect what God has bestowed on us..Practicing Catholics take our vows seriously, like marriage..For better or worse, in sickness and in health, for richer or poorer until death do us part..

[@Durnyful]

Surely it's core is being a follower of Christ?

[@MarcusCorbett]

Good Lord! RFK got a mention from the Spectator.

[@gerilynganger3190]

fREDDY - VANCE DID NOT GO TO HARVARD. HE GRADUATED FROM THE OHIO. THEN ON TO YALE LAW.

[@edwinblake]

Very informative!

[@anavenegas7826]

JDVance great 👍 TRUMP win win 🏆 like the interview

[@fredwu6000]

What puzzles me on Mr. Vance is that he stated (in a recent speech) that America's biggest problem is the large number of immigrants (legal and illegal) entering the country. We all learn (from books and schools) that the essence of Capitalism is market and competition. There's no mention of national boundaries. Just let the 'best' win no matter where they are. Moreover, America was and is built by immigrants (and diverse immigrants at that, unlike some other countries in the Americas), right ?! So I am really puzzled. My view. Hahaha !

[@michaelgalt388]

Pretty sure he said immigrants are welcome but it will be under our conditions. Translation, legally. Trump in the All In podcast before the debate entertained the idea giving automatic visas to those who have graduated with a degree, especially in Tech. I can only assume it is because of the artificial intelligence race, which is the next big industry, and of course for national security.

[@lauramcconney9367]

Just like Kennedy who cares about the people being in control of Government!!!

[@shirleybalinski4535]

The Vice Presidential spot is more of a resume builder & PR JOB than anything else. The VP does speeches. Shores up fund raising & votes, attends weddings & funerals. Meets dignitaries, shakes hands, cuts ribbons. The job is good for learning on the job. The VP is the " wife" to the President.

[@tanler7953]

Two VPs in particular stand out as being quite different. Nixon under Eisenhower and George H. W. Bush under Reagan both traveled the world extensively and built up personal relationship with many world leaders that they put to good use once they set up their own administrations.

[@shirleybalinski4535]

@@tanler7953 ...very true in both those cases.. Generally, that is why some relatively unknown person is chosen. Plus the fact that most Presidents do not enjoy being upstaged by a well known, perhaps even more knowledgeable person.

[@ramstrong1961]

Glenn Greenwald, who is JD Vance and what does he really believe (Teamsters Union Pres supports Vance)

[@brendancorrigan]

There seems to be much to admire about Vance - his Catholicism aside. A more *traditional* traditional conservative it could be said!

[@eemoogee160]

"Senility of Biden and his followers" lol

[@kempfkempfkempf]

Freddy Gray attempted to engage Christopher Caldwell about a possible connection between Vance's conversion to Catholicism and the Integralist movement among American conservative intellectuals, such as Adrian Vermeule at Harvard Law School and members of the Claremont McKenna College faculty. But Caldwell, who's a conservative of an earlier generation, seemed unfamiliar with the phenomenon, which punches well above its weight among populist nationalists in leadership positions .

[@brianpollard4350]

Yahoo!

[@martycrow]

There is a reason why Peter Thiel picked JDV to promote, first as his employee and second to Trump, as a candidate for the Senate. He's only been a Senator for under two years. Also Hindu Indian wife and a vegetarian! The story is not quite as simple as people make out.

[@Anna-tj7mp]

@@martycrow vegetarian 🥦🥬🥒🫑🌽🥑🫛🫛🤯?

[@prosoblue]

Vance married his wife way before he became a devout Catholic. Different beliefs is no grounds for divorce, pray for her conversion.

[@martycrow]

@@prosoblue Modern Hinduism does not prohibit a person to also embrace other faiths. Hinduism is not a unified faith, but more a philosophy, culture and way of life. JDV married in 2014 when he was a non-practicing (Pentacostal) Protestant, and went through Hindu initiation. He is vegetarian and maintains Hindu cultural practices at home and with Usha (a practicing observant Hindu) and their children and in-laws, with whom he and Usha lived for a while and then close to in California. They are regular visitors to India, including attending Hindu spiritual retreats. I don't say all this to criticise JDV, but just pointing out how things are.

[@martycrow]

@@Anna-tj7mp Yes, as in does not eat meat or fish etc. Was I unclear?

[@Anna-tj7mp]

@@martycrow but what's wrong with being vegetarian? You make it sound so dreadful...

[@shireenmcquade1951]

Very good discussion. Learned a lot about JD Vance.

[@jae2686]

Freddy, in his haughty ignorance equates Trump’s belief in God, as “Superstition”, he doesn’t even understand how bigoted that sounds.

[@christopherflux6254]

I don’t think Trump believes in God. But he has to pretend he does to hold the Republican base.

[@jez49647]

As an apatheist, i would also say that religion and superstition does seem very similar. I don't say it to be unkind, but it is what i think and I'm guessing it's probably the same for Freddy. Feel free to try and explain why it's bigoted, but i probably wouldn't understand either, tbh.

[@bdnl6268]

@@jez49647 religion has to do with aligning oneself with ultimate reality and truth in faith and trust, in Providence (ie God.) Superstition is trying to control reality for ones own benefit. It is close to magical thinking.

[@etherspin]

I don't think it was a reference to Trumps claimed faith but stuff like luck and omens

[@1LittleNonna]

​@@jez49647 I would call Freddy's manner condescending, and his "haughty" manner of seeming dismissive supeirority is not something I, personally like in an interviewer. His calling any religious person "superstitious" was gratuitous and showed an ignorance of the importance of religion and God to a large percentage of US voters. I think his style is very offputting in general, but that's just me.

[@joaosabino2909]

Vance was recently Feature 5 Times in the posts by Trump Junior - scoop by Doug In Exile!

[@flameofthewest6196]

The more one really understands traditional Catholic teaching (not the Woke, hippie Jesus Godspell post Vatican 2 version) the more President Trump is the only possible choice.

[@geoffwales8646]

'Conservative Christian' is an oxymoron.

[@zhalberd]

“Structures of permission” - added to library. Excellent interview. More on J.D. Vance please! Fascinating person and potential future of conservatism? If we can even call it that moving forward.

[@Brommear]

You can take a Hillbilly out of the bush but can you get the bush out of the Hillbilly?

[@edwardbell9795]

Oh Freddie, J D Vaaance.....do you also say Alabaaama and Maaas?!

[@misteroz]

MAGA needs a succession plan if it’s to continue after Trump leaves office. Of all the potential VP candidates, I think Vance is probably the most likely to continue that legacy.

[@DavidMotherland]

FYI it was Jimmy Carter's deregulation of trucking that destroyed the Teamsters Union

[@doctorwoohoo1152]

Trump news cycle is moving so fast, Freddie hasn't even had time to comb his hair since Saturday.

[@timfinneran5047]

Trump lacks nothing…. Getting JD in as VP is awesome…. USA needs more MAGA not less.

[@christiansmith-of7dt]

I feel bad for trump because he doesnt have alot of experience , he grew up in a shoe box

[@christopherflux6254]

He’s someone who doesn’t know Pakistan is a nuclear power. How can he be trusted with the nuclear codes if he doesn’t know which other countries have nuclear weapons?

[@bwofficial1776]

No one cares about Pakistan.

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

His wife's Indian & he's a former marine so I'm pretty sure he does. It was a poorly contrived joke.

[@jenniferfisher7455]

Vance is good looking he has my vote ❤

[@Puddlesmolly]

😂

[@keekeemyfirstcat8410]

JD Lance is a good person, moral and smart with experience in the military and as a honest politician. He will be good for all people.

[@amcluesent]

Has he not heard of Britain?

[@juditheriault4597]

Why does Britain matter?? It's not like your country has much skin in the game. So what does this mean?? He's not from Britain. So what does this refer to?

[@mattwardman]

@@juditheriault4597 I'd suggest we do. Trump is clear that he can sell the USA's sensitive information to whoever he wants in his personal interest, and SCOTUS has essentially declared him to be above the law. Through Five Eyes and other alliances the UK is exposed to the same, now legal as ruled by SCOTUS, betrayal.

[@Дарья-я2е8к]

Разве скажешь,что Вэнсу 38 лет???

[@vancouverteacherbc]

a hindummm Hindu

[@davidap257]

the "money" was behind Nikki Haley ? bullshit.

[@jdg9999]

Does Caldwell really not know about the whole Trad Cath trend among the dissident right? He seemed to think you were talking about urban working class Democrats who tend to be from traditionally Catholic ethnic groups.

[@badlyniceness2315]

The beard and the carpetbagger..very nice..

[@Benedict401]

500 miles.

[@stevebeschakis9775]

I'm trying to figure out if Vance is real or a clever phony.

[@susie6133]

Me too

[@michaelgalt388]

Check out his old book tour and speeches on youtube. He’s the real deal, and i hope he continues to be. DC is very seductive. He has achieved elite status. But like Trump, he became a class traitor, turning his back on the elites. His senate voting record seems consistent on his desire to help the working class and forgotten. Like what the guest said, he is really really smart. But unlike many intellectuals, he is a gifted communicator.

[@bonniejordan8192]

I thought it was interesting.

[@jozsefnemeth935]

Trump s hopefull come back is similar to Viktor Orbans in 2010 aftler 2002 similar defeat. Trump once called Orban and himself twins.

[@king.g-l1g]

"Right Wing" 🇮🇱☭ 😎🤣

[@MultiCren]

I love Vance, but his and the republicans views on Ukraine are so damn short sighted, if they think they can ignore this problem then they are on another planet. It’s true that Europeans need to take their defence more seriously and I wholeheartedly agree with that, but American isolationism makes the world a more dangerous place for democracies!

[@craigr4763]

@GalacticGalahad This is perhaps the most crucial rebuttal.

[@AnonymousBosch]

You mean the war that the west instigated?

[@Moonchilling]

@GalacticGalahadand Germany sniffed Putin for their oil and cackled when President Trump told them that their behavior was dangerous. Now they’re trying to build their military, lol.

[@Durnyful]

They've made it extremely dangerous for Ukrainian democracy. It's gone!

[@michaelgalt388]

Prioritizing is not the same as isolationism. The US has no real national interest in a prolonged Ukraine conflict, which is why diplomacy is what they are pushing over sending tens of billions to Ukraine with no end game plan. Fighting is a last resort in cases where there is no national interest. Vance i think is correct in focusing our resources on Asia/Taiwan because of the current artificial intelligence race, which will be the next huge industry, and national security.

[@manlath]

Painful watch Lee Atwater's disciples

[@DerDudelino]

I think even a lot of Democrats will ask themselves: Do we really want a grandpa in The White House, who is barely able to read the teleprompter and says weird things on every stage he is on? Or a very strong President who dodged a bullet and didn't just ran away, but stood his ground. It's not just a political question, but a representative - Biden can't represent the United States, that would be a bit of an embarrassment going forward.

[@richardloach610]

Trump is a one off, there is no next generation Trump candidate, Vance is way off there

[@jsigur157]

Trump never was defeated and that's a huge difference from Nixon. Your guest feels like to me, a Rhino. That's not a complement

[@BryieURuncal2023]

It can't be bad talking to a slick talking used car salesman such as JD Vance you won't believe they had owns especially that undercoat

[@meeranraees3183]

T 0:19

[@keewng]

VP JDV is Trump soft windbag in the making!

[@geoffwales8646]

'Conservative Christian' is an oxymoron.

[@RubenRodriguz]

You give a gallon of words to give a teaspoon full of thought. You must love to hear yourself talk just cut to the chase. Boring

[@samehmohamed2027]

awful interview

[@gerilynganger3190]

Don't bother ever watching Spectator. He doesn't know his subject matter. His guests don't do their homework either and are not wise historians.

[@WoodrowWagner]

A pathetic interview !!

[@freddoformica7598]

America" american? It is a exclusive false identity. Ther is not a County called "América." America is the name of the american continent. There isn't no America country listed in the Organization of the AMERICAN States ( O A S) nor in the United Nations. You use the Eurocentric, Anglo centric, misnomer to call "America" to the United States, as is listed in the OAS & The UN.

[@Stoddardian]

Vance is an obvious grifter.

[@badlyniceness2315]

And a beard..

[@rumekpadamrophe912]

@@Stoddardian Yeah, he's a politician

[@Stoddardian]

@@rumekpadamrophe912 You think H*tler was a grifter?

[@bwofficial1776]

Good for him. There's nothing wrong with making money where you can make it.

[@Stoddardian]

@@bwofficial1776 Typical American.

[@winstonschwarz1636]

Boring. No insight. Petit bourgeois values.

[@robertdevos7]

Who is Vance? Another opportunistic leech following the money.