This Corruption Situation is Crazy

[@megamcee]

I've played the game for ~70h overall. I've ran a completely solo caravan, ran around pretty much the entire map, farmed rare resources (shoutout to my bois copper and zinc) - all in front of other players that were doing the same. I've stolen mobs from under whole parties as well. Not a single time was I PKed for any of that. The only time I experienced someone attacking me was during the pre-A2 stress test and it was just a random dude trying to PK everyone around him. He got immediately stopped and that was that.

[@dwgautier]

I've been in Alpha 2 for the last three weekends, I have a lvl 15 bard. I had ONE pvp experience thus far which was my group of guildies of four running away from a flagged group of 8 that wanted our farming spot. Even though we were on the losing end of a non skirmish, 'we ran', it was still a fun experience. We wrote down that guilds name and have sworn to get vengeance later!

[@isth3reno1else]

good luck!

[@vladyslavkukhtiuk6039]

Good, good

[@Wedcakskacdew]

Now 9:00 I also think you should flag if you approach combatants, like within 10m of active combat you get a count down to flag, 8secs or something, big red letters "You Will be Flagged in 6..5..4..3..2..1"

[@davidsumpter4933]

The pk deterrent system for starter nodes and close areas definately needs to be activated for the next phase. I also like the idea of corruption and blight being attached to the account and not just the current character.

[@ZapatosVibes]

I think safe starter zone is already being tested from what I heard

[@onyx4469]

@@ZapatosVibes Doesn't the starter zone have guards? in nodes the guards destroy anyone thats flagged why weren't they online in the starter zones?

[@Cascaden-i2v]

Agreed.

[@me1134]

The problem is when it happens to anyone else they don't ban. Example a couple weeks ago a person named notfuppo killed dozens of level 1s for hrs and tons of people reported him and they did absolutely. He was killing people 2-3 times before they could even get out of the starter room. But because it wasn't someone famous like asmongold nothing happened to him or his account. Tons of people were even defending the griefers saying they need to test the griefing mechanics...by greifing people.

[@isth3reno1else]

yeah that's not cool

[@StarfieldWX-tb42]

They're not wrong that the mechanics need to be tested, but they should roll up with friends who agree to be the victim on repeat to actually TEST the systems and not just kill randos trying to start the game. That is how you appropriately perform an alpha test.

[@ericgibbs3579]

There is also a big we found that you can flag up and fight a person, then at the last second you can flag down and the person kills yiu and they get corrupted. We reported this. Hopefully it gets fixed soon.

[@micheljolicoeur6094]

Pirate Software got streamed sniped over the weekend, Thor wasted no time in putting the guild on KOS. The idiots then tried to use out of game actions to try and get Thor banned by mass reporting him, to which Thor upgraded the KOS to KOS in Perpetuity (aka permanent KOS on that guild).

[@Texinga]

To fix the assisted suicide issue, corruption should destroy materials and gear more often than it drops it. Starting zones are like The Hardest Cut by Spoon: "They say you need a little...Protection."

[@Grimasaurus]

Suicide isn't without risk... you may not be able to get back to your gear before it de-spawns, or someone loots your corpse.

[@guardianv5846]

it's a start, but it doesn't incentive other people to hunt you. maybe if it can be locked from your account? but that might get tricky with the auction house. maybe you would have to pay a laundering fee to be able to equip it again if you got something that was dropped by you earlier.

[@brunobadjiduaso6378]

I'v seen a lot of people talking about getting the gear destroyed on death but i feel that being able to loop items can maintain a base line of players, if a players spends 200h and like it happened to you by protecting friends gets corrupted and ends up loosing important gear he might just quit. But if you know that you might farm other's loop instead of re farming it makes it more rewarding. At the same time gear thieves might appear, people organized to bait a player into corruption and kill him with several players. But at the same time i love the idea of an mmo that allows this kind of human interactions, the best stories are made from this risk reward sittuations.

[@Grux_ASG]

To be honest I’m not getting ganked at all, I’m thinking of playing flagged to incentivize people to kill me.

[@harrypeener]

My experience as well. I'm not seeing people running around killing each other all over the world. Only have had PvP twice, both of which my group instigated.

[@dl3472]

Only narcissists with a victim complex seems to be getting ganked

[@LemonHam5408]

I don’t think grieving will happened in the first weekend while everyone was still learning and fast-leveling. However if you joined game three weekends later, lv1 streamer became easy target for all those 2 weekends veteran players. I am pretty sure if any big streamers only started from now, they will get decent degrees of grieving cuz it is so easy now to grief new players compared to 2 weeks ago. (After asmongold incident, maybe people will scare to get banned to lose 100 dollars).

[@isth3reno1else]

this is a fair point as well and i agree, but I will say that there were people griefing pre a2 on the ptr servers and they could have just went over to do the same thing. one person i know stopped specifically because of the corruption penalties that currently exist. A flagging system allows for so many different interactions, and obviously not all of them are great. Intrepid was swift with this one though which should be applauded

[@lanakias1]

No one have attack me or try to PK me until now in Alpha 2. One time I saw a corrupted person and we hunt him and kill him in 20 seconds. Someone pick up his gear and thats it. After that I never experience such a thing. I was in parties that many press need and collect items that was not for their chars, they got kicked from party but no one PK them. Others pick up our loot when we die in dungeons and no one PK them. Really what happened to asmagold was personal and nothing more than this. The corruption system seems ok for me and very risky. No need further change or further penalties but is too early to decide that

[@irishsage2459]

Ultimately it doesnt matter. Those of us who are playing/will play in the future, we know what the deal is. However, cope aside, this was a bad look to those people who were on the cusp of trying this game. No matter what anyone says, the game NEEDS players to survive...pvp or how much you love it aside. And this hurt perception. The people who went out of thier way to grief Asmon did harm....thats just the reality if the situation. You, me, Nyce, everyone else invested...we are going to play. We are in our own bubble. Nothing is going to change that. But this did ruin that all important impression of the game. There's no way around it. Those that would've tried this before now will absolutely not. And thats bad.

[@isth3reno1else]

Yep I don't disagree. I think functionally intrepid is doing the right thing and the actions they did are more important than what happened...but that's not how everyone views it right now

[@StarfieldWX-tb42]

I'm more likely to play than before the Asmon event because I saw how swiftly the devs stepped in and cut that shit out, and how harsh their measures were for the few who didn't cease and desist. A+ management and deescalation of a potentially volatile situation. I'm more like to play as someone who isn't terribly interested in PvP but wants to be part of a hella fun game and larger community.

[@irishsage2459]

@@StarfieldWX-tb42 I like this attitude. However just from the number of replies saying the opposite, I sadly can say with confidence that the way you see it is the exception, not the rule. I wish more felt this way.

[@StarfieldWX-tb42]

@@irishsage2459 Oh it's definitely the exception. Just know that some of us are watching and seeing good choices being made regarding these kinds of incidents. The folks who knee-jerk negative to everything probably wouldn't make for very good compulsory PvP game players anyway. 😂

[@fyrestorme]

0:50 you're right. that's not true. mortal online 2 is actually what they're talking about. ashes is carebear land by comparison

[@z3rofang692]

I think one thing people aren't talking about, and Asmon mentioned himself is how it "wouldnt matter if its level 1 or later down the line" which I think matters alot. Asmons problem is only happening because its an alpha where everything is temporary. When the game comes out and things are permanent, and everyone hits lvl 50 eventually, no one would randomly pk asmon, go red and risk their gear at max level with permanence. It wont happen. The corruption system works. The risks work. And by that time and that level people are in guilds, running in groups, etc. Chances of it actually happening are low. Griefing for the point of griefing when the game comes out is very unlikely.

[@UncannySense]

its wouldnt matter Asmond cant even play PVE MMOs without instanced content. His fans are his own worst enemy...If he wants to play it he cant stream it...its that simple

[@AngryZealot]

Thank you for clarifying Ashes is a PvP game, could never find a clear answer from other youtubers. It's a shame but I genuinely don't have the time for PvP MMOs or zerg rush centered games I hope it turns out good for other players though.

[@wickedknight348]

0:53 I can 2nd this. 3 weekends solo pugging no guild tags 0% damage taken from other players.

[@Darsh-s4b]

Even if you come up with rules where guild members can’t loot your stuff, ppl will find loopholes and have allies guilds do it instead. I think the only way to somewhat mitigate that loophole is to have a 50% chance that the item dropped gets destroyed.. in that case I think ppl will really think twice before asking a friend to kill them. ArcheAge also had a prison system where after dying while corrupted, you’d be in jail and had to complete some tasks in there. I think that could also be a good way to mitigate things as the PK wouldn’t be able to simply come right back within a few minutes.. they’d also lose some valuable time doing prison tasks ..

[@isth3reno1else]

Yeah I don't specifically have a great way to fix it. The idea of broken gear isn't bad, but it takes away from the people that want to hunt corrupted players. Prison sounds like a good idea too. I just mostly wanted to highlight a loophole that i think should see an adjustment

[@Darsh-s4b]

Totally. And I’m glad you are pointing those loopholes. Because talking about these issues is how devs come up with solutions.. 😊

[@Wedcakskacdew]

TLDR; give us area denial with group challenges, like group Mak'gora 4:43 mins in, I thought about corruption abuse lot and I watching this I had an Idea (I agree allowing pvp is great cause if you try to grief by training mobs on me, following me everywhere etc etc, I have agency). To counter noncombat griefing, like corpse looting (currently your allies have to go corrupt to stop it) and corruption baiting, what if we could challenge other parties, raids and players to pvp by throwing down a flag that marks an area, instantly flagging your group for pvp, anyone else that remains inside the area after 30s gets flagged, this way you could do area denial, fight us or leave (we dont risk corruption to defend our teams loot or grind spot, you dont risk corruption to take it from us). If they choose to stay and pvp ensues you could have buffs for the winners and or debuffs for the losers, maybe (the hope being that winning your challenge or overcoming your enemy's should be impactful, and temporarily finale, not a case of ok we lose everyone regroup and force them to challenge us again and waste their time. challenge area could scale with challenger group size, solo 20m, 4 man 40m 16man 100m, 40 man 400m for example.

[@isth3reno1else]

This is a pretty cool idea. I like it

[@riseofduckente9868]

i think there has to be something like 1 free kill before the corruption system kicks in it doesnt make sence in a pvx game to not be able to contest recources. For example if i see someone in NW flagged up and mining some iron that i want i will attack him and try to get the ressource but that doesnt mean im killing them over and over. they should implement something like resently killed enemy so u get corrupted if u kill the same guy a 2nd time withing like 10 minutes or something that makes sence with the distance to respawn points

[@NijelBlakk]

Why didn't you just loot your friends stuff and trade it back to him??

[@isth3reno1else]

They beat me to it

[@SeanTheOriginal]

The courrption system is a good START. I want it to be even more harsh and punishing. Level 3 bans you week once you die, level 4 deletes the character outright, level 5 permanently shuts down your account and hardware bans you from the game. I'm just so fucking tired of good ideas for games being WASTED on PvP games. There's a reason PvP focused games die so quickly after coming out: most people are not psychopaths who only get pleasure from wasting people's limited time on this earth.

[@isth3reno1else]

Well that's not happening, corruption is getting less harsh.

[@ZapatosVibes]

Feels like the only way to prevent gear-dropping loopholes is to have a piece destroyed on death. Even guild restriction could be circumvented by having a guildless friend loot.

[@isth3reno1else]

This is a good idea for sure.

[@guardianv5846]

I thought it was interesting that this happened right after all the excitement around Pirate Software.

[@blktauna]

Where is the footage of this Sawman duel? And no I did not expect those people to get whacked on the first weekend because everyone was on the same footing at that point. Now we are in the part I fear, there's a group of fairly levelled folks who can now prey upon those who are just starting. The whole point being to build themselves up to a point where a noob isn't a threat. The people waiting for the noobs and the people w/o a guild to take revenge for them are a plague. This is a thing that will only be exacerbated by the continuing gap between the ogs and the new players.

[@isth3reno1else]

Sawman has the clip so you'll have to ask him lol. I get that second part too but it only takes a few hours tops to dominate level ones. I'd have thought we'd see it on the first or at least the second weekend. Either way it's a good change

[@blktauna]

@ too many tech glitches early on, this is the week I expected to start seeing it tbh. And Asmongold was a rare target of opportunity. Im glad they seem to be taking this incident seriously although id heard of others that had not been. Still something that public had to be addressed swiftly. And I will poke Sawman 😺

[@StarfieldWX-tb42]

I'm still going to wait until the game is fully launched and see how the average gamer who isn't worried about a $100+ account or losing early access acts around non-combatants. I'm not surprised at all to see 1) the current community playing very, very politely/within the rules of the systems beyond a couple outliers, or 2) that even with those things at stake, a handful of people were willing to risk it all to grief Asmon. Time will tell once the regular gaming crowd gets in there whether it turns into the same toxic shitshow that WoW PvP servers always become. If the overall community DOES track down and deal with the few bad actors and keep non-combatants safe, I'm all in, even with the occasional chances to be stuck in a PvP situation. If there are more corrupted players than expected, or the community just can't be bothered with taking care of them... this is not a game for me.

[@madhatten5123]

Easy fix for now for guild members trading back gear is to make corruption dropped gear “corrupted” and not tradable would fix it for the time being.

[@isth3reno1else]

for sure. i like that idea as well, so it drops on an NPC death or non guild death. idk something else

[@trugamer8489]

Idk how I feel about gear dropping i love pvp but as a casual player that works and wants to enjoy the game on my days off to lose my hard earned gear is kinda demoralizing for me that is.

[@Wedcakskacdew]

11:10, what about if there was dmg scaling for pvp, like lower lvl players take 5% less dmg per lvl difference after after 2 lvls for example

[@Wedcakskacdew]

eg lvl5 attacking lvl1, the lvl1 takes 10% reduced dmg, maybe capped at 40% reduction, if this mechanic was to strong it would favour zerging

[@madhatten5123]

@@WedcakskacdewThere have been similar systems in games before. New World used to have a damage scaling system based off level and it was widly abused. You would see level 30s that became god tier so people rolled low levels and kept them low level to farm max level players. It was funny and pretty fun but made the game kind of dumb. Max level should matter and there are better ways to protect low level players. PS I may or may not have a clip of farming 6 level 60s on a low level character over and over.

[@ajhenniggs5041]

This situation kind of bummed me out. Me and several other people got "harassed" by some Enveus members early on. We mentioned it in chat, discord, to GMs. Nothing happened. This was Pre A2. But everything that is being used as a rationale with banning these randos should've applied to our situation. I think its pretty clear why it didn't. Same goes for this vs the Thor situation. Seems like if its a streamer, the rules get a bit bendy. They can harass players into quitting with that being a stated goal, and its okay. If it happens on the flipside, not okay. I just want consistency. If people got banned for what happened to Asmon, why were the Enveus peeps on Resna Pre-A2 not banned. It was a widespread issue. On top of downright exploiting to grief people even further. Through one of the stress tests, the game was damn near unplayable because of this behavior. I thought the whole reason we strove to not be P2W and be against RMT was to keep the game at a baseline of fairness. If people are getting special carvouts...why did I pay to play the game? I don't want a special carvout, I just want to play the game in a fair fashion like everyone else, but its seeming that the rules change depending on the person right now.

[@richardwillmeth1534]

I personally found it to be sending very mixed signals. Steven doing an interview with Pirate Software - a streamer who has stated publically on his stream, that his style of "PVP" is to harass/grief people until they quit playing the game - is where he decides to give an interview and in part talk about how tough he is going to be on griefers? Are you kidding me? Did they not vet the streamer at all? Is it only Pirate Software who is allowed to grief whenever he wants? Because he is a streamer? Because he is a zerg? Reeks of favoritism / mixed signals.

[@gilsonsilva5811]

Are you saying that you were killed several times in the starting area by the same people (I don't like that guild either) in a short period of time? And that this was during the stress test, when they said that the corruption system was not fully operational? I'll leave these two questions here, and one of them has a clue about the problem with your comment. Regarding the bald guy, the person who killed him was most likely from his own community, and that already says a lot.

[@ajhenniggs5041]

@@richardwillmeth1534 True dude, idk. If the people that killed Asmon caught a ban I think Thor needs one too. Or unban those people. Consistency is key. Also hard rules, not some subjective nonsense.

[@gilsonsilva5811]

@@ajhenniggs5041 But wasn't the fake Thor drama about a group that was shooting streams and killing them and He said they would kill those? I don't like Thor or Asmongold (personally I think they and their community are really toxic and we don't need them), but it's really unfair what you guys are doing here.

[@gilsonsilva5811]

@@richardwillmeth1534 Fake Thor got stream sniped and then, He "flagged" the guild/person who was killing him. Baldman got killed several time by his own community. For me, this couldn't be even a comparision, friend. Ah, I don't like both, not tryng to deffend anyone.

[@TwistedKodiax]

HA!!! Nice Video!! Big Boi Damage for real! Azmon didnt deserve what happened to him. we need more people coming to AoC not less. Azmon crazily has the base/power that could help or derail a game like AoC. Hope he got another shot at playing and enjoyed it. :)

[@isth3reno1else]

Same. Hopefully he tries again and has the fun we've all been having

[@FaintMagic]

I dont get it… why have the curuption system if pepole wont be using it, why not just remove it if pepole are afraid to get it, just have the pvp flag system

[@Reddragoncolev]

I feel like, as the kind of person that I am. I'd be interested in making a Guild focused on helping people being griefed. I'd treat it like in a sense the Police in game. However we'd have rules. We don't protect other guilds during guild wars or other such large scale battles. We'd act only as protectors of individuals, or rather than protectors we could act as Avengers to some extent. When thinking of this guild being created id say it'd be more akin to the 'Blue Sentinels' from Dark Souls 2 and 3. We'd be a peoples guild, when people need help because someone is overly harassing them that's when we'd step in. Just gotta make sure those on the server know we exist and to report it when it happens. Which in a sense would incentivize a Discord Channel of sorts. And on the side, the guild could act as a bounty hunters guild hunting down red players and or hunting down purple players for compensation. Granted I'd say we'd only hunt within reason(Like once per bounty contract, then instigate a sort of Cooldown on being hunted via a contract unless that player is a Griefer). After all no need to become what we are trying to prevent.

[@shadowcoffee7661]

The second time you got corruption sucks . That is dumb but idk how they would fix that without some sort of exploit

[@Patton243]

Asmon gets what he deserves and I said the same thing in Nyce's video too. If you're a big time streamer, expect to deal with the trolls and people who don't like you. Personally, I'm not a fan of these big streamers because they bring loads of zerglings with them wherever they go and it usually ruins the experience for people having to fight against them.

[@TheGreenguy85]

Ive been killed by players twice... another group rolled into our groups grinding spot, and just wiped us... 1.. 2nd was me trying to gank one of them 10 minutes later.. i failed miserably.. its not a "gank box"

[@Peter-nn9ht]

No one is going to care about all the incentives not to grief if it gives them a moment of fame for 'ruining a streamers stream'. The fact that there's no pvp safe havens is idiotic but I guess it would ruin the game by allowing people to run away and hide from PVP or cheese it by running into a safe zone. Idk why this game doesn't have factions? Like imagine a human warrior killing you in northshire abbey as a human mage in WoW, what were they thinking???

[@isth3reno1else]

Sure, and those situations can be handled on a case by case basis. Safe zone for lowbies is fine, but at the same time this is week 3 of the a2 tests and it wasn't widespread in week 1, 2 or 3.

[@beyondgreatness1861]

Didn’t wow PvP have this kinda stuff? I remember ppl camping dungeons higher lvl killing everyone. No one took it like this. Especially since it took u 30 mins to run there lol. Idk. I’m torn on this subject

[@Azhrei776]

I am just here in case you say Behoove again.

[@isth3reno1else]

ill make sure to add it for every video

[@Azhrei776]

@ starting today or??

[@isth3reno1else]

It would behoove me to do so going forward

[@Dustygoodz]

I want everyone to enjoy the and dont agreed with people being PK’d but at this stage of the game As weird as this might sound dont we need people griefing more so they can receive more data and perfect it more?

[@KnightsTempura]

Is this game worth investing on? it seems like everyone can PK you wherever. Couldn't they just make a pve server for pve folks

[@UncannySense]

the world systems wont function, the corruption system imparts risk to PK to the point PK is rare...its not a PVE game

[@irishsage2459]

@@UncannySense The game has a ton of PvE. However, yes, PvP is "always on". And yes, players can kill you whenever. However, if you are not flagged you can still be killed, but it's *EXTREMELY* detrimental for the attacker to kill you. But no, it's not JUST a PvE game, will most likely never be just a PvE game, and that's fine. Not everything is for everyone...but you'll be missing out on a great game.

[@michaeljenkins6707]

I killed two corrupted ppl got amazing loot from them. But no I didn’t gank anyone or was ganked. Unless you count the corrupted but I look at them ppl as free game better be worth it to go corrupt. Let’s say the pker kills low lvl 1s while naked. Well their storage area will drop items at least 3. So, whoever is by your storage wins when that person dies. Now they are making a noob safe area at the start but i would not. Because the corrupted will hide there. I think the system works add storage drop if naked or something.

[@TheGoodFellasz]

If all normal mmos are dying whats a good pvx mmo game thats popular then

[@Nyce-Gaming]

5:06 😂😂😂

[@isth3reno1else]

We support our brits 😤

[@pipz420]

I dont like how they are turning pvp into some form of griefing. Streamers should not get special treatment and something like stream sniping is a problem you create when you decide to stream. I dont like any of this. Sure make safe starter areas but once things like this start making rules about what is griefing or exploits when people are using the game rules in the intended way and you choose to ban those people. It makes me extremely worried to play a game like this and put in thousands of hours for some random dev to decide some way of me playing is exploiting and ban me out of the blue. In rust everyone gets killed in the starting areas, to think it somehow griefing here makes me think you cant decide if you want pvp in your pvpve game.

[@lmfnatural]

Asmon was ganked soon as he loaded into the game and those pker got warned many times to stop from Steven him self and they kept Killing him this is most def abusing the pvp system. I agree no streamer should get special treatment but this situation def was handled right at least in my eyes.

[@Kuteiapi]

Never been ganked. Saw 1 red player on the second weekend. We fought. when I see red all I see is red 🤷🏽‍♂️🤣. Didn’t get to play this past weekend. Asmon gold can only play a game like this as a tanks with his guild around him. He has too many trolls..

[@alchemist9905]

sounds like the corruption system sucks ngl

[@isth3reno1else]

No u

[@Grimasaurus]

I have no problem with the "Guild Loophole". It encourages being in a guild and if you're red, you have to get to your guild or they have to get to you. This can generate another "memorable gaming moment".

[@brelshar4968]

S C A M.

[@sircrookie115]

Wooooo spawn camping goood

[@Kaia-LiniFox]

I just got a bit back into eso until this game comes out all clean, also tbh asmon will get griefed in any game lol I have seen him in wow in his peak the crowd around him massive; also funny story is they say pvpers have ego (not that some don't) but theirs is the one that will get hurt more if they die from someone else yet be okay from dying from npcs, but god forbid boomerslayer69 outplays u

[@isth3reno1else]

boomerslayer69 is formidable

[@Kaia-LiniFox]

@ truly

[@DjangoLowe]

put your rations in your quick bar. :P

[@iamisobe]

asmondownbad get gud

[@kevinkenney-m5b]

Not necessarily disagreeing with u..I hated New World so didn’t play long.. but what would be so bad having a toggle off/on pvp option? That pretty much takes care of griefing. Maybe a lot of players aren’t all that interested in pvp and want to PVE? I’m waiting to play AoC and pretty excited about it…but to have a system of ganking by lower levels players so a guild can steal gear etc and u can’t really fight back for fear of corruption isn’t going to work either. Believe me there will be plenty of players with $$ that $100 or whatever is a drop in bucket as long as they get great gear from another player etc. Maybe I’m just not fully familiar with “when” u are penalized… I say earlier videos saying if your are AoEing and accidentally hit some lower level player you are corrupted? It should be based on intent. Or you could just have a pvp icon letting everyone know you are fair game to pvp with therefore both sides consent…idk.

[@isth3reno1else]

I like the idea of things ending. I've played games where beefs go on for forever...and a toggle off/on system allows that to happen more than a corruption system does. Asmongold has even said in a few of his livestreams in the past that toxicity is a lot more prevalent in pve over pvp because of the lack of consequences. I personally wouldn't go that far...but that risk of people crossing the line has made for a very enjoyable ashes experience so far. It's only been ~ 100 ish hours for me but it is BY FAR the least toxic mmo ive ever played. Obviously it's anecdotal but I think the risk keeps people in check, and the freedom allows people to make decisions that can really hurt their progress...so they choose the safer route. As far as ganking lower levels goes, they made the safe zone in the starter area like i talked about in this video. It makes sense to protect lowbies in this situation, but at a higher level pk'ing really doesn't happen. I've done it a few times and all but one of them it was on accident. I have yet to be pk'd also and I've no lifed this alpha. Regardless I don't want to see that, I want a competitive environment. I think a toggle if done well *could* be good, but the freedom to do more things if done well can be better, if that makes sense.

[@davejohnson4061]

There are only 2 real MMOs that have PvE content and systems, the rest is just P2W crap to say the games die because of PvE is just stupid.

[@isth3reno1else]

I didn't say they die because of pve.

[@davejohnson4061]

@@isth3reno1else You start your video with that insinuation. If you like PvP you dont have to discredit the other half of the playerbase. The PvE aspect even bolsters playernumbers and therefore instance based content. These onesided takes are not helping to make the game better.

[@soneca798]

Everything I've heard about the ashes corruption system makes me think it's too soft tbh. Idk if Steven is too worried that pk players will be a problem, but with those insane penalties in place when will people ever feel comfortable to go pvp without fear of getting corrupted? Imo albion did it pretty well with the zone types, having blue and yellow zones with no risk but low rewards, red zones with ok rewards and flagging, and black zones with huge rewards and auto flagging

[@isth3reno1else]

I'm of the belief that they will soften the penalties in either phase 2 or 3, or both. In phase 1 it makes a lot of sense to deter it. I think on p2 or p3 as people get better and better gear that will be the deterrence

[@soneca798]

@isth3reno1else my point still stands tbh. Feel free to correct me if I'm saying something wrong, but if steven wants people to pvp and engage in conflict over resources, then this system, even if more mild, does not encourage pvp at all

[@isth3reno1else]

No you're right and that's something I've said as well, and will discuss on another video this week. It's a weird limbo situation which I get for p1, I just hope it doesn't bleed into p2. Sorry I should have said that earlier.

[@soneca798]

@@isth3reno1else thank you for sharing those concerns! This alpha is very expensive, and idk if I'll even be playing this game, but I'm following it with great interest and praying for its success. I want more pvp mmos to be successful

[@madhatten5123]

The current tests is for stability and networking they have made corruption for harsh to properly test what they want to test.

[@ShadowKingRecks]

Maybe later on...but as it stand it is a murder box lol.

[@ferocious_pooh]

TBF to Asmon, in his reaction to Nyce’s video he did say, “I think the devs should do what they think is best for their game.” I do think the problem is that in the early phases of the game the corruption system isn’t much of a deterrent. Until you’ve invested significantly into your character corruption is meaningless so you could potentially target people early on without much downside.

[@isth3reno1else]

I agree with that. A testing phase is going to have players do things they wouldn't normally do and the starter zone is an opportunity to be a dick without much in game risk. The devs taking matters into their own hands should be applauded imo

[@ferocious_pooh]

Agreed. I didn’t see anything particularly concerning, and Intrepid handled it appropriately.

[@lostpenguins]

Sorry but I disagree with your video here. Your assessment of MMOs are dying would include this game. Regardless of mmo vs pvx, there’s no mmo game that will reach peak WoW Wotlk. So if we’re talking about a dying genre, then you can easily say Eve online is a pvx game and that never got “MMO big” and it also has died to a small, loyal fan base. Is that what you’re looking for ashes of creation? You may retain a small fan base but if you aim small I don’t think you’ll end up huge. Secondly, if I get griefed in PVE centric games, I’ll get griefed here. There will be plenty of people who won’t care about the penalty when it comes to a high level players griefing lower levels.

[@isth3reno1else]

My point that I didn't articulate very well here is every time a game is coming out people want it to feel like the best parts of their old game. We saw this happen with new world where it started off as an edgy survival pvp mmorpg and now it's a group based arpg. They don't know what they are. I'm a fan of games staying true to their vision and having a backbone to make the best form of that game possible. If ashes adopted more things like an eve, or a wow etc they're just a lesser version of that game instead of their own thing. That's my pushback

[@lostpenguins]

@@isth3reno1else Okay. But isn't Ashes just Eve Online based on Fantasy and not space? Seeing Pirate Software's review it sounds like it's a niche game and it's okay, stay true to it's vision. And you're right, it might not be for me. If it doesn't have any true end game besides gathering in large groups and controlling the landscape against other players - that doesn't interest me. It seems like the content will be mostly driven by the interaction between different playerbases which means you're either in or out of the major groups.

[@The-Dark-Tower]

AoC Alpha 2 is kind of Quinfall looking game with a little more better visuals in UE5 with lots of bought assets (the UI, gameplay3, animations biome and many other things gave me that impression really when I watch this gameplay video) but AoC Alpha 2 has lots of problems too and it looks like very old school tab-target gameplay from decades ago. T&L, even New World, Archeage, Tera Online, Aion, Lineage 2 looks for far better than many aspects of AoC Alpha 2 which is in development of 8 years, +150 development team and +$80million budget already... In a way, it looks like a scam game really where thy asked $250 for Alpha 2 and around $100 for Alpha 2 entry only for the all three phases etc.

[@sketchyx8307]

I wouldn't start a video with " all your current MMOs are bad and dying ". Kinda makes you biased and a shill. Why would I care about your opinion if you've played a game in alpha and acting like it's better than other MMOs lol. Kinda liked your videos but what a trash opinion

[@isth3reno1else]

You dont have to listen to me, you can look at the charts yourself.

[@sketchyx8307]

MMOs outside of Wow and Final fantasy have always been in that cycle. Ashes won't be any different. These games come out, there's hype then die because there's no real substance there. I'd criticize Ashes but it's in alpha so it's not really fair. You're not any different than anyone else online. The MMO crowd does this with every new MMO out. Big hype, best next thing and they always fall on their face . This one is just going to take like 3 years of nonsense development to get there. Also that wasn't the point, the point was if that's your opinion, then you're looking at this game through a skewed lens.

[@madhatten5123]

@@sketchyx8307I have had more fun in Ashes the last month than any MMO I’ve played in years. Fun is kind of all I care about.

[@sketchyx8307]

@@madhatten5123 then your bar for fun must be really low. Movement is shit, combat is meh, quests are a disaster. I could go on. Saying you had the most fun in an alpha that's meant to be broken and basically crap says enough lol. What are you comparing it to ?

[@madhatten5123]

@ Have you played the game? I’m comparing it to the p2w garbage and the everyone gets a trophy garbage that is the current MMO genre. Most of the people that have actually played the game feel the same way I do. Is it perfect nope is it a true Alpha absolutely but it’s still fun as hell.

[@King_of_Sofa]

In my opinion, there should be no corruption but also no dropping anything on death. The incentive for PVP should simply be that you are booting your rival out of a grind spot. Or it should be that before you can gather a high tier valuable resource, you should have to stake a claim to it which takes a couple minutes to go through while other players can challenge your claim - settled by PVP. And the fact that you have to travel great distances with no fast travel should be enough of a consequence to dying in this game

[@JELKEK]

There’s no excitement in that. Say you know a guy is the highest level miner on the server, and you learn his route by stalking him for a bit (ranger camo or rogue stealth). You see him finally start to head back towards town, so you ambush and take his mats. Boom, up half an inventory of high tier mats you cant even farm yet. If you’re max level, no XP debt or level loss. You wear your throwaway gear for each slot so your eventual corrupt death isn’t much of a loss. This could never be possible with your WoW copy system

[@floyd776]

AWWWW ninja boy got grieved.jeez probably gamers parents whose kids had their credit card milked when asmon got kids to send him in game gold

[@obsidiannewt9103]

Do me the courtesy of telling me the name of any game that was PvX with a strong focus on PVP that survived? With a sub, no less.

[@isth3reno1else]

should we talk about other games that have failed for a variety of different reasons or should we talk about this game?

[@obsidiannewt9103]

@@isth3reno1else Considering the history of such games, yah. The track record for games likes Ashes is abysmal. But each of those games were also hyped to be the second coming of our MMOs. Ignoring their failures while still thinking Ashes -is the one- that's going to pull it off is just stubbornly ignoring something because you can't accept the probable reality that Ashes, like all those other games can fail.