This is not actually about JK Rowling... but stop saying she's "gone crazy"

In the wake of my last video on JK Rowling's statements and behavior over the last few years I've seen a tendency by some people to look for an answer as to why. And some are turning to the idea that she's having some form of mental health crisis or condition. And I need to talk about why this line of thinking, while understandable, carries some serious problems.
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[@naomipenelopemccarthy9737]

As someone with a mental illness I'm tired of people using mental health issues as an excuse for terrible people. I'm not a terrible person. And I have mental health issues. So please stop using that excuse. It only villifies good people like me.

[@unseenmolee]

ok but it villainizes *all* ppl with mental illness. framing it as good ppl vs. bad ppl is still harmful imo. like i can be a terrible person sometimes, does that mean im not worthy of compassion or respect? does it mean im no longer a complex human with many experiences and contributing factors to why im acting out? yk? like saying all ppl ppl who are terrible have mental illness is wrong, but also why cant we still see the humanity in imperfect ppl? having a mental illness and struggling with that is not something that should be looked down on.

[@mortdewerewolfe691]

[@naomipenelopemccarthy9737]

@@unseenmolee of course I believe everyone should have companions for each other. But if someone does something bad and blame it on a mental illness and there is no prior record of it then they are just using it to get out of trouble and it makes other people who do have mental health issues look very bad. And I also think it's become an easy excuse. I don't hate people. I may not like every they say and do but everyone has my compassion.

[@AlexirLife]

I'm with you on this. I have a mental illness, I've never used that as an excuse to say hateful stuff or shoot people. Folks with psychosis are really unlikely to do those things. You know who does those things? Entitled people. People who feel entitled to spray their damaging & hateful opinions no matter the consequences People who feel entitled to the bodies of other people, ie incels People who feel entitled to kill other people for their own needs & emotional relief. That's not us!

[@schiffelers3944]

The thing you got issue with is; it being used as an excuse - don't conflate that from the topic at hand. Psychology and labels. Also good and bad are social constructions, and are not very functional. What is good in one case can be bad in another. It isn't that black and white - it is more nuanced - so maybe talk about it, show there is more nuances to this. Also it depends on how it is used. What mental illness - your communication shows your afraid to be open because of all the ignorance, which can only be taken away with being open and coming out. Standing up for your self. I can give you my labels - that still doesn't tell you how it effect me personally, etc. I got CPTSD complex post traumatic stress disorder, I got dysthymia aka chronical depression, I got a high sensitive personality - which others like to simplify with the label autistic which I don't agree with. My psychological development might be leaning more to the "negative" side, that doesn't make this or me bad. Positive can be toxic as well. Too trusting, only seeing the good, not the bad, etc. If you call me names, and I dislike you for that - it is not because of my labels, it's because of your actions. Others might be able do deal with it differently with a different psychological makeup. But that still doesn't imply my behavior was the problem, cause. I work in a work place specifically with people that are neuro diverse, mentally/psychologically diverse in some form. If I know someone officially has Tourette and he calls me names like curse names like queer, faggot, etc. I can deal with this differently than if my "healthy" normal boss uses these words or terms, not towards me directly but circumstantial. {I don't know a single person that is "normal", only different levels of neuro divergence, and some being labels as better functioning in the society at large. With a broken society we could ask what that implies as well. If society is broken, and you function well in this - you need to be compatibly broken for that.) Someone saying they got Tourette so they might get away with calling people names is a different story, using it as an excuse.

[@angiep2229]

I feel that when a mental illness is blamed for someone's reprehensible beliefs or/and actions, that adds further stigma to that mental illness, causing more people to associate that mental illness with something reprehensible. It's harmful to people who suffer from mental illnesses when that already carries so much stigma.

[@lexihopes]

I think we can acknowledge the role mental illness sometimes plays in bad actions while recognizing the person is still ultimately responsible for those actions/not managing the mental illness and that most people with mental illnesses are not dangerous, and that if we don't do so we will never be able to reduce bad actions because we refuse to understand the causes. That said, I don't think this applies to Rowling. Mental illness doesn't have as much of a role in beliefs. (Well, it can increase vulnerability and a need for somewhere to belong which can make indoctrination into a group with harmful beliefs easier, but that almost certainly doesn't apply to Rowling, especially given the beliefs/angles of those beliefs she's espousing).

[@dandelion_16]

It also often becomes an excuse for people to dismiss the behavior as "crazy". That way they can distance themselves from it and don't have to actually engage with the thoughts of the person.

[@CapriUni]

Exactly.

[@mortdewerewolfe691]

@@lexihopes Under UK law if you're mentally ill it's a Defence that you're not technically responsible in court, the court doesn't have to believe in your defence BTW and your counsel has to prove that (yes the burden of proof is on You). Psychopathy is a different matter ( as it isn't treatable it's not an illness and Psychopaths are legally culpable for their actions) and Rowling is increasingly veering towards Psychopathy. If someone does something based on her ravings ( look what happened recently in the UK when a Home Office Detention Centre for refugee was attacked in an act of terrorism ) she is criminally responsible. it's called Incitement to Violence. The academic term is stochastic terrorism.

[@MarkCalise]

That is exactly what I came here to say. That is plays into and off of the stigma against mental illness, makes it seem like mental illness makes you a bad person.

[@josgibbons6777]

One more thing: there's no reason mental illness should make someone's behaviour more harmful (e.g. the mentally ill aren't any more likely to be criminals, but they ARE more likely to be victims of crime); so if a person's behaviour worsens during confirmed or conjectured mental illness, other factors are likely relevant. So you're right to remind people we have to look at systems too.

[@mortdewerewolfe691]

@josgibbons6777 see my point about the clinical difference between Mental Illness (treatable) and Personality Disorder (resistant to treatment or untreatable). Rowling's behaviour is becoming increasingly more threatening, violent and dangerous. I'm wondering how long it will be before she ends up in the UK's Dangerous Personality Disorder Unit ( seriously, I'm not joking) her violent rhetoric will get people murdered, if it hasn't already and she needs to be stopped.

[@matthewrouge]

That depends on the mental illness. Some personality disorders definitely have antisocial behavior as a symptom, e.g., antisocial personality disorder. Etc.

[@cryofpaine]

@@matthewrouge But with those, you don't just contract it. That's a lifelong condition. You don't suddenly wake up one day and go from being a decent person (at least in public) to being an asshole. At most, a mental illness just exposes the asshole that was already there. But the reality is some people are just assholes and we have to be comfortable with the fact that we don't know these people that we like their works. And sometimes some really shitty people make really cool things.

[@matthewrouge]

@@cryofpaine Some diseases do appear in people's 20s and 30s (e.g., bipolar, schizophrenia) that can definitely cause problematic transformations. I don't know what's up with Rowling. It doesn't seem like mental illness to me at all, and she didn't use to seem so harsh and mean, so I don't know what happened. Maybe she was bound to be anti-trans all along and it took trans issues becoming more prominent in recent years to bring out her dark side.

[@eshbena]

I was very badly abused as a child and I've met other abuse victims who tell me that their childhood abuse is the reason why they are such jerks now. I don't accept that. A crappy childhood is no excuse for being a crappy adult. JKR was an abuse victim, but that doesn't excuse her abuse of others. We're not children anymore. We're not responsible for what was done to us, but we are responsible for what we do to others.

[@wmdkitty]

Was she a victim, or has she conveniently co-opted the narrative of a battered woman to support her bigotry? Wouldn't be the first time a TERF has outright lied...

[@MajaBiana]

Agree. I was emotionally abused and neglected by my parents and for four neverending years I was bullied at school too while having no one whatsoever to turn to. But I realised early on that I had a choice: I could abuse and bully like my abusers and bullies were doing to me or I could decide that this ended with me. I still tried to understand and be empathetic towards abusive and neglectful people for years after, but in my late 20s I began to grow tired of giving not only second but 536th chances to people who were too comfortable continuing to treat others including me badly and never work on themselves, and I've since stopped doing that. I understand that we're all made differently, but at least when we get to adulthood I now believe that we're fully responsible for how we act and how we treat others, no matter which good reasons exist or not.

[@SavageBroadcast]

@@martinabbott4640 Just watch Council's other videos, it's too long to do justice in a single comment.

[@adamdavis1648]

@martinabbott4640 Just to be clear, I'm not accusing you of being one of the "she never did, Hah!" people, just linking you to that Twitter thread to answer your question.

[@adamdavis1648]

@martinabbott4640 I tried about five or six times to post the link, but my comment never showed up for some reason. It's the Twitter thread that begins with the words "every time a certain transphobic novelist starts raising a fuss", so hopefully you'll be able to find it if you Google those exact words.

[@cakt1991]

As someone who also engages with true crime content, the “mental illness” argument sucks. Except in some extreme cases where it can be proved that the perpetrator didn’t have an awareness of the gravity of their actions, mental illness only serves to color the pathology of the perpetrator, not to absolve them. And even in those extreme cases, it’s for legal purposes and their capacity to stand trial. Mental health issues from a traumatic childhood don’t justify what the likes of John Wayne Gacy or Ed Gein, among others, did to their victims. So why do people think mental health issues, confirmed or assumed, are an acceptable excuse to justify bigotry, especially in cases like Rowling or Ye, where it’s clear they’ve been like this for years?

[@happysquirrel]

Totally agree with all of this. It's also incredibly ableist, equating mental illness with bigotry, further stigmatising another marginalised group. People do it all the time too with armchair diagnosing people who commit terrible, harmful acts or hold abhorrent views, as autistic (not a mental illness but the same reasoning behind it). The idea that it could be someone "normal" like them is unacceptable because then they'd have to think some deeper thoughts, so it must just be one of us weirdos! It is truly exhausting.

[@Stargazer_Ley]

This is very much true. It places the hate and bullshit as part of their illness and not part of them. It's not. There's loads of people with mental illnesses and neurodivergent disorders and conditions that aren't complete hateful pricks. Ye might have Bipolar Disorder but he's also an asshole. JK may or may not have some condition but she is also a hateful jerk who just threw a trans woman under the bus for saying "I'm not junking the stuff I own but I won't give her more money either."

[@ronjaj.addams-ramstedt1023]

ALL of this! Thank you, Vera and Stacey!

[@alim.9801]

Thank you for this!!

[@bekkers29]

I can understand a person not wanting to believe that someone whose work they love is and always was an asshole, and yes it sucks when people with large platforms use them to cause harm. Knowing their reasons for doing so wouldn't lessen the harm, though. As for mental health in general, I have an anxiety disorder. I will be the first to admit that it is tough for me not to be a jerk if I'm on the edge of a panic attack, but I am still responsible for my behavior. It is on me to recognize if I have behaved badly, and to apologize to those I've wronged. A mental illness is not an excuse to behave badly.

[@klop4228]

Hell, I'm not even convinced she was always an asshole, just that she ended up with some bad opinions and got unlucky enough to be radicalised into proper bigotry. Obviously, like every bigot, she's still responsible for herself, but it's sad to think she could probably have turned out differently. EDIT: And it might be helpful to see how she became the way she is, so that we could try and avoid letting it happen to other people (and, in a pipe dream, try and effectively help her back out of this hole).

[@marocat4749]

Kill your heroes, while there some exceptions, most prominent people can do great work and be extremely problematic. Amd rowling at least always was conservative with no problems with problematic portrayals and not aware or able to take criticism and especially not progressive. I am sure she was a bit radicaloze but she definitly wasnt prohressive and a conservative. At least. And terrible at taking criticism pf her worldview. That i am confident isnt new. And even of she were, she like kanye/ye has any ability to get help, and do whatever she wants, it would be no excuse even if it were,like kanye, who is antisemitic on his choice to not question that anyways.

[@marocat4749]

@@klop4228 I mean she probably always will be a bigot and conservative, but its sad she is a willing mouthpeace and icon of a hategroup. And not just a private bigot. Like thats ok, its ok to be that private, my pragmatic branch. Just know when to shut up.

[@klop4228]

@@marocat4749 That is fair, she has had trouble with accepting feedback in the past. I do think it was far from inevitable that she'd turn out the way she did, but in a way it's also unsurprising. And, obviously, even if a person can improve, or was led towards taking certain actions, it doesn't mean the things they've done are suddenly ok. For that, you need at the _very_ least a genuine apology, and to stop doing what you're doing (and it's arguable if that's enough). But, again, my point is that it's important to look at how and why these things happen.

[@mortdewerewolfe691]

Have you seen the recent debacle over the UK's now dropped ''Online Safety Bill''?' ( A terrible piece of proposed legislation btw). I wonder what legal steps could have been taken to ban/imprison Rowling had it passed.

[@bitnewt]

I'd like to add the other way to your points: being mentally ill is not an excuse to be cruel; most people who are suffering don't make life harder for others. Though some mental states can make people act irresponsibly, they still have to take responsibility for how those actions affect others and do their best to make amends, just like if they weren't mentally ill. Their health is irrelevant to anyone who isn't part of their process to recover/improve.

[@cryofpaine]

EXACTLY! Let's say like Kanye, he actually has a diagnosed mental illness. So what? Racism is not a mental illness, nor is it a symptom of one. Mental illness might make it harder for assholes to hide that they're assholes. It might magnify their bad behavior. But it doesn't cause them to be assholes.

[@josephjarosch8739]

A bit of a tangent. I am mentally ill and there is a *strong* tendency towards mental illness in both sides of my family. Something I have noticed in certain circles such as this, is that in trying to de-stigmatize X (mental illness in this case, thought it applies to lots of things) they also, for want of a better word, sanitize it and downplay just how badly something like, say, untreated bipolar disorder can screw up your life and the lives of others who have contact with you. They treat mental illness as a harmless quirk rather than something potentialy debilitating but always difficult. Whenever someone says "I'm bipolar, and I never did X", congratulations, most are not so lucky. True, most are not spewing nazi shit to an audience of millions, but the vast majority are not harmless quickly chaos goblins either. Most fall in the middle, causing great pain to themselves and others, apologizing, promising to never do it again, and doing *exactly* the same. Rinse and repeat. Some eventually escape the cycle, but not all are so lucky. Consider a quote I think about constantly. 'You didnt make good choices. You HAD good choices'. Congratulations for being a good person. That is a luxury not everyone can afford. My paternal grandmother had untreated mental illness for most of her adult life, which only got worse when the dementia kicked in. She lived with my uncle until his own issues (alcoholism and being generally a dick) got her taken out of his care by the state and forced into our house. She spent eight weeks in our tiny house in the autumn of 2020 in lockdown with us, unable to comprehend why we were 'keeping her prisoner', hurling verbal and physical abuse at us, trying to climb the fence and escape whenever we weren't looking. The only reason I didn't personally send her to the farm upstate where dogs go myself is because she had an episode so bad we had justification to call the cops and let them handle her. Because such things run in families, there is a strong chance that both my father and myself will end up like her, eventually. I think about that a lot. I had a friend who had severe depression for most of the time we were together. Eventually, they seemed to be happier. After years of struggling and several false starts, they finished college, got a job. I helped them personally, as did our shared friends, at great cost in time and emotional energy. They eventually relapsed, lost everything we had build in a downward spiral, and passed away a few years ago. They did all they could. WE did all we could. It wasn't enough. Nothing was ever going to be enough, because sometimes the battle cannot be won; and the best you can do is hold the line as long as you can, until you finally cant anymore. This is part of why the "Good representation matters!" crowd irk me a bit. When they say they want 'good' representation, what they really mean is they want FLATTERING representation. By definition, marginalized peoples are rarely presentable or palatable, even to each other. PS: you know that "People with mental illnesses are actually LESS likely to commit crimes than the general population?" statistic people always trot out? What the studies actually say is "ACCOUNTING FOR ALL OTHER VARIABLES, people with mental illnesses are less likely to commit crimes than the general population". The difference is important. It means that a white male New Yorker in his thirties with a 90k annual income and no prior criminal record has the same likelihood of commuting a crime as a Schizophrenic white male New Yorker in his thirties with a 90k annual income and no prior criminal record. The problem is that the former is a realistic representitive scenario, while the latter is a spherical cow in a friction-less vacuum. It is equivalent to saying 'people without symptoms do not have symptoms'. Related, but look up Simpsons Paradox.

[@mutate34]

I hugely agree with what you're saying, but it's very unpopular among cool/progressive people. Which is probably why you have no replies yet. I wish there was a way for good/non-bigoted people to talk frankly about the negative side of these things.

[@jcp1984again]

I couldn't agree with you more. That's why I see a lot of hypocrisy in how these things are discussed.

[@PPfilmemacher]

It tells allot why rational, self deflecting comments like this one have only 8 likes and all these self-pitying, narcissistic, comments who always blame others for things they have done to them self, getting way higher upvotes is explains allot…

[@casualcraftman1599]

I'm autistic and I fucking hate it when people blame autism for shitty behavior and accuse and assume shitty people are autistic.

[@Pinkiechu92]

This! It sorta puts us all under the same box despite us all being individuals

[@Dancestar1981]

Precisely because we are the complete opposite

[@mrdoctorgilmore]

Sadly, as someone who's been through issues regarding mental health, there was a point where I was so angry and miserable I would often get needless angry about certain things. Fortunately it only ended up being complaining about Doctor Who, general nerdy outbursts fans end up going through when they begin to start forming critical thoughts on the brand's they enjoy, you'll probably find some of these in your comment sections. While these aren't the same extent as Rowling by a long mile, I still feel bad and embarrassed I got that mad about these things, had a lot of repressed emotion and I took it out on parts of Dr Who I didn't enjoy at the time. Thankfully the only person who was impacted by what I said was me, I'm now out of that mindset and am much better at dealing with my mental health and have been able to re-appraise those issues I had, I no longer hate the 10th Doctor or stories like the End of Time. It was important to recognise these issues and except that what was being said wasn't right, I don't even remember writing half the stuff I moaned about or even understand why it made me unhappy.

[@tarab9081]

I would argue that the basic worldview that underlies JK's transphobia is present in Harry Potter and underlies a lot of the problematic elements of the books. I really liked Shaun's breakdown of the conservatism in the HP books.

[@mortdewerewolfe691]

I wonder if she's abusing the trans community merely as an easy target? I'm NOT writing that to excuse her, but if she started on about ''the Bankers/Globalists'' etc. it might raise more alarm bells and she'd lose more money/support/face legal consequences. Her work is along those lines anyway but if she dropped the mask all at once it would be a lot harder for her in public than the nudge>nudge she's deploying now. Five-ten years down the line she'll feel she can get away with picking on the next fungible group. She's slowly going the same way MTG went and perhaps needs a few years in a cell to think things through.

[@tarab9081]

@@mortdewerewolfe691 Here's a link to the video I was referencing. I think what it comes down to is that Joanne is wealthy and white and cishet and British and for her systemic oppression is mostly theoretical(she's never been forced to really question her view of the world and her place in it) so it's easier for her to believe that her discomfort with trans people(and her stereotypical views on other marginalized groups) is a problem with us rather than a problem with her. kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y2LMkn2NiNyIkNU

[@Juliebel177]

I have bipolar disorder. When I am with others, sometimes someone will say "I hope you don't mind me saying but, that person is crazy!" I don't connect my illness as "Crazy" I don’t. But, without the proper care, I would lose my mind. Go truly crazy. And I don't see that in a lot of people who others call crazy. It's a strange experience.

[@r.j.sullivan2104]

In my experience, “JKR is crazy” isn’t so much a diagnosis as it is being used as an offhand insult. I’m not convinced much deep thought is happening there.

[@voltijuice8576]

I think that's the point! If one uses diagnosis as an insult, perhaps some reflection would be beneficial. Otherwise we risk both excusing bigotry as well as denigrating those who experience mental health problems.

[@r.j.sullivan2104]

@@voltijuice8576 people have been doing it for decades. I don’t see that changing.

[@robokill387]

That's the point, people need to actually think about what they're saying and challenging their assumptions. R.e, "people have been doing it for decades. I don’t see that changing." people have been using "gay" and "fag" as generic insults for decades too, but people have been moving away from using that kind of language casually recently.

[@pjaypender1009]

@@r.j.sullivan2104 people have done transphobia for decades. Should we not try to stop that harm? Ableism harms mentally ill people in much the same way transphobia harms trans people. And racism harms PoC. Should we not work to educate people about marginalization because you "don't see it changing?"

[@r.j.sullivan2104]

@@pjaypender1009 I get what you are saying, but for me, the JKR isn’t owed that much respect or thoughtfulness. If someone says “what the JKR said is insane” my inclination is to agree and move on. She no longer gets the benefit of my time or patience to correct the speaker on her behalf, She lost that years ago.

[@unseenmolee]

omggg i havent even watched it yet but i already know im gonna love this. i have been unfollowing so many creators i used to love because i recently started noticing how much ppl use words like "crazy" or "unhinged" "psycho" all those synonyms when they want to talk abt ppl or actions that they dont like. its so frustrating to me, like for one it kind of hurts me personally, as someone with mental illness, to hear ppl use it as a joke to make fun of ppl or to dismiss ppl like "oh theyre fucking crazy" yk? its fucking depressing how common it is for ppl to say like "omg their so insane" or anything like that. idk i could rant forever abt this but ill stop myself so i can watch this video. tysm for talking abt this

[@Seal0626]

And three hours later, JKR sicced her mob on Jessie Gender. Just to prove that the introduction of this video is perennial, I guess.

[@harrietamidala1691]

Yeah, I saw Jessie’s posting that she was targeted by JK. Talk about thin-skinned.

[@talkingpsychology]

Thank you for tackling this topic. The question of diagnosis is a complex and multilayed and it always pains me that people use it in a such simplistic and reckless way. These conditions aren't meant to be thrown around casually on the internet. There are given to guide the treatment of the patient/client be it by psychotherapy and/or medication. I think you made very good and valid points Anyway thanks again for the video and your input!!!

[@christineherrmann205]

I think, more accurately, JK Rowling is _traumatized,_ given her own descriptions of things that happened to her. But passing on to someone else the abuse you've suffered is absolutely awful. Healing is not only your right, it eventually becomes your duty. Because becoming the abuser - which is what she has done - is the alternate path. 😭

[@donaldduck3888]

You can continue to suffer under your trauma and still not become an abuser. Many people never quite heal from their past and still don't harm innocent people.

[@SPDYellow]

@@donaldduck3888 Agreed. Rowling made the conscientious decision to become an abuser. No one is holding a gun to her head, making her tweet transphobic BS. Plenty of people have bent over backwards to try to educate her as to why her views are wrong, yet she ignores them. Whatever trauma she may have experienced, it doesn't change the fact that Rowling chooses to do what she does. You don't get to choose your trauma, but you can choose how to respond to it, and unfortunately, Rowling has decided to be a bigot.

[@moonflowergal]

But what she has explicitly stated is that her relationship with her father was bad and that so was her previous marriage to the point that she even dragged those issues into her transphobic essay. The way she described those two relationships made it sound so traumatic cause in her essay she was assuming that similar traumas would be the driving force behind "young girls" wanting to be boys. If she doesn't want me to speculate about whether or not she is suffering from trauma then she should not have brought it up in something as public as that essay. If she feels so strongly about those past, bad relationships that she assumes that that would make a person transition as she has stated, then presumably she is the one with very strong emotions due to trauma. So instead of projecting her own emotions and experiences on trans masc people whose experiences might be radically different to hers, she should see a professional about her own feelings. Through her essay, she made her mental health everybody else's business by trying to appropriate the emotions of young trans masc folks for herself. If her mental state is supposed to be none of our business, then how trans masc people feel about themselves is none of hers! Another reason I bring this up, is because with TERFs in general trauma is often times brought up as a justification for their actions. But the absurd part though is how we as a society are guilt-tripped/pressured into giving into TERFs just because they might have had bad previous experiences with men. What they in essence want is a false sense of security that they could get from driving away trans women and anyone who doesn't agree is painted as a villain. Just as a physician can't give a patient the wrong medicine no matter how loudly they are asking for the wrong medicine, transphobia does not make cis women safer from cis men. Trauma does not justify action against people who have nothing to do with it. Transphobia at best is just a placebo for TERFs and while it is regrettable that some of them might have indured trauma in the past it does not in any way excuse any of the harm those TERFs are causing. Two wrongs don't make a right. By equating her own experiences with those of young trans masc folks, Rowling is making an emotional appeal. It's on the rest of us not to take the bait. Whether or not she is driven by trauma to do that or she is just an awful person... That's irrelevant. It's on the rest of us not to give into her or other TERFs.

[@JZBeasty]

THANK YOU! This is something that has been bugging me so much lately. It feels like another form of ableism or sanism. I feel that people with mental health issues are marginalized in some sense because of how it’s treated by the systems and people in this country. It might be a bit cynical but blaming mental health for stuff like this feels a lot like the scapegoating of poor people, immigrants, addicts, queer people, and the like for everything bad going on. If they can’t fit a shooter into one of those brackets, they’ll question his mental health instead and ignore systemic causes while throwing people with mental health issues under the bus. It’s another method of keeping us divided by my estimations.

[@SMAnthonyW]

Will watch the premiere tomorrow, but liking the video for the algorithm for now

[@dariadarling]

This was really good and insightful, thank you! It sucks, no longer being able to enjoy a piece of media because of the actions of a person attached to that piece of media. I hate that that list is getting longer and longer. And everybody needs to figure out for themselves where they draw a line. But slapping a mental illness on someone, when you are not their diagnosing caregiver, is just a screen to hide behind. An excuse to not draw that line.

[@HarveyMidnight]

Puts me in mind of a quote from 'Good Morning, Vietnam"... " I've covered for you a lot of times, because I thought you were a little crazy. But you're not crazy... you're *mean*."

[@LeoChris64]

Would you apply the same logic to someone like Ezra Miller, though? While they eventually released a statement which stated that "[they were] suffering complex mental health issues and have begun ongoing treatment", without trying to diagnose them with anything specific, even before that statement was made, a lot of people noted something was off with them. Of course, in their case it wasn't really the rhetoric they engaged in but their frankly bizarre (and illegal) actions. Like, I feel like the concern for their mental health came there from a place of empathy in a sense, and not as an attempt to excuse them like "Ohhh poor Ezra, they're clearly off their rockers, we can't hold them accountable." but more of a... "are they okay? Truly?" I guess my point here is that mental illness is not necessarily an excuse for actions, but it can be a reason. And if I noticed a loved one acting strangely, I'd try to get them to a professional for help. Try to convince them to make an appointment. While we are certainly not in a position to do so with celebrities on an individual basis, perhaps a vocal (and repeated, by multiple voices) concern for their mental well-being may lead to those celebrities themselves understanding it couldn't hurt to seek treatment? Of course, they're unlikely to engage in the comment sections of random youtube videos, but some public figures do engage with material tweeted at them. Ezra underwent treatment because someone, somewhere, convinced them they needed to, after all.

[@voltijuice8576]

I'd say it's different, in that Miller was displaying erratic and questionable actions and behaviors. As opposed to espousing a political ideology that seeks to reform society by attacking specific groups of people. It's unfortunate that Miller's actions have impacted the lives of actual individuals and families, but whatever the cause that's a different kind of harm than conducting a media crusade to vilify entire demographics of people.

[@cullain3967]

One of my favourite quotes from Stephen Fry - I hate the term homophobia, it's not a phobia, you're not afraid, you're just an asshole, and not the good kind...

[@adamdavis1648]

You sure bigotry and asshole behavior are never motivated by fear? Also, there's a good kind of asshole? What?

[@ThatFlamingFroggo]

I've always hated people saying someone is, "acting crazy" or "acting bipolar", when someone does something bad, or unexpected. It adds to the stigma, whether or not they are actually bipolar (which often, they aren't.)

[@ameliawade78]

Absolutely. On the second point, something I've learned is that trauma and mental illness may go some way (or not) in explaining damaging behaviour and immoral actions but that doesn't mean to say that it at all justifies them. And speaking as someone with depression, I know that 1 that does not make me exempt in any way from having to take responsibility for my own actions and their consequences, and 2 this kind of thinking only serves to add further to the stigma that poeple with mental illnesses face.

[@muhmerumpumpel]

Great Video!!! Thank you for making me think about this topic - it has never been on my radar before and I will surely reconsider the next time before I excuse someone's behaviour with a supposed mental state of mind!

[@Ficus1493]

I struggle with several severe, clinically diagnosed mental illnesses every day. I'm working on it with professionals, and I'm working so hard that it hurts. "You don't have to have a mental illness to be a bad person." There's an inverse to that assumption. "Mental illnesses will make someone a bad person." I know that's not what YOU meant, but that underlying assumption exists in the background of every time that someone uses mental illness as an excuse for bad behavior, bad advocacy, or atrocities that they don't understand. This was a bit of a painful watch because of it. Everything here needed to be said to call out the people who are perpetuating these ideas to distance themselves from their own defensiveness by using mental illness as a scapegoat. But it was painful nonetheless.

[@pjaypender1009]

I mean, Vera is saying that mental illness doesn't make you a bad person. IDK where you got that she's not.

[@jamesbramwell6547]

Another thing to add is that even if a public figures had something like bipolar or dementia, etc, they still have people around them who manage them, advise them, and who maybe even realise that it's their job to protect these people from making these sorts of statements and creating this kind of reputation-destroying backlash. People who might step in and say "You know you have this condition. Let's make sure you are taking your medication and maybe don't post anything on Twitter until you are genuinely doing it in your right mind and know what you are saying."

[@nicolesouza8]

As frustrating as I am sure this is for you, it needs to be said, and I am glad you said it. Thank you.

[@shannon3315]

I see this thing of trying to diagnose people who surprise you with bad behavior a lot, I actually used to do it myself. The impulse seems to be somewhere between “why do people behave so horribly” and “how can I protect myself”, and for me, this meant running around diagnosing people and cataloging a list of “symptoms” to be on the lookout for. Eventually, through actual therapy, I came to the realization that all I really needed were boundaries, and to develop the ability to directly confront bad behavior and tell someone if I don’t like the way they’re treating me. I empathize that a lot of people can’t afford therapy, and that a lot of people use the abundant online resources about mental health to get some help that they can’t otherwise afford. But there needs to be a greater understanding that diagnosis has a standard of ethics around it in therapy practices, and that when we self-diagnose and diagnose others, we are inherently stepping around those ethics. There also needs to be an understanding that quite a lot of therapeutic treatment for mental health is about accountability. A diagnosis isn’t a “get out of speaking to others with respect free” card.

[@tommihorttana860]

And even if those mental health professionals *did* know enough about those people to diagnose them, it would be completely unethical for them to discuss that in public.

[@cassandrawasright1481]

So many people don't understand that evil is not the domain of freaks, monsters, and crazy people, but ordinary human beings. Often, ordinary human beings who want to get the "freaks, monsters, and crazy people" before they get them.

[@beast6213]

Your comments and thoughts are very mature and well put. Since so many of us have grown up with HP, to me the hurt reaction toward finding out JK isn't as wonderful as we thought, is a bit similar to realizing your parents are human/imperfect/flawed. It's hard to come to grips with, but it's a natural, difficult part of growing up and as we mature and become adults, we can decide how to handle the relationship with that parent or if we'll even have one at all, but their actions or views that we disagree with are not our fault.

[@KiraKamiya]

I didn't get rid of my Harry Potter books when JK Rowling first started expressing her views. I had already paid money for them. But when I lost them in a hurricane last year, I knew that I would never repurchase them - no matter my childhood attachment to the series. She is not getting more of my money.

[@MadameTamma]

I think a much more helpful action to take when it comes to these types of situations (where you're watching a public figure openly fall into hateful rhetoric) is less to speculate on their mental state, but rather to educate yourself and spread awareness on HOW a normal person can become radicalized into hate groups. Which isn't something that gets talked about enough. It's important to stay vigilant and look out for others that they don't fall down that kind of path or that WE ourselves don't fall for hateful propaganda or lose our ability to keep an open mind and empathize with others.

[@thecolorjune]

I 100% agree that blaming mental illness is a way to avoid discussions of systemic issues.

[@desertkhaat]

omygoodness: so on point! It's so infuriating the impulse to label a public figure's undesirable behaviour as *crazy* or *insane*! You've done an AWSUM, succinct job of exposing this inclination to exculpate a person from accountability - & oneself from recognition of said person's actions....well-done!!!

[@andyt7295]

I think you're onto something. I remember when Rowling was hailed as an icon for her rags-to-riches story and her support for relatively progressive causes - it was also over twenty years ago, when the social justice discourse was far less mainstream, so any criticism of Harry Potter was less likely to make an impact... Now, in the era of social media and with much more awareness, people see this once beloved author with an increasingly problematic work and a increasingly vocal opposition to trans people... I understand the cognitive dissonance.

[@ALtheuncommonicedragon8360]

The irony of fact Rowling straight up tweeted “Merry Terfmas” recently ain’t lost on me. I despise mental health problems being used to brush over or explain a person being bigoted. It’s not an appropriate thing to assume or put on other ppl who do live with mental health issues. I’m depressed & have an anxiety disorder & autistic. I don’t appreciate being grouped in with bigots! My mental health isn’t something I can change or drastically alter. Just say they’re bigoted. Stop saying they have mental health issues. It’s needless point!

[@oneoftheorder]

Without a strong background in psychological or psychiatric diagnostics, we can hardly make anything like informed estimations about others' mental health -- and indeed, even then diagnosing "at a distance" is analytically and ethically questionable at the very best. Nonetheless, I think there are limited cases where such speculation over specific types of public figures retains more utility than inherent harm. Particularly, with respect to political and corporate leaders. Mental health issues won't "justify" or excuse behavior, but if present they may speak to future trends in stability or capacity -- that kind of assessment may be extremely relevant when evaluating someone's competence in leadership roles which either affect your life in some way and/or over which you exert some degree of influence in filling. I think it can be justified to both consider and discuss those questions in that kind of case. For broader "celebrities," there is no utility beyond gossip.

[@theaureliasys6362]

Overall a good video, I wish you had made a segment on how this impacts mentally ill people adversely, but I understand that that wasn't your focus, and the points you did make were good. ^^

[@R_SENAL_WHO]

I just found your channel, flipped thru your vids and found this first cause it has been a topic in this household recently. My wife is a trans-woman and she really wants the Hogwarts Legacy game, but also feels guilty for wanting it, and I'm not sure what to say either way. It can be hard to separate the artist from the their art, and/or the financial support that flows from one to the other... I loved Braveheart too, but it's a movie. I watched it a few times and done. An ongoing property like Harry Potter is another thing all together. I like Terry Goodkind books despite him being clearly in the cult of Ayn Rand nonsense, but that isn't the same either... I agree with you about the excuse of mental illness not making a difference to the harm caused, appreciate your viewpoint. Subbed.

[@CouncilofGeeks]

Unfortunately Harry Potter and JK Rowling are about the most complicated version of this question that I've yet encountered. Because the franchise will never fully go away, and it's now largely perpetuated by studios and creators using the license, so on the one hand folks can say she didn't directly contribute to something like Hogwarts Legacy. But on the other hand, she will still see residuals, and she's made clear that she takes any sale of anything connected to her as a tolerance of her views and what she's doing if not outright support. So whether or not you intend for purchasing a game like Hogwarts Legacy to indicate support for her transphobia, she's going to take it that way and it empowers her both with literal capital and with social capital. And it's made worse by the fact that this isn't a thing she did, it's a think she's actively continually doing. So it doesn't compare to someone with say a sex scandal in their past, because that's a thing they did, possibly even only once (and if they're in jail for it are presumably incapable of doing it again at least for now). But JKR's transphobia is ongoing, and there is no reason to believe it will stop. But then on yet another hand, I'm not comfortable telling people for whom this franchise offers a respite from pain or a sense of community that they need that they're bad people for not dropping it. But, I do ask that people in those situations take the time to truly examine whether something else can possibly fill that need. Does it have to be Harry Potter specifically? And if the answer is yes, then I would ask, if nothing else, please buy second hand or take a sail on the high seas.

[@thatDamnAusWhoFan]

I agree that someone's mental health is none of our business but she has commented before that she is an abuse survivor and how her experiences relate to her current beliefs. That her current views are essentially a trauma trigger response. And I think that's fine to talk about that. Trauma and bigotry are often related. It never justifies it but understanding how trauma and bigotry can intersect, and understanding bigotry in general is a good way of recognising bigotry in oneself.

[@robokill387]

True, but it does several bad things in that; 1) it equates bigotry to trauma, when most bigotry is due to social dynamics and privilege, not individual experiences, i.e, there's a reason why the UK has a higher level of transphobia than average and it's going up at the exact same time as the pain of Brexit is starting to become apparent and the government is failing to run the country properly. Boris Johnson openly and blatantly used transphobia to try to distract from criticism of his policies, for example after getting criticised for hosting a giant christmas party during lockdown when it was illegal and everyone else would have got a giant fine for it, he responded by asking the accuser what the definition of a woman is. 2) it equates trauma and mental illness to being morally a bad person, i.e, mad = bad. In fact, many mentally ill people are very good, nice people who are simply suffering

[@thatDamnAusWhoFan]

@@robokill387 very true. I only meant to say that trauma can inform someone's bigotry. Not that its the source of bigotry or that people with trauma or mental illness are potentially bad people. Like for example if someone is assaulted by a black teenager I can understand if they are jumpy around black teenagers for a bit after that. But if that person then starts campaigning and using their influence to curtail the rights of poc then I take issue.

[@Jessica-uo4qk]

Thank you for making this video. As someone who does struggle with mental illness I find it incredibly hurtful whenever people start using it as an excuse to explain away or worse defend the actions of immoral or violent people. Millions of people who have various mental illnesses or disorders are wonderful, charitable, empathetic individuals who constantly get scapegoated by mainstream media for some of the worst of society's problems. Because as you said people find it easier to just jump to conclusions than deal with the systemic problems. Not only does this take away the importance of personal accountability and responsibility, but it also actively harms some of the most vulnerable members of that society who are statistically more likely to be the victims of crime and abuse than the perpetrators. We always seem to be brought up as a first theory to explain dangerous, immoral, violent or irrational people without any evidence. No one wants to think about the fact that maybe the real monsters aren't mentally ill at all, because then they'd be forced to confront dealing with that reality and their own contributions to it. Then they might have to change their behaviour in some way. Easier to just blame the "crazies".

[@obsessionoverdose3136]

Hi, Just here to send you some love in order to battle possible hate comments. I enjoy your work a lot, be it about media that I consume and the ones that I do not, yet you bring to my attention. Thank you for challenging my thoughts and giving me the ability to empathize with people outside of my group circle. I appreciate your work a lot. Over and Out

[@visionary202]

Thank you! We need to do more than excuse or explain away with mental health as a fall guy for things occurring!

[@thomasrdiehl]

I feel like calling her crazy is an entirely diferent thing from attributing a mental illness. One is a judgement, one is a diagnosis. Equating crazy with mentally ill is really insulting to actually mentally ill people. There is a reason the more neutral phrase "mentally ill" was coined. Crazy can be due to a mental illness - but it can also just be what a person is like or a believe they have.

[@instinctart2548]

Omg how can yoy say so? The council has gone crazy! Just kidding. Great video. I agree with about everything said and it made me aware of a problem i didn't know it existed. I think i need to watch more than doctor who videos from you/attending more council meetings.

[@deenakuhn7611]

Thank you for stating so perfectly what I was having trouble explaining even to myself. Whenever someone excuses away Rowling or Ye’s actions due to mental illness (whether diagnosed by a professional or not) I always find myself wondering why that makes it acceptable. I also wonder why we have a right to speculate about that any more than we have a right to speculate about endometriosis or cancer or a thousand other ailments. I do agree with the commenters that are pointing out that by assigning mental illness to people we disagree with and whose views we often find reprehensible, we are stigmatizing anyone with mental illness. Not everyone who is depressed grabs a gun and not everyone who grabs a gun is depressed. I used to love the Harry Potter franchise. I own the books but can’t bring myself to re-read them. Like you, I can’t bring myself to get rid of them but I also can no longer enjoy them. But when my niece wants to discuss them with me, I refuse to take that from her. I just don’t send my support that way.

[@5pmsfanvids]

What a good faith take on this issue. Another, perhaps bigger, problem is that some people (and maybe there truly are no people like that in your comment sections specifically, I don’t know) speculating that a celebrity who does harmful things has a mental illness are being ableist and psychophobic in doing so. Calling someone “crazy” to insult them and disparage their opinions (instead of addressing what’s actually wrong with their views). But yes, if someone who does horrible things harming lots of people does happen to have a mental condition that doesn’t make the systematic failures that enabled or pushed that person to do those things any less significant in that case. Shifting the conversation like that is not helpful. Thank you for this video.

[@KierTheScrivener]

"Don't distract" I love that. It also paints mental illness and vileness directly together, which is something that harms another vulnerable community. An in every case but paranoia, still indicates that the belief was already there. The 'mental illness' just allowed it to manifest. Which means other than compassion doesn't really change anything. But I would argue that holding compassion and calling out atrocious behaviour should always co-exist no matter the person or diagnosis. She's spoken about abuse by men, something most women, especially transwomen have experienced. That can make someone suspicious. But no one's trauma excuses them to traumatize others. It's the systems that have entrenched her into non accountability and terfdom that are the problem. Not any trauma or mental illness she may have. It is the nurturing of hate (and us against you) rather than compassion. Always apperciate your thoughtful videos, Vera ❤️

[@JennaGetsCreative]

It's not only unethical for mental health professionals to diagnose someone who isn't their patient who they've met with, it actually violates their licensing. That was discussed a lot during the Depp v. Heard trial because the professional hired by Depp's team to assess Heard actually did meet with her but neither professional hired by Heard's team met with him and their second mental health professional witness gave diagnostic opinions based on in-character interviews.

[@camillagilmore1547]

The thing is, even if you take a sociological approach of mental illness, those broad nebulous categories of "mentally unwell" or "crazy" could generally be defined as "persistent belief or behaviour that lies well outside of societal norms in a way that causes harm to the individual". This may be persistent belief and behaviour from Rowling but it is in no way well outside of societal norms and has not caused her as an individual much material harm.

[@bookworm209]

I will argue that someone doing something seemingly wildly out there should lead us to question "are they okay, is something going on? Do they need help?" like with the Kanye West stuff. But that doesn't excuse the actions, all it does is explain them and that question is really only appropriate in those more extreme cases. Nothing JKR has done is "extreme." Hurtful? Yes. Damaging? Yes. But are you extending that same grace to Republican trying to pass bathroom bills and the like? Or for other TERFs? Because unless you think they're all suffering from some mass illness, then JRK falls well within the normal bounds of someone who just has hateful opinions. Just because you like her book doesn't mean she should get special privileges. That's part of what got us in this mess.

[@dragonofmordor]

Thank you. As someone who does have mental illness, it is very frustrating when people excuse other people's terrible things by claiming they are mentally ill.

[@enchantedlight]

To add on your one of your last points, if you think that all bad people are some type of crazy, that is painting people who have legitimate mental issues in a horrible light. Loved this video. I really appreciate how you can separate the person from an issue. Yea, I don't like JK Rowling any more, but you are completely right with your point. You can't excuse bad behavior just because it is aimed at someone you don't like.

[@idab9958]

I've been thinking exactly this for years. I understand the desire to simplify bigotry by individualising it. I certainly understand not wanting the author of a work you love to have always been a bad person, and not wanting to acknowledge that their problematic views were always pretty obvious in their work, as is the case with Harry Potter. (Shaun's recent video on HP explained this really well.) I cut myself some slack for not noticing it, since I was a child when I read these books. But the most important thing I learnt from Harry Potter and JKR's bigotry is the importance of acknowledging that even the art and artists you love the most can and must be criticised for being problematic.

[@ugolomb]

As someone who's cultural world contains many historical figures (my field is classical music), I've gotten used to the notion that artists I admire had detestable personalities and/or supported heinous ideologies (yes, even compared to their own contemporaries), I do not automatically expect great artists to be admirable or even decent human beings -- some are, some aren't. What's more surprising, and disconcerting, is that some artists can express ideals in their art that are far superior to their beliefs and/or actions as documented outside their art. Of course, separating the artist and their art is easier when you know that, in purchasing (say) a recording of a Wagner opera you are in no way contributing to the actual wealth and personal influence of Richard Wagner, who died in 1883

[@MrsMelrom]

this is something I've been thinking about a lot recently. Someone in my immediate circle has really lost it and turned mean, while I do know many of the underlieing reasons, their words and actions are horrid and hurtful. I have come to the conclusion that the explanations I give and exuses I make for them are more to put me in a better light and to be able to live with myself for not cutting them off while they're having a bad time, than to help them. In the distorted words of Hagrid 'You're a bully JK, you're a bully'.

[@nineteenthly]

I like your response. It does raise a major question in my mind though. I'm highly sceptical about the existence of free will. I presume what provokes many people to make such comments is that they can't make sense of people's behaviour as a response to their circumstances and experience given their, well, parasocial relationship I suppose. But can free will exist at all? The more I experience and, I hope, empathise with people, all I perceive really are causal chains which happen to pass through people's minds, and with behaviour which is diagnosable as mental illness certain professionals have a set of working models which to some extent can explain that, but looking further in, extrapolating on what we currently understand to be entrenched facts about human mentality and behaviour, there will, I imagine, be some causal chain which accounts for JKR's, and other people's behaviour, which it may not be appropriate to pathologise, but over which she and others have no control, simply because there is no control. Bad stuff happens and is associated with her seems to be about as far as one can go, and she may not fall into a diminished responsibility category as currently understood by psychiatrists, but is she really any more responsible than anyone else? Is anyone? What do we do with that?

[@OMGg4m3r]

Its something I'm trying to work on, where I have a habit of looking at bad people and going "what made them this way?" and try looking into the phycology of the person and I end up feeling pity towards them as I see it as a horrible image of the worst of humanity and what any person can become if they let themselves and I'm trying to stop doing this as I end up feeling a weird form of sympathy for people who don't deserve it as I end up saying "what in their life twisted them and made them this way" and I find it hard to accept that sometimes its just them being an awful person and nothing made them that way. I'm slowly working on it but I just find it very hard to get my head around that some people are just born bad people. It doesn't sit right with me as I believe everyone can achieve redemption and I need to work on pushing past that idea in my mind as it makes me try to understand people's logic when sometimes there isn't any.

[@CouncilofGeeks]

Be careful about going “some people are just born bad people.” Because in its own way that also absolves them of responsibility. Some people actively choose to do harm. Maybe because it benefits them in some way. Maybe because they’ve rationalized why it’s actually a good thing or at least a necessary thing. Or maybe they just don’t care. More often than not, these are choices.

[@elvishkat]

THANK YOU

[@pmmolnar]

THANK YOU! ❤️

[@leechtheadult]

this is exactly what needed to be said about people doing stuff like this

[@Tymbus]

So glad you pointed out it is not ethical to diagnose someone who is not your patient. I have worked as an acadmic psychologist and am a trained cousellor and you are right. I was pretty shocked when people "diagnosed" Trump and then Biden . I think people need to accept that writers are not their fiction, One way forward is to reject the work. The Harry Potter books are filled with judgemental attitudes and a not so great take on fantasy

[@mugety5130]

As a queer person who was raised jehovahs witness I do feel so annoyed that the second I actually got to read some of the Harry Potter books people realised she was a terf.

[@KiltCladViking]

I agree with your points and really do need to reexamine and make a conscious effort to change my own vocabulary when talking about people and stop using mental health issues in the same way "gay" was used on playgrounds in the 90's. I do think though there is a missing element of discussion is how talk of strangers mental health can be rooted in a strange form of compassion. Not saying that excuses the issues with calling in to question mental health, but rather that it can come from a place that isn't necessarily bad. As an example a friend recently shared a meme about Jordan Peterson getting up to his shenanigans, and I could think was this guy needs help. Not help I can provide, certainly not help I can diagnose or prescribe. Without that compassion though I'm not really sure how to react to such things, the best case scenario at the point it to say "Well, he's wrong" and just kind of falls flat, or can veer some where more problematic. Either way though when talking about public figures I guess even if the argument for compassion is valid, it's not like the figure them self will be likely to hear/ act on that concern, so guess it's kind of moot.

[@emerafey]

This. I saw a student doing this in my diagnostics class and wanted to scream. I have mental health diagnosis of my own and its awful to see people play with this. Beyond what it does to the public figure, it causes stigma to everyone who really has a diagnosis.

[@spadealt456]

Howdy, Bipolar 1 here, I’ve got 2 cents for anyone who wants them. I really, really appreciate the points you brought up about armchair diagnosing. It’s bad enough having the stigma of “crazy,” it’s worse that people flaunt it as an excuse for anything a celebrity does. I’m not a celebrity, so I my mental illness doesn’t shield me. Instead it becomes the reason I feel any emotions at all in regard to other’s perspectives (“Are you off your meds??” Is a regularly heard thing every time someone expresses any emotion, be it good or bad.) Basically, due to armchair diagnosis, people’s perspectives of me is filtered through what they know from celebrity gossip without any of the benefits. That being said, (and this is not in reference to any specific thing in your video, just continuing the conversation,) I don’t think that mental illness should be completely separate from the discussion on a persons actions. It terrifies me that I might at some point be seen as a public figure, because I can’t guarantee that I won’t go manic and start screening about “The Great Reboot” all over again. Does that mean I shouldn’t pursue being seen? Well, no, one of the first steps in ending a stigma is being seen. It DOES however, mean that I need to be willing to hold myself accountable, apologize when things go wrong, and be as transparent as possible. If someone’s actions are causing harm, then yeah, they should be deplatformed, mental illness or not. If JK’s actions are further radicalizing and calling for violence against minorities, then it’s irresponsible for her to have a stage. Back in ye oldie days, she’d be the one rambling on the corner street while people pass her without paying any mind. I wish there was a way that we could go back to that style of doing things. Unfortunately we’re seeing a pretty big divide between “let people live their life regardless of the harm they bring” and “incarcerate the people that can’t control themself.” As talk of mental health becomes more and more radicalized in both directions, the lives of people who are “crazy” are put further and further at risk. Im not the only one who has been subject to the medical trauma of being pinned down by four men and sedated via needle. TLDR: Don’t armchair diagnose people, there is room for societalism in the discussion of mental health (in addition to the individualism that’s also in place,) and harm reduction should be the goal.

[@nozzlepie]

On the spectrum of TERFs on terf-island, JKR seems fairly moderate compared with many of the newspaper, radio and TV voices. She's just one of the richest and most well connected and happens to be a favorite of geeks. It's not a suprise that she has those views when far right to liberal media and politicians often have such disgusting takes on "the trans issue". Ugh. It's absolutly the media environment to blame.

[@Donnagata1409]

A heartfelt ramble, that puts us in front of a mirror and encourages us to do some introspection. All your arguments seem very on point. Thanks, Vera, as always.

[@CnctCnpire]

i hate the mirror i look fucking ugly and it makes me want to get perscribed shit tons of medication

[@felisazure1820]

One of the scariest parts is, when people equate someone's horrible behavior with a mental illness or disorder, if someone that just so happens to have that illness or disorder does something horrible, people will immediately excuse them. Because they were taught that was just how the person with x, y, or z acts. Which then ends up negatively affecting and hurting other people with the mental illness or disorder.

[@Paulxl]

I totally agree with the video. I would add that saying that increases the stigma around mental health issues and it also absolve her of her own actions. Some people are just bad people. And there's no explanation other that bad people exist.

[@LadyQuotes]

I completely agree, people should not speculate on someone else's mental health. It's not their business and it's unethical. And even if it is true, you still shouldn't allow poor behaviour. If someone had an illness that caused them to go around and stick people with needles, people would stop them. Just because there's a reason behind it, doesn't make the behaviour more acceptable.

[@julenegarcia7322]

I appreciate your emotional & intellectual labor in regards to this topic. You have been more than fair & professional when discussing JK Rowling and the BBC. I appreciate you & wish you a happy holiday season .

[@JustinW332]

Mental health is nothing to take lightly and we don't need it to be anymore stigmatized than it already is. This stuff with Rowling reminds me of when I found out that my favorite Christian rock singer collaborated with the Billy Graham Evangelistic association on one of her singles and a book she wrote. I'm sure I don't need to say why that's a bad look. I was just so disappointed as a member of the LGBT community because I loved her style and her lyrics. And to see that she was willing to associate with a group that was actively anti LGBT was heartbreaking. Since then, I can't, in good conscience, support her new work because who knows what hate group the money will go to next. I do still own their old albums, but I won't be buying any new ones.

[@isaganipalanca8803]

Great segment!!!!! Cogently argued!!!!!!

[@sigyn27]

The video is really good, but because I love nitpicking, I need to point out that J.K. Rowling had discussed her struggles with depression in the past, so it's not entirely accurate that she had not disclosed her mental health issues. That being said, you made really good points. While I can see why people want to understand and explain why J.K. Rowling is doing what she is doing, I think the conversation should be focused on the whole gender-critical movement, not on J. K. Rowling herself and her life story. On an individual level, there can be a myriad of reasons why a certain person subscribed to a certain ideology. What is more important I think is looking at the wider picture and trends.

[@Katherine_The_Okay]

Everyone else has said everything that needs to be said about mental illness not equating to jerkassery, but I'm actually going to go a step further and say that mental illness has made me a MORE loving and compassionate human being than I was in my early 20 when I felt invincible and thought I knew everything. When every day is a brutal battle against yourself that no one else can see happening and that even your closest relatives are judging you for, that is a SOLID reminder that anyone around you could also be fighting a similar battle. Long story short, there's a reason my only bumper sticker just says "be kind always."

[@Faeryunknow]

Thank you

[@ElynevanOpzeeland]

While i often recognize patterns for certain mentall illnesses/ disorders in celebraties, and sometimes youtubers, i'll never share them publicly. The human brain has a bias for recognizing patterns and i know that. If my brain suddenly recognises a pattern i know is highly related to a mental illnes/ disorder i just chuckle and move on. I think i have shared one or 2 with my brother while i was still figuring out my own diagnosis, and it helped a lot discussing it with him. Also funnily enough for a lot of people i recognised patterns they at a certain time came out with the fact they indeed had that mentall illnes/ disorder, but that could be the bias speaking again. And again, i've never shared my suspicions publicly. The only time i will share my suspicions is when it's a person that's very close to me, and shows signs of struggle they don't understand and can't find a reason for. This way i can nudge them into a possible reason and advise them to seek help professionally for their struggles, and see if they indeed have an undiagnosed mental illnes/ disorder that is making life more difficult than it needs to be. But again, this is only appropriate with close friends and family, and just completely wrong with public figures!

[@cameronheaton9900]

I didn't even know this was being talk about. Thank Council of Geeks.

[@rachelbecknell4259]

Thank you. I have suffered from PTSD and thus I am a person who has/had mental illness, and I do not appreciate having myself associated with transphobia (here-not by you, obviously, but by those you call out), racism (numerous excuses for racists I've seen on-line), or gun violence and other hateful things because a man beat his wife in front of me and scared me so that time broke and I was left with fearful flashes and heightened startle responses and so on. It has nothing to do with mental illness. It has to do with hatred and cruelty, and I assure you; as someone who suffered PTSD from violence, I abhor violence and the hatred and cruelty that beget it. I despise how our society treats those of us with mental illness, and I am done with people associating me and mine with that.

[@CLDJ227]

I immediately knew school shootings was gonna be used as your second example and couldn't agree more. Merry Christmas 🎄 😎.

[@pjaypender1009]

Yes. That's called the Goldwater Rule. A mental health care professional is ethically proscribed from diagnosing someone they have not interviewed and assessed personally. If they had personally interviewed and assessed someone, they would be ethically proscribed from revealing that because of confidentiality. To call someone mentally ill because they've are or became problematic is ableist.

[@Efegaming1]

I have a therapist which I go to Regularly about once a month And I struggle with my anxiety and Rage issues sometimes

[@asuka_the_void_witch]

Thoughtful video

[@sycoraxrock]

In addition to, you know, not dragging people with mental illness into this… the scariest thing about JKR’s transphobia for *me* is how she “logiced” herself into those views. You can go back and look at that “mask off” manifesto blog post from a few years ago, and… yes, this thought follows that thought and I can see the mental path she took to arrive where she did. That’s what’s so scary: she actually thought it through and still wound up on the side of “let’s bully trans people because, uh, feminism I guess.” She didn’t wind up in a place that was good or helpful or based in any reality other than hers and the harm she’s done to trans people with her platform has been massive (especially younger ones who grew up with Harry and are now having to deal with Wizard Mom tell them they’re either delusional or a threat) but - nope, she’s not crazy. She’s very, very, VERY misguided and wrong, but not crazy necessarily. If there’s anything to be said about her mental health without a proper diagnosis, I’d question why she feels the need to continually and consistently make things worse for herself (and - obviously - LGBTQ people too, but it still begs the question how someone who once claimed to hate bigotry and ignorance above all else simply cannot *stop* being a fucking bigot on Twitter.)

[@rassilontdavros3004]

Thank you. This is something that society has needed to stop doing for a long, long time.

[@eviesholette]

Only tangentially related, but we all need a laugh right now: when I studied abroad in England, Mel Gibson was mentioned and I basically got laughed out of the history department for saying that I really enjoyed both Bravehart and The Patriot. The Lecturer was not impressed 🤣

[@CouncilofGeeks]

Entertaining movies. Terrible history.

[@M-CH_]

Nathaniel is the only person I like to watch getting angry.

[@zravenwolf1408]

So much yes.

[@sammyauroraloves]

This and also the misconception that someone being "crazy" means their actions are inexplicable and have no logic or thought behind them and are basically tantamount to being possessed by a demon - which isn't how mental illness nor bigotry works, and assuming it is makes it that much harder to meaningfully address both.

[@tysondennis1016]

Mental health is not an excuse for bigotry.

[@pinupgoblin]

I feel like it is human nature to want to know "why". "Why is this person this way?" "Why did they do/say what they did?" Etc. It's part of trying to gain understanding and even empathize with them. I don't think that should be demonized. However, I do think labeling it as "a mental illness" is harmful and insulting to those who do actually have a mental illness. It's also lazy because even if that is the case and true, why does that matter? It says that people with mental illness have no choice and cannot get better.

[@kevin10001]

These kinds of people are looking for any reason to be able to continue to love the franchise cause the can’t accept the possibility she was always like this to some degree but getting big in the publishing industry gave her the means to be able to express her views

[@TalLikesThat]

Yes yes yes and a 5,000% yes. Thank you!

[@Lexi_Zone]

Yeah, we all need to talk about this because ableism is _everywhere._ It's the go-to explanation for anything someone doesn't like or agree with, and it all too often seems to brush over the actual problems. And all you have to do is re-examine Rowling's books with a critical lens to see that she didn't suddenly become this way.