This Is Not Korean But It Is Cantonese!? | Can We Use the Korean Alphabet to Write Cantonese?

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Seb'xTeaHouse2.0

Seb'xTeaHouse2.0

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 118
@My-nl6sg
@My-nl6sg Ай бұрын
Additionally you can technically write out a grammatically correct Mandarin paragraph and write out the corresponding Korean Hanja pronunciation in Hangul; or write Mandarin phoneticized with Hangul directly, or Cantonese. It doesn't matter, you can even use Hiragana, use Arabic (Xiao'er Jing in Xinjiang already does this with Xinjiang Mandarin), Cyrillic (refer to Dungan), and what have you.
@bringbackthedislikecount6767
@bringbackthedislikecount6767 Ай бұрын
As someone who can understand Cantonese, without the context I would have absolutely no idea what the hangul transcript is trying to say
@samomanawat
@samomanawat Ай бұрын
Hangul didn’t represent tones. However, Thai Script represented tones and it was one of the first scripts to incorporate tones into the script.
@xwtek3505
@xwtek3505 Ай бұрын
Modern Hangul spelling doesn't, but the Hangul as Sejong initially designed it does mark tone.
@Rungsawas
@Rungsawas Ай бұрын
Yes, Thai language has 5 levels of tones to represent sounds, but some consonants of foreign languages ​​do not have Thai consonants.
@samomanawat
@samomanawat Ай бұрын
@@Rungsawas There were 38-40 consonant sounds in Proto-Tai language, according to Li Fang Kuei’s and Pittayawat Pittayaporn’s reconstructions. And in modern Thai language, we still have consonants for those obsolete sounds. And not only Thai language but also every tonal languages (in East and South East Asia) falls into the same category of tone boxes by William J. Gedney. Chinese called it 平上去入 system but Chinese didn’t incorporate the system into the writing. Thai script, on the other hand, incorporated the system into the script thus can be used to write any tonal languages in East and Southeast Asia (+ some parts of South Asia).
@Isl33p
@Isl33p 27 күн бұрын
Hangul DID represent tones. It gradually stopped representing tones as the Korean language slowly abandoned tones
@jangtheconqueror
@jangtheconqueror 8 күн бұрын
As another Korean commented, Hangul originally had a system to represent tones (pitch accent), by drawing dots to the left of the characters. Tones disappeared from standard Seoul Korean, although they're maintained in regional dialects. But it was only a low tone, high tone, and rising tone, very simple. You'd need to invent extra symbols anyway to represent the tones of Cantonese. Also, Hangul originally had several additional letters. Some of them were for sounds that have disappeared or merged with other sounds in the language, and some of them were exclusively for use in writing down the sounds of Chinese. I have no doubt that restoring some of them and perhaps repurposing them as needed would help in this task.
@eatfruitsalad345
@eatfruitsalad345 Ай бұрын
While I think this is a pretty interesting exercise, I think that the best results come when someone carefully designs a writing system around the components of the language. I don't know Cantonese, but having learned Mandarin in Taiwan, I have a bias towards liking the Zhuyin Fuhao system (aka bopomofo) for transliteration, and I'm aware that it can also be used to transliterate Taiwanese Hokkien as well as Cantonese (though I'd love to hear from a native speaker how good the transliteration is compared to jyutping). Also similar thing that this video reminded me of: Japanese katakana was once modified to create a writing system for Taiwanese Hokkien during the colonial era. I cannot speak Taiwanese but I am also curious to hear from any speakers whether this transliteration was any good
@limanto4946
@limanto4946 2 ай бұрын
You can read again, ancient korean text book, nogeoldae, in three languages, Old Mandarin, Mongolian, Manchurian, these text boook use hangul to write three languages
@Alternatives_Universum
@Alternatives_Universum Ай бұрын
I think its Phagspa.
@polyommatusicarus208
@polyommatusicarus208 Ай бұрын
영상 내용 제대로 안 보면 국어 선생님 극대노 하시겠넼ㅋㅋㅋㅋ 조선 시대에 성조를 나타내는 방점은 글자 왼쪽에 썼음. 하지만 광동이죠ㅋㅋ
@rbalsdldiify
@rbalsdldiify Ай бұрын
As a Korean, this is really cool project ngl, but still I think it is best for Cantonese to be written in either Chinese character, for mutual textual comprehension with other Chinese dialects, or Latin alphabets, for better accessibility for foreigners. On the side note, instead of Cantonese, the language I think the most suitable for Hangeul transcription is Japanese, our eastern neighbor. Compared to Cantonese, Japanese language has much simpler phonetics and quite rigidly defined letters. I mean, add some "f" sounding consonants, and then you can literally transcript Japanese right away. And plus I believe that Japanese people are more familiar to Hangeul than Cantonese speakers are.
@muizacetheadorable5319
@muizacetheadorable5319 Ай бұрын
japanese can never be written with hangul because japanese NEEDS kanji, in japanese language even hiragana couldnt completely replace kanji...
@rbalsdldiify
@rbalsdldiify Ай бұрын
​@@muizacetheadorable5319 Right, japanese may need kanji for better readability. but that doesn't completely nullify my argument that Japanese can be written in Korean. Back in around 80s and before, Koreans also used a lot of Chinese characters in their writings just as much as Japanese do nowadays. so it wouldn't be that big of a problem to write Japanese with Hangeul along side with Kanji.
@TheSiegeKnight
@TheSiegeKnight Ай бұрын
Cantonese is already written in chinese characters. Hong Kong internet has a somewhat well established convention on what characters to use, and cantonese-only characters are already in the unicode.
@PhionYu
@PhionYu Ай бұрын
There was f,v,z consonants used previously. Modern Korean just abandoned them
@CorwinLovesLangauges
@CorwinLovesLangauges 16 күн бұрын
I love what you are doing bro, this is the your first video that I have seen, but I love it, don’t stop❤️♥️
@SebxTeaHouse2.0
@SebxTeaHouse2.0 16 күн бұрын
❤️❤️❤️
@Hampter-m7r
@Hampter-m7r 2 ай бұрын
As a Korean, BRUH 😮
@polyommatusicarus208
@polyommatusicarus208 Ай бұрын
쥐 공, 어쩌다 이곳에 오게 되셨소......
@BBarNavi
@BBarNavi Ай бұрын
@OcienOnce
@OcienOnce Ай бұрын
Korean language needs more letters for more flexibility
@KR_Picaserica
@KR_Picaserica Ай бұрын
Actually, there used to be more.
@sumi2973
@sumi2973 Ай бұрын
What letters?
@KR_Picaserica
@KR_Picaserica Ай бұрын
@@sumi2973 ㅿ That is expected to sound like z of "zebra", ㆁ that sounded like ng of "song" ㆆ that sounded like Hamzah(ء) of Arabic.
@somethinginthesun
@somethinginthesun Ай бұрын
ᄬᅵᄄᆚ. 테ᄙᅦᄬᅵᅀᅧᆫ.
@martinsalves-io3bc
@martinsalves-io3bc Ай бұрын
@@somethinginthesun Where do you type this way: "ᄬᅵᄄᆚ. 테ᄙᅦᄬᅵᅀᅧᆫ.", do you use an specific keyboard?"
@hanng1242
@hanng1242 Ай бұрын
How many homonyms are there in Cantonese? I suspect that there are enough such that Cantonese is still written in Hanzi rather than something like Jyutping. If this is the case, using Hangul would not be an improvement since it is also an alphabet. Does Hangul represent the phonology better than Juytping? Does Cantonese make the distinction between tense consonants and (for lack of a better term) loose consonants? If Hangul isn't objectively more accurate than Jyutping, what would be the advantage of using it in light of the far more widespread international use of the Latin alphabet?
@SebxTeaHouse2.0
@SebxTeaHouse2.0 Ай бұрын
Yep, so Nowadays, Cantonese speakers still use the Chinese characters to write Cantonese. And here Cantonese has 2 kinds of Hanzi, the written version(such as, 的≈of) and the spoken version(such as, 嘅≈of). In addition, Hangul is still a prototype and Jyutping is a tool that can help people to mark the pronunciations.
@oishibaking
@oishibaking Ай бұрын
Tbh due to a lot more vowels like “oe” “eo” etc which mandarin doesn’t, Cantonese could use jyutpimg (if include tone marks) there’s a system where you use Vietnamese to write canto to include tones. I think the problem is most people, don’t know the pinyin for Cantonese
@quyenluong3705
@quyenluong3705 Ай бұрын
@@oishibakingbecause there’s no need for Jyutping?
@oishibaking
@oishibaking Ай бұрын
@@quyenluong3705 your argument goes both ways. mandarin does not need pinyin too for people to learn it well. look at past dynasties: Song Yuan Ming Qing. none of them had pinyin. However, jyutping is MANDATORY for the promotion of cantonese, and for people to type out what they want. I mainly use jyutping when i type chinese.
@bravehero7897
@bravehero7897 Ай бұрын
You has changed the elegant poem to weird-sound poem.😂😂 The 9 tone table is useful and easy to remember. Thanks for your work.👍👍
@chappy3125
@chappy3125 21 күн бұрын
Using original hangeul, its possible to represent tones and sounds not found in Korean so i think this is a great idea
@ilililiililiil3006
@ilililiililiil3006 5 күн бұрын
As a Korean, I think Cantonese language is get along with Chinese character so far?
@nintendokingdom
@nintendokingdom Ай бұрын
The fact that in Indonesia, there's a place that saved its dialect with hangul (Korean alphabet).
@xwtek3505
@xwtek3505 Ай бұрын
Not a dialect. It's a completely distinct language.
@firstlast2602
@firstlast2602 Ай бұрын
cia-cia is it's own language from sulawesi, very different compared to indonesian (the national language) or even languages from it's surrounding area
@NanobanaKinako
@NanobanaKinako Ай бұрын
Americans, They always think Asian languages are dialect of a dominant language. And that's not the first I sensed this ignorance. American also think Philippine languages are dialects.
@RadenWA
@RadenWA Ай бұрын
They were actually fine writing their language with Malay Arabic (Jawi) before. The Hangul thing was just a marketing move.
@shutterchick79
@shutterchick79 23 күн бұрын
​@@RadenWA Although Hangul is much much easier to learn than Arabic script, yes....?
@jungleng
@jungleng 13 күн бұрын
Been doing this with mandarin (which has fewer tones so there are enough dot tone marks to go around) so it's definitely possible for cantonese. Some of your choices for cantonese sounds are odd. Hangul had ㆁ(not ㅇ)that represents an ng sound so ㄲ is unnecessarily confusing. Cantonese has 6 or 9 tones but that's mainly because of yin/yang tones based on voiced or unvoiced consonants. So using something to denote that coupled with the dots for 上 and 去 tones would make sense. The dots had historical links to chinese phonology and your proposal seems to discard that (they were also originally on the left of the syllables). 읟 for yuet sound just doesn't make sense. 低/地 also don't rhyme in cantonese so no idea why you would use the same hangul for those words. And why would you use ㅎ for a final ng when there's already ㅇ? The vowel in 光and床 (without the r glide) are the same, so its also confusing to use 2 different hangul fornthem
@ethandouro4334
@ethandouro4334 Ай бұрын
As a Portuguese native speaker, I'm going to Macau to learn Cantonese
@광동아재廣東大叔
@광동아재廣東大叔 Ай бұрын
Don't expect anybody to speak Portuguese there... It's not like HongKong
@ethandouro4334
@ethandouro4334 Ай бұрын
@광동아재廣東大叔 ik, but at least I can have fun reading the signs
@trien30
@trien30 Ай бұрын
As a Cantonese speaker, that's a dumb idea, considering 90% of Cantonese speakers do not understand Korean nor write using Hang(e)ul.
@franciscoflamenco
@franciscoflamenco Ай бұрын
The dumb idea here is assuming that it's impossible for them to learn Hangul, especially considering how famous it is for being easy to learn.
Ай бұрын
We should make our own system that's similar to hangul
@EdwardNavu
@EdwardNavu Ай бұрын
Not effective as Cantonese script, but promising as a Hangul mnemonic for Cantonese speaker i guess
@Danpungip
@Danpungip Ай бұрын
They have to learn an new alphabet 😱 what a big deal
@quintusng9580
@quintusng9580 Ай бұрын
Also there are so many consonants in Cantonese do not exist in Korean. Hangul is simply not sufficient to indicate all pronunciation in Cantonese
@RandomUserX99
@RandomUserX99 Ай бұрын
Koreans trying to convince actual Chinese to abandon hanzi like they did lol
@d1tto232
@d1tto232 17 күн бұрын
Since British colonialism the big powers always wanted to divide china and the best way for them is to push tribalism and push people to be proud Cantonese Manchurian etc to hopefully in the future do the same what they did with the Ottoman empire.
@superramenrider
@superramenrider Ай бұрын
I think Cantonese should better use the Thai script since it is an alphabet that indicates tones. Korean hangul seems to have no tones included. Or since Cantonese is within the Sinosphere, perhaps, reinvent Hangul to include the tones.
@Isl33p
@Isl33p 27 күн бұрын
Hangul has a system that indicates tones. Dialects of Korean, such as Jeju and Yeongdong, have tones. e.g.: 그듸내〮길어〮내ᄂᆞᆫ〮 (그대들이 길러 내는) Here, there are dots on characters such as 내, where they are written as '내〮' (with 〮 ). These represent tones.
@vangiaido1285
@vangiaido1285 23 күн бұрын
Both Cantonese and Mandarin should be latinized. In the past Vietnamese language had been latinized from Chinese Characters into the alphabet since the Christian missionaries stepped in Vietnam and rapidly became popular in the Vietnamese Catholic communities.
@awelotta
@awelotta 2 ай бұрын
Middle Korean had three tones: low, high, and rising. They were marked with dots on the left of the syllable, so no dot means low tone, one not means high, and two dots meant rising. This is a kinda the opposite compared to the Cantonese Hangul in the video, where the dots are on the right, but it's clever way of adapting the preexisting system. Also the other proposals for sh ch and zh seem flawed in that in normal Korean writing, ㅈ with a スshape is just the handwritten version, so flipping it around to get a different sound would be weird
@SebxTeaHouse2.0
@SebxTeaHouse2.0 2 ай бұрын
Thank you 👍. That's a very good supplement. ❤️
@hiswieder9398
@hiswieder9398 Ай бұрын
well those were actually not tone but accent
@광동아재廣東大叔
@광동아재廣東大叔 Ай бұрын
As a Korean who speaks Mandarin and Cantonese, the Korean transcription there is simply nonsense...
@NanobanaKinako
@NanobanaKinako Ай бұрын
I don't think Joseongul is the right alternative script. Maybe Thai Script would fit better.
@Null2-irkutsk
@Null2-irkutsk Ай бұрын
As a Hong Kongan, no.
@thanono-in992
@thanono-in992 Ай бұрын
My idea i think If you want to speak for Cantonese. The sound like Vietnamese language. And you can use Thai language for speak like Cantonese(If you can speak Thai language5555555).
@Yaksha_Indra
@Yaksha_Indra Ай бұрын
4:32 Thats look like Arc System button input
@KR_Picaserica
@KR_Picaserica Ай бұрын
As a Korean, it is kinda weirdo but interesting
@bjap1563
@bjap1563 28 күн бұрын
How do they indicate tones?
@SebxTeaHouse2.0
@SebxTeaHouse2.0 27 күн бұрын
can use numbers or different dots as the tones mark.
@Isl33p
@Isl33p 27 күн бұрын
Similar to English accent marks, there used to be dots on the left side of the individual characters to indicate different tones. Like 〮 and 〯.
@lepmuhangpa
@lepmuhangpa Ай бұрын
Nah, it just doesn't fell like Chinese anymore, does it? 🤔 Of course, it's possible. 🤷🏻 You can write any language in any script, it's just that Cantonese heritage that runs deep, HanZi isn't just about writing, it's a deep cultural link & thing of pride for all Chinese ethic groups. 文 Even, Japanese refuses to discard Hanji because of how important it has become culturally.
@HockeyLegend-wd4yi
@HockeyLegend-wd4yi Ай бұрын
Is this guy even speaking English
@SebxTeaHouse2.0
@SebxTeaHouse2.0 Ай бұрын
Yep, this is an English channel. Plus most of the comments are also in English and the subtitles are also in English;) but additionally according to the information from YT studio, the 65.8% viewers (including me) are from the countries that English is the first English. As a video creator I never stop learning.
@HockeyLegend-wd4yi
@HockeyLegend-wd4yi Ай бұрын
@@SebxTeaHouse2.0 Keep the learning going ✊
@SK-zi3sr
@SK-zi3sr Ай бұрын
I love hangul but it does need more flexibility and a way to represent v and f, and a marking to make ng start at syllables and stuff like that. How that language in Indonesia uses double ㄹ is a smart way of doing it, making it just normal L. Ok I don’t think they did that Cantonese hangul consinents are weird. Why is gw ㄷ, kw- ㅌ, f is upside down ㅈ j a triangle. That’s not a good way to do it.
@somethinginthesun
@somethinginthesun 27 күн бұрын
ㅹ v ㆄ f ᄙᅠ l ㅿ z ㅸ w
@karaki369
@karaki369 Ай бұрын
韓語彥文不適合廣東話。舉個例子,廣東話有ng的聲母,韓語彥文用ㅇ來表示零聲母,沒有多餘的字母表示ng。比如漢字“牙”(tooth),廣東話讀“ngaa”,同一個漢字在韓語裏面讀“아”a,因為韓語的ng聲母全部脫落了。而且韓語的聲調也在近代消失了,廣東話還保留著六個聲調。
@mckendrick7672
@mckendrick7672 Ай бұрын
I'm reading this through a translator so I may have not gotten the whole meaning of what you were saying. Korean has the obsolete letter ㆁ which represents the same sound of "ng", so could this not be revived if attempting to transcribe Cantonese in Hangul?
@karaki369
@karaki369 Ай бұрын
​@@mckendrick7672 Thank you for telling me this knowledge. But this is just a small example I just gave. The biggest problem is that sinitic languages ​​generally have many homographs, which are not suitable for you to spell using phonetic characters such as hangul. If you are Korean, you must have heard of projects failing because of confusion about two hanja words waterproofing(防水) and waterrelease(放水), both pronounced 'bangsu' by korean.
@Willitbl3nd
@Willitbl3nd Ай бұрын
You maybe started something in me...
@CalIrons-wr2xy
@CalIrons-wr2xy Ай бұрын
Highly 順𦧄! I love it 😂
@devl9677
@devl9677 Ай бұрын
床前明月光 疑是地上霜😂
@MejaresKenn1
@MejaresKenn1 22 күн бұрын
reminds me of the cia cia language
@ronaldbolibol470
@ronaldbolibol470 2 ай бұрын
如此美丽😍
@jawijawijawi5047
@jawijawijawi5047 2 ай бұрын
So beautiful 😍
@illuminoti6974
@illuminoti6974 Ай бұрын
cantonese similar like vietnamese
@quyenluong3705
@quyenluong3705 Ай бұрын
Yes Ngọ sic kỏn duyệt mảnh.
@YoezenKau
@YoezenKau Ай бұрын
支持
@penguinpingu3807
@penguinpingu3807 Ай бұрын
It's can work to help people to learn the language. If Cantonese still want to keep the Chinese characters. Like what latin is doing as of current.
@Danpungip
@Danpungip Ай бұрын
You need to work on your pronunciation
@SebxTeaHouse2.0
@SebxTeaHouse2.0 Ай бұрын
Okay, thanks for your comment and I’m working. Honestly every video is made from my passion. So don’t worry I worked hard on creating videos. So the bad pronunciation is not mean that I just work for fun.
@wooble73
@wooble73 25 күн бұрын
Stupid idea
@somethinginthesun
@somethinginthesun Ай бұрын
ᅌᅩㅁ해ᄒᆞᇰ고ᇰ얀. 듀네ᄙᆃᄆᆃ. 😂
@kalinkavelinova2529
@kalinkavelinova2529 Ай бұрын
I made Hangul with 뾇 as a real word lol
@illuminoti6974
@illuminoti6974 Ай бұрын
cantonese similar like vietnamese
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