This Makes ZERO SENSE in Skullgirls 2nd Encore

#shorts #skullgirls #skullgirls2ndencore #fightinggames

[@ewan8200]

It’s a common thing in fighting games. Having a low jab or move can be really good for a character’s mix up ability. But If a character already has a good kit, the developers may remove the low jab; to balance the character.

[@Spleenatron9]

And having a standing low negates the need to crouch, giving your opponent less time to react since there's no stance change.

[@Meklein]

Or sometimes the character can have a bad kit and they will still do this, I'm looking at you MB:TL Akiha

[@ElpheltStan]

​@@Spleenatron9 if you can react to a character crouching then you should be winning tourney after tourney lmao

[@norock_]

Mostly it's a thing with range, a general rule is that you have range or mixup/damage potential with a move. If you have both, then the move may be slow, or leave you unsafe if blocked. For valentine and parasoul, their standing light kicks are fast, have range, and are attached to mobile characters. Beowulf's is slower and Bigband is attached to a slow character that won't be able to make use of it for mixups that efficiently.

[@chaotixspark7934]

@@Meklein Akiha still has a mid poke game. Shes not the same as mbaacc akiha or vermillion, but shes close.

[@schawangus]

“Like bro, she’s literally playing with your toes” best sentence I’ve ever heard

[@TY-PO]

Ms Fortune looks like she’s enjoying it too.😂

[@officially_uzi_onYT]

'like bro shez literly playen witz geor toez' ಠಿ⁠_⁠ಠ

[@randomgoodcommentor2072]

🤨

[@GetShrekd]

mmghmphff...

[@sadyeeter4829]

Hitbox shenanigans

[@Random_Dude_On_The_Internet_]

"So what did you learn from this?" "Jiggle physics"

[@Alone-Guy41]

Fr

[@theBlindDeafMute]

Jiggle Physics implies a physics simulation. Each bounce you see was lovingly hand drawn by the talented animators at lab zero (and zone chan) and I will NOT hear the work of these artists be erased

[@Paulo-nt2bf]

​@@theBlindDeafMute So basically Jiggle animations

[@atomak47]

😂

[@horplesmoff]

Welcome to literally every fighting game lmfao

[@fozart-9309]

ikr? Why is he impressed and confused by it lol,it's such a common thing in any fighting game.

[@CasualPhoenic]

Fighting games need to fix this issue, it’s such a frustrating design flaw

[@Omega-mf9kj]

@@CasualPhoenic its not? If this wasnt in fighting games you could block forever witb no penalty

[@BainesMkII]

@@Omega-mf9kj Not true, and the solution can make blocking much more difficult, which is probably why most 2D games don't follow that path. The complaint is the unintuitive visual discrepancy, which truly is unintuitive even if you've grown to expect it. The solution is to design attacks so the visuals match the behavior. That doesn't mean that you cannot have stuff like a standing attack that hits low, it just means that you shouldn't design a standing attack that hits low if it isn't actually going to hit low. If you look, you'll see that many overheads followed this principle, with the visual element showing the attacker briefly leaving the ground during the attack, making it look similar to regular jumping attacks and thus implying it should be blocked high. The "problem" with intuitive design is that you either limit the visual variety of moves (if you stick to a strict standing=mid, crouch=low, jump=high structure), or you make blocking more difficulty because the defender now has to react entirely to the attack visuals rather than stance. Note this is why overheads also tend to be fairly telegraphed and slow, and characters may only have one, in order to make it *easier* for the defender to block.

[@civicmimiv]

@@BainesMkII mucho texto

[@lacrossehammy124]

skullgirls: come for the hot nurse and stay for the combat quality

[@MainAccountInAbout]

Yep

[@felidaeviv4680]

Honestly, I came cause big band and squiggly

[@arkeezy.]

​@@felidaeviv4680 Guess who I came for.

[@medjaimcgraw5632]

@@arkeezy. ms fortune

[@justascarecrow6988]

@@felidaeviv4680 Big Band is just one of the coolest fighting game characters ever.

[@Mario-im1rk]

This is what we call "fighting game bullshit."

[@linnen_elm]

So.. you want a full fledged accidentally OP char without balancing nerf ever? Do you ever taste Mai's dolphin shenanigans? Like- the playerbase malding AF and begging devs to nerf her- only to end up buffing her instead- reducing her damage only ends up getting tortured for more longer- the community malding once again.

[@Mario-im1rk]

@@linnen_elm Stuff like that happens all the time in fighting games. Characters becoming OP accidently is so common. Like how in Smash bros Brawl Meta Knight is the ONLY SS tier in the game.

[@YusufZetro]

its balanced, crouch attach respond with crouch defence, its only not logic thats all

[@phongphamthanh5911]

@@linnen_elm shouldnt they change the animation to "look like" it hit low/mid if it is low/mid atk instead of changing the dmg input only? It seem they just lazy to draw another move

[@linnen_elm]

@@phongphamthanh5911 i tell you what bro.. if anything else, skullgirls is the most diligent of them all. *_Skullgirls holds the Guinness world record for "Most Frames of Animation per Character" with an average of 1,439 frames per fighter._* So yeah, changing what seams like a minuscule change would means re-handrawing more than 500 frames

[@ninjahedgehog5]

"Screw the rules! We have balance!" Seriously though it's especially weird due to skullgirl's infamously precise hitboxes

[@UnrealAxel27]

Its not a hitbox issue. Its intentionally designed that way. Many fighting games do it

[@ninjahedgehog5]

@SarenRouge like I said. For balance. But I think the argument here is that if it's not low don't make it look like one. But that would mean redrawing these hand drawn frames since sometimes it gets changed after the fact

[@fourplayerarcade]

😂😂

[@WeebSlayer27]

@@ninjahedgehog5 Production skill issue, draw it

[@cmnidit4444]

@ninjahedgehog5 if you make a mistake, fix it.

[@mattkim96]

“It makes no sense, but the more I look into it…the more it makes no sense.” mood

[@AcidWolf_69]

Thats why I have a grudge against Beowulf

[@Devonlewis537]

Heheh

[@phorchybug3286]

that lame wrestler man. he's funny but lame play style.

[@leobanks6111]

​@@phorchybug3286 sounds like someone had the Wolfamania run all over 'em.

[@Fellkun]

Honestly I just hate the grab special cause you can't break out of it

[@patatita0079]

Dude I'm a beo main and I still hate him, he grabs u, ure fuckt up U jump, he jumps, he grabs u ure fuckt up You're down, he TAKE YOU UP, GRABS U AND KEEP GOING

[@AlexLayden1]

People don't really understand why he's complaining. He's not complaining because the character has a standing low jab. He's complaining because visually all of these characters have attacks that visually strike low, it's just only one of them has an attack that actually hits low. He's complaining about the visuals not the concept of a low jab

[@uberculex]

It's because most if not all of the attacks are references from other fighting games so their animation is set.

[@anonymousapproximation8549]

​@@uberculex Terrible excuses. Make the animation consistent with the technicals.

[@uberculex]

@@anonymousapproximation8549 I don't make the games, I was just stating why they were the way they were.

[@V2ULTRAKill]

​@@anonymousapproximation8549 terrible take Balance and stance readability is enough Every single one of these mid read as a mid to a veteran

[@anonymousapproximation8549]

@@V2ULTRAKill English reads as English to an English Major. Doesn't stop English from making no sense with it's grammar and spelling "rules". Same thing applies to this. It makes sense to the veterans because they're already used to the nonsense.

[@hyliandoctor]

This is the reason why, in Blazblue, Susano'o has three crouching buttons that are not low: 2A, 2B, and 2C, with 2D being his actual low. One reason being that 2A/B are best used as pokes to keep up pressure and go into 2B which starts some dirty blockstrings, while 2C is an upward kick used as a juggle extender and sometimes an anti-air (a lot of characters in BB have a crouching button like this anyways, as well.) The second big reason is that he REALLY doesn't need the extra options, as his gimmick involves unlocking moves throughout a round that give him some of the most fucked up moves in the entire game. If you allow Susano'o to start unlocking moves, he can, at any point in a blockstring, use three different lows or overheads and interchange them AT WILL and start taking off chunks of your health. Or, just do neither, command grab you, and put you in the damn corner. His moveset is so stupidly good that tacking on even one more low would actually be overkill. And there are many characters in Skullgirls that simply do not need that extra low, and those that do, like Beowulf, have that extra low because it's something that keeps them viable in the meta.

[@DeitySkullKid]

I mean, he's not saying give them an extra low, he's saying make the design consistent, if it looks like it hits low, let it hit low, if not, design the move to look different

[@wizoop5539]

I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOP I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOP I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOP I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOP I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO I HATE SUSANOO

[@hyliandoctor]

@@wizoop5539 cope

[@KabutoGatack009]

Tfw ragna jesus kick is also an anti air. God we love japanese fighting games

[@heavyc4450]

I don't give a shit. Make those attacks lows.

[@lobster6736]

They just have the balls to hit low

[@AizenDesu]

Oh boy, I need to practice more

[@CobraHD123]

I was too distracted by the two bouncy mountains that i didnt hear any word this man just said

[@locosword3985]

Meanwhile in FighterZ: “Hello, we have characters with shit lows, characters with basically no lows, characters with good lows, and then Labcoat 21 who has 50% low attacks and 49% Overhead attacks and 1% Mid attacks.”

[@torielandcheese1076]

Robofortune's medium kick literally being a downward kick being a mid. robofortune's heavy kick being an underhand swing and an overhead. I will literally never not be mad about this.

[@B.B.B]

robos 5hk is a literal Dust attack its meant to act like that

[@Ghosted1.1]

Not the jiggle physics💀

[@chaotixspark7934]

It counts as a low because beowulf doesnt have a strong neutral game. So he needs to have a mix up game when he finally gets in. Both valentine and parasoul have ways to get in without putting themselves at massive risk.

[@jjheroup1577]

I think it's more for balancing reasons why certain attacks are lows and others aren't, though it's still weird. On the other hand this is one of the many reasons why i love Beowulf and Big Band.:)

[@boonboonsaga99]

Can you repeat that I was distracted 😵‍💫

[@dmolegend1699]

Real

[@Fonz_i]

Same man😅

[@snowgre-fm8gg]

Same...

[@foxygaming6940]

Never heard about standind low? :^) There are several characters with that kind of attack. Also standing overhead, like Pw's charge 2hp or Parasoul b5hk

[@mrpillow8065]

Then why there are same animations for standing lows and mids? Thats what this video is about

[@goodhit59]

​@@mrpillow8065 Balance decisions is why. Those are made in consideration what the character has in their kit and if something like this is needed or not.

[@WeebSlayer27]

This has nothing to do with the point of the video. The point of the video is illustrative, not technical. Like every attack *looks* low but are not, like beowulf's or Band's.

[@mrpillow8065]

@@goodhit59 Visual confusion isn't enjoyable, no matter the balance. Even though the visuals confusing is a bad balancing. You see/expect one thing, but its actually another. Really cool balance decisions to say the least.

[@judecider]

It's very easy for me to get hit by Painwheel's

[@yashclydelldizon2306]

*"We need to focus brother 🗿"*

[@NobodyNoticesMyComments]

Skull girls. Is free (just if u want)

[@mikeythestickman7829]

cring

[@micheallantler5068]

Cringe.

[@NobodyNoticesMyComments]

@@micheallantler5068 I'm here

[@lucashira337]

For Miss Fortune, Fillia and Squiggly it's probably a holdover from how most fighting games don't allow for low punching normals. Your 2P's, 2LP's etc will typically hit between the knees and waist which animation-wise indicate mids.

[@miltaire3235]

If they designed the attack properties by the visuals we'd need to memorize the appropriate block for practically every move instead of going by the general rules for standing LKs, crouching LKs, etc. Would be a hell of a lot more confusing

[@SalvadorDolbyvsZAWARUDO]

Most attacks are already in line with their visual properties. Over heads go over your head, highs aim towards the head, mids are aimed towards the torso, lows aim towards the legs and feet. This layout wouldn't change if you didn't have exceptions, like the ones pointed out in the video, included in a characters move list. The truth is that it's _intended_ to be visually confusing because it's meant to be a mix up and break excessive defense.

[@Yorikoification]

@@SalvadorDolbyvsZAWARUDO So fighting games are intentionally designing bullshit to "break excessive defence"? So if I use my reactions and skill to block an attack that appears to be low but isn't actually then I'm being "excessively defensive" or what? There are other ways to make it harder to defend than to just mix up the rules at random

[@SalvadorDolbyvsZAWARUDO]

@@Yorikoification In that situation it's meant to be a mixup and an advantage against you. Intentional imbalance is a design philosophy of most game studios. They find that people are more invested when things aren't always in their favor. For example, in League Of Legends the game is programmed to try and keep your win rate at 50 percent, max. The reasoning was that if you won too much, you got bored and left and if you lost too much then you get frustrated and quit. This is also built into characters with some being direct counters to others. So they throw in these kinds of things as a way to invest you. The problem is that fighting games sometimes have a much poorer execution of the principal and it often comes off as cheap and excessive.

[@Yorikoification]

@@SalvadorDolbyvsZAWARUDO Right....All those things you listed are just...Completely garbage. Those game devs frickin suck man. I want my skill to be the deciding factor. Not getting a free win because I picked a character that completely counters my opponent

[@hefdef9961]

@@Yorikoification what do you define as skill then? Is game knowledge not part of skill?

[@detuned_SEKAI]

don’t forget r.fortune 5hk which hits overhead for no fucking reason at all

[@ShadowFlame2002]

Ikr? Watch your head I guess lol!

[@kyeblade06]

i always get hit by the 5hp because i forget that its an overhead

[@hmad898]

it hits overhead because its a reference to Ky's dust from guilty gear. Same animation, hits overhead, and you can jump after them. Its also slow and one of her few mix up options. Either pushblock or do a delayed highblock. really easy.

[@V2ULTRAKill]

Its Robo Ky's dust If you get the reference youd immediately assume overhead

[@tree_sage]

How about we talk about the real evil here, robo valentine sword hitting high

[@sneeze4100]

i am pre-conditioned to block it correctly because of the move it's referencing,(Ky/Robo-Ky standing Dust attack)

[@tree_sage]

@@sneeze4100 that makes more sense i did not know that but like still

[@sneeze4100]

@@tree_sage It is pretty funny regardless, without that context, why the hell is this golf swing hitting my dome? lol.

[@peste4592]

because it's a dust from gg

[@CaptainCFalcon]

Robo Valentine? You mean Robo Fortune, right?

[@user-du2yq7ll6n]

like bro shes literally playing with your toes! caught me off guard

[@henrygrey7857]

I love how in skull girls there’s either sexy women or a non-sexy (better alternative) person like the chad of big band.

[@camilorodriguez5602]

What about peacock, double and beowulf

[@henrygrey7857]

@@camilorodriguez5602 I don’t know much about skull girls I don’t play it but sure I think those are good

[@lecroissant5819]

Painwheel, btw

[@claymournesden8705]

Damn this fighting game looks good 👀

[@zephyrprime8]

the eternal fighting game dilemma of "why is this attack not considered low???"

[@matmil5]

No one tell him about guilty gear overheads

[@adrianhenriquerochalima9546]

Do not question the king of the ring. *AROOOOOOOOOO*

[@IceHibiscus]

It's good to see you making Skullgirls content.

[@SyNoon]

it's all about kit functionality, not just visuals!

[@gm0506]

The game devs had a hard time making her with their right hand

[@diegovalentino3953]

Dawg she really just pulled a fucking brick 😂

[@hanavolta9785]

Better than the Leo-Chipp situation in Strive, where Leo's sweep and Chipp's Overhead normal look exactly the same just a different body orientation

[@Gensolink]

meanwhile faust's 2K a low that attacks from above

[@hmad898]

​@@Gensolinkfirst hit of faust 2k is actually a mid, then changes to a low once he gets to your toes. but yea that move is designed to be visually confusing

[@killercore007]

You should see Birdie's overhead from SF5, the thing hits low then high despite the animation suggesting the reverse

[@impureEnigma]

And also Robo Fortune Tail-Katana attack is explicitly stated to be also like this

[@Ohiosans]

We must stay focused Everyone else:bro what are you talking about man ... I erm-

[@birdonline2751]

Leo Whitefang has a low sweep that starts with him jumping iirc lol . Thats fighting games

[@MJY5drives]

“She’s literally playing with your toes” 🤣 had me rolling

[@halodragonmaster]

"She's literally playing with your toes." My goodness.

[@fearmination6996]

**Insert FNAF 2 Ambience**

[@Draven.G]

​@@fearmination6996 why FNAF?

[@alu-card843]

@@Draven.G why not?

[@TY-PO]

🤨📸

[@ThePatapoun]

Wait till he hears about robo fortune standing heavy punch that is an overhead while the animation is her swinging her tail like a golf bat.

[@pachicore]

*heavy kick

[@ThePatapoun]

@@pachicore true

[@rivy-lurk-869]

The boys just have the audacity to stub em toes xD

[@lustochka5717]

I like the way he talks. It is so cute.

[@Duckasaurus_]

smash

[@ShadowFlame2002]

Why.

[@Haevek]

​@@ShadowFlame2002 so hot

[@sinfull_king]

...y-you are talking about the game right?.... r-right??

[@yes78]

@@sinfull_king he is talking about the guy above you

[@howarewedoingtoday5635]

No no their right, smash 😌

[@TaoScribble]

This is literally why I will never be good at fighting games. The directions are *LIIIIES.*

[@TON_or_something]

Is nobody going to talk about how robo-fortunes sword attack is considered a high and goes through it swipes up instead of down

[@V2ULTRAKill]

If you know why you know

[@Inky_Kun]

I believe I can explain why a leg attack is mid, since I see it in other fighting games like BlazBlue. A leg kick, unless downwards, is always a mid attack. The way Valentine’s leg sticks out before the attack, it would only count as mid. Same with Parasoul and Double, it just sticks out, doesn’t slide down and attack. Beowulf on the other hand, due to the power he puts in it, it’ll count as a low. Maybe also because, it hits the opponent where a low weak point is, it may work that way too. (Do note this may be true, may not. I have never played Skullgirls.)

[@V2ULTRAKill]

Pretty much every move that hasn't had a properties change for balance follows the guilty gear/blazblue book of animation

[@VTRcomics]

Despite this being common practice in a lot of fighting games, the one move that ACTUALLY makes no sense is Robo-Fortune's standing heavy kick. Taking off her tail for a lightsaber golf swing, it counts as an overhead despite it coming from below... And standing overheads normally have clear indicators of them being an overhead like Beowulf's mic drop by holding medium punch, or Hulk's hammerfist in MvC.

[@V2ULTRAKill]

It makes sense if you get the reference

[@SMG6-]

Average day in every fighting game

[@elguaro3]

Cerebella's j.HP being a mid despite attacking you in the air is also a fucking sin.

[@BigalaggG]

🎉DLC privilege🎉

[@ChillJeleton]

"GOD IS TESTING ME! AM LOOKING RESPECTFULLY!"

[@rocksaltinyt]

WULF SWEEP, STANDING LOW SUPREMACY LMAO

[@alguieninconforme]

Skullgirls logic

[@Archdornan9001]

Well it's a mediocre fighter with fanservice being it's biggest draw...oh wait...they censored that? A decade old game and they censored it just now? And also the digital artbook?! Yeah this game is complete trash now.

[@theanticomment]

Characters are minors btw

[@newbyblox2013]

Lord have mercy.. We must stay focused brothers we must stay focused

[@RickRodGaming]

lol wait till you see Azrael from Blazblue Central Fiction. Homie has 2 normals that look almost the same, but one is a low, and the other one an overhead... I can never block that crap xD

[@natecgames4612]

Man I just play smash bros I got concerned when you said that they're is more that one way to block

[@KrappyMusic]

Valentine has no business having jigglies that impactful

[@longbeing]

Now this is gonna bug me every time I notice it in a fighting game

[@six_buck_dlc]

this is the first time ive seen skullgirls in shorts

[@Karutlazing]

"Nuh uh" 💀

[@atrainthedonofphila]

Sadly para and val's standing light used to hit low when the game was in early years up until beo's release

[@hausguests]

ggst Faust 2K is the funniest example of this

[@Skorpion68]

Wait until you see byakuya's 3C charged and uncharged same animation but uncharged is low and the other is overhead

[@EnderouSama]

See this is what we call a knowledge check

[@hanklee7609]

Can we just acknowledge the fact beowolf creases your jays as a low?

[@Gravity616]

So always block low unless it’s an overhead got it lmao

[@vincentprigge]

Wait until he meets Justice and sees her universal "overhead"

[@joeyyoung2983]

They knew what they were doin 💀

[@TsuZakiYa]

Saruky always manages to give me life

[@1ntoTheAbyss]

MK is like this too. Highs that look like mids and mods that look like lows. Wish they would start making the hits actually look like it.

[@AwschumTheGOD]

We must must focus my brothers

[@agaed7676]

Depending on the intended use of the move it might have a low property or not, for example a low that is relatively fast but committal is likely to have a low property but crouching jabs, move designed to be fast a low hitting often won’t hit low simply because it’s not necessary for the move to work as intended. It’s less to do with the actual animation and more to do with the other properties of the move like, what it can cancel into, what button level is it set to(light, medium or heavy), how fast it comes out, how much recovery it has, how long of a total duration does it have, and its range. These things are considered when giving moves low hitting properties. Sometimes a character already has multiple moves that hit low so the don’t feel the need to give certain moves low hitting properties. Sometimes a character has too fee moves that hit low so more moves are given low properties. This helps most of the cast have a baseline set of tools

[@RealBoulder]

Hey lady cinderblock! **Throws the cinderblock on her face XD**

[@PurpleGuy_VR123]

Her giant boom boxes are scaring me💀

[@mrmud9007]

Shit had me paying attention👁👁

[@itslextry]

Oh so thats where she comes from

[@mohammadalchab6666]

The men hit legs harder lmao😂😂

[@Jacket0120]

It's called "the grappler privilege"

[@tophu3170]

Big band isn’t a grappler

[@LuxIunaeLumen]

Exceptions will usually be made for balancing purposes, this happens in every fighting game

[@thepicausno5561]

This always bothered me in fighting game. Characters can leave the floor and launch both their feet at your torso and it's a low, but they can slide their weapon across the floor and it's a high. Makes it really hard to get into some fighting games.

[@Ridgan.]

I am a normal and sane Valentine player and can be trusted with a standing low

[@rafaelcastor2089]

It's a balance thing. I'm not too knowledgeable on Skullgirls in particular, but in other fighting games they usually do it to "nerf" the mixup potential of a character, otherwise they might be a tad too strong

[@technofan3778]

me *focussing* for the 1st third of the vid:

[@dharakcolossus981]

In Guilty Gear strive, Chipp, Sin and Leo all have a move that's a flying dropkick and they all look similar. Except Chipp's is an overhead, Sin's is a mid, and Leo's is a low...

[@Ayanami00]

I'm just looking at the physics and the jiggly jiggly

[@XxXpotatogamingXxX]

idc how bad the hit boxes are i’m playing for the jiggle animations

[@modestlatios5553]

Proving once again that you should only play as the men in skullgirls

[@AngeloBassComposer]

Seeing these animations for the first time is like being blessed by a goddess. Bro how does this even exist on the IPHONE APP STORE?? It’s too good. I don’t play the game, so I can’t comment on gameplay, but the art and animation, chefs kiss.

[@dcard228]

"fighting games are easy" Fighting Games:

[@IPODsify]

Beowulf and big band both came after this mid standardization, for them standing lows are specifically intended to be a part of their toolkit

[@kornonthekob713]

“nah” “Nuh-uh” “crab!”

[@tencoth]

Dear god do not make me think of a world where Parasoul has two standing lows or Fortune's crouch jab is a low.

[@Son_akshay]

We need to stay focused boys

[@collegestuff2511]

Quickly learned to always block low unless i see an overhead 😂

[@FlamesFireFly]

Peacock forgot use the brick to block on her foot or toe

[@navarotan]

"What was the building color Timmy.." "WHAT WAS THE BUILDING COLOR, ARE YOU WATCHING THOSE JIGGLY BO-"