This One Had Me Stumped

In this video I visit a customer I had just seen a few days ago. This time we have a low voltage fuse blown. #hvac #hvacguy #hvactechnician #hvaclife #acrepair #hvacinstall #airconditioner #hvactech #airconditioner #hvactech #heatpump #furnace ‪@ruud‬ ‪@FieldpieceProducts‬ ‪@VetoProPacToolBags‬ ‪@KleinToolsVideo‬ ‪@SealedUnitPartsCo‬ ‪@hilmorTools‬ ‪@KNIPEXofficial‬
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[@HVACGUY]

In the end I believe the new sequencers pull more amps on startup and we’re causing the fuse to blow.

[@jamesfitzsimmons381]

What I was saying maybe your popper was a 5amp instead of 3amp was the reason it wasn’t tripping

[@andyvitz]

So what does your popping switch regularly have maybe just put a fuse in that's the same as that

[@HVACGUY]

@@andyvitz it’s a 3 amp popper

[@georgesummerlin1602]

Anything on the High volt side will never blow a fuse.

[@georgesummerlin1602]

Meaning a low voltage fuse

[@johnscherer8054]

You inspired me, worked 40 years for a company, retired and still wanted to work part time. Watched your videos and peaked my interest. After some online courses I passed my type 1, 2 &3 EPA certification. I just started working with a small HVAC company. Thanks

[@RexFella]

40 years at 1 company?

[@RadioReprised]

In 30 years of low voltage I have crawled in crap you would NOT believe, and once I saw ''Rat action'' on my wiring I would tie a new one on and use the old as a pull and replace it end to end. I ain't crawling it twice!

[@ronchambers9762]

Thank You Curtis. You are a great ambassador for this awesome trade. You are smart, gentle and caring. We all benefit from your demeanor and attitude.

[@alfredkauth3128]

All true

[@qyouwilber5734]

Yes, a time delay type fuse should be used if the in rush current is the problem. We used SLO-BLO fuses on our milling machines to cure those problems.

[@gerdberg4188]

Yes i agree , easy solve .

[@johnnym.rodriguezr3562]

I’ve been an electrician for 45 years and intermittent problems are the biggest pain in the butt…

[@redneckways1617]

When there is a low voltage short but not blowing the little breaker I will first check amp draw on low voltage at the transformer then work my way around the system to find the source of the problem…contactor most of the time is the problem

[@kens.3729]

“Persistent” is your Middle Name. You’re a Bloodhound in the HVAC Industry. Your Customers are Very Lucky when they find and Call you for Service. 👍

[@catwrangler1613]

U can always give it the smoke test. Fuse it up and see what smokes as a last resort.

[@hillside7077]

What is the smoke test?

[@catwrangler1613]

@Hillside 707 install a much larger fuse, put power to the circuit and see what burns up or gets very hot. Then replace and do again.

[@hillside7077]

@@catwrangler1613 interesting. Thank you

[@jthonn]

Heat pump, shmeatpump, pumping in the summer, pumping in the winter, until it pumps it's little guts out. That's what Vern said. Just cut the socket off, wire nut, no more fuse. lol, My luck it would burn the house down. They do make a slow-blow fuse, not so sure that would work. You got it working, that's what matters. Nice job Curtis

[@search_eternal]

Shouldn't you always have some 5amp fuses? 3 and 5 are the most common ones for air handlers and furnaces.

[@Rabid-RazorBack]

Should be a 5 amp fuse on that unit, 3 is way too low

[@rodgraff1782]

You can’t exceed the VA capacity of the transformer.

[@Rabid-RazorBack]

@@rodgraff1782 40 VA transformers are the norm for most air handlers, fuse distribution is decided by low voltage consumption at start up and running consumption. If there is an exceptionally longer run of low voltage wiring the transformer VA will need to be enlarged 75VA to accept the load

[@bamatractor]

I thought of adding a amp gauge to the circuit of my popper. Just a thought!

[@victorblackwood3727]

you can use your amp clamp

[@jeffsomers28]

You have the patients of a saint. I would've left hammer marks on entire unit after crawling out from under house. Merry Christmas!

[@Sctronic209]

Always wounded how units get so beaten up. Lol

[@kens.3729]

Merry Christmas, Curtis, to you and your Family. Wishing you a Safe, Healthy and Happy New Year. GOD Bless your Family. 👍🙏

[@groovy1937]

What does the schematic show for the amps of the fuse? Maybe the wrong size fuse was installed at some point or wrong type (one that doesn't blow immediately). Any time a fuse blows, really got to figure out what is causing that draw/ what is different - make me pause since you don't want increase fuse sizes and risk wire burn up. I see that the operating amps were below 2 amp, but still something is off. Since you did change the sequencer - has to be a starting point for diagnosis. Would be good to get the schematic/operation sheet for the newer sequencer and confirm the amp draw at startup - to maker sure that is normal or a problem with the sequencer or talk with manufacturer and pin point what exactly is going on electrically.

[@uxwbill]

It's always a good sign when the cover inside the breaker box falls out! Most all of those little circuit breakers are thermally activated rather than magnetically, and thus are more forgiving in an overload situation than a fuse. Even though the control voltage was still in spec, it looks like that system might benefit from a larger transformer.

[@joehead1294]

Damn, is that a 240 volt splice laying on the ground @32:12?

[@MrKen59]

They use to make slow acting fuses that handle inrush current better. If you remember, they were the glass tube style of fuse. Something to consider if you can find them in this format. Watching you in the crawl space made my knees hurt. Take care of yourself.

[@throttlebottle5906]

they don't make any in automotive style ATC or other fuses that I know of. too many fools would burn their vehicles down, not that they don't oversize them and try that anyway.

[@MrKen59]

@@throttlebottle5906 look up a company called littlelfuse (there is an extra l in the middle) as they make slow blow fuses. They are designed to absorb short hits without blowing. Think about breakers in your house, they don’t blow at exactly 15 amps (except for gfci with ground fault). Something to consider.

[@jeremyg8568]

@@MrKen59 Late to this upload but there's big difference in ac and dc. You can easily survive a bite from most hvac ac capacitors, dc caps on old school computers could knock you dead.

[@MrKen59]

@@jeremyg8568 exactly - DC shock is similar to using an AED to stop a fibrillating heart. AC is not fun either. Lol - getting shocked is not my idea of fun.

[@robertwojtowicz933]

I hate when people think they know it all…. i’ve been doing this for 30+ years and I have a lot to learn. I enjoy watching your videos, including the bad, the good and the ugly. Good job and thanks for being honest.

[@tonyrhoton6613]

4 sure

[@JMHVAC502]

We had an actual ambient temp of -12 on December 23rd and the wind chill was -38. That was fun running many heat pump calls even after explaining to the customer that the heat do absolutely nothing when it's that cold. We had 30 mph winds in southern Indiana and all 5 of my heat pumps were going into defrost every 2 or 3 minutes. I had to start a fire and run several space heaters..

[@ronniebuchanan6575]

Every sequencer I have replaced was always powering the strip heaters evven when unit was turned off at stat. Mind you these were older in mobile homes. Its a thousand wonders the plave never burned down.

[@Kangenpower7]

I had a similar problem, but the rat damage was more evident, because they chewed through the wires going from the indoor furnace to the outdoor A/C unit, and was easy to find. Normally when I have a fuse problem, I put a amp meter onto the low voltage wire at the fuse, and that helps me figure it out. If it shows 1.8 amps when the heat strip energized, then I could quickly figure it out. 5 ohms at 24 VAC would be several watts, so does not seem right. 24/5= 5 amps going through that 5 ohm load. It seems like you have a bad batch of sequencers?

[@kens.3729]

When you’re a one-man show, it’s You that has to Figure Out where the Issue is and what Parts it’s going to take to Fix. 👍🙏

[@jthonn]

Yep and he is good at it, one of the best.

[@jackiewest5352]

Good trouble shooting, most guys would just be like gonna need a new unit.

[@carllungwitz5171]

What is the VA rating of the transformer?

[@HVACGUY]

40

[@Hvacnc]

Coworker told me a few days ago he had one just like this. He ended up leaving his popper. Fuse would pop every time. He said it’s been years since then, with no problem

[@michaelaylor5376]

Try amping the control wires, w by itself y, g, o,etc. Move wires around while watching the amp draw. I usually cut out the frays, the short can be deep in the bundle

[@nicolasmuniz9452]

Hoping all are having a happy Festivus, broke out the aluminum pole, performed feats of strength and aired out all grievances

[@robalexander7348]

Nice work Curtis, lets hope the heat keeps on running now 🤞 BTW, the temp at my house now is 33 C = 92.5 F @ 12.00 i'm keeping my house cool @ 24c with my Daikin A/C and you need to get home to keep warm, it's a crazy world at the moment. Take care 🍺

[@Rabid-RazorBack]

Pressure switch wiring shorting out on refrigerant line, maybe?

[@greyguy9767]

4.63 seems to many amps for a 5 amp fuse. Would probably overheat the fuse in time.

[@Kangenpower7]

The problem is the transformer is probably 50 watts, or rated at only 2 amps. I might install a 75 watt transformer, with a built in 3 amp fuse, however the A/C ran fine for several years with a 2.5 amp fuse, so why is it tripping only after installing the replacement electric heat strip sequencer. I think he got a bad batch of sequencers.

[@scottmaz4063]

Past 2 days up here on long island 8 degrees with the windchill-15. Today balmy 28 degrees 18 night.

[@mypindiwala]

Great video as always. This one is one of top five. I was scratching my head throughout .Glad that I am learning thing or two from every one of your videos. This one realy realy helped to understand what low voltage troubleshooting is. So what is final verdict ? Bad sequencer or unit rated for 5 amps or 10 amps fuse circuit?

[@HVACGUY]

I believe the sequencer I replaced the other day pulled too many amps on startup, and was blowing the fuse.

[@j.j.6050]

@@HVACGUY That would be a good thing to do in the outtro: summarize what was wrong and what fixed it. (suggestion)

[@chrisgray3147]

You go above and beyond most HVAC Tech.'s. Just curious, before you taped the T-Stat wire. How did you determine that the common wasn't touching red wire ? inside the sleeve.

[@search_eternal]

Good job. What was that siren sound I kept hearing when you where first going in the crawlspace?

[@HVACGUY]

My watch. My gloves were pressing the help button

[@StringDriver]

I thought it was the “Open air splice ahead” warning! ⚠️ ⚡️

[@eddymumford4086]

maybe it's the flux compassator

[@jamessanchez4411]

Those low voltage shorts are a real brain twisters some times

[@jamesmichael3998]

Great job don't you just love going under the house where all the critters are, never know what you'll bump into, most folks never get to experience it. Merry Christmas and Cheers from Jacksonville Florida 🌞

[@markcarpenter3600]

I was screaming amp clamp the 24 volt circuit from the beginning, you can see which wire is pulling what.

[@markcarpenter3600]

If you have an intermittent low voltage short, separate out each circuit at the transformer with spade connectors. Measure and install ATO/ATC fuse rated at 125% - 150% of current including inrush, and move on to another job. A day, week, month or year later you know where to start looking. Thanks for what you do.

[@StringDriver]

@@markcarpenter3600so are you suggesting that doing that would set up a known “have to return” situation? I’m honestly not following you.

[@markcarpenter3600]

@user-us5eh3xl1z a good Amp clamp will read below an Amp. it's a good tool when there is a problem on low voltage wiring. My Fluke 87 Maxx will read a peak current in less than 100 mS, I've found shorts to ground like that as well. The arc would open the gap and clear the short, randomly a few moments later it would come back. if the problem is intermittent, it may not happen for weeks. I can't fix what isn't there. ATO/ATC fuses on each low voltage circuit will tell you what circuit is causing the problem when it happens. Yes, in that case, if it doesn't happen in a reasonable time, you may be back. I've had alarm circuit that was randomly taking the RTU down for a moment, and then it would take 3 minutes to re-start, it would happen over and over anywhere from a few minutes to hours later.

[@franciscotejeda1461]

Excellent video and a good job

[@MrMultitool]

I guess You could add a time delay for the sequencer coils so their not activated at the same time. I really can't believe they pull that much current. Learn something everyday,

[@mmichaeldonavon]

Never saw such tenacity - you must be commended for hanging in there and doing what needed to be done. Like the other commenters said: Your customers should be so glad they have you to rely on. My hat is definitely off to you. Thank you sir.

[@kens.3729]

I do the Bare Bones minimum when I have issues like replace a Capacitor. I’ve seen but have never replaced a Sequencer. I respect the Power that Runs these. 👍🙏

[@horacegardner3516]

Hats off to your persistence. I once chased a low voltage short for 8 hours. Owner/operator retiring this year. Would enjoy working with you for a couple days. Enjoy your videos!

[@stephennichols4815]

Any high limits or fusable links on heat strips or blower motor housing

[@johncspine2787]

I guess hindsight will give you foresight next time..whenever I had to fix a variable in my physicality/mental approach of playing a brass instrument, (musculature, mouthpiece placement, breathing, mental approach the list is endless) if I started having an issue, I’d first think about the obvious situation in the present, (space too cold, tired, not eating right, muscle overuse..) but then if I had changed absolutely anything at all in any of my other variables. I’d have to analyze if what I changed had a domino effect of changing something else. Just thinking about how you take a breath before entering can change your posture, then your muscles, then everything starts to feel different. Same thing, only different, as my music theory teacher used to say. Next time if you have changed something, I’ll bet you take a different look at it! Merry Christmas, Happy New Year!

[@OcRefrig]

Good video ! 99 out of 100 times for me is Allways a Rodent eating the wires to the unit. Or by the unit wires frayed for some reason.

[@paralegalty]

I just stumbled back onto one of your videos, after not watching any hvac type vids for a long time. I had forgotten about you and how much I enjoyed yours. I think you're a great resource for the inexperienced tech wanting to learn a lot, as well as for older guys like myself who can still always learn something. Thanks for the content and I hope you keep them coming.

[@sparkytech8787]

You should wear a must brother, all that pink bat fibres floating around, I've been in the industry sense 1987 3 years ago ended up with the dredged C..... health should come first so you can enjoy your retirement

[@Bryr2112]

ya i did a couple calls yesterday till around 1. Man it was very cold. I got to work the overnight tonight into tomorrow morning.

[@gregrangel4709]

Wow. LoL. I just had this happen on a diagnostic for a Lennox 80% furnace. 3 amp fuse was blown but when I had my short tool finder the system would start up like normal until the gas valve energized. I took amps on the gas valve and it was pulling 3.8 amps. On further inspection of the circuit board it stated that the Mac amp fuse was a 5. 🤦🏻‍♂️. Moral of the story always check what amp fuse the control board takes😂

[@MemoriesRR]

You are a blessing to your clients and your community. Merry Christmas and may you have a prosperous New Year.

[@HVACGUY]

Same to you!

[@TopzWorld]

I would’ve just a 5 amp after putting aftermarket part. I’ve through this before and as soon as I put a 5 amp fuse. It stop

[@jamesfitzsimmons381]

U the man Curtis working in cold doesn’t help things either. In case you didn’t know it those lil poppers can be bought in 3amp and 5 amp.

[@vinnieromano1336]

Why not invest in a good headlamp system instead of carrying around a light? I rather have both hands free and have light where I ‘m. Looking.

[@jameswood9764]

Need to plug off the nock out hole that is open on the right hand side below the seal tight conduit stop mouse takeover?? Need to raise the thermostat wiring up off the ground??

[@andreeriner811]

Brother I ALWAYS try to carry 5 amp fuses. IDE rather use them

[@wilsonallen2782]

That low crawling under the house with 100' of excess wire is no fun. Good video, what I could understand.

[@j.j.6050]

High voltage splices laying on the ground are treacherous, too.

[@charleswashington7576]

You said the refrigerant was low, that would cause the the heat stripes to engage and the sequencer coil resistance being to low could be the cause of popping fuses.

[@Eddy63]

Boy , that one was a stumper ... Good vid Curt ... Thx ...

[@tonyrhoton6613]

When u did the deep excell of breath I no the feeling 1 thing I hate about these issues is some customers think cause u there forever u don't no wat u doing

[@DavidRodriguez-qb6dd]

I'm same way if I can't figure it out don't drive me crazy I won't be able to sleep at night

[@JohnH1370]

We're those Amazon fuses you bought that were defective??

[@HVACGUY]

Yes, the ones that were defective were from Amazon, but these were not those.

[@stephennichols4815]

Is that thermostat wire running down the corner of unit and when you put the panel on the screw is going into the low voltage wire😊

[@randywoodward3312]

December 25th Christmas day in Cincinnati we were at _12 degrees to start the day

[@garylujan777]

Low voltage issues can happen under the mobile home and that is because mice and animals get to it

[@jaycrypto-ns7vs]

trailers suck could be unit sometimes stuff under the home chew on the wire lol

[@MadBmbr06]

What app are you using to get the sub cool and heat along with the pressure reading?

[@iamnoone.]

I feel for you those shorts can be a bear 🐻 🐻‍❄

[@karellodewijks4971]

👌👌👍👍

[@gerdberg4188]

You need to be explaining what is going on and what you are waiting to see .

[@rgirod4164]

What kind of air quality safety tester are you using? I thought i heard it chirping while you were crawling under the residence. Great job, low voltage shorts are sometimes the hardest to figure out in our field. Robert

[@HVACGUY]

that was my watch. my gloves and position of my hand pushing buttons on my watch

[@gerdberg4188]

You have fuse it at the inrush current or you might be back !!

[@billybrown1979]

alright you did a very good job. your happy and they are happy.

[@trickorraz5740]

You are the real 24/7 working person!

[@tedhicks5431]

Almost like the fuse needed to be a slow blow like for motors

[@gordonpotts753]

What ya think bout a 5amp time delay fuse.

[@yz250a]

Merry Christmas Curtis!

[@robertlyman9789]

Heat strips for 2nd stage heat or just defrost?

[@gerdberg4188]

I detest crawl spaces under trailers OMG

[@oc9668]

What brand of contactor do you recommend?

[@gerdberg4188]

I hope you charged good for this one !!!!

[@BobBourt]

What’s the amp draw on the transformer

[@MariosACandRefrigeration]

THE FIRST SEQUENSER you replaced was the problem low resistance high amps.poor quality.thanks for sharing.

[@googacct]

How does the unit know when to turn on the heat strips? If it is based on temperature, maybe you could have used some kind of freeze spray to chill the sensor and trick the heat strips to turn on?

[@HVACGUY]

Thermostat calls for them when the set temp is 2+ degrees higher than room temp, and defrost board brings them on when it goes through defrost.

[@HVAC559]

Ice doesn't build on the coil instantly. so when it senses that the coil is below freezing it will start a timer and go into defrost after the set time. When he jumps the terminals on the board it simply causes the timer to go faster.

[@larryehrlich57]

I slept in a snow cave just outside of Nome Alaska. The outside temperature was -40°f and the snowcave temperature was +30° f. The worst part was having to unerate at -40°...especially for my girlfriend!!! Survival class.

[@orionwarren4244]

Sounds pee-culiar to me!🤣

[@j.j.6050]

Urine expert now

[@dustinbartlow4318]

where are you located? love the content!

[@tonyrhoton6613]

Short pro better than little popper imo.

[@scottmaz4063]

Merry Christmas Curtis

[@gailtaylor1636]

I'm little surprised the housing industry hasn't established a code/system of sorts for running cables/wires under houses. Always run like a rats nest on the ground. Just asking for trouble if anyone has to crawl over that stuff. Be nice if they ran short runs of plastic conduit marked low-voltage/phone/cable/electrical/etc. String the cable and route it thru the conduit. Maybe 8 foot sections of 1.5 inch with 1 foot gaps for access. Leave a 3 foot loop at ends for the next guy. Get it overhead so not being climbed on/over. Now guys, tell me why it couldn't/shouldn't be done?

[@devonpeeples2188]

Not looking to bust your balls, I love the videos. I’ve noticed you seem to fight low voltage issues though. Just from experience, I always keep power off or don’t replace the fuse until I find the issue when it comes to electrical. I also don’t move wires or move them as little as possible. Ohm everything out and work to isolate the issue, typically under 3 ohms will pop a fuse, under 5 can cause a transformer to get hot and drop out. I just work it out to keep isolating the issue until I have it narrowed down. Doesn’t take narrowed down. I’d say there’s very rarely a situation you won’t find the issue that way. Not trying to be that guy but don’t want to keep secrets either.

[@craigbraswell4269]

Brother, I hope you wear a respirator around these crawlspaces and attics when you're not filming! I've acquired several allergies by not wearing one for years. I ALWAYS wear one now, no matter how hot it gets here in w ga.

[@rodgraff1782]

Did you measure the amp draw on the transformer secondary once you bypassed the fuse? You could burn up the transformer. Rats chewed up the insulation on the thermostat wire, I’ll bet. If you put an amp meter on the secondary you could see what is going on as different things get energized. Ohm out all of your t stat wires to each other and to ground. What VA rating is your low voltage transformer? It would have to handle over 100VA or it will burn up. Volts X Amps = VA so your 4.6 amps times your 24 volts= 110 VA. I’ll bet you are over fused for the transformer. It may even take out the thermostat, depending on what it is rated then you have to think about overheating the T stat wire. I don’t know of any residential equipment that has a 110 VA low voltage transformer. Something else is going on there. Hope this helps if you’re still having issues with the unit.

[@vandalsr1959]

Merry Christmas and happy New Year’s

[@HVACGUY]

Same to you!

[@timmcclannahan8309]

Rerun over stuff

[@reprovin4514]

40 amps running.

[@MrMultitool]

I think I may have not been thinking but I was referring to 1 of the sequencers with the time delay. Otherwise it wouldn't be any help with the inrush current. The 5 amp fuse may do the trick anyway.

[@reprovin4514]

Mini welder.

[@mr.fixdaplate]

legend

[@glenbeaver2784]

I had almost the same situation. Replaced t stat wire,two days later fuse blown again. Every thing in outdoor unit and electric heater low voltage wiring looked great. After another three days,same #!@%$&*^. Finally figured out the defrost sensor was full of water and would short to ground erratically.

[@jeremyg8568]

Had the same issue once. Found a loose wire, tightened, called back next day. Came back found another loose wire, tightened it, called back in 2 days. Finally i just replaced the contactor as I was out of ideas, haven't had the call back since.