This Tekken 7 Combo Only Works on 3 Stages (and why)

[@4xiszer031]

Mechanics breakdown and under the hood stuff is so nice to watch, would be so cool to have a series around tekken about various things! And this is so well done, congrats.

[@Koenji]

That's the goal, Tekken has a lot mechanics that I'd like to dig deeper on, so hopefully I can provide more of these videos!

[@4xiszer031]

As a complete layman on 3D and video games in general, stuff like this is sorcery to me. But funnily enough, I feel like fighting games are essentially just taking the very basic concepts of video games like frame data and hitbox collision to the extreme, that's why cool stuff like this just feels like a fascinating extension of that for many imo. Keep up the great work.

[@zechariahcaraballo8765]

Wow

[@masku3205]

The game is done for lok try getting views t8

[@masku3205]

And upliud not only a year but twice a year

[@lancergt1000]

Really makes you realize how small the margin of error is on Tekken's combos, even a 1 frame difference can change everything

[@redjux04]

Kazuya df 2, pewgf

[@Needformadness2]

Most Tekken have at least 1 frame perfect combo

[@dat1faclesdude]

unfortunately my man post these cool videos once every 3 months

[@Koenji]

I'll do my best to upload more frequently!

[@IAMOP]

imo these types of videos are very time consuming to make You also get discouraged in the long run because low effort videos generally do better For example, a random intro and outro compilation that took an hour to make might do 10x numbers Overtime you would end up thinking, why did I waste 13h on this video

[@dat1faclesdude]

​​​@@IAMOPare you telling me that it took him 2 years to make a video about law's i12 launcher in tk8?sorry 3 years

[@Koenji]

​@@IAMOP Striking a balance is obviously important, and I'm interested in making videos faster... But in general, I wanna do things a bit different. It will take a bit longer to get videos done but I'm confident that what I make will be enjoyable!

[@KnTElixar]

@@dat1faclesdude he actually manually renders each individual frame by hand and staples them together in the KZbin editor, its a very slow process 🧢

[@KeithJamesChua]

This is one of the most well put together and straightforward Tekken videos I've seen. Incredible job

[@ParaSMG]

Wow man this was an outstanding video. The presentation, the topic, the info and the way you explained it is so top tier. Cant wait to what you'll cook up for tekken 8

[@Alexman208GR]

Woah. What a fantastically well made video.

[@elijahstar513]

OMG, your content is easily the most easiest on the eye! This is what the Tekken community needs more of, it’s so technical yet digestible. Wish you’d upload more. More subs to you.

[@Nemouik]

Considerably more interesting than I thought. Well done, keep it up.

[@Cat_in_The-Box]

I hope this video will get hyped by algorithm, your content is fire

[@JustAdam3D]

Games really are held together with spit, duct tape and prayers aren’t they How you even thought to check something like this is wild to me, what a cool video!

[@astjuly8239]

Thank you for this incredible video. I am already subscribed only in 2min of the video. Yoy are mixing my favorite stuff: fighting games and game dev, is like paradise

[@FahmiZFX]

This is the kind of videos that are worth subbing to. Can't wait for you Tekken 8 stuff already.

[@Head_Pie]

Great deep dive into this bug that I’ve heard next-to-nothing about. Only other bug I can think of in T7 is Jack-7 being able to combo after Rage Art after a max range wall splat. It’s so broken that the damage scaling percentage gets stuck when you continue the combo

[@cosminache96]

What an amazing investigation you've done!! Big props for this video 🎉🎉

[@yiggs]

Quality content as usual! Thanks for the vid!

[@dimasever_twitch]

the quality is godlike, I would imagine that from a channel with hundreds of thousands, even a million subscribers, and here you are, just starting your journey with 1.91k (+1 from me) making videos is 100% what you should be doing, good luck with that Koenji!

[@JakubDi]

One of those videos that makes people's jaw drop. As someone involved in QA and playing fighting games for years, I cannot recommend this video enough.

[@jigglejogglers2606]

Video deserves much more views ngl. Great detail and explanation

[@coolkarl182]

Even at the very end of Tekken 7, we still discover things we never actually know. Quite poetic.

[@Rampage1Rules]

Found like a true dev , great video bro

[@RealKatTea]

Yo this is sick man, please do more!

[@user-kw6ww1oy9l]

absolutely amazing content. just found your channel and it's on par with kiloutre imo fantastic work

[@Koenji]

He's a very good friend of mine, so its natural that his content as well would be one my inspirations.

[@KnTElixar]

Fire vid again man, where's my call to action to like, subscribe and comment on what other bugs I wanna see covered next though smh smh

[@RobSomeone]

Just found your channel and your videos are fantastic! Love the editing. Excited for Tekken 8 content to come!

[@ТимурБ-й7б]

First time viewer here and I'm really impressed! Subscribed

[@Koenji]

Welcome aboard!

[@meekaillim]

Insane vid, good stuff

[@dogallcaps395]

WOW ! I never knew about this combo thanks :)

[@Scootworth]

Amazing breakdown, super neat stuff on such a specific piece of Tekken 7/Jin

[@hassancr13]

Super cool!

[@krivas404]

Great job! Thank you for content, man, keep doing what u do!

[@Scias]

I'd found this out and the only absolutely wild theory I came up with is the earth's gravity is slightly weaker at higher altitudes, pulling the opponent down just a micron less leaving them just high enough for the kick to connect lol, made sense to me given how it doesn't work on the bottom floors of these stages as well. I did lab the combo and found the combo is pretty much never optimal, surprisingly as they seem like decent damage moves

[@ultraboy99x]

Your work is too clean my man.

[@FGirao]

Damn great video

[@ubaidtariq7728]

Can't wait for Tekken 8 and all the bugs that await 😂

[@KikoBG12]

Nice video, didnt know that as a Jin main! Earned a sub 🔥

[@miou722]

Great Video, some really cool game design concepts! Do you mind sharing how you get the unreal project? It looks really fun to explore how the game works behind the scene.

[@Kjernekar]

I remember discovering that Leo could get a different combo off of CH b1,4 in Tekken 6 if she played on Fallen Colony, and only on the upper floor.

[@matitone]

Can you upload a video of that? I'm very curious about it

[@Koenji]

Same i'm curious about this as well

[@Kjernekar]

Don't have a video of it, but I posted it in a Leo thread on Tekken Zaibatsu way back. The short answer is you could use either u/f+1 or d/f+1 after the counterhit to get a full juggle. Don't remember which.@@Koenji

[@GizouGitai]

One theory I'd have is a float rounding error, but the I don't think the positional value ever gets high enough for that, does it? EDIT: Have you tried setting the Floor to be an inordinately larger number?

[@Morritt_AJ]

Amazing video, and you sound extremely handsome

[@inzanity490]

Great quality video man. I hope this video reaches to the devs. T8 is also still suffering the same issue.

[@Koenji]

Wait is it actually? I thought this has been fixed in T8?

[@inzanity490]

@@Koenji I swear I remember seeing a video of someone showcasing the bug in T8 where it works in Ortiz Farm but not the others, but I can't find the video anymore unfortunately

[@inzanity490]

@@Koenji I found the video. It's in the Tekken subreddit, name of post is "Stage specific combos in T8"

[@razorrzr]

very clean edit

[@ldAstrid]

cool video

[@JazzBoiiFGC]

Underrated

[@polarchibi]

nice

[@e33w33]

I did the thousandth like 🤙

[@seanlmaooo]

I am entirely foreign to tekken, smasher D:, but this is was super enjoyable big props

[@Koenji]

Should hop onto Tekken 8 next week!

[@anibalmattiwos7613]

Great video.

[@Shahars71]

Wait, but why was the floor height related to that bug if it's only affected by the opponent's falling speed? Shouldn't they fall at the exact same speed no matter how high they are? This is basically like saying that from a particular threshold gravity just gets stronger. ...maybe this has something to do with the stage transitions in these levels? All three have a transition where both characters drop really quickly from a big height, so maybe that has something to do with this?

[@Koenji]

They do fall at the same speed. But the height of the floor is used somewhere during the calculations of checking if the opponent has reached the ground or not, this calculation inaccuracy is what leads to the frame difference you see in this video. It's a floating point error but the error itself is deterministic

[@Shahars71]

@@Koenji Thanks for the clarification! If it's floating point error, it makes total sense that the threshold is a weird number like 755.

[@ZettaSlow]

Koenji my boy! We back??

[@Koenji]

You'll be seeing more of me this year I hope!

[@ferinine]

B3f3 was a standard combo on every map until this last year

[@adeebh1238]

That’s pretty cool and all I just wish I watched it 3 years ago

[@Koenji]

Don't worry, we'll be posting Tekken 8 stuff when that drops.

[@Reayashin]

1:10 true horror

[@Sammysapphira]

Its probably a rounding issue causing a 1px discrepancy.

[@Koenji]

Check updated description :)

[@IAMOP]

There is no way they could have found this in QA testing lol

[@Koenji]

Yeah, or seeing how the bug has been around for years, maybe it did get brought up during QA but there hasn't been a rush to fix it.

[@leandroa.foloni3559]

Lídia also had a specific combo where her df2 would only work on those stages, I can't remember the combo though.

[@dovs96]

That's cool, but the exact mechanism is still a mistery... But yeah, since we don't have an access to the game code it's pretty hard to solve:)

[@mariocruz591]

If this is a bug it should be fixed right? There must be a way to make the height for each stage the same for consistency or the developer does not bother to fix the bug at all?

[@ultralowspekken]

They probably either never knew or never cared. The bug is rather inconsistent, the combos are often not optimal and the flow of the game isn't changed. It's one of those fighting game niche trivia matchup things where you would exclusively land it for flexing your silly skills, and as such fixing the bug would be a waste of time.

[@LaughingTombstone]

imagine practicing that combo for hours only to go into ranked and have it not work for 26 stages

[@Leadblast]

Tekken 7 is one of the most bug-ridden entries in the entire franchise.

[@ultralowspekken]

Except not?... You sound like somebody who didn't play 4 of the previous 6 mainline games.

[@NERDSAUCE]

This absolutely reeks of floating a point precision bug.

[@mjanmarino]

This bug existed way back in Tekken 6! I'm a Lili main and she had one combo that only worked on the top floor of Fallen Colony and I suspect it's for the same or a similar reason.

[@edgelord121]

This bug is also in tekken 8. Some combos don't/do work in ortiz farm for the exact same reason

[@Koenji]

Do you have the Lili combo that shows this off? I'd like to add this in a follow up video!

[@psycheSNAKE]

Does that combo not work on bigger characters though?

[@Koenji]

If your opponent is a big body yes, I kind of forgot to mention this as a side thing but I wanted to only really focus on the things necessary for explaining the bug.

[@jerpelguy8142]

So basically, since the fighters are far away enough from the earth (775cm or higher), gravity affects them less causing the person getting comboed to fall back down slower Tekken is complicated lol

[@PatrykG59]

damn there is 29 stages in Tekken, everytime i play it feels like there's only 5

[@ultralowspekken]

It still is a mistery. You figured out when. Not why. I'm still believing it's a floating point error thing, where some number should be rounded but, when accounting for a floor height higher than intended, it rounds in the wrong direction. Edit: it's in description. I still called it first with 0 research

[@Koenji]

Check the description of this video! Me and another individual did some additional testing for that and this is the likelihood of the issue.

[@ultralowspekken]

​@@Koenji lmao I literally did not read that. I called it immediately when it was discovered. Cool.

[@KTP200]

Floating point precision? Rounding?

[@Koenji]

I initially thought this but because the result is deterministic and it will always trigger past 775cm, Im leaning onto it being more of a calculation issue.

[@KTP200]

@@Koenji I hope someone can find the nitty gritty details behind why the math is working out this way. Might lead to another fun discovery along the way. I don't have tekken 7 installed tho so bleh

[@ParkourGrip]

This is how floating point errors work. The further away from the origin of the world you are the bigger floating point numbers are used to calculate stuff. The higher the floating point numbers in calculations, the higher floating point errors. When i first saw this bug i tought that it was due to the combo route having a hit that is on the edge of being detected (coliding) so the small floating point error can influence the result. But it seems like you figured out that there is a difference in the time it takes to do the fall animation. But the same type of floating point error could happen in the code that does the fall animation since maybe the starting point of falling could be just barely higher or lover to add one or remove one frame to falling. Its hard to know for sure.

[@ParkourGrip]

And yea floating point errors are determenistic like that. The higher the numbers the bigger the errors. Same numbers in a floating point operation always produce the same result with same error.

[@ParkourGrip]

If you want to experiment. Make a custom stage with the floor really high or really low like 100 billion. I wonder if and how many combos brake there. Actually i wonder if the falling animation takes same ammount of frames on that height too.

[@micshaz]

Damn that's p spooky man

[@dyvyby]

Tekken 8 also has the same bug

[@Logomancy]

Yes, Kazuya -- it's all your fault

[@Dyleniz]

In before I go on a mission to find one with lee lmao

[@Koenji]

If you can find one before T8 launches i'd be impressed!

[@TK_TheFURY]

This is not exclusive to Jin, multiple characters have combo routes that only work on elevated stages, I made a video on it showing examples with jin and bryan 2 years ago kzbin.info/www/bejne/bpScf4Nrm6ynmassi=2hj4JJaH_Mz1CuV- Edited: Never mind, you showed it at the end and its not only b3f for jin

[@Cat_in_The-Box]

Oh hi, big fan!

[@TK_TheFURY]

​@@Cat_in_The-Boxmuch appreciated

[@squibbtastic7589]

Hey man, I loved this video and I’m wondering if you got a email I can hit you up on? I am working on a project and I’d like some advice since I’m working on a class project and just now getting into UE5, id appreciate it

[@ElKenshitou]

Someone show this video to Max and see if he reacts

[@21kHzBANK21kHZ]

So once again Jin did nothing wrong, it was all Kazuya 😂

[@AnonymityIx]

I have Anna combos that only work here

[@anon3631]

He needs it.

[@kristovicaccipoloska6028]

Excellent scripting

[@TK_TheFURY]

I wanna give a big L to discord that made fun of me 3 years ago for saying there is difference in fall speed and kazuya combo was bugged even on infinite azure, its too bad I couldn't record it again despite trying for weeks to prove I wasn't lying, still the people on discord called me out as a fraud just because they couldn't do it with macros. I don't normal say bad stuff and I haven't said anything untill now but people on discord that blame me just for presenting a different idea are simply dumb losers.

[@kajetanmiliankovic3183]

???