This Totem "Mite" Be One Heck Of A Mess... (also, who sent this in?)

[@NosEL34]

That's my speaker. It just so happens that my name is Smudge

[@richh650]

I would have held out for a better speaker to claim LOL

[@darrenschmitz2712]

Well be thankful "Partially Smudged" brother "Completely" didn't send the speaker in.

[@chriskeogh3113]

I owned a pair of Mites for a few years. I used them with a Roksan Caspian integrated amp. I enjoyed their sound. They were offered a warm but still detailed presentation to my ear. I thought they reproduced acoustic music really well. I'm sure the measurements of this pair "as found" may or may not reflect what I enjoyed about my pair. It would be interesting to see (and hear) what improvements could be realized.

[@Elberoth]

Both drive units are made by Tonsil from Poland. Tweeter model is GDWK 11/100 and midwoofer is GDN 13/40/2.

[@BruceLimozaine-c4q]

Thanks Danny! Great video as always 👍

[@haycrossaudio5474]

Hey Danny. I've been sent a pair of TOTEM ARRO for evaluation. Haven't measured them yet but the crossovers are just like yours. Good components used on the tweeter circuit on these. Laminated iron core inductor on the woofer circuit with poly caps.

[@dannyrichie9743]

You are welcome to send one to me and I'll have a look at it.

[@haycrossaudio5474]

@dannyrichie9743 I'm in the UK. I'll be doing a video on my channel in a few weeks if you want to take a look 😉 Client not happy with there sound. I'll show all the before and after measurements

[@Fufiloofa]

Used to work in a shop that sold Totem and the Mite was very "meh", never liked them, and yes, most Totems are empty from insulation inside, and use that annoying tiny port that can make honking sounds.

[@jdlech]

LOL, I'm now imagining Richie getting 2000 emails claiming these speakers. And the original owner not being able to distinguish himself as the owner. Used to be, you could look up an address and get a name and telephone number. Nowadays, you got 12 web sites that will do that only if you give them all your personal information to sign up to their monthly subscription and agree to let them sell your information to every spam operator in the greater Asian continental area as they bury your E-mail account with a billion offers to sell you an extended car warrantee.

[@dannyrichie9743]

We can make out most of the address on the label.

[@MicheldeGroot-n8y]

Ah, we need an update on those new speaker you are working on with NRD! You've got me all hyped up about it. 😅

[@dannyrichie9743]

Coming soon.

[@rancosteel]

Stereophile Magazine rated the Mites as a “winner” for under $700 USD.

[@dannyrichie9743]

Looks like a loser to me. This thing has issues.

[@stefpichette7742]

I paid 250 Canadian 🤷‍♂️

[@trutmaasfull]

They should had called it “Totem Termite”.😁 heard totem speakers is quite good 👍

[@bryede]

If those floating steel terminals get pushed too close to the inductor, they'll change its value.

[@FOH3663]

Yep, it's how they're voiced ;)

[@jd2plus2]

Would’ve liked to see the recommendations. To order any simple upgrades . Had a pair of these for years they’re not too pricey and old one of companies earlier av speakers or classical. I do use them in my RV with small tube amp . They’re middle vocal orientated , not very open sounding ,true sound bass but weak , same for higher end .

[@IliyaOsnovikov]

Recently I have tried to measure the difference between gold plated steel nuts on binding posts and brass nuts that have bought for replacement. I was measuring an inductance of of the gold plated brass post body from one end to another with various nuts and without them at 100 kHz with my DER EE DE-5000 LCR meter. And as I recall I was not able to detect any difference in inductance. I am still gonna use the brass nuts though.

[@dannyrichie9743]

You are measuring the wrong for the thing. One is ferrous and can store or hold a residual charge. They other will not.

[@IliyaOsnovikov]

@@dannyrichie9743 What is that residual charge? Are you talking about Magnetic Hysteresis that's common for iron cores of inductive chokes and transformers? Sure, such thing affects operation of iron-core crossover coils. However, insertion of any iron core into a coil does imediately and significantly change it's inductance and it's performance. But in case of my measurement the inductance of that "circuit" with addition of one or even two steel nuts hasn't changed at all. That may mean that those nuts were not in any magnetic interaction with a current passing by via brass post. Otherwise the inductance should change as that happens with any air-core crossover coil when some ferrous material is placed within it's magnetic field.

[@dannyrichie9743]

@@IliyaOsnovikov It doesn't have to add inductance to alter the signal.

[@IliyaOsnovikov]

@@dannyrichie9743 Agree. I am trying to say that NO change in inductance means there is NO magnetic field interaction with that nut. Hence NO residual magnetic charge in the nut to be held. That's kind of indirect evidence. I am thinking of a direct experiment of trying to charge a steel nut like a magnet by passing a high current pulse in a wire that goes through the nut.

[@seanb3303]

Vince didn’t add insulation to the box because he wants the extra radiation through the cone so it sounds bigger

[@dimitriskatramados2055]

He could also take advantage of using paper instead of mdf at the sides of the box...

[@stephenyoud6125]

@@seanb3303 all that’s gonna do is create ringing issues in The spectral decay with the delayed resonances in the box re-exciting the cone with signal that’s already passed. You need cabinet wall bracing and damping and internal damping for the standing waves and air resonances

[@seanb3303]

@ it will make a little speaker sound bigger and that’s the design goal with this little mite 😉

[@ilaion11]

​@@seanb3303it's a bad design!

[@seanb3303]

@@ilaion11 It’s different and some people like what they do. Same with Omega speakers or magnepan…tekton…Zu…where accuracy isn’t the goal

[@charlesnr]

Totem has traditionally used first order, no solder, and specially coated dampening inside in a veneered internal cabinet surface.

[@alexw890]

A real head scratcher all around. Danny what are your thoughts on notching cone breakup by bypassing the 1st inductor with a small cap like 0.22uf?

[@dannyrichie9743]

That won't resolve a break up issue.

[@-loki-7727]

You can look up the tracking # and it should give the sender. Nice Video!

[@hoth2112]

We have their name on the label, but we need contact info

[@globaltune8580]

I’m not sure that this is an original totem speaker. Looks like somebody may have tinkered with the crossover. If so, I think that to them should be given a chance to respond to this. They are a highly reputable speaker manufacturer in my view, so I was quite surprised to see this.

[@dannyrichie9743]

The capacitor was made for Totem and it had their name on it. There was nothing wrong with the parts quality. It had multiple issues in several areas.

[@geminijinxies7258]

Is this the first pair of Totem speakers that's been sent in? Cos I can't recall seeing the brand on this channel before. I own a pair of Totem Dreamcatcher myself and they also measure really funky, but it's still the best speakers I've owned when it comes to musical performance.

[@dannyrichie9743]

We've done a Rainmaker: gr-research.com/product/totem-rainmakers-upgrade-kit-pair/

[@anton_osteo]

Rainmaker previous Totem on this channel

[@IliyaOsnovikov]

Gold plating on steel nuts could be used to improve their electrical conductivity. As I have mentioned in another comment I was recently measuring gold plated brass 5-way binding posts. And to my surprise despite fairly low brass conductivity I've got the resistance of those posts next to zero. Something like 0.000 Ohm. I believe that's mostly due to a gold plating.

[@dannyrichie9743]

No, that is not why they are plated.

[@Fiendhopper]

So ignore the result? How about ahowing us your measurements of the damage you always posit ferrous elements cause, preferably in a frequency response and waterfall plot of stored energy?​@@dannyrichie9743

[@IliyaOsnovikov]

@@dannyrichie9743 Do you know why?

[@dannyrichie9743]

@@IliyaOsnovikov To look pretty.

[@IliyaOsnovikov]

@@dannyrichie9743 Interesting thought. But, who can see those nuts inside, besides of specialists like you? People usually buy speakers without taking them apart.

[@BruceLimozaine-c4q]

That freq response... ouch

[@HansDelbruck53]

Looks like a hell of a speaker to me.

[@Taffy84]

Totem Acoustics uses borosilicate to coat the inside of their speakers and is why there is no insulation.

[@dannyrichie9743]

Yeah, that stuff does nothing to control internal standing waves.

[@1mctous]

They have a heart of glass?

[@Blacklighting]

Danny, I do wish you would listen to a pair of totems in a setup or talk with Totem. It might be pure marketing, but they do things a little differently on purpose. I think they very much design things and just listen. From reviews, they do seem to be a like it or leave it type of speaker. I Love the Totem Hawk but could never pull the trigger.

[@dannyrichie9743]

I don't think listening to them is going to resolve the out of phase issues, the break up and ringing, or comb filtering issues. Designers don't add in major deviations and timing errors on purpose.

[@rikardekvall3433]

So excited to send to Texas, that he forgot whom he is.😳 Danny, problem with the camera? Not so sharp, or has Ron added some filter? 😉

[@sean_heisler]

Very interesting. Totem is known for high transparency and resolution, and that may be happening with first order crossovers with fairly decent quality parts. That will WOW some people. But you can see they are not accurate speakers with flaws.

[@favorit601]

Great shirt! Willkommen in Baden-Württemberg.

[@dannyrichie9743]

Sent to me by a customer.

[@vcp93]

LOL! Hey Danny, maybe someone "regifted" you a set of speakers. Finders keepers! 🤣

[@matthiasmartin1975]

02:48 Danny, that is because a tiny bit of gold on a steel nut is cheaper than a nut made from solid brass. These days gold is put on _anything_, even dessert. Brass on the other hand has almost completely vanished from our everyday lives, because you can fool most people most of the time by coating a steel item with a bit of brass, or gold in when it comes to binding posts. But I guess your question was rhetorical, and i get it, i feel ya.

[@RennieAsh]

It helps to reduce corrosion

[@davidmorgen4558]

Wasent totem made or based on a Paradigm design or am I thinking of the minis?

[@roccobruno8027]

Totem oh Totem.

[@andrecaron6195]

When I went to the Montreal Audiofest show a few years ago, I listened to some Totem speakers. One of them seemed to have an issue. I believed it was the Skylight. While this pair of little speakers were playing, I put my hand on the top of one of them and felt some vibrations. Is that normal? I have Linn Espek speakers at home and there is no vibrations. What can cause that?

[@Herman-f9m]

What can cause vibration in a speaker cabinet? Thin walls. If the cabinet wall is thin enough compared to its span it will be so flexible it will vibrate at certain frequencies, much like a guitar string. It needs to be thicker (twice as thick is eight times as stiff) and more massive (force = mass times acceleration) to reduce the acceleration that causes the resonant vibration. The woofer provides the force. Only more mass or more stiffness can reduce the vibration.

[@ford1546]

Hi. You can take a magnet to see how many steel pins the are on the components inside a normal good CD player or amplifier. You will be surprised how much steel is used. You can hardly buy a single component without finding steel pins on them! especially capacitors and resistors

[@dannyrichie9743]

That is just in all the cheaply made gear.

[@RennieAsh]

They always forget about the biggest lumps of steel such as the speaker motor system. Just imagine all the inductance and hysteresis in those ;-)

[@sloboat55]

Excellent

[@jogmas12]

Totem says their speakers are made like violins 🎻

[@jonathandavis9507]

😂

[@ChicagoRob2]

Broken violins

[@scottmackey4182]

Gold-plated steel violins. 😂

[@imqqmi]

Like a box full of resonances?

[@RennieAsh]

​@@scottmackey4182violins can have steel in them too. And just like the speaker, it's not "made from it" , it just has small parts made from it.

[@stefpichette7742]

Hey I have a pair I like them with my rel t5x

[@stefpichette7742]

I soldered the crossover and isolated them and made metal stand for them

[@davidmills3846]

I've never seen one of you videos where you find a speaker that you don't find something wrong. Is there a speaker out there that you haven't found something wrong with it and if so what was it thank you

[@RennieAsh]

His own speakers of course

[@RennieAsh]

​@@CinnabonMcTastysome of them are quite reasonable, others have shown some.. interesting results.

[@gregkoblentz7872]

Not true. There's been plenty that got two thumbs up for pretty good response and things like build quality, design etc. They've always got penny pinching parts and can be improved in that respect.

[@dannyrichie9743]

I've praised the good ones. Golden Ear, Mofi, ATC, Monoprice and a few others come to mind.

[@davidmills3846]

@dannyrichie9743 ok great I did good I really like my goldenears,and my kef 107.2, and the tyler acoustics,

[@marct9587]

Ouch, after these test results, maybe the owner doesn't want it back!

[@BootJamesOut]

Hello folks: yes those frequency graphs sure look like roadkill that was cook up then serve who knows if this was the first speaker from a new employee that said you can take this job and shove it I’m not working here no more. That had steel nuts. It’s not even April Fools yet. I to don’t know what there was a thinking. Ride Easy

[@davidtomsett]

Actually it’s my speaker and it just so happens that my name is Smear

[@raymondpitre4872]

DORK! You didn't even listen to it

[@dannyrichie9743]

That isn't going to help them any.

[@toby9999]

What kind of creep makes an insulting comment like yours?

[@seanb3303]

Stated goal of first order filter is to avoid phase shifts…but these two drivers don’t like each other 🤷🏻

[@dannyrichie9743]

It creates phase shifts.

[@spentron1]

Drivers don't like a simple inductor and capacitor, it's rarely much like a first order response even electrically, much less acoustically.. Phase shifts are a inherent part of crossover design.

[@hom2fu]

9:00 at least the graph look like art or company logo

[@richardgrant418]

For someone who I thought ran a speaker design and manufacturing company you sure spend a LOT of time critiquing other manufacturers!

[@dannyrichie9743]

We get a pretty good handful of them in every week. I shoot a video on a little more than half of them. More than anything else, people love watching upgrade videos. So we give them what they want.

[@marcsmulders6550]

did you listen to them

[@dannyrichie9743]

Why would I want to torture myself by doing that. I already know they have problems.

[@IanKnight40]

But after all of this, the bottom line is that Vince has voiced them like this.

[@dannyrichie9743]

What we are seeing here is not voicing choices. We are seeing problems and several areas.

[@IanKnight40]

@dannyrichie9743 Fair comment Danny. I think Vince personally voices every model. In my view dispite the obvious problems that you highlighted I do believe that the designeer wanted them that way for the sound voicing of his design. Regarding the lack of acoustic wadding. I believe that tgere is some sort of borosilicate aerospace type coating appied to the internal walls of the cabinet to transfer energy in some way. Cheers Ian.

[@dannyrichie9743]

@@IanKnight40 I can't imagine anyone designing a speaker and thinking, I really don't like the sound of an accurate response, I think it would sound good if the drivers were out of phase in some areas. I can't believe that anyone thought, you know, a little ringing and breakup in a few areas sure would sound good. Whatever they coated the cabinet walls with does nothing, and it is no substitute for adding material to absorb standing waves. The reflections within the box are re-exciting the woofer and causing a delayed smear.

[@rawsonte]

Always bitchin, know a number of diy'ers who found the gr woofers hard to work with. Plus when listened to friends 'upgraded' klipsh's (I think, whichever the popular model was, K5? K600m), heard horrible 1.5kish resonances with led zep where I know main thing was to address the mid dip, felt like his full out upgrade did not resolve everything as touted

[@dannyrichie9743]

I find all of that hard to believe. Our drivers are super easy to work with. Maybe someone didn't know what they were doing. If you are hearing something that you don't like with one of our Klipsch upgrades, it isn't a fault of the upgrade. You must be hearing something else.

[@hoth2112]

Sounds more like there was something wrong with his assembly of the crossover, or something wasn't tightened down properly, hard to know without seeing their work.

[@theforceiswithme8804]

If every speaker in the world produced identical graphs, would they all sound exactly the same? If not, why not?

[@stephenyoud6125]

Interesting Question, I’ve wondered the same. I think not as materials used would have an impact. I’d replied to Danny about how good the Spectral decay was on his upgraded Klipsch speakers and said the drivers settled pretty well with the new crossover. He said yes but Paper cones sound better to him. Rubber surround material and how its stuck to the cone may also affect it. And of course the parts quality in the crossover. With the same crossover design and values, He says they’ll measure the same but sound very different which is part of the reason for his upgrades - not just the better crossover design to fix issues

[@FOH3663]

What the listener experiences is the combination of every characteristic. The on axis freq response, blends with the radiating pattern to produce the in room sound we hear and feel. Listening rooms vary dramatically in boundary support, vessel gain, decay times, early reflected energy, etc. The loudspeaker's non-linear behavior at various output levels also alters the playback experience. The cabinet's acoustic contribution varys with level. There's essentially countless ways similarly measuring loudspeakers can sound different in varying environments.

[@dannyrichie9743]

The measurements show accuracy, and not sound quality. Two speakers can measure the same and yet sound very different.

[@theforceiswithme8804]

@@dannyrichie9743 Well, I'm glad to hear this. I was wondering, given that speaker manufacturers have the test equipment to keep working on the curves, why all companies would not be producing speakers that were so near perfect as to be indistinguishable.

[@dannyrichie9743]

@@theforceiswithme8804 Every little thing in the speaker will change how it sounds. Different brands and different quality levels of parts, wire, connectors, can all make big changes.

[@anthonyjackson7097]

I would say, don't waste good money on overpriced name brand speakers. If you are going to spend $500.00 or more, buy a well engineered kit from GR Reaserach, Madisound, or other reputable kit suppliers. 99% of the time, you will receive something that does not have any of these problems and for less dough.

[@stefpichette7742]

No there nothing in them

[@NosEL34]

@@stefpichette7742 that seems weird. Maybe bad quality control on this particular speaker...someone forgot to fill it

[@jacksound5471]

Totem is supposly using a kind of "damping paint" inside. ... 🦧

[@TomT-bn1lm]

@@jacksound5471 Borosilicate Paint on all inside surfaces for resonance damping, not so much for sound wave absorption.

[@AudioGuyBrian]

That God those Totem junkers can be had for as little as $100. They might make good computer speakers if you have a sub attached as well. Not something you would ever want to listen to music on.

[@TomT-bn1lm]

Weirdly, I feel one buys Totem speakers for the shape of their sound. There is no real company sound, you just go with the one that sounds best to you. Changing the crossover for a flat response is throwing away the 'charm' of each design.

[@dannyrichie9743]

I don't think that one can consider out of phase cancellation, breakup, ringing, and internal cabinet reflections to be what one would call "charm".

[@imqqmi]

@@dannyrichie9743 As much charm as sand on a vinyl record I reckon.

[@TomT-bn1lm]

@@dannyrichie9743 Still. some of them sound pretty good without modification. One would think that you consider all speakers need modification. Though i don't think that is true.

[@dannyrichie9743]

@@TomT-bn1lm In this case this, model needs a lot of work.

[@hoth2112]

@@TomT-bn1lm Most do need help, but some are well designed, just built cheaply.

[@martinenstrom8206]

Forget about the magnetic hardware it doesn’t make any difference. The magnet in the speaker is also steel. But the linearity of the speaker is dependent on the evenness flux in the pole piece gap in combination of the high inductance of the voice coil. The inductance in the binding post is pretty much nothing, and it doesn’t move. Forget about it…

[@dannyrichie9743]

No, actually the ferromagnetic material has a clear audible effect that adds a little smear and eats up detail levels. The steel parts on a woofer are not conducting the signal.

[@martinenstrom8206]

@ So how would that actually work from an electrical point of view? Is it messurable? It should be if the signal changes and it eats up detail. Then we would see distortion and noise at audible levels. Present the measurement to support the claim.

[@lekmannen9990]

I think Danny is talking about the signal carrying parts shouldn’t be ferrous materials. I don’t claim that it make a difference, but I think it’s measurable.

[@martinenstrom8206]

@ Yes you can measure contact resistance and such but that’s not related to distortion of the signal.

[@dannyrichie9743]

@@martinenstrom8206 Sure, pass an electrical signal in or around a piece of steel and you can measure a residual electrical charge on it. It is also very easy to hear the effect.

[@fochtyu2694]

First order XO makes it sounds muddy. That's why I sent the KEF Q350 back.