Being Vietnamese watching this video, I now realize how hard Vietnamese is lol.
@uchoang53323 жыл бұрын
Haha, xem IPA Vietnamese
@NgaTran-dk9sh3 жыл бұрын
Hahaahaha me too, very hard
@lilbean7244 Жыл бұрын
@@NgaTran-dk9sh Same😂
@thivan9988 Жыл бұрын
righhhht Totally Agree. I am first gen AmeriViet and whoa.... Im sitting here trying to relearn Vietnamese so I can properly teach my children. lol
@NCXitlali Жыл бұрын
Jus the pronunciation. The grammar is easy 😂
@paulmarshall77943 жыл бұрын
After studying Vietnamese for 12 months - this video finally makes sense......and is extremely helpful.
@archy4833 жыл бұрын
Oh god his accent sounds so good 😭 even sounds better than mine although I’m vietnamese lol
@Lycanyt28583 жыл бұрын
Chào
@khahue1543 жыл бұрын
@@Lycanyt2858 Hello! I am Vietnamese 🤣
@WAD_Blue3 жыл бұрын
Ghê
@WAD_Blue3 жыл бұрын
Vietnam đây
@trnkwangchiotwntranquangch7853 жыл бұрын
Cô giáo có cho bạn biết: ia nờ = iên hăy IAn = IÊn ? Tương tự, ia ngờ = iêng, hăy IAng = IÊng, Tiếng Việt = TíaNG VịaT. .... kw = cw = qu (w=uơ, uờ là phần cuối của âm u. k + w = c + w = c + uờ = qu) .... Âm /to/ khi khéo dài hoặc nói thật chậm sẽ nghe thấy 2 âm: to, oooo . Âm /hoa/ khi kéo dài hoặc nói thật chậm sẽ nghe thấy 3 âm: hoa, oa, a. (Tiáng Viạt (Tiếng Việt) không có quy tắc ráp vần , thực chất là THÔNG CHUYỂN KHẨU HÌNH ÂM (giữa 2 khẩu hình âm là 1 khẩu hình âm: giữa âm i và âm ê là âm ia (khi khẩu hình đang ở âm i thì phát âm ê sẽ sinh ra âm ia, nên iê=ia, iêN=iaN, hiên=hian. Tưang tự, ươ=ưa, uô=ưa....). Và tiếng Việt không phải tiếng đơn âm mà là NHIỀU LỚP ÂM LIÊN TIẾP: phiên âm đầy đủ của từ hoa là /hoa, oa, a/, đã là /đã, ã, a/...không phải chỉ có 1 âm đâu) Một số khác, nên thêm ký hiệu w vào tiếng Việt sẽ giải quyết đươc nhiêu vấn đề (w = uơ, uờ gần giống /w/ của tiếng Anh nhưng đặt ở cửa miệng (front sound) hay nó chính là phần đuôi của âm u khi kéo dài hay khi nói u bạn đưa cằm lên rồi hạ xuống sẽ nghe thấy âm w (uơ, uờ) rõ hơn): Âm h trong từ ha thì phát là hờ, nhưng trong từ hoa sẽ phát là hw (huơ, huờ): hoa = hwa, wa = oa, wang = oang, uy = wy = wi, hwang=hoang. Uyên=wyên=wian (do yên hăy iên = ian). TưaNG tự với l, ng, b...có thể phát thành lw, ngw, bw trong lua, ngoa, boa thành lwua, ngwa, bwua. Tiếng Việt (Tiáng Viạt) có trên 50 âm mới đầy đủ. Người Việt học tiếng Việt dễ vì hầu hết họ biết nói trước khi biết đọc, viết. Học sinh đến lớp chỉ cần nhớ mặt chữ cái rồi ghép cho đúng âm là xong dù họ không hiểu bản chất tạo âm của tiếng Việt. Nhưng với người ngoài nước và người dân tộc thiểu số thì rất khó học theo theo kiểu ráp vần. (Học như con VẸT)
@user-ll8dj4kp5m3 жыл бұрын
wow you are extremely smart to figure this out. The classical classification in Vietnam was 8 tones like you mentioned. The new classification of 6 tones was introduced by the French during colonism period. Most Vietnamese people nowadays don't know about the classical classification of 8 tones.
@andreaxwa3 жыл бұрын
Me, a Vietnamese: Interesting. I approve.
@hoailinhangthi73463 жыл бұрын
As a Vietnamese and also someone learn a but linguistics, I really enjoy this. Btw I do can realize 2 kinds of 'dấu sắc' and 'dấu nặng' based on Northern accent, but me as a Huế people, I also try pronounce those words with Huế accent and I feel they're different at all tho. Hope to see others opinions too😁 Tbh, I do think Vietnamese people are way too focus on teaching Vietnamese language based on the writing alphabet but not in phonetically way. Seems like Vietnamese people havent had enough linguistic research on our own language so we cant understand our own language properly and teach it for foreigners.
@thichtrongcayvietnam Жыл бұрын
Cái này nghiên cứu ngôn ngữ chuyên sâu sẽ có. Còn thực hành thông thường chỉ 6 là đủ bởi 2 thanh kia sẽ được phát âm 1 cách tự nhiên hoặc biến mất tùy vùng miền.
@Jumpoable Жыл бұрын
Yup, most Vietnamese language instructors are completely unaware of the natural sound changes they do when they speak their mother tongue & expect non-native learners to "just know" or pick up these phonological rules. It's pretty much IMPOSSIBLE for untrained ears & vocal chords.
@GeoSeoKwan Жыл бұрын
no need to be discouraged because the phonetics in English differ a lot more and the pronunciation is in syllables at once so Korean and Vietnamese I'm not surprised at all, Vietnamese linguistics is still better than English I have to guess every time the pronunciation😅
@rubiks64 жыл бұрын
This was very helpful. I'm not sure a native Vietnamese speaker could have done this lesson. It is very good for a native English speaker to do this lesson. He understands what we are doing wrong and why. Great lesson!
@duongha6833 жыл бұрын
I struggle to do this eeee
@rubiks63 жыл бұрын
@@duongha683 - Tell me more.
@duongha6833 жыл бұрын
@@rubiks6 like, I can't do the "." or "nặng" sound, it's too sharp and heavy to pronounce.
@あすかニューン3 жыл бұрын
Well, just like many Americans don't understand their language as much as learners from other countries. Usually if it's your language you don't go and analyze it. You just naturally and subconsciously speak it.
@trnkwangchiotwntranquangch7853 жыл бұрын
uya + n = uyên = uyê + n => uya = uyê = > u+ya = u+yê => ya = yê hăy ia = iê 🤸♂️ ---------------------------- ia ngờ = iê ngờ = iêng, Tiáng = Tiếng; ia tờ = iê tờ = iêt, Viạt = Việt; => Tiếng Việt = Tiáng Viạt 🤸♂️
@andylitchi43642 жыл бұрын
Actually and amazingly, I'd discovered that Vietnamese has 8 tones when I was only 4. I'd told my mom and some of my friends but no one supported me on this view.
@CentralHighland3 жыл бұрын
I'm Vietnamese, and this video make me think more about my own language as a strange language, it's deeper in the core that a lot of points i'd never noticed.
@huuhaa334 жыл бұрын
This is so awesome to have a non-native vietnamese speaker as a teacher in the videos, because he knows all the struggles and things that non-native must be learned! Disclaimer, i consider myself still as a beginner. After your previous video about tones, i started to pay attention to differences in the same tones. I can feel that many tones, if not the all, have their own quirks. Recently I started to notice this distinction of two different dot tones. Now this video explained it much more!
@jo-hs9bx3 жыл бұрын
Ị Í Ì Ĩ =))
@daotruong22753 жыл бұрын
Just my opinion, vietnamese pronunciation is harder than finnish pronunciation, and finnish grammar is harder than vietnamese grammar
@jomana11092 жыл бұрын
@@daotruong2275 That’s no opinion but fact 😂 The hardest sounds in Finnish are: ö, y and distinguishing between ä and a plus double constants, that’s it! You can count them on one hand lol. On the other hand grammar is 15 cases, passive/active voice and the spoken/written language difference. Vietnamese has one tense 😂 but hella weird sounds excluding tones. Beautiful languages either way.
@letranminhkhoa74923 жыл бұрын
Holy hell in the "Động vs Độc" section, I just realized that the complications come from the FACT that it is pronounced in a Northern Vietnamese style, so it sounds so freaking similar. In the Southern manner, they are SO distinct, and you wont have ANY problem distinguishing it.
@Jumpoable Жыл бұрын
So there is chaos in both varieties of Viet to totally trip up & frustrate a learner. LOL.
@lapprentice8 ай бұрын
@@Jumpoable LoL, sorry my man. I was born and raised in SaiGon, South Vietnam. Naturally I speak the Southern Vietnamese accent. When I first listened to people speak Northern Dialect or Middle Dialect, it sounded like a different language to me. On speaking, you just have to pick one dialect and master it. About the listening part, it is just training & exposure. Once your ears are trained and exposed enough, you will understand other dialects. You may not able to speak like the people from different dialect, but you will understand them just fine. 😅
@ml-mw7ms8 ай бұрын
Agree with southern accent. The tones are pronounced more distinct. Northern accent makes those tones sound too similar, almost merged together. This makes it harder for the non native speaker to hear, learn to speak.
@rainbowwatcher3 ай бұрын
Anh này học accent miền Bắc nên đang phân tích dựa trên cách phát âm của miền Bắc. Mỗi vùng miền có cách phát âm khác nhau. Ví dụ: Ở miền Nam, từ "ngả" và "ngã" sẽ có cách phát âm khó phân biệt.
@GaunCochran4 күн бұрын
The southern dialect on the other hand mixes up hỏi and ngã
@PeterViet7 ай бұрын
It's one of the most important videos for anyone trying to learn Vietnamese. Every teacher should start with this video before explaining ANYTHING about pronunciation and tones. It should be at the beginning of every single teaching material. I can't emphasize strongly enough how valuable this video is and it's been already 3 year since I watched this for the first time and everything made sense immediately. Btw... I owe you, John. I really do. Thanks
@haicautrang53044 жыл бұрын
Is this young student the same one who explained how to pronounce dấu hỏi? He's really helpful, thank you. i did much of this without realizing if tvo collaborated w their students to make a textbook youd make a lot of money
@felixeckert98174 жыл бұрын
this makes so much sense, i`ve been learning vietnamese for one year and haven`t noticed this, but when you explained the difference it made so much sense, like I would have pronounced all these words correctly because my teacher would pronounce them like that, but now i am aware that there are some real differences!!
@TalaySeedam3 жыл бұрын
It's just an example of entering tone that exists in southern Chinese languages or Thai and of course Vietnamese too.
@hnp1523 жыл бұрын
Vietnamese is my mother tongue and I have learned Thai and Chinese too, but this video messed me up 555
@cuckeongot91543 жыл бұрын
Tieng Viet (Vietnamese): Khmer+China Nice xừ
@cuckeongot91543 жыл бұрын
Tieng Viet (Vietnamese): Khmer+China Nice xừ
@KienNguyen-vp2gh Жыл бұрын
As a Vietnamese person, if you truly want to achieve the highest level of pronunciation and improve quickly, here is my advice: the following letters: a, â, ă, e, ê, i, o, ô, ơ, u, ư, y. Each of these letters can have 6 tones, which means we have a total of 72 pronunciation styles. Please note that these 72 styles mentioned here are for individual letters. If you combine these individual letters, they will form different pronunciation styles: ươ, uô, uê, iêu, ưa, iu, ao, iếp. Only the word "iếp" is default with a tone mark, that's why I specifically mentioned it. For the other 7 compound words, they will have all 6 tones, resulting in a total of 42 pronunciation styles. When considering reading and recognition alone, we have a total of 115 pronunciation styles. Please note that these are words that are connected to their respective tone marks, and you need to combine these words with at least one more letter to give them meaning and form complete vocabulary.
@quyetlepham3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for this video. Pretty interesting. Also kudos to you for your effort in coming up with this tone system independently. Most contemporary Vietnamese speakers and learners might not know this, but this 8-tone system was thoroughly studied and taught by Vietnamese scholars before the modern Latin-based script became widespread. According to this system, the Vietnamese tones were traditionally consisted of 4 kinds: 平 bình, 上 thướng, 去 khứ, 入 nhập, each one of them split into two classes: 陰 âm and 陽 dương. 平 bình is split into 陰平 - âm bình and 陽平 - dương bình, respectively equivalent to contemporary thanh ngang and thanh huyền, 上 thướng is split into 陰上 - âm thướng and 陽上 - dương thướng, respectively equivalent to contemporary thanh hỏi and thanh ngã, note that accents in the southern dialect typically don’t separate these two classes, the people there learn to write them as two tones nowadays but they sound the same when they speak, 去 khứ is split into 陰去 âm khứ and 陽去 dương khứ, which are respectively equivalent to contemporary thanh sắc and thanh nặng in sounds that end with ‘soft consonants’ like n, m, ng, nh (per the video’s explanation), 入 nhập is split into 陰入 - âm nhập and 陽入 - dương nhập, equivalent to contemporary thanh sắc and thanh nặng in sounds that end with consonants like t, p, c, ch (per the video’s explanation). I read this from a 19th-century booklet that presented one Vietnamese script based on the language’s phonology. This script has never been adopted widely. This system is also discussed in a book about Vietnamese and chữ Nôm, see Khái luận văn tự học chữ Nôm, by Nguyễn Quang Hồng, NXB Giáo dục, 2008, p. 483. It’s also referenced on the Wikipedia page about the Vietnamese language (page in Vietnamese). Personally I’m strongly of the opinion that chữ Hán-Nôm (Hán and Nôm scripts) need to be made mandatory in the teaching of Vietnamese language, alongside chữ quốc ngữ (Latin-based script). Vietnamese learners will be a lot more confused in more areas and will find the language painfully difficult the further they learn it knowing of only chữ quốc ngữ as our writing script.
@viethoangpham7320 Жыл бұрын
As a Vietnamese, I never knew that "dấu nặng" and "dấu sắc" have two different tones until I watched this video. I just pronounce it in the way that is familiar for me. Thanks for the interesting video, I understand how difficult it is for non-native speakers to learn Vietnamese 😢
@Tiengvietoi Жыл бұрын
Cảm ơn Hoàng vì đã theo dõi và nhận xét nhé. :)
@JoniloNguyen4 жыл бұрын
Native Vietnamese speaker here. Very useful information I would say. Thank you for the explanation 😊
@danmitropolsky97404 жыл бұрын
This is no theory, it's simply true. Linguistically the reason for this is that in closed syllables (those ending in hard consonants), it is generally difficult to distinguish multiple tones. Hence, only the simplest contrast exists in such syllables: that between high and low pitch. Confusingly, the sắc and nặng symbols got reused for these tones. This phenomenon (closed syllables having few tones, often just 2) is cross-linguistic; an identical phenomenon exists in Cantonese. You did miss one important point about dấu nặng, which is that in open syllables, it results in them being cut off with a *glottal stop*. There is some assimilation like that you talk about (eg chọn ends with a hold in the /n,t/ position) but the primary cut off is always a glottal stop, regardless of how the open syllable ends. Btw- none of this final cut-off of nặng business applies to the southern accent, where nặng in open syllables in something like a lower dấu hỏi
@JH-ty2cs4 жыл бұрын
It's still blowing my mind that you watch these, tiền bối Dan. Thanks for your input - as you know well, I'm very far from a linguist, most of the content here came from my own amateur grappling with the phonetics of the language. I found that picturing a word like 'bạn' as a mid-tone 'bat' with a creaky, glottalised end to be a useful heuristic for correct pronunciation - although sometimes northerners do pronounce it more like baʔn for emphasis. Whether or not the primary cut off is the glottal-stop or the denasalised consonant is a question for people far more educated in this area than myself.
@Tiengvietoi2 жыл бұрын
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@glenshearer62193 жыл бұрын
Fascinating (and impressive)! Similar somewhat to connected speech in English where the presence of one word influences the pronunciation of another.
@rafaelkorinsimoes64494 жыл бұрын
I always noticed that but I'm studying all by myself and thought that it was just because I'm not a native or because of how people talk in daily life. tysm for this video
@françaisminutes Жыл бұрын
Brilliant explanation of a problem that no one has been able to explain to me after 15 years in Vietnam. Very helpful video.
@Tiengvietoi Жыл бұрын
Thank you for your comment! :)
@BearJoyner002 жыл бұрын
This video was very helpful. It helped me decide to give up on learning Vietnamese and switch to an easier language for the time being.
@Tiengvietoi2 жыл бұрын
don't give up just yet, Vietnamese is not easy, but it's not that difficult, watch this video of us to find out why kzbin.info/www/bejne/moPNnZegqJmoa68&pp=ugMICgJ2aRABGAE%3D
@lehonganh287 Жыл бұрын
Vietnamese native speaker here and I can’t help laughing at your comment. Keep pushing on. You’ll get there one day. Maybe learn some Chinese will help you expand your vocabulary faster.
@dice48663 жыл бұрын
I was like: Wait... There are different kind of sắc and nặng? P/s: I'm Vietnamese btw, don't mind the name (I'm just a big disgusting weeb shit myself )
@AsrielDreemurr3 жыл бұрын
I've been studying it for a some weeks and I'm probably much more confused than you, my friend
@duongha6833 жыл бұрын
Me too lol
@cinoss56 ай бұрын
In Vietnamese we have a wordplay called “nói lái” or “vần đảo” for rapping where we mix and match consonant and vowel of syllables to create new fun sounding word. For example: còn thơ becomes cờ thon. It does get tricky for hard vowel is in the equation. Your table perfectly explains how “thìn đẹp” would become “thèm địt” when we try to do the wordplay. Thanks for the eloquent explanation.
@xjapanforever2 жыл бұрын
For Chinese speakers, the hard syllables are called 入聲 in the Chinese tonal system. In the Chinese tonal system, there are 平上去入 4 categories. The 4 categories were split into "yin 陰" syllables and "yang 陽" syllables. Hence, there are 8 tones.
@Jumpoable Жыл бұрын
Let's not describe them using a model from a foreign langauge that is centuries old (& hence OUTDATED). These are VIETNAMESE WORDS and VIETNAMESE TONES with VIETNAMESE SOUND CHANGES. Did the examples given in this video sound like Chinese tones to you? Putonghua, Cantonese, Hokkien or Shanghainese? Nope. NONE of the above. If you speak Hakka, then PERHAPS the glottal stop one might just vaguely be mapped onto the Vietnamese tonal system. Yes it's fun when comparing historical linguistics but using an archaic Chinese tonal system to learn Vietnamese helps NOBODY.
@xjapanforever Жыл бұрын
@@Jumpoable I am sorry but you might have missed the point. First of all, this comment is for Chinese speakers. Second of all, according to Wikipedia, 四聲- 現今各種漢語標記聲調仍然沿用平、上、去、入四類聲調。
@wednesdayangeline Жыл бұрын
@@Jumpoable lol the Chinese tonal system isn't archaic at all what are you on...
@ThaiIsland3 жыл бұрын
Wow first time ever hearing this topic. Great job, John!
@Bsophie1023 жыл бұрын
This is the best vietnamese lesson ive ever seen!
@phuonganh.nguyenn3 жыл бұрын
Omg, i’m vietnamese and when I watch this video, I feel Vietnamese is difficult to learn. So I hope to find a friend who speak native English. Let’s learn together ^^
@Saohesc2 жыл бұрын
O.k. I just started. Almost 2 weeks tieng viet.
@rumitrapp69954 жыл бұрын
Thank you so much for your excellent explanations of the tones in actual usage. It came at the right time for me, since I have been studying Vietnamese on my own. Your work is great!!
@tfancymurad17293 жыл бұрын
Bạn có muốn giao tiếp với người Việt chúng mình k
@yomolandia3 ай бұрын
Thank you so much for the video. It has helped me a lot.
@noahclark44473 жыл бұрын
This actually reminds me and makes me think of the tones of Cantonese, many people argue between the 6 tones vs 9 tones because the tones for the checked syllables, ending in a p, t, k, sounds, all sound different than the tones of the non-checked syllables. Really interesting!
@Jumpoable Жыл бұрын
Actually for Cantonese it's not really a thing. There are 6 tones in HK Cantonese, 7 spoken in Guangzhou. The -p -t -k finals are just that, consonant finals, but they map within the 6 Cantonese tones. Vietnamese, however, as explained in this video, CHANGES their tones as well as consonant pronunciation with certain endings. So yeah, it's an 8 tone system. Together with a complex CONSONANT FINAL pronunciation shifts. But yes, in natural or very theatrical speech, Cantonese could double those 6 tones & may go up to 12 tones, but nobody's teaching 12 tones to non-native Cantonese learners. SIX TONES is quite enough, NOT 9 because they simply are not needed.
@DavidNgoVietnamese6 ай бұрын
@@Jumpoable I'm struggling to understand how many "tone/pitch contours" Vietnamese actually has with all considered. Like you said, In Cantonese you'd have 6 or 7, with the clipped finals distributed among the level tones contours. In Cantonese, you'd have low & high rising tones. With this you'd have still have 8 distinct tone "contours" in Vietnamese?
@caohathaonguyen7313Ай бұрын
Wow through this video i learn do much more about my own language!
@Tiaimo4 жыл бұрын
Ah Ok. This is why sometimes it use ไม้ตรี (rising tone) or ไม้จัตวา (falling tone) in our language to represent the different tone for Dấu sắc. The ending consonant has a different indication. I have to change it accordingly to match the exact sound for Dấu sẵc but sometimes get lost. Talke about Dấu Nặng, I also used to ask my VN friend who is a teacher and perfect in Thai in all areas, speak like a native + perfect writing. Why "học" pronounce like it has พ/บ/ป (IPA - p̚) instead of letter ค/ก (IPA - k̚) in Thai when nặng comes to play? She explained to me but I didn't get it at that time. So I use it directly instead of understand it. This is why it's intermittent lost during the learning if new words come up for me. "ng" sound also gets me confuse since we have the letter ง to represent this sound (IPA - ŋ) where the position doesn't matter either initial or final consonant. But in Vietnamese languages, it seems change to m or ม in Thai (IPA - m) when it's final consonant e.g. "không". I have to close my mouth suddenly after pronouncing ŋ to match the final m like Vietnamese speaker. To my ears, it's weird in the first place since it's not exactly ŋ sounds that consonant ng represent. Now I just go with the flow by using "ŋm" as it said in IPA for ng final consonant. Back to the word "học", I've learned that It pronounces like โอะ sound in our language without any tone marker for "ọ" which is quite identical and then change final consonant from C to P / ก to พ/บ/ป to represent final sound p̚. But your summary chart is far more clear to me like an advance alarm before pronouncing VN words. The hard part of Vietnamese pronunciation for Thai people who speak only the standard one is ngã sound. But It's not the case for Sounternner Thai since we got far more tone than the central one. Need some time to familiarize then tweak a little bit. Anyway, it takes time to make it perfect like a native speaker. Otherwise, we'll speak like a robot and weird to their ears. :) Thank you very much for your summary and the effort you've put into this clip. Really fun and enjoyable to see videos like this. It's the same idea when I try to speak English where someone said ... "How can you communicate with them if you don't talk like them". ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Side note: Talk about example glottal stop word "BAT". Now I know why Thai people always confuse to pronounce when they talk to English native speakers. Since the way we write to represent the English language makes our own people confuse. The way we write "Batman" is "แบทแมน" : Literally spells : แ + บ + ท + แ + ม + น Symbol "แ" can represent to vowel "แอ" (IPA - ɛ: ) or "แอะ" (IPA - ɛ ) in term of writing. To represent the correct IPA sound one by one it will be: IPA: (แ = ɛ)ː + b + t + (แ = ɛ:) + m + n In our writing, we drop the symbol "ะ" for vowels "แ-ะ" (IPA - ɛ ). And in English language itself also doesn't have any indication to specify. So this could lead our people to understand that it has แอ sound (IPA - ɛ:) instead of แอะ (IPA - ɛ).
@guitarislife013 жыл бұрын
I knew this for dấu sắc, but never noticed it in dấu nặng. Rất hay.
@yeschefwithchadkubanoff3 жыл бұрын
So helpful, thank you
@learningvietnamesewithhano37002 жыл бұрын
Hello all you guys. Thank you for sharing something interesting.
@kentclark19693 жыл бұрын
I actually want to make a point here, since we both integrate the "pitch" notion to Vietnamese pronunciation. "Nhấn mạnh" actually still has the first word's pitch higher than the second one (well I do some vocal training so I could say my ears are tuned more or less). But yes, it's true that we can break down the tones system in Vietnamese into pitches. From how I speak and how I hear native people speak in a normal manner, they usually go in this ascending scale: huyền - nặng - ngang - hỏi - ngã - sắc (ofc, considering only the ending sound, since "ngã" and "hỏi" are uttered with a bit of riff)
@kenynotkenny3 жыл бұрын
As a vietnamese, I thing there is a way to make sure you speak the works "động" and "độc" correctly: Try to continuously say the "động" like "độnggggggggg". If you can do that, you did it right And with the "độc" you can't do that all
@HeyKevinYT2 жыл бұрын
cảm ơn ônggggggggggggggggggg
@Jumpoable Жыл бұрын
But it's all dope.
@tdanielsesq4 жыл бұрын
This was a super video. Thank you TVO.
@devintheguru6 сағат бұрын
Thank you for making this video. I've started analyzing Vietnamese phonetics before I start learning the language, and I was wondering why they were pronouncing words differently with the same tone marks. I played them back multiple times and was scratching my head 😂 like why are they spelled with the same tone mark?! I've studied Mandarin, Cantonese, and Thai, and Cantonese has a similar thing between soft and hard endings like sî and sîk. Thai has 5x2 tones depending on long vs short vowels. In Thai the ending also changes the tone based on the spelling, making the orthographic system rather complicated; that's on top of multiple spelling redundancies like in English! 😆 รถ รด รส, are all "rót" homophones, but spelled differently: R-Th, R-D, and R-S, like rain, rein, and reign, but even crazier cause they're all pronounced as different consonants at the beginning of a word, but as and ending they're all "T" sound, and then there isn't even a vowel in there! 🤣 Took me over 40 hours of study for Thai akson to sink in, vs Korean hangul which took about 20 minutes and Hindi devanagari which took ~40 minutes to get, but to be fair, I learned devanagari after Thai akson, so it felt like easy street! Viet orthography looks like it's gonna be a bit tricky to learn, but after this video, things make a lot more sense. With that said, I definitely agree that there are 8 tones. There are people who say Cantonese has 9 tones, but the distinction is kinda nonexistent for 7 and 8 (sī 1 and sīk "7", si 3 and sik "8"). So I would argue that there are only 7, since sî actually has a different tone pattern from sîk, which would be the 6th and "9th" tone, but it's really more like 7th tone. It's actually kinda funny, cause the Cantonese 6 and 7 is similar in an inverse way of the two sac tones, since Canto 6th goes from mid slightly down, and 7th is flat slightly low, starting and ending at the low end of 6th tone. Language learning can be such an adventure 😂 esp when you go beyond the Indo-European family. Korean phonology was mind blowing after learning Japanese, how they're similar yet Korean has 8 vowels rather than 5 like in Japanese, and Korean aspirates the S, and have no F, yet they pronounce the R and Sh the same way as Japanese Namaste 🙏🧋🌺🌈
@zitloeng87134 жыл бұрын
actually you can divide hard sắc into two tones when considering short and long vowels, e.g. nít niết or something
@csteven79353 жыл бұрын
I have been learning Vietnamese for 2 months now and you helped me save much time and effort with your lesson. I noticed there was something wrong with the tones since I speak mandarin chinese and I'm already used to tones. I had put it aside for a while but it was bothering me lol. Finally got it figured out. Thanks mate ! Your Vietnamese just sounds awesome to me btw :)
@trinhhoang86833 жыл бұрын
I'm Vietnamese person. I can teach you Vietnamese language if you teach me English. Are you agree?
@matthiasbolroc3969 Жыл бұрын
YOU EXPLAIN SO WELL ABOUT PHONOLOGY OMG !!
@Tiengvietoi Жыл бұрын
Cảm ơn anh! He's so good right? :) If you like what we do and wish to receive more exclusive learning materials, become one of our Patrons at www.patreon.com/tiengvietoi nhé 🤩
@TheGrunnewaod2 жыл бұрын
Thank you a lot for this video! Extremely helpful!
@b3arwithm33 жыл бұрын
Interesting how you dfferentiate the 2 additional tones. Your prononciation is so crisp and clear. Much better than many native speakers 👌
@William_Fei3 ай бұрын
Thank you very much for your lesson🙏🙏
@paulmarshall77944 жыл бұрын
Exceptional video - thanks for the explanation. And I really wanted Ms Huyen to sing a song ......
@sazji4 жыл бұрын
This is really interesting. What do you think of the idea that the hard/soft syllable variants of these tones could be considered allophones? I like your approach, thank you for this! I’m learning Southern dialect (because living in the US, that’s what I’m surrounded by!) so some of the tonal issues are different. I wish someone would analyze southern tones from your angles as well. I have often noticed that Vietnamese teachers will demonstrate a tone and then say it differently in a word, and found it confusing. So rather than try and pronounce them like I’ve been taught I “should” say them, I’m going to be listening more to what they’re actually saying, with these issues in mind. This sort of teaching issue seems so common with native speakers hearing allophones as “the same” or hearing according to an official analysis without ever stopping to consider the inconsistencies between theory and practice.
@JH-ty2cs4 жыл бұрын
Hey, thanks for commenting! It's true that the hard nặng and soft nặng are in complementary distribution, so they could be considered allophones of each other. But remember that hard nặng is *also* in complementary distribution with all the other 6 tones too. So why not consider all the hard nặng words hard huyền instead? Writing 'bạt' as 'bàt' would make just as much sense, considering both hard nặng and huyền are low, smooth sounds. It could be that it's worth treating the extra 'hard' tones as seperate tonemes, in the same way we consider the english 'h' and 'ng' as seperate phonemes despite also being in complementary distribution. Ultimately, I'm not a linguist, and I'm not the right person to draw the distinction between an allophone and a phoneme. But I do think that, allophone or not, it's worth understanding the distinction as a vietnamese learner.
@seenonyt22106 ай бұрын
@@JH-ty2cs Not a linguist? Well this right here sounds like a very linguistically grounded and sound description and statement of the analytical options! But I salute your humility. Thanks a lot for this very useful and insightful video!
@hieutranminh75592 жыл бұрын
That's Hanoi voice. In southern, we pronounce dấu nặng and dấu sắc just 1 way. We do not say giảo viên, we say exactly dáo viên, just like tôi muổn we say tôi muốn.
@tamtran0072 жыл бұрын
As a fluent speaker of both Vietnamese & English I find your analysis very accurate. Never realized it till now. I’ll use this new found knowledge to teach my son.
@emrebennett28572 жыл бұрын
As a fluent reader of English. I find your comment very accurate
@uongnguyenquachhai77303 жыл бұрын
Your pronunciation is really good!
@daotruong22753 жыл бұрын
Amazing work. Keep it up 👍
@tGoldenPhoenix3 жыл бұрын
As a Vietnamese studying English , watching a foreign guy teaching Vietnamese is kinda fun. Thank you.
@TKN_NTBY3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the knowledge, helpfull even for native Viets!
@Creees2 жыл бұрын
Super educational video. I found it really helpful
@광동아재廣東大叔 Жыл бұрын
Almost 70-80% of the words the teacher gave as an example in this vid are of Chinese origin, which means they can all be written with Chinese characters. I'm not sure if this teacher has learned Chinese before or is aware of the fact that not only the lexicon of Vietnamese, Korean and Japanese have this in common, but the phonetic system too. As these are the most historically heavily Chinese influenced languages, it is very easy for a speaker of one or at least two of them to just guess the meaning of the words when you know how to read Vietnamese. I'm a native Korean speaker, living in China for more than 20 years, understand Japanese and Chinese enough to access academical stuff. My wife is from Guangzhou, so I also learned how to speak Cantonese(9 tones), some Teochew(8 tones) and Hokkien(8 tones) which are widely used in Guangdong, Hokkien, Taiwan and Singapore and even in Maleysian and Indonesian Chinese expat communities. If you understand the phonetic system and the tonal system of those Southern Chinese dialects, learning Vietnamese is just a piece of cake. When it comes to vocab, the more easier. Take this as an example : the official name of Vietnam goes like the following. Cộng hòa Xã hội Chủ nghĩa Việt Nam 共 和 社 会 主 义 越 南 (Chinese) 공 화 사 회 주 의 월 남 (Korean) きょう わ しゃ かい しゅ ぎ えつ なん (Japanese) It's just like as a French speaker would have no big problem when trying to learn Spanish or Italian. As for me, I was already able to speak and express basic daily needs in just about half a month after watching several KZbin videos teaching Vietnamese in Chinese or Cantonese. The tonal system of Thai, Laotian and Burmese work the similar way with the same principles. In fact, what this teacher explains is actually TRUE, seen from the phonetic system of Asian tonal languages. Northern Vietnamese has 8 tones, whereas Southern Vietnames has 7 because the 'dấu ngã' and 'dấu hỏi' are merged together. Those so-called " hard endings" the teacher is explaining are actually called 'entering sounds' or 'clipping sounds' . These sounds are all pronounced with a glottal stop. The difference lies in the actual position of the tongue. To exactly distinguish between these sounds is a huge difficulty to overcome for those who speak only European languages. These phonetic phenomena actually happen in most languages, with the difference whether they are allophones or not. In English these are allophones.
@richardjones5967 Жыл бұрын
Brilliant video and explanation!
@Tiengvietoi Жыл бұрын
Cảm ơn anh nhé! 🥰
@nguyenanhduc3313 жыл бұрын
I'm Vietnamese and I practice my English listening skill by watching him teach Vietnamese @@
@thp9400119 күн бұрын
I am a native Vietnamese speaker. I have lived in US for almost 35 years now. I am still fluent in Vietnamese. In the beginning of the video where you spoke in Vietnamese. I could understand you about 90%. I got to glance at the subtitle a few times to catch up what you were saying. You spoke a little bit too fast and with the accent it was a little bit difficult for me to fully understand. Nonetheless, for a foreigner to speak Vietnamese like you, it is extremely good. Anyway, as a native speaker, I have never recognized and appreciated how difficult for a foreigner to learn Vietnamese. You have done a great job breaking the learning down to make it easy. The more you talk to the native speakers, the faster you learn the language. And it goes with any language learning. For Vietnamese, if you learn from the Northern Accent, the pronunciations are more "correct". The Southern Accent has many words mispronounced but people still understand you.
@Tiengvietoi9 күн бұрын
thank you so much for sharing!
@valinormons Жыл бұрын
I'm trying to learn Vietnamese. I was there for a short time many years ago, but I didn't have time to learn the language. I would like to go there again. There are a lot of videos and I'm watching them to learn. They help me a lot. I have many Vietnamese friends here and they also help me to learn. All the videos are from a few years ago. Are they still being made? Is there any new content?
@Tiengvietoi Жыл бұрын
Xin chao. Yes, we are still making new content! Subscribe to our channel to see the latest videos!
@wwlee54 жыл бұрын
Absolutely agree on the tones. I can hear them even from the beginning. I noticed how tones don't really represent to the speaker how to speak proper Vietnamese.
@eloyah4 жыл бұрын
Okay my favorite viet teacher on KZbin so far!😍
@ozzie31264 жыл бұрын
Thank you very much, John!! It’s very helpful
@jordanmcmorris52482 жыл бұрын
Incredible work
@giasonle51823 жыл бұрын
I’m Vietnamese. :)) And today I learn Vietnamese taught by a foreigner. He’s cool~
@dustintran90173 жыл бұрын
Tui là người Việt, học tiếng Pháp thấy khó quá phải tìm mấy cái video người nước ngoài học tiếng Việt.
@dirremoire4 жыл бұрын
Do one on Không Dâu. My teacher says it’s the easiest, but it’s the one I struggle with the most.
@haicautrang53044 жыл бұрын
flat and higher than english speaking
@hoangduy98023 жыл бұрын
Không dấu is like how a American say a word without knowing anything, should be the easiest one Some of us called it Dấu thanh
@pickledjalapeno94823 жыл бұрын
@@hoangduy9802 How is that? I'm trying to learn.
@justakathings Жыл бұрын
It’s funny because I speak Japanese and I’m learning Thai and Taiwanese so I can hear the difference super easily and also noticed it too when I learnt a bit of Vietnamese. (I think) This is usually taught because a) teachers are teaching based on writing but also b) the writing was based off a different dialect than what’s considered standard now so the underlying -ng and -c distinction is there, it’s just that Hanoi does that distinction with tone rather than with the coda consonants
@MrEueu893 жыл бұрын
The most frustrating part of this is the native Vietnamese can't tell the difference when you describe to them the different tones you're hearing
@あすかニューン3 жыл бұрын
Cuz for native speakers, lots of things go unconsciously.
@nguyenhongngoc89733 жыл бұрын
OMG I'm Vietnamese and i didnt realize this until i watch ur video omg
@MartinAlix3 жыл бұрын
This was so helpful !!
@haraffael782127 күн бұрын
The thing is, this is true, especially in Standard Vietnamese and the other Northern Dialects. My Vietnamese girlfriend also dismissed it, until I showed her more of the studies. Now she believes me about the pitch now but still says "Thats still nặng, it just sounds different, because m and p are different"
@nahweh59384 жыл бұрын
The native speaker cuts off the ô later in độc than in động, making the vowel sound longer in the former than in the latter. Is that a thing with my poor ears or just overall irrelevant? Oops. Didn't watch long enough before I commented. Love the technical details. Keep it up!
@coffeecookies286 Жыл бұрын
Thank you so much!!!❤❤❤❤
@andrewdunbar8283 ай бұрын
In other tonal languages the same concepts are called open and closed syllables or live and dead syllables. Cantonese counts the tones as different depending on which of those two categories the syllable is. Thai and Lao count them as the same. Mandarin only has open/soft consonants.
@amikecoru4 жыл бұрын
Crystal clear. Many thanks.
@whichri798 ай бұрын
i always thought I was getting gas-lit when I questioned the soft sac
@tienrong3 жыл бұрын
Great analysis! I'm a native speaker but I'm in central Vietnam so I can't master the 8 tones. People in the northern part of Vietnam normally can speak with the 8 tones. For foreigners who want to learn Vietnamese, I highly recommended to learn with people who speak with the "Ha Noi" accent instead of other regions of Vietnam.
@kwongpaw7 ай бұрын
Thank you. Now i know it is not my untrained ears problem.
@riley093 жыл бұрын
Day 573 of quarantine, and I'm learning my native language
@MichaelWilliams-ks1sp4 жыл бұрын
Really helpful! I live in Danang and i have heard friends even pronounce the dot tone as the wobbly one.... But like a low wobble (sorry i cant remember the proper tone names). This video was great though.
@JH-ty2cs4 жыл бұрын
>even pronounce the dot tone as the wobbly one.... But like a low wobble You're not crazy - in central and southern vietnam, the dấu nặng is often pronounced like a low version of a dấu hỏi/ngã. This can really confuse people, because nặng is always taught as a low/dropping tone, when it's actually a rising tone in the south/center,
@erichayestvАй бұрын
So interesting, thanks so much! 😃👍 It’s worthy of a 30 minute part two with lots of examples. 😃🙏 As for nhấn mạnh though … it still seems to me that the mạnh is very slightly lower pitch than the nhấn and not higher… 🤔
@user-zh1nf3no1t3 жыл бұрын
I'm Vietnamese, but I have just learnt few things about our language that I wasn't aware of. lol
@duyanhgeorge32283 жыл бұрын
i like his pronunciation,he is speaking very good standard vietnamese
@henryt98713 жыл бұрын
I'm Vietnamese and i've never realized how hard Vietnamese was until i watched this video. Actually, if you follow the southern accent, these tones will much soften and nothing wrong with that. It's similar like English but in American accent and British accent. In the spoken southern accent, "?" and "~" would be the same, "x" and "s" the same
@nhuhdoifyАй бұрын
He's absolutely spot on regarding the tones. Only one caveat is this is mainly appropriate and applicable to northern accent. In many words, Northern accent blurs the line between 2 tones: dấu sắc and dấu ngã. Southern native speakers like me, we have more clear cut distinction between these 2 tones. However we make almost no distinction at all about 2 other tones: dấu hỏi and dấu ngã. So basically we have dấu săc, dấu huyền, dấu hỏi/ngã, dấu nặng, dấu ngang. That makes a total of 5 tones.
@user-jx4th1od6t2 жыл бұрын
Thank you so much from Korea🙏👍🙇
@l0nelys0ul2 жыл бұрын
Are you Korean? I’m learning Korean. The grammar is killing me. If you are learning Vietnamese our structure is very straightforward.
@thuylinh-ih2qd3 жыл бұрын
I'm a native Vietnamese speaker and I have an extremely useful advice: hỏi, ngã, nặng tones should be pronounced exactly the same in real conversation. When I was a kid studying tones, I found it impossible to distinguish those tones in daily conversation, this is only applied to academy. In school, nặng tone you just simply stress that word, ngã tone you wave that word sounding like you are a soft gay, and hỏi tone you pronounce it normally. I was always having 10/10 in Reading on that tip. And in real life conversation, if I talk like that, no one will understand me ( Trust me, I tried and always got "cái gì" meaning "what?/pardon")
@jigosanchez2 жыл бұрын
This is funny. :-)
@thuylinh-ih2qd2 жыл бұрын
@@jigosanchez no need to put a lot of effort into separating those tones. I've given up on it since I was a kid cause it only results in lack of natural in my talk
@dirremoire4 жыл бұрын
I notice that when native Vietnamese teachers show how to pronounce a single word, they always pronounce it "by the book", but then when using it in a sentence, that "book" goes out the window.
@paulmarshall77944 жыл бұрын
yep...same as English teachers.
@dirremoire4 жыл бұрын
@@paulmarshall7794 In spoken English, grammar goes out the window too
@6Uncles7 ай бұрын
so... seems like it's just about glottal stop finals, or entering/clipped "tones" 入聲. Same deal with Cantonese, where you have 6 tone contours and 3 entering tones, thus 九聲六 調
@huntbones33633 жыл бұрын
This dude is so good
@timurinvietnam4 жыл бұрын
That's gonna help a lot. thanks!
@NamAnh2809 Жыл бұрын
Keep in mind that the "2 more types" he's talking about is more relatable and informative if you want to speak in Northern accent. This almost doesn't apply for Southern and Western accents. But yes, you'll get the hang of it if you really nail the pronunciation of the 6 tones. Those are the building blocks of speaking Vietnamese like a native Vietnamese.
@bruce61264 жыл бұрын
Really awesome vid guys
@wonderfullife9043 жыл бұрын
Impressive, bro. In general, when we speak fast or naturally, the pitches are softened. Those pitches can be annoying for non-tonal speakers when there are competing noises as we speak.
@Strawberry_ishh4 жыл бұрын
and I though vietnamese wasn't that hard 😭😭 hu hu. but this was very helpful because i struggle so much with dấu sắc. Can you please do a video on the word "thì" or maybe vietnamese onomatopoeia's😃😃
@attran49673 жыл бұрын
As a vietnamese, this is f**king hard to learn holy moly