Time for m0NESY to MOVE ON? / Maniac: G2 are Top 3 at T-side Calling - Counter-Points S2E15

Thorin and Maniac discuss some what if scenarios for the recent PGL Major, roster rumors surrounding m0NESY and Cloud9, the current status of G2, ZywOo and Vitality's performances this year, the strengths of the CIS region, and more.
Counter-Points is a Counter-Strike talk show, hosted by Duncan "Thorin" Shields and Mathieu "Maniac" Quiquerez.
This video was recorded on the 18th of April.
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0:00:00 - FaZe
0:10:48 - Major "what ifs"
0:13:18 - MOUZ
0:17:54 - G2
0:21:54 - m0NESY, G2, and C9 rumors
0:37:44 - NiKo and HooXi
0:45:36 - huNter
0:51:28 - Potential moves for G2 + apEX
0:53:38 - ZywOo and VItality
1:05:51 - electroNic and VP
#podcast
#counterstrike
#thorin

[@mylesstevens4367]

Been binging old By The Numbers episodes through my graveyard shift waiting for more LFNCS! Perfect timing

[@MusHrOOmsonaCid]

yeah me 2

[@tigerjoseph]

The thinking man's Counter Strike program.

[@ollen1234]

Tips fedora

[@DavidDeCorso]

real

[@floofy1]

hey thorin, i actually think that Faze made a mistake picking Ancient against Navi. the reason has nothing to do with Navi looking weak on Ancient but its that Navi came off of a super close game vs g2 on that and the confidence of every player on that map will have been boosted, especially jL's. It was shown in the final in that 1v3 too. after that semi final win against g2 jL is already believing that he can take ANY team on Ancient and he can pull 1v3s ALL DAY on that map. Thats how high the confidence were for them. And ALSO, it doesn't help that Faze played bad especially Ropz, blud was almost afk on every fookin map they played except for a couple moments here and there.

[@mehow2g]

It's funny, there is always something preventing NiKo being a major winner but it's never him.

[@laugenpeter7315]

we all know it is his rtarded atitude.. but no one talks about it :D

[@Mathieu_soDjo]

They literally said that he fucked it for himself and m0nesy

[@saschailenic4543]

😊pq😊😊😊ppppppppp😊😊ppppp😊pppppp😊😊😊😊

[@pinkocean310]

His skill checks out but his choice of teammates doesnt

[@cd2194]

Not funny but tragic

[@booyaka2981]

Maniac talked for about 15 minutes and still managed to spew the most insane words heard in recent CS history, remarkable

[@schmeed0000]

maniac be HOOOOOXIN, we're so back bois

[@heathaen]

Nice pfp, idiot

[@TYLERLOVESBMX1]

thank you for the content

[@belair5009]

I’ve never been comfortable with having family members on the same team just on the principle. No matter how shit your brother or your cousin is playing you’re not going to go along with him being cut from the team because he’s family. Another thing, Nexa came into an underperforming team and if you followed his career you know he was not going to turn this G2 team into trophy winners. If it really was a play to activate Hunter and get him to perform better then unfortunately time has run out on waiting for him to get back to his best again.

[@MrMatom55]

Great timing as always

[@RobCooper-Bachatador]

JAME w/ m0NESY works better than JAME w/ Shiro On paper Shiro makes sense with their style however imagine JAME still playing the clutch role with m0NESY playing the AWPer The team can still save the AWP and play the save style w/ m0NESY but now they have an AWPer that has more early round impact

[@homeless7756]

I love cp, these episodes are so good

[@ourboyhemingway]

phrasing

[@arttuy437]

Fbi lock him up

[@72hrs_vermithor]

Wtf mate

[@fyroe]

HUHHH

[@sunshine8338]

Ladies and gentleman... we got him 🥳🥳💪🥳💪🥳🥳🙏🙏🙏👏👏👏

[@floofy1]

oh my god yesss more LFN

[@eZstah]

What if Big boom and Perfecto to G2 repacing Hooxi and nexa?

[@rare8567]

i like this, boom is such a G

[@therealnemesis1627]

I feel like the language barrier would be enormous

[@0ggyMild]

Perfecto does not speak english at all, boombl4 english is passable like b1ts.

[@zombie92110]

Ngl if I m G2 and the team is not winning anything until the player break I m trying to build a CIS team around Monesy

[@morai4247]

@@0ggyMild Where did you get that from, Boom's english is same level as M0nesy's, Perfecto can speak english just fine too, Out of them all b1t still has the worst level

[@kevinwrimel8566]

Great Episode

[@nosreklem]

Feel like people haven’t given credence to the fact that just 6 days before the mouz vs g2 game was the crocus city hall attack. Can’t even imagine how terrifying that’d be seeing the news and then having ppl rushing you in a crowded event when none of mouz were given the context of the stage rush. And then to just reset and play your game is a lot to ask of a team w/ an average age of 20. Agree that working on their mentality is one of their top priorities, but feel that the major was as extreme of an outlier as it gets

[@bar0v]

I think this adds more to m0nesy's pov because he's russian. iirc he also mentioned that he was kinda thinking about crocus thing while this stage rushing was happening

[@xanderbailey9106]

Exactly what I was thinking too

[@Reaching8]

I’m happy to see apEX getting more credit as an IGL, but seriously look at his situation. Everyone on his team is an awesome player most days. He can’t really get that much credit if his team works as it’s supposed to and shoots the opponent out of the server completely.

[@ZoiusGM]

39:11 LOLL

[@stayhome4626]

51:10 idk if people actually watch all the games or just look at the final and hltv top 20 then talk , bcuz hunter was just average last year , the only salvageable part about him was Kato23 , he is mechanically inferior to almost every player in the top 10 that plays the same positions , he was 1.06 rating against top 20 , historically he has been just smart player with average output but not anymore .

[@odyx1]

wish we had more transparency around contracts and fees in esports like in trad sports.

[@EntrEsprit]

Nah G2 on ancient just weren't there, yeah there was the jL deagle round, but even when it came to gun rounds that wasn't really close like the scoreline suggested. They didn't seem to have a gameplan, they won both pistols and it didn't help them, they were holding on merely due to monesy doing everything he can. They lost the map as a unit, and i rather agree with the angle that they should've went with Inferno in their veto

[@stayhome4626]

36:50 Titan after Kenny and Dan is different from G2 if monesy leaves , G2 have way more money and they are international , they can get two players for less (a good rifler and a good awper if they cut one of nexa or hunter) . For example : Heavygod , Jimmphat , deko , artfrost , degster , nawwk , nilo , blamef , s1mple ...

[@pochyena555]

Man... *Jimmy in Vitality.* Beyond great suggestion by Maniac and I quite like mezii.

[@flickjames420]

23:32 mate u should shift ur perspective sometimes.... aunkere is a big name in the russian cs scene, especially with the same young audience that follows monesy. Its completey understandeble that he talks about roumors like that, especially when its somebody he considers a friend spreading them

[@Jerome-iwnl]

The boston major is INSANE, still nightmare fuel for me

[@63alkash]

Well, now cloud9 roster moves are even more interesting

[@astar2394]

LFN gets me through my work shifts fr

[@Vlipper2009]

@thorin do you think niko could work on navi? Replacing iM

[@augie6735]

i doubt he enjoyed his time with aleksi on g2 but that’s a cool move i hadn’t thought of

[@sollertia_]

​@augie6735 to put on a tinfoil hat maybe hunter was the one pushing aleksi out and niko just supported hunter

[@TheBelgianEmperor]

On the Ax1le discussion: purely by the stats, his game shifted completely as Electron1c joined. Before July 14th he had a 1.18 rating in 2023 while after in CS:GO he had around 0.98 rating and overall only 1.06. And I think this makes sense. They share a lot of the spots, while Ax1le also had to adjust to a new IGL. Since Boobl4 he's had a 1.08 rating, so maybe it's a calling thing where he didn't get enough the freedom to play the way he wanted under Electron1c. So I'd be willing to bet that Ax1le can get back to being good. Edit: all stats are LAN

[@KeefeL]

3:55 Thorin the football manager and pundit What a terrible example

[@FreddeLibre]

it's so criminal that G2 and Vitality haven't met since Gamers8 in August.

[@KarmaChoedakAcharya]

JKS is the still missing piece of G2, thats it!

[@TYLERLOVESBMX1]

NAF really is the man

[@jianchen7450]

m0nesy to vitality, zywoo+m0nesy+sphinx is so OP ofc s1mple+m0nesy would be the dream

[@jeremyjacobs3539]

Double awp jame and monesy. New meta. Grand slam

[@RobCooper-Bachatador]

Sports history is littered with teams that played their Grand Final before they get there, causing an upset or upsets and then come the Final they are a shell of themselves and lose to a lesser team. It is similar to the team that causes a come back and then collapses from relief, only to lose the clutch final rounds and it just looks cosmetic.

[@borran112]

Maniac going delulu yet again

[@stayhome4626]

28:00 Worst calculations I've heard in a while , most big orgs are living off VC and sponsor money , that has never been reported that C9 , G2 or Faze have been net positive at any given year . Also most significant payments are not paid at once but are split for multi years plans in addition you have to consider signing bonuses and Salaries . Don't give that crap about Jake and Paullie or Carlos being good business minds , because they are terrible and have serially miss-managed funds but nobody really cares since it is the house money after all .

[@corey5894]

I think what thorin is saying is that Cloud9s moves aren't as wasteful as some people think. Thorin knows Jack and many of these org owners, and he can't say all the info he knows behind the scenes. Read between the lines.

[@Rexxyseksi]

Yeah after perfecto and hobbit leaving, C9 is indeed over

[@Spetsnazty]

Does Thorin let Maniac talk?

[@Jerome-iwnl]

If grand finals is Faze vs G2 Faze would win no question IMO

[@dmitrykim3096]

Thorin McGregor

[@kapilsharmaWorld_uncensored]

Niko and Monesy to C9 and we have a 🏆

[@Martin-zn5hk]

s1mple to G2. core of s1mple, niko, monesy...doesn't matter who the other 2 players are

[@miinus8972]

they really shouldve sold niko while they could

[@stayhome4626]

35:03 s1mple is not that good anymore , there is no reason to get him if you are a Major Semi-finalist team especially for whatever is NaVi is asking for . He already said he won't play with russians but C9 is the only logical destination . G2 and Vitality both have better awpers and better riflers .

[@dmitrykim3096]

Thorin is always a devil advocate, one time he trashes Zywoo, next time he defends him

[@luvhcchris]

LMAO imagine Jame on a rifle

[@m0nk3yscr4tch]

I hate that maniac is running around nonstop calling for jimpphat out of mouse in every occasion… mfer let them cook in mouz.

[@austins567]

2nd

[@71snack48]

Y

[@blink2665]

C9 snatch Donk and Monesy

[@f.j.gibbons7267]

first baby

[@stayhome4626]

14:20 How many times do we have to say that the stage invasion happened in the middle of the second map where Mouz were already losing ? The players took a break after that and everything was explained and then the game was resumed , Mouz are chokers and because they choked they played on the incident , but they still did it again in Chengdu .

[@elizabethmurigi1131]

I'm not saying that MOUZ was gonna win that game but the ''invasion'' started way before that. The players were asked to leave the stage twice.

[@stayhome4626]

@@elizabethmurigi1131 bruh , it was half time , I was fucking there , we waited for like half an hour for the game to be resumed and there was multiple people going up the stage to protest . I'm saying that the stage thing wasn't not even close to being the reason that they lost , they were already losing and they looked terrible , also it isn't like they didn't win anything after the incident , they were down 5-7 , they won CT pistol but G2 had better T side and it felt like a typical Mouz choke .

[@elizabethmurigi1131]

​@@stayhome4626then Siuhy lied in his post the following day when he said they were evacuated from the stage twice.

[@TomarSahab]

Its ludacris you compare hooxi with Apex, apex is better

[@cd2194]

Jimmy should lock in and join a top team imo Friendship and good vibes is nice but a cs players carrer is limited and he could fall off in 4 years with half the amount of trophies he could have had

[@KeefeL]

A young ranked #3 team is not a top team...? Literally only FaZe and NaVi are ranked higher

[@cd2194]

@@KeefeL rankings are not everything If jimmy can play with monesy+niko or zywoo+spinx he should imo since in my eyea this mouz might be capped for a while

[@KeefeL]

@@cd2194 so name value determines "top team"...? Falcons is a top team, then

[@cd2194]

@@KeefeL well yea name value do determine teams most of the time. Maybe faze could even sell ropz to vita and buy jimmy

[@corey5894]

​@@KeefeLThink of the examples he gave. Zywoo and Monesy have no equal on Mouz or Falcons

[@Horatiusxa]

Donk -> Cloud9 :>

[@KeefeL]

Donk the AWPer roflmao

[@dmitrykim3096]

I think currently Monesy price should be 2.5 mils in cs2 he is the mosg prove and best player, the one who survived cs2 switch, he is proved to be the guy who can adapt to any bullshit valve throws at the game. He should be priced much higher than shiro

[@ernyzaz]

Navi won 18 maps out of 21 vs g2. Wtf is maniac talking about :D

[@youngphil8766]

The only problem being a not native english speaker is missing 50% of what Thorin says

[@nixnt]

Myself 6 years ago. Just keep listening. I didn't understand anything this man was saying, watched only for the guests in the interviews. And now I understand everything and I believe it greatly helped me understand a lot of other English-speaking accents as well.

[@sunshine8338]

I think you'd miss 50% of what most people say if you're a non native speaker

[@Loxly-ti4sq]

well i'm not a native speaker here (EFL), and i can probably transcribe what thorin said in this video with little to no mistake. the only thing i've been doing for the longest time, probably for over a decade now, is just watch people speak English in videos every single day. If i eat i must watch something, if i play mind numbing games, i listen to podcasts or videos like this in the background. It's a long term commitment but damn now I'm like a pro compared to myself like half a decade ago. All you need to do is just consume media in a language you want to learn consistently, that's it.

[@youngphil8766]

@@sunshine8338 i can understand most of the people 100%, but this guy, this guy speaks fookin gnomescrolls

[@hayden0959]

NAF and twistzz on vitality would be great, or even just NAF. Get rid of mezii.

[@cz_czan]

The narrative that b1t got activated only on the 3rd map in the final is so ridiculous to me. He was top of the scoreboard on every map for NaVi. Almost on every half as well.