Couple of thoughts a week later when posting this regarding faster vessels! We just cruised 10 hours (you’ll see the video later this week) and averaged 6kts at 1.5 gal / hour. So roughly 15 gallons of diesel. A 30kt vessel burning 30 gals / hour would burn 60 gallons but save 8 hours. As always nothing is black and white but if your goal is to save money on diesel these are sure-fire ways to help! Cheers! Thanks for watching our video! Please check the KZbin description if you’re curious to when this video was filmed. Want to keep up with us in real time? Sign up for our weekly email to be filled in our current cruising plans and adventures. schoandjo.com/sunday-summary Do you have recommendations for future stops along America’s Great Loop? Please share them with us here! bit.ly/great-loop-recommendations
@tmac7092 жыл бұрын
This video is loaded with info. I enjoyed watching you two in the windy weather.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks T Mac! A wild windy day!
@AdventuresofAplusK2 жыл бұрын
These are great tips!!! It’s super fascinating to learn how fuel consumption in a boat is different from a vehicle!
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks y'all!!
@justathought9582 жыл бұрын
When you finally get around to cruising SOUTH on the Chesapeake Bay, and you get to the Bay Bridge, turn your eyes to port. There you will find Kent Island and the Kent Island Narrows. There are several marinas and even a boat "Boatel". Yeh, it's kinda neat as it's enclosed. More, there are several nice restaurants, not cheap, in that area that are within walking distance, including Fisherman's Inn, Bridges, The Narrows, the Jetty and Harris' Crab House. If you want a great crab cake (and you DO realize is that crab cakes are what Maryland does RIGHT, not the usual thing) those are the places to try. We've gone to all of them and while it's rather uppity, price wise, we love the food at The Narrows. Fisherman's Inn is cool because it has a G scale train running between the main dining rooms and their bar/waiting area is friendly. So you can't go wrong if you choose to stop right there, beside MD 18 and US 50, that road that goes from Ocean City all the way to Sacramento. Good sailing and give Ollie a big hug from us; she's a love!
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Ollie loves her hug 😁 Super cool about Kent Island and Kent Island Narrows! We've been around that area when we were in Crisfield last summer and headed to Annapolis a few times... thanks so much for the tips!
@bobstern78272 жыл бұрын
Add Libby's and Adam's Grill to your restaurant list.
@gothatawaychrisandsandra11 ай бұрын
Hey guys. As you know we have the same boat/engine. In one of our episodes Chris found the same specs...1600 rpms is our sweet spot for fuel consumption as well. We had these engines in our industrial forklifts and they take a beating! We ran them pretty hard in all weather and they just never give up. We have 575 watts solar but have LiFePo 48v 13kw...and ditched the generator. Chris put a charger in so we could top up charge from the engine while underway. Cheers guys (Sandra)
@EricUdell2 жыл бұрын
Hi Scho and Jo. My wife and I own Terrapin, a Marine Trader 38 with the same Super 135 Lehman as Pivot. We're also loopers, though we're on the "slow" plan and are spending this summer on the Chespeake and points north. We've got a Lithium house battery bank and a Balmar alternator ( 100A ) and separate Balmar controller. We use the alternator to directly charge the house bank with some custom settings and use a simlar DC to DC charger ( 30A Sterling ) to keep the AGM starting bank topped up, so we more or less charge opposite of Pivot. We typically charge at about 70A when running, which is a significant boost. It's also pretty easy to add a temperature sensor to your Balmar alternator ( if you don't already have one ) to prevent it from overheating when it's running at full output for an extended time. Feel free to message me if you'd like more details and/or if you'd be interested in meeting up as you pass through the Chesapeake. Thanks for the videos! Give some pets to Ollie, smooth seas and favorable winds for your continued travels.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Very nice! Seems like a good set up! I think the big difference is that balmar alternator set up - they make some really great products. Maybe we will cross paths in the Chesapeake! Cheers!
@bbmatthews20022 жыл бұрын
I really like your technical vids. We bought our trawler in September with Perkins engines after several years of a single Lehman (which I really miss). There's a good bit of new tech out there that could make miles of wiring and other 40 year old systems obsolete. Older boats have the remnants of older owners both good and less good. I counted batteries this weekend. We have 12 batteries!! No words. But I understand why. Would be nice if y'all posted more contemporaneously, but I see the work that goes into your vids and see the editing. Safe travels!
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Ben! Wow 12 batteries - quite a bit 😁 Sometimes its hard just understanding and tracing the existing systems nonetheless actually fixing and/or upgrading!
@ThePassportCouple2 жыл бұрын
"Everything's fine" 🙌 I felt like you were looking at us when you said it 😂
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Haha 😂
@stephenhayes10962 жыл бұрын
Doing a great job. Your 34' trawler has a theoretical hull speed of 7.8 knots. The Ford Lehman 135 has peak torque from 1600 to 1900rpm. Peak efficiency, as you have found is around 1600rpm. Pushing beyond 1900 will triple fuel burn for 25hp. Similarly the boat will need much more power to get past 8 knots. Tide and wind are the additional unknowns. Very enjoyable content, hope you have a decent anchor. 40lbs👍
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Stephen! 7.8 knots theoretically would be great in practice... we've found roughly .5 knots with each 200 rpm but I need to redo my calculations... so 1600 would give us 6, 1800 6.5, 2000 7.... This is with a very full and heavy Pivot though so I wonder if that changes things. Our anchor is 35 kg so roughly 77 lbs - practically a hurricane anchor 😁
@rlegate735710 ай бұрын
A couple of thoughts. Your stern wake will tell you how you are burning fuel. Run your boat so the waves are just about to whitecap. Running old boat engines hard. Fallacy. Run it for long periods of time withing it's working temp. range. Usually around 160 to 175 degrees F. Charging. My new Victron inverter charger never recharged my batteries well. I tried a Prologic management system that too failed. My alternator is a 105 amp. So I went back to simple. NORCO A/C to D/C chargers. 1 double for my starter banks. One for the house bank. And one for the bow thruster and windlass battery. Now my batteries are happy! Cheers Rl.
@stinker436 ай бұрын
The "run it up to max" comment most of the time doesn't need to be previously planned. On my trawler (same as Pivot but with single 120hp Ford Lehman), I cruise at 7k at 1700/1.5gph or wide out at 8.5k 2450/5.8gph.) It happens when you need to pass someone, or run home before the storm. I get it for a few minutes crossing the Bar entering Tomales Bay. Don't usually really need to do it there, but having been over that bar in 5ft breaking seas, I just want to get thru!
@SchoandJo6 ай бұрын
True! Wide open throttle can happen naturally in normal cruising. Cheers!
@steveandereggen31822 жыл бұрын
Another great video with a plus of tips on saving on fuel costs. With all the stress of anchoring during high winds, and the stress you go through about other boats near you losing anchorage and doing damage to your boat it may be better to dock the boat. You guys don't need all that stress on your trip.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
It's always a tradeoff! At ~$3 / foot that's basically $100 considering you can even find a slip.... BUT that being said we are extremely confident in our anchor and slept through the night even this night! We have our anchor alarm that wakes us up and in this case the boat that was coming close was no longer close due to the wind direction... Thanks so much for commenting and watching Steve!
@dennisallen79062 жыл бұрын
Hi I'm seeing a dirty air intake on the main engine. Keeping it clean helps . I am enjoying your videos. Thanks Dennis
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Dennis! We didn't notice it - any tips for cleaning it out? Cheers!
@randyputnam10562 жыл бұрын
Great video! I installed the same Victron DC-DC unit last year to supplement our solar charging to 2 LFP house bank batteries. Works great. We run a single Chrysler Marine gas engine and, like you, I’ve kept a log of our consumption for years. Our optimum performance is 1800 rpm at 3 gal/hr. Diesel would be better.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Nice! That's still super fuel efficient 3 gal / hr - thanks for watching Randy!
@davidingraham19892 жыл бұрын
WOW! That place brings back some fond memories (not). That will be a good story with a few beers. Good job on the charger. As always- great vid. Thanks. D.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Oh yea?? Haha looking forward to hearing it one day! Cheers David!
@lorihutchinson78832 жыл бұрын
Great video! ❤
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Lori!
@davehayes88122 жыл бұрын
Thanks, nice work! Finding that speed where the fuel consumption goes exponential??? Watch you wake! Wakes cost fuel!
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
No doubt! Thanks for watching Dave!
@haroldconnell29732 жыл бұрын
Great video
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Harold!
@mattryder18032 жыл бұрын
Spoke to you today on the water at Plum orchard Cumberland Island 🏝 Georgia cool channel
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Right on man! Thanks for checking us out! Cheers
@lancehayson1522 жыл бұрын
Keep your hull clean and your prop clean also, that's why racing yachts will lift and wash every 4 to 6 weeks.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Great point!
@buckpowers48372 жыл бұрын
Wondered how these strorms coming through were affecting y'all, The south suffered another round of nasty weather. Things will improve as well as your knowledge of diesel engines. Solar seems greek to me. Enjoy
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Buck! If you have any questions on Solar let me know or send me an email... I spent a lot of time figuring out our setup and have been pleased so far 😁
@jacobalderman105 Жыл бұрын
👍👍
@keithoutdoors7337 Жыл бұрын
wind generator lol
@kevocal2 жыл бұрын
Have you looked into running on / mixing in cooking oil? I don't know much about it but know that it's possible. I also know they used to sell kits to convert diesel mercedes engines to run on nothing but used cooking oil (after filtering out the fried bits first of course! ).
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Interesting! Nope, never considered it but would be curious to see whats involved. Thanks!
@rlegate735710 ай бұрын
It attracts seagulls like crazy! The smell of yummy French fries and all. Sorry I had too. Me bad. Cheers rl.
@gothatawaychrisandsandra9 ай бұрын
We used to convert Delica vans and Diesel Jettas to run WVO. For our own use. It was the bomb for saving $$ on fuel. However, as more and more vehicles have more digital air care/monitoring systems, it became difficult to find newer than 20 years old to convert. We ended up moving to another province and not having vehicles at all. My husband (he's the one who converted to WVO) says that it is possible to do that with our boat engine (also a Lehman 135) but the hassle of finding oil on the Loop would make it not worth it. When we had the van, we had firm suppliers. Anytime we travelled it was a scramble to line it up and then to be where we said we would be to pick it up. Looping would make that harder. But, if it is something somebody wants to try, he felt the engine was a good candidate. Cheers, Sandra
@zooba1974 Жыл бұрын
Another awesome video!!!
@SchoandJo Жыл бұрын
Thanks!!
@Prototheria2 жыл бұрын
Well yeah, throttling back on anything with an engine will save fuel. But no mention of hull speed? That's what's really going to dictate your most efficient speed. The square root of your LWL * 1.34 will give you hull speed. Alternately, on a flat day, you can go out and start slowly and steadily increasing your revs until you feel the stern start to sink. Back off about half a knot and there's roughly your hull speed, and about a knot below that is going to save you the most fuel while still maintaining directional control... as long as you're not in a hurry. To find out your consumption, go on Vic Prop's site and use their displacement/semi-displacement calculator (it's actually a prop calculator, but don't worry about engine HP or RPM, or gear ratio. Just put in WLL, beam, draft and displacement as accurately as you can get, then fill in the rest with whatever, then calculate. It'll show you what your hull speed is, how much power it takes to get there, and you can also select target speed, which if you put it one knot less than hull speed, you'll be amazed at how much less HP is required. Anyway... pick whatever speed you want to travel at, then take the required HP over to your engine data sheet and find your GPH on your prop curve using HP as the fixed variable. Boom, fuel economy calculated, and you don't even have to step away from the computer. Buy a membership at boatdiesel.com to access all the data sheets, and you'll be able to reasonably estimate fuel burn at any speed on any boat with any engine. Now, as for engines liking load to burn out the crap inside and more importantly, to prevent dry stacking... yep, they sure do. More specifically, they need heat. Since load = heat, you're not wrong. However... you don't need to load the engine up in order to heat it up. Let me explain. If you're unfamiliar, read up on how marine heat exchanger cooling systems work in regards to removing heat from the engine, and think about how similar it is to a car. The cooling system in a car is no different than a boat, except that instead of a heat exchanger, you have a radiator, and instead of raw water, you have air. When it's cold out, you'll see all the truckers throwing cardboard in front of their radiators to limit the amount of air going through the radiator so that the engine runs at the normal operating temp. This isn't adding load; it's reducing the cooling efficiency of the radiator. So... if you're running a boat engine under a light load and it's not reaching operating temp, you can do one of two things- burn more fuel by increasing the load. OR... reducing the cooling efficiency of your heat exchanger my limiting the amount of raw water going through it. Since you still need raw water passing through your exhaust manifold and through any other coolers (trans, for instance), you'll have to divert the raw water partially around your heat exchanger. Think back to how a thermostat works, and apply it to the raw water circuit around your heat exchanger. Now you don't have to worry about running it up to blow the crap out and more importantly, you never have to worry about dry stacking.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the write up as always! So according to that equation Pivot's theoretical hull speed is 7.37 kts... However, we haven't ever seen this, unless we have it right around 2200 which is way past our optimal torque which seems less efficient. Now this is when Pivot is very heavy (full fuel & water) but I wonder why its less? My assumption has always been the prop pitch and design and that our boat's most efficient operating speed is between 1600 - 1800 (referencing to the torque curve alongside fuel consumption). What do you think? We have never felt the stern starting to sink at any RPM lol Even running at 1600 our thermostat does open up and we see a good operating temperature (right around 180 ish deg), so it sounds like dry stacking shouldn't be too much of a concern for us?
@Prototheria2 жыл бұрын
@@SchoandJo Weight will play a big part in how much fuel you use, but hull speed is strictly dictated by the waterline length due to its relationship with the bow wave length. Because I feel we may be using the word efficient differently, I should have clarified: I was using it in the sense that it's the fastest speed attainable before you start seeing diminishing returns on your speed increase vs. power added. Like I said before- throttling back will ALWAYS save fuel and if that's your primary performance objective, slow it down as much as you want. But hull speed is the optimal speed if you need to make distance without excessive fuel burn. Your boat doesn't have enough power to get up over the hump and on to a plane, so anything beyond hull speed is just wasted fuel as all you're doing is pushing more water. As for the prop- you bring up a good point that'll baseline your setup: When running WOT, fully loaded, what's your indicated RPM? Your engine should be able to turn 2650-2750 RPM. If you can't reach that, then you're overpropped (if you hit that RPM before the throttle stop, then you're underpropped). Open up to your performance curve page and look at the prop curve and max power curve (I'm looking at the Super 135 data sheet on boatdiesel). Notice how they converge at max rated RPM? That's so the engine can make max rated RPM without overloading. Being overpropped (too much pitch and/or too much diameter) isn't necessarily a bad thing, but you need to be mindful of where the prop curve intersects the max power rating. Say you're not able to make more than 2200 RPM. That's your new max rated RPM, which looks like it'd be right around 75 HP. Pushing the throttle any more forward will overload the engine. Then you shift the prop curve over to the left (but not down or up) so it intersects the max rating of 75 HP. Following the curve down to 1600 RPM, that shows you at a hair over 40 HP being required to maintain that RPM. That doesn't mean that you're still burning 1.3 GPH, though... that means that you're burning 40 HP worth of fuel at 1600 instead of 1800 RPM as indicated on the published curve, so your fuel burn is really going to be 2.25ish GPH. If you're always running at low speeds, this condition is OK, but it's not any more "efficient" than it'd be if you had the right prop on there and needed to turn 1800 RPM to get that required 40 HP. Same speed, same fuel burn, just 200 RPM up the scale. Yes, operating an engine at the RPM where the peak torque is made (even though you're not using peak torque at a steady speed) will always be the most efficient in terms of specific fuel consumption (quantity of fuel per HP produced). But the difference between the highest and lowest point is very minimal. Your performance sheet doesn't show specific fuel consumption, but if you're able to find one for another engine somewhere (older Yanmars come to mind), it'll show it as grams of fuel per HP per hour. A gallon of diesel weighs 3220 grams, and the usual difference between peak and bottom of the specific fuel burn curve is somewhere around 100- 200 grams. Or, a range of .19 to .38 ounces of fuel per HP per hour. It's nearly insignificant on the scale we're talking about here, but makes a huge difference in the shipping industry (they'll fall over themselves to spend millions on shaving a couple percent off the fuel burn rate). If your temps and pressures are good at 1600, then you really only need to give 'er a hot supper maybe every other week or so, but if you're throttling up on somewhat regular occasion to make a pass or to buck a head wind or current, I'd never sweat doing it on purpose. Detroits are the only ones I can think of that you absolutely want to run up every day if constantly run at low loads. But backing up a bit to the prop... I want to reiterate the need for the max RPM number. Next time you're underway, put the throttle to the stop and let me know what you end up turning. We have no idea if that's the original size prop for the boat, but generally OEM props are sized for the light ship displacement figure. IE- minimal crew and stores, empty water and waste tanks, and half-ish fuel. Fill the tanks, add all your stuff, throw a slightly dirty bottom on it, and you'll need to repitch the prop to hit max rated RPM. But again- that's only if you're spending most of your time at 80% load. Anyway, sorry for the book, but I love nerding out on this kind of stuff.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
@@Prototheria This is an amazing write up... Thanks so much! I feel like you really helped explain some of the inter-connectedness between prop pitch, RPM, and speed that I wasn't fully getting.... Interesting to know that the torque curve isn't as impactful as I thought. I think our max RPM is about 2400, I'll double check on our next cruise! Again thanks so much for sharing so much knowledge!
@Prototheria2 жыл бұрын
@@SchoandJo You're welcome, and any time! I appreciate the videos you upload, so it's the least I could do! If you guys are still cruising East of the Mississippi in a few years, we'll see you out there; grub 'n brew's on us.
@MarkKrebs2 жыл бұрын
Power is approximately cubic with speed, up to hull speed. Your graph shows expected power assuming 2600 top end, but at 1800-2000 rpm, (where you cruise?) you're not running very efficiently. 1800 will be the best fuel economy, 0.39 lb/hp-hr, but only if you're extracting that power. I put a bigger prop on my Lehmans, gained a knot cruising at 1800RPM, lost a knot and 1000 RPM at top speed, but really worth it. I feel that if you're propped to hit your max rated RPM, that's too small, unless you really intend to run WOT all the time.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Good thoughts Mark, thanks for sharing!
@MarkKrebs Жыл бұрын
Oops typo. Lost 100rpm at WOT, not 1000.
@shawnengstrom22462 жыл бұрын
I know it's not this video...but do you have anti-fouling paint on your depth transponders? The ones I'm getting they recommend a couple different brands that have less harsh chemicals as to not damage the transponders. I was surprised they get painted at all.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Nope, when we painted our bottom, we taped over our transponders so we made sure not to put any antifouling on them... Interesting to hear that you can paint them with a specific paint - thanks for sharing Shawn!
@shawnengstrom22462 жыл бұрын
@@SchoandJo Yes. I'm getting Raymarine. It's all in the solvents of the paint. I was thinking about that when you said you had barnacles on then. Here pretty soon it will be pretty cold to swim under and clean them.
@toddthompson43072 жыл бұрын
What the software you use to track your milage? I couldn't hear the name on the video. Great video.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Todd! We use Nebo (nebo.global) we used the app only last year but now that we have the hardware hooked up directly to our ignition it turns on automatically 🤙
@toddthompson43072 жыл бұрын
Thanks you I will download it and give it a try on my boat. Thanks for the tip. Looking forward to your next video.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
@@toddthompson4307 Sweet! Thanks Todd!
@brianbavington46652 жыл бұрын
Great information again point on As I mentioned before I run 2 generators 1 diesel 12.5 kw 1 gas the gas being 3000 W Inverter generator which means it runs low RPM somewhat quiet We'll run 9 /12 hours on 2 1/2 gallons of gas .Great information on RPM and fuel burn when we brought are trawler home 120 miles at 1600 we made 2 knots durty bottom increased to 3 knots after some of the growth broke off .still had a lot when hauled out burned right at 100 gallon 75 hrs run time . Ford leyman 120 .I am hoping for 6 knots 1500/1600 2 gallons ah 44 foot Thompson. Would be nice Anything above that would be remarkable .mabe see you out there living a dream .ups and downs 28 knots gust on a tight anchor/ mooring .will get the blood pumping yes sir
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Thats some really fantastic efficiency for your generator! Good luck for 6 knots, seems very doable - thanks for watching Brian!
@ClassXIRoads2 жыл бұрын
Our thoughts on fuel is find it as cheap as we can, fill up then, and we don't plan on leaving our kids any money. We are very near age 70 and only have this life to live.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Haha!
@RBLVentures2 жыл бұрын
Another trick is NOT to tow your Di nge behind LOL
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
That's true! Reducing drag as much as possible would help too
@Janchez2 жыл бұрын
It's my understanding your most fuel efficient speed will be at the point where your wake just starts to curl off the back of the boat. Depending how much water you have in the tanks you'll probably see this around 5 knots in calm water. So maybe your fuel burn goes to 1.25 per hour at about 5 knots. .25 gallon savings probably isn't worth giving up a knot of boat speed. You guys picked a very economic boat to run.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
That's super interesting Jan - we haven't heard of that before! During tomorrows cruise I'll check what speed our wake curls off the boat, thanks for sharing!
@Janchez2 жыл бұрын
Around 3-4 knots the water behind the boat should be pretty flat then around 5 knots the wake should form angling out away from the boat with just a bit of a curl to it. I'll be curious to know want rpm you notice it happening. It varies by CHB because folks run different pitched props.
@frederickschranck8932 жыл бұрын
Have you considered or used a second anchor for these conditions?
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
We haven't found the need for dropping a second anchor yet... I think they are most helpful when you don't want to swing but if you are the only boat not swinging in an anchorage where all the other boats are swinging it could create a problem... We are confident in our anchor and if we would've done anything, it would be to slightly put out more scope if we started to drag. We do have our old CQR with a bit of rode on board in case we need it, but our mantus anchor, chain, bridal, and method of setting has been great so far. In our winter we stayed at this harbor through a gust of 45kts and were equally fine!
@snowgoose93222 жыл бұрын
@@SchoandJo Any decision to set a second anchor will primarily be driven by how all the other boats are anchored. In No Name, with everyone swinging on a single hook in a crowded anchorage, you pretty much have to follow suit. That said, I dragged there once on the third night, no change in wind conditions. It happens.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
@@snowgoose9322 Good points!
@seadog63512 жыл бұрын
23 knots is 26.5 mph so your watch and app were both reading the same.
@seadog63512 жыл бұрын
Wow, didn't realize that the price of boat fuel varied so much. Great advice there.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
The varying prices are super surprising! The next day, cruising through North West Palm, we say 7.22 and then literally 100 yards after the next bridge 5.20... Thanks for watching!
@thecommonboater22462 жыл бұрын
Running the engines hard for a time is for turbo charged engines not ones like yours. The turbo'd engines load up with fuel and need to be blown out. Especially older detroit 2 strokes.
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
Oh good to know - thanks for watching!
@frankrice53642 жыл бұрын
You need to study your prop..1 degree can burn more fuel are less add 1 degree you can burn less
@SchoandJo2 жыл бұрын
One day if we can afford to pull out and adjust it that might be interesting, I’m pretty sure we are slightly over propped because our max RPM is a bit low.
@Joshua-dw8wu3 ай бұрын
I used to be very interested in sailboats but seeing how much more expense the extra systems cost in maintenance it seems like a motor vessle might be better idea. I got a sick feeling watching the moey that the sailor's on KZbin were constantly spending on their boats.