Joshua Powell Case Analysis | Disappearance of Susan Powell

[@hughenadasilva5055]

Thank you very much Dr. Grande. I've been free from a narcissistic "marriage" of 56 years, for nearly 3 years. The Court removed him after he said he was going to kill me. Very grateful.

[@KissMeImABBW]

A virtual hug for what you have been through. XXXX

[@ismnotwasm1420]

My Dad was one, my Mom never divorced him, but they lived in different parts of their property at the end. - he died a few years back. His last stunt was to try and get her declared ‘incompetent” so as to control her IRA, and get complete control of their finances. Told everyone he could find the she was “crazy”. my Mom is a loving, giving and completely competent person. His death was her only way out, I think. She’s happy now. Blessing to you and you are very brave

[@JustDr.S]

56 years is a long time. I'm glad you got out. I wish you all the happiness you should have had all those years. I guess it's never too late, then? ❤❤❤❤

[@JustDr.S]

@@ismnotwasm1420 I'm so glad you're mom is happy now. ❤❤❤

[@vicster3758]

Hope you are focusing on yourself and sorry you had to go through that

[@MSlushalot]

This has always been one of the most disturbing cases. The father was SICK and Joshua was sick. Bless Susan and her babies :(

[@MusicLeeSarah]

And everyone that decided Josh's rights were more important than Justice for Susan and her baby's, those people, they are sick too...

[@andrewmantle7627]

@@MusicLeeSarah I saw and followed this case from long before the final act. The authorities did everything within the law to nail Josh. They tried and tried to separate him from his boys. Even at the end, the visit was under supervision by Child Protective Services. Imagine that if he had wanted to, he could have let them in, then shot them all. Or ignited the gas with her and the boys in the building. He was going to do it one way or the other.

[@niara961]

@@andrewmantle7627 he shouldn't have had any visits in the first place

[@ms.annthropic4888]

I still remember hearing he blew up the house and killed the kids. Felt like a punch to the gut.

[@lesleythompson6801]

I blame Steven for most of this tragedy. At the very least, he was controlling Joshua emotionally, and Joshua may have believed that Susan was involved with his dad or leading him on. Steven drove the wedge in their marriage deeper.

[@petertreid]

Leaving a note saying 'I was probably murdered - even if it seems like an accident.' is NEVER a good sign.

[@ashleygarden6906]

🤣🤣🤣. Sorry, but that cracked me up.

[@nadou760]

When you are in an abusive marriage you always feel like that .I was married to a sick narcissistic malignant husband and in my mind i was like sure he would kill me and my babies one day .Thanks god I left the monster after 7 years and feel so proud of myself I could save myself and 2 kids .I wish Susan had the courage to do that but the sweetheart angel though he would change .Rip Susan and her angel babies ;I'm sure they're in a better place now .

[@petertreid]

@@nadou760 I'm glad you escaped your situation physically unharmed.

[@georgeweaver9665]

@@ashleygarden6906 yeah… I seriously wouldn’t laugh about something like this I were you. (at least given the overall context, here.)

[@ashleygarden6906]

@@georgeweaver9665 sorry🙈

[@Thundersnowy]

As a person who escaped a narcissistic relationship where I feared for my life, and had two small children, I appreciate your comments so much about how difficult this decision is. People tend to say why don't you just leave? Without realizing that usually you will have to share custody, meaning your children will be alone with the person you fear most, whereas if you stay, you have a better chance of protecting them. I managed to escape by agreeing to sign over all of my possessions including the house and car in exchange for him agreeing to supervised visitation only. I took the children to a women's shelter where we began the process of starting our lives over. By the way, women's shelters are also used by judges to place women as a sort of halfway house. This, and other stringent rules, made staying there for 3 months extremely painful for myself and the children whose lives were changed overnight. It seems to me that a women's shelter should be a warm, and inviting place, where the woman is treated as a trustworthy person, not a potential criminal. But we made it out, and slowly rebuilt. I might mentioned, it's much harder to rebuild a life from scratch at that point, then having built your life from the ground up over a lifetime. Be careful who you marry. Narcissists can destroy your life in one way or another.

[@georgeweaver9665]

well, that’s basically what people like myself are indeed saying: *don’t just save yourself. bring whatever children or pets you have along with you, so they will be safe as well.*

[@unknownstranger6875]

I’m sorry you went through all this and I hope you are doing a lot better now. You are spot on about Women’s Shelters. I was in there, not because I was in an abusive romantic relationship, but because a family member was being abusive towards me…she is sadly now a therapist. Anyways I digress. The social workers who worked there would make us do chores and clean the kitchen after we used it. It wasn’t. Big deal, however the women who had children were asked to not let their children go in the kitchen while they were made to clean it. So they kept them in the living room area. These scumbag social workers would make a report to CPS if the kids went behind the couches or to the dining area, even though it was them who told the mothers to not take the children into the kitchen while they cleaned. Talk about abuse of power. Sadly it happens so often. Someone who is abused seeks out help only to be further abused.

[@maureeningleston1501]

The whole story is worse than your worst nightmare, the creep and horror factor is off the charts.

[@richardhart9204]

Yep, definitely Dr Grande's sleaziest feature story, so far.

[@suni.L]

When we trust outside sources & not the little voice within. "She kept coming back to divorce"

[@samum5856]

Unfortunately, this story is a warning of all warnings to pay attention to the relationship dynamics in the family you’re marrying into. I always say, the way a man interacts with his sister or mother is a foreshadowing of how he will treat you. His relationship towards women that he has little to no obligation to be nice to, esp. sister, shows a great deal. Josh was a major asshole to his mom and sisters. He thought of them as lesser human beings. Granted, Josh was severely mentally damaged by his father, a pervert. And Susan was such a young, loving person. Blinded by her need to prove she will have a perfect family and by her obligations dictated by the LDS church. The worst part is, Susan is forever missing, with all people who could reveal where she was killed, dead.

[@redshiftexperiment]

I was just thinking the same thing. So many of the people involved in this seem to be lost in a downward spiral of dark and disturbing behavior. Josh, his brother and his father! It's like something from a Rob Zombie movie.

[@maximix3531]

Absolutely hell on earth for this poor woman and the kids.. Hope one day we do something about narcs, maybe some unescapable detectors so that don’t they can’t continue inflicting pain and manipulating others. Best punishment for narcs is to force them to be by themselves

[@steviecrow914]

People at the work party didn’t think Joshua talking about disposing bodies in mine shafts as “out of the ordinary” for Joshua. Holy hell.

[@DingDongDaddyFromDumas]

I mean, depending on the place of work's culture and how close people are there, that isn't that weird. Like I've worked at places where plenty of our conversations could easily be used to strengthen a legal case if anyone there committed a crime.

[@knitter4years]

@@jcldctt :)

[@JudgeJulieLit]

Indeed, days ago that is where Susan's remains were found.

[@jaychanchez1772]

Poor girl got mixed up with those CRAZY people

[@SCUMMY4205]

My old manager would say weird shit like that too, everyone thought it was weird, but nobody thought it was out of the ordinary. About a year into me working there he was arrested for stalking, battery, and attempted kidnapping. The guy is a fucking psychopath. He only got 7 years I think too.

[@floraposteschild4184]

This is such a sad story. Everyone, please please: if you're going to make a nest, don't make it with wounded birds. For you own sake, and the sake of your children, seek good, sane people. Yes, we're all "works in progress", but there are so many red flags. It is ALWAYS better to be alone than in an abusive relationship.

[@marys3127]

Very well said. Naive and young people tend to think having a baby will “fix it all” - sadly. It just draws a child or children into the nightmare with the adults.

[@katiekarakondis3348]

@@marys3127 re..chris watts

[@reythejediladyviajakku6078]

Speaking as someone who has worked with children, boundaries are essential. If they don’t learn what’s appropriate and not appropriate, then they basically grow up to do stuff like this

[@SueP-D]

Words to live by.

[@dadon6055]

Good luck finding any un-wounded birds in this world these days.. especially women I am in my 30s and all the women my age are damaged goods.

[@lint212]

Thia case is pretty fascinating because NOBODY helped Susan. Her father-in-law was a pervert and her husband was a horrible human being.

[@bjarskiweber]

People tried to help Susan, her parents offered to hire a divorce lawyer and multiple friends encouraged her to leave him and they would protect her.

[@thereal4113]

Everyone knows, but they say it's not their business....until there is a murder. So sad for Susan and her children.

[@elizabethgrogan8553]

@@bjarskiweber It's so sad that she felt the need to stay. There is a lot of pressure from the LDS Church to stay in a marriage. It's a patriarchal Religion and women are often led to believe that they are the problem.

[@thereal4113]

@Joey Trombone apparently you don't know a mother's devotion for her children. Susan and her children paid the ultimate price.

[@thereal4113]

@Joey Trombone do you know the definition of chattel?

[@DEPARTMENTOFREDUNDANCYDEPT]

Joshua was a chip off the old block. His first girlfriend was so lucky, smart, or both when she moved away from Joshua, and is a walking advertisement for the idea that one should not ignore one's instincts.

[@jupeter24]

@Richard Benz, yes! excellent point.

[@AedanGUnit]

Amen to that! Always go with your gut instincts.

[@MusicLeeSarah]

Your brain will overthink things and send you down the wrong path. Your heart will misconstrue things and steer you awry.. But your gut cannot think. Your gut cannot misconstrue. Therefore your gut will never send you down the wrong path or steer you awry. Your gut just wants you to be alive and stay alive. Always trust your gut. always follow your gut.

[@abelis644]

@@MusicLeeSarah You gut it!😁

[@kaym.2854]

@@abelis644 lollllll

[@dianecooper7405]

Joshua knew his kids might eventually, with time, and space from him, remember details of the murder. A child’s description of driving as “flying an airplane” could be simply a recollection of an analogy of speeding on a highway to flight. Joshua must have sensed his kids were afraid of him and shouldn’t have been allowed supervised visits. Protecting children is more important than hoping the father wouldn’t hurt or destroy his own children. A father who could put mommy in the trunk could have similar plans for his own children. A father who would harm the mother of his child(ren) should not be considered safe with his children.

[@ShellyPurple47]

If only Washington State CPS would have believed how dangerous Josh was!

[@bnic9471]

CPS is often so misguided.

[@RYMAN1321]

@@ShellyPurple47 I have heard from people that custody arrangements have somewhat changed since then. But yes, a murder suspect should never ever have any business around children

[@whitedragoness23]

@@bnic9471misguided? I saw another video where Joshua was so bad during the reunification process. He was out of control and they violated their own rules because he couldn’t be around other kids and parents. That’s not a parent they should be doing parent child unification with!

[@nrgbunni.]

Charlie made reference to going to the beach (which is likely the waterfront near Susan's work could look like a beach to a 4 year old), flying/planes (josh would often take the kids to see the airport on their way from Susan's work)dinosaurs (the dinosaur monument they'd go to often), the crystals (crystal geode beds near the dinosaur monument theyd go to before). This was all in a video I watched I think it was in the cold podcast vid with Dave Cawley.

[@thebettermariah7753]

This entire case was extremely unsettling and it was one the few cases I’ve ever heard that genuinely made me so angry and so upset. How horrendous all the Powell men were and the fact that the world will never know the answer as to what happened to Susan is disheartening. Cowards. Thank you for talking about this case, Dr. Grande.

[@Mama_Bear524]

My heart absolutely breaks for those boys. And her family. It’s just so horrific.

[@RYMAN1321]

Everyone failed Susan and the boys

[@ChristinePerez903]

That 911 dispatcher that the social worker called when Joshua locked himself with the boys, he was so rude and condescending. It made me mad how this all happen. Great video Dr Grande.

[@heavyfeather0100]

I agree to a point that he was rude. But he really only became rude after it became apparent the woman didn’t know the address. Then she sort of rambles on inquiring about gps and goes on to say “this is strange” “it’s never happened before” Then asks if the dispatcher is still there... and he goes “l need to know where you are.” I believe both parties were at fault. If what I read is accurate that particular dispatcher trains others on 911 call etiquette and seems to have really learned from the experience.

[@lizbetpcb3759]

@@heavyfeather0100 yes, he was also condescending and dismissive. You can search to find audio and/or text of call. It was disgusting and inexcusable. He was given a reprimand.

[@fibrobear]

This is a completely tragic incident. The social worker was lucky that Joshua locked her out of the house or she might have been gotten the hatchet treatment and blown up along with the others.

[@LMCEK]

Agree. That 911 dispatcher was disgusting. Hopefully there was a performance review after this case.

[@strawberryshortcake8382]

Yea, he fiddled around with nothing that couldn’t have waited to be asked once the babies were safe. He owes those boys a apology 😔

[@leonieromanes7265]

That poor young woman and her sons never stood a chance.

[@knitter4years]

100%

[@BeckBeckGo]

I actually cried at the fate of those two kids. And it takes a lot for me to cry over a story. Like imagine, you see your mom get killed, then you’re ripped from your dad, and then the second you’re finally reunited with him, he takes a hatchet to you and blows you up. That is so fucking sad. Their last thoughts must have been so horrible… they were just little boys. I mean the whole story is awful, but this part messed me up.

[@SinisterScoundrel6562]

And yet somehow life goes on

[@KimberlyLetsGo]

I disagree. If she would have looked at the entire situation as volatile and dangerous, there were plenty of warning signs, she would have got the heck out of Dodge. But, not all women allow themselves the idea that they can actually be out of harm's way for themselves as well as the children by walking away from a dangerous husband.

[@leonieromanes7265]

@@KimberlyLetsGo it can be incredibly hard for women to get away from abusive partners. Especially if they're from a religious background. It makes me angry that women and kids have to upend their lives and go into hiding, to get away from the person who is meant to protect them.

[@heidiho5179]

Thank you so much for what you said about there being no easy answers for the partner of an abusive narcissist. My ex-husband was diagnosed with ASPD, and I was terrified of him. Often, on our drives, he would take me past The houses of people he was stalking who he had on a “sh*t list” that he hung on the refrigerator and ruminated about endlessly. He had beaten me so badly I had skull fractures and sciatica, and I needed twice the time in hyperbaric oxygen chamber (60 days) covered by insurance, plus 15 months IV antibiotics to fight infection in the bone because he demanded I swim in lake water after the surgery. I literally had to go back to him to recover because I had no relatives who would take me and the women’s shelters wouldn’t take me because they said I needed a nursing home, which my insurance wouldn’t cover. He had threatened to abduct the kids if I left & and I don’t doubt that he would’ve done it, had I left at that time. I had so many people telling me to just leave and it was never that simple, especially since I’ve been disabled since that attack. I don’t think you can tell people enough what a difficult situation that is and I thank you for saying that and sharing Susan Powell’s story. All I ever read for “leisure” when I was with him, once he lost the mask when we were married, were read true crime books and try to figure out how not to end up dead. All the while I was harshly criticized by anyone, who was like a friend or a family member, for having my kids in that situation. I really appreciate your compassion and validation.

[@Thurston86]

I’m glad you got out of the situation and I hope you’re in a much better place now. There’s never an easy answer when it comes to these kinds of things and what works in one relationship / situation may not in another. I wish people would remember that more often when passing judgement on others. I’m glad he’s now your ex and again, I hope things are better for you now. ❤️

[@cl5470]

I hope you do a video about Josh's father. He was beyond creepy and weird.

[@BrightSeaStar]

YES !! Not only - It looks like he was the root of all the troubles.

[@CC-fo7tr]

Dr Grande sure knows how to pick them. If you like podcast, check out Cold season 1. It’s absolutely riveting, about the Powell family. It’s worth it just to hear about Josh’s dad’s obsession with Susan. Feel SO sorry for Susan’s parents.

[@BigZebraCom]

Just a reminder, the diagonally-arranged cactus on the upper level of the night table are not diagnosing anybody; only speculating what could be happening on a night table like this.

[@tx_gal6518]

Two murdered children and this was what stood out?

[@KissMeImABBW]

@@tx_gal6518 I get what you are saying, but sometimes people need to add a little bit of light-hearted humor into sad things.

[@conorfitzmaurice8959]

Could they speculate as to why flo rida was in the euro vision...

[@zensbleexperience3470]

😂😅😂😅😂😅😂😅😂😅🌵🌵🌵🌵🌵🌵🌵yes! I'm still laughing

[@BigZebraCom]

@@zensbleexperience3470 Wow! Thank you!

[@jessicascott5847]

For anyone who is interested in this case, the Cold Podcast did an amazing, multi episode deep dive on this case.

[@Anon_E_Muss]

Agreed!

[@BlueBelle-711]

Where is the Cold Podcast? Thank you, in advance.

[@jessicascott5847]

@@BlueBelle-711 You can find it here on KZbin :)

[@BlueBelle-711]

@@jessicascott5847, thank you so much!

[@maureeningleston1501]

Thank you for covering this Dr Grande, it's a true horror story, with so many twists and turns.

[@janiesigmon5104]

Thank you, Dr. Grande! I had asked you to analyze this case and was happy to see it. Steven Powell was definitely a horrible influence on members of his family, Josh included. He was the creepiest father-in-law that I’ve ever heard of. When Josh was losing control of his life, he decided that he would take his boys with him in death. Of course he should never have been allowed contact with them but that is hindsight. From what I understand there are new laws that say if you are a suspect in your spouse’s murder/disappearance, you cannot have access to the children. Hopefully this case has saved the lives of other children.

[@Ali-kb8gr]

I thought I'd heard about this case... but when we got to the father in law... I was like yup! I'd remember that creepy nut job any day. Awful story.

[@RoseRoseRoseRoseRoseRose]

Narcissistic people are only impressive for a certain time but the interesting videos of Dr. Grande last forever because of his great sense of sarcasm, his voice actor voice and his offer of knowledge. Thanks a lot❣

[@LMCEK]

Sounds like she was in an impossible situation. Toxic hope is very powerful. I empathize with her situation a lot. Tragic ending to this story.

[@GoGreen1977]

One girlfriend had the sense to get away. I always wonder how men like Joshua lure in women and then make their life miserable and the women let themselves get sucked in. Susan, for whatever reasons, didn't see or act on the red flags early on. All too common.

[@RYMAN1321]

@@GoGreen1977 Susan didn’t know about Josh’s troubled past? But I always look at cases like this and think about something I heard long ago “You can’t make someone love you”

[@natalielawyerchick]

I had never heard of this case, so when Dr. Grande got to Joshua’s final act, I gasped. How terrible and sad. So many lessons here, especially when it comes to Susan’s feelings. Thank you Dr. Grande

[@oliverquach9614]

As traumatic as it sounds that social worker should count her blessings. If he dragged her into the house or if she ran after them he would have probably killed her.

[@marys3127]

Yep.

[@evonne315]

True. Yet no doubt he wanted her a witness and enjoyed that. Another sick thing.

[@thelocalmaladroit8873]

What’s creepier than a psycho husband? An equally creepy father-in-law. So sorry for her and the two kids! Thanks, Doc! Suggestion , the late comedian John Pinette 😘

[@floresnashvilledrummer]

Oooh, I remember him! What's up with him that would make for a case?

[@dos4591]

i would like to know whats up wuth him

[@perrrry]

This is in no situation an excuse, but in my eyes Steve Powell (Father-in-law) was the root of everything. He made his sons the way they were. There were really no hope for them.

[@whitedragoness23]

@@perrrryhe was and he inadvertently caused Susan’s death. I saw in a documentary how father and son got closer before Susan’s death. Joshua powell was closer to his creepy dad than his sane wife! And all josh did was complain about her and Steve encouraged it thinking it would get them divorce.

[@lynn2574]

Although usually referred to as a social worker, the person that Josh locked out of the house the day he killed his sons was an employee of the agency contracted to supervise the visits. That is typically a position considered entry level, and usually does not require licensure or a social work degree.

[@RYMAN1321]

But he should never have had visitations take place in the home

[@beeimaginative]

Heartbreak for anyone associated with the Powell family. I feel so sad for Susan, Charles and Braden and for the social worker who dropped them off to be killed by Joshua with a hatchet. Dysfunctional does not even come close to describing the Powells

[@megalopolis2015]

This family was evil. Why couldn't they just stop at stupid? And why did the cops and social workers have to join in by enabling the massacre? My heart breaks for Susan's family.

[@nelthehippie]

This case happened in my hometown, I will never stop wondering about her. If you’re interested in additional coverage, the “Cold” podcast is worth a listen as well.

[@LaineyTsang]

Just wondering; the police assumed Susan just left when she went missing?? There was no evidence that anything might’ve happened to her? The police just accepted Joshua’s asinine camping story?? They didn’t try looking for her or investigating at all??

[@PhotoRealisticBeaver]

@@LaineyTsang The police had their hands tied by the D A who wouldn't let them make an arrest without sufficient evidence.

[@kenbrandt6100]

I hadn't seen my mother in quite awhile before attending a wedding together last weekend. She asked me how a friend of mine was doing, and I started my response with, "Bear in mind I'm not diagnosing anyone here, just speculating on what *could* be going on in a situation like theirs."

[@leege4257]

I was married to a man who was so much like Josh it gives me chills. Luckily, I saw. The danger eventually and got away...

[@cookie_dough_hangover]

So glad you are free.

[@abelis644]

Good for you to have listened to your gut.😳

[@terrysmith1382]

I am from Utah. I remember when this case was happening. It was crazy to watch it unfold. A local news station did a podcast series on this case a couple years back called Cold. This is probably one of the best podcasts I’ve ever listened to. I would highly recommend it. As usual, Dr Grande’s analyses are interesting and insightful.

[@eek1759]

Here's my analysis: That was one hell of a f***ed up family. Those are my thoughts on the Joshua Powell Case.

[@adamaunya69]

LOL, accurate

[@HoneySun16]

I think there was incest going on too

[@pera654]

Agree!

[@petezipardi4022]

Yep.

[@ashleygarden6906]

🤣🤣🤣

[@cottontails9003]

Great analysis Dr Grande. I feel so sorry for the whole situation. Those young boys should have never been placed with their father. I feel he had no intention of letting his sons live. This situation makes me mad as hell and sad. Thank you Dr Grande, hope you have a great day.

[@rachelrose1368]

This was chilling to watch. This guy sounds so much like an ex of mine who is now in prison for murder.

[@Mama_Bear524]

Wow! Glad you got away. So sad for his victim.

[@kadyk4185]

Glad you got away

[@RYMAN1321]

People like Josh never change, they are who they are

[@violetedge83]

As a former CPS worker is another state, I'm curious as to why a supervised visit was happening in the home. I think that supervised visit would need to have happened at 1 of the CPS offices. Especially due to the matters of the case.

[@seahawksfan7298]

The Cox family sued the state of Washington over this matter and one several million dollars last year. It will never bring back Susan or their grand babies, but at least some justice came from it. Washington has since changed supervision policies to be more strict.

[@violetedge83]

@@seahawksfan7298 thanks for the update. Good to know policy has been changed to keep children safe so some good has come from this

[@marys3127]

Yes, things have changed as a result of this case. Thank goodness.

[@BellissimaFaith]

Great point. I’ve known one person with a case due to DV happening to mom and child and the father was allowed supervised visits but never at home it had to be at a public place.

[@RYMAN1321]

@@seahawksfan7298 That’s great to hear But this was an incident waiting to happen

[@pembrokelove]

Oh, my heart. I never met these people, but when they returned to puyallup his little boys went to the same school as my youngest sister. She was older than them so they didn’t share any classrooms or anything, but they had grief counselors come in to help the kids and everything. This area has had a bad run of luck with young kids, because right around that same time another kid from the nearby school our nephew attended was killed by a freak accident involving a monster truck. This case never made sense at all; Even if they could not prove in a court of law that he had killed Susan, there was certainly enough circumstantial evidence to interfere with custody.

[@RYMAN1321]

Anyone considered a murder suspect should *never* have visits with their children

[@carolecompton9270]

That social worker should consider herself extremely fortunate Josh locked the door before she walked in the house...Such a sad story...No happy ending 🌷 🌷

[@laurenjeangreenbean6301]

Thank you Dr. Grande, for allowing your empathy and dignity for this poor, trapped woman to show. Not everyone can combine fact and loving-kindness for victims simultaneously. You can. ❤😇

[@chasityyoung815]

I swear I love this channel! Not only do you get educated on mental health in which I love learning about. You also get a true crime story here and there. Not that I love the fact that we have all this crime. I just like being made aware of what walks around us daily. This makes me pay closer attention to my surroundings. Recognizing behaviors and signs of really sick and unstable people.

[@seahawksfan7298]

Thanks for analyzing this case. I’m originally from Utah and now live in Washington. I used to live just a town away from the Powell’s house, and it was all we could think about for so many years; it became very personal to so many citizens of the Salt Lake area. I wish some day someone finds Susan, so she can be laid to rest with her babies, but it’ll probably never happen. So much time and resources were spent looking in endless mine shafts and caves in the west desert without success.

[@chrissyellem7397]

They might have found some of her remains and clothes recently in a mine shaft. Look at the news reports this week.

[@seahawksfan7298]

@@chrissyellem7397 yeah, I watch the you tuber’s channel that discovered them

[@dirtypossem]

​@@chrissyellem7397it was not Susan or her belongings. That you tuber will do anything for views.

[@hayleybourgault4114]

I feel bad for Susan, first she marries a very sick man, then shes spayed on by dirty old man father in law then is killed by sicko Josh. So sad, I wish she could have gotten away, gone to a shelter with her kids. This story couldn't have ended more sadly.

[@toniemorrison4263]

There was no way out of that marriage for Susan. Interesting but excruciatingly tragic story and great analysis, Dr. Grande, as always. 😍🔥

[@marys3127]

Yes, the term you used “excruciatingly tragic” is perfect to describe this case.

[@toniemorrison4263]

@@marys3127 I feel so bad for her and those completely innocent boys...

[@bellakatherman1477]

I just don’t understand why she didn’t leave. She could and should have grabbed the boys, gone straight to her parents house and never looked back.

[@TS-rd7oy]

Yes, there was. It's called divorce, but organized religion probably warped her brain, as it does many women, into believing that keeping the family intact is all that matters, even if it means you die.

[@playsaboutmycat]

Camping in a blizzard. He didn’t have his charger; phone charging in the console. Mommy was in the trunk! 🚩🚩🚩 Great presentation as always!

[@jackstevens585]

Camping at 2am?? Saaay whaaaat!!

[@abelis644]

Why wasn't he immediately locked up...

[@RYMAN1321]

@@abelis644 Agreed How is taking two young children out in a blizzard “camping” not abuse?

[@AndriaBieberDesigns]

I remember this he is clearly. I live in Washington state and it was all over the news.I feel so bad for Susan. I feel bad for her parents and for those poor babies.

[@thereal4113]

Catherine got away with her life. Susan and her children are a cautionary tale to women in relationships with a NARCISSIST. Children are blessings from God, but in the world of the NARCISSIST, they are merely chess pieces in the mind of the NARC. I loved this analysis so much, I watched it twice. Thank you so much Dr. Grande🪴🪴🪴🪴.

[@loriburnip]

I see so many people abbreviating narcissist to narc, but that term used to mean something very different. Lol. I agree with everything else you said though.

[@marys3127]

Allison, have you heard the podcast “Cold”? It is about this case, it is excellent!

[@thereal4113]

@@loriburnip NARCISSISM IN NY IS SO COMMON. WE SOMETIMES CALL THEM NARCS, BUT YOU ARE RIGHT NORMALLY PEOPLE USE THE ABBREVIATION NPD FOR SHORT. BUT YOU ARE CORRECT.

[@loriburnip]

@@thereal4113 to me Narc has always meant someone who works in narcotics. Or at the very least will rat on you for having drugs. We'd call them a narc, we'd say things like "dont trust her, she's a total narc" Stuff like that. Narc meant a rat or tattletale in my day.

[@thereal4113]

@@loriburnip you are totally correct. I just call them NARCS for short.

[@LMCEK]

I have a video idea, which seems to be at the center of Susan's thinking: Toxic hope, aka When you keep wishing and hoping they'll change. Not necessarily the whole topic of codependency, but the hope and denial that keeps someone together with an abuser or other toxic person. It can also prevent you from getting over someone long after you do actually leave. Toxic hope can destroy someone's emotional and even physical health and well-being

[@vickikay25]

This is one case that is so horrendous. My heart goes out to the Cox family and all of the people who loved those little boys. May Susan and her babies rest in peace.

[@Tealcats]

hi Dr. Grande ! I just found your channel last night and I’ve been binging so many of your videos. I’m a last year psychology student and hoping to get accepted into the Psy D. clinical psychology program near me. your videos are so interesting not only for my love of psychology but you take relevant things and look at it through your psychological lens! I’m so glad I found your channel !!

[@sherunswithscissors]

He has lots of older videos including case studies.

[@zenawarrior7442]

Sad, disturbing case. Another event shows severely mentally ill/narcissistic people will not get help/won't change. Thanks Dr G😊💜❤

[@RYMAN1321]

Agreed They’re incredibly sick in the head and could give two shits about anyone else despite trying to pretend they do

[@Ricki_Raquel]

This story is almost unbearable. My heart breaks for Susan and her children. Dr. Grande, the quality of your content is unwavering. You, hands down, have the best channel on KZbin.

[@tammyjohnson7401]

Very sad what those two little boys went through and their mother.

[@zero_bs_tolerance8646]

What an incredibly messed up story. Very tragic. Thanks, Doc.

[@joev1097]

I came here as soon as I could This is amazing 🤩 Thanks so much Dr. Grande for responding to my request on this case I deeply appreciate and I believe everybody else in this channel does. You are the best!!

[@Jess-kn8vl]

Your assessment at the end was very understanding and empathetic of what Susan went through. 💔

[@mrs.reluctant4095]

This analysis was very sensitive and compassionate. And our doctor almost smiles while speaking the last lines, this is a good sign. 🍬

[@TheSliverleaf]

Great video! If anyone wants more in depth information on this “COLD” podcast ( and on KZbin) by Dave Cawley is amazing and so well done. I found myself riveted to this story. Mr. Cawley and his team gave a voice to this story and really did a great in showing how domestic violence happens and the signs. Many have found this story as what got them out of their own situation before it was too late.

[@sunsetdelrey4442]

i was having a conversation with somebody on the ethics of covering true crime & how the ways in which some on youtube make light of very serious topics would upset me if i was familiar with victims in question, but your humor is very tasteful, well timed & you give very insightful recounts of situations. your commentary doesn't simplify human beings into "this one is the good guy, this one is the bad guy" & it really does help to give a better understanding. you are probably the only trume crime related channel i watch anymore due to the way you handle these subjects & your content is really appreciated

[@sunnypie2]

Thanks for discussing this. I remember watching a KZbin video about this, and Joshua’s father seemed to be the triggering one. If Joshua’s dad was never obsessed with his wife would this even happen? Also imagine being raised by his dad 😯They were living with the dad for financial reasons. And they abruptly left when the dad declared his love to Susan. imagine having a dad like that? so obsessed with his wife he would try to steal her from his own son. Probably traumatizing. Very sad case. The children were so innocent and sweet looking. Very sad and scary. And Susan seemed like a supportive wife and seeking help for him🙁

[@RYMAN1321]

People like Josh can’t be helped or change. You can’t make someone love you

[@rayross997]

Please cover Charles Lindbergh and his involvement in eugenics. Thanks Dr. Grande.

[@clairepancerz9744]

I second this request! Lindbergh the media creation seems very different to Lindbergh the man, and I’d love to hear Dr. G’s thoughts.

[@madelainewinger7014]

Yayyyy! I was waiting for you to analyze this case. What a messed up dynamic in Josh's family, and his father...I have no words. So tragic, entirely avoidable, I think Susan felt obligated to make it work and didn't want to look bad in the eyes of the LDS. Ladies, listen to your gut.

[@joelled1099]

I’m not sure if someone else has said this, but I would HIGHLY recommend the podcast “Cold”. Specifically season one, it covers this case, and is one of the best third-party investigations I’ve seen regarding this kind of case.

[@joelled1099]

Other than what Dr. Grande covered; based on some of the audio files included in the podcast, I personally believe Josh had some OCD tendencies and possibly was questioning his sexuality. That’s just speculation though.

[@Dread_Mender]

I have delved into hundreds of cases during my life. the story of Susan Cox and her beautiful sons (who are an awful lot like mine) Charlie and Brayden have a special place in my heart. Susan was an incredible mother, an intelligent employee, and a supportive spouse. She wanted to see the best in people. I'm not a religious type, but I really hope that she's with her boys now.

[@RYMAN1321]

Unfortunately though, for some people like Josh and Steven there is no goodness within some. They’re basically narcissistic psychopaths, and are incredibly sick in the head. And have no care for anyone else but themselves Domestic abusers never change, they are who they are. You can’t make someone love you

[@Julesb2183]

I'm glad you've done this case. It's super interesting.

[@justhere4697]

Never understood cases such as this, I've worked in corrections, sexual abuse facilities, and department of juvenile justice and women's work release facilities, there's a great deal of mental issues we face and deal with without being PhD doctors, and I can't fathom this going on and Nobody knew.... its truly horrifying how " there is no village" to help victim's, yet so much blind eye to abusers in extremes.. the logic loops are endless. Good job with this video Dr grande.

[@cacu3989]

LDS church. Sick, sick culture.

[@KaylaMarie_]

This is one of the saddest cases for me. I think about it a lot.

[@debbiethompson14]

One of the most tragic cases I've ever heard

[@rerite2]

Couple of thoughts: when you marry someone, you're also marrying her/his family. Ask yourself: do I want to marry this family? Also, to know someone takes time. First meetings, usually the person is on their best behavior. When married, and living in close quarters, the mask comes off. Sometimes a little at a time, or, all at once. The spouse cannot but reveal their shadow side. The "truth will out," as old Bill Shakespeare wrote. This girl, Mrs. Powell, found herself in a minefield of madness. Yet, she knew her life was in danger -- if only intuitively. If, by some twist of fate, I had been her friend, I would have told her to: "GET OUT!" Get on a bus, a plane, a train, put on your sneakers and start walking away -- just get away first, then get a lawyer and deal with the child custody, etc. I shudder to think how many plunge into marriage without any pyschological self-awareness, completely ill-equipped for the journey into the Other's subconscious shadow. The daily headlines are filled with the tragic outcomes. Again: GET OUT. Life goes on. But it doesn't if you're not alive. Another great analysis, Dr. G.

[@JustDr.S]

@@TheCandiceWang Then don't marry him. Please.

[@97indianuk]

@@TheCandiceWang then don’t marry until you have enough money to move away from them. You don’t have to do anything you don’t want to.

[@97indianuk]

@@TheCandiceWang also have an exit strategy. Have a few friends and family members who you can stay in contact with and check on you. If things become abusive and toxic please don’t hesitate to leave. There is no prize for suffering.

[@bluecollarlit]

Candice, don't marry him.

[@0megaVon]

One hell of a story, Dr. Grande!! 🤯🌵👓💯

[@JaneDoe-ip5yl]

Not exactly party convo "how to dispose of a body" 😆 Susan had a lot to deal with- father & son

[@rullmourn1142]

I know about this case. Powell's father was a special kind of creepy. He wrote and sang a song about his daughter-in-law called, I Can Love You In A Secret Way..😳

[@michaellykke100]

That dad is the creepiest guy I have Steen.

[@maryriley6163]

Your analysis was very interesting. How awful for Susan Powell to feel trapped and even suspected that she was in mortal danger.

[@christieculp4936]

Thanks for doing this story, Dr. Grande. I wish Susan could have successfully gotten out. It's important for people to know that Divorce is a valid option if you are in danger, even if your church is shaming you into to staying.

[@yvonnestyhr8308]

Hi Dr. Grande, one of my sisters had my parents believing in high school and again at 24 that she had a brain tumor. My Dad finally insisted on attending her appointment with a neurologist with her saying he did not need to attend. The neurologist gave her a card and referred her to a therapist. A huge shock to my dad. This same sister is treating my dad poorly now. Is she a narcissist? Something more in your general opinion? Thank you greatly! 😃

[@lethu6413]

I can no longer watch your videos while eating anymore because I always choke from your unexpected jokes. 😂😂 and I always feel guilty for laughing because these are serious topics.🙈

[@melfreemans]

Susan reminds me of Patricia Kimble, a girl in our church who was murdered by her husband and his brother. Her husband was extremely narcissistic and his brother worshiped him. Patricia was the purest soul you could ever know. It was absolutely heart breaking what happened to her.

[@genievemcdonald9744]

Ouch! Boy I would have loved to heard this 4 years ago. I had a boyfriend who started off great but really turned on me. He believed he was "perfect in every way". If you remembered to talk to him as a Perfect person you were fine. He could not hold down a job because he was untrainable...because he was perfect in every way. I left him one afternoon. I moved 2 states away. Thankfully no chlldren with him.

[@janesmith9628]

"There are no easy answers... [Susan] only had choices that would result in pain." Sometimes this just sums up life. Great line-up of the cacti today, and WHAT IS That cardboard-looking-like tall, spotted one in the back, in the black and white striped pot with the white rim?? I know it's been making quite a regular appearance lately, but it's kind of camouflaged against the brick wall, so hard to see. Does s/he have a name??

[@kenmore01]

I think that's an LED cactus. 😃

[@janesmith9628]

THANKS @@kenmore01 ! I've been wondering for a while what that thing was!! (never seen one before.)

[@kenmore01]

@@janesmith9628 🙂 Maybe he'll light it up for us someday lol!

[@maryshaffer8474]

It only takes one person to destroy so many lives.

[@JustDr.S]

@@maryshaffer8474 Absolutely.

[@beckyrockwell7964]

I'll be shocked if they ever find her remains.

[@samum5856]

That will never happen. Josh and his brother took this mystery to their graves.

[@carolecompton9270]

@@samum5856... I definitely 2nd that emotion 🌷

[@GGiblet]

This is one of the most distressing of all the true crime cases for me. So many horrible elements and people impacted. I really appreciate your thoughtful analysis🙌👏👏👏💜🌈💜

[@doit9854]

Technically, the best way to hide a body is to ship it internationally with DHL, they'll lose it for you.

[@conorfitzmaurice8959]

Have you tried

[@vsanchez7158]

😂😂😂

[@doit9854]

@@conorfitzmaurice8959 of course not.

[@kathyclark8274]

LMAO 😝

[@adamaunya69]

Bruhhhhhhh

[@debbiemilam2204]

Excellent analysis of this fascinating case. Listen to the podcast Cold. It's the best I have heard. Thanks Dr Grande.

[@TerriLetitia85]

I wanna see Dr. Grande's blooper reel

[@bumbling_bee]

Yes! I've been waiting for the Dr to speak on this case!

[@mikederucki]

Listen to a podcast series about this called “cold” by KSL news.

[@Glorindellen]

Cold is definitely the #1 source for info on the case.

[@seahawksfan7298]

Yes, COLD Is an excellent piece of journalism covering this case!

[@Glorindellen]

@@seahawksfan7298 I had the opportunity to collaborate with Dave Cawley on another cold case as it finally broke, I'd been trying to talk him into doing a podcast on the murder of the mother of an old school chum. Nearly 10 years to the day of the murder, police announced they had arrested a guy who confessed after being confronted with his DNA coming back as a match. So I messaged Dave and told him that the guy arrested, his father was also from the old neighborhood and together we untangled the story. Turns out Dave also lived in the neighborhood when he left college, so we were having some pretty surreal moments. I'm still waiting to see what exactly led the police to him, I had talked to the detective 4 months prior to the arrest about a couple of tips after studying the profile from the VIdoq Society coupled with my local knowledge. I know it wasn't my tip directly, but it did give the detective a couple of different avenues of investigation.

[@marys3127]

One of the best podcasts I have ever heard, along with the one about the Kristin Smart murder case, “Your Own Backyard.”

[@Glorindellen]

@@marys3127 I'll have to check out the Kristin Smart one.

[@aprilread6620]

This case is absolutely devastating. Thank you for giving your thoughts!

[@amateur_artist6057]

It's hard for me to understand why they couldn't keep those little boys away from him. It breaks my heart

[@carolecompton9270]

At that time...Josh had supervised visits with his two little boys...Josh had rented that house, so the boys could come to that house for supervised visits... That is when Josh planed to end their lives...All 3 of them... 🌷

[@amateur_artist6057]

@@carolecompton9270 I know, and I understand the supervised visitation but knowing he was under suspicion for his wife's death makes me wish he had no visitation supervised or otherwise.

[@HoneySun16]

There is a whole channel dedicated to this case that is so good at detailing it. It’s called Cold Podcast

[@Babebubby]

OMG I can't believe you did this case! This one's always bothered me, almost as much as Chris Watts! You're right on target! 😉

[@GenXhorseGirl]

There is a podcast "COLD" which provides every tiny detail in the case.

[@PrivateAckbar]

I'd like to hear your thoughts on the personalities involved in the Steven Stayner abduction. His problems readjusting are heartbreaking.

[@marys3127]

Great suggestion!

[@Anon_E_Muss]

That poor kids parents were something else, boy......

[@hayleighmorgans]

I requested this, thank you 😊

[@emilywilson2084]

Thank you for this Dr Grande!!! I’ve wanted your analysis for years, you never disappoint!

[@samum5856]

I have seen a lot of material on this case, but never have I heard or read that a neighbor heard “get in the car” and a woman replying “no, you will hurt me if I do.” Dr. Grande, could you provide the source?

[@blurrylights6344]

I would be interested in that too. I used to really appreciate his content but that has gone down considerably since I realized that he gets most of his background from Wikipedia. There's nothing wrong with that but I can just read the Wikipedia article myself. This video for example is slightly longer than 15 minutes but the first 11 just tells you what the Wikipedia article says. I am sure he has the resources you are asking for. I'm not saying he is dishonest at all. I would prefer a balance where he gave the greater amount of time to his analysis rather than the background which anyone can look up in Wikipedia.

[@sueyardley7489]

Ann Rule's book describes that event.

[@jeandixson5610]

Where the hell did that come from?

[@jeandixson5610]

@@sueyardley7489 thank you, one more way police covered up incompetent behavior

[@Moodtoodrude]

It's so odd to hear you speak about cities close to me. Another great one Dr. Grande! 👌

[@johnfw1973]

I remember hearing about this case. It's very sad with a tragic outcome. Almost all the cases that involve people who are members of the lds are very disturbing. 😥

[@danithompson1693]

New subscriber. I have been listening to Dr. Grande for hours today and am thrilled to know I have many more hours to catch up on.

[@dawnchorus7167]

I'd like to know what is in that plant table drawer. More plants perhaps?

[@craigryan5290]

Your analysis was helpful in furthering my understanding of that case. You alway are well researched.

[@stt5v2002]

Raising your children in religious institutions leaves them very vulnerable to the other manipulators and con men.

[@yamaha5647]

100%

[@Irunwithscissors63]

Raising your children in any abusive situation leaves them vulnerable to other manipulators and con men. Many a time it’s single parents that take up with new controlling, jealous boyfriends.

[@jeandixson5610]

Ya think?

[@user-ic9qm8mb4t]

Especially LDS