Tokarev TT M57 vs. Colt 1903: Which Is the Best Pistol?

[@raymondhouser5174]

If you use eastern bloc 7.62x25 military surplus ammo, it is much hotter, as it was used in sub machine guns. Almost all commercial loadings are a bit more gentle for pistols.

[@DirkDiggler6903]

You are correct sir, military arms channel has a video, where surplus defeated level 3 body armor.

[@SB-mw1bg]

I'd love to see the 32ACP come back in a bigger way, especially for pocket carry. I have yet to shoot the Beretta Tomcat, that certainly is a gun on my list to get.

[@Gunlands]

It certainly looks interesting. Apparently there is also a suppressed version.

[@robertrobert7924]

The original 7.65 Browning/32 acp bullet was .312 inches in diameter. Modern US made 32 acp bullets are only .308 inches in diameter, so they are not accurate in my 1903 Colt or my 7.65 Mauser pistols. I reloaded .312 Hornady jacketed bullets for these pistols and they were very accurate @25 yards.

[@SB-mw1bg]

@@robertrobert7924 interesting

[@SB-mw1bg]

I'd like to get my hands on an old PPK chambered in 7.65.

[@robertrobert7924]

@@SB-mw1bg I have a C&R Walther PP in 7.65. I believe it was a Wet German Police pistol from 1970. It would not chamber the reloads I made using the Hornady .312 bullet. It will chamber the .32 acp factory loads with the .308 bullet, but is not accurate @25 yds. It has moderate accuracy @12 yds, which for me is very disappointing.

[@gfhfmf]

Russia: Maybe USA made world's first computer but we, created "COPY" and "PASTE"... Lol

[@DeanAWhite-gr8eo]

I'd like to see another test of the Tokarev TT under the conditions that it was designed for. I'd also be happy to hear if you have identified the reason for the many jams in that one particular pistol that gave you trouble in this test. The Tokarev is a good, solid design that served very well, for a very long time, as the military sidearm for several nations. Poor designs seldom serve long as military firearms. The Tokarev has stood the test of time, and has shown a remarkable record of strong, reliable service and good performance in the field.

[@Gunlands]

We haven't confirmed what the issue was, but most likely it's the spring. Tried to order one from Zastava but they cancelled our order lol. We will try again. If you have any suggestions on what could be done better as far as testing please let us know!

[@DeanAWhite-gr8eo]

@@Gunlands Okay, not to be "Captain Obvious" here, but old pistols tend to have old magazines. magazines are easily damaged, and sometimes old magazines can be cracked, dented, have bent or worn feed lips, or seriously weakened springs. So, have you tried the magazine from the fully functional pistol in the malfunctioning pistol? This is my go-to check for malfunctions with any box fed semi-auto rifle or pistol, and probably 95% of the time solves the problem. A penetration test with ballistic gel, and/or wet clay against the .32 ACP might demonstrate better what the 7.62X35 is truly capable of, rather than a simple go/no-go with body armor plates. I won't ask for a durability test, the Tokarev TT proved its durability many years ago. Thanks for the quick replies. Best of luck with the malfunctioning TT, and best regards to you. Dean

[@Gunlands]

@@DeanAWhite-gr8eo Thanks, those are very reasonable suggestions and we'll definitely keep them in mind for the future. As for the magazines, we tried different variations of swapping the originals as well as using brand new aftermarket ones with the same results, hence why we're leaning towards a recoil spring malfunction.

[@DeanAWhite-gr8eo]

@@Gunlands I'm sorry my suggestion was of no use to you. It would seem very likely that you do need a new recoil spring, since the magazine isn't the issue. You mentioned that Zastava had canceled your order for a new one, perhaps you may find one at Numrich Arms/Gun Parts Corp. Wolfe Springs is another possible source of a spring for this pistol. It would be a shame to see this old war horse put out to pasture, or cannibalized for parts, for lack of a recoil spring. Best Regards, Dean

[@Gunlands]

@@DeanAWhite-gr8eo We'll definitely get it working. Thanks again!

[@alancranford3398]

IN 1983 I tested a 9mm Parabellum pistol (a Beretta 82SB) with Geco 124 grain FMJ on a Level I body armor panel. I started at ten feet and fired three shots--I wanted to make sure that I hit. Level I isn't supposed to stop 9mm, but two out of three lodged in the armor and the third penetrated the thick stack of paperbacks I had taped to the armor panel. I had to reset the target with each shot. So I moved the test panel out to 75 feet and fired five carefully aimed shots--the target didn't move. I thought I had missed until I examined the armor--all five bullets had sailed through the armor panel and through the books without disturbing the target. Was my bullet not fully stable at the closer range? It was a surprise to find that at close range Class I armor was bullet resistant against a caliber that it wasn't rated for. Perhaps if the vest was out at 25 yards the Tokarev would have punched through the Class II armor panel. I'm not surprised that there were more TT pistols made than Colt M1903. Look up production levels for the French-issue Ruby pistols. There's a reason why gun makers seek military contracts--really big orders.

[@Gunlands]

Definitely something to consider for another test in the future. There are some things we would do differently for sure.

[@derfaschist9687]

The sound of tokarev is extremely beautiful. The loud and lovely sound.

[@vladimirm8719]

Love the M57! Would love to see you try other TT ammo on the plates.

[@Gunlands]

Yes, great handgun! Probably going to do another video on it in the future.

[@gregwillis7767]

Try a Wolfe spring kit on the one that jammed. May not be the only problem, but would be an easy fix if it is.

[@Gunlands]

Thanks! We too had a strong suspicion that it was the spring.

[@gregwillis7767]

@@Gunlands Even if that's not THE problem, at least the sidearm will be running at "full capacity". Military arms were produced at a high rate, and the same pistol during peacetime was the same production mentality. At least one doesn't hit 2 inches left and the other 3 inches high. 😁

[@Gunlands]

@@gregwillis7767 Makes sense.

[@badas45]

7.62x25 is a very interesting cartridge

[@Gunlands]

For sure!

[@billfoster213]

You can also try a CZ52 pistol with the roller locked breech for the true power of the 7.62x25. I also have a Colt .32 model 03. It is from 1916.

[@Gunlands]

Definitely an interesting looking gun. And it looks like its still pretty affordable!

[@billfoster213]

@@Gunlands they have a unique mechanism, and the recoil is fairly impressive compared with a .32 blowback like the Colt. It's just a weird looking gun in general. Mine is fun to shoot.

[@bernhardseidel934]

Tokarev factory ,and military ammunition has velocity from 1250ft/second to.1800 fps! Which one was used? It makes a hell of a difference !

[@Gunlands]

Good question. We used the Serbian PPU, which according to their specs has 1720 FPS muzzle velocity.

[@robertrobert7924]

No wonder it would be extremely dangerous to shoot 7.62 Tokarov in a 7.63 C96 Mauser.

[@scottdunn2178]

We fired my brothers ChiCom Tokarev with 7.63 Mauser rounds when I was a kid... we didn't know any better and I'm still here to tell the tale 👍

[@robertrobert7924]

@@scottdunn2178 It is safe to shoot 7.63 Mauser ammo in a 7.62 Tokarov. Just not the other way around.

[@scottdunn2178]

@@robertrobert7924 Thankfully we didn't find that out the hard way...

[@walczyc9572]

Here before this channel blows up!

[@Gunlands]

Haha, thanks for your support and optimism!

[@josiahhayes4903]

How can you even compare the 7.62 x 25 mm Tokarev, which is a very powerful round, to the 7.65 mm Browning (.32 ACP)? Of course the Tokarev wins, there is no question about that.

[@Gunlands]

We weren't trying to simply compare them based on the power of their rounds (which is a no-contest as you have pointed out), but more as overall package in light of their similar origins. We wouldn't say that we would take the Tokarev over the Colt every single time just because of power, it really all depends on the situation.

[@sulaco2122]

The "bulge" on the back of the armor is called back face deformation and usually about 2inches of bulge is considered acceptable.

[@Gunlands]

Good to know. It looked like it was more than one on the Level II plate though.

[@atharvatoskar1633]

In india licensed Gun owner are preferring 7.62x25 tt on .32 ACP which is non-prohibited bore round made by Indian ordnance factories. 7.62x25TT ammo is available only imported

[@Gunlands]

Interesting fact!

[@mkshffr4936]

For me the big issue is the safety mechanisms. I am familiar with the 1/4 cock system and it appears to be effective. I am not familiar with the Colt. Not a fan of hammerless designs in general but an effective safety goes a long way towards making them at least acceptable.

[@nolagospeltracts8264]

I saw a Colt 1903 in pawn shop today for $599. Looked liked it's been sitting in the bottom of an ocean for 100 years so I didn't buy it. But I'm thinking of going back.

[@Gunlands]

Lol, you might want to check out gunbroker first. You may be able to get one in much better condition for the same price, or slightly higher.

[@nolagospeltracts8264]

@@Gunlands yeah, That's what I've been doing. I've also been looking for a CZ 83 in 32 ACP and I found one on line for $424 but I'm not sure if I trust the website. Know anything about MaxArms?

[@dlife7427]

The Colt 1903 can be brought back to life from any condition. There's plenty of parts available as well.

[@DougHinVA]

So explain why the gunshots are suppressed to be nearly no sound at all ?

[@Gunlands]

Gunshot is too loud for the mic, so it filters it.

[@red9man2130]

This is NOT an entirely fair comparison! The TOK should be compared with a 1903 BROWNING 9MM LONG cartridge pistol sold to SWEDEN I believe.

[@Gunlands]

You might be right, but this is what we had available. Would be great to have an arsenal one day big enough to select the best match though :)

[@wolfgangemmerich7552]

This swedish ,, Browning" was made by Husquarna!

[@MrHrKaidoOjamaaVKJV]

The interwar Estonian military also purchased 1903 FN pistols in the 9mm Long caliber. They came in parts and were put together at Estonian National Arsenal Tallinn. Which also produced a submachine gun the M23 in the same 9mm Long caliber. In 1935, the FN 1903 pistol was replaced with the FN M35 ( Browning High Power pistol) in the 9x19 Parabellum caliber. The M23 SMG in 9mm Long was replaced in 1938 with the Finnish Suomi KP31 SMG in the 9x19 Parabellum.

[@jackbarnard1781]

Oh... Those ww2 era firearms. Love em. I have a Italian beretta m1934. Manufactured 1941. Mine participated in the invasion of crete. Operation mercury. Italian paratroopers folgore unit. Oh.. The caliber is .380.

[@Gunlands]

That sounds like an amazing piece of history!

[@zdravkonovosel122]

Which is the better? You're joking right? M57 7,62x25 Tokarev of course!! Amen 😎💪💪

[@mefirst5427]

I think Tokarev copied FN 1903/07 and Colt 1911 more than the Colt 1903

[@MrHrKaidoOjamaaVKJV]

The Tokarev TT33 and the Yugoslavian M57 are favorite pistols of mine. I carried my personal privately owned Soviet TT33 pistol, while I was in the Estonian Defense Forces Army Military Police, back in the early 1990's such was allowed for personal and unit collective security. My experiences with the TT33 are really that the TT33 is even in some ways superior to the Browning M1911. As the TT33 has a better,superior simplier one unit hammer/ firing pin that is easily removable and offers easy concealability of the handgun.

[@oubliette862]

when I use 2 guns I fire them simultaneously and always get better results.

[@Gunlands]

Good to know!

[@DeanAWhite-gr8eo]

Not to disrespect the Tokarev round, BUT I'd damn sure rather have a RELIABLE pistol to one that jams! As for why more were produced? the very EASY answer is, that it was a military issued battle pistol, not an early semi-auto design for civilian use. Of course more were produced. Why am I not surprised that the 7.62X25 didn't penetrate the body armor? It was designed in a day when it needed to penetrate a uniform, perhaps a heavy coat. Why would it be over designed when what's most necessary is fast and economical production? It becomes very apparent that Soviet Era mythology is just BS, not fact.

[@wolfgangemmerich7552]

Last week i got a very impressiv video from a ukrainian soldier! He and most of his comrades wearing TT-33`s in 7.62 X 25 . This Guy fired serval rounds on a captured russian body armor incl. steelplate insert from 25m distance and all bullets was abel to penetrade this russian body armor.

[@DeanAWhite-gr8eo]

@@wolfgangemmerich7552 Is there any chance that you can post this video? I'd be interested to see the results, and to see what the quality of the "Russian Body Armor" is. Regards.

[@kenstewart7700]

Obviously the TT wins it’s a better caliber was pretty much the best around until the .357 was introduced comparing this to .32 acp is dumb though 9mm would be a better opponent

[@Gunlands]

Well, our aim was not to simply compare the rounds, as that would be a no contest. We tried to compare two guns because of their similar design origins, and aside from the cartridge we wanted to look at performance. In our cases the TT ended up jamming quite a bit, if you saw towards the end, plus the Colt felt better made overall and was more accurate. Personally, can't say that we would choose one over the other every single time, as each has its pros and cons.

[@تحسينالزهيري-ض9ص]

Good

[@borisgorin1170]

Tokarov was actually designed after the 1911 colt not the 1903 colt 😬

[@VerbalAssault360]

I guess he is saying look wise. The Tokarev also looks like The FN 1900.

[@ElCineHefe]

In Russian, they call the Tokarev, "Pizda." I guess that means pistol?

[@MrRedeyedJedi]

I'd love a tt43 and would pay good money for one

[@A.L.I.E.N.6.6.6.]

It not a TT

[@spetsnaz600]

It is, just not a TT33. It’s an M57, same design, essentially the same gun.

[@ستايلقديم-م9ك]

✌️ TOKAREV /57m

[@wolfgangemmerich7552]

@@spetsnaz600 Even the egyptians made this gun in similar cal. ... remebering this gun was made under the name Tokagypt .

[@android3183]

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