Top 10 Advanced Two-Player Games

[@Zarfin]

for me the invisible middle list would be the most interesting one

[@speedandstyletony]

And with the most entertaining banter!

[@whatsontheboard750]

Please make a middle list….and all according to the bgg scale.

[@JJ_TheGreat]

It looks like Tom just made the middle list today :-)

[@mydemon]

I agree.

[@aronkleinsasser970]

I second this

[@montagen8084]

Absolutely do NOT STOP being "mean" to each other. You are not "mean", you are teasing. It's the banter and back-and-forth that makes these videos so entertaining.

[@mydemon]

Sometimes Zee 'teasing' Mike is bordering on elderly abuse tho lol

[@rhino2218]

Mike is such a fantastic addition. Love the chemistry you guys have

[@dansimmons2095]

I would dare to say he takes the show to a new level. If only they had a curmudgeon from Huddersfield to give a counterpoint to some of these picks.

[@SimplicitySingularity]

@@dansimmons2095 Now, as of 10/2/2023 he seems to be gone.

[@dansimmons2095]

@@SimplicitySingularity WHAT??????

[@speedandstyletony]

" I know two things, this game is heavier than you think it is and these pretzels are of the devil!" - Zee

[@crystalpawlowski4260]

A mid-weight two-player game list would be super useful. Please do!

[@MarcTelesha]

I have a friend that makes all down time to be double or tripled just by his addition to any game. I need a medium weight 2 player game.

[@luckbfern]

I’m loving all the banter! So much fun.

[@GGdeTOURS37]

For me it's star wars REBELLION the best ever for 2 players!

[@Noonycurt]

Did Zee mutter "Spoilers!" when Mike said that everyone knows that Abraham Lincoln was assassinated?! *lol*

[@ColZep]

Where? Lol

[@go_golden]

​@@ColZep 2 years late, but for posterity's sake: 36:30

[@nathalievazquez4708]

I've seen this video a few times now. I wait to forget and relisten to it in the background. The pretzel bits are the best part. 😂

[@jdtyler7]

You guys are not too mean at all. We can tell it's all in jest. It's great chemistry!

[@MrPigpom]

Get meaner! Back to the Sam heeley level! Lol!

[@FFKAK]

I’m with you Zee, Everdell is great at 2.

[@runwin3]

Yep, I agree with Zee. The combination of having a few long-term goals to try to achieve, along with maximizing resources and utilizing the card draw and “conversion to resource” spaces to filter through the deck for what you need makes this adorable game one of our favorites at 2 players. Not to mention the immersion, theme, and flavor. You feel like you are a part of your little city and can be proud of it.

[@Atlas-FM8]

Tom should do a top 10 video for his invisible two player games.

[@StabGR]

He might have already done it!

[@thedicetower]

Or is going to!

[@florianstock376]

You just cant see it - it is as invisible as the games.

[@mattvucu6706]

Kick out mike and put in Roy…. And then have mike and Roy both do a really actually truly advanced game list

[@JJ_TheGreat]

He just did it yesterday! :-)

[@Crs9072]

You should really change the background graphics for the slides. The Dice Tower background is so busy looking that the game images are hard to differentiate from background image.

[@tawnyarasmussen1965]

Agree!

[@JonReid01]

Eh to me "busy" is their design language and I'm happier since I just accepted it 🤣

[@rpiazza72]

@@JonReid01 join the resistance brother!!

[@arekkrolak6320]

if you can improve something easily then why not? :)

[@mydemon]

You're right it's nuts

[@dnaseb9214]

Favorite style of videos.

[@MerrillWhiteKalEl]

Roy is correct - Star Wars Rebellion should be here.

[@hucz]

The theme is too divisive, I personally am not a Star Wars fan so I will never play it.

[@mylor1066]

If Sam was around it would be on the list. Such a great game.

[@JB-ym4up]

War of the ring felt quite similar to rebellion. One of them should have been on a list.

[@ezunino1711]

Aeons End is Amazing with two!

[@guillermoz4914]

List like these really need honorable mentions in no specific order. I’m always looking for 2-4 player games that play well with 2 ! 🙌🏽😊

[@jr637-1]

Have you tried Azul at 2? I almost prefer it at 2, and BGG seems to agree.

[@ogreman2229]

1:05:20 Zee mentions the duel decks which are no longer sold. For a new player intimidated by the deck building I highly suggest grabbing 2 of the pre made decks from Card Kingdom. They are inexpensive and in my experience extremely balanced with each other.

[@JonReid01]

Pioneer/Standard Challenger decks are also decent, but they seemed to have stopped that as of 2022 as well

[@Jesus.the.Christ]

Quantum Mechanics is not a groups of people that work with subatomic particles. Mechanic is a perfectly fine word to describe what you're calling a mechanism. Both work.

[@codykunka5558]

Thanks for the video! Your interactions are fun :). Just a feedback: Some of us only play at 2 players so would still be interested in games that play great at 2 even if they play the same or slightly better at higher counts. So excluding those from a list like this can make those types of games hard to find.

[@jdotco23]

I feel the opposite. In fact, going off your idea, I'd rather them make a whole list of games that can play more than two players, but plays best at two players.

[@BeyondTheLineProductions]

I agree

[@susannemke]

Race for the galaxy should definitely be on this list

[@revimfadli4666]

But it's not 2-player only? Though the 2p variant feels more strategic with its higher degree of control

[@slowmodeproductions]

I'm very surprised War of the Ring wasn't on anyone's list. That game is absolutely incredible. But to each their own! I'd also have Sekigahara, Hands in the Sea and Polis on my list.

[@drstclair]

I know it's been replaced by Battle of the Five Armies for Tom. Zee doesn't like long games. And make doesn't tend to like wargames.

[@msa4998]

You are 1000% correct. I am not surprised that not very many heavier war games showed up … was glad to see Tom put TS in, however. I almost wish they would have just excluded heavy war games as part of the criterion.

[@corssobv]

Sam is not there thats why :D

[@Skarpo89]

I thought the same thing! Such an awesome game

[@WanderingKumquat]

Sounds like a Roy game

[@codym6376]

Waiting for the “Top Ten Intermediate 2 Player Games”

[@emeralddream5965]

As a Tolkien fan I would add: - War of the Ring - Hunt for the Ring I want to mention Star Wars: Rebellion as well. Although not being into SW I enjoyed that solid and engaging game.

[@dustinboatman6134]

Definitely The Battle of Five Armies too

[@kcw1879]

MAGE WARS! My all time favorite game, for 2 players yet. I just love it, never get tired of it, and it just disappeared suddenly.

[@DarthEd77]

Star Wars: Rebellion is the obvious missing one.

[@JB-ym4up]

Rebellion or war of the ring, one of them should have made the list.

[@altecapollyon]

I was shocked that Tom didn’t mention it.

[@DarthEd77]

@@altecapollyon I'm not really that surprised. Sam was really SW: Rebellion's champion at the Dice Tower.

[@nshaw1299]

guys, at the 6:57 mark, Mike's list is showing prematurely...

[@JustJoeBlogs]

Yeah looks like a classic case of premature dissemination.

[@boardgameknight2791]

Ha! Love the excitement of live streaming! Overall though, a really smooth performance from the DT team!

[@r.l.jeffries1091]

Roy is fired.

[@nshaw1299]

I like it, it's like an homage to 'fight club'

[@wroot_lt]

I love how you sneaked in food into videos :) Also, Gummy Bears from late 18 hundreds cracked me up :)

[@JamesD2957]

I love how the pretzels went from a distraction from mocking someone for saying something stupid to a punishment for saying something stupid

[@jmanjoshua1982]

I hope they make it an occasional thing. I might introduce this into my games when everyone gets together again.

[@joelbloch08]

Spirit Island plays really well at 2.

[@ezunino1711]

I mean is there any other way to play it 😂

[@bensdecoy7871]

I am committed to staying incorrect on the mechanic/mechanism divide because in my head a mechanic is a broad category while a mechanism is an individual rule. For example in D&D the act of healing a character is a mechanic but healing surges specifically are a mechanism.

[@conillet]

Mike is spot on about "Blue Moon". This game is not only excellent, but if you want to play all those different factions well it definitely becomes an "advanced" challenge.

[@tonygilbert5256]

I keep bouncing between these two-player game top ten lists, but what I really want to see is either a top ten or even a top five cooperative two-player games. Yeah, I know there isn't a lot to choose, but I am curious in what order they would come in for people at the Dice Tower.

[@Serpenzeye]

I agree! I was looking for such a list when I discovered this video.

[@SanswayNuna]

I want to chime in about Everdell. My boyfriend and I always played 2 players on all games until just recently (When we found more BGGs in our area). Everdell is great at 2 (Especially if you never knew you were supposed to use less forest locations at that player count :D). To answer Mike's question, I don't think the lower player count means you're struggling to find cards. IT just means you have to be more flexible in your strategizing. You can't just decided to do a farm/husband/wife every game. You have to be willing to try to win in other ways. I find it to be more relaxing and you can focus on building your city to the best of your ability, rather than struggling with the other players so directly all the time

[@Picosaurus]

0:31, the eyebrows of judgment from Mike.

[@MichaelJones-yp8gj]

I would really like to see a video with the invisible medium list!

[@kyleskayman5309]

Thank you for mentioning Wildlands! I love this game and have gone deep into every expansion, but nobody knows about it (or so it seems)!

[@athanasiospetsas9367]

Battlelore second edition is my favorite advanced 2-player game! Second comes Star Wars Rebellion! But I like all those picks you mention :)

[@gamera2351]

Before even watching the video, my first thought was Star Wars: Rebellion. Second thought was War of the Ring. Im shocked it wasn't on anyone's list.

[@inezkestens5561]

I haven't heard Grand Austria Hotel? or is that too medium? :D

[@sabrinav]

1. A Feast for Odin (definetaly best at 2) 2. Ark Nova (wasn't out when you made the video) 3. Paladins of the West Kingdom 4.7 Wonders Duel 5. Castles of Burgundy 6. Gloomhaven (you need to play 2 characters each) 7. Welcome to / Welcome to the moon 8. Summoners war 9. Tainted grail 10. Hoplomachus

[@TorIverWilhelmsen]

They used to make a simplified introductory version of M:tG called _Portal_ but it seems to have been discontinued ages ago.

[@Deabru3]

Jokes aside, I think all of us met the same conclusion: we want that middle level or NEXT STEP games top ten for 2 players.

[@bceagles99holla]

I like Res Arcana at 2

[@robertbouley7697]

So solid. 👍🏻

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

I have never played Everdell. I'm waiting for my all-in from the last Kickstarter.

[@codym6376]

Played it once but also eagerly awaiting my KS copy to arrive!

[@JJ_TheGreat]

I am with you, too!

[@mikemudrow]

Are you in for a treat! It's a fantastic game.

[@moozarger190]

Top 10 games turned into card games could be a good list

[@andymcguire237]

Surprised Zee didn't put Imperial Settlers: Empires of the North on here. It's absolutely best as a 2-player game.

[@mystic839]

Most of Tom's games are my favorite games ever but I just can't find anyone to play with anymore.

[@cay6857]

I do think a top ten medium level would be great. It would help people like me who are ready to move on from casual games but not quite comfortable with advanced games yet.

[@garyfaust6769]

Thanks for your thoughts. I would include Star Wars X-wing, Star Wars Rebellion, Original Mr. Jack, and Grizzled,.

[@MathMagicianSam]

I love the dynamic just like it is :)

[@manzell]

In Twilight Struggle, to even sniff competitive play you need to know every card, almost every edge-case interaction, and /when/ your opponent holds each card.

[@EarnestWilliamsGeofferic]

Blue Moon Legends is easily in my top 10. Of course, I think 8 of my top 10 or Knizia.

[@jianpanglam570]

2 player Mombasa for me, hands down, at 2 players the rules give each player one more worker, and oh my god it is SUCH A BEAUTIFUL FORWARD PLANNING GAME. I had it different because I purchased it during the pandemic and I played it as 2 player first with my wife and was completely blown away at how beautifully challenging it was, then played it the first time with 4 players and realised it was a completely different game at 2 because you totally plan your future moves according to what you think the 2nd player will play. So intense

[@mikemudrow]

Unforgiven is excellent. Great pick, Mike! This was one of the most hilarious lists you guys have done in a while, and I loved it. Thanks!

[@sarumon17]

I honestly love terraforming Mars with 2 players. Obviously it’s still great at 3, but 2 is really good

[@joshjenson8111]

Its not good at any player count because its not a good game #overrated

[@dallastexas5653]

I need to go ahead and start purchasing some of these. Then all I’ll need is a second player.

[@GTRichardson7]

Tom its not "Top 10 Middle of the road 2 player games" its "Top 10 Middle Weight 2 Player Games" and you should do it!

[@namethem00]

I'd like a middle list!!

[@evandercaldwell9993]

This is one of the most interesting Top 10's ever, with a few interesting and exciting games I've never heard of (I'm quite new to boardgaming) Thank You for sharing!! 🙏

[@Bieranti]

I would add some of the Stronghold 2nd Edition games, only two, is quite advanced and cherish multiple plays with same opponent.

[@francescodefilippis9384]

Android netrunner and star wars rebellion for confrontational strict two player games, and aeon's end for cooperative games, playable by more but best count at two.

[@kellinwinslow1988]

Good show as always guys. One of my favorite advanced two player games is still Star Trek Frontiers. I think it flows better and plays a bit better than Mage Knight and I even like it more than a real two player game like Star Trek Fleet Captains. Plus it feels like older Trek,ie anything that isn't made by Kurtzman and Secret Hideout,and that's a good thing. You can play it with up to 5 but 2 plays best I've found. Otherwise Arkham Horror LCG can be pretty interesting and games like Sword And Sorcery or even Gloomhaven work well as two player games also. Your milage may vary. Lol.

[@TheJharland]

"Yeah, 40%." "Have a pretzel..." lol too funny, love it guys!

[@magehammerChad]

Mechanics is correct as Tom conceded (see ‘quantum mechanics.’ That has nothing to do people who fix cars. And that term has been around for decades). It seems that those who come from an RPG / MtG background seem to say ‘mechanics,’ and those who say ‘mechanisms’ come from board games. But ‘mechanisms’ works as well, (though it makes me cringe every time you guys say it). However, when I hear ‘mechanisms’ I think of machines or contraptions (the game Mousetrap does use mechanisms) just as Tom thinks of people who fix cars. I purpose a new word to put this ‘controversy’ to rest: Mechanix. Pronounced ‘mech-a-nix.’ Ok. I feel better I got that off my chest.

[@gustavk962]

Mage Knight, Twilight struggle, Through the ages, 1989... Insane that none was mentioned.

[@arthurdent9281]

Twilight Struggle definitely was.

[@JorWat25]

Twilight Struggle is at 48:33. Insane you didn't notice.

[@MsGinahidesout]

I LOVE Everdell!! And I think it's best at 2 players (although I do like it solo as well)

[@jimalexander687]

Star Wars Rebellion, Dice Masters, Combat Commander Europe/Pacific/Mediterranean, Twilight Struggle. Four of my top seven games are two-player games.

[@misomiso8228]

5:30 the app is actually fantastic for Twilight Struggle. It's one of the best implemented board games i've seen online. Just play some matchmade games and you start to get used to it. it's actually better than playing in real life as it takes away all the set up time, and the app is better at tracking things.

[@msa4998]

Correct!

[@ilqrd.6608]

if only it wouldn’t take the AI forever to „think“ about their turn

[@misomiso8228]

@@ilqrd.6608 Honestly it's much better just playing against people. It's quicker and the games will be more interesting.

[@Daliman13]

@@misomiso8228 It is certainly not quicker, but once you know what you're doing the AI is no competition at all. I would rate the AI as ~800 in the TS ELO system

[@chrismichael9556]

Great video. I watch tons of board game content and you guys somehow make talking about boardgames actually entertaining. This is not achieved so easily so kudos. You guys shoulda been school teachers ! I mean that as a compliment. 😀

[@thedicetower]

All three of us WERE school teachers.

[@combusticator]

To each their own, I'm surpised Of all 30 games listed, War of the Ring, Star Wars Rebellion or Forbidden Stars (that one being best imo with 2) didn't make the list. Star Wars Armada is another on my list, but I didn't expect them to list it.

[@damjanm5557]

SW Rebellion, War of the Ring, X-wing, Battlelore 2nd ed, Netrunner

[@mattvucu6706]

How many players do you play 51st State with Zee? I love 2

[@r.l.jeffries1091]

Duel of Ages is a battle royale, before "battle royale" as a video game concept even existed.

[@mitsakosL]

Underwater cities, paladins of the west kingdom and aeon's end would definitely make my list.

[@irrevenant3]

This is probably in the comments somewhere but I can't see it, so: The rook in chess is from the Persian 'rukh' meaning chariot. For some reason it got turned into a tower at some point but the way it moves makes a lot more sense if you think of it as a chariot...

[@justmakingthistoreply5085]

Did Hive not make any list?

[@maxv658]

I'm realizing I really don't play many advanced 2-player games. 7 Wonders: Duel is probably my favorite right now, but I would honestly consider that pretty casual. Maybe middle-weight at most.

[@CaptainGamer347]

Duelosaur Island FTW! Nice pick, Mike!

[@hovistocose...5075]

did anybody review the new edition of lewis and clark with the new rules that shorten the lenght ???

[@pwootton24]

Dice Tower singing the Marine Corps Hymn?! That’s all I need.

[@Veldryn17]

Surprised Arkham LCG isn't on Zee's list

[@Icy_Sparks]

He plays it solo only. That's why it's not on the list I think.

[@xobxob]

I was expecting to see Fields of Arle, Race for the Galaxy and Imperium: Classics/Legends. Especially Fields of Arle which feels like the quintessential advanced two player worker placement game.

[@adamtorkelson8272]

Alex, the dice tower is not really keen on euros. Especially heavy ones. The dice tower is 99% an ameritrash reviewer and recommendation channel. Fortunately, there are other channels that can review and recommend euros.

[@judaschh]

@@adamtorkelson8272 which channels is that? Just curius

[@adamtorkelson8272]

@@judaschh Rahdo regularly puts out videos with strictly Euro recommendations (several "best of" lists), even ones concerning heavy euros. And when he reviews them one at a time with their own video, he is usually a little more fairer with his assessments, IMO. He is a bit more informed with his opinions and also doesn't always resort to the same old "dry" or "feels like work" bit. Tom is a bit harder on euros than ameritrash. That's fine. We all have our preferences. The channel Heavy Cardboard does playthroughs of heavy euros and is an excellent channel to watch if you are looking to purchase one. They do several a week I believe and have hundreds in their archive. Great channel to look through.

[@eileenwood3119]

What about Dr. Finn's game Nanga Parbat? It is a clever little 2-player only game.

[@searose6192]

Zee's historical top 10 is the funniest thing on dice tower. If you haven't watched it....GO WATCH IT!

[@Specialist0815]

Again a great video. I really love to see le Havre in this list. What I was missing is Mage Knight. I consider it as a 2 player only game. I do not enjoy playing solo and with more than 2 it is not really enjoyable. But it is a great 2 player game (in co-op mode..)

[@writeheroics7490]

After Mike's #2, I think I need to pull that game off my shelf of shame.

[@ballzz2thewall]

Once you have played Watergate enough (we are talking 200 plus games) you will see its quite unbalanced (70-30 for Nixon)

[@josephbegin6074]

I like how pretzels became a punishment.

[@Polovene]

Mike quickly became the best reviewer: consistent, analytical, wide taste and expresses himself the best

[@Jonathan-ei7vp]

No Dice Throne on both of the two player lists?

[@aaronmoore54]

The invisible mid-level list.

[@namelessfire]

Any Top 10 where Tom gets triggered by Blue Moon is a good Top 10 😂

[@larshoffmann2594]

I got into Crystal Clans recently. It is 2 player only, but maybe fits the ominous middle list.

[@JohnSmith-pu3pm]

Duel of Ages II, Batman Matagot, but battlelore 1st ed for sure. 1st ed is so good.

[@mikoliko5657]

Stronghold undead should be on This list as Well as underwater City

[@joerihessels8230]

Stronghold & Imperial Struggle are missing ;)

[@Donaghwik]

Entertaining as always but Roy’s list should have been on there as it would have added so much to this list. Wildlands is far and away best at 4 IMHO. Personally Batman Gotham city chronicles and tyrants of the underdark are best a 2 players and would have made my list.

[@Henry-lk5pm]

Descent Legends of the Dark is great as a 2 player game because you can play with 1 character each, then play double handed as you become familiar with the system and each heroes abilities. Then go back to 2 characters or 3 if you want the quest to be a little quicker. Such a great system to allow you to enjoy and get to know all the characters during a campaign. Perhaps not a true “heavy” game (apart from the box). Would definitely put Arkham Horror LCG on this list though.

[@Chainey02]

There is ground penetrating radar. Incidentally one of it’s uses is finding dinosaur bones. Was shown on the movie Jurassic Park.

[@robertmiller6058]

Not a fan of 2-player games but, I'm watching the entire video just for the entertainment value of your pretzel provoking repartee. Also, Mike is a fantastic addition to the team...