TOP 5 WORST CLANS - Total War: Shogun 2!

[@robdean9216]

Me on Hattori: these guys look cool! Played 5 campaigns. Quit 5 times. Convinced I couldnt play SG2. First time I tried Shimazu, steamrolled Japan. Coudlnt agree more with the list.

[@maxmustermann-zx9yq]

Hattori with their free deployment are the strongest, you can take the capital at turn 0, look up legendoftotalwar's campaign, he is owning the shit out of the entire map

[@dgray3771]

Not just that, the provinces surrounding them have good forts. Lots of income with the ninja buildings. The problem with the Hattori is war with the Ikko and Oda early on. And you just can't field enough units. But if you can run the gauntlet you have a good chance at victory. Always play reserved with them. You don't need to rush it, and upgrade your ninja building line income and better ninjas to sabotage enemy armies. You'll never have to fight overwhelming odds. The problem with most players is they want it all straight forward. While the Hattori require their own play style.

[@maxmustermann-zx9yq]

the easy solution for legendary is riding around creating a ring of Vassals (yes you will have to help them, betray them or resurrect them) with that you stay in the game, develop a tight ring of strong provinces with elite armies with several maxed out generals

[@JuergenGDB]

I conquered more than half of Japan on my second try with Hattori. tru, Shimazu is extremely easier starting, but if you can make Hattori work, they are bad ass! Also the Chosokabe are great, you start with your own little Island after you take it.. fortify one side and advance to the Shimazu and take them out.. get the sea trade lanes and your rich.. continue to the Mori.. and by the time you get to Kyoto you are extremely powerful and wealthy.

[@DonPeyote420]

Shimazu had tactical advantage because they were on their separate island far to the East. This is why they're a multi-million corporation these days.

[@Snoogen11]

I'm actually surprised as Chosokabe being considered weak. I always thought they were the "beginner" clan, for people who aren't to confident in strategy games. Considering at least a third of most of armies are bow related that guarantees a bonus to approx 33% of your fighting force. They start on an island with only 1 enemy. Which can be conquered easily within 3 turns. Then another 3 settlements to grab, giving them stone, wood, and horses. Not to mention: if you're fast you can grab 3 of the western trading posts. At this point, you can choose literally anywhere in Japan to fight next, with enough money to field at least 5 samurai armies and still have koku to spare.

[@captainnyet9855]

I personally consider them to be one of the strongest factions (if not the outright strongest faction) in the game; they have a very safe starting position, Daikyu Samurai are in my opinion some of the best ranged units in the game (they're almost as good as bow monks at ranged combat but are cheaper, and being much better in melee lets you bring more per stack), thanks to Yari Wall you don't benefit from strong melee infantry nearly as much as you do strong archers. Increased income from farms also means you will always be able to field more armies and/or upgrade your towns faster. their starting island isn't amazing (bad farms, not the best resources) , but it's easy to secure the whole thing, and it is a perfect staging ground for invasions into the mainland from that point onward. It's also worth noting that archery and cavalry are researched alongside each other in the skill tree and your starting island has warhorse resource, you can get early access to some very strong cavalry units (which will beat unupgraded Takeda cav) while your archers are of superior quality to any other faction's (especially since you can get those 175m range Daikyu Samurai much earlier than other factions get their bow monks) Stacks of 70% Daikyu Samurai, 30%Yari Cav is very viable; you will be unmatched at range, buffed up Yari Cav can obliterate enemy cav and archers alike, and you can take out/rout most infantry before they make it into melee (especially if you properly harass them with the Yari Cav) this army composition is also nearly unbeatable in offensive sieges as they outrange most of the defender's archers. When you get too massively outnumbered it will obviously fail, but if you can easily support it with a locally recruited Yari Ashigaru stack. Oda got nothing on this.

[@jeffthemercenary]

For me the beginner clan is the Shimazu

[@IAmKnight8]

He didn't say they were weak though, just somewhere in the middle

[@thesurvivor75Ejercito]

@@jeffthemercenary Well they are the clan with the "best" samurai with katana , most look at them inmediately .

[@jeice13]

@@captainnyet9855 it seems like routing quickly is less reliable on higher difficulties due to morale buffs but having longer range on archers is incredibly useful as it allows you to consistently force the enemy to approach without needing gunpowder research or slow siege engines. Also bow ashigaru apparently have worse attacks than samurai of the same stats because armour pen is determined by unit tier not accuracy. I found ashigaru and katana samurai do a good job protecting the archers though

[@shinsenshogun900]

Top 5 Most Annoying AI Minor Clans - Total War Shogun 2 5. Hatakeyama (OP starting positions + never getting vassalized by having scattered provinces) 4. Ouchi & Amako (Traitors and Gold digging Mori targets) 3. Miyoshi (Naval Invasions and odd starting positions) 2. Imagawa (Tokugawa Masters and Triumviral Traitors, tbh) 1. Honma (Gold digging Naval Invaders) Probably my opinion so far in Shogun 2

[@STARS_Redfield]

What about Ikko Ikki ? :D

[@christopherjones5700]

You forgot the honma, ooh realm divide went off, *4 turns later* oh a full stack of 7 generals and a bazillion ashigaru because those inbred rice farmers hadnt left their island until now

[@ishiba100]

It's the number one on his list

[@totalwar1793]

The Amako always get large.

[@jamiesnack]

@@christopherjones5700 I got the other way around lol, got kicked off of the mainland as uesegi and now I'm a mysterious temple island full of death monks

[@RusskiBlusski]

Date are one of my favourite clans. Though I hate that they basically instantly rout anything they charge so you don't get much kills :(

[@richardkholin4243]

Same here, The Uesugi are my Fav Clans but... Due that they're Buddhist Clan... They cannot have an heir so... The Uesugi only have small amounts of general and province to take on the Whole Clan. And yes, their true strenght is Based on their monks only.... 😭

[@Khan-bm8ks]

Takeda is my favorite clan even tho I don't like playing cavalry that much, but Im getting used to it :D

[@urthofthenewsun8465]

Playing Date is pacifist mode because you scare off more people than you kill

[@daniellyons8433]

I live for routing, since realm divide my empire is stretched so thin, fighting armies many times the size of mine. I continually keep the wolves at bay by concentrating multiple units on individual ones and trying to rout them one by one. Ive one some pretty one sided battles due to this

[@jeffthemercenary]

Yea i aggre i have played with hattori and date and when the RD came in it became hell on earth

[@cielopachirisu929]

Poor Mori, seriously. “We have such cool ships!” *knock knock from the south* “Who’s there?” *”PORTUGAL and their Otomo buddies, who hate you”*

[@kagtkalem7115]

Mori can build nanban ships too.

[@MarvinT0606]

when the scumfuck Black Ship destroys two stacks of your expensive Bune fleet

[@kagtkalem7115]

@@MarvinT0606 Try using a nanban ship to bombard and lower their morale. Also using bomb kobaya's mines drop their morale too.

[@benerdick_cumberbiatch]

@@kagtkalem7115 Only if you turn Christian. Something I never do. Because Otomo already suit that role.

[@benerdick_cumberbiatch]

You know this actually happend historically. The Otomo got the Portuguese to bombard a Mori castle from their ships.

[@thaitotalwarob318]

I Agree. Agent trait should be plus 5 or 10% but 2 % is ridiculous.

[@alexerny5552]

Personally, I agree with that. If I could change something, though, clans with specific traits to agents would have an automatic increase (like +5%) to success chance, but then they gain +1% for every level they gain in campaign. Meaning if you can keep these guys alive, they get better and better (even more so than what they normally would)

[@ajohnymous5699]

I've never had much success with agents outside of Ninjas sabotaging, but with the AI never having money problems the most this does is waste my money to slow down their production of samurai. I usually play Shimazu or Hojo, with the Shimazu strategy being to beat the enemy clan's army in the field and overpowering their castles and the Hojo using artillery or bomber throwers to break gates and kill heavy units, and artillery to hit the enemy units as best I can while punching holes in their defenses as they're great for sieges but absolute shit in the field.

[@edwardmaginot]

You can tweak it with PFM, by creating a new mod to tweak or just edit the game files directly.

[@theREALChadsexinton]

It's a shame that Hattori is such a difficult clan to play with. When using mods that fix diplomacy and the Kiso Ninja bug, they can be the most fun clan to play with. Night battles are especially useful at picking off enemies when you're outnumbered.

[@jordancarl1895]

What are good mods for diplomacy?

[@theREALChadsexinton]

@@jordancarl1895 it’s called “Common sense diplomacy adjustments” on Steam. I also like to use the mod “Jaki’s Unique Factions.” I hope you enjoy them!

[@RocketHarry865]

If you are playing as Hattori and want to fix your early game finaical issue you should upgrade the Ninja specality building to Smuggling Networks. This gives you +1000 to wealth from commerce in the province and two extra xp levels to any ninja agents that were recruited. Best thing about smuggling networks is that you can get them rather early due to the required tech school of shinobi is an early chi tech requiring you only needing zen and todofuken and has low research time allowing you get it rather early. However you do need to first upgrade the Mountain Hideout to Burakumin village which costs 1250 koku and then you need to spend 4500 koku to upgrade the Burakumin village to the Smuggling network. So guess you may have to limit your army size for some time The most valuable province the Hattori need to get is the Kii province. It has very fertile soil and the ninja specality resource and with a level 2 settlement with a market and ninja building and a metsuke agent overseer you will quickly get a lot of money out of that province.

[@dgray3771]

Just grab all of the center provinces and turn it into a stronghold. You are bound to get attacked by the Iko. And if unlucky the Oda as well. Try to survive untill you have enough resources upgraded and maybe a harbor get you some oversees trade.

[@AquaticSkipper]

Adam Baker my brain ran out of oxygen trying to read that 20 line sentence, God damn dude punctuation!

[@RocketHarry865]

ok i am going to fix it.

[@kaleidoscope3234]

Or use only your ninja and go around assassinate everyone all the clan leader.

[@nicolapacella5966]

its also usefull to corrupt small armies of other factions during all the campaign to get rid of that ridicolous 25% cost

[@kazutama3902]

love this game. Whos playing in 2020? me yes Edit: wow you guys are amazing. I'm gonna continue play TWS2 in 2021!!

[@Akechi910]

Me too, Shogun2 for life!

[@No-ms3hj]

I've always wanted to and now there's a free to download and keep deal for a while

[@VeridarRasko]

Actually I play it from 1 year and I don’t want to stop myself to play it.

[@fergusonthereaver6686]

Who is genuinely the best clan i was thinking takeda but it just says that itll be hard to play as them and im knew to total war and my brother plays as the shimazu and i didnt wannna be them bc of this.. So any suggestions. My fav colors are also black and red so thats why i was thinking takeda. But if any one knows japan fedual history like the actual history. Could you by chance elaborate on all the clans and what they where like and truley known for though out history.

[@No-ms3hj]

@@fergusonthereaver6686 campaign wise, oda. PEASENT SUPREMACY

[@RolfHartmann]

I loved playing as the Chosokabe going Christian which allows you to have great gunpowder units while still getting a great archer unit (normally a role which is only filled by archer warrior monks). Their island starting position also makes the strong fleet an even larger advantage.

[@kinghosed4261]

The thing about Shogun 2 is that the units are very homogeneous. Because of this, the most important factors for a clan are starting position and clan traits. As evidenced by your placing of the Uesugi on this list. They have comparatively strong units, but not enough to overcome the more important disadvantages. The Oda, on the other hand, enjoy a both a strong starting position and great clan traits that make their ashigaru units overwhelmingly affordable and effective. Edit: When I say homogeneous I mean that pretty much every faction gets the same basic roster. In contrast to, say, Medieval II where rosters vary wildly based on the faction.

[@LordVader1094]

I initially read "overwhelmingly affordable and effective" as "overwhelmingly ADORABLE and effective" lmao

[@Monke-fj2qz]

Tokugawa’s hard starting position(at least to me) makes me really appreciate just how talented Tokugawa Ieyasu was.

[@something7609]

Well, Ieyasu survived because of Nobunaga. At the start of Shogun 2, I think it's the time that Ieyasu father give Oda his son to be a captive and make peace with Oda, because of his defeat while supporting his Imagawa liege. When Ieyasu came back to his home province, and take his father mantle, and after losing again when Imagawa decided to attack Kyoto via Owari, he immediately ally himself with Nobunaga and never betray him. He is a talented politician and tactical genius that after Nobunaga, Mitsuhide and Hideyoshi died, he immediately declared war against Mitsunari and win himself the shogunate throne

[@alexsempaiivankotpetrov8231]

Nobody: SG2 in the turn 2: Clan Destroyed... Tokugawa.

[@GeraltofRivia22]

Yep, pretty much exactly the same thing always happens.

[@rizalalbar]

Same with the Oda, which is Ironic, because three great unifier were from both of those clan.

[@boxcarz]

@@rizalalbar It's pretty 50/50 with the Oda tbh. And when they don't die, oh boy...

[@valiant8321]

Same lmao and they are my favorite

[@Naraku-no-Hana-WE]

Our rankings were pretty similar. I had Chosokabe and Otomo swapped at 5 and 6, and had Uesugi (8) with Hojo at #10. Chosokabe vs Otomo is obviously going to be a personal taste thing for everyone. I rate Hojo's starting position lower than you, considering they tend to face all the most powerful clans at their prime (Takeda, Oda, Date, sometimes Uesugi, Hatakeyama, Ikko Ikki and even Hattori as well) and their distance from many of the strategic resources. Yes, they start with smiths and border warhorses but it can take a while to actually acquire them. The first tradeable resource tends to be crafts 4 provinces away, and they are a fair distance from the rest. Uesugi gets a slight nod from me for having bonuses to warrior monks and being in an interesting starting position (even if it is one of the hardest). That said I agree you could easily place Uesugi, Hojo, and Mori in any order based on personal preference from #8-10. I even predicted the Hattori 12, Tokugawa 11 correctly though I was being partly sarcastic about it. Hattori's start position is arguably the hardest in the game and their clan "bonus" is the most crippling in Legendary. Still, Tokugawa don't really have a compelling argument in their favor so it's really up to how much you hate Hattori's starting position and clan bonus. Some people love their start, I'll admit there is some intrigue to it.

[@DEVAEGIR]

I actually rate the Otomo quite high, much higher than Chosokabe. This is partly because of personal preference (I like to use gunpowder quite a bit), but more objectively, because of starting position, as Kyushu is both extremely wealthy and can make you almost entirely self-sufficient resources-wise. It is also fairly easy to capture, the trade nodes are close and the Black ship is easy to capture almost as soon as it appears, and because you have very wealthy provinces, you can sustain the upkeep and (depending on the difficulty) also recruit at least two Nanban trade ships, keeping one near Satsuma and the other at the junction between the islands.

[@Naraku-no-Hana-WE]

Well as I said Chosokabe and Otomo are essentially interchangeable at around 5-6 based on personal tastes, but let me refute some of the arguments for Otomo. Starting position is the most quoted reason for why Otomo are a top 5 clan, but I would argue starting position goes entirely in favor of Chosokabe. The archery clan has arguably the easiest starting position in the entire game, they are never really threatened at any point in the early game. Only the Ikko Ikki (with smiths, crafts, wealth, and two chokepoint provinces) are arguably better, but the moment Ikko step out of their starting provinces their situation becomes much more vulnerable/volatile. After Chosokabe secure Shikoku they can expand in any direction they want, but the most obvious direction is into Kyushu. So they pretty quickly end up with the same powerbase as the Otomo/Shimazu, only difference is they get there with potentially two full stack armies, some trained monks, and only 2-3 clans to oppose them making Kyushu far easier to conquer. Otomo meanwhile begin the game surrounded by enemies who band together against them, with Bungo being a wide open province. As they expand forth they have conversion problems that makes their starting situation more volatile. Not going to debate much the value of naval dominance in this game, but Chosokabe start with wood in a port province, which is about as valuable as Mori's clan bonus at the very start allowing them to start flooding the western seas with ships. Obviously Otomo still have the edge with naval traditions and early access to nanban trade ships, but the former Chosokabe will soon be capturing, and the later is a bit overrated. Either clan can easily gain naval dominance and control the trade nodes by the time they reach midgame, Otomo only having a jumpstart in the early game on it. As for the black ship that's entirely a luxury in legendary games, as someone previously stated if you have the ships to throw away capturing the black ship, you already have naval dominance. The main weakness of Chosokabe's start position is limited trade ports that hinder them in the mid game. It's not really a concern in the early or late game though. Finally, while Otomo does get the better units, they're a late blooming clan (nanban trade ships aside) with their valuable units coming far down the tech tree. Chosokabe clan bonuses are strongest in the early-mid game, with the early game usually being the most difficult part of any campaign (Chosokabe arguably third strongest early game clan behind Oda and Ikko Ikki). Anyhow, both clans are quite strong, but it mostly boils down to early-mid game dominance vs mid-late game dominance and nanban tradeships.

[@DEVAEGIR]

You make a good case. One or two points to add in response. The Otomo get to the tercos fairly quickly, and if, like me, someone is a gunpowder fan, then this is a quick way to get a teppo samurai level unit early on. (If you're a fan of bows, this is largely irrelevant, of course.) It takes getting used to playing with the tercos, but like most teppo, they are monsters on the walls when defending a settlement. What I also do, especially if not on legendary, is destroy the Nanban quarter in Bungo and rebuild it in Buzen. And here is an important advantage for the Otomo - the missile upgrade which the archers Chosokabe don't have from the beginning, which I then also use for the tercos. (Nanban trade ships are OP anyway, they don't need experience, they can rack it up very quickly.) Not only do the Otomo have it from the beginning, it is fairly tricky for the Chosokabe to get to a fletcher early on. You need to either take Bungo, which is not easy early on, or hit against the Mori and cross over the mountains there under attack from the Ouchi. Personally, I never had an issue with the enemies surrounding Otomo. Stick a couple of ships on the crossing between Kyushu and Honshu, and you can block incoming armies for a while, and deal with the Shoni with relative ease. I usually wait for them to attack (which they do a few turns in) and either crush them in a defensive siege, or use the bridge as a choke point. Then counterattack. Bungo is a bit of a challenge, because of the two-turn movement, but not impossible to defend, since the Ito (?) take a few turns to betray me. Christianity yes, this is an issue, although less so in terms of conversion, more in diplomacy. The Otomo generals help in the conversion, and the missionaries seem fairly effective. Always seemed more effective than monks, actually. What I also do is try and build at least one more church when I eliminate the Shoni, and with two missionaries it is fairly easy to manage. The one issue Christianity has which on higher difficulties is quite pronounced is the diplomatic penalty. Then again, I almost never enter into alliances anyway, limiting myself to trade agreements. I thus avoid being dragged into unnecessary wars unexpectedly. From there it's all play style. I have finished the game a number of times, so I don't get hanged on the given timeframe to win, which gives me more time to play defence, if I need, or provoke Christian rebellions and wear down the enemy thus. And convert. The easiest faction I have played is Shimazu. Oda and Ikko-Ikki share the second spot for ease, Otomo come 3rd, I would say, with Chosokabe 4th. Hattori I haven't touched yet, in all these years. I am eager to try them as soon as I submit my chapter. So, in a couple of weeks. :)

[@Naraku-no-Hana-WE]

Oh do Tercos only require the first gunpowder tech? Been a while since my most recent Otomo play. Yeah, naval traditions aren't all that useful (usually only a single battle's worth) and accuracy improvements are significant. Just a sidenote as Chosokabe I usually invade Buzen first and work my way south. Great chokepoint, good recruitment center, and borders the wealthiest Kyushu provinces. Also I typically get there while there are 2-3 clans left (Usually Shoni, but occasionally Otomo in the north, and likewise usually Ito, but occasionally Shimazu in the south). By invading from the North I don't have to go to war with the Southern Kyushu clan/s until I want to. Maneuvering Northwards from Satsuma can sometimes get a bit dicey with the long marches to Higo and Hyuga, but it's not an issue if you're marching South from Higo and Bungo. Anyhow... rough estimate I'd probably have Buzen under my control somewhere between turns 12-15ish. The Northwest corner of Kyushu within a few turns of that. Without a doubt that's preferable for the Chosokabe rather than trying to take march across Chugoku and take Hoki from the Amako/Ouchi/whoever currently holds it in the invasion carousel that sweeps the region. Yeah Otomo are a bit better at converting than other clans for sure, though it still does slow you down to an extent. Shimazu are probably the easiest clan to play, though Oda and Ikko are stronger factions with their early game dominance. I'm with Daimyo Donkey on Takeda belonging in the top 5, their cavalry is quite strong and easily accessible. Their starting situation is actually really strong with their initial alliances letting them expand pretty much however they want. They are one of the more fun clans to play as. I'm sure you find Otomo more fun but I can't put Otomo or Chosokabe ahead of Takeda. Hattori can be fun. Despite being the "worst" clan in the game that does not make them boring, just the most challenging. Even if they are the least historically accurate faction >.

[@Ty8011]

Before watching I'm guessing Tokugawa

[@DonPeyote420]

they were Imagawa's bitch before Okehazama, then they became Oda's bitch.

[@Madjo-qj2ge]

@@DonPeyote420 and yet,they ruling Japan for 200 years

[@larreyxiv3014]

@@Madjo-qj2ge Ieyasu Tokugawa

[@ashina2146]

Hojo is actually that clan that's "Easy to play, but Hard to master" The Hojo has a great Economy and Military, but it was kinda swapped. as the Castle with the Gold mine is your capital and the Castle with the blacksmith isn't, which means you can only produce 1 unit at a time at your Blacksmith province. Don't even think of recruiting from the Capital, it will take 2-3 Turns to reach the second castle. Unless you fight the imagawa and takeda, or ally with them.

[@Svanberg123]

It also sucks that historically Odawara was their capital, eventhough they first appeared in Izu.

[@AvengerAtIlipa]

Chosokabe are underrated in the sense that their bonus to farm income is often overlooked. Late game, unless you sacrifice a ludicrous amount of money in fleet upkeep to keep trade nodes open, most of your income will come from farms.

[@fluffynoses]

lol i loved playing as Mori, especially when you make them Christian. Christian Trade Ships are OP lol

[@Immortal-lh3ew]

i agree with chosokabe being low, but what helped me in the campaign was that the only way other clans could attack me were through naval invasions. which can be countered easily

[@Sharnoy1]

I can agree to this list, thank you for the video Donkey! Good quality as always. Still looking forward to more clan overviews. I just can't get enough of those it seems D:

[@spartanxmonster]

Seeing my Uesugi here makes me cry, but it's understandable. The long road is tough but it's well worth the reward.

[@Smaug2b]

my first campaign is with uesugi i buy the game recently and yeah this is so HARD

[@orarinnsnorrason4614]

Shimazu and Date are my favorite mainly because of the start locations. Of the smack-in-the-middle-of-the-map factions I like Takeda alot.

[@larreyxiv3014]

Try Oda

[@orarinnsnorrason4614]

Funny you should mention that. I just re-installed the game and have a go at it again. Selected Oda :)

[@Celedan]

that feel when the top 4 is my literal 4 favorite clans TT. I like tokugawa for their challenge tho not anything else.

[@MidlifeCrisisJoe]

Well I always felt the reason Tokugawa sucked was on purpose. In no small part because of the fact that the chain of events that got Tokugawa Ieyasu to succeed in reality are almost unbelievable, and would be except that they actually did happen. What's a shame is that it's really, really hard to replicate even basic conditions that actual history followed with them, where you team up with Oda and end up creating an alliance, since 9 times out of 10 players will just focused on killing Oda right away since you start at war with them and Oda on your doorstep immediatey. That said, they DO have a dark horse advantage most don't realize, in Ieyasu himself. Because unlike all other clans, who either start with grown heirs or no heirs, Ieyasu starts in the game as a baby. Considering the average game length of time of 55 years from 1545 to 1600, this means that you start with a general who will be alive and of age through most, if not all of the game starting around turn 30. He's perfectly aged to go through the entire rest of the game without any worry that he'll die of old age before the end, or that he'll show up too late to gain enough experience for the late game. So, as long as you're using Ieyasu once he comes of age (which might even be a little early for him), you're almost guaranteed to have a good maxed out general early and who will reliably last until the end. It's not much, but considering how tough the Tokugawa start is, it is *something*.

[@dgray3771]

I think part of Tokugawa succeeding is that he had no power haha. Each and every leader up till then got backstabbed. The clans themselves were not interested in a central power. Tokugawa managed to keep everything together. Even if the clans were semi autonomous.

[@marvinm8343]

I don’t think the Uesugi should be the third worst clan in the game. Uesugi Kenshin (Nagao Kagetora) is one of the best starting daimyos in the game and the youngest at 15 years old. (Historically, he became the head of Nagao clan at age 19 and later the head of the Yamanouchi branch of the Uesugi). He has high honor and has a good starting trait (+1 morale to troops). Rightfully so, since historically, he is one of the most honourable and charismatic daimyos of the Sengoku period. One of the events /dilemmas in the game was inspired by an episode of chivalry between Kenshin and Takeda Shingen. When the Imagawa and the Hojo conspired to deprive Shingen’s lands of salt since Kai did not have a coastline, it was Kenshin who implored Shingen to obtain salt from Echigo. In terms of generalship and administration, Kenshin was as formidable as Shingen, even if the latter was older and more experienced. He was also one the few who scored a victory against the infamous Oda Nobunaga (Battle of Tedorigawa). Echigo’s expanse is a double-edged sword. On the defensive, space can be traded for time. You can lure potential enemies like the Takeda and Jinbo deep inside your border to defeat them. You can parlay these victories into alliances or vassalage. Jinbo can be a useful buffer state. Same with Takeda if one can manage an alliance with them. A way to deal with the vastness of the Kanto-Tohoku regions is to max out the “strategist” trait. The problem when playing Uesugi is that the Kanto area is a crapshoot. Any alliance between/among the Takeda, Hojo and Imagawa makes the game extremely difficult. The Yamanuochi is always a conflict-magnet. Diplomacy must be used to the utmost. Isolate enemies and fight limited wars. Generally, the Uesugi should be played as an economic, rather than a military clan. The Uesugi have a trade income bonus. Couple this with chi bonuses by going the Zen path, they can become an economic juggernaut.

[@R3GARnator]

The higher ranked clans, don't require as much luck and skill to succeed.

[@benerdick_cumberbiatch]

How good a clan was historically doesn't really change how good the clan is in the game. Also Kenshin never defeated Nobunaga. He defeated all of his best generals in a single battle, besides Ieyasu. Probably an even bigger feat.

[@normanenthuaist366]

Usugi is nothing in front of Date masumune He is only daimiyo who denied tyotomi hidoyosi purposely to join him and oda never attack date and they still exist

[@benerdick_cumberbiatch]

@@normanenthuaist366 wrong loads of daimyo defied him. The shimazu fought him then submitted, he defied Hideyoshi and then submitted without a fight, turning up dressed in white ready to commit suicide

[@shoichi8474]

I personally love playing the tokugawa. My best runs with them have me staying as vassals of the imagawa as long as possible. This typically keeps me pretty safe from the takeda and hatakeyama. I focus on building my economy and opportunistically grab good provinces when I can. I also employ tons of monks, metsuke and ninja to manipulate things from afar and in late game to conquer provinces without declaring war.

[@Roadwarior2]

It'd be neat if he ever downloads one of the faction mods that swaps out all the major clans on the faction select screen and makes a best/worst video off that. I used one to play as the Matsumae in FOTS, it was quite a blast playing as the mighty march lord of the north, if a bit easy.

[@DEVAEGIR]

After many years playing with the Otomo, the Oda, the Takeda and the Shimazu (on and off, as I do have a day job as well), tried my luck with the Hattori. The only way I managed to get anywhere with them is by shipping my heir with the best troops I could buy to grab Buzen and then played them basically as I would the Otomo, grabbing Kyūshū and establishing myself there to use as a stepping stone for later. I have to say though, that in a perverse way, it was one of the most interesting games I have played, because while I was grabbing Kyūshū, I was simultaneously loosing the three or four provinces I had captured around the home region, to the Oda and the Takeda (who were allied between them); Mino was my last province there, and when two two-stack armies came, one Oda and one Takeda, I abandoned the fortress and hid in the furthest woods I could reach; losing the province, my orphaned army (thankfully, with a ninja and with a metsuke) conducted a fighting retreat across Honshu all the way to Kyūshū, battling and setting up vassals here and there (to rest and replenish). It was absolutely mesmerising!

[@duoantipala]

Just a Hattori player here. Basic tips: 1- Don't over recruit units, only the necessary ones and replace archers with samurai archers asap. 2- Expand to the north (Ikko), and alliance with Tsutsui as fast as you can. He will expand through Ise to the north-west, covering your ass most of the time. 3- Make as much trades as possible. 4- Use your ninjas to stop armies from attacking you. That way you will be able to regroup or make more units. 5- The faster you capture Omi, the faster you will be making money.

[@TheManofthecross]

but then there is Kyoto which is right next door anyway

[@order_truth_involvement6135]

2021 still a great game, can run on almost any pc

[@Dfathurr]

I kinda agree with Tokugawa being 2nd worst clan to play with. I never win with that, even next neighbor Oda, i still can win. But i never win with Tokugawa. So thinking that in real life, it is Tokugawa clan who win is actually depicting how smart Ieyasu is

[@mastr3ss]

Thanks for the videos man, you are the reason I'm back in Shogun 2 for already a week (I mean daily so thats pretty big)!

[@davidagudelo2435]

The Hojo bonus of cheap repair costs makes sense once you realise their main gig is to tear the castle down. No sieges, only fire.

[@IceniTotalWar]

Useful video as I'm about to restart playing Shogun 2 and upload, it's been years since i last played and don't want to mess up my 1st YR campaign in Shogun 2 😁.

[@iamplay797]

i love playing the hattori its challenging at the start and thats fun

[@AquaticSkipper]

The Mori at #4?? There is a settlement with a port and blacksmith closeby, and mori wako raiders are incredible. You're underestimating them they're far more cost effective than katana!

[@MrSmartDonkeyLP]

They are, but you can't recruit them in the town with the blacksmith, which makes Katana Samurai better. If that town also had a port, that would've probably made me place the faction as a whole a lot higher up (or lower up depending on how you want to see it) because that's a pretty big deal, but as it stands there's just not really any point recruiting Wako Raiders if you can get Katana Samurai with upgraded armour or melee attack.

[@AquaticSkipper]

MrSmartDonkeyLP yeah that is true alright if you're min maxing power.. honestly it would be too broken to me if that was the case considering how unfair mass wakos feels already for me, thanks for the reply! Their stats are real in line with katana and it's a decent discount, it's real useful early

[@flaggy185]

I was playing Shogun 2 with the oda Declared war against one faction And soon I was fighting a 3 vs 1 war against the Shogunate, that faction, and another one Nothing related to the video, but also that the fricking spearmen are so OP

[@dubiousdevil9572]

Funny enough the Hattori clan was the funniest campaign I ever played. I played defensively and just turtledove and used my Ninja to essentially intrigue and assassinate myself through Japan. It was so fun. I'd only attack clans that attacked me first.

[@rockjock3]

I don't disagree with your assessment of the Hojo, which was the first clan I played on the campaign on normal difficulty. I like upgrading castles. When I felt it was time to take down the shogunate that I felt was getting too nervous about my growing power, I marched my two main armies through Takeda lands who were my allies and straight to attack the capital before the shogunate could declare me japan's public enemy numbah one. In opening seconds of the battle of the capitol that I commanded one of my siege engines landed a lucky shot and killed the enemy general. From their it was relatively smooth sailing and the rest of japan never collectively made me their enemy. I was the new shogun with a new shiny capital and everyone was cool with it. Good times.

[@shinsenshogun900]

rockjock3 Basically what your neighboring Imagawa planned to do through their road leading to Okehazama. How did you deal the factions like the Oda, Ikko Ikki, or the relatively minor Azai, Miyoshi, Hatakeyama, or Kitabatake clans on the way to Kyoto?

[@rockjock3]

@@shinsenshogun900 my allies the takeda kept the ikko ikki off my back by already being at war with them. Granted, I was straining my alliance with them by marching my two main armies through their lands to get to kyoto. Thankfully, they didn't object. I dealt with the oda by beating them in two previous battles that made them sue for peace before I marched on kyoto and then subsequently, battling them and annexing their lands over the next several turns. I don't remember encountering much difficulty dealing with the minor clans, but I realized that by taking out the shogunate before they could declare me japan's enemy. None of the remaining clans united against me, and so I was able to take down every clan afterward one by one. The takeda's remained my steadfast stewards in the north with me eventually aiding and disposing of all who opposed us there. Eventually I won by completing the long campaign victory condition and starting a new campaign with the Date.

[@koreancowboy42]

I'd chosen Oda as my first since I enjoy the slight morale boost for the Ashigaru units since they need abit of love for being the back bone for early game especially if you can dominate around the Oda's starting area you can set up lots of troops on the road to block enemies from sieging and keep producing more better troops in the castle. I always made boarders units with Ashigaru since their cheaper so my other advanced castles can make katana samurai and bow samurai or naginata samurai along with yari cav.

[@MrUself]

The Hattori is the clan i play as on higher difficulties..... Just seem natural to me.... I tend to go for all the resources and hold them while my tech tree and income matures.... I turtle a bit using my ninjas etc to keep eye on enemy movements and assassination opportunities .....

[@Sandpitboy]

Next list - top 2 mediocre

[@thekween9037]

Date are my favorite. Always attack, get the weather to be messy so archers are less effective (fog, rain, snow, etc), charge no dachi sammies in and you don't even have to micro. They are hard to play on the campaign map though, but I beat them on hard yesterday.

[@brainwasher9876]

Uesugi has a consistently easy start if you ally with Mogami in exchange for declaring war on Honma and invading Sado. Sado's the second richest province in the game and it's a safe direction to expand.

[@Ac1dB3a5t]

Online lobbys are dead now. And this was the best TW made :(

[@georgethakur]

Sucks, man );

[@anirbanbhattacharya9185]

It has been revived somewhat

[@maltvinegar436]

Well, it was free for a month, maybe that did something

[@helikos1]

Must have never played rome

[@goodcomrade2949]

Its prety much revived

[@fireblast8972]

Is it possible to get a basic coop guide? with things like strong clan combinations and how armies should be built?

[@iceee420]

Joe Scirrotto the same as single player you just have an ally that can drag you into shit from across the country Clan combos depend on what you are after but boil down to look at the unique units and pick from there

[@vichodeivis1219]

As long both have the same faith its only a matter of cooperation: who expands where, battle plans and financial help. If one of the players plays with the otomo or wants to convert to Christianity its better to avoid sharing a long border until both clans are christians.

[@mrorlov2706]

One takes Date and another one takes Shimazu I would say. Chosokabe is also an option.

[@koreancowboy42]

I'd say one should take Oda, since you have better chances at early game and can become powerful in late game if done right. The next is Takeda clan which has strong cav.

[@Senovitj]

As Tokugawa I used my vassalship to focus on getting the trade notes. That tactic pays off so much.

[@SpaceKnight105]

What I just said was just a KZbinr playing as the Date clan in shogun 2. I don't wanna confuse you

[@MrSmartDonkeyLP]

Too late for that, I’m very confused.

[@Nightfire-ui9zu]

0:49 Are you ready guys!!!!!?????? PUT YA GUNS ON!

[@justvictor1383]

I agreed with the mori, yet yesterday I played them on Very difficult and I pretty much won after turn 2. Just made an alliance with the Kikkawa and got 3 of the commerce points, was already rich with only 5 provinces.

[@VK-sz4it]

I won with Mori even without navy. Just made a lot of +5 armor Mori wako raiders. They are slightly superior to katana samurai with much less cost and thet have kisho training

[@justvictor1383]

V K what a creative approach.

[@MorgueMage]

I’m doing a hattori campaign now on hard and I’m absolutely crushing. I’ve been able to ally with some pretty strong clans in the region and my strategy is to completely surround Kyoto before I go after them.

[@MonkeKuechler]

I was expecting the Ikko Ikkı in the list because of religious problems. At the begining of the game, growing larger can become great deal and you have to leave garrisons every castle you take until they have been turned to Ikko Ikkı. Loan Sword Ashigaru and larger ashigaru units cant change everything.

[@louditalian1962]

Hattori is a pain in the ass. Playing as Ikko-Ikki I went to the east while my western borders were secure. I took out the Date, Tokugawa, Hojo and other smaller houses. By the time I went into the west, the Hattori had taken everything around the Shogunate. By this point I had multiple armies with warrior monks and a decent Navy to block their ports. My first army went in with half the roster being sword Ashigaru and archer monks with 3 light cavalry. First battle was easy, took Owari and made the Oda into a vassal. I felt pretty confident at first and walked my army straight into an ambush loosing the whole damn thing. The Hattori counter attacked and took back Owari, they landed a naval force into the island with the gold mine and lost it, they also had a smaller army land on Date territory and burn half my resources down. My large military was already stretched thin, but with the lost of the gold mine and loosing resources on the north my economy went into the negatives, to add insult to injure a general betrayed me and took half the army with him. Still I went forward and recaptured Owari, dealt with the raiders on the North and sent a fleet to take back the island. I went once again into the Hattori lands just to me AMBUSHED once again and loose the whole damn army of monks after my general was assassinated by a Ninja. After a brutal war I took out the Hattori and took out the Shogunate, but I decided to make the Hattori Into vassals as a sign of respect for their brutal campaign their gave me. Jesus It took me 2 days of set backs and fights just to take them down.

[@dark_winter8238]

The way you safe date caught me off guard. I have been saying it as the English version sense shogun 1 was new.

[@krustygaming5887]

Heard the opening and my brain immediately filled it in with the among us theme. I think I’m beyond saving.

[@mrorlov2706]

Hmm, it was weird to find Uesugi in top 3 worst clans or maybe i love the warrior monks way too much lol. I mean It definitely not as good as my favorite clan Oda but when I played it I didnt feel like its really bad or something(I actually took an island with a goold mine and expanded to the south because Takeda declared war on my vassal and they were allies with Hojo so I also took the Hojo town with a gold mine) with such an income I was able to deal with any opponent. The campaign was weird though because most major clans were rekt by minors aside from Takeda, which I destroyed myself and Hattori. So when the realm divide happened I had to deal only with 3-4 big shots.

[@RFXMixedGaming]

I occupied 8 provinces just within turn 27 and Kyushu in turn 46 when playing Hattori (Legendary) and I finished that campaign in turn 107 😂.

[@sverdmester]

Mori was always my favourite clan since they specialized in warrior monks in Shogun 1. I was a bit miffed when they just got better ships in for Shogun 2, but i still end up playing them again and again.

[@dimitrifalowski]

If you play as Uesugi Clan, go and conquer Kaga Province (Smithing) and Echizen Province (Craftwork) to recruit Exceptional Melee Naginata Warrior Monk and recruit Superior Accuracy Troops to conquer Kyoto

[@KrullsKj]

Hattori were my first game, and I pretty much annihilated everything :(

[@ArabicYeti]

I always play Tokugawa, underdog ninjas, gotta protect Konoha

[@CanadaMMA]

The Hojo should be much higher on your list. Their daimyo automatically get the night attack ability. While there are other ways to get it, it's not the easiest thing to do unless your clan starts with it. And being able to attack without having to worry about reinforcements is a massive bonus if you know how to use it correctly. Especially on the higher levels of difficulty.

[@Panic_Wot]

Uesugi are my absolute favourite clan. The armies you can build are just insane

[@bencochrane6112]

I started with Tokugawa. Was the most fun I had ever had playing Shogun 2... strong underdog energy.

[@Dan-rr7sm]

The one time I beat the campaign, it was with the Mori. You get a huge pirate army and badass naval ships...what's not to love? I think any idea of a "top 5 best or worst factions" is really subjective. It's all about personal preference.

[@microbrewlogic6963]

Honestly, in Shogun 2, I think there's a pretty strong argument to be made that even the very "worst" factions are still good, because Shogun 2 is a very good game. It's not like some of the other Total War entries where some factions are useless trash.

[@microbrewlogic6963]

I have to agree with you on this, as they are definitely the least fun clans to play. The Hattori are just frustrating with the increased upkeep, The Maori are only good at a thing that really anyone else can do pretty easily, the Hojo likewise really don't bring any meaningful bonuses to their faction, the Tokagowa start playing with shackles on, and the Date and Usegui both start out in a slow slog of a fight due to the providence size. Not that they aren't fun in their own ways, but its generally a lot less fun to play them than the Ikko-Ikki!

[@SkySweeperSyn]

Hattori have always been my goto clan. :c them or date. I guess i like the red and black too much. Lol

[@ArtanisOwns]

playing tokugawa, i took lots of money from the Imagawa for my indefinite military access and then made war. it went realy well

[@AnthroTsuneon]

I do not entirely agree with the final result, especially as, even on legendary, they can loot the shogunate on turn one

[@SixCylinderSamurai]

With Uesugi, I take Shimotsuke by turn 5, crank up the taxes on turn 3, have a revolt by turn 5 in Echigo, and lose Echigo with the sole intention of having Shimotsuke as my capital provence for the extra unit recruitment slot. Shimotsuke has a holy site giving all your units a buff to morale and eventually can be upgraded to give your warrior monks more xp. It synergizes perfectly with their clan perk. I only take back Echigo once I become Shogun.

[@partyboycoo]

Wait, the Oda ended the sengoku period. The Tokugawa just displaced oda nobunaga's successor. Didn't they?

[@mk_gamíng0609]

Oda died before it ended. It was his retainer Toyotomi Hideyoshi who ended it for him. He then became defacto ruler of Japan but he lost prestige in his failings with the invasion of Korea and upon his death his son was displaced by Tokugawa Leyasu another of Odas confidantes and his shoe shiner So yea it was the Oda who ended it but not with a Oda at the helm

[@Jinny-Wa]

I think Uesugi is mostly hard because of Takeda is near them. Majority of the time Takeda is one of the steamroller clans. Also they rarely accept alliance and 99% of time never trade with you. If by some miracle they offer alliance to you, then they declare war on your vassal and you are forced to join against them either way

[@ianhancock6736]

I love playing the Mori, but you make a very good point. The Ouchi are terrible to have next to you. they always turn on you because they turn christian

[@carlobresciani3168]

Which is actually a good thimg, because you want to take them down early on, so that you can expand into Kyushu.

[@janbazuine6636]

1 disadvantage of chosokabe is that there are only 3 ports on shikoku so you can only have 3 trade partners

[@eliasfrp]

My first ever (I believe) campaign is a multiplayer one, which I'm playing with a friend. He is Chosukaba (sorry for wrong spelling), and I'm Hattori. I am loving the Hattori. From what I understood, the ninjas can be recruited sooner, than in other clans, and they are an incredibly strong unit.

[@MrSmartDonkeyLP]

They’re recruited from the same building as other factions, so no earlier recruitment and despite their Kisho Ninja supposedly being better they’re actually worse. Their stats are identical to other Kisho Ninja with the exception of lower ammunition. There’s mods that fix it but by default they’re straight up worse than regular Kisho Ninja.

[@eliasfrp]

@@MrSmartDonkeyLP That's bad. I suppose I'll pick another clan for my next campaign. Although I did enjoy the Hattori. But everything is easier, when played with a human ally, so I guess it isn't that easy to determine how good/bad the clan is. Thanks for the reply btw!

[@eliasfrp]

But is it possible to recruit ninjas in other clans already in the first turn?

[@Sagar_Patelv28]

I dunno about the game but according to history Tokugawa clan leader (Ieyasu) made to Shogun and united Japan under his rule And Kageturo (later known as Kenshin) of Echigo (Ueisugi) defeated Imagawa (Takeda clan) despite odds against him and Takeda thereafter never dared to march upon them

[@Volucrum]

My game is modded with 12 month years and more provinces so it changes some things for me. Date is really high up with a lot more land to conquer and easily gets the top of the list. It also gives Hattori an edge to me. Because the extra cost is less felt with more professional units like naginata samurai. I send more of those. Add some units which have a heavy charge and quite quickly your slower units can flank without the danger of getting shredded by archers. I never loose a battle as Hattori because of it. And with lord perks armies will get cheaper.

[@311johnjohn]

Agree with everything except the Hattori, I find the global vanguard and night battles extremely strong on legendary. Mainly because you can often get to a hill the AI wants adjacent to their deploymentzone earlier than they are able to, which is almost like an auto-win in offensive battles. As for economy just extort military access money, rush to Kii and Settsu in the first 5-6 turns and spam out 5 metsuke and its really not that bad. Also Ninjas aren't bad imo, just make sure to have some yari cav in their vicinity or they'll have real issues with enemy cav charges. I'd probably put the Date somewhere in the bottom 5 instead.

[@RFXMixedGaming]

Emil Jønsson Yup, Hattori is the clan which Warrior Monks aren't necessary. Just place the Kiso units right, front, and back the enemies and rape them😂. Btw, you and me have the same when taking Kyushu first 😂.

[@derekaarts4997]

All time favorite game. Always thought Uesugi was the most difficult, how have to fire up the game again and check out Hattori

[@JanM457]

I like the Mori because I hate naval battles - ships no do banzai - and getting stronger ships makes it more viable to automate away naval battles.

[@shd0wc0re98]

I can agree that the top three worst clans are some of the toughest to play in Legendary difficulty, but goddamn it does feel good when you win with all odds against you, especially during the Tokugawa's early game if you decided to betray Imagawa on turn one, only mods I'm playing whenever on legendary difficulty are the camera mod. (Forgot the name.) As well as the Hattori Ninja Samurai which just changes the models of the soldiers of the Hattori clan into ninjas wearing armor. :P Looks strange but eh it looks cool.

[@大魔王ゼレムーン]

MrSmartDonkeyLP Pls can u make gameplay videos on every clan with Expanded Japan (97 new regions, 101 new factions) mod? I just finished my first campaign with this mod as Otomo clan, and it was terribly interesting and funny! I recommend you to play on normal difficulty, because of the 97 new region it would take incredibly much time to finish campaign on harder difficulties. And seemingly this mod is exempt from bugs.

[@Vincrand]

I'd put the Date in worst 5. It has a similar issues as the Uesugi. The distance to your starting enemy is huge, so you have to play on the counter. By the time you can siege them they have another 4 units in that stone province and possibly reinforcements incomming from the south. Once you've taken the stone province the Honma will keep invading you. If you have a bad day the Hatekayama will also attack you. As you meantioned the Hojo have a good starting position, which is by far the most important thing. Clan traits and unique units are for the most part not really relevant. You can eaily play without those as long as your position is good/great. The Hojo have an easy expansion path. The first couple of towns can be reached in 1 turn. There are no strong opposition factions in the early game and you can take them on 1 at a time. I'd rate any clan with an easy save base of opperation better than a clan that doesn't have that. Chosokabe, Hojo and Shimazu are the only ones I'd say that have that save base.

[@maxmustermann-zx9yq]

look up volund's hattori campaign, if you know how to paly them you can take kyoto on turn on and start vassilizing all non special provinces, utterly dominating everyone with the stealth trait

[@MrSmartDonkeyLP]

Ugh... I can't believe still think I don't know you can do this. Does it make their clan any stronger? No, they're exactly the same clan for it, in fact, I would never recommend doing it. I did a Legendary difficulty Ashikaga Shogunate campaign which makes them have the traits of the Oda, and even with all of those early game buffs it was the hardest campaign I've done being in realm divide on turn 4.

[@maxmustermann-zx9yq]

@@MrSmartDonkeyLP ok...I just find their stealth trait makes any battle so easy that they would get 1st place, but I guess you need veteran skill and some cheese

[@crusaderofthelowlands3750]

I never liked the Date. I smiled when you placed the Chosokabe higher than them. As for the Hattori... The starting position is terrible, the upkeep cost is awful (though deployment can be useful), but their general is the best looking one in the game. Who doesn't want to play as a middle-aged, balding, warrior-ninja?

[@benerdick_cumberbiatch]

The bullgod mod makes him look second best after masked Shingen.

[@ameyasingh8628]

its hilarious that the weakest won the Sengoku Jidai

[@turinmormegil7715]

Nice to get here and see you chose one of the worst clans for your first hard playthrough. Yes the Mori have a very poor position, as everyone on your vicinity is warmongering. It's hard not to get dragged in many conflicts. Just to put in perspectvie how my current campaign is faring: bot hme and amako were in such a bad shape that I saw no other option than to accept his peace proposoal, giving time to an enemy that should be dealt with in the beggining of the campaign, time to recover. All cuz Kikkawa stabbed me in the back when I was preparing for my first advance towards Amako's home province to finish him off, and declared war on me, killing my momentum since my south side was wide open. That let him block my port for 5 rounds and made me break trade agreements thrice now (that's a shame for the best naval faction of the game). When I just finished kikkawa over and was heading for a reconstruction and rearrangement of my states, Urakami declared war on the same turn and already had two huge armies (one of which I destroyed in a impossible siege defense last time; figured camping on the former kikkawa fort will be best since I have way lesses troops after campaign with kikkawa). Meanwhile, ouchi died and shoni has becoen the master of kyushu islands and of the late ouchi territory right to my west frontier. If I were to follow the missions issued i would have to declare war on the guy that ate otomo, shimazu and ouchi alone at the beggining of the game and poses now as the strongest faction on west Japan. So overall, up until now: lost my ally, fought three wars (one interrupted for now) and almost began a fourth. That's to put in perspective how easy is to get dragged in many conflicts and how the Mori situation can escalate quickly Also; I can't seem to save money with all these poor provinces and recurring wars with no time to recover and invest

[@Sherudons]

My first full clan clear was tokugawa, then went on to clear the shit out of everything except hattori since I don't own it. Was dead on the first three, was a little surprised with the usegi when I played them, but with the expanded japan mod they become bearable.

[@vasslander9602]

My first ever game was with Tokugawa just cause i liked the Looks of the Daimyo, without realizing they were a vassal. Maybe I got lucky but I was able to smash Imagawa early and snowball followed. It was on normal difficulty tho.

[@MarchalisVan]

If you have an ally you don't like, you can always cause a rebellion when they leave their province unguarded ;)

[@MrRonoaro]

My "Hard Campain" memory: 1. Shizmau- Easy. 2. Hojo- I am rich man. 3. Uesugi- Bow monks are crazy good. 4. Hattori- I don't want live on this planet anymore...

[@kyokushinbaka6046]

Hattori imo are one of the 3 best clans in shogun 2 legendary, the higher upkeep cost can be managed. In my recent hattori legendary campaign I had 10 provinces by winter 1558, which included Omi and Kii, 2 of the 5 richest provinces, Kaga and Echinzen 2 more rich provinces which can act as recruitment centre, Mikawa which gave horses, 7 honor and 4 star rank on daimyo. By 1550 my income was at 6.7-7k per turn depending on sea raids.

[@MrSmartDonkeyLP]

But you can do that exact same thing with any other clan except you don't have to deal with higher upkeep.

[@kyokushinbaka6046]

@@MrSmartDonkeyLP maybe Oda and Ikko Ikki but with hattori you save 3 points on generals because all of them have night attack.

[@jagartharn6361]

Its funny seeing the Mori on this list when they were pretty much the best faction in Shogun 1 (yup Im one of the few modern TW fans that has played it it seems).

[@helikos1]

Wow such as boast! I played original shogun too. It was actually the first computer game I every played and I prefer it to shogun 2. I was 8 at the time, so I didn't realise that you could choose other clans until my fourth playthrough. Mongol invasion was hilarious. "THE ENEMY GENERAL HAS FALLEN GREAT KHAN! LET US TAKE HIS SKULL AS A DRINKING CUP!"

[@jagartharn6361]

@@helikos1 Not really a boast more than I dont know very many TW fans who still talk of it or play it.

[@helikos1]

@@jagartharn6361 Fair one. It was a very good game. I feel it captured the essence and atmosphere of the sengoku jidai. I mean it hasn't aged well but most games I played in my youth haven't. I loved the ninja movies

[@MrZega000]

I like Uesugi because it's different. It forces you to play more diplomatically in the beginning and gradually work your way up to the steam roll. Probably boring to watch, but great for a well thought out and tactical campaign.

[@HP_lovecrafts_cat67]

Uesugi was the first clan that made me actually think tactically all the other clans was just me thinking “Haha war go brrrr”

[@swordsman1ke511]

Due to my incompetence, the Mori somehow turned into a superpower, including taking the Chosokabe island

[@julesdl3270]

Knowing that the tokugawa ruled the shogunate for 287 straight years since 1600 this game is odd making it so hard for them haha

[@simonnachreiner8380]

I feel the Hatori could’ve been amazing if a few design choices had been different First of Kisho training should’ve allowed placement inside the enemy deployment zone. 25% upkeep basically hemorrhages your funds and possibly starting the battle literally inside the enemy formation is the only thing I could see being worth it as it exist currently your forced to do the same battles with 25% less units for what basically amounts to less walking. Secondly Moar Ninjas. With the reduced army capacity Ninjas do a LOT of your leg work keeping enemy armies immobile doubling the amount of ninja’s available even if you keep the cap of five would go a lot farther than the pitiful 2% success bonus

[@MrBanks2024]

I can't agree with Chosokabe as middling, when I first successfully went about winning Legendary the strategy I settled on was taking their island quickly then supercharging the economy - straight towards land consolidation) using the sea as a natural defence - I went forever without a serious invasion but at very least you're not likely to hit multiple armies. After this I took the Western island from the south, allowing you to exploit the blacksmith. When both island are taken you're really all set to build up a bank balance and some perfect units before you get some 3* monks to convert goof agents. Then just explode out East. That's without even mentioning the trade nodes. I guess people would say why not just use Shimazu the reason is mainly the land bridge in the North makes isolation less easy. Surprised to see Hattori there as I've won legendary with Takeda with no trade nodes and minimal ships but for a while was trying with them and came close. The real difficulty I see with Hattori there is that just being right in the centre of the map it's very difficult to fight on two fronts without a natural end. But they are so close to Chosokabe I will try simply getting the crack agents you can quickly assemble for the Hattori and hopping across the sea with 1 ship safely then running the Chosokabe strategy - Katana Samurai are recommended early on to slice through large yari armies. This will mean getting away from the main fighting clans and surrounded position until properly developed, which is where I tend to lose - everything going fine and then you get everyone declare war almost randomly or Oda comes out of nowhere with a 4-stack early on. Clan I personally fear is the Date. So often I've just been crushed by the Takeda-Hojo alliance.

[@MrSmartDonkeyLP]

I don't take strategies like you mentioned with the Hattori into consideration because that's not clan specific, anyone can migrate to a safer starting location, but that doesn't make them a stronger clan. Hattori have one of the weakest starting locations, and a clan trait that is mostly negative, making almost all your units 25% more expensive for almost no upside. I've finished a campaign with each clan on Legendary multiple times, including challenges like Gunpowder only, Cavalry only, Warrior Monks only, even Stealth Units only with the Hattori, and these are my findings, it's fair enough if you don't agree with them, but unless you've finished a campaign with each clan at least once on legendary difficulty you can't make a proper assessment.

[@MrBanks2024]

@@MrSmartDonkeyLP I know you are a stronger player, your videos have helped me develop a lot from start. I only been play 6 months or so from easy short campaign difficulty. Not saying you're wrong, but would have to personally disagree where I am now to see Hattori quite so high up partly on account of the excellent agents. Currently trying to master Hattori. I'll get back to you when I've done each!

[@tedcomet3121]

4:27 yah but Monks allow you to incite revolts so that you can concur citys without declaring war or losing honor

[@shadowguardian210]

I would put the Date at #1 best clan.

[@Darcstar-du3dh]

funny how all except the Hattori and Tokugawa always survive to endgame in my games and then procede to annoy the living shit out of me