Top 5 Worst Outdated Mobile Suits

[@kakarot197]

If this video performs well enough I'll also do a video on the opposite, 5 outdated Mobile Suits that actually managed to perform really well. (I think I'll be able to find 5) Btw, how's the audio quality? I tried improving it.

[@YeagerBomb-ww3bn]

Make the video and we will watch. Suggestion, top side stories that should have an anime adaptation?

[@hypershock0storm479]

Kakarot197 In that case, video liked!

[@Ton_D_Chicken]

JUST DO IT!!!

[@TurnTexAustin]

The audio quality definitely sounds improved! Keep it up!

[@RyuJose]

Audio sounds great. I like this Style content and your Gunpla reviews. Whatever you got time I'll watch.

[@RayShadow278]

Mad respect to the guy in the original Build Fighters anime who made it to the World Tournament using an Aries

[@calebbilling4984]

Any character that can make a Wing mook suit work deserves nothing less.

[@sithmaster4305]

Dude has my respect for even considering Aries, assuming his opponents weren't total garbage, he had a WHOLE gundam franchise to chose from and he picked the fucking Aries.

[@calebbilling4984]

Only way he could've been even more ballsy would be using a Leo.

[@thunberbolttwo3953]

Treize khushrenada I would have choosen a tall geese.instead of a aries.

[@barrybend7189]

In build Divers there's a guy who is the number 7 gbn player and he uses the proto Mobius mobile armor.

[@MrPatriot112]

Two reasons why the regular armies used these outdated things: 1. Too expensive to build newer and better machines (Which were mostly given to Elite Units) 2. Incompetent Leadership.

[@Mazj559]

Drew Cobb good point

[@holmiumh]

1, They want sell Gunpula

[@Christopher0184]

So, just like modern militarys.

[@Mazj559]

Christopher0184 u right

[@satriaputrapratama4703]

@@Christopher0184 yep, many armies still use T-54 for example

[@Spider_Rico]

I love the GM II. Whenever I play those Gundam Dynasty Warriors games, I make that suit sing. I believe in what Char says "it's not the suit it's the pilot”.

[@codename1176]

Spider Rico GM guard customs had the lowest loss of ALL GM types as hardly any were defeated

[@kassandraodessa2633]

When I'm playing dynasty warriors gundam 3 I can make that dual beam saber jegan dance!

[@TypetwoAbsolute]

I mean he says that but his direct rival killed two MS while he was still reading the instruction booklet because he had a way superior mech.

[@Nehfarius]

Char does have a point...in the words of a certain Aussie, skill always beats luck. However, tech-levels also account for a lot, and skill can only add so much to a suit before upgrades are needed.

[@nabkill0134]

@@TypetwoAbsolute during his first rodeo of fighting. By the end of the war rx-78 is the one who cannot keep up with amuro need.

[@acetraker1988]

Prototype canonically means = if this mecha randomly kills the pilot, allies, the world, we the manufacture are exempt from all responsibility...., we will provide a budget mass produced model at a later date, from the data collected from this -death trap- that only newtypes/the mentally unstable would bother piloting.

[@MrBioniclefan1]

Lol

[@issackaiser]

That’s about sum its up🤣

[@MrBioniclefan1]

Yeah it really does

[@kennethscott6533]

So true

[@plague6566]

_Pale Rider_

[@Mgauge]

It’s sad when your military’s main vehicle is outperformed by what is essentially a glorified steam shovel. It’s depressing when said glorified backhoe is also what your unit was supposed to be based on.

[@andrewowens4421]

When advancement goes backwards.

[@ElHarmonyV]

Why didn't they just keep the heat shovel at least that had more range than their stick.

[@divuhola6913]

@@ElHarmonyV the shovels are the superior melee combat weapons this situation is heretical

[@Laidengizer011]

I couldn't tell what that show was. I didn't recognize anything I saw on it. Looked kind of like Gundam Seed though.

[@apollopham3256]

@@Laidengizer011gundam age

[@tomtheconqerur]

Sgt Johnson would have easily taken on any mobile suit with just two sticks and a rock. one stick if he is being generous

[@commandermerc58]

O RAH

[@BinBintheRiceCake]

Lighting the stick on fire would devastate them

[@Mrwednesday84]

And he would dominate!

[@ethanyan3251]

back when i was in the marines, we only had two sticks! two sticks and a rock! and we had to share the rock!

[@Servellion]

So imagine what happens if he shows up inexplicably in a mech suit.

[@crytex6441]

2:15 Imagine going through the lengths: to become a Federation soldier; passing the entrance exam and physical exams; getting into a mobile suit and getting experience through combat; joining the supposed "elite" Titans unit, which will probably have it's own higher entrance exam and physical test; finally being deployed by said unit, only to be killed BY A FUCKING ROCK.

[@delllee4915]

CEASAAAAAAAAAR!!!!!!!

[@crytex6441]

@@delllee4915 *A sweet Italian song plays while his friend screams his name in grief and his mentor starts crying*

[@mercenarygundam1487]

That pilot must probably have the shittest luck in all of Gundam history if that's the case.

[@MikeLaRock88]

Sucks but thats real life war. Soldiers get hit by shrapnel and debris from their own weapons sometimes. Or trip and sprain an ankle and be pretty much done, bad luck

[@crytex6441]

@@MikeLaRock88 Yeah the worst way to die is by friendly fire. Reminds me of that scene in Jarhead where their convoy is fired upon accidentally by A-10s

[@odweaver]

The issue with most of the suits on the list was the proximity to plot characters.

[@codename1176]

odweaver haha

[@tamjana]

🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@Optimaloptimus]

Fair enough lol

[@TsorovanZero]

In defense of the Aries, it was probably just about to be phased out anyways when Operation M happened. The Taurus was just getting into production, and an atmospheric variant would be only a matter of time. I think OZ needed just another year, maybe 2, to start having front line air units equipped with Taurus suits.

[@rwg6357]

Seeing that the Sanc Kingdom had atmospheric versions... more six months, The Virgo just ended up being the better ground pounder unit

[@JeffreyPiatt]

We do see some in use by the covert Sanc Kingdom Ms forces. LT. Noin stole a Batallion of Taurus units being the AC era she probably just drove the transport off the supply Depot no questions asked after all those other people with Leo's. OZ has really bad security on there heavy equipment. It be like casually walking on a National Guard Depot and getting no response for taking a Tank or anti tank platform out for a weekend. Just odd.

[@DrForrester87]

@@JeffreyPiatt I mean...that dude who drove that tank through San Diego pretty much did the same thing.

[@AC12246]

The machine guns where useless against the gundams and what makes the aries useless was it will take two aries to lift a beam cannon while it will take on leo to lift a beam cannon

[@criscros4207]

i don't thi9nk the aries were outdated wen the seri started and sins we only have aries vs gundam its not really fair to state it was outdated has oppose to not use in advantageous situations aries were extremely situational mechs . plus i dont think its fair to compare them to gundams taurus on the other hand were design for space combat and were the base for A I system aries were design for atmospheric combat and mostly suport / command

[@rwg6357]

Its not a Stick! Its a Stake! We were expecting to fight Space Vampires not Space Dragons!

[@MasterArchfiend]

If that is not the engineer's legitimate response when confronted over the Genoace's performance, then I will be very upset. And keeping up the Vampire jokes, the suit the Genoace is based on took out a suit by decapitation.

[@broodo1]

Nah. It's a stick

[@samuelkolarik9760]

Oh, lieutenant Jerid, are you sure about that?

[@JeffreyPiatt]

It's not the suit's fault that Jared got in it. He makes any suit look bad. Like the Gundam mk2 .

[@christiandauz3742]

Imagine if the Federation had the Heavygun Makedonia at the start of the One Year War! How long would Zeon last? Few months? Weeks? Days?

[@darkusblader]

@@christiandauz3742 or even the jegan

[@davidvasquez08]

@@darkusbladerthe war would’ve ended in mere hours

[@Tokumastu1]

The fact that the Federation was still fielding Gm 2 during the Laplace incident is just embarrassing. Seriously if not for the Byarlant custom being there, WHILE being piloted by an ace pilot, Torrington would've been completely lost.

[@jeff3221]

Yeah would have been pretty tough on the Tri Stars if they rocked up and had to fight not only the desert forces but the amphibious and base jabber forces too. It's crazy how many units one Byarlant went through. It took out a couple Zaku Mariners, a Z'gok, 2 Zee Zulus, a Kapool, a Zogok, a Gelgoog variant, and a Marasai.

[@SudrianTales]

Tbf, they weren't meant to fight front line. Torrington was a reserve unit base

[@FLJBeliever1776]

@@SudrianTales - Even so, the GM II was seen fighting in the Federation Capital, which by default should have the best and next to best equipment to defend it. Only Nemo IIs and GM IIIs should have been in Reserve with Ground Type Jeagans as the Main Defense Force. In fact, the Federation had way too many Mobile Suits. GM II, GM III, Jeagan, Nemo, Nemo II, Jeddah, just to name a few as even I can't recall all of the Federation models in service in UC 0096. There's a thought for Kakarot. A listing of all Mobile Suits in service with the various factions in the UC Timeline on a year to year basis or conflict to conflict basis. He'll likely be making videos for months!

[@SudrianTales]

@@FLJBeliever1776 Are you talking about the Zeta conflict? Because everyone was using the GM 2 then, overproduction could actually explain a few Federation issues including block obsolescence

[@duelgundam]

@@jeff3221 and even then, it wasn't destroyed(at least on screen), only damaged. That suit can REALLY take a beating.

[@ShawneeLad117]

Genoace don't score a single victory in the first 15 years of the war: "ok everyone, who isn't sharing the rock?"

[@pangzhiyu8098]

But Sir, we all had one stick.

[@autofox1744]

Depending on how you categorize it, the Ball. The RB-79 Ball, fielded as a stop-gap by the Federation during the One Year War before RGM-79 GM production came on-stream, was originally designed in UC 0076 as part of the RX project, and was itself based on a platform known as the SP-W03 Space Pod, which was a civilian work vehicle designed for use in assembling space colonies, which should give you some idea as to just how OLD it was. Essentially, the Ball was a decades-old construction machine given armor, a cannon and a fresh coat of paint, and then sent out with its hapless pilots to fight Zakus. And it gets worse, too. In fitting the Ball with armor, much of the older design's cockpit canopy was removed, and replaced with a single round, forward-facing view-port, giving the pilot tunnel vision, essentially. The original liquid-fueled maneuvering jets were also replaced with a solid fuel pellet-fed system, which was quicker to refuel but much, MUCH less precise. The Ball could only spasm its way across space with abrupt movements, and didn't have much endurance on the battlefield. Its main armament was a 180mm recoilless cannon, which could only fire semi-automatically, in comparison to the Zaku's 120mm machinegun. The Ball's armament was really only good at fairly close range, where it had no real ability to defend itself, having no hand-to-hand weapons or really any fine maneuvering capability. Hundreds, perhaps THOUSANDS of these deathtraps were fielded by the Federation, and saw action as late as the Battle of A Baoa Qu, where they faced the most modern Mobile Suits that Zeon could throw at them, including the MS-14 Gelgoog. Worse still, the Federation did NOT immediately and rightly scrap the Ball after the One Year War had ended. They remained in inventory, indeed in SERVICE, until at least UC 0083, where a number served as close defense units for the Solar System II weapon during the last phases of Operation Stardust. These units were in fact a slightly redesigned version, the RB-79C Ball Type C, which mounted a LESS powerful 120mm cannon. Not only did the Federation go to the trouble of refitting their most useless mobile weapon, they managed to DOWNGRADE it. In conclusion, a Ball equipped with a Heat Stick would be terrifying.

[@FLJBeliever1776]

Actually, the Ball remained in service well until the end of the Federation itself. By that time, it was being heavily upgraded to the point that entirely purpose-built designs had been created. Primarily used as a Fire Support Unit, the Ball could actually be a very tricky opponent to destroy. Those jerky movements actually gave it more precise movement, while inferior to the Worker Pod, it was actually SUPERIOR to a typical Mobile Suit. It was lighter and so the thrust output allowed it to dodge more readily. It was also considerably smaller and so its overall mass was much lighter. In addition, its round size also meant that a Zeon shot had a rather increased effect of simply bouncing off, though, not without gouging the armor but even a 37mm left gouges on a Tiger II's armored hide, so that's immaterial. The 180mm gun was Artillery. The RB-79 Ball would be classified in the Real World as a Fire Support, Space Artillery Mobile Pod. Exactly what kind of designation that would be, is hard as no one has really sat down to create a system of identification. Like how the MS-07 Gouf would be best described as a Mobile Suit Destroyer rather than an actual Mobile Suit. Designed to kill Mobile Suits and not much else, I would be unsurprised if in a Real World encounter, the Gouf lost to Federation M61 Tanks in open combat. For lack of a FCS and dedicated weapons to engage Tanks at a distance. While, yes, the Gouf could use the Optional Machine Gun Hand Armaments of the Zeon Mobile Suit Corps, I'd imagine they would have had to modify the left hand to do so first. Removing the literal Handgun would entail removing the entire left forearm and modifying the remaining left upper arm and shoulder to compensate for the weight changes. And in turn, adjusting the rest of the Gouf for modifications and weight changes. Part of that would be safety. A Gouf pilot triggers the wrong command and he could literally blow the left hand to pieces. Possibly resulting in a fiery ammunition detonation that would amputate much of the left arm, destroy the handheld weapon, and likely cause damage to both the main body and right arm. That would also entail modifying the controls so as to remove the selector switch for the Gouf's Handgun Arm. Overall, this would detract from the Gouf's selling point as a Mobile Suit Killer. In addition, the Gouf would either be unable to or require additional modification to fire Shoulder-mounted Weapons or to use such weapons as Bazookas. The massive spikes on its shoulder armor gets in the way. So, replacing those would be a requirement. Which is probably why we see a continued decrease in such ornamental additions in later Zeonic designs. So, frankly, the Ball isn't the only Mobile unit undergoing modifications. It's just a more reasonable modification. I've heard it referred to pointedly as a Mobile Pod in the past or a Mobile Armor in some games. That said, Ball had a lot of uses. Though, why the Minelaying Balls were left unarmed is kind of stupid. They could still have been fitted with 'Get the Hint' Guns and Missiles that while not destructive, would be enough to deter Zeon pilots from getting too close unless they want to spend weeks as Reserve Space Infantry until either repairs are done or a replacement arrives. The Ball was essentially deployed by the Federation as either Mobile Gun Platforms or as Space Tanks. They brought firepower to bear on a target leaving the GMs to fight anything else. Something that wouldn't weigh them down. But as was the nature of the fighting, the Ball ended up in the mix as a direct combatant. Part of that is training. Part of it is doctrine kinks. Part of it would be inexperience. But then there was the general fighting that occurred. By the end of the Federation, the Federation had finally found the Ball's place in combat. It was strictly a Fire Support Platform and Engineering Unit. Essentially performing Guntank's role in space, but able to do both at the same time rather than require two separate models. That said, I do believe the Federation would have had Balls designed for other roles, such as Ship Support, Recovery Operations, Mining and Mine Clearing, and other specialized roles where the less precise and more expensive Mobile Suits would have been ill suited. Especially in areas where the cost of trying to use one anyways was prohibitive or it was too big for the job or couldn't be modified correctly. Something of a peeve I have about SEED and the fact it uses a number of existing Mobile Suits in its lineup for roles they are clearly too big or ungainly for. Now, as for Ball's survivability, it is actually recorded that Ball pilots had the HIGHEST Survival Rate out of all combat positions. While we see a lot of Balls get destroyed, remember, the Federation was flooding the battlefield with Balls. For every GM we see, there were 4 Balls as well. If not more than 4 Balls for every GM. So, while the lose rate was still high, the actual losses were quite low. One of the contributors is that thick armor. It is denser as it is spread out over less area. If anything, the Ball could get away with less armor because it was so much smaller and therefore had better armor coverage per square foot than a full-size Mobile Suit. And that only improved when Reduced Size Mobile Suits were adopted. Their already general poor armor coverage rating got poorer. That's why pilot deaths went up in smaller Mobile Suits. Everything was bunched up tighter and the armor was considerably thinned. Whereas the Ball stayed the same size and therefore gained even BETTER protection as Armor was developed. In the One Year War, a punch to the cockpit wouldn't kill the pilot of a Mobile Suit. Even repeated blows would struggle to kill the pilot. The same applies to all conflicts prior to UC 120. After UC 120, a punch to the cockpit was more than likely to kill the pilot, but otherwise leave the Mobile Suit almost intact. Cockpits would need replacing, though, due to crumpling like a beer can. In a Ball, in either UC 0079 or to the end of the Federation, a Ball that gets punched near the cockpit is just going to have one very annoyed and offended Ball pilot. Ball's round size, as I stated before, also means that Kinetic Rounds, like the Zaku 120mm, would have a harder time getting through the armor. When coated in Anti-Beam Coatings, a Ball would actually have a very significant defense rating against Beam Weapons as well. As for weapons, the 120mm was a High Velocity Gun, which is open to debate about its ability to fight off Mobile Suits. It could be that the Ball was retrofitted with being a Mobile Suit Destroyer in mind, but in practice was far less effective. The 180mm was the most decent match for the Ball at its time of introduction. The reason being as it afforded a Ball pilot a powerful enough weapon to cause harm to Fixed Emplacements, Ships, Barricades, Mobile Suits, and, with the right ammunition, Space Fighters. It was also light enough to be more readily carried around. The Ball pilot enjoyed a decent level of maneuverability and defense. A Mobile Suit pilot would find destroying one a difficult prospect. Like trying to use a F-105 Thunderchief to dogfight a MiG-17. Which, as we know, happened to little avail. The Mobile Suit pilot would need to get extremely lucky to destroy a Ball outright with one hit. Typically, only Aces getting up close and personal could do that. Unless a Zeon pilot found himself in a flood of Balls, but typically, that would be a flood of Balls and thus a lot of Balls firing back plus any and all GMs present also attacking. As it stood, it would require luck to just knock a Ball out of action with several shots. By contrast, though, the Ball pilot only needed one shot to ruin a Zeon pilot's day. Often, permanently as the round was sufficiently sizeable to really take a chunk out of ANY Zeon Mobile Suit. Even the heavily armored Rick Dom and Gelgoog. As a stopgap, even early on, the Ball showed resilience and survivability on the battlefield. The Federation would continue to use them, though, they typically disappeared from combat formations during much of the last decade and half of a 0000 Century. At some point after UC 100 or 120, the Ball was reintroduced into the Federation's combat formations where it would remain in service well into the next century with production only stopping when the Federation itself collapsed.

[@WarriorOO2]

Don't forget: The Zaku was also a work machine (however, it's like the Galactic Empire was the Republic; giving this info afterwards which is up to the viewer to decide whether it is true or not), and the Ball was a quick-response makeshift weapon to counter them and later delay the advance of the Zeon forces while the Federation came up with a plan on how to progress during the war. Edit: I did not read the comment above me, so if it was stated, my bad. Also, welcome in 2023, and Happy New Year!

[@autofox1744]

@@WarriorOO2 Good point about the Zaku, but it's worth noting, the combat versions fielded during the OYW were a couple of generations of development removed from their worker ancestors. The Ball was almost a straight conversion, the Gundam equivalent of a work truck with a machinegun mount in the bed. Versus the Zaku, which is an armored tank compared to its Holt tractor ancestor.

[@WarriorOO2]

@@autofox1744 Yes, that is absolutely right.

[@rahul327]

Ball my beloved

[@ME-kx9od]

You are very wrong Kakarot, these mobile suits can perform like/even better than Gundams. It just depends if you're one of the main cast.

[@Optimaloptimus]

Or if you’re equipped with a particular set of titanium balls.

[@KaiserStormTracking]

Or if you cough cough a guy from the real world

[@glitterboy2098]

especially in Gundam Wing, where being main cast or not was often the only real difference in some battles. (it is rather interesting how often the main cast wound up piloting the "mook" mecha due to their gundams being damaged or destroyed.. though Leo's and taurus's tended to be more common rides in such cases) in battles where the non-main cast fought each other, the Aries seems to be pretty effective, even against Leo's. that VTOL flight ability really gives them the mobility advantage.

[@superplushtiman7ti075]

Yeah… If you are one of the protagonists you make them into badass mobile suits

[@darthhiro7425]

No armour is better than plot armour

[@CrazyPlatinum92]

What is this a walking War Museum ?

[@chrisphelps4552]

They got guts attacking in ancient suits like those.

[@magnoliaeclair7822]

Zeon triggred

[@JeanLucCaptain]

Nice reference 👍

[@CrazyPlatinum92]

Zhengkang Vijaya well they put much of a fight than the Feddies

[@CrazyPlatinum92]

I wonder why the nemo wasn't on this list

[@marcosdheleno]

in defense of the aries, it was never intended to fight a gundam, its main role was that of aerial support. basically it was the equivalent of an helicopter. it was great at its job, and for mass production, i makes sense to have a dedicated flight capable unit, that is also able to fight on the ground.

[@Sierlea]

And it didn't perform badly against contemporary ones like Leos. The big problem was the whole generation was obsolete.

[@basteala525]

@@Sierlea Those are fair points, and the Ares wasn't useless, but it was certainly more outdated than the Leo in the end, as the Leo and its more versatile armaments could sometimes surprise a Gundam, whereas an Aries was almost always fodder. Helicopter is the perfect comparison, though. The Aries was essentially a patrol unit to spot trouble, and either deal with it or call for backup.

[@barrybend7189]

Those engines on the Ares were used on some Leo variants to improve their mobility.

[@nathanjones6638]

On a slightly related topic (pertinent to Gundam Wing) I find it rather amusing that the only mobile suit that can really go toe-to-toe with a Gundam in single combat is the most outdated mobile suit in existence, the Tallgeese.

[@demomanchaos]

@@nathanjones6638 The Tallgeese was old, but far from incapable. It was like the RX-78 in that it was the first prototype and was built to push the limits of the technology and was thus much more capable that the much less complex (Thus cheaper/easier to produce) models based off that prototype.

[@-ocean_vibes-7449]

“And we had to share the rock!” -Sgt. Johnson R.I.P

[@cissuperdroid]

Excellent Halo cameo! Johnson's such an amazing veteran!

[@VolticWind]

I feel that the Genoace being as bad as it was is an intentional narrative choice to make Flint and the Age-1 more impressive and basically single handedly turn the tide of the war.

[@Mgauge]

All that does is make the leadership of both sides seem wildly incompetent. The Federation for sending pilots to pointless deaths for a decade and a half and the Vagans for somehow not winning a war where the enemy is incapable of so much as damaging you in that same decade and a half.

[@twig4661]

the number one pick... with 15 years and no wins how is there still a war?

[@brodiecrain13]

Twig 46 Gundam Age's horrible writing

[@Vert344]

Yeeeaahh it wasn't a war... just simply sending Lambs to the slaughter.

[@barrybend7189]

Slowly replacing the genoace with shagdols and upgrading the Genoace to the Genoace 2 slowed the Vagen advance. After the first 15 years.

[@deadlyta]

If we were talking real life you just described Vietnam. Its takes more then winning battles to win a war I havnt seen that gundam yet just saying it's happened before

[@duelgundam]

To be fair: at the time of AGE's start, the Vagan were still proceeding with their invasion covertly, and moving with enough enigmatic knowledge about them(Unknown Enemy/UE), but without enough speed and force that would result in a large armed response(they only had ONE battleship, and a token battalion stationed at Ambat). Factor in the corrupt Federation leaders who KNEW about it, but kept any sizable force from responding to attacks at bay(because of the deal they made with the Vagan behind the scenes), and you have how the Federation managed to make do in the first 15 years of the war with only the Genoace. It was only after the Diva's victory at Ambat, that the public pushed for the Silver Chalice Treaty to be revoked, and increase production of weapons and MSs that were effective against the Vagan.

[@SerRompalot]

The Javelin was outclassed the moment someone thought rocket-powered subsonic spears were a better replacement for a beam weapon. It'd only be a good weapon if it flew at ICBM-speeds (Mach 15+).

[@Nehfarius]

You can blame the Crossbone Vanguard for that one, btw. They invented that shit.

[@PsydenIII]

When talking about Mobile Report Gundam Wing units, I think it is best to look at why they were, according to in-universe lore. The Leo was not an anti-MS unit, it was designed to defeat conventional tanks and such, which it did fairly well. The Aries, while out-classed by later units, would have been an excellent close-support unit, like an attack helicopter in support of ground forces. It could also pull double duty as a replacement for a Leo, even if it wasn't optimized for land combat. If you look a fighter jets of the time, it didn't look like they could carry heavy enough ordnance to do more than inconvenience an Aries. Of course, when the Taurus comes around, both the Leo and Aries are rendered obsolete.

[@gundamdragon]

One more fact for you was that Oz originally developed the Areas to give them an edge against the alliance when logged apparition day break since the leo was the alliance main ms and the taurs was for space battle

[@warmachine5835]

You can't forget the Zaku I from the OYW itself. While the technical first mobile suit used by Zeon, it was already slated for mothballs the moment the war broke out as the Zaku II was already in production. Nevertheless, as the war went on and Zeon found itself on its heels, it started putting the MS-05 back into service as it became more and more desperate. By Operation Odessa, it was horrifically outclassed by the Federation's mass production suits, and could only be reasonably expected to serve as a support weapon platform.

[@donovanbradford8231]

While a great point in a newbies hands much like in space the Zaku I would be a casket but on earth with pilots like the Midnight Fenrir a Zaku I could still be taken into battle and expected to return safely even as a first strike unit.

[@Lex-vd2is]

If only the Diva had a giant 3D printer to make a new rifle for the Genoace... this wasn't a problem of being outdated but characters being stupid for plot reasons.

[@SonicSP]

Lexkun They haven’t figured out how to mass produced it yet. The AGE System had to design one that fits the Genoace’s lesser power plant first. Hell it was noted that if took them 30 years to finally be able mass produce the AGE-1 because they had to simply a lot of things.

[@barrybend7189]

@@SonicSP actually they did as the DODs rifle has a separate battery.

[@marcosdheleno]

30 years is a LOOOOOOONG time to reverse engineer something, and by that i mean, you need a team of really incompetent researchers to NOT do it sooner. seriously, just by looking at it functioning, they should be able to see things they could do better. also, i highly doubt they couldnt make something better than a stake, as a melee weapon, this is crossbone "this machine is focused on speed, so we will give it a weapon that is WEAKER THAN THE ZAKU MACHINE GUN", levels of stupidity and plot contrivance...

[@vienlacrose]

That's what they get for surrendering their mental faculties and engineering prowess to a breadboard.... _notices technological singularity_ *"Aww shit, here we go again."*

[@cdeer17]

Just so you know guys the only reason there weren't better weapons by then is a ton of colonies believed those unidentified mobile suits to be a myth so that's why the Geno Ace was still the top suit to them also remember that one colony was using old ballistics level mobile suits to fight each other people do go on about the Geno Ace not getting a dots rifle but the technology wasn't strong enough for that time to produce a strong enough laser from the battery pack without some extra power from the generator and do remember that the age one was basically a colonies pet project in reality to how much actual support it would have gotten also the technology was mostly taking so long cuz until kid got the blueprint nobody was making this or trying to backwards engineer it it was basically a whole new system having to be done by scratch even with blueprints and information

[@aaronluisdelacruz4212]

In the Semi striker's defense, the pilot of the Efreet Scheind is Fred Reder. The same pilot of the Pixie Gundam.

[@southy98]

This seems to be a running theme with the Federation.

[@whee38]

Of course, how would Zeon Remnants maintain parity with the Federation in they maintained a modern combat force. It wouldn't be as exciting then!

[@satriaputrapratama4703]

Decades of war did not help Fed's military budget at all

[@spartana1116]

@@satriaputrapratama4703 or have it blown up several times

[@SandwichRobot]

5:22 everybody gangster till Amuro shows up in wing.

[@davidvasquez08]

Bwoah, I’d never noticed

[@AgaiLazen]

7:00 You know, it's kinda funny. Pickaxes and shovels actually *were* used in real wars, notably in WWI as an entrenching tool for creating better shooting positions and...latrines, and in WWII where German and British armies adopted a folding design and could even be mounted as a beyonet for use as a mine-prodder. Modern "combat spade" designs even have a toothed edge and a curved edge for sawing and gouging. Wouldn't it be awesome to see a mobile suit with weapons this useful? Closest we have is Daibouken from Boukenger. You know, the Sentai super robot. Also, can we please get a gunpla of the Genoace Fox Custom? That thing is beautiful.

[@jeff3221]

A pickaxe would be a pretty valuable weapon for a ms to have. You'd more than likely be able to punch a big ass hole through the weak points in armour. Additionally, if you were able to disable it with just one swing you'd have a tonne of undamaged parts to cannibalise and possibly even an enemy pilot to interrogate.

[@tedhodge4830]

Meanwhile the heat axe is butt and the beam axe from the Geara Doga doesn't seem to be much better. Mobile suits would actually be way cooler with the Zaku II High Mobility Type heat dagger/bayonet used in Cucuruz Doan's Island, or the beam bayonets of the GP01, or even the beam lance concept from the Zeta Gundam itself, all of which would probably have saved a lot of pilots' skin in a pinch Anyway, beam sabers exist in Gundam and are gigantic light sabers, I think they fit the use case pretty well in universe considering how they are portable, cheap and everywhere too, enabling a lowly grunt suit the ability to seriously damage mobile armors with concentrated beam energy capable of slicing through Gundarium armor

[@dk2k1]

To me, the Genoace deserves the number one spot because of one reason- It seems like it was DESIGNED to fail. The other suits were good for their time, and you can argue that the Aries was simply a failed experiment. But the Genoace? With how weak its weapons were-especially the stick- there seems to be no conceivable way anyone could expect any results from it. In fact, I don’t think it’s fair to call the Genoace outdated because it’s the Mobile suit equivalent of Tiger Electronic Games as described by the AVGN- they were never INdated to begin with.

[@terradrone3905]

Agreed. Funnily enough the Genoace itself isn't that shit seeing O'Brian's O custom could go toe to toe with even new gen Vagan MSs, it's just for the longest time Fed Command outright _refuses_ to give it better weapons. That stick and lackluster spray gun just doomed it to fail.

[@boxtank5288]

The Genoace: The Bob Semple of Mobile Suits.

[@FLJBeliever1776]

@@boxtank5288 - More like a Tankette and/or Interwar Tank Design and Concept. And that's if you want to go in that discussion Though, honestly, to me it seems like it was meant to be a Peacekeeper than a Warfighter. But who would they be keeping the peace safe from? The stick makes sense if you were talking the Gundam version of Patlabor. But you're talking a frontline combat unit. Even in Peacekeeping Operations, you'd be dealing with guys with firepower that can be basic to intermediate Military Hardware. Otherwise, just call the Police out. They can handle it.

[@boxtank5288]

@@FLJBeliever1776 I say Bob Semple because of the similar origin (Labor Unit turned into a crappy Military Asset)

[@FLJBeliever1776]

@@boxtank5288 - The Bob Semple wasn't the only of its kind. Trust me. That wasn't a half bad idea, but the only one to get worldwide fame. Or rather, infamy. Really, in hindsight, the Bob Semple Tank is just a very big Tankette which had very much similar performance values and designs. If I recall right, Bob Semple also wanted actual Medium Machine Guns, but was stuck with Brens. He also wanted a cannon, but none were available. Pretty much stuck with what he was given to use.

[@nm2358]

Yep, Leo did grapple Wing Gundam in the first episode. Seems like when you put an Ace in them they can handle even the most potent of suits.

[@striker0]

Same when Lady Une went up against the Shenlong in episode 7 or 8, I forget which. But then again, that one had a flight pack on it. Oh and when Trieze used one against units that were equipped with the Mobile Doll system.

[@Wing0Alchemist]

striker0 And Heero vs Wufei in Altron Custom during Endless Waltz

[@basteala525]

I imagine the biggest problem with the Leo was probably the inability to carry a really potent beam weapon, so in order to threaten someone in something like a gundam, you either really needed to be good with a dobergun...while dealing with the extra weight, or getting close and personal with the beam saber. Both of those take way more skill than you could ask from the average pilot, but may also explain why the Leo could sometimes pull a miracle out of its ass.

[@KyriosMirage]

@@basteala525 Recall that Trowa used a Leo to blow up Deathscythe with a Taurus Space Laser while taking the OZ entrance exam. We also see one use a heavy over the shoulder beam cannon to blast a shuttle taking off from a colony in the opening narration for episode 1. So the Leo could carry the really big guns, but I suspect they'd have put a major damper on its mobility.

[@Goji1]

Endless Waltz Heero fought Wufei's upgraded Altron Gundam with an outdated Space Leo

[@vustvaleo8068]

while the 300 year old MS's from Iron-Blooded Orphans are still seen capable of going toe to toe with the current models e.g. a Graze, still not sure about the dug up ancient MS's from Turn A though.

[@CarolusMagnus2501]

Because no one made new suits for centuries. Or innovated at all. IBO is a silly show.

[@atastydonut]

toe to toe? you mean taking on multiple modern suits at once because gundam frames are really damn powerful in the ibo universe

[@azizabdul8914]

honestly they could have just set the Calamity War in 50 years or less and literally nothing will lost at all.

[@Lelouchxzero1]

also they weren't being produced but found so I don't think they really count.

[@hauptmann_ivan]

NoGoufy more like no one CAN make new Gundam frames.The technology just sucks after the war.

[@krysle3337]

Can someone explain actually why most main MSs are "prototype"? What do they consider " fully combat-ready"? Hell, even the Nu was a prototype.

[@Arrowdodger]

Actual answer: same reason so many mobile suits are "Kai" or "Custom" when it barely makes any sense. Japan thinks it sounds cool. That, and they want the Gundam leads to be a rarity in most cases, to make them seem more special.

[@seb24789]

"Full combat ready" mostly means "affordable and not a complete walking deathtrap". Why most main characters get fancy prototypes? To stand out more, i suppose. And to sell more toys of course.

[@jesta7837]

Prototype just means it's the first or preliminary model for the other mass production MS and serves as a template. So it can be combat ready and extra fancy since they don't have to worry about how expensive it is to develop it. But prototypes aren't always fancy though. Waff from Gundam Origin is a prototype MS but not necessarily combat ready.

[@DESTRAKON]

sleeb, correct

[@Darkthal]

The reason prototypes are given to, the main characters is another topic to be discussed. To answer question, it’s because in the very first gundam series. The Federation realized if they were going to fight the Zeon’s mobile suits. They needed to build prototype mobile suits, that would survive actual combat with other mobile suits like the zaku. So when it came time to build the the prototypes they used, Luna Titanium Alloy for the armor materials. Luna Titanium was designed for use inside of nuclear fusion reactors, so that means the material is strong as hell. It’s also lightweight compared to Titanium Alloy. There is more than this, on the reason why prototypes for main combat.

[@carlosmaciel2676]

To be fair the Aries was more of a patrol unit and it was actually really good against the Leos. Ace pilots could do real damage with it too.

[@heirtoroma4152]

Jerid... King of L’s in all of Gundam

[@agentmonika2521]

My favourite outdated machine must be the Zudah. High performance, and also a great tool for committing suicide by overheating the engine

[@javierpatag3609]

You just gave me more reason to try to kitbash the Tiltrotor Pack on a Leo...

[@marioishifranz2326]

Genoasis was good imo, refitting lesser MS units with better armor and gear. Although Desparato units also seem a bit competant when reapplied in battle.

[@japanesesandman]

AMX-003 Gaza-C. Falls apart after transforming a few times? Only good for 3 combat missions before breaking regardless of being hit or not? (Do NOT) sign me up!

[@kakarot197]

I wasn't sure if that made it outdated or just plain bad lol. It's like a disposable mobile suit.

[@teslashark]

It's disposable and basically a high-end machinegun Toyota, sure, but Haman uses it herself before the big Q is finished.

[@Nehfarius]

That's why they followed it up with the Gaza-D. Like the Gaza-C, except it doesn't suck.

[@bluedestiny2710]

I think that was a design flaw more than outdated, considering the Gaza C could still keep up with modern weapons during thr Gryps conflict...

[@Jim-Tuner]

The Gaza-C was the first mass-production transformable mobile suit. The design was very innovative, but beyond the ability and resources of Neo Zeon to successfully manufacture when they were outside the earth sphere. After neo-zeon returned to the earth sphere, they started producing much better suits that were still extremely innovative in design. In my opinion they had the best weapons systems of anyone from the end of Zeta Gundam all the way through Char's Neo Zeon. And the Nu Gundam was only able to be produced because Neo-Zeon (Char) gave them with the technology.

[@joshstreet6819]

I personally love the RGM-179 GM II and RGM-86 GM III even though they were both out dated when they went into production.What can I say I love the GM mobile suit.

[@Nehfarius]

It's not fair to the GM3 to compare it to the GM2. As far as I know, the GM3 was a very decent MP-type mobile suit.

[@valsioncustom]

@@Nehfarius Yes! The GM III is great!

[@GonnaDieNever]

@@Nehfarius the GM II was also great, exceeding the RX78 in most regards, like most of these units it just stayed in service too long.

[@Nehfarius]

@@GonnaDieNever More that we see it in the wrong era. The GM2 was made for the late OYW and a little beyond it, kind of like the Hizack was.

[@crescentschwarz8714]

No one wants to put in "regretable" cannon fodder.

[@jeromekhies4948]

how about that Longgest biggest canyons you have there.

[@basteala525]

I think the big selling point of the Leo was just how flexible it was, and how--by all accounts--it was still a scaled down Tallgeese. The fact that it could carry a dobergun and shield reliably was nothing to scoff at, considering how cheap the mobile suit was--and you could essentially use a budget beatdown strategy of lots of Leos with doberguns. We actually kind of see that when Duo and Quatre attack the Singapore Spaceport Base. The fact that its able to use things like the taurus beam rifle isn't bad either. Honestly, most of the time the Leo failed less because of the Leo itself, and more because the Mobile Dolls in a mobile unit like the Taurus was way too fast for the slower reflexes of the Leo's human pilots.

[@DeamonChocobo]

So one issue I have with the Aires on this list is that, at the time of rollout, the Flight Pack for the Leo hadn't been made yet and the most the advanced enemy they would be fighting were the Maganac suits.

[@ZeonicZaku1-Zeon_Grunt_Suit]

Despite how much People dislike the GM II, I'm a big grunt suit guy and I like it. the shoulders look better and the backpack has two extra verniers, and with all the other extra touch-ups like the antenna and chest sensor make it feel like it should've been everything the OYW GM was in the first place, with the most noteable touch-up being the Beam rifle. Also not ALL GM IIs were refitted OYW GMs, RMS-179 units were brand new and the RGM-79R units were refitted GMs.

[@thithanhhoapham2616]

ZeonicZaku1 well that explain 2 serial numer

[@lacarthcinclair5401]

Heck yeah. I love the GM II. It has that perfect "unimportant" look while still looking cool. Plus, I just like the generic Joe-Shmoes in just about everything, like the Imperial Guard in Warhammer. They win through the sheer combined weight of their adamantine balls.

[@wackydude101]

I wouldn't have said the aries wasn't an outdated machine it was just designed for a different role. It was designed for air superiority so to content with smaller fighters it had to be light to be quick and nimble. The leo flight pack also didn't allow for high continuous flight.

[@megacat4529]

I want a heat stick.

[@JosephJoboLicayan]

Too be honest, both the Hizack and Galbaldy make no sense at all. By the time the Hizack was deployed en masse the Fed/Titans already had generators/reactors capable of using beam weaponry effectively enough, ie the GMs. Another thing that doesnt make sense is that it looks WAAAY too much like a Zaku. By that point the Zaku wouldve become a symbol of infamy, war, oppression, death, maybe terrorism, and a symbol of the enemy. Its really a good way for the Titans to tell the entire Earth Sphere that: "HEY! WERE THE NEW BAD GUYS NOW!" even though their entire budget was reliant on the Federation. Even worse still, they gave it 2 shields yet it doesnt increase its defensive capabilities AT ALL. I dont know about you guys, but I dont think its a good idea that you should look like the enemy that youre hunting, ie Zeon Remnants. I also have a feeling some of the Titans' pilots would be unable to pilot a Hizack due to trauma from the One Year War (Keep in mind, it is probably the bloodiest war in all of Gundam except for Gundam X. Also, it took only a few months for half the Earths population to die as well. Trauma hits hard as evidenced by both World Wars which were a sneeze in comparison to the OYW.) because of how much it resembles the Zaku, atleast the green colored ones. The Galbaldy is listed as a Mass Production MS even it should be listed as a Limited Production MS due to the fact we only see it for 1/4 or even less of the entire Zeta Gundam show. It looks to be based on Zeon tech, namely the Gelgoog (which was state of the art) and actually had bigger and better potential than the Hizack. Problem is, why did nobody in the Titans bother to truly mass produce this!? Its better than the Hizack in all aspects except for price. You could say both thr Hizack and Galbaldy were eclipsed by the Marasai but the Hizack was around before the Grpys war up til its end and it performed miserably. This prolly also stands as the designers' fault forgetting that their antagonists (Titans) are part of the Federation AND NOT ZEON.

[@CarolusMagnus2501]

The Hizack is cheaper, and having "Zakus" terrorize the colonies is hilarious.

[@ITSPLANEWHACKHIM]

It was mostly from zeta's heavy handed writing. if it was standard feddie gear, the AEUG would then be compared to zeon who as last shown were 'bad'. So make the 'new' bad guys have zeon looking gear= simple to pick up. also, GM's aren't nearly as "oh shit" as "zaku looking thing with more spikes than the average mad max raider"

[@dagonfell1566]

the Marasai was worse than the Galbady Beta

[@waropton]

Galbaldy Beta was developed from Galbaldy Alpha witch was one of MS competing for mass production with Gelgoog, next Hizack was developed at Anahaim Electronics after they absorbed Zeonic, Zimmad and others Zeon arms companies, witch is why it looks like Zaku and was rollouted sligtly before or around time Federation started to upgrade old GM to GM II, to replace GM Quel for the Titans, and GM Quel also had problem with beam guns, also it was seen most out of GM II and Galbaldy Beta as those too where mostly used by Federation and not Titans, dou im not saying that they didn't used it, couse they did just in smaller numbers, much smaller numbers, as Galbaldy was seen as Federation ace unit, and GM II was well something like a Federation face at the time.

[@teslashark]

The Galbaldy Alpha is basically a Gelgoog and Gyan hybrid, but the Hizack... Just how many subsidies is the Federation handing out? What happened to Doms?

[@thearisen7301]

But the Aries was able to regularly beat Leos? Oz forces used them to great effect against the EF's Leos.

[@basteala525]

The Leo strikes me as one of those suits that was unremarkable, but could be pushed to do more given its more versatile loadout of weapons, and thus having more options with a creative, experienced mind. The Aries, on the other hand, kind of had what it had and that was it. Wing mooks in generally struggle a lot with speed, though. Look at how the Taurus mobile dolls mopped the floor with pretty much any unnamed pilot.

[@TheRealTerranMarine]

You could easily make at least an elite variant by using the same materials as a regular gundam, change the power core within it to allow the thrusters to adapt to the armor's weight and change the weapons up.

[@Feronen]

My favorite, least-effective masspro mobile suit HAS to be the Zaku I, though. It saw use by militia forces as late as the UC100s and was outperformed by EVERYTHING. Even the mobile suits listed here could beat them out, but the Zaku I's versatility just makes it so worth having that getting rid of them was just not something anyone could do.

[@duelgundam]

In fact, around the time of the original series' end, the original plan Zeon had for the Gelgoogs was to issue them to veteran pilots, of whom a majority decided to stick with their trusty Zaku IIs, or requisition one of the MASSIVE amounts Zaku Is lying around in storage at A Baoa Qu, because it was much more familiar, and there was little to no down time to receiving those machines, compared to the much more complex and slow-deploying Gelgoogs, leading to not enough experienced pilots for what was supposed to be the Zeon equivalent of the Gundam.

[@boxtank5288]

@@duelgundam which is a shame because the Gelgoog had some genuinely horrific weapons that would have savaged the Federation like a Tiger with a Wildebeast. A Beam Naginata and Beam MACHINEGUN. That's bursts of Ship-Killing shots that recharge when the clips are mounted onto the 'belt'.

[@TheStephenShow]

I felt like the Jegan and the GM II/Hizack should have switched places on this list. At least the Jegan had a reason for losing badly to the Crossbone Vanguard Mobile Suits. There wasn't a major war for decades. In the GM II and the Hizack's case, it's only been 4 years between Operation Stardust and the Gryps War.

[@w4rr10r11]

The comparison of the Mark IV and the Genorace is a very loose comparison bordering on wrong. While the Federation based it on a pre-existing chassis that was in manufacture at the time in the anime, the designers of the Mark IV designed the tank with civilian tractor parts to build the tank. There was never a tractor that looked like the Mark IVs. Like I said, it's very similar in terms of using civilian parts to make a war vehicle, but the means of producing them is completely different.

[@Victor-056]

7:00 "Used a Heat _shovel-"_ Elsewhere in another universe, several Korpsmen of Krieg felt the Urge to hold their shovels aloft in respect for a fellow Shovel Enthusiest.

[@ight9365]

The only reason why I love the leo is cuz Heeto/Heero was a straight beast in a leo. That's why the Leo is my favorite mass produced suit

[@sithmaster4305]

I'll clarify it for you his name is Heero, or if you're japanese Hiro.

[@williamstellmon7565]

That is the reason why I feel heero is the best of all time. No other main character ever is seen doing so much with so little.

[@Xenobears]

I always thought of that scene where Heero fights all the Virgo mobile dolls in a Leo as an extreme case of plot armor. Every other Leo on the field explodes from glancing blows and near misses… Then Heero takes dozens of direct hits and suffers an arm malfunction-that’s it.

[@alarkhar]

I'm kind of astonished that he didn't even mention the ZakuTank - I mean, "take a Zaku 1 Torso, slap it on tank treads and call it a day" was possibly the most ridiculous decision a commanding officer ever made. The only good thing the ol' Z-Tank had for it was that it was VERY modular - cripple a section? Just snap it off and add another. Also, it was quite fast for what amounted to the Boss Borot of Gundam history. But the main problem with the Z-Tank was... elevation. Or, rather, the lack of it. The only way the little heap of junk had to fight flying units was to actually lift the entire front of the tank, as the only ranged weapon it had was a front-mounted heavy machine gun. Funnily enough, the Z-Tank is among my favorite units...

[@swordimpulse07]

0:59 In Gihren's Greed, GM II's can be developed earlier and participate in the One Year War.

[@Mudrock29]

How were the GM II there?

[@XerxesTheUndead]

Mudrock29 once you reach the higher tech levels in the OYW stage, you’ll unlock units from 0083 which includes the GM II and use them in the end game

[@Ryan3d]

It's worth playing Gihren's Greed? i would love to play it but the lack of translation is kinda intimidating to a heavy text game unlike SRW.

[@spacedead123]

I would say it's worth it if you like strategy games.The only things you would need to know is what everything does and events. Lucky for you the wiki basically has everything.

[@Ryan3d]

Thanks for the answer mate ! i'll give it a try !

[@teslashark]

The Gafran, i.e. Dragon Zaku, is used 60 years after its first appearance. How did it perform? Still better than Genoace successors!

[@Nehfarius]

Clearly, the Vagans make good MS, whereas the Genoaces just couldn't keep up. That's why they eventually built Shaldolls and Adeles.

[@barrybend7189]

Basically think outer sphere mercs to inner sphere patrols from Battle tech.

[@SonicSP]

Clanches best them.

[@darkusblader]

@@Nehfarius well the adele is the mass production version of the age 1 normal

[@danielmcphee2546]

i liked the jegan and the hizack. Funny how modern armors and vehicles take about 20-30 decades of service or longer before replaced. But In gundam universe their often always replacing the mobile suits. Least in mechwarrior/battletech the mechs tend to have much longer life span. (minus few mechs that were terrible)

[@ZeonicFenrir]

Great video! I do want to add my two cents in the matter, namely in the case of the Gryps era MS: In the mechatalk forums the issue of the Hizack frequently came up. In one of the last threads on the subject we discussed how the Galbadly Beta, Hizack and GM II were quickly developed in UC 0084 and began full deployment by the next year. By UC 0086 projects for improving these units, such as the Galbadly Beta High Mobility Type, RX-107 Rosetta and in theory the RGM-86R GM III, were already underway. However, the movable frame enters the picture and supposedly it’s such a major innovation that these projects need to be rescoped. We could assume that the main difference between the RX-107 and RMS-108 could be precisely the implementation of the movable frame. Likewise, we could consider that the reason for the GM III’s odd model number is that the upgrade was planned for UC 0086, but the design had to be changed to include movable frame technology, thus pushing back its deployment a couple years (possibly also to make the upgrade more substantial than the upgrade from GM to GM II was). Ultimately this means that we have 3 mass production type MS that were introduced as the EF’s response to Operation Stardust and which were already rendered obsolete with the introduction of movable frame technology just 3 years later. For what it’s worth, there was an old concept about MS generations, with 2nd generation units being MS which use beam weapons as their standard armament, have a panoramic cockpit & linear seat, use Gundarium Gamma alloy for its armor material and finally also have a movable frame. Any MS that fell short of one of the 4 requisites were sometimes called 1.5 gen MS, which would be the case of not only the 3 aforementioned MS, but also units like the RX-178 (due to its titanium ceramic armor), the Rick Dias (which uses a Block Build Up construction similar to the Gaza C’s) and even the Nemo (uses Gundarium Beta for its armor material).

[@themagicalrobotprisma2793]

You gotta hand it to the earth federation for their outstanding competence in using the cheapest parts along with a good old designs that'll never be out of date.

[@TreeStupid-xy3wi]

True

[@thefez-cat]

If you can't win ANYTHING for 15 years, how the hell do you even have an army at all at that point?

[@twilight_phantom2969]

Personally I love the GM 2 and 3, partially because of the battle of Torrington base

[@Arrowdodger]

GM III is at least WAY better than the GM II, so there's that.

[@wasdwazd]

Torrington Base was MSV porn.

[@twilight_phantom2969]

Kyle Morgan it is, and it's glorious!

[@user-Jay178]

Wireless_Phantom yeah

[@valsioncustom]

I've always thought that a series from the perspective of the Earth Federation before Char's Counterattack, with Jegans being State-of-the-art technology ace units, and GM III's being the main unit would be dope. I've always liked the GM III, its such a nice suit, but we only see it when it's outclassed.

[@KamiPyro]

7:22 I have to say, from my work experience, people dont care that something isnt working because the money has already been spent to make what is current so I guess Gundam really shows that off

[@ludovicocammisa9320]

Also, please make a video about the OZ suits...They deserve more love

[@tatsuyah4695]

Especially Leos. For all the jokes that explode on them, they deserve a little bit of redemption.

[@baron_bananas]

Higher specs than a Zaku 2

[@adumbedgyname7158]

"Higher specs than a Zaku 2" Higher specs, probably, than a Jegan or Geara Doga.

[@hyperiongm330]

>Higher specs than a Jegan >Baseline TV show Leo. I sincerely doubt Bandai would ever let it have specs like that. Especially considering the HGAC is out and they usually put out some basic tech specs with the kit's manual. I mean for chrissake the Leo is literally made out of the same metal as the basic GM, and later MS in the early UC boast titanium alloy ceramic composites instead and rarely if ever field ballistic weapons for whatever reason. Note that by the time Wing's plot goes live the Leo line is 10 years old, essentially making the current model seen in the show basically GM IIs/GM IIIs with less weapons variety and worse armor/thrust in space than the GM III if they've been upgraded even remotely comparably. Which seems doubtful given that there was no real *need* to upgrade the Leo dramatically, just simple block updates that upgrade computers, control units, and joint systems or the such until the rumors of Operation Meteor started popping up and then the Gundams shredded everything in their path. Contrast this to UC where every five years until 0097 it seems that Zeon would crawl out of the Woodwork with a bunch of new high performance MS that the Federation would spend billions on R&D countering. So the Leo is literally just a Hizack/GM II expy since the conflict in Wing is closer thematically to Zeta's than OG Gundam, and probably has comparable performance to them to boot. The Taurus I can believe being Jegan/Doga tier because it absolutely thrashes everything that's not a Virgo or special custom/experimental including the ground optimized 1st Gen colony Gundams, but not the bog standard Leo, which gets trashed by every other MS in the series. That said, the handful of ace custom Leos used by OZ Prize in G-Unit and the Leo IV (Grief) in Frozen Teardrop and Glory of the Losers on the other hand are a different story. Those I can see being a viable threat on paper specs alone to a Jegan or Doga/Zulu, especially since the Leo IV is a baby Tallgeese. All of this aside, the pilot has a lot to do with the performance of the machine they're piloting. And not just Wing's bullshit plot armor. Most of the average mooks in Wing couldn't fight anyone more competent than other random faceless Guerrilla mooks who were on *foot* due to lack of anti-MS training given how the Maganacs shredded them without the Gundams' direct help. Any trained Feddie or Zeek pilot would absolutely tear them apart.

[@basteala525]

One thing worth mentioning about the Leo: When fighting tooth and nail against the White Fang and their Virgo IIs, most of the World Nation's mobile suits were Leos.

[@GurrenTheStormbolt]

Hmmm... Plan on doing a top 5 state of the art mobile suit list?

[@edmondchan3426]

It'd have to be mass production models versus prototypes, otherwise it's just what Gundams were most advanced for their time, like 00 compared to...everything before GN Drive Tau

[@GurrenTheStormbolt]

EcchiBunny what about if they are not gundam type suits

[@christophercombs7561]

Gurriith The Stormbolt well i only really watched wing with any ammout of enthusiasm so serpents or white Taurus for stae of the art production suits the tallgese 1,2,and 3 for prototypes

[@edmondchan3426]

Gurriith The Stormbolt now that would be interesting, like the much coveted "Gundams Destroyed by Non-Gundam Mobile Suits"

[@TheDansonT]

Great video! It really raises the question of how far an "outdated" mobile suit can perform if an ace pilot is behind the controls. I'm reminded of Char vs The O & Quebley, newtype powers aside, I believe Char's battle experience saved him from destruction.

[@mix-up9003]

I did love the Hi-zak and the Heavygun designs back in the day I was really into Gundam. I also did liked a lot of the Gundam X series MS in it as with how customizable they seemed to be, always had a soft sport for actual grunt MS'

[@SoloAxlion]

To perhaps be fair on the Genoace's case, it's weapons and armor were probably fine or good against other suits before the Veigan showed up with their developed-from-advanced-tech MS.

[@AzureRoseMarshal]

replying to a 3 years old comment lol. but yeah the only other mobile suits were civilian and paramilitary ones, still using machine guns

[@pristine3094]

twist with genoace. 3rd vegan war. new adele and clanche. and there's a guy with blue genoace. wreck both ghirarga and farsia.

[@LuckySolshot]

To be fair Obright's Genoace was originally a Genoace II which was an amazing step above the old Genoace with armor, weaponry and performance right on par with the AGE-1 and Obright being a great pilot with experience to come at the 3rd generation time and his Genoace being heavily modified

[@pristine3094]

imo genoace 2 actualy not really on par with age 1 since it just a wolf genoace custom but massproduc, adele is more fit for that and adele is basically a age 1 but grunt.

[@gunznblades3547]

In the end, the Genoace was underpowered, the Genoace Custom changed the head, shoulders, backpack, and rifle but didn't do so well + it had so little screen time, the Genoace II was a mass-produced Genoace Custom with a better rifle and a beam saber, and the Genoace O-Custom changed the head, shoulders, backpack, and rifle. The body, legs, arms, and shield were never changed on any of theses.

[@Felix24148]

I almost thought I'd see the MS-05 Zaku 1 in the list. But that machine did kick ass with the right pilot

[@arx3516]

I think that in the end th GM series did much more for the federation than that single RX-78 unit. By the way, i think that all the mass production models in the various series suffer from a bad red shirt syndrome.

[@themagicalrobotprisma2793]

ARX 351 the gm even looks like it's wearing one

[@barrybend7189]

Well during the one year war the Gundam was a symbol so it was a high priority target for zeon much like how char was a symbol for zeon.

[@DeathToJihad]

Well, technically there were a few others, the RX-79[G] battalion from 08th MS Team.

[@marcosdheleno]

lets be honest here, Amuro's contribution in that last fight were so focused on taking down Char's zeong, that i dont think he did add that much to the fed's victory. not saying that he wasnt important, far from it, without him, Char would have decimated the fed army. thing is, Char actually did more to end the war, than amuro.

[@magnatcleo2043]

To some degree, I think the Gundam's, and by extension Amuro's , reputation was its most powerful weapon. Consider how many prototypical mobile suits and armors, and they're respective ace pilots, were wasted in trying to destroy it, and the resource drain that caused for Zeon. Amuro's direct contribution to the war wasn't significant, but he was the perfect distraction for the Federation.

[@DEFC0NZER0]

In defense of the Aries.... "It's not the plane, it's the pilot." -US Navy Aviation Lieutenant Bradley "Rooster" Bradshaw

[@TheHobgoblyn]

I don't see any justification for the Hi-Zacks here as they were the elite mass production suit at the beginning of that series. And people were more or less able to keep up with a Gundam in them and they kept pace with the Galbaldy. In terms of mass produced mobile suits, they were only surpassed by the Marasai and Barzam during that series. And I am not even sure the Marasai counts as a real mass production suit as it was more of a commander suit and the Barzam came so late that it really didn't do much. The Zaku I and Guntank in the original Gundam series were far more outdated.

[@LeoMidori]

These are all fair points. The Marasai wasn't an awful suit, I'd say it's about comparable (aside from speed) to even the Gundam Mk. II or Rick Diaz. However the Barzam really was a highly disappointing mass production model, basically on par with the Nemo and was far too little too late for the TITANS. The Zaku I was absolutely outdated, which is why the Zaku II was already the face of Zeons forces for a long time. The Guntank was essentially just a proto/test type model to get some of the mechanics down and learning to use the alloy materials for production. At least it wasn't so bad that they completely phased it out, using the mass produced version as support artillery in an otherwise close range war.

[@snowtree07]

Leaving aside on weather or not the Hi-Zack was trash tier during the the Gryps Conflict, they would have been very effective in the One Year War (especially if it was mass-produced in the middle stages of the war). The Hi-Zack is essentially a poor-man's of the Gelgoog, aside from being able to use beam weaponry (which by its self was already a game changer for Mobile Suits during that time), It is also faster and more agile then that of a Zaku (probably only being surpassed by "Too expensive to mass-produce" High-Mobility Type R2s), and most impertinently of all they were easy to pilot making them ideal for rookie pilots. Just leave out the beam sabers and focuses on the beam refiles. Although, I will admit whether or not adding them to the fold would turn the tide of the war in Zeon's favor is up for debate. And before anyone makes a comment about this possibility being moot because the Hi-Zack incorporates technologies from the Federation and Zeon, keep in mind that the beam rifle used by the Gelgoog was developed by incorporating the Federation's technical data on Energy CAP technology that Zeon obtained via Side 6 during the war.

[@Nehfarius]

@@LeoMidori That same logic is why they continued to make Guncannon variants too: there will always be room for at least mid-range fire support in war.

[@scottprice4955]

Not gonna lie it would be kinda cool to see aGoblin Slayer styled story of a pilot stuck with an awful mass produced Mobile Suit, but they win battles through clever planning, tactics, and understanding the enemy weaknesses. All the while there is a "main character" running around in a Gundam we hear about every now and then. If such already exists please let me know. I'm still very new to the UC Timeline.

[@ludovicocammisa9320]

It's funny how a giant humanoid robot that's able to walk,fly and fight can be somehow outdated

[@brentwhite7150]

Ludovico Cammisa i know mobile suit technology advances too fast. Plus they keep making new suits instead of just a steady stream of upgrades.

[@RexWort]

Outdated by other humanoid mechs out preforming it

[@vustvaleo8068]

tell that to computers and smart phones.

[@marlondavis1230]

Do you think a P-51 Mustang from WW2 can go up against an F-22 Raptor from our era? I don't think so.

[@ludovicocammisa9320]

DarkAlex1978 pensavo di essere l'unico italiano a seguire kakarot197 ahaha...comunque a parte che i mobile suit si tagliano coi grissini, quello che volevo dire io è che dare del datato ad un macchinario che praticamente sfida le leggi della fisica è un po' assurdo ahaha

[@cultofmalgus1310]

I want a gundam RTS game that spans from the one year war to the end of Zeta. Including infantry, tanks, fighter jets, mobile suits, mobile armors, carriers, supply ships, the whole 9 yards really. MS teams would consist of 3 MS units. Char, Ramba, Mash, Gaia, Ortega, etc would be Hero units.

[@Saviliana]

I would suggest that they actually let us choose balls, I would like to use only balls and type-61 to clear that game if it ever existed.

[@99jmaster]

Is it just me or does he sound like the English va for Amuro but with an accent

[@FighterDoken]

You're wrong about the Ares/Leo thing. The Ares is a superior suit to the Leo in almost every way. Zechs just loved his Leo...

[@295Phoenix]

Leo had way better weapons, dawg.

[@acetraker1988]

5:08 "only machine guns and missiles." Very same clip 5:10 one using a beam rifle.

[@ZstackZip]

God that Sgt. Johnson bit had me rolling

[@YeagerBomb-ww3bn]

Good video. Keep up the good work. Suggestion, top best grunts units both Hero/ Villain factions?

[@ME-kx9od]

Yeager Bomb My favourite is the Geara Zulus and the ReZels

[@Laidengizer011]

A quote from a German World War II tank commander went something like this: "The Panzer was as good as five American tanks, but they always had 10." Not sure if I got the numbers right, but you get the picture. If there's enough of you, you can easily win. Even if your equipment is a bit inferior.

[@corporategunner5972]

In defense of the outdated EFF mobile suits, it isn't bad that an outdated military vehicle would still be used. An example of this would be the M1A2 Abrams, it was put into service in the early 80s and is still being used in the present day.

[@AzureRoseMarshal]

but the m1 abrams keeps getting updated, while these barely did

[@shinigamikira9469]

Not a vehicle but the Lewis gun was used until like the early 50s. And ofc the Ak47 is still used today.

[@Ausdoerrt]

IIRC, the early Zakus were also based on civilian machines, so these kinds of conversions don't have to be bad

[@GunMeister22]

My "favorite" outdated grunt suit is the GM cannon and GM III if that counts.

[@dagonfell1566]

GM Quel is my favorite outdated piece of shit MS, at least it looks good while it does not explode

[@tranz2deep]

As a second note (hence a seperate comment), Thank You Very Much! for not listing the mothball reclamations that Neo Zeon (with Sleeves) grabbed hold of in that episode of Unicorn. In all honesty, that's not deployment as much as it is carjacking,

[@jerrybot3000]

GM2 is not outdated, in the right hand it can defeat a Unicorn Gundam using pure skill and magic. Also bad mobile suits are only bad because the writers want them that way, kind of like how Storm Troopers only hit main characters when the story requires them to.

[@Lucivius27]

Good joke

[@DrForrester87]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH what?

[@Turbofurby]

Jerry Bot the GM II was basically a GM with the stats of the RX-78, and that's still pretty outdated by Zeta standards

[@dagonfell1566]

GM Powered was better but the feddies did not like it

[@dagonfell1566]

compared to the gundam, the gundam gp1-3 or the gundam MK2?

[@michaelnathan4221]

I love how there Talkabout this fictional cartoon robots like how a real military Analysis would.

[@tylerox9]

cool vid. id put leo and aries on the list. surprised no early MSs from Destiny. like Guaiz R and the Ginn/Dagger remodels pushed first before upgrades implemented

[@valsioncustom]

But... he did. And mentioned why they were or weren't on the list.

[@sideswipebl]

Is there some sort of rule that prevents people from remotely piloting mobile suits? Do they need a pilot inside them to work in the first place or what?

[@SonicSP]

Sideswipe A lot of times there’s jamming tech that prevents it. For example in UC Minovsky Particles jams radar and long range communications which makes what you’re saying impossible,

[@sideswipebl]

Ooooooooh, I see. Smart.

[@asebeleketo1466]

Why dont you get a fighter plane : to every mobile suit ever

[@Nehfarius]

"Because fighter planes can't hold melee weapons." -every Mobile Suit ever.

[@JeffroBaggins]

I love the Leo, it is my favorite mobile suit of all time, and I cannot WAIT for someone of your knowledge base to make a video talking about it.

[@wolfskid15]

Even if it's out dated I still love that A type Jegan

[@sithmaster4305]

I at least give the Jegan props that machine did its job for 30 some years until more advanced suits kicked its shit in.

[@user-Jay178]

Great video I love that your channel does gundam and really they should have replaced these units with better ones.

[@GodsPoisonSamael]

Can we all agree that the Zaku 2 is still one of the coolest "grunt" mecha in anime? Its so simple and "military" looking compared to some of these other series suits.

[@GhostBear3067]

It always struck me as akin to the Kalashnikov of mecha. Not particularly elegant, but effective and there are just so GODDAMN MANY IF THEM!

[@cinnabar546]

I don't understand the logic of the aries.. why not just build fighter planes..

[@abdellah7879]

Aries are superior To normal fighting jets

[@themrfives]

7:45 "Yeah just keep shooting, it's not going to-WHATTHESHI-"

[@Schregger]

Yeah, the Leo isnt the worse Mobil Suit... wait, thats not really much to cheer about, is it... Also, what was that catchy bit-tune?

[@adumbedgyname7158]

A Leo is probably superior to anything in the early UC timeline. Jegans going up against Leos with well-trained pilots probably wouldn't fair much better than they did against the Crossbone Vanguard's mobile suits. UC timeline mobile suits could afford to be big, slow moving behemoths due to the Minovsky particles interfering with long range weapons and radar. Without Minovsky interference, early UC mobile suits would be nothing more than gigantic coffins. The mobile suits of the AC timeline had to be designed for an environment without M-particle interference, thus they were first introduced as small and very lightweight when compared to their UC universe counterparts.

[@willyvereb]

Opposite, really. It'd be shocking if a Leo can stand up to a GM II. While Gundams in Wing are pretty neat UC has a more balanced lineup and at times ridiculous showings even for mook suits. UC beam weaponry are quite terrifying compared to the borderline wet fart such weapons are portrayed in most of the other Gundam universes. And your logic is backwards. Without sensors warning from long range the value of agility shoots way up. Even Zaku IIs were nimble enough to occaionally evade tank shells mid-flight and could rocket boost to cross miles or temporarily reach up to where jet fighters are to hit them with their fucking axes. Your argument that UC suits are bigger thus must be heavier and slower could have some merit... if evidences wouldn't actually point towards the exact oppose.

[@mlo009]

Tallgeese actually had a Leo head.

[@adumbedgyname7158]

"Opposite, really" Fanboy detected. But I'll humor you... "It'd be shocking if a Leo can stand up to a GM II." Ah. A giant, heavy, slow moving behemoth against a smaller, lighter, more agile opponent. Because Jegans fared so well in that scenario... Keep talking, kid... "UC beam weaponry are quite terrifying..." AC beam cannons are colony killers. "And your logic is backwards" Why are you talking to yourself in the 2nd person? I know your logic is backasswards, but keep going... "Even Zaku IIs were nimble enough to occaionally evade tank shells mid-fligh..." Which scene in which anime? "Your argument that UC suits are bigger thus must be heavier and slower could have some merit... if evidences wouldn't actually point towards the exact oppose." There's another way of saying that: "I don't know anything about the physics or the laws of the universe." -willyvereb Checks the specs, noob. A Leo is smaller and weighs much less than any pre-Gundam F91 mobile suit. It's going to be more agile simply because it's movements are on a smaller and therefore less clumsy scale... The Tallgeese itself pulls 15 Gs. The Taurus itself, a run-of-the-mill mass production mobile suit, can pull at least 8 Gs (Episode 18: Tallgeese Destroyed). And even then, there were rare incidents of Leos shooting down Tauruses and Virgos. A Leo is a god among insects compared to early UC mobile suits. You think a pathetic pre-Gundam F91 mobile suit can go up against that?

[@natsume-hime2473]

The number of Gs that a unit can attain isn't indicative of its usual performance. You'd need borderline super human pilots to withstand even a second worth of even 8G acceleration without sustaining serious injury. Then you also need to realize that for their size and weight, Leos are basically armored with tissue paper and have pitiful output in comparison to first and second generation One Year War mobile suits. That and in frame by frame comparison shots, the units you cite as being vastly superior operate at about the same level as the OYW suits are demonstrated to operate at. Then throw in the fact that Minovosky particle pollution would blind the sensors of anything from the After Colony time line... The advantages lay with the OWY suits and their more sophisticated sensor suites, heavier armor, and heavier fire power. Also... There are no concrete statistical statements on exactly what the capabilities of After Colony mobile suits are. They're just given a vague power rating in several categories. Which brings me to this: Before you go shouting "fanboy", it's best not to go fanboy in the other direction. Especially when it comes to Gundam Wing, a series where the concept of realism in physics is thrown completely out of the airlock. We never see any contemporary resistance for the Leos for one thing. What's even worse is the idea that a 16.2 meter tall mecha would weigh in at a measly 7 metric tons as its dry weight. Due to it's size, there is no way it would be able to even support itself at the stated weight. Unless it was completely immobile and had none of the equipment it's supposed to have to even move. Even if it could move, being made of alloyed titanium... At that weight... Any sudden acceleration, or deceleration and the thing would tear itself apart.