TPI MEGA TEST-WHAT WORKS BEST?

[@camaromustangmods3327]

Richard Holdner" So what did you guys think about the big intake shootout" I think it's the best video to date hands down. You keep raising the bar.

[@richardholdener1727]

thnx

[@xmo552]

@@richardholdener1727 What's the ECM?

[@jimdouglasgregory]

I will take the 530 ft lbs of the the tpis long runner. WOW

[@marcbrazzers]

I put as&m, ported stock plenum, accel/lingenfelter manifold, stock TB with airfoil, and make 271hp and 354 tq with a 305 (P&P heads, bigger cam, forged internals, bored over 0.030 which I guess makes it a 310ci). Going to keep entire top end (except will upgrade to 24lbs injectors) and replace block & heads with a 383 and AFR 195 heads which should yield similar numbers to this I think (500+ tq range and 400+ HP range)

[@cmcbunch]

Now imagine if you put a turbo on it with a air to water intercooler to make up for the loss of high rpm flow with boost. Best of both worlds. Sacrifice some top end HP for OUTSTANDING off idle response, drivability, and fuel economy when cruising but you got the hong kong hurricane for passing all these 20yr olds with 5.0L mouse stangs.

[@jeremypike9153]

That extrude honed stock intake surprised me the most. Definitely not the 500 hp mark but torque was as good as the TPIS whole package.

[@cmcbunch]

@@BuzzLOLOL yup. They are the best forced induction type for street driving. Turbo is best for peak output, centrifugal is best for ease of tuning, roots is best for price/perf in towing/mid rpm power. Each one has an application. Putting a twin screw on a TPI setup though would be interesting project due to mounting/hood clearance.

[@cmcbunch]

@@BuzzLOLOL you do if you want to maintain high torque production in that rpm band. boost just uplifts the torque curve that already exists. TPI is great for tq.

[@1970chevelle71]

This is a very good illustration of tuning with the intake manifold runner length, a 500 foot pound / 500 HP small block makes for a very enjoyable street engine.

[@FBobby]

This is Fantastic! More GOOD SOLID PROVABLE TPI info is what we need.

[@ilovethephilippines8991]

Absabloodylutely...

[@fernandopina4161]

Was hoping to see the newer FIRST tpi and FiTech ultra ram....

[@Redmist370Z]

I was thinking that you completely ripped this article off from...YOURSELF! Glad your still out there doing the lords work!

[@richardholdener1727]

I did! I do it all the time!

[@kristiankitsch6976]

​@@richardholdener1727 I have a question if you where to say put new heads, long tube headers upgraded pistons, cams with efi to run 91 octane would you still be able to put the engine in like a tow truck and be as reliable as a stock 305? The new engine is basically a race 305( minus the crank and rods) will it hold up as heavy 12k pound hauler or is this strictly a track setup engine?

[@zackchigo]

Love this. Built this engine with my Dad a few years back in our C4 based off the magazine print. 3k stall and 500ftlbs hits hard on the street in a 3,100lb vette.

[@cimism610]

Link to the article.

[@xmo552]

@@cimism610 10 times the torque The ultimate tpi shootout Google it. You can download the pdf

[@xmo552]

@@cimism610 It's called "ten times the boost"

[@xmo552]

Zach How did you tune it?

[@chrispompano]

Which TPI intake did you choose?🤔

[@RSChris666]

Would like to have seen a FIRST TPI intake thrown in as well.

[@johnclary729]

Looking at FIRST TPI it looks like the power would be much like the extrude hone or TPIS because it was just a big runner TPI. I saw a video of a 383 running the FIRST kzbin.info/www/bejne/ppfSkHeebLuVd9U and it's a little better than the factory TPI but without knowing the cam on the FIRST setup I couldn't say how much of an improvement over factory it was any.

[@bluecollarhotrods9781]

Just looked - they still produce/sell them. I am surprised, all the other intakes/runners in this test are hen's teeth nowdays.

[@DrewLSsix]

I know its more of a hack job but a converted LT1 manifold would have been cool, I doubt they were doing this back when the original tests were run but a decade ago they were the poor man's mini ram.

[@of_lion22]

@@DrewLSsix I don't see why using a converted LT1 intake would have significantly different results than the MiniRam used in the video.

[@adamarndt7617]

John Clary Those guys didn’t build a great crate with the FIRST. These guys at RCS sell a crate motor with 460 hp and 520 ft lbs. It’s so far beyond a factory TPI intake: rcsracingengines.com/Perf%20Crate%20Engines/Crate%20383%20HP460.T520%20SB%20Chevy%20EFI.html

[@corypierce202]

So cool to see all the old aftermarket TPI setups after all these years. I forgot about many of them

[@renwickconolly2839]

Richard's page is amongst the BEST on You Tube.. SUPER CONTENT that is well presented.. Wishing you much success!

[@richardholdener1727]

thnx for the support

[@paulverisor]

I performed a couple of these tests personally in a car on a 350. I had a stock tuned port and both TPIS set ups. The TPIS stuff is amazing on both long and short runner combos. It literally is just a trade as he says. In the car at the track both ran better than the stock but both ran exactly the same ET and MPH. The difference was how the car felt on the street. With the short runners, the car felt less snappy and soft to drive.

[@AP-vv1yu]

This guy always hits it out of the park with info/data! Keep it rolling man! 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@nowayjose596]

One thing you had to take into consideration was the huge drop between 1st and 2nd gear in the 700R4 - that's when the benefits of the extra torque of something like the SuperRam really shined in comparison to the Miniram. Now if you were running a T56 swap with steeper gears in the rear, sure, Miniram or Stealth Ram all day with a cam this size. But with a smaller cam better suited to it, 2800-3200 stall converter, and 3.27 stock rear end, I think the SuperRam would perform best overall.

[@JNAMOTORSPORTS]

You never heard of changing gears?

[@nowayjose596]

@@JNAMOTORSPORTS You mean that thing that's specifically mentioned in the original comment? 🤦‍♂️😂

[@xxxxxxxxxx6903]

The LPE SuperRam was designed to be smog compliant. The MiniRam, not so much. Depending where you live, that can be a major factor!

[@GIGABACHI]

GM TPI intake: Best n/a truck manifold . . . E V E R. 👌🏻😎👍🏻 I liked better the XTRUDE HONED combo. 😊👍🏻 Gains everywhere. 👌🏻

[@DrewLSsix]

Remember a guy with a worked over 305TPI in his chevy conversion van, thing apparently moved out well and returned north of 30mpg when cruising on the interstate.

[@shadowopsairman1583]

Erm the LM7 and LR4 and TBSS intakes are rockin.

[@xmo552]

My 85 GMC tow truck is getting a 400 TPI when the 350 needs a rebuild. Dad wants to fix up his old 88 caprice wagon and drive it to the grand canyon from SF Bay while maybe pulling a small trailer. It's a 305 TBI. It needs a new engine, been dead for years..... I think a 305 TPI might be the best for mpg AND torque.

[@samholcombe3129]

I never get tired of your videos, nobody else is doing so much research on L98 stuff as you, LS stuff too, much less sharing it. I’ve had several 3rd Gen L98 cars and have been wanting to LS swap one for a while, watching this has me thinking just build and stroke the L98 again, I never did more than bolt ons, cam and SLP shorter runners and throttle body. It would be nice to see all these setups at the drag strip to see which is faster in 1/8 and what’s faster 1/4 mile. That is a lot of work. Maybe I can just google them for 12 hours lol. Seriously thanks for making these videos Richard, I love them all.

[@icsamerica]

Thanks Richard... I think the origional test was called 10 times the Torque and it's how I arrived at my present setup. I've referred to it a lot over the years. I've got a mild cam (smooth idle) 406 with a Super Ram and a T56. Started with TPI, Tried bigger cams, and the Stealth RAM but went back to Superram with a mild 210/218 roller cam crutched with 1.7 roller rockers for a dead smooth idle good street manners. Makes all the power from 3500 to 5500 where I like it for my skill level on a road course. I recently got my first 6.0 LS2 and was surprised how much better the SBC was everywhere below 5500. The LS is getting twin turbos and mild cam soon but I still enjoy the SBC.

[@bartpang]

Cubic inches will do that.

[@mickeycruz912]

Thank you Richard... I would have liked to see the F.I.R.S.T TPI in there too

[@firstperformancecenter]

Would have been great!

[@Reffuhnayr]

I wish you could still buy all of these intakes 😢

[@frankmarson2425]

Thank you for your TPI videos they have helped me confirm that the my gut instinct when we finish the mustang the C4 will get a long tube intake and centrifugal supercharger. Hopefully it will give her plenty of torque low down and the rising boost curve will stretch the top end out a little

[@erenzoscroggins8056]

Bro this is crazy!!! That's more power then a lot of LS combo's especially the torque WOW.. thanks Richard this made me rethink the set up for my 1977 Suburban,,, the ported stock intake didn't do so bad either💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾

[@xmo552]

My 85 GMC tow truck is getting a 400 TPI when the 350 needs a rebuild.

[@Vekurus]

The Accel box is what I remember back in the good ol mid 90's. Father had an old Carroll Supercharging Paxton hooked up to a Lingenfelter built 420 with that intake on it and a 100cfm throttle body, Brodix heads. was a solid 11 second 85 C4.

[@guyconnell2250]

That long runner extrude hone deal would be the one I'd choose for street.

[@mikef-gi2dg]

Excellent demo. Where do I want my power? For a heavy vehicle or a 90% street 10% strip, car. extrude hone TPI. For a street/strip hot rod, single or dual plane intake setup. A holey throttle body sniper would work to.

[@batasspp]

This test was done like 20 years ago. Carcraft maybe? Same engine, same heads, same intakes, same pictures, same test. I'd love to see an LS make that much low and mid range torque. Thanks for bringing it back. 35 year old technology still more tq than the L8T!

[@batasspp]

@@BuzzLOLOL I agree, but they don't make the same torque under 4k that tpi does on a 383 with good heads, even a 6.0. But the overall torque curve is a little better.

[@beardedreviews]

Immediate thumbs up for clipping the lav mic to your shoulder :) This guy is a trooper

[@finnroen2334]

534 lb/ft from 383 CID is 1.39 lb/ft/CID = Excellent and very rare for any engine.

[@rattdog777]

I love the SBC tests !! Thanks for not forgetting about us non LS peeps !!

[@TK-eg7eg]

I’ve had a mini ram since 1996. Been wanting to see all the intakes tested together. Thanks!!

[@b.c4066]

Stealth ram, or performer rpm with a holley 4bbl efi. Both made the broadest power and really close to the short runners max hp, as well as matched the stock ported tpi tq curve. Interesting stuff.

[@markbuskens6070]

Oh and I almost bought the Holley Ram fuel injection for that same motor and was happy to see it was very similar to the Edelbrock RPM in torque and hp too!!

[@redtesta]

Great comparison. So many of those TPI's i remember from the past. Great video

[@arandumassol1144]

Funny I mirrored this test back in about 2000 when I bought my 89 Firebird with a 350 that had a converted LT1 intake but the guy who did the conversion did not get the distributer hole angled right and it chewed threw dist gears. I first bought a TPI intake to replace the LT1 and it made huge torq down low with a GM Hot Cam, 700r4 and 3.73 gear but ran out of breath at 5000 to 5500 rpm range. I then bought a Holley Stealth Ram and it was the better all around performer for my combo, better torq down low than the LT1 and better up top than the TPI. I just pulled engine in 2020 and the dist gear as well as the cam gear are both chewed, prob why my timing has always a bit erratic after the intake swaps. For a street/strip car I would recommend the HSR but as always it depends on your combo and where you want your power. Keep up the good work Richard!

[@jtthill5475]

Great series Richard. I wonder if you ever did any cross ram tests. Several years ago Nelson Racing built a X-Ram intercooled dual intake for twin turbo applications. I have always been fascinated by long tube cross rams since the 413 had it in the 60's. Torque is what moves the vehicle and horsepower is what accelerates a vehicle. Old school thinking. Would love to see something on old and new cross ram technologies. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

[@richardholdener1727]

I have run X rams on lots of motors

[@wheelstandr]

I was shocked at the power of the extrude honed with Tpis runners. A lot of guys are going to be disappointed with they’re edelbrock set ups. I have the TPIS mini ram on a 350 and really like the high rpm power for racing. With the ram air setup I get every penny of power. Fun video for those of us gen x’ers!

[@jarvislarson6864]

00⁰0⁰00

[@gordocarbo]

The edelbrock bases are fine and real good after porting Runners...Id use asm if you can find them.

[@cmcbunch]

I had a 383 with dart iron eagle 215s, 10:1CR, stock TPI base/runners/plenum, dual 58mm throttle body, B&M full manual 4l60, and 2.73 gears in a 92 camaro. The torque was outstanding. She'd top out at 4750 RPM in 4th with the torque converter locked doing about 189mph. I wish i had a locking axle back then. You had to be real careful because it would blow the tires off right off idle, and the engine rev'd so fast that it would shift up before you could get out of it (hence the full manual valve body later). Car had so much front end lift at 190 that the front suspension was full droop and steering would get scary. I did a road trip and set the cruise at 135 once and got about 33mpg at that speed. I was sure I did the math wrong so I ran another tank out of it with the same results. TPI is great with the right application. High RPM just isnt that application.

[@xmo552]

How did you tune it?

[@cmcbunch]

@@xmo552 i went through about 7 chips back and forth through mail. If I had it to do over again I would have bought a standalone, but at the time I couldn't afford it. I later ran a different engine with accel dfi, and a dual sync distributor for sequential injection. It worked WAY better as it had wideband o2. In a 77 caprice with the original th350 3.08 gears (non lockup) i was able to get 22 mpg at 55 mph towing about 7000 lbs.

[@robertwest3093]

Hard to beat the large runner TPI manifolds from stoplight to stoplight 👍🏻

[@carsandcorvettes]

Gotta do a video for “The other guys” with the crossfire 305s and 350s used on the Camaros, firebirds and corvettes

[@utahcountypicazospage5412]

Cross fire didn’t work well even in stock form that’s why tune port was proven better but still lacked power

[@geoffmooregm]

It would be cool to see a well tuned crossfire in action. The induction was so neat. The fact that it was a dog on power was mostly due to the ultra low compression, shitty heads and baby camshaft. I am sure with modern parts and a port job on the intake the power would be great.

[@safetyfirstintexas]

Or even the 96 to 99 vortec base which is essentially crossfire base with a spider injector contained inside a plastic housing.

[@VeTTeMaNC486]

The crossfire was a dog mainly because the runners were 2/3 the size (cross sectional area) of the head. Tinyyyy ports. The make really good gains opening them up. They are one of those situations that the larger you can make them the better.. some people even weld near the ports to get more meat. A well ported crossfire would perform better in the upper RPMs than the stock tpi, simply because it has shorter runners. I would love to see a crossfire test, stock manifold, then good heads and cam, then add a Renegade intake!

[@ronb113]

Pontiac turbo 301 lol

[@johnclifford1911]

This is a really well-done video/test... the best one I've seen on L98 engines. I have a '91 C4 L98 and now I know what I want to do with it (stroke it, get AFR heads, get the stock TPI manifold and runners Extrude-Honed, with a larger TB, so it looks stock but really performs). The intent is to build a sleeper street car that looks stock but surprises most people. Hard to use more than 450 HP on the street without traction control.

[@TheJMan1K]

What rear end do you plan on running if you haven’t built it yet? I’d say just reinforce the stock rear if it’s purely a street only car.

[@yng4evr68]

That may be the wrong cam but boy is that horsepower line flat out to beyond 6k with the stock induction on it. Something like this looks like the best of both worlds. Even my little 305 would fall on it's face at the track after 5200. I would try to shift at 5500 and it would run 2 tenths slower every time. But 300 lb/ft at the wheels sure was fun in a 2700 lb Datsun Z. Low 8s/high 12s all day and 24mpg. Loved that 240Z.

[@stefanmilazzo3093]

Hey Richard, awesome comparison of all the different TPI systems and manifolds. I love your video of you putting one under boost too. Have you considered testing the FITech Ultra Ram system? I’d love to see what curve it puts out and how it compares to these

[@75zl1]

I wish this was here when I had my corvette LOL that is awesome, I even had a 383 in it! Thing was a MONSTER down low

[@carlos64030]

Great video and this will help me a lot! I have a 1991 Trans Am GTA and I've been trying to decide which route I'm going to go with my motor build since I've completely ruled out doing the very popular LS swap. My goal is pretty low by looking to make only 400 - 450 horsepower at the crank, which I feel can be easily done without having to switch to a different engine platform.

[@BlackRam17]

What did you end up doing?

[@carlos64030]

@@BlackRam17, last week I purchased a 383 c.i. crate motor - 435 hp / 450 tq FIRST Performance TPI style intake Holley HP EFI ECU & Harness Kit Holley 30 PPH injectors Individual coil on plug setup

[@rotorblade9508]

2:32 the shape of the tpi looks pretty nice, basically you have a 400hp motor and if you want to run fast you simply it from 4500 through 6000rpm and benefit from all the power it can make, 1500 rpm range is ideal. if for example you are in a competition where they accept a maximum of 400hp+-2.5% this setup would be perfect :). if you want the fastest intake from these 3 , sure this is not the fastest, although for take off it’s good.

[@joelvallejo7451]

Can you do a video on the TPI first intake. That would be awesome thank you

[@devianb]

I would have been curious about the "FIRST" intake. Looked exactly like the stock TPI, but much larger intake runners on the inside. My vote is for the Holley Stealth ram for street/strip, but the problem is that its too tall to fit under the stock hood of corvettes and Firebirds. Camaros could get away with it with a little trimming of the hood brace.

[@firstperformancecenter]

Yes it would have been great to see the difference between the Holley stealth ram!

[@travischristian7738]

Please test a FIRST tpi intake on this. I would assume it would perform similarly to the long runner TPIS setup, but I'd love to know for sure.

[@Madmax.3]

should do a bit more everywhere compared to tpis setup on this combo but on stock l98 i would run the tpis its also much lighter

[@firstperformancecenter]

Would love to be involved!

[@travischristian7738]

@@firstperformancecenter I'm glad you chimed in. Hopefully, we get to see another TPI intake test soon. In my opinion, your intake is the best TPI setup available. If someone is looking for a max effort, high rpm deal, it's best to abandon TPI style intakes altogether. For those, like myself, who want to retain the killer lowend of TPI and still pull strong at 6000rpm....FIRST is where it's at.

[@firstperformancecenter]

@@travischristian7738 👍

[@chupacabra5205]

I remember reading in the 1990s car magazines how the Accel Super Ram was kinda unbeatable. The price was steep but kinda cool looking.

[@corvettefever360]

I had it, & always had the best results with the Accel Super Ram. Ironically I recently just sold it, & it was just the plenum/manifold & not the complete DEI system, regardless I got over $2k for it. Guys were jumping on it as the bids kept increasing. They are very hard to find, & quite sort after.

[@markbuskens6070]

This is probably my favorite small-block Chevy test that you’ve done!!!I agree the cam hurt the lower torque numbers but it was a great intake test👍Some of those intakes were designed for use in a boat so low end is less important,I’m very glad you did the single plane and the RPM for the do all end all results!🤓This is one of the best if not the best intake test I’ve ever seen by far!I had a 408 with next smallerComp cam with the Rpm and the mighty Demon 750 and it was a very good street combination. Brutal low end and would pull hard to 7000 in a 4 speed.Thanks for all your great content and testing 🙏🙏🙏

[@rdub79lx]

Had a Miniram back in '98 on a 11:1 355, TPIS ZZ9 cam, TPIS PROM chip and Performer RPM heads. Full interior and AC, '87 IROC was a solid 10 sec daily driver on a 125 shot NOS plate kit.

[@richardholdener1727]

they definitely work

[@ninjahawg94]

I'd like to see data with "the other guys" ITB's Weber style manifolds.

[@robertb3409]

I'm amazed how flat the hp curve is the stock and tpis intakes. I do like the 500ft lbs of torque

[@downhillskier7]

First Fuel Injection intake would work better with 383 but was NOT included in the manifold test

[@sseibonnevilleman]

I ran a stealth ram on the Firebird back around 04-05. I also did a cam swap. It made a huge difference.

[@coreytheisen6948]

Was it 305 or 350

[@sseibonnevilleman]

@@coreytheisen6948 350, biggest difference is it made power past 4K RPMs.

[@stevegunderson2392]

Was it using a mass air flow or the 'other' later memory mapped setup from the 90's not enough info for me I am using the DEMON with a RPM manifold on my 383...I think I will leave my TPI systems sit on the shelf.

[@richardholdener1727]

we used after market ECU (speed density)

[@michaelangelo8001]

Thanks. Turned out about like I expected, but it's great to see hard data. No more need to speculate.

[@bluecollarhotrods9781]

I had a set of Accel Runners with hand ported factory lower and plenum on my IROC 5.7L years ago, it worked well. Then had an AFR headed 383 with a TPiS Mini Ram... two entirely different animals. Wish Holley had the TermX back in the mid 90s - "chip burning" had a STEEP learning curve.

[@firstperformancecenter]

Very good information! Who did the actual dyno tests and what electronics were used? I may have missed that information in the video? Very curious that we were not invited to the party? Would have been fun! 😁 I guess it is a good thing we will be doing some comparison dyno work on our KZbin channel in the future as well! Thank you for the support you give to the tpi crowd! I am glad to see others are out there, keep up the good work! 👍

[@richardholdener1727]

I used a fast ecu-this was done many years ago-maybe before you were even in business-I would be happy to test a system and return it

[@firstperformancecenter]

@@richardholdener1727 Hi Richard, when did you do this test? The FIRST has been out for almost 35 years. It is good information for guys to understand the difference between the types of intakes for sure. We have been making the FIRST tpi since 2000 and air sensors which originally designed it, did so in 1987 or so until the early to mid 90's. It was shelved as air sensors moved to the propane side of things, until I purchased the tooling to bring it back. The FIRST tpi has been out quite sometime actually. The vector W8 used it as well. We have many magazine tests that we can pull from the archives and post dyno testing against all the competitive companies of the time period. I would be interested in who did the dyno work on your tests? Can you tell me who it was that did this testing for this video? I would love to bring out a FIRST tpi and be there when you did the dyno test for sure. Have you ever had a FIRST tpi in your hands? Just curious, as it is much different than the tpis that you compare it to. It also has a lot more potential as the base is cast at 1.875" ID and the runners at 1.75" ID which is larger than any other system out there. It also can be opened up to 1.9" ID all the way through. Then add the siamese work, to theoretically shorten the runner length and I think it may open even more eyes? Keep up the good work and maybe we will talk soon! 👍

[@Madmax.3]

@@firstperformancecenter the test was done in 2004 yes first used to be called air sensors richard was there for these test but didnt do the tuning this is all form the acticle called ten times the torque. as you know the correct tune for a efi has alot to do with how much power can be made, i own your first intake along with all the other tpi intakes used in here aswell as both design SLP runners the first unit is a tpis on steroids

[@jamesbowman7963]

Ran Formula 350 Firebird with TPIS lower and 52mm throttle body with AS&M runners and ported plenum with Brodix 180cc heads. Had a TPIS cam I think around 226 duration. Comp cams roller rockers with a T-56 behind it. Lingenfelter headers Tri-Y through twin big cats and a 3.5" single exhaust without mufflers. Car would almost jerk the fronts off the ground and got 26MPG at 75mph because of the T56... Embarrassed more than few mustangs... Would have loved to see it with modern electronics burning chips like throwing lawn darts at it, also maybe a 383 with AFR heads. A TPI done right is an 11 second machine all day.

[@johnclary729]

Looks like the TPI works well with a big cam to extend the power curve higher and the long runners keep the low RPM torque stupid high so you get that good dig out of the corner and then the big cam keeps the engine from falling on its face as the engine revs out at the end of the straight.

[@NanceLvr]

The one at 6:00 does TPIS still make them? Any links could help, I only see the mini ram on their website

[@monkey32z]

Be nice to see a comparison with this combo between the 305 and 350 as the GM TPI was intended for the 305. GM was gonna kill the 350 and the TPI intake was only designed for the 305. Consumers and corporate kept the 350 and they just slapped the 305 designed TPI onto the the 350, significantly killing air flow...

[@gordocarbo]

tq curves would probably look the same just more of it with the 350 GM already had the LT1 down pat yrs before it came out so they didnt wanna waste money on a larger TPI system Never liked the short runners on the LT1 or its lousy plenum area

[@Knightmare-gz9ls]

Love the old school look of the traditional style tpi. Would be a hell of a good time in a iroc or gta

[@tomorr152]

Richard, I was just looking over the "Ten Times the Torque" article today, I've got it in my computer. I've got the SuperRam and MiniRam intakes that I've used on my 383. Like them both, just like you prove on your show runner length determines power curve. I've ported my SuperRam, base and runners also siamesed them about 2" to try and get the best of both mid and upper rpm power. It has improved it a bit, but the MiniRam definitely pulls harder on the top end. I've raced both intakes and with the 700r4 trans the SuperRam edged out the win by about .5 sec. I think the MiniRam is faster with the 6 spd. Haven't raced it with the 6 spd yet. I have to say I like the feel of the SuperRam for regular driving. You do a GREAT show love watching, keep up the great work and videos!!

[@richardholdener1727]

THNX-SOUNDS LIKE YOU DID SOME COOL TESTING

[@tomorr152]

@@richardholdener1727 after watching you put the Torque Storm supercharger on that 305 TPI I want one for my 383. Question is my compression is around 10-10.5. Is that to high to run the TS? I've got SRP forged pistons, ring gap set .019-.022, H-beam rods, Howard's cams 4 bolt main caps, scat cast shaft 9000 pro comp. I'd like to run around 10 psi boost get me up to 600-700 HP. Do you thinks that's possible with street 93 octane fuel? Thanks!

[@roostercogburn2600]

Gotta love the eldelbrock rpm. Crazy good value and great performance. It's easy to see why they talk it up on engine masters

[@richardholdener1727]

it is always a solid performer

[@party_on_dudes]

I agree with some of the comments that a video on a stock L98 and how to improve performance would be nice. I looked up these intakes and no one makes them anymore.

[@cheviacGuy89]

Yes they do. The holley and tpis is still made and the fast tpi which wasnt mention is still made as well.

[@waynesmith896]

Loved this test but was hoping to see the First TPI set up as well!!

[@firstperformancecenter]

Wish we were invited as well!

[@echadmiyodea]

me too

[@Shane-Singleton]

I have always loved the L98 injection setup. Probably because I was a teen in the 90's and they were everywhere before the LT1's were really common. I wonder how much that extrude honing costs. I've got a few projects i've been wanting to convert to fuel injection and have been going back and fourth on the idea of L98 style vs one of the new bolt on throttle body injection packages from either Holley or Fi-Tech. While the throttle body "carbs" have the benefit of not having to yank the intake off they also don't increase flow over the stock cast iron intake or increase runner length, etc. I could also say screw it and drop a junkyard 5.3 LS in for the same price as that TBI setup, lol.

[@allanb3222]

I paid $500 to get my lower intake extrude,honed. That was with a v6 plenum.Not including shipping.

[@HorsepowerTube]

I'd like to see what the Edelbrock proflo xt does. There have been many tests of these old manifolds. Never seen one on the proflo since it's newer

[@JacksoNR26]

What camshaft and head combination would be best for a 383, with a non ported tpi manifold

[@ilovethephilippines8991]

Mate, you would have to be one of, if not the best, most informative, most bloody useful site on the planet, not just utube, thank you ever so much AGAIN... Eddie. Australia 89 C4.

[@richardholdener1727]

Glad to help

[@adamferoli]

Do you have a comparison video with the first intake?

[@WilliamMaginnis]

Can we get the spec sheet on the 383 factory TPI system?

[@THEFERMANATOR]

I would like to have seen the first fuel injection intake included. It's similar to the TPI, but much larger runners, and said to have the bottom end of the TPI but carry the power out much higher up in the RPM range. I'm considering one, but can't find any info other than the manufacturer's on it.

[@richardholdener1727]

it can't do both

[@THEFERMANATOR]

I've only found 1 dyno sheet for a 383 with one on it, and it was only a quick shot at the very end of a video, hence why I would like to find more info on them.

[@firstperformancecenter]

👍

[@kennybiggs3944]

Thanks for the good information appreciate your channel it is the best information a guy could get 👍👍👍👍👍👍

[@rorydottin7143]

I would have liked you to test the 50mm itb system in comparison to the aforementioned manifold/manifolds test.

[@geoffmooregm]

Great info, really shows that runners matter. I have a measly 3.1L TBI V6. It came stock in Isuzu Rodeo's but I have swapped it into my Trooper which had the slightly smaller 2.8L. If any of you have seen any of the stock TBI manifolds you will know how sad the runner situation is in there. I am going to fabricate a new intake by taking the lower section of a MPFI manifold that was on the F-Body V6 and graft a plenum and mount the TBI on top. The engine performs well but I know there is more I can do. It won't cost me much so it's worth a shot since there are no aftermarket options.

[@richardholdener1727]

add boost

[@geoffmooregm]

@@richardholdener1727 I would but sadly there is no easy way to do it without a whole lot of custom work and electronics. Plus I use it off road so I want to keep it dead simple.

[@joegomez6929]

Love how the regular dual plane kind works best. Was wondering if y'all have ever tested LS coils to see if there is any gains with aftermarket?

[@richardholdener1727]

we don't see gains with coils unless there is a misfire

[@mr67maro]

Glad to see my Performer RPM do so good,what a great manifold. Thanks for the video!

[@chrisyeahbuuwassrileegowyn9279]

Very cool to see these comparisons, I built a similar 383 for my 89 formula 350. TPIS base /runner and cam .523/.528 with 1,6 rockers, cant remember the duration/ LSA It was pretty hard to ever be caught in the wrong gear, or at the wrong rpm. Pulled like a bear from just off idle, then it was shift soon, or sooner.

[@v8vega355]

What if the camshaft in this motor peaked it's torque at the same time the intake wants to peak torque. What kind of horsepower would it make then. I know it will be less than the tq output but would torque be close to 600ftlbs? You're getting into turbo diesel territory at that point with an na engine

[@GlassTopRX7]

All these V8's make more than enough torque down low, so unless you're building for towing you aren't going to miss the low end on the short runner setups that much IMO. Even with my torqueless wonder don't miss giving up the 2500-3500 torque for that massive kick from 4500-6800. It's not ideal but with a sub 3000lbs car with 4:10's it's not totally gutless either. I mean even with sticky 285, I can smoke them in 2nd at 40mph by stabbing the gas, if don't realize what's actually happening it's pretty impressive, lol.

[@approachingtarget.4503]

In all the yrs of test after test. This large plenum and tpi system with a centrific blower has produced the best power and fuel economy ive ever seen. I believe it was in a article from the early 90's that used the eccell. Set up. I believe the title was 500hp and 25 miles to the gallon. Nothing gas has macthed that performance yet.

[@str8edge_lifer83]

I believe that was in gm high tech magazine

[@tracymarlar934]

Thanks I've been thinking about putting the factory setup on my pickup and you just confirmed it!

[@bennyfactr6122]

I ran a 11:1 385 dart ie200 headed sbc with tpi & lt4 hotcam for years. While the torque was fun, running out of steam at 5,000 became tiresome. Stuck a stealthram on it and never missed the low-end torque. Pulled hard through 6,400 with great street manners.

[@pinchnloaf]

Was the ASM runners tested on a stock TPI bottom?

[@richardholdener1727]

no

[@bdugle1]

How much could you boost the torque curve of this combo by optimizing the cam for the long runner intake? I think those AFR heads might be able to make use of more intake lift, too. Probably too hard to do to re-create everything, so just wondering. Maybe put together a test mule 383 with AFR heads and test cams and runner length on an IR intake? I’d like to see that.

[@richardholdener1727]

we ran a different (smaller) cam-it doesn't change much

[@bdugle1]

I think Brian Tooley says lift is optimized at about 0.3 x valve diameter. That would suggest around 0.615 lift at the intake valve. IO at 2° and IC at 40° would be a 222° intake lobe on a 109. I would expect that would make a difference, but you’re the guy with the hands on experience. Thanks again for all the good work!

[@DSRE535]

It's funny how to this day its really tough to beat an rpm air gap with a 750 for street/strip duty for a sbc, personally I love the tpi stuff, I think I might add a tpi system to my K5 blazer, still doesn't make sense that gm didn't use tpi on the trucks

[@DSRE535]

@ron Kay yep, im sure it was an exclusive deal meant for the F-body and Corvette but still if you have a small block in a heavy truck its probably the best induction system you can use for idle to 4500rpm

[@paulsteinheiser8674]

Great videos. Learning a lot. Where do we get the Let's Make Some Noise shirts. Your merchandise?

[@richardholdener1727]

I'm working on it

[@shon9kemp]

In the beginning of the video Richard said he would go with a smaller lift cam. Just curious on how much smaller? Thinking of doing this 383 tpi in my 86 Iroc

[@maclogan6872]

I am working on a Firehawk with a SLP T-Ram. Are there any notes on the size of injector used? (Checking comments)

[@Madmax.3]

should be 22lb

[@xXcashXx3]

I looked all over for the tpi box intake i could never find it

[@Michael_Lorenson]

Thanks, Richard! Liked and subscribed. I'm wondering if the long-runner intakes will produce similar percentage gains on a stock L98 with a mild cam. Obviously, it won't make as much power as your 383, so I'm thinking in relative terms. Any guidance is appreciated.

[@richardholdener1727]

gains won't be as great on the milder L98

[@bassettraceengines]

Tune port would be good in a tow vehicle?

[@danieldimitri6133]

Hp? Tq? Why not both? Have bullet grind you a solid roller cam for that piece with a mid length or even a dual plane.

[@chrispompano]

What about de-stroking a TPI 350 & use high compression????

[@richardholdener1727]

destroking doesn't add torque-but compression does

[@andrewburt7900]

I like your work man but as a mopar guy you don’t have much content. I would love to see some 5.2, 5.9 magnum stuff, or even some newer 4.7 stuff? Some old muscle car stuff? I want to turbo my 5.9 magnum and there is very little info, yet the motors are plentiful and cheep at the yard. I am also interested in v6 stuff, but I would just be happy with more mopar stuff of any kind

[@richardholdener1727]

I agree-just spoke to Steve Dulcich tonite about a 340 six pack test

[@andrewburt7900]

Richard Holdener thanx that’s a great idea! I might be able to get you some big blocks or small blocks pretty cheap! Thank you for your reply!! Keep up the good work!!

[@indyrock8148]

Interesting to see HSR and Dual Plane results so similar

[@indk240]

Great video, love the old L98 mani. Would like to see a similar video on efi Ford 302 intake manifolds (gt40, explorer, tfs, edelbrock performer etc) especially if you have data on whether or not phenolic spacers do anything

[@richardholdener1727]

I tested all those intakes way back as well

[@idriwzrd]

Excellent test. Very informative. What changes to the cam would optimize it best for use with the long runners? Wider lsa, less duration? Have you ever run a cam test on an L98?

[@richardholdener1727]

yes we have run different cams on the L98-cam should be milder with less duration and slightly wider lsa-won't really change much in power, just help idle and drivability

[@blair79bear38]

@ron Kay thanks for the info. I have a TPI induction system pulled off a scrap 305. might yet be useful with the right engine configuration. Probably work well with Edelbrock Performer heads.

[@ThePants2012]

@Richard Holdener hey man, just an idea (maybe a pointless or boring idea!) But maybe you can test how far you can go on a SBC with a TBI setup? I know things can be done like increasing fuel pressure and using big block injectors, but how hindered are you by the CFM limitations of the TBI throttle body? Keep up the good work!

[@richardholdener1727]

you would definitely be fuel limited eventually, even with the BBC injector upgrade and more fuel pressure

[@ThePants2012]

@@richardholdener1727 For sure, naturally the most economical and fruitful thing to do would be to convert to carburetor, im just curious on where the limit is, ya know, for science!

[@jasonhudek3470]

Fantastic comparison! Back in the day, I always wondered how these intakes compared on the same motor, questions answered! Definitely a lot of mystique (and a few expletives) with the Superram, great to see it in here as well!