Tractor Rant! And an Erin Update

This impromptu video is to give everyone an update on Erin's progress, and also I have a bit of a rant about some of my viewers mindsets regarding a previous upload.
Ashleys Analysis | Inches From Death - • Ashleys Analysis | Inc...
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[@chrislaing7153]

I have found on Google Maps where this incident took place. Nathan lifted off the throttle 55 metres from the tractor (i.e. when his speed reduces from 63 to 62). He doesn't take up an overtaking position - he simply panics. The satnav was still showing 54mph when approx 10m from the tractor. (I appreciate that there can be a latency with the update of the speed on the satnav, but I don't believe that there was in this case, as the cats eyes were still passing the car at the same rate) There was nothing that the tractor driver could have done to prevent this. The tractor has very little view in his mirrors. He has a set of disc harrows on the front and what looks like a set of disc harrows with a seed drill on the rear. He is also not very maneuverable as he has a lot of weight that is sitting outside of the wheelbase. I would suggest that you speak with a farmer and have a drive of a fully laden tractor to understand the workload that the driver has when driving one on the road - it is very high.

[@tpm2056]

I agree. Imagine if the tractor was just stopped on the road for some reason (an obstacle maybe), the BMW braked way too late and would have crashed either way. Also the BMW pulled out to overtake very late, so if the farmer has checked his mirror he probably saw the BMW in the lane behind him and I would guess it's very difficult to judge the speed of a car coming up from right behind. Zero blame on the tractor in my opinion.

[@Chris-im3ys]

@@tpm2056 But could the tractor driver have done anything better in your opinion?

[@tpm2056]

@@Chris-im3ys You can always double and triple check, but I don't believe there's anything he could have realistically done

[@joejoejoejoejoejoe4391]

Surly the tractor driver must have a good look at the road he's about to turn into to make sure it's clear, he can't do that and keep an eye on traffic behind.

[@dorianleakey]

I think the argument is if the tractor stopped and didnt try to turn then Nathan could have overtaken. I think the tractor had little time to see Nathan, a second at most in fact, but if they maintained their position Nathan could have gone round.

[@wandpj]

Ashley, I think you are expecting the superhuman of the tractor driver in that instance. How many seconds did the tractor driver have to recognise that a car was approaching at speed from the rear, recognise it was not intending to slow but intending to overtake and then stop the tractor so as not to overshoot the entry and create an ongoing traffic hazard or alter its steering to allow space for the car to overtake? Two seconds is recognised as the time taken for a driver to react to a simple situation of a vehicle in front braking and the following driver needing to react appropriately. Assessing the factors involved in this more complicated situation would exceed two seconds. Of course the tractor driver would have won no friends by stopping if the car driver was intending to stop because he would be confronted with a tractor stopped in front of him. And the tractor driver may have had no prior warning that any vehicle was in the vicinity behind because it would have taken a considerable time for the tractor to go around the curve and not been able to view the road behind for that period. I don't think the tractor driver was turning because he felt entitled to do so; I think that he turned because there was no perceived risk at that instant. And when he did perceive a risk he did swerve back into his lane. Of course the car had swerved the other way by then and nothing further could be done within the time available. No Ashley, I don't think anyone could have driven that tractor any differently to avoid that accident.

[@OriginalSycan]

The tractor driver could see the fast-approaching vehicle for at least 3 seconds before he committed to the turn but you admitted it takes 2 seconds (which is max in my opinion -my reaction time is 0.2s and MAYBE 2 seconds MAX to process things fully), and you said no one could have driven it differently? As soon as you are turning right you should be already in the mindset of checking for people behind who may overtake and checking the oncoming lane. It doesn't take 2 seconds to process that information if you were looking out for it because you have already processed what to do if the situation arises, which I think is Ashley's point. I would agree that a lot of drivers wouldn't have avoided the crash also but someone definitely can.

[@vicfire]

Ashley himself in the last video said this happened within 12 seconds. I understand his points entirely and there is a lot to learn I just have some of the same reservations as you do. If it was a concave mirror, the car would've seemed further away. With the machinery blocking part of it, how much visibility could the driver really have had to spot it and sort it out? Questions we'll sadly not know the answer to

[@1hd3szfgrdm13]

Superhuman? Nah, when driving a tractor with that at the back you triple check before making a turn, which wasn't done here, come on.

[@josephmarsh8235]

Are you a fully trained lorry or tractor driver? Me, no? But the have dreadful blind spots and I know how the tractor driver went in video simply

[@stefanb155]

Wayne Jackson Yes, i also doubt it is reasonable to expect the tractor driver could have made a difference. It might be true that he noticed the BMW later than he could have. But even if he had seen him earlier, and he would have stopped dead, i doubt it would have avoided the accident. Maybe the BMW would have hit him even sooner and therefore faster and harder in that case. You could also argue that the tractor should have sped up or try to make the turn earlier to clear the left lane sooner, instead of going back left last moment when he saw the BMW. But since the plow or what it was had quite an overhang, the BMW would probably still have caught the side/corner of it. Agree with Ashley that everyone that risks an accident to happen just because „i‘m in the right“ and „you’re in the wrong“ is just as bad as someone who is deliberately driving like an a*****e. But this one, just does not looks like an case of „i see what you are trying, but i have right of way, so f you“ case. As i said before, something like this has to happen to most of us once in order to get it. Usually you are lucky enough that it gets not quite as close to death as this one. Even luckier are the ones that just saw it on YT, but still remember it when something similar evolves in front while driving.

[@chrisis6]

The people who say that having right of way means you should go regardless of what other people are doing wouldn't last long as bikers. Many times I have needed to relinquish my right of way to protect myself, the stakes are a lot higher when you're not sitting in an armoured box. There's a very good reason bikers refer to a shoulder check as a "lifesaver" check.

[@CraigNiel]

Agree. I've always said, "It's no good saying (from your hospital bed) I had right of way!"

[@Historyfan476AD]

i had a friend once who moaned about a lorry driving though his right of way, my friend ranted about it and i replied" You might have the right of way but he has the laws of physics".

[@awild10]

These are people who get mixed up when talking about rights of way and priority. You can have right of way without having priority. Priority isn't had it is given. So yes you can have right of way but if you are not given priority and you plough on anyway, it usually ends in tears.

[@brianocampo7981]

@@awild10 An example of difference between 'right of way' and 'priority' is at a set of traffic lights. Traffic lights are a replacement of police officers who used to give or hold right of way at the junction. A green light means that your road has right of way and a red light means it doesn't. But a green light doesn't mean you can just drive through the junction, because it's blocked or you're turning and need to give way to pedestrians/oncoming traffic.

[@pirateadam3686]

Remember the 'Law of Gross Tonnage' - priority goes to the biggest bugger because he isn't coming off worse. More than once I've had to do the Straight-brake-pray going round a round about because some lorry decides to just pull out.

[@Captain-Cardboard]

I'll miss Erin's lessons. I wonder if there's another learner who'd be brave enough to have their journey filmed. Some food for thought there, Ash. I'm going to make sure to take extra care when making right turns from now on. I'm reminded of the case of David Holmes, who was killed when the motorcycle he was riding collided with a car who turned right in front of him. Now, David was travelling at 97mph, but the driver was convicted of causing death by dangerous driving. So things aren't cut-and-dried as they first appear. The video is available on KZbin for anyone who wishes to see it.

[@planecarfanaticjosh9086]

Captain Cardboard what’s the video called?

[@Captain-Cardboard]

@@planecarfanaticjosh9086 Just search David Holmes Crash

[@fluxant]

It’s hard to judge someone’s speed with a glance in a mirror , I’m guessing even if the tractor driver saw Nathan he wasn’t expecting him to do what he did .

[@jacintarene_]

If you look one second and they’re not there and you look the next second and they are suddenly there that probably means they’re going fast ...

[@wandpj]

@@jacintarene_ And it takes time for your brain to process that information, formulate a response, implement that response and for the laws of physics to come into effect. And that smash was over in a couple of seconds. Enough time?

[@jacintarene_]

Wayne Jackson that’s not the point of the comment bud. My comment was in response to “it’s hard to judge someone’s speed with a glance in the mirror”.

[@Old_Man_Pete]

Question: would you have made this video if he had hit a minibus full of school children going to a farm on a day trip? Personally I think driving lessons should have a video day of fatal crashes involving speed and the interviews with the families who have lost loved ones, they should be shocked to see the damage it can cause. I have seen my fair share of fatal crashes in my time, the image doesn't go away.

[@wandpj]

@@jacintarene_ It's hard to judge someone's speed in a mirror without staring for a couple of seconds.

[@jamiereid9322]

I was one of the ones in that analysis video that said the tractor didn't really deserve any responsibility in that accident. I mostly stand by that. I'm not one of these people that has the "I have priority" mindset". Someone pulls out on a 60mph road in front of me with a massive speed difference, I'm going to slow not keep going 60, smash into the back of them and say "well I had right of way, it's your fault". Only point I'd change my mind on Ashley is the secondary check by the tractor and the fact he swerved back in because he saw the BMW. Honestly neither of us can say for sure, but I don't think with the bend of the road, how fast the BMW was approaching, that he saw him, or that the BMW wasn't in his blind spot with the angle. For all we know he could've been checking his mirrors and the oncoming traffic, and when he checked his mirrors the BMW was on the bend in his blind spot. No one can say for certain what the tractor driver could see apart from him. He clearly did do a secondary mirror check just as he started turning because he swerved back in which I missed the first time. You could argue that it's a bit late then so yeah possibly a little bit of fault because of that. But I mean for all we know he checked those mirrors regularly, and the BMW's speed meant that he wasn't visible with his 1st check, maybe his 2nd check he was in the blind spot, and a 3rd check was a little late.

[@kluchakiller]

That's what I was thinking he did realise what the bmw driver was up to and swerve to the left. And actually he had pretty good reflex considering cammer off side wheel just touch white line

[@jeremyashford2145]

You don‘t have a “blind spot” in an open vehicle moving at 0mph. You turn your head and look to see if anything is approaching.

[@georgelane6350]

If you wouldn't see the vehicle coming behind then you are a bad driver

[@incinerati]

@@jeremyashford2145 good luck seeing a speeding moron around a bend. ;)

[@SteffanHarries]

Always be ready to fix other people's mistakes. 👍

[@MK-1973]

Spot on

[@captainhulk8691]

Totally agree. Anyone with a brain cell would slow down / submit there right of way to avoid an accident. Yeah it might P us off but it’s better than having the fuss of claims etc. I always try and tell myself in them situations “5second delay vs days/weeks of insurance, courtesy cars hassle”. I know it can be difficult in the heat of the moment but really, is it worth it?

[@x-raf7652]

As a statement - you are bang on. This and 'right of way is given, not taken' are my driving mantra's now

[@mjradar]

The speed the bmw was going I don’t think the tractor driver would have seen bmw in time to reach with it being on a bend

[@scottlaaa]

J Walker it’s a speed limit not a target. I’ve got National speed limits by me and I wouldn’t dream of driving 60mph through them it’s way to dangerous!

[@SongDesire]

@@scottlaaa not to mention that some single vehicle width b-roads are still national speed limit as well, and so many people actually drive at that speed. Its nuts. When ever I am on a single vehicle b-road i drive 30mph at most, and slow down a fair bit more for all corners. Especially if they are totally blind. Speed limits on rural roads in the uk really need looking at.

[@scottlaaa]

Ialyrn the speed limits are fine i find it’s the drivers! If i go through the lanes by me they are National I wouldn’t attempt to go over 30mph. I would rather drive to the conditions than have an accident in them. About 4 years ago I Had a bmw on my side of the road he was flying damaged my front wing and the entire length of his car it went 50/50! I pulled over about 15 yards from the collision because i was traveling slowly for the bend and before I turned my engine off he had disappeared out of sight done a 3 point turn and got out and went mad at me! Straight away he said i was going to fast which was ironic because I stopped 15 yards from the impact when he went out of sight! He was trying to bully me into taking full responsibility by threatening me with the police to which I responded was phone them get them here who are they going to believe a professional driver or some bellend speeding in a bmw? In the accident my tyre was damaged so I changed it he had a flat tyre and refused to change it then when we left i was doing about 25mph he floored it away!

[@scottlaaa]

J Walker this clip 40mph is plenty especially with the bend coming up.

[@scottlaaa]

J Walker the bmw in the video was doing 60mph and hit a tractor so yeah It would be sensible to drop 20mph 👍🏻

[@alanhindmarch657]

Ashley I truly understand what you are saying and where you are coming from, BUT, even if the Tractor Driver had Mirrors Checked just before turning, then stopped the Tractor and Aborted the turn, I still think Nathan due to his inexperience would have still run into the back of the Tractor.

[@highloughsdrifter1629]

I agree. Nathan was going into the back of that tractor whatever the tractor driver did. It happens far too frequently to vehicles stationary in lane waiting for the opposite lane to clear to make a right turn. This can be a nerve wracking process on a fast rural road with poor visibility, waiting to turn and constantly expecting to be hit from behind.

[@magikjoe3789]

Without a doubt. Nathan was bloody lucky not to have a seed drill embedded in his head. His speed, positioning and lack of forward planning meant this collision was inevitable. If there had been a truck coming the other way so tractor couldn't make the turn, if Nathan had tried the blind overtake and met that oncoming truck, or even with the tractor aborting the turn, Nathan had nowhere to go, no backup plan, not enough space,too much speed and zero anticipation. He is very lucky not to have killed himself or his passenger.

[@CycolacFan]

With that sharp bend behind I wonder if the tractor driver could have seen what was behind him when he was still pointing forward, perhaps the speeding BMW only became visible in the one second or less that it took him to begin turning, which is when he then did do everything he could to prevent the accident by halting the tractor. We’re talking about a large, heavy and slow accelerating piece of agricultural machinery, farmer likely felt since it was evidently clear ahead he was safer continuing his turn than halted on a bend. Right of way probably didn’t come into it. It’s not like the tractor was pulling out of a side turning. I don’t think anyone not driving the BMW can say with 100% confidence that they could have prevented this accident from happening.

[@CycolacFan]

J Walker to be honest I’m presuming it was since in the UK 60mph would be the most you could legally do on a single carriageway road, unless there are different rules in that area of Scotland. Am happy to be proved it wasn’t if someone knows for certain. Let’s face it though, if it wasn’t speeding it was right on the legal limit and clearly being driven too fast for that particular situation.

[@CycolacFan]

J Walker depends what the speed limit is on that stretch of road. I’ve never been there so I don’t know. Lots of roads are 30, 40 or 50. But 60mph is the absolute top speed remember, you don’t have to drive at 60 just because your allowed to, a lot of factors should also be taken into account including time of day, weather and driver ability.

[@eddiegremlin]

Hindsight is always 100% correct. Nathan was heading toward the scene of the accident, despite the actions of the tractor driver. You should also include that Nathan believed he had the right of way to overtake. If we’re going to be hypothetical here, what if the tractor had stopped, and a car emerges from the turn the tractor was turning into. So the BMW misses the tractor and t-bones possibly a family car, occupied with children. They would have been unsighted and would have taken the tractor stopping as permission to emerge. Thankfully this did not happen, but it could have done quite easily. So we’re left once again with the BMW exceeding the speed limit and conditions.

[@dennisphoenix1]

You make a fair point about another vehicle at the junction, the bmw driver was in the wrong in lots of ways .

[@marklittler784]

Soon as you see a tractor in the countryside one of the first things your thinking about is people that might be about to overtake it, your supposed to assess its safe to enter any road especially a 60mph speed limit one by at least looking both ways before committing yourself.

[@marklittler784]

@James Stewart Probably fit for the straight sections of a road.

[@eddiegremlin]

James Stewart cam registers 63 the speedo would say 66...

[@Seanmcdhuibhne]

When the tractor started the turn the car was at least two seconds behind. Did Nathan notice the tractors wheels were touching the centre dividing line? If you are one of those drivers who cannot see the tractor was about to make a right turn then hand in your license. Just down to careless driving by Nathan.

[@georgelane6350]

You're a bad driver.

[@Plexipal]

TBH if the tractor just stopped in lane he probably would have got rear-ended anyway, or if the car and tractor didn’t both panic at the last minute might have been alright.

[@SonOfVulkan]

I used to drive selfishly not because Im an asshole! but, I just thought it's my right of way. You have opened my eyes and I now preach your lessons, I'm so much more happier when I drive, I feel alot more relaxed. Thanx!

[@raymondbenjamins5884]

Same for me. Ashley taught me so much. I never realized it's so much more relaxing to just let the idiots get past and to just take it easy when the situation requires it.

[@camcab147]

I'm always wary of driving behind tractors. I'd encounter them a lot when I used to regularly drive over The Quantocks. It would have been crazy to contemplate overtaking them due to the number of bends in the road and cars sometimes coming the other way but I knew that they knew I was there. I'd keep a good distance behind them and match their speed. What would often happen is that when they found a spot where they could snug into the side of the road to allow me to pass safely, that's exactly what they did. I had a good view of the road ahead to overtake safely. Just being patient with each other really helps.

[@tractorman5720]

I drive tractors on the road a lot, sometimes I get other drivers so close behind me that it is unsafe to pull in to let past the traffic building up behind me. Bear this in mind when stuck behind a tractor in future, they might not be ignorant to the queue behind, they like me might be trying to save lives.

[@fearlessjoebanzai]

It boggles my mind how closely behind some people follow tractors. (or how closely people will follow anything for that matter!)

[@owen_003]

Not sure your headrest is in the right place 😬

[@chrisdevine4848]

Perhaps a more common example of this situation is a car turning right, with a motorbike going for an overtake. You wouldn't make the turn if it was a bike coming up fast behind you because the result is pretty obvious. As you say Ashley, we all have responsibility to have an that awareness all around us when we drive, not just look at the road in front of us, and react in good time. That said, it would be an excellent lawyer who could get the BMW off and state that the fault lies principally with the tractor. Notwithstanding you explained what you would have done differently, it would have taken a pretty exceptional driver (in the tractor) to have avoided the accident. Whereas the BMW had way more opportunity to do so.

[@ProMilkshake]

Nail on the head with this one. If I was going down a national speed limit road. Planning to make a right hand turn and there was a bike approaching quicking, I wouldnt dare to make the right turn, unless the biker had changed his speed dramatically and I knew that he knew I was turning.

[@Chrisallengallery]

I was taught this too by my instructor.

[@seetherbridge3]

I would like to know what the blind spots on the tractor would be with a big plough in tow though, the guy driving that has a lot more to focus on than just a car turning right looking out for a bike, so I'm not sure it can be put in the same boat. The BMW is going so fast it may have gone through his blind spot when he checked meaning he assumed it safe to turn... Just a thought.

[@jamiemorris7688]

Happens all there time with bikes but that's why I wouldn't overtake on my bike where there is a opportunity for someone in front to turn right.

[@fluffyfetlocks]

I totally agree with you. I was on a roundabout near a slip road coming off an arterial road a few months ago. A learner on a scooter pulled out in front of me. Because I was going slow, and not bombing through the roundabout, I was able to gently break and let him through, even though I had "right of way". My grandma was in the car with me at the time, asked me why I didn't honk at him and I told her; He knew he'd messed up because he was looking me in the eyes after he pulled out, at that point, honking won't fix the situation. The best thing to do is to slow and help right his mistake. Most of the time, newer drivers know when they've messed up, and I think that people using the horn to tell them off, only ends up putting the younger driver in a frantic mindset where they might make further misjudgements.

[@Ultima2876]

If someone ever asks me why I didn’t use the horn I just ask them ‘what is the horn for’?

[@WavScorn259]

A fantastic comment! This is true! Take my like good sir!

[@Chrisallengallery]

People forget that it's 'give way to those already on the roundabout' not just give way to the right. Mistakes happen all the time and we should all drive defensively, not aggressively.

[@konradgreen2567]

Well said. The only thing I'd say about using the horn in that situation is that it alerts other road users about something which they may not have seen, and might need their attention too.

[@adamspencer95]

If everyone drove with this mentality, I would guess the accident rate could be halved quite easily. Everyone makes mistakes, and we should all do our best to minimise the impact of anyones mistake.

[@Pumpkinhead77]

Imagine the tractor did stay left but someone was pulling out of the junction to go left.

[@robchissy]

i must disagree, the BMW trying to overtake a tractor while turning right, no way that the bmw could see if anything was coming from ahead at the speed he was going, he is just lucky there wasn't or it couls have been worse, 100% the bmw is at fault

[@nofatchicks6]

Of course it was his fault, but that’s not the point. The point is that other drivers can increase safety and stop accidents by driving more defensively.

[@dailiynasheeds]

your rant is misplaced. nathan didn't look like he was positioning himself to overtake. he wasn't legally allowed to overtake. he only reach the legal road markings when he was right behind the tractor. simple case of nathan driving too fast around a bed not knowing what's ahead.

[@georgelane6350]

You're a bad driver

[@supervitz7178]

Ashley. Something I picked up at the AA, Each driver gets a "blame" and "avoidance" score, Nathan probably gets quite a high blame score, but the tractor also gets a high avoidance score because they could've done more to avoid the accident even though they're weren't at fault. Being good on the road has to involve understanding that it's not good enough to just avoid getting blame, but rather accepting that people make mistakes and trying to do more to avoid being in a crash regardless of who is at fault! One other technicality, the only person who can assume they have "right of way" is the Queen, everyone else can only assume "priority" until they are given the right. We need to move away from this idea that "it's my right of way" therefore I will proceed at any cost.

[@fearlessjoebanzai]

Wtf? The Queen? The Queen of the fascist regime? Get outta here, servitude sycophant!

[@AmeliaAlfie1619]

'Would that accident have happened if I was driving the tractor... no it wouldn't have' Wow.

[@Being_Jeff]

I thought the same thing, Ashley's good but nobody is perfect, the tractor driver would not have deliberately got in the way, he probably tried his best to avoid the crash but he'd started his turn and was then helpless to do anything. Also the tractor driver's main focus of attention would have been ahead of him, Ashley is speaking from hindsight and there is no way he could possibly put himself in the tractor drivers situation (I am not a tractor driver by the way, cyclist, campervan Porsche 911)

[@fearlessjoebanzai]

@@Being_Jeff, cyclist, campervan, Porsche!?! Shouldn't you be jogging Jeff?

[@samscott9395]

I drive tractors for a living and I have to say that he would have done well to have seen the BMW charging up behind him as the mirrors probably wouldnt have seen round the corner behind him. It's also difficult to see directly behind him as the drill was in the way. It is very common for people to overtake even though you are indicating, therefore you always check your mirrors before you commit to turning and as you begin to turn. This allows you to check your mirror and check the previous blind spot as you turn. The tractor driver clearly checked his mirror as he turned and aborted the turn. In most cases the BMW driver would have escaped by overtaking and not rear ended the tractor.

[@David-sw2fn]

I always right mirror check when turning right and take a good look. Even when indicating well in advance. here in Birmingham you can’t be sure that someone isn’t going to try and go round you. I understand the point Ashley is making. However, I want to be clear that the tractor’s actions should not detract in any way from the sheer recklessness of Nathan’s driving.

[@JodokusHV]

Spot on! And good luck Erin on the test!

[@donaldasayers]

Having had a motorbike I am in the habit of that lifesaving glance over the shoulder, if only to check the blind spot. At a very low speed it saved me from a nasty crunch the other day when I needed to turn right into a car park, immediately after a left turn into a T junction. The lady behind had already started to overtake me, after I had gone less than a car length down the road because presumably I had not started to accelerate as much as she wanted to.

[@dennisphoenix1]

It's just sheer impatience, because modern cars will go quickly doesn't mean they should

[@whateverthejourneykeepwalk336]

Hi Ashley and thanks for all your videos , l passed my test but l continue watching as it’s so helpful

[@stevenuibhist]

Have to totally disagree with you on this one mate. I drive tractors for a living and this is what i gather from it: The tractors mirrors are absolutely curved, so yes he can see some traffic coming behind him around the bend to a certain extent. If I'm coming along that stretch of road, I'd have checked my mirrors, signalled, looked behind me; at this point I see a car coming along solid white lines, no reason to think they're overtaking. Especially if they're not indicating, and we don't know if this car has indicated to overtake. Coming up to the junction I do another check of my mirrors, and again are we certain the cammer has their indicators on? If not, they are still at the solid white lines so again, this tells us they cannot overtake so it's safe to make the turn. When the cammer makes their idiotic attempt to overtake, they are 1. Driving at a speed much higher than the limit and have made no attempt to slow down. 2. The tractor has initiated their movement early on while checking, these are 4+tonne machines which requires more time to make the turn unlike a corsa for example. The tractor driver in my opinion has done nothing wrong unless the cammer has indicated their overtake which we cannot assume or know for sure. They read the information presented to them and acted upon that.

[@stevenuibhist]

@MO RTM and what I'm saying is that there was no way for the tractor to stop that.

[@stevenuibhist]

@MO RTMhes making it out anyone else driving the tractor could have done it differently to change the outcome. You cant

[@ryanjack5013]

Booked my practical for 16th November, checked two days ago and there is a free slot for Monday 28th September. So luckily got that booked

[@davidlax9454]

Hmm I get your point but the speed of the beemer the tractor only had a second to alter his decision

[@bedclintred]

Your a lifesaver Ashley, changing the mindset is a must.

[@roopsingh3840]

Congratulations 👏 Erin! Good luck with your new career too 🙂 you'll become a great driver and teacher combined 🚸🧐👍🏽

[@samknipes262]

Ashley, in the majority of your videos I completely agree with you and what you say, as most of the time you are right, but in this instance you are wrong, the part you circled in your video (which you said was the tractors mirror) was not, The part you circled was actually the front load marker on the tractor, the same that it has on the rear (red & white stripes). The tractors mirrors are always at the tops of the doors on modern tractors. The tractor was clearly carrying a very wide sowing machine and from experience I can tell you that when towing machines of this width you can very rarely see in your mirrors. And I must add that driving a tractor is a world of difference to driving a car, and I would actually love to see you have a go at driving one in a situation like this and see how you get on. Ok yes the driver might of been able to see the car in his mirrors when going round the bend but I would hazard a guess that the car was driving so fast that the car could of easily been missed. This is the probably the only video you have made where I have actually been angry at you and I think in this instance you were being big headed.

[@andrewbaines8760]

you cannot say the accident wouldnt have happened, even if the tractor didnt turn, the speed and angle of the car approaching wouldnt have made it to overtake without contact

[@JohnM...]

He's saying it wouldn't have happened with HIM driving the tractor, because he's absolutely magnificent, the god of drivers.

[@sli3972]

I often cycle on a busy 40mph B road, and there is a right turn to access my road. I always look several times over my shoulder to gauge oncoming cars (speed/volume--largely dependent on light changes about 500m back) before entering the turning lane. If a car isn't too close, I will indicate right with my arm before moving across. I would probably have been killed on more than one instance if I had moved across simultaneously with the signal. Cars overtake despite this, and to ensure no accident I have once or twice had to continue to the next roundabout to make a U-turn (adding 5-10 minutes to my journey). The logic here, then, is that if drivers around you are behaving erratically, you have to be prepared to continue past your junction.

[@edwardknight3284]

You have a good point, it’s always wise to prevent a accident no matter who’s fault it is.

[@Zeyr01]

"Honey, it's that man talking to his glovebox again" Jokes aside I can't reasonably disagree with anything you've said here. 👍

[@Keithbarber]

Oh, but zeyr0, did you notice his camera? Dooooooohhhhhh 🙄🤔

[@SonOfVulkan]

😂🤣😂🤣👌

[@highdownmartin]

Fair point, I do a “ life saver” on the m/ cycle when turning right. In this scenario if the tractor had just stopped and not crossed the white line, and the Bmw overtook i still think there was insufficient view ahead and an equivalent BMW coming the other way at the same time then there would have been a 120 mph head on. Clarification on the available room would be interesting. I think it would have still been a fingers crossed overtake even if the tractor had not been turning off. Also agricultural machinery like any plant has a much higher proportion of non functioning lights and filthy reflectors than most vehicles. Also to be borne in mind, the indicators may not even work ditto brake lights

[@Ep1cure]

100% agree, Ash. Defensive driving reduces risk significantly. I know that if I had this 'I have right of way' mentality, and not slowed when there was risk when I had right of way, I would have had a fair few collisions by now. I really don't want to tempt fate, but my premiums are very reasonable with the no-claims bonus, and defensive driving can save you much, much more than money can ever buy.

[@Historyfan476AD]

Right of way can't save you from physics.

[@wandpj]

@@Historyfan476AD And biological processes.

[@keithweelands5822]

I live in the countryside, the fastest I ever drive is 40 on 60 mile perhour narrow roads, I can't count how many drivers road rage and honk because I won't speed up, but you never know what's around those bends

[@johnbower7452]

Just came back from Devon/Cornwall holiday; there were roads there where more than 30 felt reckless despite a 60 limit.

[@dedenail]

As the wise words are: "It's a speed LIMIT not a speed target"

[@elizabeths6261]

Same! Winding, bumpy roads and roads that are rarely in the best condition because it's the countryside, and people coming around corners in the middle of the road at speed means I never feel comfortable doing more than 40 in a 60, but other drivers don't like it! My driving instructor always drummed into me "think cow!", if you went around a corner and a cow was in the middle of the road, would you be able to stop? That stuck with me.

[@keithweelands5822]

@@elizabeths6261 I finish work late at night the amount of times I've had a fox, deer or bager run across the road. My soul couldn't take the hit and neither could my wallet.

[@DGQ1Q2]

I am not living countryside, but I have the same complain, indeed, I am all the time trying to avoid drive in countryside roads

[@andyb8015]

I totally see where Ashley is coming from here. If the tractor had seen the situation enough in advance to abort his maneuver, he should have done so. However this should not be an expectation from the tractor, its merely a learning point for something perhaps he could have done better. It could be that the tractor checked his mirror, then Nathan came into view of the mirror the exact moment the tractor took his eyes away from the mirror, and the tractor begins his maneuver as he checks the road ahead. Perhaps this would not have happened if Ashley was in control of that tractor. But what if Nathan was going just a little smidge faster? Would Ashley still manage to see him? What if Nathan was going just little smidge slower? Maybe the tractor would have seen him. Another point to note is that Ashley is clearly a skilled and educated driver, and I admire how he is applying this for good. This is what he has made a career out of. This tractor driver's career is ploughing his field and looking after his crops ect, so we cannot necessarily expect him to have this same level of knowledge and skill. Can the tractor driver learn from this? Of course he can. Is he at fault in this incident? Of course not.

[@davearmstrong2296]

Good points very well made and understood.

[@markwright3161]

4:51 I think you've circled the edge of the front implement and not the mirror. Mirrors on tractors are mounted off the roof and hang down. The top of that circle is where I believe the bottom to the right mirror to be. I've never seen a rear view mirror mounted there and if any mirror was there it's for the driver to see the equipment is functioning correctly from the cab. Edit; I disagree with you being able to see as much as you suggest you would from the tractor driver's position. Visibility out of the cab with implements like that cultivator and seed drill equipment on is severely restricted. This includes view from the mirrors, especially when equipment folds up like this rear mounted item. Tractors are primarily designed for function and not for driving around populated areas, so 360 degree visibility is not held as as important as it is in cities with pedestrians and cyclists swarming all over the place. Mirrors are mainly there for manoeuvring in a yard, in and out of sheds, etc, close quarters manoeuvring needing focus on key areas near to the vehicle, not showing distance or maximum coverage. Trucks have secondary and tertiary mirrors for seeing distance and covering as much of the area to the sides/front as possible. Tractors only have the 2 (one either side) for showing what's around. All others are for showing linkages (to improve view for hooking up to equipment) or other parts of equipment that are prone to 'malfunctioning' in their specific applications, where there isn't a camera or sensor now to do the same job. There is nothing like driving a tractor with the exception of other argi or construction self-propelled equipment. You need to sit in the driver's seat to know what that tractor driver could and couldn't see. I'm on a smaller farm so can't comment with absolute certainty on how bad the view is from that, but I can say that even with our smaller and older equipment, a great deal can disappear behind equipment, and with you in the middle of the cab you can't simply lean out one side to see back that way, it's like looking out the passenger's side window of a van at an angled junction, but in both directions constantly, and without the ability to use your mirrors to help see (be that having a wide angle lens or being able to adjust them electrically).

[@Rover200Power]

Yes, in the original video when the tractor is turning the circled object appears to be right at the front of the tractor, not attached to the side.

[@grahvis]

I can see a possible problem with the tractor slowing or stopping. The overtaking driver may be allowing for the moving of the tractor when pulling out to overtake, if the tractor were to stop, they may not pulled out far enough to clear it and there would still have been a collision.

[@Species1571]

You must always be able to stop in the distance you can see. There could have been another vehicle coming out of that road on the right that the tractor would have had to let clear before turning, or any other obstruction in that road that would have prevented the tractor from making the turn. There's also the possibility of stalling or mechanical breakdown. You cannot just assume things will go the way you predicted.

[@aylesburynumptydrivers9672]

What you have highlighted is not the mirror. The mirrors on tractors are mounted to the top of the cab

[@ClarinoI]

I appreciate the message here Ashley, but I do think you're being very harsh on the tractor driver. He's not a professional driver, he's farmer. He began his turn at the same time Nathan moved to overtake. I truly believe that he never had a chance of preventing this collision, and that the blame falls squarely on Nathan's shoulders. As I said before, I don't think it's about arrogantly assuming priority and forcing the car behind to stop, I think it was close to impossible for the farmer to prevent this collision at all. He will have made the decision to turn before it was possible to see Nathan at all, and while a secondary mirror check is best practice, I don't think it's reasonable to take any blame away from Nathan for this accident.

[@paultune1696]

I agree you have a point Ashley. I have changed my original thought that Nathan was 100% at fault and now make it Nathan is 99.9% at fault. Tractor driver 0.01% at fault. He stopped his turn when he realised Nathan was going to attempt an overtake, in fact there may have been room for Nathan to get by and thus complete his highly dangerous and illegal overtake but he didn't. It's like criticising Chelsey Sullenberger for the crash in the Hudson just because, after repeated attempts and a prior knowledge of what was going to happen, another pilot managed to land at an airport in a simulator.

[@andrewholdsworth4953]

I completely agree with your point about the incident. I drive a 7.5t truck so I'm always checking my mirrors for what is going on behind. I only make a right turn if I'm happy with everything behind me.

[@bennyboy0773]

Great video, I did wonder though, in the eyes of the insurer if you didn’t make the turn (as the vehicle in front) when you see the car approaching from behind, and the car ran into the back of you, would they have a case to say you were unnecessarily blocking the road in a dangerous spot as the indicator would suggest they you may be out of the way by the time they got there. Insurance aside, I agree with your analysis and saving lives trumps insurance battles any day of the week

[@grahamsmith5491]

Never assume that a person indicating to turn is going to do it immediately as there may be some obstruction in the road/entrance their indicating.

[@simonmanners4108]

I agree with what you say. One thing to be mindful of is these situations can and do happen in split seconds. Sometimes there simply is not time to make good decisions or in some cases different decisions. It’s good to analyse these situations and understand what could be done better. This comes down to training and experience. These videos definitely hit this target.

[@stevesmith7530]

Having gone back, watched the video in question, it seems you are possibly making a mistake common of newer drivers. Overestimating your abilities. Even if you are that good, and we all like to think we are, there is a limit to how much you can do to account for other people's actions and choices. Lots to say, probably contentious, so here goes... One critical factor I did not mention when posting on the other thread is the distortion of the dashcam. The moment that tractor comes into view, it is already much, much closer than it appears, with a closing speed of somewhere in the region of 40-50mph. Stopping distance at 50mph, the effective speed, is listed as 13 car lengths. Go find a clip of a more congested roadway, how many car lengths are there at 4:48, a reasonable point for the tractor driver to have perhaps have observed a dark car at high speed around a bend with convex mirrors and sometimes obscured by traffic in the opposing lane? Convex mirrors not only give a wider angle, they massively distort the appearance of distance, just like the wide-angle lens in the dash cam. This is one of the reasons DRLs are a good idea, why motorcyclists have ridden with headlights on for years, to be more than a speck in a mirror. So "I don't think he was actually watching". So even if he were watching, what? He was indicating and a car was coming up behind him at speed. Stop dead? Accelerate away? Make the turn? No option ends well thanks to the decision making processes of the other driver? "He's probably going to overtake", or "He's seen my indicator, he's probably going to stand on the anchors". As is, I dropped down to quarter speed playback, it does rather seem that both vehicles start to move right within a couple of fractions of a second of each other. Remember, 50mph, 13 car lengths. Last time he looked, a split second ago before starting his manoeuvre, the BMW was in lane (likely in a blind spot where he should be). A few metres later, another final mirror check and there is a BMW halfway across the road. The time taken to "change his mind", well that is pretty much about the thinking distance for a last quick mirror look before totally committing to the turn. "I would see the BMW driver" Don't bet the farm on that, bearing in mind the mirrors, the bend, other traffic, the dark car, the speed of approach. Let's assume that the tractor did not commence the turn. Let's further assume Nathan continued to attempt the overtake. Odds on he is now trying to both overtake, and emergency brake. An inexperienced driver already beyond his limits, how is that going to end up? I think I am done now..... But one overreaching question..... When did Nathan first see the tractor? We cannot tell from the clip supplied, did it come out of that side road, or was it visible ahead in the distance on the fairly straight preceding section of road? When Nathan was likely totally invisible to the tractor. The tractor driver did nothing wrong, seems to have done everything correctly, had priority (although most rules of the road ignore the concept, instead referring to who should yield). Signed advanced response driving trainer (with a Cat f - agricultural tractor licence). Defensive driving only goes so far.

[@ashley_neal]

Walter Mitty I think! There is no way on this earth you are Ex traffic Police with your mindset. Anyone with any decent knowledge would know you get your Cat F when you pass your Cat B but you make it out to be something special! Now I've called you out on it please prove me wrong. Thanks anyway for all your recent comments, Ashley.

[@stevesmith7530]

@@ashley_neal I got f before B :)

[@khazi54]

Totally spot on Ashley !

[@M0XXQ]

Very well put Ashley, right of way is something of a confirmation bias which in situations of being in control of a 2 tonne lump of Steel and Aluminium becomes a lethal combination. I drive a relatively fast motor, but that doesn't mean I have to be an arse and overtake everything in front of me, at least only when necessary and safe to do so of course, and recently I conducted a test, bit of a nerdy moment but the result was amazing - I filled up and reset my Odometer, usually I get around 19mpg combined driving so I wanted to see what I could do to improve this versus sacrificing time to get to my destination. I set off on my 65 mile trip north from Gateshead to Berwick upon Tweed in Northumberland, now the main part of this route is the A1 dual-carriageway and is a major trunk road between Scotland and England used by all classes of vehicles, I sat in the inside lane and matched my speed to the slowest vehicle (56MPH) and never once did I have to turn off the cruise control - Total time lost? 10 minutes and returned 33mpg. I was overtaken by several cars and vans (fair enough) of which I caught up with around 10 minutes later, unable to overtake a couple of lorries. The conclusion of this test is that I saved money in fuel consumption, completely stress free drive and only took me 10 mins extra to get to my destination - People just need to calm down and stop being so self-entitled and the roads would be safer and less stressful. So, I would be inclined to agree that "blame" is rightly apportioned between both the Tractor and the BMW driver, thankfully everybody walked away from this terrible accident, a couple of inches the wrong way in the lads decision to abort the overtake would have been met with certain death.

[@davekenworthy630]

Great attitude. It took me some time as a younger driver to learn this lesson, that being "right" doesn't mean very much, and I wasn't on the road to fix other people's mistakes, or punish them for it. Just like in anything else in life, driving presents you with opportunities to make things better for others, and thus yourself. The thing I find myself thinking these days when I see bad driving presenting a hazard is "is this what I want my day (or week or month) to be about?", and then do the safe thing. Other people's bad driving's like bad weather, you can get wound up about it, but what's the point? Better to do what you can to limit the harm.

[@adrianellis2433]

I’ve only just watched both videos. I use to drive Tractors and apart from not indicating earlier (I would have indicated on the start of the bend) the driver of the tractor couldn’t do much more. The type of equipment attached to the Tractor would have given the driver a poor view of traffic behind even to a point where you may not see any vehicles. You are right right of way isn’t a given I just think from my experience’s the Tractor driver only saw the car as he started to turn. Really enjoying your channel and it’s really changing the way I look at road situation

[@iallso1]

Here in New Zealand on faster rural roads it is in the road code that right turning traffic should pull to the left if they can't immediately make the right hand turn. This maintains traffic flow. If the road is busy it can be difficult to make that turn across both lanes, but people have been killed while sitting in the middle of the lane waiting to turn.

[@malcolmclarke7181]

My driving instructor said many years ago, to treat other drivers as idots and I still use it in this day, and it maybe 40+ years ago.

[@CaptChaos1964]

My uncle first taught my older brother how to drive and he told him the exact same thing! We’ve passed that advice through the family for decades, and it works to keep you safe.

[@jamesbooth9017]

Total agree Ashley I always tell my pupils that just because it maybe our right of way it doesn’t mean you can just blindly carry on.it sometimes takes a bit of time with pupils from another Instructor to change the mind set. If You can see things early enough you can sort nearly everything. Keep the good work going

[@wandpj]

So, did the tractor driver haave enough time to sort everything?

[@MBooley]

To quote yourself, Ashley, "Priority is GIVEN, not TAKEN". And what a great quote it is!!

[@frodev728]

Spot on with your analysis mate 👍🏼

[@FelixBank]

Ashley is spot on with this.

[@StAtIc__5]

Great work Ashley. You explained it very well in the previous video and again for this one. That’s just my opinion. Good job 👍

[@decky1990]

This video is yet another example of complete speculation. You should hire the tractor and then show us what it’s like instead of thinking what it’s like. You should also speak to the tractor driver and get it from horse’s mouth instead of assuming what he was thinking or doing while driving.

[@asbornbros]

At the 6:54 mark you circled the marker board warning the the front of the tractor was wide not the mirror the mirror is much higher up

[@mattbarratt5570]

Can I just add the mirror on the tractor is higher and closer to the machine not as marked. Convex mirrors make it harder to judge speed and road position also make cars appear smaller, something that should be taught on driving lessons. The tractor probably would have already braked and slowed due to oncoming traffic. The tractor possibly would have started turning just after the white car as it has to take a shallower approach due to the rear mounted drill. Once a tractor has started turning it would be difficult to stop as a sharp turn to the left would throw the rear mounted machine on to the wrong side of the road.

[@dang2651]

I love the overall message of this video mate. We all use the roads, look out for each other.. not just yourself. Nothing is more valuable than life, even if they are at fault❤

[@doggydriveruk]

If your rant helps save one life, it was worth it. Well said and explained.

[@pdcmoore]

Been in that tractor drivers situation. Idiots behind, me turning right and having to delay the turn. Only a couple of months ago the last one. Saw car coming, long signal, idiot ignoring my signal and still overtaking me. So Ashley has a point. Guess it's one of the things you learn when you do an advanced driving course. But, its difficult to say with any clarity from the video exactly what the tractor driver could see.

[@vx4716]

it might of been a rant but an important one. another great vid thanks ash !

[@ewanhamilton56]

What you circle isn’t the mirror. It’s the front marker plate for the front packer. Mirror is much higher on the side of cab.

[@craigkearns6425]

Ash, I believe your channel’s subscribers and likers are here for your insight rather than the entertainment of other purely dash cam channels. Most are probably dedicated learners looking for more, PDIs, maybe other ADIs. I came as I was helping to teachi a friend, Jody, to drive (her husband was but it was leading to a divorce lol, they came to me as I’m considered calm and knowledgeable about driving). I’m now about to embark on the IAM training and your insights have helped give me the mindset I need.

[@roopsingh3840]

Thanks for reminding me of these key skills to teach! Young lads with emotions in cars with power 🏇 phycology thinking about Risk factors? Always been a tough one to crack! Sound advice Ash. ✅✊🏽 Warwick 🚦🚸

[@alsmith5604]

Well said!

[@paulcollyer801]

Ashley, you’re a man after my own heart! You’ve nailed it on so many levels here! I’ve commented on many a clip compilation about right of way does NOT mean no accident. And the change of mindset and review of things is another. I have been very critical of my own driving on many occasions, thinking, how can I make that Not happen again. And while teaching my late fiancée to drive, my 1st ever teaching to drive experience, (I honestly don’t know how you lot don’t have messy underwear, but then, I don’t have dual controls lol), we had a near miss in a roundabout filter lane with only a chevron separation. The other driver just cut across the chevrons, and my fiancée braked hard & steered off the road. I explained later that while she had done nothing “wrong” she Could do better by easing off in the same situation so the other vehicle wouldn’t have the chance to hit us; a big argument from her, but, I remained calm, and she got it in the end. We can all improve, but only if we accept where we have learning opportunities.

[@zulut1876]

I 100% agree with you Ashley. I'm a response driver for the police, I was responding to an incident the other day and I came to the exact same circumstances of Nathan's collision, I obviously had my blue lights and sirens on. I went to overtake a slow-moving van that was slowing down for a right-hand turn and it pulled out straight in front of my path. The van driver clearly wasn't paying attention or carrying out the appropriate mirror checks. Luckily I planned for the van drivers error and managed to comfortably avoid a collision and continue on my way. This is exactly why the tractor driver in Nathan's car collision is to "blame" or rather is at fault as well. Knowing what's happening around you is extremely important.

[@carlyhilton5114]

Well done to Erin for passing her theory test.. Ashley, I have a test coming up and I just wanted to know if it’s normal to get at least one serious fault on the mock test leading up to the test? I’m getting more and more nervous the closer my test gets! Do you have any advice to help me calm my nerves?

[@douglasorr7799]

Thats not the side mirror that you have circled, its a red/white warning panel like it has on the back. The mirror is positions at 11 oclock just above your circle, its the thing with an image of a BMW driver realising hes fucked up.

[@greebo6549]

@ 4:46 - 4:47, he should have realised he was catching up to the tractor exceptionally fast, and already be slowing down, access the situation then consider an overtake if required

[@Ajd83.]

Well said Ash!!!!!!!!

[@evbobdemon6994]

Yes Erin you go girl. Wooo hooooo.

[@peebee143]

Well done Erin!

[@benjaminhague2675]

I do agree with most of your points here, however there is a massive amount of task loading when driving a tractor, couple that with the very slow speeds can lead to a complacency when out on the roads. Perhaps the tractor driver could have made a difference but honestly I have my doubts in this particular case.

[@catastrophic009]

Most situations are avoidable ...in that instance the BMW driver was not in the mindset of what the tractor might do & it was compounded by his speed & lack of patience All he had to do was slow & wait to see what the tractor was going to. There is always a safer opportunity to overtake! Patience is key....Why take the risk?

[@RonSeymour1]

Well said, Ashley.

[@paulbingham8921]

i totally agree i have a difficult right hard turn on a blind bend i do most days so i always apply my brakes and indicate well before i turn as otherwise im sure my car would be rear ended at least once a month and of coarse i do all my necessary checks before hand ive been driving for well over 40 years and have never written a car off yet being a motorcycle rider to makes for a much better car driver in my opinion

[@Midsussexrailway]

It's a bit like the F1 crash at mugello the other week. Just because the light is green doesn't mean you should go. It's up to you to determine if it is safe to proceed.

[@DisleyDavid]

Totally agree Ashley. Being a good driver means allowing for other road users mistakes even when they are being stupid. I lost count of how many potential crashes I have avoided. Thankfully, most of the time, good drivers gave me a bit of space when I made a mistake.

[@Anolith23]

The way I see it a right the right of way is a guideline for driving in an ideal world without idiots. I treat it more as a way for insurance to sort things out in the event of an accident. Too many times I have had to stop at a give-way for an idiot who doesn't want to wait. If I had continued forward with the mindset of "I have right of way" I would have been in so many accidents, potentially injured and paying a lot more for insurance every year. Best thing to do is always assume everyone is an idiot who is going to cut in front of you, slam on their breaks, turn left from the right etc etc. It has helped me avoid quite a few accidents by being ready for someone being stupid. As for the tractor, I don't think he is a bad driver in the usual sense of things, I just think he wasn't checking behind over and over. I am assuming he checked, signalled and then never checked again just assuming people behind him would pay attention. If he had assumed someone would come in too fast and try and over-take then maybe this wouldn't have happened. At the end of the day, Nathan will be held at fault (rightly so) but it could all have been avoided if the Tractor had been a bit more aware.

[@edwardwong3074]

Agree with you on this 100 percent

[@OldSkoolLover1996]

Everytime I watch those other dashcam channels I see plenty of things that could have been done differently. And that's thanks to you, I wish everyone had this approach to it. Cheers

[@ProMilkshake]

People speeding up on a road about comes to mind.

[@Rover200Power]

One thing that isn't mentioned is the workload on the tractor driver. Driving a car is easy once you have a bit of experience, the hard part is reading the road ahead and making the correct decisions. A tractor, especially one loaded with machinery can be a lot more complex to drive, especially if it is an older model with less automation. The tractor driver only had a few seconds to make sure the road he was turning into was clear, the road ahead was clear, there was nothing behind trying to overtake and to get the tractor in the correct gear ratio and moving.

[@josyms7849]

The fact is Nathan was going far too fast to be able to stop in time. What if there had been cars coming in the opposite direction so that Nathan couldn't have overtaken? Nathan would still have crashed into the back of the tractor. Not the tractor drivers fault at all.

[@andyowens5494]

The change in attitudes required to avoid even more incidents is similar to the approach taken in aviation; yes, it might be easy to attribute pilot error, but investigations go deeper to "why did it happen that way" (insufficient training, poor oversight of performance, cockpit layout etc). We can ALL contribute to reduced incidents by changing behaviour, and as my driving has improved, I realise this and have lost count of the number of times I've been able to say "theres another one avoided". I'm not perfect, and have still ended up in a few over the years, but a lot less than I could have been with some of the muppets driving around me. We all make mistakes, so its nice when someone else bales us out; it's nicer to bale someone else out before the incident happens.

[@johnspear3452]

The tractor driver is not only having to look ahead for other traffic and check behind on his right. Because the implement is mounted behind the rear wheels as he turns it swings left therefore he will be checking his left mirror as much as he is checking right.

[@ZoltanF1LH]

I so agree with you, every time I drive my main aim is to not let other people crash into me or as you say fix their mistakes 😅

[@piggypiggypig1746]

I think the tractor was put under enormous pressure to clear the road by the fast approaching car. It's not a defensible argument I know, just saying. A second or two later and realising that the car was on top of him, he then tried clearing the right side of the road in an agonisingly slow to maneuver vehicle. Anyone who has tried to avoid a pedestrian walking towards them on the high street will understand. Don't forget that a wide angle mirror makes things look much further away than they really are. This is a situation where both parties are lucky enough to walk away from and learn. Speed is your enemy.

[@99awacs]

Just an observation on the tractor; the rear indicator lights set against a white background not that easy to pick out, especially with all the paraphenalia of the rear mounted implement; also an orange strobe light on the tractor cab roof would have given more warning to the BMW driver; this is compulsory on dual carriage way, advisory on single carriageway. I'm not suggesting this was all the fault of the tractor driver. Excessive speed of the BMW driver played a major part in this accident

[@Threelinkdave]

I have only recently found your blogs so apols for late coment. My issue is over use of beacons by works vehicles. I was prompted by the visibility of the indicators The incident happened on the M25 when a highways maintenance vehicle traveling down the hard shoulder nearly pulled out in front of me. I got a blast on the hhorn because I hadnt reacted to his signal, at lleast that is what I assumed. The truck, a rigid HGV, was covered in beacons of the modern LED type. It was lit up like a christmas tree. It was not untill I was almost alongside that there was an additional yellow light on the offside compared to the nearside. With all the beacons the indicator did not stand out. Do you think the HGV should have turned the beacond off before joining the carriageway?

[@R33Racer]

Ash, with all due respect, I do think you're expecting way too much from the tractor driver. Yes in a perfect situation, it would have been good if he saw the speeding car but this means he'd have had to look in the mirror for several seconds to even judge the speed. But then what? He can't exactly 'dart' out of the way. That's also ignoring the fact the machinery on the back would absolutely have destroyed his rear vision. Plus the bend that was blind for some time. Nothing the driver of the tractor could have done would have prevented what happened. What you said is definitely valid and worth taking on board. But this was definitely not avoidable from the tractors POV.