Transphobe Debunks HERSELF on the Joe Rogan Experience

amazin
Website - www.vaush.gg/
Twitter - / vaushv
Patreon - / vaush
Donate - www.paypal.me/...
Intro animation credit goes to / itismekyleg & / honeybunnbadger for the visuals, and / sound_sierra for the audio! Thank you!

[@isaacbenzing5686]

She says most intersex people want to stay within the gender binary, but fails to consider the possibility that they might want to stay in the gender binary because they would rather not be discriminated against by people like her.

[@EdamL22]

You mean to say most people would rather conform to deeply-ingrained social norms which they've been inculcated with from birth than not conform to them? Colour me surprised.

[@rldx7662]

Can you explain how she is discriminatory?

[@blasphimus]

@@rldx7662 She doesn't believe non binary people exist so she likely doesn't believe in their rights. She'll never say it explicitly. Most bigots stay away from the optics of visible bigotry because it gives away their game to get people on their side.

[@rldx7662]

@@blasphimus Yes, she doesn't believe in the concept of non binary. She still thinks the people who say they are non binary exist, so where is the discrimination?

[@antarath517]

@@rldx7662 She believes that anyone should feel free to express their identity, unless their identity is one that she doesn't want to recognize, even though it's been proven valid by science. Consider it discrimination yet?

[@rachelwindsor850]

For those who don't know, Michael Bailey did his "research" for his book at a local gay nightclub. Yes, this is what passes for "research" to these people.

[@emptyeye1324]

Yeah, if you've every read the descriptions of "HSTS" trans women in his book then there's no doubt in your mind that he's a trans chaser.

[@xBINARYGODx]

@L Cincinnatus Please show me the damage to a disadvantaged community that Vaush is doing? Oh right, you cannot. False equivalency. (ignoring that you probably know nothing about that book you are whining about)

[@rachelwindsor850]

@@emptyeye1324 I think Blanchard and a lot of his companions are actually trans chasers.

[@zap192]

@L Cincinnatus do you know what "unemployed" means?

[@NotimetoVero]

@L Cincinnatus who are you talking about? Vaush has a job.. or are you talking about Marx? He also had a job.

[@klip8726]

Thought she was gonna come out as a trans man live

[@IndigoGrey]

I know, that shit was wild.

[@disastermidi1990]

honestly I feel like she's a repressor or some shit

[@eoin8450]

Closeted "he/him"

[@fuzzybuzzy3159]

@@disastermidi1990 She gives me the vibe hard.

[@diamondpelel6291]

I know it’s kind of a dumb cliché to just say “oh they’re just repressing and using their hatred to harm people like them” but fucking SAME. I almost feel bad for her (him?).

[@tessaedwards5707]

"gender isn't a spectrum but here's where I land on the gender spectrum"

[@utrix_1121]

@Jacob Strom To allow for more wiggle room in our conversations about gender. Staying strictly binary limits people in their understanding of themselves.

[@nomemeshere4807]

@Jacob Strom it's science and it's progressive, even if you don't agree with it it's nothing that really affects anyone. People just want to find the best ways to express their truest self to others and doesn't change much about how society runs.

[@ericsmith116]

Makes sense to me

[@ystl1093]

Listened to this podcast, I’m glad I’m not the only person who caught this😭😭

[@cristianproust]

She used the word spectrum in a different sense. She was a masculine woman according to her own words. There is a behavioral average, and the more or less femenine/masculine including asexual, there is zero controversy about it. She refers to a plethora of infinite identities as changing every 15 min your gender (there was a famous case in a podcast). And at the same time, if there weren't 2 biological extremes, trans people wouldn't have a biological claim as being in the wrong body. It is the "they/them" idea that is unscientific (born of social constructionism, as the idea that women have no biological substrate at all, but are constructed, while society modulates, but cannot change innate tendencies), because trans people have existed since the dawn of times, and is a natural as gay people.

[@Deemo202]

“The reason people are mean to you are because you are wrong Debrah” “Oh I know, I know”

[@Drawoon]

26:35

[@lindseyjohnson7156]

That was perfect timing!

[@LouisMV]

Why are you mean to people witch are wrong?

[@toericabaker]

Literally all of my homies hate terfs

[@maruchanramen3500]

Where can I find friends like that? Asking for a friend

[@plubbly3812]

It's me, I'm the homie

[@anyalaASMR]

ay mine too!

[@saladman420]

all of the cool people hate terfs

[@saladman420]

SoggyShrimp nah you’re the sad spiteful loser since you hate trans people

[@anarchohelenism]

Joe Rogan's understanding of gender ended with his 7th grade sex ed class.

[@selenerahman4586]

Bold of you to assume he made it that far.

[@electroflame6188]

tbh that's true for most people

[@chaytonlindsey4885]

he went to school in the 70s and 80s so like I don’t imagine gender was even taught.

[@disastermidi1990]

@@chaytonlindsey4885 can confirm my daddy went to high school in the 80-s and he killed himself to get away from our fam and my trans-ness

[@chaytonlindsey4885]

DisasterMIDI you good?

[@laurendavis-whatley8097]

It’s wild that a transphobe contradicted themselves. Absolutely wild...

[@brooklynhatch9705]

@SoggyShrimp nice strawman. Also that's not even contradictory

[@JoseRS1186]

@Julianne Taylor Pretty much.

[@brooklynhatch9705]

@SoggyShrimp no it didn't. Don't be a snowflake. Also that's a strawman.

[@mmeditatio]

@Julianne Taylor i'm not sure she even realized what her point was, but the idea that she 'felt masculine' because she had 'masculine interests' is dumb. there is no such thing as Masculine Interests. we should be wary anytime someone tries to gender anything, but interests....come on.

[@danielsantos-wh2op]

SoggyShrimp some of them should, some of them no.

[@MaxSnowDude]

Transphobes are the weirdest feelings over facts people I’ve ever met

[@maruchanramen3500]

Yeah, I’ve heard TERFs say “Genitalia defines gender”, which means two things: 1. They clearly don’t know people can be born with both Male and Female genitals or without either. 2. They basically admit they see women as walking vaginas. Edit: Trans Rights!

[@MaxSnowDude]

SoggyShrimp yes you are becuase data shows you’re wrong

[@TheIrishGamer12]

SoggyShrimp trans people have been allowed to compete in the olympics since the 70s. If it would really have been an issue of trans women destroying cid women in sports there should be literally any data on that by now but there is none so that’s a nice feeling you have

[@Lastrit_JME]

@SoggyShrimp That doesn't debunk anything he said. Sometimes Trans Women are going to be really good at what they do, but other times they won't/ Trans Women are allowed in the Olympics, why aren't they dominating the Olympics?

[@Lastrit_JME]

@SoggyShrimp Actually I've played like... a shit ton of sports. I can't anymore cause some homophobic dick heads broke my knee, but I've played Football, Tennis, done Wrestling. In all three of these, I've competed with or alongside women and men, beaten and been beaten by both. And "No transgender athletes are known to have competed at an Olympic Games since 2003" that's because THEY HAVEN'T EVEN QUALIFIED. Yes, some records will be shattered by trans women, I... don't care? There's no real evidence of women being at some incredible disadvantage. In competitive sports trans women have been, and will continue to be, beaten by their cis counterparts. Even with the UFC, Fallon Fox that everyone liked to point to as "just too strong" was... beaten... So like... no big deal.

[@Electric_Bill]

Trans right are human rights. ✊🏿

[@pebb.le_]

Yes!!!

[@VMohdude-]

Based

[@johngr1747]

100%

[@zdrug3676]

So Brave and stunning!

[@aomorgancool1775]

Noooooo

[@Alice0x]

I've come to the conclusion that watching Vaush dunk on transphobes counts as self care. Dysphoria reducing content.

[@miss_drama]

💜

[@RevolutionaryLoser]

Based

[@turbocat8329]

Based and hrt pilled

[@musicvogeladeline]

@Steven Seagal of

[@xavierbuck7179]

@otha cindy Can you elaborate? Do you have academic research showing left leaning people are more likely to be narcissistic and right leaning people are more likely to be psychopaths?

[@eman22017]

I’ll never understand why so many people get so bent out of shape over what people want to identify as.

[@runningoutoftime7065]

I only care because I want to be sure that I am with a biological woman

[@Prodigi50]

If you look at gender the same way you look at race, then it’s not hard to understand. It’d be... interesting for someone who’s white to say they’re black and vice-versa.

[@kassandracrow6119]

little correction. they dont want to identify( you cant choose your gender identity ) they identify because they are women male or non binary.

[@odonnellcaleb]

Seriously..Imagine this happening with just a name... Guy 1- "Hey my is Scotty" Guy 2- "Well here on your birth certificate it says your name is Scott" Guy 1 -"Scott is my dad's name I prefer to be called Scotty" Guy 2 - "Well your name is Scott I'm not going to call you Scotty just because you prefer to be called that." Universally everyone would think that second guy is an asshole.

[@Prodigi50]

@@kassandracrow6119 Considering that gender is a social construct and a spectrum, it’s an identity that’s chosen based on characteristics that people innately feel.

[@BullofCrete]

The fact that she can go "gender isn't a spectrum" and then almost IMMEDIATELY afterward describe how her gender presentation includes a lot of things associated with masculinity is baffling.

[@youwontgetmynamenotevenmyl6986]

It's kinda a semantic disagreement. A lot of these people don't draw any distinction between sex and gender, but they do draw a distinction between presentation and sex/gender. So they would agree that presentation is a spectrum, but they don't connect gender and presentation.

[@Andrewhamiltonfox777]

She never claimed to be a man, she claimed to be a woman with masculine traits. That's the difference.

[@BullofCrete]

@Sean Davis Gender is a set of social roles with expectations for how people should look and act. And considering how people act is pretty heavily tied to personality, they kinda have a lot to do with gender.

[@BullofCrete]

@@Andrewhamiltonfox777 I never said she claimed to be a man, I'm just pointing out how asinine it is for her to say, "you're either MAN or a WOMAN, it's BINARY" and then describing her own gender presentation along a spectrum-i.e she's a woman with masculine traits, but in a binary, there's only woman or man.

[@emptyeye1324]

The etymology of the word gender is that it comes from the same root word as genus or genre and originally meant "type, kind, or sort"

[@officialasa]

“sex and gender are the same. that’s why i’m a female but i feel like a man” seems legit

[@skeelo2502]

When did she say they were the same?

[@officialasa]

Skee Lo she conflated them a few times, saying sex is determined by gametes, and immediately following that up with “so scientifically there are only two genders”, which suggests that she doesn’t make a distinction between the two.

[@skeelo2502]

@@officialasa You are skipping over the sentence just before that where she says that "for 99% of us our biological sex is our gender".

[@lancewalker2595]

Can I get a timestamp on that?

[@fanghur]

@@officialasa That's because outside of the social sciences, and especially in the harder sciences like neuroscience, sex and gender ARE very often used much more interchangeably in many contexts. So yes, she technically misspoke there insofar as how Vaush would use the terms, but at that point you're just quibbling over semantics and not the actual empirical claims.

[@DeciduousClouds]

"you're not cancelled; you could drone strike my house"

[@irequireyourcheese5106]

That shit killed me

[@Lanoira13]

Out of context Vaush lmao

[@thelax5311]

I cringed when she unknowingly started arguing against herself.

[@SalinaBabba8343]

Someone revoke her PhD. Can that be done?

[@ktaikamatika1397]

@@SalinaBabba8343 PHDs nowdays are given in a protectionist/nepotistic way, no proper opposition, many conflict of interest, etc. Check out How Sam Harris acquired his equipment for his "believer vs. nonbeliever brains" PHD.

[@Axxilles]

Came here to the comments literally to say the same thing.

[@joseph_soseph9611]

I started laughing uncontrollably

[@skeelo2502]

She didn't though. But if you're a Vaush fan it comes as no surprise that you couldn't keep up either.

[@FuneralThirst999]

her book is literally dedicated "to everyone who blocked me on twitter" dont even know what to say to that, in all honesty.

[@cmac3936]

I guess that’s a valid dedication, since getting blocked on twitter helped fuel her intense victim complex and got her on Rogan’s radar.

[@LuxPsy]

When a paediatric doctor from Harvard tried to have a discussion with her on Twitter, she promptly blocked him.

[@Madkalibyr]

Yikes?

[@theboneeater]

NICE

[@LuxPsy]

@scandinavialuvr poggers Yes his name is Jack Turban. He's a paediatric psychiatrist. He went to med school at Harvard and Yale, and is now working at Stanford. He got blocked by Debra on Twitter for pointing out that she erroneously used “transvestic festishism” to invalidate trans identity. You can see their Twitter exchange here: twitter.com/jack_turban/status/1014661084442218496

[@TM-qt2ze]

i can throw a punch💪💪 i'm so boy-ish😋👦🙈, girls like dolls👶😘🌸 and being stupid💞?😂, i'm so masculine😏😳💪🌌

[@Romanticoutlaw]

“not like other girls” syndrome going strong

[@ananyats5063]

Lol

[@industrialalliance9905]

Giving me pick me energy

[@joe-fk5ud]

i think she’s just a masculine woman not one of those girls lol

[@zachperkins688]

Joe Rogan drives me nuts. He shouldn't be qualified to do ANYTHING political - he always just morphs into his guest's political views whether good or bad. He probably isn't even transphobic... He reminds me a lot of me a few years ago where I genuinely though people like Blaire White were representative of most trans people.

[@AConnorDN38416]

nah, he is transphobic. He's been shitting on trans people for years

[@DoinkertonGreeble]

The real problem is that Joe Rogan provides zero pushback against the people he "interviews". Whether or not he agrees with what they say doesn't matter, as he is providing them with an unchallenged platform for them to spread their beliefs.

[@furiousapplesack]

@@DoinkertonGreeble That's not entirely true, though. His tactic of giving people enough rope to hang themselves does bear fruit on occasion. Dave Rubin, Ben Shapiro and Candace Owens come to mind. In the face of basic questions they crumbled because they were caught off guard and also quite dim. Usually I chalk it up to whether or not a guest is a skilled propagandist. The skilled make full use of his platform to reach millions, the unskilled are made to look like idiots. It's a double-edged sword. I was surprised that Shapiro did so poorly in the system racism bit because he's a more technically talented rhetorician than most of them, but it was one of the few segments where Joe seemed knowledgeable enough to argue the case.

[@ElectricChaplain]

@@alejandropena9825 insincere. Who knows why it didn't show up in your keyboard's spell-check 🤷‍♂️. Oh wait duh you're probably not using a phone

[@moodycxnt]

@@DoinkertonGreeble this is wack and untrue. How do people keep saying this? It is constantly debunked. Vaush himself has done videos showing Joe pushing back on stupidity from right wingers. Usually only when he actually knows what he's talking about tho. Like he doesn't know trans politics, but he pushed back (and easily destroyed) Rave Dubin on building codes, Steven Crowder on weed, and Ben Shapiro on his homophobia.

[@klip8726]

Sex is biological. Gender is social. They are not the same.

[@klip8726]

Hot take sex is dumb too

[@onepartyroule]

Gender isnt entirely disconnected from biological sex though. Some aspects of gender are, some arent.

[@johnedwards1968]

@@onepartyroule I'd say gender is based on, but not dependent on sex.

[@fanghur]

The broad behaviour patterns typically associated with the two sexes also have strong biological (More specifically neurological) underpinnings, though. Gender may be largely social, but it also can’t be completely divorced from biology either. Albeit not in the sense most naive essentialists typically have in mind.

[@ivan_ivankovich]

Biological sex is also cringe in the sense that the two categories are heavily flawed. An AFAB can live their whole life wihout realizing they never had a womb or XX chromosomes, or that they had other physiological characteristics that are actually associated within the male category. It's bimodal

[@jadenschneider1279]

"Gender and sex are the same." "I, a woman, have always felt more like a man."

[@jasonradeke4571]

But she's still a woman. That's her point.

[@miajajajajajajajajajo]

​@@jasonradeke4571 that's the thing, other than taboo, there's nothing stopping her from being a man, or something close to a man

[@slampey]

Yeah she totally “debunked” genderisms especially when she said “no Joe, it’s not ME who is right. It’s the FACTS that are right”

[@DeathRayGraphics]

If there is a "gender spectrum", then by all means tell us: If gender does not reference the male or the female, what on earth could it be referencing? Is there any possible , limit to how many "genders" there can be? Does society have to embrace limitless pronouns? How is this practical?

[@slampey]

Death Ray who cares

[@DeathRayGraphics]

@@slampey Obviously Vaush does-- he's furious at a professional who has a reason to say the things she does instead of Vaush, whose heart is in his colon.

[@slampey]

Death Ray malding

[@DeathRayGraphics]

@@slampey I have never heard that word before.

[@grosezero8834]

Joe Rogan will talk to a person and agree with anything they say

[@anyalaASMR]

weakest bald baby man

[@bobjenkins4925]

Or Stephen Crowder on weed😂

[@zongzoogly4549]

Which is why we need to push for him to get Zizek or Richard Wolff on his show and he'll suddenly become a communist.

[@mmeditatio]

@@bobjenkins4925 hate crowder but that was truly uncomfortable

[@ulipeterson6112]

not everytime. he sometimes openly disagrees with his guests. remember when he was discussing climate change with Candice Owens?

[@warframergaming6420]

This is like the all homophobes are secretly gay meme but it is an anti transgender female person who has felt more masculine all her life.

[@noorasoroushnejad2841]

this is the most evolved stage of "im not like the other girls"

[@user-hu3iy9gz5j]

You do realize personality is not the same as gender?

[@sophiepooks2174]

@@user-hu3iy9gz5j Of course most trans folk realize that, a butch female doesn't always equal trans same as fem man doesn't always equal trans. same as we had music subcultures in the 1980's had little to to with gender identity or sexuality but some of us in those music cultures were lgbtq+

[@diegosanchez894]

Plot twist, she is trans. Directed by M night shyamilan

[@MatthewBanks100]

Would it....KILL Vaush to learn to say Sam HARRIS vs. Sam Seder?!?!?!

[@griggerykimothy4865]

SERIOUSLY

[@_12346.]

“Calling me by the name of a psychopathic liar like Sam Seder is a deliberate attempt to mischaracterize my ideas and take them out of context from all the nuance necessary” -Sam Harris

[@BeanBossing]

@@_12346. sounds like a phsycopath to me

[@Axxilles]

It literally would. Don't make him do it, we need him.

[@gavinerickson9392]

Both suck and hate Socialism.

[@QosmicVoid]

Imagine how poorly thought out your arguments have to be that you debunk yourself because *another transphobe* asked you basic questions. I'm more impressed than anything.

[@nukiradio]

A special wrong I can only refer to as " *Wrong2* "

[@brianm7278]

She has a doctorate in philosophy. Philosophers are expected to understand logic.

[@tomasrocha6139]

@@brianm7278 She has a doctorate in psychology not philosophy

[@disastermidi1990]

26:35 Vaush: "The reason people are mean to you is because you're wrong, Debra" Debra: "Oh I know, I know"

[@EdgieAlias]

Kaitlyn Bennett moment.

[@RaulHernandez-li8po]

Conservatives always debunk themselves in real-time on his podcast. It’s like Joe puts them to tee off and they swing missing.

[@cagecunningham6316]

EVERY. TIME.

[@poisondamage2182]

Inb4 Joe Rogan is actually a 45D chess playing leftist

[@sgwinenoob2115]

@@poisondamage2182 well he subtly pushes against them very often

[@counselorguy5481]

She's not conservative at all. She's a standard lib.

[@DalleDayul]

Sam Seder joined the Intellectual Dark Web in this debate

[@wolfstar675]

🤣🤣🤣

[@Hayden_Cat]

SalasASS boi he does the talk show “majority report” and he tries to get steven crowder to debate him but crowder is to much of a bitch to do it.

[@BetaDreTV]

you caught that too huh? he probably meant sam harris.

[@avosthyric]

@@BetaDreTV yeah he mixes them up regularly and corrects himself every time he notices it. Definitely meant Sam Harris

[@avosthyric]

@@Hayden_Cat before Vaush came along and I switched over to his content I watched Majority Report a looot. Still can't get over the fact Sam Seder is supposed to be over 50

[@HookEmRicky]

These right wingers and their obsession with the trans community is so weird lol

[@LexEx913]

Wanting special treatment is also weird

[@tylereline5148]

T D by special do you mean equal?

[@LexEx913]

@@tylereline5148 given that trans people can't handle critism and accountability (which is a part of equality) I'd say no they want special treatment.

[@gavinerickson9392]

The Dems like to tout their diversity, but there are more gay men in the GoP than any other organization.

[@dantealighieri8403]

@@gavinerickson9392 that's interesting, I would have never thought that was possible. Could you link it?

[@Siberius-]

She literally mentions how her gender doesn't align with her sex, but is hoping no one noticed? or maybe she does align with the gender of "woman", but, "a woman who likes likes to fulfil expected man-roles in society" (maybe excluding the presentation part of it, or just too uncomfortable to do that in society). Which is still explaining the difference between gender and sex, it's just a matter of identification.

[@forposterity4031]

I know huh, penises are totally vaginas are have no differences!

[@fanghur]

Sex refers to what's between your legs and/or what your chromosomes/gametes are. Gender on the other hand is neurological, and need not necessarily align with one's sex.

[@tomasrocha6139]

Gender means the male or female sex it has nothing to do with personality

[@Siberius-]

@@tomasrocha6139 - Just so as we're on the same page, the way people are using the terms in this context, is sex = biological sex, and gender = identifying in relation to behaviour and presentation as they pertain to gender roles/appearance in society. The terms have often been used synonymously, but they are not at all synonymous in this context. You might not personally like to use the terms like this, but this just IS how many people/organisations are using the terms.

[@bigbrain955]

Absolutely nobody: Female xx proud adult human female Terfs: You know actually I've always thought of myself as a boy even when I was a young child and I always liked being super boyish and I would always get mistaken for a boy and it felt really good but now Im just a tomboy guys I swear

[@maviebaby]

It's amazing how ppl like this base their career and identity on being cancelled. Noam Chomsky never brings it up unless he's asked about it. He might be the most cancelled intellectual living today.

[@eoin8450]

SHES ONE OF THE BOYS

[@wolfie1234100]

R/notlikeothergirls

[@cdubbart]

I would just like to congratulate Dr Debrah Soh for being so brave here and vulnerable enough to express her masculine gender identity. Let’s all encourage her to continue to come forward and embrace her true self.

[@GrayYeonWannabe]

this but unironically

[@UmongusSussehFrusseh]

*HIS true self.

[@kedamafoe2240]

Lol this tomboy just invalidated her own argument. "Gender not a spectrum" "let me explain how me being a woman is a spectrum"

[@kiralawliet5612]

I believe she was trying to make the point that although she exhibited masculine behavior as a kid, that didn't stop her from identifying as a woman. What you do and what you're into doesn't make you a man or a woman.

[@HARLANDfigueroaZ]

By the way SHE IS NOT A MEDICAL DOCTOR. She has a doctorate in philosophy, she has no authority on this topic.

[@cameronfrancis7699]

Ah, Peterson style

[@tardigrada2286]

She has awful opinions but don't blame it on her having the wrong degree. Her PhD (doctor of philosophy) is in psychology and even in the right general area. As "sex research" includes a variety of different fields, such as biology, behaviour, and sociology, a lot of the researchers have PhDs. They are still serious experts on the topic. The problem with her degree is more the opposite and worse: she should know better and doesn't.

[@joeyrasmussen8394]

Holy shit. Of course

[@lancewalker2595]

Do you maintain the same standard for sociologists?

[@HARLANDfigueroaZ]

@@tardigrada2286 My main problem is that she is intorduced in Joe Rogen as a Doctor and a sex researcher. And to a Layman that would imply that she is a medical doctor that treats transgender patients.

[@musicf3b]

I’ve grown tired of “debunked” video titles. This lady just has a conflicting opinion. She hasn’t empirically disproven anything. (Referring to Joe’s video, not V’s satire of the trend)

[@ArtoriaZz2137]

you mean she has contradicting opinion?

[@musicf3b]

Jakub Szymański I saying she has an opinion that conflicts with the general consensus

[@iJettla4]

You can't empirically disprove that gender is a spectrum. Gender is a spectrum because it's defined to be that way in the social sciences. It's like saying you can disprove that the electromagnetic spectrum is a spectrum. Edit: Not saying that I think it's wrong to think of gender as a spectrum.

[@ej9806]

I mean most Vaush's fans are clearly illogical and uneducated so he can put whatever title he wants

[@musicf3b]

E J His title appears to be a playing off Joe’s

[@icemeoutlikeelsa]

He also had another woman that wrote an entire book about an epidemic of teens being peer pressured to become trans based on a "study" that was just a survey of people who had gone to websites with anti-trans content. Not even surveying trans people who regretted it or teens who felt pressured. And still Rogan had her on for hours just running their mouths about trans people and what a massive issue this was.

[@a-zfan3229]

Rogan really values his masculinity and there’s nothing wrong with that. So when people try to tell him that the basis, the rock, of his gender identity is not as solid as he would like to think, he resists

[@lancewalker2595]

What about Joe Rogan makes you believe that he "values his masculinity"?

[@lancewalker2595]

@@tyler-xo3rb He doesn't tend to focus on particular topics, which podcasts are you referring to?

[@imacds]

**in a nasal voice** Well technically a galaxy has a finite, albeit large, amount of atoms while a spectrum is uncountably infinite so...

[@williamsanders2348]

Just Googling her name reveals photos of her and Shapiro, Glenn beck, Tim P(F)ool, and of course Rogan, she's already appeared on the podcast.

[@KevinUchihaOG]

Guilt by association huh?

[@accountnotfound4209]

Not so intellectual intellectual dark web

[@ultravires2335]

This debate transphobed debunked lost.

[@brandonw2471]

oll

[@matuibrzui389]

appeal to authority fallacy

[@Cobalt985]

@@brandonw2471 oiI?

[@WiloPolis03]

@@Cobalt985 oil

[@stefanalexanderlungu1503]

@@matuibrzui389 Bruh what

[@phenomiks]

she’s literally a “not like the other girls” girl

[@OakenTome]

The “I have some concerns” line has started to throw alarm bells on in my head. I have this internal connotation with that phrase and “I’m about to say something reaaal sketchy”.

[@Romanticoutlaw]

it’s got the same feel as “I’m not racist, but”

[@bonthebunnycat667]

That line are literally in every TERF manifesto, including J.K's

[@mychemicalshazam]

Joe needs contra on his show

[@GOLDFISH817]

He would agree with her then agree with someone who says the opposite shit cuz he’s assumes everyone is smart

[@Count_Gustav]

@@GOLDFISH817 As I always suspect about "podcast" thing, It's probably under the contract that Joe should agree on, "do not argue with co-respondend"

[@lieli_tash2777]

ooooooo

[@nopenotnever3769]

No he needs someone who can speak for trans men/ NBs since apparently being trans and having dysphoria is fake when AFABs do it and its just because we're ugly and dont like barbies.

[@johnedwards1968]

Jordan Peterson has a protege apparently.

[@Electric_Bill]

Lmao that grille.

[@matuibrzui389]

appeal to authority fallacy

[@Electric_Bill]

@@matuibrzui389 Imagine calling fallacies out in current year.

[@gavinerickson9392]

Wait, she's addicted to crack?

[@johnedwards1968]

@@matuibrzui389 More like appeal to LACK of authority

[@smallman3381]

so she's "not like other girls" but I can't be nonbinary?? eeejskskssjej

[@kiralawliet5612]

You can do whatever you want as the sex that you are. Not fitting into the traditional feminine gender role is not the same as not being a woman.

[@lostotter1956]

@@kiralawliet5612 Sure, sex is different to gender, and gender is different to gender roles. Someone could be born female, not fit the feminine gender role and not be a woman. Alternatively, someone could be born female, not fit the traditional feminine gender role and be a woman. It depends on the individual. Idk, you might already understand and agree with this, in that case I apologise, but it isn’t clear right now

[@kiralawliet5612]

@@lostotter1956 What exactly is a woman though? I typically get two types of answers to this question. One is "someone who identifies as a woman", and two is "someone who exhibits traits and behaviors traditionally considered feminine." I take issue with both definitions. The former means nothing. There is no utility to a label, that doesn't go any deeper in describing you than, "that's what I choose to call myself". The latter is deeply regressive, in my opinion. The idea that you have to fundamentally identify with a socially constructed range of behaviors, just doesn't sit well with me. If you have another definition, I'd be interested to hear it. But for now, I'll stick with "a human female".

[@RoseRocket]

What is "not like the other girls" anyway?? Shes not bashing women at all by saying that. Shes bashing them by disagreeing with genders but how is she not like the other girls?? I never understood how saying you're a masculine women is bad. I understood the joke by the way, but generally I just want to know what's the problem with the "not like the other girls" type? Are woman only suppose to be feminine? Girly? Why don't men have this label when they say they're a feminine man? This kind of label is just rude. Maybe not on her but whenever someone is tomboy or a masculine women they get this label.

[@justaspiral13]

@@RoseRocket The problem isn't her masculinity, its the fact that she keeps talking about "you should own your masculinity, dont trans yourself" but she is completely misunderstanding nonbinary identities and putting others into boxes,, so it just comes of as a pointless flex.

[@jayd3337]

Why is she so concerned about trans people? Stop already. Got a feeling she's undergoing internal conflict. If she's a tomboy, cool.

[@stefanlangenhoven78]

🤦🏽‍♂️she really just went and discredited everything she's said

[@jacob-breedlove]

Vaush said Sam Seder and my face went 😟

[@jacob-breedlove]

SalasASS boi vaush said his name accidentally instead of Sam Harris

[@cutecommie]

@@jacob-breedlove He always does that, you learn to ignore it

[@LazarheaD]

Vaush wants the Sam SEEDer.

[@oneraindrop8089]

I usually find accussing transphobes of being eggs (transpeople that don’t know they’re trans yet) distasteful, but she literally said, “I feel like a man in the way that you feel like a man…I’ve always felt masculine.” She explained transgender identity perfectly wtf

[@andrewesposito2071]

I don’t think people realize how much influence this woman has. The things she says are frequently repeated by people like Steven Crowder and Ben Shapiro. It’s terrifying

[@horizon92lee]

“Gender is not a spectrum” , what an ignorant sheltered take

[@tubbylumpkins4885]

Forreal. You really don't even need to see evidence, it's just a logical thing to think.

[@brownwater6212]

@SoggyShrimp """Gender in not a spectrum" , what an ignorant sheltered take" , what an ignorant sheltered take" , what an ignorant and sheltered take

[@brooklynhatch9705]

@SoggyShrimp unironically no uing

[@josephinegrant8941]

@SoggyShrimp the old "I know you are but what am I" it's very childish.

[@hihiz432]

@SoggyShrimp 😬 yikes someone needs to look up the definition of sex and gender.

[@jeffc5974]

"I'm not anti porn, I wrote for a men's magazine." What do these things have anything to do with each other?

[@user-sf9gs2pg1b]

Lmao, good point

[@undeniablereality9904]

I just looked her up, and I'm a bit ashamed that I share an alma matter with her. However, she's misrepresenting herself as a scientist. She hasn't practices as a scientist since she was a PhD student. and after looking at her profile, it's clear that she was a mediocre PhD student who couldn't make it in academia anyway. It's quite unethical for a science columnist to present herself as a scientist while spouting pseudoscience. Shameful.

[@bradm6287]

Every 40 or 50 years, a Conservative comes around that is smart enough to attend medical school.

[@bambimorrison1031]

Her doctorate is in philosophy

[@poisondamage2182]

@@bambimorrison1031 oof

[@AznGotChen]

@@bambimorrison1031 u do realize that the acronym phd is short for doctorate of philosophy. She has a phd in psychology, meaning she has a doctorate of philosophy in psychology. Please if you are going to Google, click on the resources and not just read the description.

[@lolwhatidk]

wow she literally did debunk herself not a clickbait title A+

[@bekkayya]

watching Joe be so dumb he accidentally asks his guest a cutting question and they completely implode gives me life. Its happened a few times now. Joe is aweful but I legit think he is unaware of the metagame.

[@pythosdegothos6181]

You think that was accidental?

[@goddesseris4561]

When you said Sam Seder I was about to unsub Dog, don't insult my dad like that!

[@Sebanovic5]

Elemental GQ have Vaush and Seder ever talked? I would love to see that

[@sathrielsatanson666]

You know your views are bad when Joe Rogan manages to debunk them.

[@paulmckeever9489]

She's confused. She seems to be telling on herself. We all seem to use our academic clout, such that it is, to amplify our own life process. Whether it be recovering from trauma, or issues with identity, or disorders of behavior- the list goes on. Whatever she's going through, I hope she gets the help she needs and discontinues working this out in public.

[@Deadpool3E]

I've heard of Dr. Soh. She was one of the shrinks used to verify James Damore's claims.

[@dudeman5303]

@Julianne Taylor oh my god it was also Jordan Peterson. I just looked it up, they were the first 2 names listed lmao. How pathetic

[@lancewalker2595]

James Damore's claims did not address the topic of gender, his claims were exclusively predicated on biological arguments. You can disagree with the cited biology, but don't conflate sex with gender.

[@mcbrodz1663]

“Yeah sex and gender are two different things but I have female genitalia but I also *feel* masculine”

[@lancewalker2595]

Right, and she's saying that she doesn't feel it necessary to alter her biology to feel masculine. Essentially she is keeping sex and gender distinct, gender and sex are not the same thing - so why would a transgender person need to alter their biology to be properly trans?

[@The5armdamput33]

I like how she pretends she's an authority on science...

[@fabscams4136]

Gender is a social construct but then again what isn't a social construct? We can then argue what social norms are based on our biology, and gender is a social construct based on biology.

[@amber9040]

Someone's gotta tell this Debora person about the concept of demigender

[@anonymanvandare3681]

Gender Identity is a social construct just like any kind of identity . But gender is characteristics and behaviors influenced by biological, social and cultural factors. So gender is not totally a social construct but it’s partially a social construct

[@loobly]

Lmao I'm trans/nb and honestly porn was the reason I realized I wasnt just a guy. I watched porn and a lot of the time I thought "lmao but what if it was from the woman's perspective". Yeah it probably branches from not having an often present male role model and mostly just having women around but like this is just who I am. People like her that say it's just wanting to escape some sexual expectation are just kinda ?? to me like yeah ig that's a valid point and maybe it's true for some people but for me it's more bc I feel like I fit into both categories, sometimes I wanna be a guy and be good looking but a lot of the time I just want to look pretty and smol. Idk, this shit makes me fuckin tired

[@mscottjohnson3424]

I come from a science background. In the strictest biological terms, yes, sex is determined by gametes and nothing else. Males produce sperm, females produce eggs. Some organisms, like most seed producing plants, produce both and so it is not appropriate to assign a sex to the entire organism, it is rather assigned to different reproductive organs. This, of course, raises some questions. What is the sex of a pre-pubescent boy who doesn't yet make sperm? What is the sex of a man who, through nature or injury, can't produce sperm. Are post-menopausal women still female? Do intersex people who don't produce functioning gametes have a sex? These questions expose that when people talk about sex, they aren't really talking about biological function most of the time. Yes, humans have primary and secondary sex characteristics like genitals and body hair, but those are in no way definitive of sex. Male and female dragonflies don't have these characteristics. So while I would argue that in the strictest biological terms there are exactly two sexes, that isn't really what people are talking about when they talk about sex and gender. And this is the first time I'm mentioning gender. Gender is very much a human thing, as far as we know (who knows, maybe dolphins have gender identities, but starfish certainly don't). And gender is a very complex combination of an internal sense of one's own sex (which may or may not match the gametes they produce, if they produce any at all), how one presents that sense of their sex, and the norms society has set up to differentiate how sexes are expressed. "How many genders are there?" is impossible for biology to answer since what constitutes a gender is socially constructed. We could have a society where butch lesbians or small feminine men are considered to be a different gender from very feminine straight women and large, hairy men.

[@mscottjohnson3424]

@SoggyShrimp It's far more complicated than that. First, there is no "male" or "female" body. There are such a wide range of bodies. Second, there are intersex people who have sex characteristics associated with both sexes. Third, if you take hormones, your body will change to be more male or more female. So people can literally change their bodies to be biologically similar to the other sex than the one they were born with. On top of that, it is medical, psychological, and scientific consensus that transitioning is the best treatment for gender dysphoria. So there's that.

[@TheDominicProject]

I take offence that fighting is masculine. She can fight without it being gendered. Looks like the curse of cringe strikes again she's just a sleeper agent in denial of her true identity

[@kiralawliet5612]

You can do ANYTHING and not have it be gendered. All sexes have access to the full scope of behaviors.

[@joshuniacke2442]

This completely encapsulates why I’m so confused at her point, she insists on binary gender, says gender is linked to sex, then goes on to explain how her behaviours don’t conform to the standards of binary gender norms, so what is she even saying? Does she just thing gender is another word for sex and societies ideas of masculinity and femininity are separate? Cos that’s categorically incorrect medically and etymologically, these right wing grifters just shit words out their mouth sometimes

[@Stickiey_]

Vaush, this is in REALLY bad taste, I agree with you on the transgender issues in the video but when Joe Rogan clutched his chest and starting having a heart attack why did you start laughing?! Jamie ran over to help him and called an ambulance, BUT HE DIDN'T MAKE IT. Joe Rogan is dead and you laughed at his demise on video. Not ok. Delete this.

[@coolgirl23145]

What

[@Stickiey_]

@@coolgirl23145 Joe Rogan is dead

[@vicentemariani8730]

I just googled him and he is alive

[@Stickiey_]

@@vicentemariani8730 no hes not

[@vicentemariani8730]

@Sane _ That’s what I said He is not dead he is alive

[@andrewesposito2071]

Also, she’s hardly an academic. She left academia real fast after her PhD and became a journalist

[@ChewyThomson]

"I can't be racist, I have black friends." - Debbie Soh, a real academic

[@gavinerickson9392]

I thought that was a quote of Joe Biden's.

[@stefanalexanderlungu1503]

@@gavinerickson9392 What

[@gavinerickson9392]

@@stefanalexanderlungu1503 It's pretty self explanatory, or is it just dawning on you that Joe Biden is a vicious racist?

[@stefanalexanderlungu1503]

@@gavinerickson9392 Are you talking about "you ain't black"? I'm having a really hard time conceiving of what you could possibly be talking about.

[@gavinerickson9392]

@@stefanalexanderlungu1503 No, I'm talking about the crime bill that put my coworkers and their parents in jail or to death, I'm talking about the political maneuvering along side segregationists, I'm talking about all the wars he helped start with sole purpose of raping black and brown people over seas and pillaging their lands. I'm not talking about foolish drivel he says in his currently demented state.

[@theboneeater]

D. Soh is clearly closeted about something. I've had similar experiences and I know how miserable everything feels. The self-betrayal is constant and pervasive. I hope they feel better soon.

[@aspacelex]

Reminder that she holds a doctorate in philosophy, not biology.

[@juliusbeutler7090]

If cancel culture is so damn powerful, then why haven't we cancelled Joe Rogan for being transphobic af?

[@MichaelAronson]

Go ahead. Nobody's holding you back.

[@thephoenix756]

You can't cancel someone that does not rely on your support.

[@FrauStormm]

Vaush got rick roll’d in this debate

[@scottshaw8864]

Lack of self awareness is such a hallmark of conservative thinking.

[@radicalpasta7040]

It hurt itself in its confusion!

[@user-il9ze9py8c]

Why is it that when people talk about needing to have a conversation, they don’t ever actually have the conversation?

[@kuggacouragegx6093]

Ppl do. It just ppl like vaush don't

[@kuhj278]

To answer your question about porn, it's called autogynephilia and is very common among young autistic boys who overdosed on anime and porn. You should know this.

[@manganess5126]

Imagine saying that sexism and homophobia may contribute to some people transitioning, and instead of combatting those turning to transphobia

[@PiPArtemis]

Mad respect to the guy that linked a Rick Roll in chat Genuinely laughed my ass off. I really hope you didn't get banned for it

[@mielipuolisiili7240]

I laughed too and would laugh even more if I learned that they did get banned.

[@Squirreltasticqueen]

If you come up with a theory on gender and sex and then say "well we can just ignore these outliners" you aren't a credible scientist you cannot ignore outliners and then expect to be taken seriously. Sincerely a intersex woman

[@anonymanvandare3681]

I REPEAT GENDER IS NOT TOTALLY SOCIAL!!! ITS A MIX OF SOCIAL, CULTURAL AND BIOLOGICAL FACTORS THAT determines ones gender!!! You can’t say that gender and sex is totally independent from each other... Sex partially influences gender. Ands that’s not an opinion that’s a fact

[@RavensRift]

As a trans man who was in fact exposed to pornography at a young age by accident, i can garentee that me witnessing a woman getting fingered at the age of 6 has nothing to do with me wishing I had a penis. I didn't even actually fully consider being trans until I was in high-school. I took my time and figured out what my problems were with being female, so that argement is total bull shit. I am a man because I want to be perceived as masculine. I want to be with a woman as a man would or be with another man as a man would. I have no desire to be perceived as a woman regardless of socal standing. I was encouraged to aspire to be whatever I wanted as a child dispite my gender and eventually decided that I just hated being perceived as feminine at all. I'm disgusted by the concept of personaly bearing a child from by body. It seems wrong in evey way. And thats not because of the pain or witnessing childbirth, this came well before. Scientifically speaking, I have a brain more of that of a male than of a female. Any claim that it is due to some emotional trauma is dumb and wrong.

[@Graeberwave]

Words will one day express the anger I feel when in the “JRE.”

[@nimpark]

Wow... I saw her book in the bookstore near me and almost bought it because I'd never heard of her name. As a trans person, the title seemed intriguing but now I'm glad I never bought it and gave any support for that woman!

[@sammyvincent9615]

I kinda love when Joe rogan questions her masculinity because that's EVERY TRANS PERSONS LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@samuelreynaldoff]

In regards of the comments that "no one tell people things can't be discussed,...You had a bad idea, got criticized and now play the canceled card" How would you define the Lia Thomas situation. When most of the team were told to be quite about expressing there discomfort of having a born male in the changeroom with them?

[@slimvincent10]

Debra is not even close to being a serious person that anyone should listen to. Stunning that a person this close minded could be awarded a doctorate.

[@freyathesage1749]

I left comment about her debunking herself. Thanks for catching up Vaush.

[@wolfstar675]

You're gonna get a lot of replies from conservative chuds hating on you.

[@amazing_custo]

"It hurt itself in it's confusion!"

[@joeyjose727]

“Wrong Sam” lmao can we get a Sam Seder v Sam Harris count

[@Turalcar]

He had me really worried for a minute. I didn't know this is a regular occurrence

[@Monochrome_Rainbow124]

Afab here, I was exposed to pr0n at a very early age and some of the very first things I saw were women being r*ped. And because of the internet and the school I went to, I learned a lot about how women are treated both in America and in other places. I would always hide my behind under a hoodie tied around my waist and once my chest started to grow I was so incredibly scared of being r*ped and scared that people were looking at my chest and at my behind. I was so scared to be female, basically. But also I did hang out with a lot of guys and my brain is definitely way more in the middle than on the female side. This woman is def dumb, but when you asked “is this a thing? Afab people turning non binary over trauma in childhood?” Yea, it absolutely happens :/ I don’t think it should be used as an argument of “THIS is the only reason non binary people exist”, that’s stupid

[@KarlSnarks]

If you've turned non-binary because of trauma, is it still really non-binary or just a coping mechanism for it? I mean if your gender identity is supposed to be an innate thing (a disconnection between the sex of your body and the gender of your brain) it doesn't make sense. Sure you might discover your identity later in life, but it can't be triggered to change because of something. Now, I'm not saying you specifically aren't non-binary, since you say your brain is more in the middle anyway, but this reasoning is the gender-identity equivalent of saying it's possible to pray (or bully, or rape) the gay away. Also, I'm sorry you were exposed to so much misogyny in your youth, must be tough.

[@Monochrome_Rainbow124]

@@KarlSnarks that is the question, isn’t it? I’ve been thinking about that for awhile now. The human brain is a complex and tricky thing, and I honestly feel at this point way better about myself and my body and my life after having transitioned. I’m so much happier and everyday when I look in the mirror I look more like the person I want to be physically. So maybe it was a catalyst, but it was always meant to be? I’m not sure. That’s an interesting thought about the equivalent to “bullying the gay away”, I had never thought about that. Thank you for your condolences about the misogyny, it did suck a lot :/

[@andythedestro12]

Debra Soh is just mad she couldn't transition to male when she was younger and now is trying to cope.

[@rafaelalmada723]

Man, PhD's are really being handed out these days... This gives me hope I'll be able to get one.

[@jbark678]

Sam Seder is living rent free in Vaush's head in this debate.