Try Guys Apology - Therapist Reacts

[@sambee8815]

It's the hypocrisy that begets the anger and disgust. If he wasn't using his marriage to make him popular it wouldn't garner so much disgust

[@miranda13c]

Exactly.

[@ulrikanilsson6395]

Also that is was someone in the company and someone who worked with his wife (on videos she was in, "try moms" etc)

[@ahlimahs]

He had his younger, thinner mistress doing on-set work on a video where his wife talked about her insecurities with her post-pregnancy body & being older than Ned, then taking lingerie photos. It's not because the fandom is young & inexperienced. I'm 52, I found stuff like that super gross & if they hadn't addressed it openly & honestly, people like me would have just never watched again.

[@euodiaclitterhouse4726]

Jesus. That's low.

[@jillianj310]

For me, as someone who watches the try guys, as a 30 something married with two kids cis woman, I was really hurt by the news because my heart broke for his wife and kids. She was made a HUGE part of their Try Guys world with the Try Wives videos and You can sit with us podcast. So through the years the audience has really gotten a look into her life and her personality and she seems like a wonderful person, so it’s just heartbreaking for the family. Then, the person he cheated with was also being brought into more videos and given more of a platform. This really opens the company up to criticism because if he was having a long standing affair with her, was she getting special treatment? Will others in the company see it that way? Did she get promotions or raises during that time? Did she feel pressured to keep the relationship going? Etc. it is just a nightmare from a company standpoint. And to throw it all away for a workplace affair is crazy to me.

[@JLynnEchelon]

To be honest, I think the fact that they have a millennial audience and a decent percentage are married and/or have kids. I don't think that their audience sees them as black and white, but Ned himself sort of created that. I don't think people who have never seen Try Guys truly understand how much Ned never shut up about being married.

[@a.gluecksbringer]

I wanted to say basically the same thing. I think a lot of hurt comes from Ariel's involvement and the connection to HER much more than any connection to Ned. Also Wesley being in for example the Quarantine Without A Recipe episodes... AND a lot of videos with Ariel and Alex... it's just a lot. Also the audacity of just going to a concert and engaging in PDA as a public figure. All of it is just a betrayal in so many more ways than "just" cheating in a partnership. Edit: also getting the names wrong in this is a big Yikes. Ariel is the wife, not the affair partner.

[@JLynnEchelon]

@@a.gluecksbringer omg, yes. The audacity to do it at a concert where they knew they had fans (because he took pictures with people before).

[@SantosAl]

And wasnt Ned also head of HR? Making the power dynamic thing worse.

[@jillianj310]

@@SantosAl I don't know if that was totally the case at this point with their company because they have hired a lot more people over the years, but in the beginning they said they didn't really have official HR and those types of things tended to default to Ned. So if that was still the case (and it may have been), super big yikes.

[@theantichick]

Another aspect others may have mentioned is that the Try Guys’ spouses are part of the business (they are in many videos and have a separate podcast) and friends group. So Ariel (Ned’s wife) and their kids are special to the 3 of them on both a personal and professional level that is going to be messy and painful on many levels. These guys and their families have been close personal friends since their days together at Buzzfeed before they broke off to form the Try Guys company.

[@MyEyebrowsAreMyEnemy]

Yeah, that was why I opened the comments, to see if someone told him, his wife is also an employee of the company... The others partners are in the company... All the peoples relationships just 🤯 in that company

[@sirmel11]

Lmao Ned's family is more important to them than Ned?

[@theantichick]

I can’t speak for them, but what I’ve seen of Ariel, she’s all class… if I were friends with them, I’d take her and he could go butt a stump. He’d only breathe the same air as me through her grace and forgiveness and because of my love and care for her as a friend. I’ve BTDT with some friends of mine who split because of assholery on one party’s part. No one is usually completely blameless when a marriage dies, but when there’s clear cut jerk behavior, I know where I land. It’s Ariel’s call whether she can forgive him, but friends of the couple are going to be in an awkward place if she does. Especially when there’s also a business involved. Not to say their friendship wouldn’t be salvageable, but Ned will have a butt load of work to do to repair and regain trust.

[@sirmel11]

@@theantichick lmao are you good

[@manne4291]

Here are 4 of the reasons I have seen people voice for being so upset about the cheating scandal- besides the obvious sexual misconduct with an employee, opening their company up to being sued- •Ned dated, and married his wife while on their show, had 2 small kids and built a home, wrote a couples cookbook etc and monetized all of it, turning it all into videos for his channel, people seem to feel that he was using his wife and kids for content and faking the whole “I love my wife and kids” thing. •the flagrant way he was cheating. Going to concerts alone, going to lunch together, making out in bars with his employee etc over the course of a year while millions of people recognize him as “Ned, the wife guy” It almost seems like he didn’t care enough to hide it. •his wife is a major part of his channel and has a podcast on it with the other “try wives”.. the fans really grew to love her and hate to see her and their kids hurt so carelessly. •Ned was such an example of the kind of relationship people looked up to he taught a “ethics of healthy relationships” class at universities, all while behaving unethically his own relationship.

[@Mama_Bear524]

This is very well said. Thanks for outlining it simply like that.

[@LauraPalmerD]

He didn't meet her while on the show. The rest is correct.

[@merribethsartors7393]

Ned and Ariel (his wife) also toured around to colleges talking about how to be in a health relationship.

[@sarahm5936]

Ooof that last one is a doozy that I didn't know!

[@meowiestwo]

@@merribethsartors7393 and they released that date night cookbook! more like affair night cookbook >:|

[@apurva616]

Hey Dr. Honda, quick correction: Ariel is actually Ned’s wife, and ALEX is the woman Ned cheated with. Eugene’s angry reaction probably stems from two things: one, he’s a child of a messy divorce. Two, along with being close to Ned, he’s also close friends with Ariel, so in his mind, his friend cheated on his other friend. Also, along with the damage to the company image, Ned’s affair with Alex puts her in a position to be able to sue (for discrimination I believe?) if she was fired for an unrelated issue and also they can be accused of favoritism if she gets promoted or anything. It’s bad for the work culture overall :(

[@sallycinnamon5370]

I’m pretty sure companies can be left open for sexual harassment suits when there is a sexual relationship within a company particularly when there is significant power disparity between the parties. Particularly when the powerful party was an owner.

[@maplechuuni]

@@sallycinnamon5370 A big problem too was that Ned was the head of HR. It was just very messy. Overall, Ned was a liability and his choices did not fit their work culture or what they wanted to promote. It was also very personal matter to everyone involved and I personally think it would have heavily hindered the quality of their content that would be put out in the future to keep him on board. It was just better to cut ties. He was also my least favourite Try Guy so I don't feel a particular loss. And with what you said, if there wasn't infidelity present on both parties sides maybe that could've been a plausible outcome (not sure how it would work with Ned literally being HR). But in the end if she was fired she could sue the company, and if she was promoted it's favouritsm. Ned branded himself as the wife guy so he set expectations onto his persona and then utterly destroyed them with his, mind you very public, inappropriate behaviour. (He also got caught having sex in his Tesla right by a park filled with kids back in the spring so he's been doing some dodgy stuff).

[@ChiZillaaa]

Also with Eugene, he looked up to Ned and Ariel's relationship as a married couple. As a child of divorce I think he's mentioned a few times about some reservations he had regarding marriage so when he learned about the allegations, I'm sure disappointed wasn't an accurate enough emotion for him.

[@andreakubiak4778]

Additionally, as Alex became more visible in videos in the past year or so, other female employees may have grounds to sue arguing that they were unfairly not promoted as they were no having a relationship with a boss. Additionally, Ariel was also an employee of the company (hosted a podcast with the other leads' partners). Problematic company issues abound.

[@JaxLittles]

She was not fired at all. She still works there and could resign if she wishes. But they won't gire her for legal reasons.

[@zaxxya7883]

For me, I was a teenager when I first watched the Try Guys. I saw how adoring Ned was of his wife and I remember thinking "that's how I want to be loved." None of the men in my family cared about their wives like that, with that admiration and empathy. As a young person it was the first example of a "good" man I had. It made me hopeful that someday I could be safe and loved by a true life partner. When the news broke I really was devastated. My first thought was "does this mean my husband will cheat?" Obviously that's not logical, but I just wanted to give a perspective on why some of us were so shaken

[@Lunasent]

This! Exactly! A couple weeks before the news broke, my mother and I had just binged their old and new videos and I said, “I hope I find a man who loved me as much as Ned loves Ariel.” I’ve never taken back words so fast in my life!

[@allytrudie864]

Life will be less scary for you if you realize cheating happens all the time and the odds of never being cheated on in your life is very very slim whether you find out about it or not. The good news is that cheating can make your relationship stronger if both parties go to marriage counselling. My aunt cheating on my uncle was the best thing to happen to them (their words) because once they got therapy their relationship was closer than it had ever been even before marriage. Just because people cheat does not make them a bad person. This is life and poop happens. No one is perfect.

[@zaxxya7883]

@@allytrudie864 wasn't asking for advice lmao. Just was being vulnerable and sharing but thanks for going our of your way to talk down to me

[@amorky8391]

@@allytrudie864 just because a lot of people cheat does not make it acceptable. If someone devalues me so much that they cheat on me they are no longer worthy of me. Be honest with people you’re in a relationship with and don’t accept less than what you deserve. I’m glad your family members were able to resolve their situation in a good way but that’s very rare.

[@writerchick94]

@@allytrudie864 no one is perfect but everyone is free to set cheating as an uncrossable boundary if they so desire.

[@hippityhoppityilikemypriva4467]

You can watch videos of ariel talking about her lack of confidence and how she doesn’t feel beautiful ( at the time, i think her confidence had improved) or struggles with her feelings about her body after being a mom, and she seems so kind and warm and its easy to get attached to her, and then to know that in some videos the person asking ariel about her insecurities and filming her in these vulnerable moments, was having sex with her husband the whole time…

[@hippityhoppityilikemypriva4467]

Also ned imo kind of misrepresents some of what happened, like his friend on snl presents it as “they kissed one time” but like it doesn’t seem like thats what actually happened. Cheating isn’t something that gets me , like it’s personal to the people involved in it and doesn’t automatically constitute abuse, and i dont like how much people are conflating those things. Also, the drama of the situation is intense and ned seems to continually deny the details and pretend its not as bad as it was .

[@jamie6639]

Yikes

[@kdonaldson7308]

For me the guys handled this well, and it was probably a consensual relationship but with Neds position as the Head of HR having the affair it just adds a horrible twist to the affair not to mention the potential legal consequences.

[@me-iy2hf]

Jeez, this and the ‘celeb status’ Alex saw in Ned and the try guys on top of that makes this really messy ethically speaking imo

[@quitabanana3684]

Ohhhhh that’s a layer I didn’t know about

[@CrimsonEclipse]

@@me-iy2hf beside that Alex also was engaged and was in a relationship with her partner for 10 years. Also she gained a pretty high position pretty fast and also had her own show as a food baby under the try guys brand.

[@emilwandel]

@@CrimsonEclipse she was in a relationship with her finance for 10 years but got only engaged recently. Who is engaged for 10 years. If something sounds wrong it probably is wrong.

[@CrimsonEclipse]

@@emilwandel yes, she was in a relationship with him for 10 years. They dated in college.

[@juliamuffinmonster1838]

I think an essential thing you (and to be fair, a lot of people) missed is that Ned made it literally part of the brand - putting out a date night cookbook with his wife, giving paid talks on college campuses with his wife about how to have ethical business/romantic relationships. Even though every other Try Guy has a partner that we're invested in as an audience to some degree, this marriage in particular was sold as a product through merch, gigs, and content. I felt mostly sad for everyone else involved for having to deal with the repercussions of it more than betrayed, but I can see how even someone who's usually pretty differentiated and cynical about the romantic relationships of public figures would feel very betrayed by this, specifically if they've been watching Try Guys content longer than I have. This marriage was sold to us as a stable and comforting commodity, not a normal relationship where sometimes bad things happen or mistakes get made. That meant that for a lot of people rather than responding to issues in that relationship the way they normally would with some ability to differentiate themselves, it felt more like a personal betrayal of their emotional/time/money investment.

[@janelleelizabeth]

I agree with this comment - it’s like Ned out Ariel into a position where she was a public figure because of their marriage and then publicly humiliated her. And by cheating with someone who was in the company he risked everyone’s jobs to boot.

[@juliamuffinmonster1838]

@@janelleelizabeth Right! I get so annoyed when people treat this like it's naive or silly of the audience to feel this way, like they just made up this parasocial imaginary relationship whole cloth. Even though I don't feel betrayed, it's very easy for me to imagine why someone would because this type of parasocial relationship was explicitly encouraged! We were told as an audience "invest in this marriage, it's safer and more wholesome than investing in other marriages, here's all this stuff to make you feel like this is a safe thing to put emotional stock in and here's an objectively lovely woman to make you feel more confident in emotionally investing in this man you otherwise wouldn't" and then when people did we're, what, pointing and laughing at them for being dumb babies and falling for it? Nah. Miss me with that.

[@gabbygabs5107]

Agreed!!!

[@tommiegnosis]

I love the way the other guys handled this situation. I'm a millennial, 34, and was a fan of them for a long time. They actually have a millennial audience, they've been around for a long long time. I think the issue with Ned is the "my wife" persona and his complete downplay of the relationship. It's the lack of accountability and blatant disrespect. This affair was going on for a whole year and his wife works with them! They're called the "try wives." I don't think Ned is anything close to anti-social but he just doesn't seem to care about what he's done. Also, Ariel is his wife not the person he cheated with.

[@BeckBeckGo]

“I’m Ariel’s husband everyone. Love me” Ew

[@djk5v]

Exactly. The whole I lost focus part of his statement still bothers me.

[@allytrudie864]

I think them speaking publicly and not purely dealing with this on the business end of things quietly removing Ned from the company was EXTREMELY unprofessional. The way things should be done in business is all in house with ONE blanket statement (not on video but through a press release) “Ned is no longer with the company and we will NOT be speaking about this publicly or addressing the rumours” and then go on like nothing happened. That’s business. These guys are so immature.

[@WeOnlySayHelloReal]

@@allytrudie864 that's not how business works anymore. maybe when you were young, but not anymore. get with the times, you old bag.

[@masey423]

I'm you but 10 years younger - I was a teenager when the first video was posted on Buzzfeed, mid-20s now... this was such a shocking turn of events and they came out of it so much stronger.

[@stitchlightly5995]

I had a former friend who had a 1 - 2 year affair with a married man. I cut ties with her because of this behavior. I was the friend she called when he canceled on her because "His wife wanted to watch the finale of GOT with him so he's going to facetime me after she goes to bed." Somehow, her other friends decided I was the only person who did anything wrong by telling her I couldn't be supportive of this kind of behavior. I appreciate Try Guys sticking to their morals and handling this so expertly.

[@allytrudie864]

My friends are so judgmental of my mistakes. They stick to me and help me through my learning curve. You are a terrible, judgemental and not a loyal friend.

[@stitchlightly5995]

@@allytrudie864 loyalty was indeed the issue at hand. This was her 3rd relationship in a row behind another woman's back where I was used as an alibi. Think what you want.

[@a1ntcry1noveru]

@@allytrudie864 are you serious right now? lmao this feels like trolling

[@kaylastarr7863]

The SNL sketch was so out of line. Honestly can't believe they even touched this, trying way to hard to stay relevant and they had the absolute worst take on it. Thanks for your thoughts Dr Honda ❤️ just as mature and thoughtful as always.

[@miola2083]

The sketch was so funny!

[@thegamingkitchen8429]

Nah that ish was funny

[@marshmallow4646]

Someone said Ned has a friend in SNL and that's why it was made like that

[@Dauerglotzer123]

Yeah on one of the tripod episodes bed mentioned one of his yale friends was in the writing dept of snl

[@toadinboots]

The SNL sketch tried to downplay sexual misconduct and power dynamics. The sketch joked by saying it was just a kiss when it was a year-long workplace affair. You can’t write a proper satire if the sketch doesn’t have the facts right. The sketch was written by Ned’s friend and criticized the 3 Try Guys taking action rather than Ned, the one at fault.

[@fiig5196]

As far as professional ties, Ned had the Baby Steps podcast with his wife, the You Can Sit With Us podcast with all the try “wives”, all Try Wives content, they had a short DIY stint, they were picked up for a Without A Recipe show on Discovery which has now been moved timeslots, Ned and his wife wrote a Date Night Cookbook and did a book tour and marriage Q and A and universities. Moving forward, any sponsored content with Ned is taken down or re shot, or the contract is just lost. Ned owned at least a fourth of the company so they needed to buy him out. Their optics have suffered so future sponsors might not want to work with him and future projects from the other guys are now in jeopardy including an off Broadway show from Keith and a TV pilot from Zach. But those are speculative. But yeah. Cheating on his wife really …. made a huge mess

[@Dauerglotzer123]

Not just cheating on his wife but doubling down and doing it with an employee. He would have been able to stay I the try guys and rebuild his image if not for that

[@-NiamhWitch-]

Ariel is Ned's wife... Alex is the other woman.

[@DS-jb9rt]

I love this channel, but I must admit I am a little bit put off by the assumption that the Try Guys audience expects them to be perfect and "happy all the time," suggesting that the audience is frustrated because we don't want to believe that people can be complex rather than black or white. I watch the Try Guys because they are imperfect and are not happy all the time. Zach has been extremely forthcoming with his struggles with chronic illness. Eugene came out on the channel and has tackled the homophobia that he experienced growing up in Texas. I think we've seen each of the guys cry at some point on the channel because they've all tackled issues that are difficult for them personally (maybe not Keith? He's actually pretty happy most of the time). The group has been candid with their experiences and it's not their failure to be perfect, but rather Ned's deception, that is so upsetting. Moreover, Ned has monetized his relationship with Ariel, forcing her into the limelight only to initiate an extremely public scandal. I may be in the minority, but I really don't care that he cheated. I mean, of course it's terrible that he did that, but I agree - cheating isn't black or white and there could be a million reasons he did it. But what bothers me is that he chose to cheat in a way that completely discounted Ariel. His affair was with an engaged employee - odds are, they were going to be discovered. He didn't think at all about Ariel or the pain he would cause her, and how her pain would get blown up on the internet as entertainment. It wasn't even just that he cheated - he did it in a way that showed he didn't care if he was caught. In the end, the affair was leaked because he and Alex were making out in a nightclub. Ariel was obviously the furthest thing from his mind. Moreover, he chose to undermine what this channel stands for - which isn't happiness or perfection - but vulnerability and candor. That's what feels like a blow to the audience. And honestly, I don't feel that entertainers owe us that sort of vulnerability, but that's the Try Guys brand. In the end, I feel that Ned got what he deserved but I do genuinely wish him and Ariel the best - whether that means staying together or separating.

[@hannamiller8749]

That's not what Dr. Honda was saying. He was pointing out that people may use their channel as a mechanism for support which is why it can be so devastating to their audience. He personally doesn't use that mechanism for support, but he literally said he validates and hears anyone who has "hubbub" about this situation. He said that before even getting one minute into the apology video.

[@hannamiller8749]

He also discloses that whatever he is saying is speculation, and he admits he doesn't have any prior knowledge of the situation.

[@DS-jb9rt]

@@hannamiller8749 that's fair, but I'm also responding to a direct quote of his from this video which felt to me like a misjudgment of the situation. Nothing that was born of malice, I'm sure, but rather just not knowing what the Try Guys actually mean for their fans. And I completely understand this is all speculation - my goal here is not to attack Dr. Honda or his words but rather to provide some context for how fans might actually feel and why this group of people is so important to those of us who follow them.

[@DS-jb9rt]

Specifically, I'm speaking about the part of the video where he says that the audience for the Try Guys might be younger and may see the performers as black or white rather than as complex individuals, which may be why we have such high standards for them. I agree with you that he goes on to discuss how people may use their channel as a source of support, but the initial statement is what rubbed me the wrong way.

[@kimm6589]

You're literally expecting him to have your same views on something he's never seen before.

[@CuddlyPuddles]

I recommend checking out the episode of the Try Pod ep 181 where they go in depth about what it was like for them emotionally during the whole situation. They also talk about their relationship with their fans and about why they think it blew up the way it did. It feels a bit like Mr. Rogers turned out to be an asshole if that makes sense. I think some of it may be due to a younger audience but it's also a lot of adults like myself who started watching their stuff years and years ago and looked up to them as wholesome positive role models, this sort of anti-toxic masculinity. One of the good ones. So it was an important part of my coming of age I guess. Their whole schtick is that they "try" things hence the name and that would include stuff like try guys try labor pain, or trying old age, or drag, or woman's clothing and it was always approached with good humor but also empathy. They seemed to treat women around them with more respect than is unfortunately typical for a lot men famous on the internet, especially at the time on youtube they first blew up.

[@jillianj310]

Yes! All of this.

[@zoeoneeva6397]

This is what I committed before reading your comment. Very validating

[@Tt-qm2xg]

This is my take on it, too. The way Ned fucked up everything, pissed all over their core values, just wrecked such a good thing for so many people around him. And to his best mates too. That would feel like such a betrayal to them. I feel really angry for the try guys, their employees and Ned's family.

[@allytrudie864]

You will be let down by everyone you love eventually with this thought process. I’m only middle aged but I notice a huge difference between gen x and millennials mind set. Millennials are extremely pious and judgemental. Gen x have always seemed to realize no one is perfect and mistakes happen but that doesn’t mean the person isn’t worthy of our love and understanding. No one is perfect enough to live in the world young people have constructed in their heads. I don’t understand how young people can have friendships that last decades with this mind set. People are not perfect. You will always be let down by those you love at some point but that doesn’t make them a bad person who deserves to be put out on an island with wagging fingers in their face.

[@CuddlyPuddles]

@@allytrudie864 So being sad and dissapointed in someone I looked up to when they cheated on their spouse is being pious and judgemental? Sorry but there are things that absolutely deserve to be judged and hurting and humiliating your entire family with a very public long standing affair with a subordinate is one of them. I don't expect people to be perfect, I have and will continue to forgive people for making mistakes irl. I have even forgiven people in my life who have cheated on their spouses. I have no idea what about my comment made you think I don't understand people are human and make mistakes. It really just feels like you saw a millenial expressing sadness over what someone did and skewed it fit whatever preconcieved millenials are bad and desperate to cancel people notion you had already had queued up in your head the very first moment you heard a summary of what happened and didn't understand why it people thought it was a big deal. There's an snl skit about the situation I think you'll like.

[@Astrosassy]

My issues with the Ned thing are as follows: - it was done SO publicly and carelessly. He took her to a Harry styles concert where many fans were likely to be - he was the HEAD OF HR at the company - Ariel (his wife) is very tied to the company as well and mostly left her design career to invest in the try guys. He brought her into the spotlight and public eye. Now the family is broken, and they may not have an income to support their kids due to his decision.

[@RockyDaTherapist]

I don’t think people are saying Ned is a bad person, they just don’t like his behavior. Ned was also in charge for HR at the company so it’s just cringe worthy altogether.

[@meowiestwo]

i kinda think he's a bad person

[@RockyDaTherapist]

@@meowiestwo 🤣

[@CharlieL]

I'm in my 30's I'm problem with Ned was not just that he cheated on his wife for over a year, the wife used to have a podcast discussing her fear of not being sexy enough for her husband after her children were born. I don't care if you cheat but if you are a public figure and you don't try to protect your children from the public nature of it you don't deserve my pity. He was seen in a very public place making out with his girlfriend. He wasn't hiding it or in anyway ashamed.

[@jesse3609-x2p]

I never cheated on someone but I've realized that when there's something missing in my relationship I dream about my past partners or I develop crushes on random people. In the past I would have made a huge deal about this, but now I understand that it's just my brain trying to escape the situation without confronting my partner

[@hp1113.]

I think because they have featured Ariel (Ned's wife) so much on the channel, a lot of viewers felt a sense of second hand betrayal and felt the need to defend her. I've seen more videos, tweets, etc. regarding how upset they felt for her than anything else. I also think it was a good point that many fans probably viewed Ned as a good representation of a good man, devoted husband, and wonderful father- so for fans who may not have these positive role models in their lives, this was extremely disappointing on a more personal level.

[@sunmiswashingmachine]

clicked immediately when i saw it

[@kelleytorres2899]

Me too

[@melchol2121]

can’t wait for SNL clip reaction!!

[@nataliesargent8405]

Its also worth mentioning that the one on the left (Eugine) was closer to Arial(ned's wife whom he cheated on) so his defensiveness could also come from his friend being hurt.

[@AnxietyRat]

The situation is also potentially touching on his own trauma. As he is a child of a messy divorce. So that betrayal is probably poking at his own past family issues. I can completely understand his anger and hurt, to be honest. In addition to him being very close with the woman who was cheated on.

[@paigecasselman1952]

I'm almost 30 and have been an on and off watcher of the try guys since the buzz feed days. I think that part of why this was a bit shocking for me was because Ned's wife Ariel was SO SWEET. Of course everyone is capable of cheating and I am not shocked Ned did it because he's human like every one else. But it makes me irritated towards him that he would put his family through this. As someone with young kids and a husband I can't imagine how bad this would hurt.

[@daisyo.6666]

I wonder if for Ned, having established this image of being the family guy, it made it much harder to evaluate whether he still wants to stay in his relationship since that would mean that he would have to change his image both at a personal and professional level. This seems to be the case with all the family KZbinrs.

[@marlyd]

I read somewhere that when people get married rather young, before their friends, they can make their identity 'wife guy' and it is a separate identity form other people. But as other catch up and also get married and have kids, the original wife guy loses his identity because it's becoming the mainstream in their social network. Which makes them feel lost and identity-less and makes them do other things, like because the careless cheat guy. But I definitely also see how much pressure he put on himself by making himself the wife guy who monetized his whole seemingly perfect private life. Which he should have thought about before he did it.

[@Redkrovvy]

That is such an insightful perspective. What a great point.

[@samanthajohansen5172]

This definitely has been triggering because my ex husband and kids dad cheated at work with a coworker and everyone knew, so it brought up some of those feelings for sure

[@Mama_Bear524]

I’m so sorry. My dad did that to my mom and it really sucks. I hope you’re healing from that.

[@samanthajohansen5172]

@@Mama_Bear524 I am in therapy and in therapy with my current bf, it’s been over 3 years but it was 8 years of emotional abuse so it’s taking work but I am working on it :)

[@almarojo4751]

I'm so sorry that happened to you. ❤️

[@oliviamuomua2764]

I was SO HURT when the news broke. I’ve watched them since Buzzfeed (I’m 30) and as someone who recently became a single mom, it was like a punch to the gut. I don’t have many married couples to look up to anymore, so I think that’s why it hurt so much. I mean, it’s not like I’M the one in the situation

[@masey423]

This. I’m seeing mostly 20s and 30s people responding to this and not as many teenagers we are adults who know infidelity 😢

[@letyoufindme]

Their OG audience is in their late 20s/early 30s, so I wouldn't say that it's because the audience is young per se. I'm only a few minutes in, so idk if you find out, but the reason why it could've super screwed them over is because Ned was such a large part of the try guys foundation, financially. Their 1st office was in their house. Ned (allegedly) owns a larger stake because he and his wife put up more money. His wife designed the office. For a while, he was also doing HR duties. All of that, on top of how do you compensate him for future video revenue, tv show royalties, etc. it was (a lot). And what happens to the tv show that just started airing? It isn't just a possibly lawsuit from Alex (who was part of the relationship), what about lawsuits of favoritism from the other workers (because only Alex and YB had their own "try guy show"). It's a very complex situation

[@kiki13450]

This isn’t really an apology, they are just explaining what happened

[@Astrovizi1]

Still watching, so I may edit later, but I want to say: they Try Guys audience definitely skews a bit younger, late teens-late 20s seems normal, and has a large population of women, non-binary, and neurodivergent individuals. I also want to say, while “wife guy” or “family guy” seem like normal descriptors, I feel like Dr. Honda and a lot of others unfamiliar with the Try Guys underestimate just *how much* Ned fully embraced and embodied those labels. First edit: Ned also did very little to identify his wife, Ariel, as an individual. She was always “his wife” vs Ariel, despite how inextricably linked to the company both privately and publicly she was. For context, Ariel did the interior decoration for their first studio, I believe completely designed their new studio, has been featured dozens of times in normal Try Guys videos, was part of multiple recurring series on the channel with the other “Try Wives”, was one of the hosts of the Try Wives’ podcast, was cohost with Ned on their parenting podcast, taught “Ethics of Healthy Relationships” seminars with Ned, and was co-author on the cookbook Ned and her put out. Ariel has always been as much of a Try Guy as Ned, and thus, always available for the public to get attached to

[@toadinboots]

I’d be curious to hear your thoughts on the Try Guys podcast episode where Keith and Zach talk about how this has affected their mental and physical health, plus their take on parasocial relationships. If you’re just trying to understand who they are, I recommend their most recent Try Guys on Broadway episode, it’s very well done and positive. The Broadway episode is the one they were filming when the sh*t hit the fan and Ned was caught cheating by fans in NYC (which they discuss on that same podcast episode.)

[@AsheaO]

Dr. Honda digging into the psychology of cheating/infidelity in the second half of the video was so interesting! And helpful. This idea that for some people it feels easier to basically burn their relationship to the ground than to be vulnerable with their committed partner or just tell them what they want… it’s just one of those counterintuitive truths we experience.

[@trampledmoans]

Haven’t even watched it yet, just happy that Dr Honda serves up great content

[@PsychologyInSeattle]

Thanks, Kelly! Let me know what you think. :)

[@kimyoonmisurnamefirst7061]

Has to be said, not calling it problematic, when he's the head of HR says a ton. I know you probably don't know that, but yeah, Ned was the head of HR, so there was no one else to report to, which would get them into a ton of legal and financial trouble if Alex decided to sue. So no, it's not simple as employee dating boss, it's employee dating boss who is head of HR and that really puts the whole business at financial risk.

[@a1ntcry1noveru]

yikesss!

[@cygnelle1232]

I think there's some shaming going on in this video. I'm not saying it was intentional, but either way, it was pretttty shame-y. People in the comments are falling all over themselves to justify their feelings around this incident. They're citing their ages (I'm 36, for what it's worth), they're talking about how they'd gotten to know not only Ned, but also his wife, Ariel. And I really don't like that people felt they had to go to these lengths to explain why they were having real feelings around this. The shaming was walked back at times with statements like, "People can have their own feelings." "And I'm not gonna ridicule that by any means." Eh... ya kinda did though - by implying that people who are activated by this are either young [read: immature?], or isolated and socially bereft, or are "jumping on the bandwagon." Or that these people just see things in black and white terms (e.g. Ned is a horrible human being.) Let's say he's not. Thing is... the betrayal still stands. It'll still hurt like hell for his wife, and was bound to trigger a lot of things for a lot of people. They have a right to feel differently towards him either way. Even though you half talk your way out of the shaming eventually... it's clearly still had an effect. It's upsetting to see so many second-guess themselves because of it. You can't just say the condescending thing and then be like, "but I'm not being condescending." Pleeeease, maybe don't say the quiet part out loud next time. It's not innocuous.

[@Sierrab11]

To add to the “younger audience” comment, I don’t think that we as try guys fans are younger, I think that when we first started watching them we we’re definitely young but now we’re older and it feels like you found out your dad is cheating on your mom. It’s almost like a betrayal of trust.

[@objectivelybiased]

Was just comfort watching your channel, couldn't believe you put this out! After all the bad takes on this situation, Im so excited to hear your view! Edit: For context. I believe the issue a lot of people have is that Ned truly didn't have much of a personality or draw BESIDES his being married. His wife and children were featured heavily in the channel, which means a lot of people felt a connection to them as well as Ned. I would venture to say that the hurt is stemming from the fact that people are not only aggravated by the cheating in and of itself, but by the fact that he capitalized on his seemingly "perfect family" dynamic by "using" his wife and children and essentially leaving them out to dry. I dont necessarily believe that to be true, but I think thats the general consensus.

[@emiiii]

Ouch! Harsh words for Ned, but I totally agree with your analysis 😬.

[@02biddle]

the wife, the mistress and the mistress' fiance all work together and the husband is the head of HR. Doesn't get any messier than that

[@CrankyScientist]

There is a large movement to ban workplace relationships between bosses/subordinates because of how often "consensual" really wasn't. It was only consensual in the boss's head.

[@haven8694]

Keith, the guy you referred to being 'the rock' is spot on! A lot of the fans joke about him being the Dad of the group. it's even worse because the wives/so are also so evolved in their brand as well! The wives have a podcast that is linked with the try guys. It's just a sad situation.

[@potetpoet]

This was very respectful analysis and validation of the emotional impact this has had on fans, but in terms of analysing what the remaining Try Guys are going through, I think you kinda missed a spot. Having an affair with an employee, consensual or not, opens the company up for lawsuits. Valid lawsuits. Not just from Alex, but all the other employees as well. And the 2nd try has some size to it, but it's by no means a massive company who can deal with that sort of thing. That's an additional stress beyond marketing and personal betrayal.

[@nicolehutto4906]

I am a Try Guys Fan! I was so upset when the news broke. It was just crazy to hear Ned "my wife" Fulmer cheat on his wife. I am so happy to hear your take on this

[@sunmiswashingmachine]

me too, i grew up with them and i myself am a child of divorce where the dad cheated. the news was so shocking and unbelievable to me

[@nicolehutto4906]

@@sunmiswashingmachine same for me too

[@christenh6006]

Huge fan as well, I think for the fan base it hits hard because he comes off as extremely shady and it’s just disgusting. I get it cheating happens but he went OUT OF HIS WAY to present himself as an amazing husband who only adores is wife and is obsessed with his family. It’s super messy given he was friends with Alexandria’s fiancé and his wife was friends with Alexandria.

[@nicolehutto4906]

@@christenh6006 Exactly!

[@sarahm5936]

I think it's complicated to say someone can have an affair and not be a bad person. I understand that there's unprocessed trauma at the core of most infidelity, but there's unprocessed trauma at the core of most child abuse. If you put your family through the emotional shit show of an affair, it permanently scars them - like physical violent abuse would, except they're emotional scars. Most people agree, someone who physically assaults their child is a bad person. It's not that they can't become good people, but at this point they're bad people. Someone who cheats on their wife emotionally damages their wife and kids, and isn't a good person until taking steps to become one.

[@juliascott4104]

Thank you Dr. Honda for listening to the requests to react to this video!

[@Ilikefrogs..]

A lot of people followed the Try Guys from Buzzfeed, which was popular in the late 2000s/early 2010s, when a lot of us were teenagers. With that in mind I would guess that most of their fanbase are adults. Probably married with kids the way they are. I feel like a bunch of kids wouldn't take a cheating scandal seriously. I'm 31 and have been watching them since their Buzzfeed days.

[@SoftChroma]

It’s a reminder that even the most (seemingly) wholesome people can do things that break up a family. It brings up fears we all have.

[@sarahm5936]

Exactly

[@jennifersvea1]

fans are losing our minds bc the try guys employ their partners at this company. the partners have their own podcast and have videos about overcoming their own insecurities, etc. ned and ariel wrote a book about date night recipes. they have a youtube show for this book. therefore the employee and ariel were interacting constantly during this year long affair! it’s disgusting that ned and the employee were able to cheat while his wife showed up to work. basically, the try guys’ lives were never separate from their work life. so when ned cheated w an employee, it’s disgusting and ridiculous.

[@Carodactyl]

Dr. Honda, I watch your videos all the time and haven't ever commented but I wanted to this time - you talk about Phil being one of your people who you go to to assess your views against (and I love Phil too!) and I hope you know that you are that person too for a lot of people, or at least for me. Your perspective on this was really refreshing - I had myself even hopped on the bandwagon of NED IS TERRIBLE HOW COULD HE, but then came to this video, and the way you spoke about it really made me identify some biases in my self that impacted how I viewed the situation and that is so important to consider. Nobody is defined by one singular action they take and I think with parasocial relationships we as people can forget this. That's not to say Ned didn't do a bad thing or didn't deserve some criticism, because he did hurt a lot of people with his actions - but we don't need to figuratively burn him at the stake, either. People aren't evil for one mistake. Goodness knows I've made a few in my lifetime, which thankfully, were not broadcast to millions of viewers. Thank you for reminding us all of this and offering an alternate perspective. It's probably also a bit nervewracking to broadcast out there that you aren't hopping on the "bandwagon" as it were, but your refreshing perspectives grounded in logic, compassion, and knowledge are why I adore this channel so much and keep coming back. Thank you for your videos, and thank you for always teaching me something new about myself!

[@HS-lv3is]

So I was very drawn to this story but I had never heard of the try guys before. The reason I was interested is because the situation of someone being married for so long and supposedly doting on their wife and family and betraying their partner behind the scenes is a fear of mine. Trusting someone and giving years of your life for them to just disrespect your relationship and lie to you. With regard to why he cheated I actually have a different theory. He has two kids with Ariel, both toddlers. Ariel takes care of the children and does the housework, they don't hire help for that. So she is worn out and doesn't spend as much one on one time with him. He in turn takes for granted everything she's doing around the house, doesn't help out with the housework, and gets upset with her paying less attention to him (Ariel spoke on him taking her housework for granted and how she didn't think she could even ask him to do the laundry). He feels he doesn't have to woo her anymore because she is already the mother of their children and dependent on him as the main breadwinner. Meanwhile, Alexandria shows up to work for the try guys at some point in the years since second try llc had been founded. Alex has admitted she is a fan of the try guys and didn't even feel she could speak to them at first, starstruck. Moreover, Ned owns most of the company and is essentially a head honcho as executive producer. Alex fawns over Ned and he loves the attention and enjoys feeding his ego. He is excited that she is attracted to him and much younger, and flirts back (other people have noted that ned has been flirtatious with other women while with Ariel, and there is a try guys clip where Keith or Zach had mentioned that ned was promiscuous in college). Alex, who had been dating her fiance will for years, gets engaged to him in early 2021. Because ned feeds on Alex's adoration, he gets competitive and more aggressively flirtatious, bam affair starts. Alex is bored with her partner of 10 yrs, Ned is bored with his wife. They both enjoy the excitement and risk of the affair and engage in public acts like having s*x in neds Tesla in the middle of the day and going to a bar together and making out. There isn't a deeper connection but Alex feels special that the big shot at work is paying attention to her and ned enjoys his ego being stroked. So to sum up, I think your interpretation of ned is too charitable, and in reality he is just a selfish partner. He exhibited this in other ways too like not discussing with Ariel before he left buzzfeed, and just generally expecting her to fill the traditional housewife role without him pitching in around the house even though when they met she earned more than him.

[@meowiestwo]

remember when the try guys were all making Valentines Day gifts for their partners, and Ned made crayons for his son and nothing for Ariel? Ariel was so disappointed. And it's another example of how selfish he is.

[@rachelmortimer6741]

I’m not a huge fan of downplaying infidelity. Just because people cheat and people cheat often doesn’t mean people shouldn’t feel sad and betrayed by someone cheating on someone that they know, even parasocially. I think just feeling “whatever, other people cheat, doesn’t make them a bad person” is an incorrect take and ultimately a sad message. The second thing is that since it was an employee he cheated with, someone the fandom knows, it makes it even more crazy. The fandom knows all parties involved. The third thing is Ned exploiting his relationship and family for monetary gain just to cheat and cheat so openly and carelessly. The fandom feels for Ariel and the Guys.

[@OhsoWoobie]

Can you please do a video on the Amouranth situation? Her phone call with her husband is a direct example of an abusive relationship and would be interesting to hear your deep dive

[@bhurley808]

As people have already mentioned he branded himself as the family man. For years it was joked about Ned always saying "my wife" at some point in every video. They also did a tour where Ned's portion was The Power of Love. So it's become a huge part of his internet persona. However to give more perspective on Ned, another aspect of his internet personality is this hyper competitive alpha frat boy persona as well. There are competition-like videos where he'll be snarky or self-loathe if he's not in a top position. He doesn't appear like this in all of the videos, but it could be editing. Without going too deep into Try Guys videos, The Lie detector videos, give an insight to his past, like when his sister relays a story about how he pretended to find an arrow head that he actually shoplifted. Without actually knowing Ned it seems like he always strived to be the center of attention.

[@Updog89]

He put people’s livelihoods at risk, engaged in an inappropriate relationship with an employee even when he had HR responsibilities, may have engaged in favoritism over other employees, may have used company resources to carry out his affair (paid for hotel rooms, bought her jewelry), betrayed his wife and kids who everyone at the company was close with (Ariel was actually also working on a podcast with them), and put an employee (Kwesi) in the awkward position where he either had to allow people to take pics of it to post online that his kids might have to grow up to see or help Ned cover up his public infidelity. And this is just the stuff that is public knowledge. I don’t blame them at all for being disappointed and taking swift action to protect their company from Ned.

[@Twirlingbarbie]

Doesn't matter if it's exploitative, imagine the work situation when they would break up. He would not be the person losing his job, she would. That's what power dynamic is. Also, cheating is wrong when you have a young child. His wife just gave birth

[@glencoco4444]

Especially cause he was responsible for HR…

[@Benji-jj2bg]

How do you know she would lose her job if they broke up? It just came to light and he was the one who lost his job.. so your whole point is just Bs now..

[@llamachai]

I wouldn't say the majority of Try Guys fans are younger. Most of us who grew with them are around the same age, millennials in their late 20's to 30's. Would love to know Dr. Kirk Honda's perspective on that since we saw them more as our brothers/best friends.

[@Magicme79]

I don’t know what’s going on with Ned/Ariel and I won’t pass judgement or weigh in there. What has been really gross about this whole thing is how “the boys club” all chuckled about how it was just a bit of making out, and how pathetic that such a tiny thing would have consequences for Ned’s career - completely disregarding all the legal crap that could follow.

[@LaurenAnne6]

Thank you SO much for responding to this. I am a fan of theirs. Probably 15 to 20 years older than their typical fan (Wikipedia says their audience is mostly late teens to early 20's). They have become the poster children for positive masculinity. From the comments I've seen from younger fans, this completely shattered their hope in men. For me, it was a reminder that I don't actually know the creators I watch on KZbin. It can feel like I do because they respond to my comments or they show me vulnerable parts of themselves (ie. Eugene's coming out video masterpiece), but all I know of them is carefully crafted and edited videos.

[@brainfluidZ]

I think the parasocial relationship you’re assuming this reaction is based off of is slightly correct but not really. He made it point to mention his wife in every video. It was his character/persona on camera that was purposeful. It was not an imagined parasocial thought. We all have eyes & ears right? So the people who watched the Try Guys understand how much Ned identified as “the married guy” “the father” & he put himself in that place on camera. He made a stupid decision knowing full well what the repercussions would be if it came out. This betrayal is public & all of their business is now public. His single act of selfishness ruined all of these peoples lives. Edit: It doesn’t matter if the relationship was consensual. They both signed a contract that states you can’t have personal relationships with ANY coworker. It’s illegal & can get their business into a lot of legal trouble. Not only did he put his wife & kids in this horrible place but he risked his own bestfriends careers. Selfish.

[@Benji-jj2bg]

And like he said, people can still love their partner and cheat. You can still love someone even though the relationship is not going well and is maybe even toxic. That doesn't make you a bad person.

[@brainfluidZ]

@@Benji-jj2bg i agree. The world isn’t that black & white. Cheating doesn’t have to mean you lack love for your partner. My anger comes from him embarrassing his wife online. This betrayal is public & all of their business is now public. I blame him for making a stupid decision knowing the repercussions ahead. I also don’t agree with people throwing guilt by association at the rest of the guys for Neds mistake based on their parasocial relationship with these people they don’t really know.

[@brainfluidZ]

@@Benji-jj2bg And a toxic relation doesn’t requite cheating. There’s literally no excuse for betrayal.

[@beckyboradley]

I'm 29 and have followed the try guys for years. This shocked me not only because of Ned's 'shtick' as the family guy but also that the cheating was so egregious. They were kissing at a concert in public and known figures. And I've seen videos from months ago of them showing PDA in public. I find it so jarring that they would do it so publicly and I would assume this means that it has been going on for a while that they were so comfortable.

[@shivvypoppy]

As a 38 year old mom who's been out of the work force for 5 years, I LOVE /r/OutOfTheLoop. It makes me feel like I'm still a person when I can converse with others. 🤣

[@Tcheera]

I mean although I think the firing was due to it putting the company at risk -- when someone has a public persona and brand it is valid as a conversation in terms of a discussion of how companies will deal with it and it doesn't have to be as simple as "are they a good person or are they a bad person?" -- if someone creates a "brand" of themselves and then is hypocritical and violates that brand, consumers of that brand will likely not want it -- and that's just realistically how it works. Ned being the wife guy -- you can find "my wife" joke videos from before this happened -- it was a longstanding joke that it was his ONLY brand and personality. I am trying to find a comparison but ... I mean... I think that if it came out and was confirmed that you Dr. Honda either were super jealous and controlling of your wife and had engaged in a coercive controlling relationship for decades... or conversely maybe that you had a history of exploiting and having affairs with borderline patients that you met online but refused to treat so that you could have affairs with them while never actually being their therapist. Like something that would technically not be illegal but that would be contrary to the image that you put forward. It would technically be about your private life -- but it would be contrary to your online brand. (And I think a lot of us would have difficulty believing you would do that). And I don't think it's immature or black and white thinking if people saw that and thought "ugh... I don't like this and I don't want to watch this" -- I think that because of the brand he put forward, that is more why people felt that way about Ned's behavior. It's not necessarily about black and white thinking that everyone who makes a life mistake or who engages in infidelity is "bad" and "evil"... Certain behaviors just seem hypocritical and leave a bad taste in people's mouths when the person has profited off of a brand. On a scale of 1 to the worst thing I've ever seen -- meh -- Ned really isn't the worst I've ever seen. But one of the issues they've probably had is that he's exploited not just his wife but others and has profited the most of all of them from that exploitation while being the one that no one ever really liked all that much BUT FOR his wife being kind. That is a rough brand to fix.

[@TR-iy1lv]

For clarification, Ariel is Ned’s wife! Alex is the employee.

[@massis9069]

Ariel & Ned opened a second mortgage & shared their home with the company while raising babies/toddlers

[@hexisea]

The Try Guys do not, broadly speaking, cater to an audience of children. They've mentioned before that their metrics show their audience as being mostly young adult women.

[@MichelleseaChelle]

The KZbin compilations of Ned saying, “my wife” over and over and over sits a little different now. Lol.

[@sambee8815]

This kind of thing used to anger me and now I'm just sad people treat each other this way. His poor wife

[@LoraK31]

Another really psychologically interesting facet to this whole thing is the fact that Ned cheated so publicly. Fans spotted them at restaurants, a Harry Styles concert, and at a club together. Was it self-sabotage or did he just think he was untouchable? We probably won't know unless he talks about it openly.

[@jasminerey9239]

It’s the lack of research prior to filming for me…

[@sidoniadaniella]

I appreciate your explanation of how affairs start. This is why therapy is so important ongoing not after things have gone south!

[@writerchick94]

Everyone else has clarified the situation a lot in the comment section but I just wanted to add, I think their main audience bracket is actually millennials because they followed them from their Buzzfeed days. Just saying this to point out their audience isn't largely young and immature or just generally young and viewing the situation as black and white. I think their audience is viewing this as very complex and nuanced and that's actually why their audience recognizes that it's so problematic.

[@silviayantuche5791]

I couldn’t relate to this drama until I translated to a more personal experience. I think it was equivalent for their audience as it would be for us to find out on Reddit that Dr Kirk is having an affair. That would be shocking, destroying and so on 😅

[@Gracewodag]

Hi! Just clarifying: the wife of Ned is named Ariel. The other woman (employee) is named Alex.

[@ladyeowyn42]

Kirk, I would be very upset if you cheated on Stacy or vice versa. I don’t feel lonely or unsupported, I just hate seeing people suffer.

[@nicolehutto4906]

Ariel is Ned's wife...Alexandria is the person he had the affair with

[@LP-zc4gy]

Honestly, I wouldn’t say I hate Ned or anything, but I do feel awful for his wife, his kids, and his fellow Try Guys. For the Try Guys, I am angry that Ned so haphazardly ruined their image as a company. Ned’s decision to cheat so openly, with an employee who was also a public figure, has negatively impacted the other Try Guys who DIDN’T make that choice. They had brand deals and personal projects that are now on the line because this is situation has cost time, money, and credibility. Not to mention, they’re also probably dealing with allegations that Alex (the employee who was in the affair) was benefiting from special treatment. That’s also affecting their credibility with their current employees (or potential future employees)! If Ned had cheated silently, with someone who wasn’t in the public eye, it would still be devastating emotionally, but it wouldn’t have affected the company as badly.

[@keegankupcakes827]

I never watched their channel, and I do agree that there’s a lot of young people that watch them, but I also think people don’t see cheating the way you do. They see it meaning you don’t really love your partner and maybe never did vs loving your partner and still having traumas that cause you to make harmful decisions.

[@Benji-jj2bg]

Sadly many people nowadays can't see much out of their own perspectives. We like to shame and attack people online like they are the horrible person while in reality, they are just a human going through trauma like a human does. And it kinda makes me disgusted with humanity when I watch people attack someone else while pretending they are the good guys and allowed to attack this other person because he's bad and they are good. It's hard to explain it but yeah, irritates the hell out of me.

[@Benji-jj2bg]

It's like, maybe just maybe, try to see it from their perspective and then judge. Don't just assume he's a horrible person because he didn't something that you don't like or whatever.

[@keegankupcakes827]

@@Benji-jj2bg absolutely, people see empathy as excusing their hurtful behavior, but it’s really just conceptualizing reality in a healthy way. Especially when in these situations if his wife chooses to stay and work on the marriage people are going to judge her unfairly for it. It’s sad.

[@CrimsonEclipse]

My opinion about Ned and this scandal. His marriage has become a chore because he built a brand around it. There are several hints before the affair scandal happened about how he was having trouble in his marriage. One of it was he said it's hard to have a romantic life especially with two kids. Two: his valentine gift to his wife was a gift to his son. Three: he admitted he was putting on a front about his marriage. I do believe he originally started out truly honest about how much he loved Ariel but after 8 years the honeymoon phase is gone but he still has to pretend he is still at the honeymoon phase to the public. About him being a good guy or a bad guy. Well everyone is grey. But Eugene who was known to be the most bluntest and judgemental Try guys who was asked to say one nice thing about Ned. He said Ned is a good guy and tries to bring out the good in others. That may had been true in the past.

[@LP-zc4gy]

Not to mention, when it comes to exploitation, neither person has to explicitly state the presence of the power dynamic for it to still be taking place because the person with more power someone is still benefiting from the situation, whether it is acknowledged or not. In this example of the affair, Ned had power over Alex’s job both as her boss and the head of HR. Even if Alex was not considering his position and even if Ned never held it over her, the point is at anytime he could have used it over her. The power he has over her exists whether either one was aware or not. Alex would still have to rely on his ignorance of the situation or his good graces to not lose her job. Now, people will argue that Alex had power because she could use her position as a significant other to earn special privileges at her job (promotions, time off, etc.). Even in that case, Ned still is the one who has to give her those privileges. He still is holding the cards in that situation. I saw another comment saying that Ned lost his job which proves the argument moot. I say, no, because once his affair became public, third parties became involved with equal power to Ned (The Try Guys) or ones with even greater power (public opinion which the any entertainment group needs to make their money). Ned didn’t lose his job because of Alex let him go, he lost his job because his fellow employers, the Try Guys, let him go (at the pressure of the public).

[@beckfry5374]

I also think it’s important to note since their company is run in California if a manager is the one sexually harassing an employee the company can assume the risk for as it can legally be considered the company has presumptive knowledge of it. It’s been pointed out Ariel is Ned’s wife, Alex is the employee. Maybe try to be a bit careful about names in a situation like this.

[@ChrissaTodd]

i am 29 and yes i am sure they have younger fans that's why what ned did was extra bad, first he convinced everyone he was the my wife guy and he had nothing else going for him, then he cheated in public. cheating is a betrayal idc if you see cheating as a normal thing, i don't can we not normalize cheating by claiming it's not that bad cause it happens alot, alot of toxic stuff happens alot that doesn't mean it should :P

[@Pktommy1]

I think also the video is missing the context that they are very good friends with his wife who also works at the company. Eugene is especially close with her. So I tho k the situation is betraying a lot of trust beyond “he cheated on his wife.” I used to watch them before but I haven’t watched them in a few years. It is shocking tbh.

[@Benji-jj2bg]

He talked about that though..

[@jungersrules]

I'm 50, not a fan of The Try Guys. I like them fine, but as a woman I'm just not that interested. The thing is ... nobody wants to watch the "wife guy" any further. He exposed his wife and family to the audience, too. Not just in clips, but whole videos. So, everyone knows who they are. If it wasn't Alex he cheated with, if we didn't know much about Ariel, we probably couldn't piece enough together to judge him.

[@Sunset553]

The discussion about infidelity is enlightening. In almost all my relationships, my partner cheated. I have been staying out of relationships because of my high failure rate. I’m older and figure I’m done. I had two nice relationships and we didn’t have an issue of cheating (as far as I know) Maybe that’s an abundance of love for my life

[@Celestein]

People are upset because Fulmer's *entire* brand was built around being a 'great husband'. He deliberately manufactured this brand for himself in order to profit from it. Him and his wife even gave lectures on healthy marriage life. This is not just any garden-variety cheating in private life: This is more comparable to a fire and brimstone televangelist secretly having orgies and gambling parties. People don't want to feel that their core values were used as a ploy for hollow popularity and profit. When someone builds their following on a specific mission and image, especially with an ethical/moral dimension, is it so unexpected for that audience to feel defrauded and wronged when that message- which is the root of what they endorse and support- is revealed to be profoundly false?

[@anettesworld8354]

I agree with not seeing people as black and white, but cheating is wrong no matter what people say. I've heard lots of people trying to justify it, but I honestly don't know how anyone can think that it is even remotely okay. Cheating is to be completely selfish, because you don't want to lose your partner, but at the same time you want to be and are intimate with another person. That is not taking into consideration the feelings of your partner at all, you're simply trying to adhere to your own needs and desires. How someone can do that to a longtime partner is beyond me.

[@veronicasummer8879]

Dr. Kirk is the hero we don't deserve 😭🤣 or i guess we really really do deserve?

[@nicoleheyl7852]

Yay! You and the try guys are my favorite channels. This is just a sad situation for everyone involved. I’ve watched them for almost 10 years. Their careers were just taking a huge upswing with a new tv show on food network then the story broke two days later 😕 All we can do is support the remaining try guys and respect the family’s privacy. If you want a weird follow up SNL did a skit making fun of this video you’re reacting too. They make fun of the guys taking this situation as serious as they did and made it look like Ned just kissed once. Not a full year affair just a kiss.. Side note: Ned has told the fans on their podcast his college friend works in the writing room at SNL and guess who helped write the skit…..

[@Dee97]

Theres a clip of the woman in the elicit relationship talking about meeting the try guys...whom she says she was a huge fan of and was nervous to meet them when she was first hired at Buzzfeed. Also checking out their audience statistics is easy, and it doesnt skew young...do some research dude.

[@elenaoakes8494]

I think part of the shock factor is also that they didn't even seem to be trying to hide it. They weren't being covert and discreet they were brazenly in public. I think it feels even more disrespectful to the other half's involved and out of character from what we know of him. Really not sure what they expected to happen...

[@samanthajohansen5172]

Ariel=the wife Alex=the other engaged woman

[@ElizahMendoza]

nah. most of their fans are millennial and gen z. kids nowadays don't know them cuz they didn't watch buzzfeed when they were younger. we did

[@MissMarth]

Also on a completely unrelated note, if you read this, I can't recommend Eugene's "I'm Gay" video on youtube- it came out 3 years ago but is still an amazing piece of art and such an awesome thing that he did with his platform.

[@mashamitchell9574]

Framing an extramarital affair as a "consensual relationship" is the weirdest thing I've ever heard.

[@ehanoo.ehanii]

I think many of us are just empathic to the situation. I am a married woman with two kids and feel if I was in her place I would be heartbroken. It shouldn't be something normal to happen. Especially so publicly even if there was problems in the marriage I in my own know to be honest and speak like adults not turn and betray my partner in such a way.

[@MsBuchnerd]

I gotta say though: I first watched a video about this, where the try guys talked about what Ned "has done" and didn't say, what that thing actually was. When I found out, he had cheated on his wife, I was kinda... Mh, okay? It honestly sounded like he had killed somebody or sexually assaulted somebody etc. Yes, it is a douche thing to do, but we don't know anything about their relashionship. Of course this gets so much worse because of how Ned was always pushing this perfect husband image, plus it was at the workplace. Still they made it seem like murder.

[@winner78222]

It's the internet. It's an emotional place. People just hate traitors, hypocrites, homewreckers, manipulative people, cheaters and Ned is all those things. He hurt his friends, his wife, his kids, his employees, and his audience. So people are going to be angry.

[@SerafinaP]

True! Its also like most people seem to think this is in some way analogous to sexual assault 🙄 i dont understand anything anymore lol.

[@meowiestwo]

ReLaShIoNsHiP

[@emlangan]

@@SerafinaP The reason people think this is analogous to sexual assault is because of the power dynamic involved. Ned was Alex's employer - co-owner of the company that employed her, and the member of the ownership team responsible for HR. Ned described the affair as "consensual" and Alex hasn't disputed that, but the concern is, even if the affair started with full consent from both parties, whether she would have felt able to withdraw from the relationship, or whether there would be an implicit (or even explicit) threat to her job if she had tried to break it off. To whom could she have turned at the company to protect her from a retaliatory threat to her job? To HR, meaning to Ned himself? Or to one of his best friends and business partners? If consent is freely given but cannot then be freely revoked, how consensual is it, really? No one I've seen is alleging that Ned actually sexually assaulted her. But the situation was ripe for abuse, even if that abuse didn't take place, and that's what people are reacting to.

[@SerafinaP]

@@emlangan thanks i know. I just think it's bs.

[@annikeellis8087]

I'm mid-30s and have been watching the Try Guys since the beginning almost 10 years ago. It was definitely a shock and disappointing to hear about Ned. One instance of infidelity is different from a year long affair with an employee who you're constantly around and travel with. Adding to that the whole "my wife" bit and all the people dragged into and affected by their decision. It just sucks. I didn't put Ned on a pedestal by any means but thought he was smarter than this

[@jetblack6381]

He fucked up. He fucked up his own life and his wife’s life and the woman he had an affair with, and he hurt his friends and colleagues. In my opinion its perfectly reasonable to be shocked and disappointed as a viewer, but fucking up is something we all do at some point (and if you never do that’s wonderful, lucky you) and it does make me sad that the response is so biblical - right and wrong, black and white, in and out. Infidelity is wrong, but its also very very common - which doesn’t make it ok, but it’s ubiquity I think should push us to be more understanding and nuanced in our reaction. Thank you Dr Honda for this calm and sensitive take!

[@rmh8940]

Hey Kirk- you don't recognize their channel because they used to post under buzzfeed channels. They later spun off and by the grace of Buzzfeed, able to keep the trademarked name but had to start their new channel

[@essendossev362]

I don't think the majority of viewers even would consider Ned to be a psychopath, just that his actions hurt a lot of people, his wife and family, and his coworkers, his friends. And honestly, I don't doubt that he still desires his wife, that he would consider himself to still love her, but that level of dishonestly (cheating for years) to me is not a sign of loving someone. I see that you try to add nuance to your analysis, not to jump on the bandwagon of hating on him, but I think you should make more of an effort to listen and learn first before jumping to conclusions and speaking. I also find it frustrating that you seem to frequently lack an understanding of power dynamics, not only in this situation with an employer dating an employee (even if she did consent to it, ultimately the dynamics are still there and will have an influence) but also in how you defend older men dating much younger women, or in that family system where all the kids ended up estranged from their mom because they found her to be controlling and abusive.

[@cygnelle1232]

Exactly! Nailed it.