GHORITCH Faces The DOUBLE LION | Skaven vs Cathay - Total War Warhammer 3

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[@sirlocodile5858]

16:19 the biggest backstab of the century with that one cannoneer seemingly aiming directly at Zhao Ming's behind

[@Bertoleyus]

Yeah, he lost 300hp at that moment.

[@Shadow-bk1im]

yep cannon lost the battle for them singlehandedly. Would have won that otherwise.

[@brannou759]

16:15 zhao ming taking a shot in the back by his own canon is very skaven like

[@Orangejulius8]

I wondered if I was the only one who saw that. Ha!

[@tyeberiusmcintyre1879]

of all the places that cannon could have aimed... XD

[@milesg7877]

Im suprised Turin missed that moment. Pretty funny😂

[@Drocksas]

You *know* whomever was operating that cannon got eviscerated after the fight by zhao, assuming he survived in the first place

[@andreacasazza3350]

A game changing mistake by the artillery crew

[@florians9949]

Ghoritch being launched into the stratosphere by that canon shot was the funiest shit ever.😂

[@Lunaras]

poor jade lions. every time they use their breath attack you gave credit to the dragon instead of them

[@infinitebeastgames1010]

I'm glad I wasn't the only one cringing a bit at that

[@adamperdue3178]

Focusing Zhao Ming and chewing through him until he breaks (and still winning the game after) is its own unique flex in the current patch.

[@calimerohnir3311]

Zhao Ming got nailed by his own cannonball at 16:15 lol

[@MarkD5678]

That exact moment might have been what cost Cathay by getting Zhao to rout for a few seconds

[@calimerohnir3311]

@@MarkD5678 I'm dead ^^

[@golum247]

@@MarkD5678 It's ok he has broken item, if it was working properly rats would have killed him.

[@sorrydough]

@@golum247 what about how he spent 2k on two dumb lions that got 800 value between them

[@golum247]

@@sorrydough How does lions change the fact that if Zhao healing wasn't broken he would have be killed by rats. The only thing that points to is the fact that CA are very slow to fix their game, if they don't abandon it. Which makes buying future Total War games difficult for me. The last one they actually fixed was Rome 2 every other has gotten the boot. TWWH being somewhat of exception but that probably has to do with it being cash cow or GW agreement. They don't fix things efficiently. Most of time patches are with content drop that break more things. Sorry went on a little tangent there.

[@N0ahface]

Wonder if Cathay would have won if Zhao hadn't been routed by the cannonball

[@dome2919]

I saw that friendly fire canonball. That one engineer probably threw the battle.

[@Shimmiy]

maybe but his morale was really bad from the ranged attacks all the night runners needed was a few shanks and he would have routed anyway probably considering how much the skaven had on the point anyway

[@Tobiasm1]

I saw that and was like no way dude, toon him from 800 to 500 ish.

[@UnreasonableOpinions]

Ghoritch repeatedly getting blasted like ten metres by every cannonball is funny as hell.

[@deediddydoo]

the lions are classed as monsters/beasts in the army-selecter while sentinels are under constructs so it seems intentional which makes it even stranger

[@Danne1040]

Cathay dragons have separate healing caps for human and dragon form but it it’s really only relevant for Miao in campaign where she can easily healing cap her self twice

[@teball31]

Well, in Campaign it's relevant for all of them becaus of how easily you can get them regen items, but in MP it's only relevant for Miao who has healing spells. Even then though, a lot of the time she was taken her magic was used for dragon's talons to delete elite infantry before it was nerfed.

[@zombiegoku1243]

I really think the lions should be a squad of some sort. Like 3 models instead of one and spilt the stats up a bit due to the more models.

[@ivanivanovich1020]

Lions are rebalanced to a squad of 4 in SFO and it actually works well and they are a fun and worthwhile unit.

[@KhaneLives-ec1hk]

A pair would be interesting, seeing as these lions are usually guarding entrances to temples and whatnot in pairs flanking the portal, plus theres no other TWWH unit that comes as a pair, except maybe Sisters of Twilight

[@homelesspirate8404]

The lions do pretty good in campaign, but there are a ton of buffs for them from lords/research and what not. (they actually make a viable early game doomstack) so i imagine if they are adjusted for MP it would be mostly a price decrease. They might just not be a good MP unit on the roster

[@SusaVile]

Yup. I was surprised of their stats when doing my spreadsheet with all unifs before/after stat upgrades. They become quite powerful

[@sleepylion9788]

they're okay in MP, but a bit too niche imo, they can use some buffs

[@spellbound1875]

Eh, they could easily gain some WS without much issue. Compared to monsters in their price range and 380 is a bit low, at least when looking at units which aren't crap (Tomb Scorpion says hi). I doubt a WS buff would meaningfully impact campaign balance.

[@TehGnomeh]

16:15 Some Rebellious Canoneer: "DOWN WITH THE DRAGONS"

[@bigmcjones230]

CA's apathy towards the multiplayer scene has killed it for many like me sadly. Crazy to see the healing item being broken healing double, still going like it is.

[@SunlessSage]

More like apathy in general. Serious bugs nowadays seem to only get fixed during big patches. Just look for how long Nakai couldn't recruit Kroxigors in campaign. The Kroxigor LL couldn't get more Kroxigors than the ones in the starting army...

[@cl1cka]

@@SunlessSage That's the result of how big the game has become - too many factions, too many interactions. You fix something and it breaks 10 others.... Hence why a specific bug is left for longer in the game. Debugging is 10 times harder than actually making new code. And when you have 3 games worth of faction/heroes/units interacting - well you gonna get bugs.

[@robertcerniglia2616]

​@@SunlessSage not only in Warhammer 3 even in Rome 2, they recently removed the multiplayer chat which completely killed the scene. Because of new UK law that forced moderation but it was cheaper to just shut it down

[@ListenAndDie]

Problem is not the presence of bugs, but the complete apathy towards fixing them.@@cl1cka

[@survivor686]

CA has always suffered from 'militant incompetence' - it has plagued them since Shogun 2 (matchlock bug that let them shoot through friendly units w/o friendly fire, to overpowered P2W shotgun infantry and cav)

[@julianspaghi4592]

At 16:17 General Zhao 2 healthbars Ming get's punted by his own cannons point blank, and i think that's beautiful.

[@alexnikolov1248]

All Cathay Legendary Lords have 2 seperate healing caps for Dragon and human form so they can heal 150% of their hp 75% each form

[@gray007nl]

But the only sources of healing they have are Zhao Ming's item which only triggers once per game, Miao Ying's spells and Felix.

[@FYATroll]

There was a super treacherous cannon shot that hit a low HP zhao ming square in the back that honestly led to his breaking.

[@dragonnight2796]

I don't think Zhao Ming's missing HP cap in human form was a bug, it rather seems to be that he has two independent healing caps, which will inevitably lead to some shenanigans in 2v2 etc. Other than that, it's incredibly disheartening to see all of that lord snipe instantly go away the moment he got into dragon from that first time.

[@johnarnold8485]

I thought that was known from how he gets regen in campaign? All Dragons have two hp bars and two healing caps unless that got changed since I last played Cathay.

[@ListenAndDie]

@@johnarnold8485 All transforming characters have 2 healing caps (so all 3 cathay lords and malus)

[@xPureAndTheTaintedx]

Turin, the green breath attack is from the jade lions.

[@mikecondo]

16:16 Dragon taken out by friendly cannon shot LMAO

[@benoliver3266]

Turin saving my evening once again…

[@ryanquinlan9718]

Cats chasing rats ...classic

[@Zoey--]

16:16 the snipe in the back of the Iron Dragon's head by his own cannons :D

[@robinbanks1993]

i know turin questioned some elements but @10:10 u can see why lions were just brought, so cathay could double alchemist for potency on Zmings double casting. wall and breath cleans the rat hordes.

[@NikukaiFightOn]

"350 value on this thousand gold monster! That's what i'm talking about baby"

[@xyro3633]

This was one of the greatest, meme-ist matches I've ever seen. Well done, rats!

[@tyeberiusmcintyre1879]

the cannon freindly fire in the 4th quarter on zhiao XD

[@Thoofdecay]

WELL PLAYED SKAVEN :D

[@spellbound1875]

Gotta love Cathay being unable to win because they can't afford to bring enough cap weight. Granted both these builds weren't optimized but both the 350 infantry and 400 cavalry having only 2 cap weight makes it extremely hard to take and hold points without an absurd unit advantage.

[@DibbzTheLoner]

Zhao Ming's healing item not being banned despite the bug is very silly. I'd be so annoyed having to face something blatantly unfair like that.

[@lenkalenech3102]

The cannons dealts a LOT of friendly fire, not only on Zhiao Ming the end, but all throughout the battle

[@Glogomog]

Heroic noble showing from the Skaven, yes yes! If only the loyal warlord could have saved Ikit, at least he was there to take on the burden of leadership.

[@memedaddy6932]

I hope the Empire Captain gets a "Second in Command" skill similar to "Power Grab" in the next dlc patch. Combined with a demigryph mount I think it would make them way more interesting to bring.

[@Lethoras]

The Cathay dragons have 2 separate healing caps for human and dragon form.

[@moritzseidl7823]

Zhao actually has an indipendent healing cap in either form so he basicly sits at 150% healing cap if im not mistaken. All the cathay legendary lords in fact but you will need to find a way to heal them in both forms. Greetings from germany

[@Khorothis]

Ah yes, the dreaded "Zhao-Ming skirmish"

[@snowdawn]

Wow what a twist. Gg to both players and great cast man

[@noname-wo9yy]

The healing bug is so easy to put a sticking plaster on, you just half the healing value.

[@memedaddy6932]

Cathay dragon lords have two healing caps, one in human form, and one in dragon form. This doesn't matter because their only healing options are linked towards being in one of the forms. This would definitely cause issues if they ever get additional forms of healing though.

[@Angeloflight444]

First time in my life have I rooted so hard for Skaven!! 🐀 Also, I guess that lord should be banned from any self respecting tournament if it’s a bugged ability, right?

[@iain-duncan]

The reason his healing cap vanished is because transforming units have different healing caps for both modes, so his human mode healing cap is separate from dragon mode

[@drew3n]

fun fact: the dragon lords have 2 healing caps, one for each form. I have a blast grabbing the regen sword in campaign and laughing all the way to the bank.

[@thomaskunz3089]

Really awesome game ot watch, dude lost for veeery little, but fun to see skaven in action, since u dont see it every day, also ghoritch is very cool.

[@Rellik428]

If people are gonna bring Zhao Ming then powergrab is fine. Is there a way to make him cost like 500g more in tournaments until CA fix his bug?

[@adamblack1]

Moar Skaven yes yes!

[@leighwallis5782]

Super clutch there......loved it...

[@davidbanterford3216]

The recent patch was just a power creep bonanza

[@paulkersey3042]

It is mind boggling to me that Skaven players of all things are looking at some nasty cheese and deciding "No, I shan't." While you've got Cathay and Kislev being all gross with Crowmen and Ambusher RoRs, and Broken lords. So hilariously backwards.

[@paulroyal2177]

"Absolute shit-house units." I love Turin's color-play, and his analysis of the strategies... The Jade Lions weren't so bad. They hid in the trees at the start, and survived to the end. Their movement speed is phenomenal. They were like meteors. But, yes, the fact that they can be "terror-routed" is "face-palming". GG.

[@ForbiddenFollyFollower]

One of the tavern challenges should be killing Zhao ming.

[@NikukaiFightOn]

cathay player was either very new or just wanted to send a message lol

[@Turnoutburndown]

What a match!!

[@vitaliyred622]

Screw the broken hero, WHY can Cathay out-spamm the swarm faction such as Skaven? Each time you fight Cathay they have 2-3 times the amount of infantry you have. Is that China reference?

[@lolsovs]

Obviously bugged abilities should be fixed - but how Zhao Ming is egregiously OP whereas some other lords/SEMs that score just as much or better damage value, are not?

[@FinleyZero]

Screw Cathay players, I instinctively root against them. Zhao Ming being this broken is just unfun.

[@Wvk5zc]

zhao healing need nerf, but screw you

[@insearchofprometheus]

yes-yes

[@akantor0811]

Cathays player must be annoyed he uses flame wall on a single clanrat and missed that would have insta wipes the entire point at the end

[@Collinpawns]

Xiao ming with the magic intensity and healing item can literally solo the skaven army, if Cathay wasn't kinda shit at pushing would've been an easy victory with that value discrepancy

[@mcsqueeb187]

Man wall of wind and fire is so bad in multiplayer, even I could dodge out of the way of it.

[@fendelphi]

If it was saved until the end, it might have been good for killing/pushing off the skaven. But it was used in a very suboptimal situation instead.

[@HistoryEpos]

WP Skaven

[@arc4830]

It feels like jet lions are better as a mobile source of yin harmony, but I still think both lions are pretty rubbish.

[@paulkersey3042]

I can't help but think Sleepylion just kind of gave the game away, He resummoned both Lions, this is meme play of the highest order.

[@themightiestpen]

Every time I see zhao ming I just get tilted. Honestly not interested in seeing games with him until his item is fixed or disabled for competitive play. Its just like… another Cathay game, let’s watch the over powered glitch be overpowered and glitchy.

[@patrickleonard4187]

The rare, wall of wind and fire usage. That spell's not even good in campaign.

[@Arhatu]

Domination was the beginnig of the end for CA. The path they followed on brought them to their fall.

[@ChaoticKatana]

why do you guys not just ban the broken item?

[@shoop6119]

Give skaven verminlords plzzzzzz

[@darumanu9276]

I feel like the lions never perform well, they lose most monster fights and can't kill infantry effectively because of their animations. Not sure what CA could do to make them viable

[@fendelphi]

They do have some interesting utility, but they have too few charges on their abilities and are way too expensive. The Jade Lion can sit in the back and provide harmony and WoM recharge, then used as a heavy interceptor when something comes to try and disrupt your firing line(the breath is pretty good against hound-type units). The Jet Lion can support the frontline and shut down some of the opposing shooting with its ability. But they are just too expensive for such a niché role.

[@lovebus00]

I dont know why people bother to bring character sniping builds against cathay

[@zacharykrastowicz7485]

One important thing to know about before heading out in car rentals in Charlotte is the seatbelt laws in the state of North Carolina. Every passenger in a vehicle over 16 years of age must wear a seatbelt no matter where they ride in the vehicle. Any child riding a vehicle less than eight years old or 80 pounds in weight must be riding in an approved child seat or booster seat. All children must ride in the rear of the vehicle.

[@fiveforbiting]

The trunk is indeed the quietest place for children.

[@cthulhubecausewhynot1182]

The children yearn for the trunk

[@lordchaos7770]

Im surprised you cast a game with a player abusing a bug like the double healing. Seems like poor sportsmanship to me

[@str0fix]

How can you be so bad at your job if you can’t make healing happen once and not twice. Is it so hard to distinguish 1 from 2 😂

[@fendelphi]

Is it even confirmed to be a bug? As far as I know, all healing effects have an "immediate" tick on cast, and then another 1 second later. So if a healing effect has a duration of 1, it will heal the indicated value, twice. Their intended value might have been 32% total(in which case it should have been 16% value for 1 second), but the ability of itself works "correctly". The funny thing is, Ostankya has the opposite issue. Her healing value is extremely low(I think it heals little less than 2% in total for each unit affected), so it is more of a long duration(with long cooldown) stamina and leadership buff than actual healing.