Is the Tesla Powerwall Worth it? Let's go over the data.

[@jamesdavison5891]

No matter what you are reviewing, it always seems to be the best, most intelligent review around. Just great!

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

You sir made my day, thank you for your kind words! You awesome people are why I do it and love it

[@IDann1]

In the UK we have a utilities company called octopus energy, and if you’re on their agile tariff (plan) your charged every half an hour, back in May we were paid at night to use electricity, yes payed 💰 money, this is a game changer when you have an electric car..

[@stevenblackthorne4790]

I laughed at your comment about your milk going bad in the refrigerator. Here in the Pacific NW, people have freezers full of venison, elk meat, Salmon, and clams. A few hours without power means all of that valuable food is ruined. We're talking about thousands of dollars in value. Many people have backup generators because of this reality. Having solar plus Powerwalls means an entirely different way of dealing with this threat.

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

Wow that’s so true! Mmm fresh venison!

[@wkrupper]

Ricky, your logic and information is the best. Thank you!

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

My pleasure and thank you for your kinds words!

[@caseyat88]

Thank you for you videos! I live in Phoenix, AZ, and I just bought solar and storage, based on knowledge I've gained from your channel. I did go with Tesla, after quoting other companies. 16 kWh pv and 3 power walls. Cost wise, worst case with interest on a loan, I break even in 20 years. Not planning on moving, ever. Paying off the loan sooner, we then save $2-3k a year in electricity, or offsetting the Time of Use plans. For emergency preparedness, the #1 reason I got the system, is excellent. My house is 100% electric. We use near 45k kWhs a year. 2 A/C units, 2 electric cars, a large pool, my spouse bakes often, and my kids keep every electrical device on. This system should keep us from being dependant on the grid during the day, use our powerwalls in the evening, and we can run our pool pump, and charge our EVs on the super-off-peak hours of 11 pm - 5 am, at 5-6 cents a kWh. Hoping to do our part, to help the environment, with an exchange of financial costs. I do hope they enable off-peak charging for the powerwalls in the future! Thanks again!

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

So glad to hear it Casey! Please write to us if you have comments etc! We love hearing from you guys! Email me anytime! [e-mail]

[@atimbancaya]

What solar company did you use? Did the same company install both solar and PW’s? I also live in AZ (west valley) and looking to install both this year!

[@dcarter52]

Your one wish can be done I believe by using a specific software. Watch “And Now You Know” with Zak and Jessie to learn more.

[@jasonsoleter4263]

Great summary. It appears that as EV use increases, PUDs are moving to a TOU model. So ultimately energy arbitrage through powerwall utilization will likely become feasible across the country. Of course it would be great if power companies would start to pay users to use their batteries for backup/grid stabilization. That may take longer. I was curious how you populated the data for your ipad display. Is there an API to query the tesla gateway on solar production and electrical consumption, so that it can be fed into a display app for your ipad? Great channel.

[@AllMyHobbies]

That is not ROI!! time to pay back your investment is not roi. if i invest 12,000 it starts retuning on day one! you don’t have to wait years just to get back your principal. in your case once you hit 11 years then it starts turning a 1000 per year in roi but that is extremely bad.

[@craigslist04]

We need the Powerwall 3, with built-in Inverter for direct DC wiring, and 26kWh usable capacity.

[@toddkes5890]

Also have four connections: one for DC input for solar panels, a second for plug & play additional Powerwalls (power and data logic), and two connections for AC current (in and out). This way if there is a power failure the solar panel is not linked to the network directly and can be used to power your house. Most solar setups are designed where if there is no input power, the solar panels are 'shut down' to prevent backfeed meaning if there is a power outage you cannot use your solar panels to power your house. By 'disconnecting' the solar panels from the local power grid you can still use your solar panels to power your house (and refill the Powerwall). Having the easy connection to a second Powerwall means being able to expand easily after the first Powerwall is installed. Just have the second Powerwall delivered, set up the ground supports, physically hook up the second Powerwall, and the two Powerwalls perform the electronic checking to make sure they are both good. The first Powerwall just packages the data from the second and uses the existing app setup to communicate with the user.

[@Leopold5100]

Fantastic great content (as always) with detailed considered review of Powerwall. In my situation (down, down Under) I opted for two Powerwalls, because of the geographic location often giving sporadic and intermittent solar generation for over 6 months of the year, during Spring and Autumn. Powerwall's 5kW input limit coupled with my 10kW solar system, I couldn't "make 100% hay while the sun shines". For example generating 10kW for 30 minutes that the sun is available, but limited to only being able to store 50% of that due to input limit, the rest going/lost to the grid (6.7c AUD Feed-In Tariff). With two Powerwalls, input becomes 5kW + 5kW, (thus grabbing full potential solar output), plus this gives me 5kW + 5kW output when charging big items like EV, thus able to use more available solar and maximise self consumption.

[@Soruk42]

2:18 If your export tariff is crap (like it is in the UK) then it can save you money by storing excess power your panels have generated to use later on at night instead of exporting to the grid for a pittance and re-importing for orders of magnitude more. It can also help you save during the day when the panels are generating, but you pull a load that's more than the panels are generating at that time, the battery can make up the difference rather than importing from the grid. (At least, that's what my Growatt system does.)

[@JR-oh6vo]

You stated an 11 year payback, your battery life was not taken into consideration, your losing capacity every day you drain the battery, there is no way this could be an 11 year payback. You have not considered any failure over an 11 year period, your system is now more complicated. Peak summer is 50c kw/h, so A/C costs are at a high and if you have a bigger than average home you wont be saving anything but simply consuming to cool your home alone, then there are those with pools and electric cars, so your consuming more then you think. If your battery goes past 20% of its storage you loose even more life on the battery as it chews up your charge cycles. Your solar export rate will be lower cause you need 13.5 kilowatt a day to charge the battery or depending on what it uses and how good the weather is. So you have waved a fair chunk of your solar export and hope the battery will make up the new return which is a dismal return as a consumable asset that will have to be turned around from 5-10 years alone depending on how hard the batt is used. The export prices are also dictated by the provider, so when the masses take it up, the provider will eventually reduce the pay back. The prices on these batteries has to come down a ton before it makes it an easy decision to get involved in being a power source. As you stated they keep rising the price on the battery, new battery tech will arrive at higher density's, but at higher costs as it will be solid state by then. Its a hard thing to judge right now and its not cost effective at all. But if you have money to burn go for it, its a great talking piece for the woke. A genset is way cheaper, you could have 6kw/h all night long for $1500. If your battery is outside in the cold you have reduced its capacity by 40%, same with high heat, not as bad at 30%, but it stresses the cells and longevity is a side effect of heat. So there more then meets the eye to this woke appliance.

[@liroger733]

Thanks for the great video! The increasing popularity of the EV's will certainly help raise demand for solar and storage batteries. After having a Model Y, I have had the Tesla solar and Powerwall batteries installed. Your charts definitely reflect my situation as well. I also live in California. The excess energy from solar is typically sent back to the grid in the afternoon once the battery is full. This is when the peak-rate hours start. I smiled when you mentioned that you removed your UPS in the house after Powerwall installation - that's exactly what I did when my own Powerwalls were in place. Having solar and battery storage is a lifestyle improvement to my family in many aspects for sure.

[@username65585]

Don’t Power companies in California turn off power during high wind because of fire risk?

[@hanks_backyard]

I feel like one area where the powerwall can pay for itself that you didn't cover is the following. I don't have time based billing here in Austin, but as my usage increases over the month, my per watt fees go up. And, the power company does buy power back, but it's at 1/3 to 1/4 quarter of what I pay. I use the self-powered mode in my tesla app so when it's sunny here - I power my house as well as charge up my powerwalls. Inevitably here in Austin we get cloud cover for a portion of the day - my powerwalls automatically kick in - often taking them down to the 30% min setting I use. Then the sun comes back and I can repeat the cycle. Additionally, I can run the house for a time after the sun goes down with the powerwalls. Thus, I can reduce my total power consumption for the day - so that I stay in the lower pricing tier longer. And, by doing this, even without ever sending power back to the grid, I believe my over all bill will be reduced even though I don't have a time of use plan here. Not sure how to get that possibility in your spreadsheet - but thought I'd mention in case I'm missing something in my analysis. Thanks for the great video!

[@dann952]

Wish I got a powerwall last year. The ones I'm buying this year are $29.750 for two installed.

[@olemissjim]

I have 3 powerwalls, it was very close to the price I was quoted for a 22kW propane generator with ATS and a full tank of propane. Over ~20 years the powerwalls will be much less expensive and work much better than a generator. Not sure how the new pricing would impact my comparison, but I love having powerwalls

[@emiliodelagarza4363]

I have 2 powerballs 🤣

[@Leopold5100]

and much better for the environment

[@chuckk6971]

It would be great to add a Consumption value by month to determine real savings/cost.

[@reid1boys]

I cant remember the last time we lost power, and since I dont have TOU and the price of those batteries makes a power wall a no go. I wouldnt buy one of those until the price was down to 3k. I would love a Tesla car, but at 65k plus for a model 3, thats a no go also. The future is certainly close and I see batteries and an EV in my near future, not until they get prices down. BY the way, if I am correct, Tesla is no longer even selling a power wall to exisiting solar customers. If NEM 3.0 passes as proposed.. it could change my thinking.

[@AnHebrewChild]

"Tesla is no longer selling a power wall to existing solar customers." Do you mean by this that Tesla will not sell a powerwall as a _later_ add on to an existing Tesla panel/tile system? In other words, is the suggestion that a power wall must be part of initial installs at this time? I hope my question is clear. Thank you.

[@reid1boys]

@@AnHebrewChild I meant Tesla wont sell a power wall to NON tesla solar system owners. If you have a tesla roof or tesla panels, they will sell you a power wall at a later time.

[@robertburnett9268]

Hi Ricky, just watching you KZbin about power walls and I was wondering if you get a tax credit?

[@Lydia00001]

I've had no power outages in 15 months 😊

[@SamuelHauptmannvanDam]

Lol. You guys aren't allowed to charge up your power wall from the grid? WTF? xD

[@Dwayne_Green]

This is great, but the one year overview doesn't take into account two very important things. 1) the decrease in effeciency of the panels over multiple years, and 2) the decrease in capacity of the powerwall over the 10 years, which I understand would be fairly substantial if you the batteries are being charged and drained every day.

[@gene8172]

Panels usually warrantied to produce 90% power after 10 years, and in the high 80% after 20 years. Solar installers take this into account when designing systems. PW warrantied to store 70% power at 10 years.

[@jonathansage2147]

There's a blind spot in this video because your net metering is grandfathered in at 1:1. If your net metering is less favorable, then storing your generated electricity will also cause the powerwall to have an ROI, even if there's no difference in peak cost per kwh.

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

Great point

[@behrensf84]

How many cycles does the power wall last? It’s no good if it takes 10 years to pay back, but then you have to replace it...

[@chefgav1]

Tesla used Australia as it’s testing ground and my state runs an independent real world testing lab and results for Tesla and batteries in general aren’t good. LG chem batteries have been removed from market due to heat issues and the battery testing centre found an 80% failure rate. So in summary tesla, LG etc will be forking out lots of warranty jobs within the 10 year period

[@dryii]

Love the data and thanks for sharing the spreadsheet. 14:03 I would still have a UPS for any necessary computers. They are much more susceptible to power fluctuations and the Powerwall won't keep them running in the event of a grid power failure.

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

Good point Doug!

[@uss_04]

Main reason I see to get a UPS is cause of an errant circuit trip and AVR.

[@Jethr001]

….it wont? i’m confused

[@dryii]

Even a couple ms outage will likely cause a PC to crash. If you want to be sure the system stays running during the time it takes the Powerwall to kick in a dedicated UPS will be necessary. After the transfer is complete the PC will go back to running off home power (Powerwall), and going back to grid power is seemless.

[@SPYTHandle]

@@dryii Thanks for the explanation, Doug! How long does the powerwall take in order to detect a power outtage and start serving power?

[@Fuhugawagah]

are you accounting for the decay of battery capacity over its life? i think that eats into your roi.

[@Leopold5100]

big time, that's why power arbitrage just isn't worth it .....

[@incognitotorpedo42]

Ricky, I love your videos, but it drives me crazy when you say that 11.8 is "about 11". It's not. The closest whole number is 12. It's "about 12".

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

ok i'll work on that

[@grizzlymartin1]

Side note, off topic since you mentioned storms. Will severe wind storms easily blow Tesla Solar Tiles off roofs? I saw your other show where roofing contractors were simply "snapping down" solar tiles. It looked like the first strong wind that came by would easily rip those tiles up and make dangerous projectiles out of them. PUN: "Project-Tiles." Just say'n...

[@gene8172]

Tesla solar roof is rated class F. There’s no way Tesla would be able to sell a roofing product that isn’t wind rated.

[@edwinhartshorn639]

Thank you. You are very good at this and very knowledgeable.I have been thinking about a Powerwall for some time with 14.64 KWH solar I plan on looking hard into this.

[@DrDsIT]

+Two Bit da Vinci The fact you can't power your Powerwall at night when the rate is cheapest but you can program your Tesla with 8x or more storage and charge it is ridiculous! You and your neighbors should petition your regulatory commission to end that and eliminate the need to tax you more to upgrade the grid. Decentralized power is the key. I've opted not to buy solar because it's so inefficient for the price however, I will buy battery backup through Alibaba because it is as cheap as the cost of a natural gas generator and the ROI is far quicker than Tesla solar and Powerwall. I own two Tesla Model X so I'm not against Tesla.

[@silverwolf9237]

I am in San Diego and in the middle of shopping around for solar. I am really glad that I found your channel, its helping me so much with this process! Originally I didn't think a powerwall would be worth it, but I think you just changed my mind! I can't afford to do it together with the solar system all at once, but maybe I will add it on in a few years!

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

Glad to help! yeah my idea was always to control costs and spread it out! i got solar in 2 phases 10 years apart, and then batteries

[@teslafudge1585]

That data sharing view between you live on tablet and the phone app data is 🔥, love that. Great data & tips.

[@fixittony]

We have it much different in Wisconsin...not time of use....have net-metering and my utility company offsets the same rates as what is normally charged....But, should I focus on setting my budget and say I will not spend more than $X and accept what offset that creates or install a system that gets close to my past 12 months use as offset...right now my bids are coming in trying to match my 2021 use...prices are ranging from $45,000 to $100,000 with a range between 18kWh to 22kWh system....any advice on approach to take? I can't afford $100,000 for 22kW but $45,000 for a 20kW seams palatable.

[@jakemcmillian]

Your wish is granted if you live in Rhode Island or Massachusetts. It's called Tesla ConnectedSolutions.

[@RWilliKiwi]

But wait, I have solar and during the summer here in MA I export a lot of power back to the grid, which they give back to me in the winter when I need it but a big percentage of my bill is delivery charge so it costs me to get it back.

[@SkepticCyclist]

Those 2-3 minute outages are most often not real outages. Usually just a grid disturbance of frequency fluctuation. When this happens the gateway often interprets it as an outage and will automatically disengage from the grid. I had this happen twice over the last 6 months

[@brian8496]

What program do you have running on your iPad that you have mounted

[@brogcooper25]

Virtual Power Plants are the solution to charging Powerwall from the grid and taking full advantage of energy arbitrage. Tesla will register as a utility so they can participate in wholesale energy markets. Our current grid isn't designed for so many small independent energy producers but Autobidder will coordinate thousands to act as one.

[@jameswagner8308]

Can't charge at midnight huh? HACKING TIME

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

If you figure out how, you be sure to write me :)

[@rslaqui]

Great in the economic review but super shallow ecological review. Yes being able to get rid of peak plants would be ideal and maybe batteries like Tesla's power wall are the solution. But making a battery has a huge environmental impact in terms of carbon emission but also in terms of mining as well as in terms of battery life and what would become battery waste it might not be the case that the benefit to the environment of having zero or low impact on the grid demand is bigger than the damage made to create the power walls

[@AnHebrewChild]

my thoughts on ecological impact as well. Similarly, this was (and remains) a primary objection to CFL bulb adoption: lack of comprehensive assessment on eco-impact. The manufacture and disposal of those bulbs are variables included in the equation only very rarely. Thankfully, here in 2022 there are available other lighting options available which are (actually) environmentally-friendly. That's off your battery topic, but just needed to get that out there. :]

[@tom8437]

I doubt power companies would have a problem with people charging their Powerwalls at night, and any regulation that prevents it would be absurd. Like you said, it would help stabilize the grid and diminish the need to run costly and dirty peaker plants (which some companies appear to be phasing out by installing their own massive battery banks, which they will obviously charge off-peak and discharge on-peak).

[@johnd01]

I have talked with people in charge of solar at my utility and they do not want to sell energy cheaply and then buy it back at a higher price. They set the rates up so that there is not enough spread to pay for the unit if someone was doing that. The summer peak is 5 days a week for 4 months. They also try to make it cheaper to buy energy from them than to go solar.

[@behrensf84]

Yeah, that’s what I was thinking buy cheap from the grid, then sell back at the peak time...

[@derekcraig3617]

or you could build your own battery bank and have all the same benefits as a power wall and you could charge you batteries off the grid when you want

[@kevinbuck6871]

Here in the UK, you can already charge the PowerWall 2 from grid. We have 2 X PW2's linked to 29 solar panels, but in winter, solar does not produce enough to fully charge them. We get cheap over night electricity at 5 pence per KWH. We charge both EV's and PW2's at this cheap overnight rate, works very well. Could be that California does not allow grid charging to storage batteries, but UK does?

[@brogcooper25]

Are you part of the UK Virtual Power Plant?

[@raz0407]

@two bit da Vinci - big Fan of your channel. Pls, keep up the good work! My current power consumption is 4000 kWh /yr for my house, I am buying EV in the near future so I added 3600 kWh /yr for it which totals to 7600kWh /yr. I am planning to buy a solar system of 6.8 kw that estimates production of 10,500kWh /yr factoring in the possible increase in power consumption as my kids grow older and also to offset Peak hour cost (2:1). I use about 400 kWh /yr during peak hours (5-8). assuming peak hour cost stays 2 times the off-peak hours in the future. IF I will send 800kWh /yr to the grid during off-peak and draw 400kWh /yr during peak and that should solve my problem of paying more during peak hours to utility company right? hence eliminating the need of battery to save $$$. I am not overly concerned about blackouts. isn't having extra few panels to generate extra energy to offset peak hour cost is alternate strategy? ROI on a few extra panels is much quicker than investing in battery. I would love to hear your thoughts on this? Just want to make sure my assumptions are correct if I go this route. I would love to get the battery in the future (for emergencies) when the cost goes down. I presume, that batteries with better storage capacity will continue to emerge in the market and drive down the cost. Appreciate your thoughts!

[@erickessler6094]

Brilliant Work Ricky! Thanks for the great video! Wow, I'm geeking out over the outstanding job you have done! I am in the US as well, in the Virginia area (snow today, haha), not your beautiful California. It looks like your home is new, so did you build from the start with solar and make optimizations? Since winter production takes such a drop-off, I was wondering if: -- you oriented your home and roof angle to optimize the winter production... -- perhaps a steeper roof pitch and maybe rotated the home 5 or 10 degrees off perfect south-facing to better catch the winter sun setting further northward? -- I love all the real data for the solar panel production on each day... It looked like you had some kind of app in the video (about 12:01mins)? -- Ricky, you said you no longer needed UPS for your computers and electronics... so is the Tesla PowerWall truly instantaneous? We lose power all the time here in rural VA but it takes my propane generator about 15 seconds it to kick in, so I still need UPS's on all my electronics. Since I am looking at building a retirement home and have never had solar panels, I am wondered what kind of production could be expected... or who is the Authority on the subject. I suspect the payback in VA is much less than San Diego. haha, I'm geek out a bit on planning. I am free to design my roof any way I want and can also orient my home any way as well. Cheers, Eric

[@sherwinm]

so based on your excel file, it would take 44 years for ROI if I get 2 batteries? hmm...

[@kendugas50]

We were impacted by the Texas freeze in 2020. Burst pipes in the kitchen (motion sensor facet shut off in four minutes). Over $50K in damage (most covered by insurance) but took over a year to complete repairs. Days without power and the gas heat did not function.I looked at solar with a power wall but the cost was over $60K cash. 25 year payback using the company's estimaters.

[@ajm1776]

Best of the reviews I've seen, but there are a few piercing questions which still need to be considered. Would the money you spend on solar and/or storage benefit you more if invested somewhere else (with a short payback period)? Also, most people move within 7 years. How much value will a buyer give you for your system? Car battery performance degrades over time and my EV life is expected to be 10 years. The ROI may be upside down already, not considering any out-of-warranty repair costs. But then again, it's sexy!

[@mipmap256]

You forgot count in federal tax credit 26% and sgip $200/KWH rebate(hazard zones) and battery degrade(bad). it’s about 7 years to get the investment back. instead of 11+ year. imo, all these make financial sense only because history low interest rates. And of course for a better environment. Bottom line You will get a 80% capacity used powerwall after 8 years.

[@marklefler4007]

Perhaps I am an idiot, but the spreadsheet does not seem to account for time of day, and how much excess power is generated. It just seems to assume the powerwall is fully charged during an off peak period and used during a peak period. Is that correct? Here in Florida in the winter (power company fpl) peak power is M-F from 6am until noon and 6pm until midnight, so the period of time the powerwall could be charged it shorter. In the summer it is M-F from noon until 9 pm. I suppose we can say he spreadsheet is a maximum case, but payback period even in this case is too long to justify this solely on savings. Anyway, good video.

[@brianarnold3250]

Powerwall is overpriced. From the value of the batteries. It is worth no more than USD 5000 these days. Even allowing forTesla's wonderful control software.

[@yoho403]

Your calculations are wrong. A powerwall with solar CAN pay for its self if you are on a fixed rate. This is because not all electricity companies have a policy for a like for like rate, if your import fee is 0.15 kwh and you get paid 0.7 kwh exporting then you save 0.8 per kwh by using your stored electricity

[@voyageprint7761]

I mean theoretically you could just use an Ecoflow Delta Pro 7.2 with battery back up same discharge as the powerwall if you pair two, charge during the day using solar, then use a automatic switch to turn on during peak hours and call it an emergency every night. I mean Ive read the California Laws on it, seems legit. Also much much cheaper and doesn't need a whole bunch of regulation

[@andrewlevesque2976]

What is everyone getting quotes for a powerwall install I was quoted 6,500 plus the cost of the powerwall. Seems a bit step to me. He said it was due to the complexity. Imo it’s not much more complex than a generator transfer switch. What is everyone’s thoughts. At that cost I can go on a really nice vacation during a hurricane heading my way.

[@11000038]

I did the calcs for battery charging off peak. I have no solar. At best i.e. I used no grid energy at peak it would still take 10 years to pay off. Not worth it as that is the life expectancy of the system. It also assumes pricing at 2023 high levels. You can't take it with you if you move though it may add the the value of property.

[@S54VR6]

I use bitcoin miners to offset my Solar/power wall costs and will approximately pay for themselves in 2-4 years at current bitcoin prices (19-20k)

[@MitchOfCanada]

tap into the solar panels line and send voltage from grid into the solar panel circuit... Can Powerwall work without Internet? Powerwall needs an Internet connection (over wired Ethernet or your home Wi-Fi) or a cellular connection to receive software updates and to communicate with the Tesla mobile app for energy monitoring. A reliable connection is required to provide new product features over time. If its connection is temporarily lost, Powerwall can continue to operate with its most recent settings, but it should not be installed in a location without Internet or cellular service.

[@esvideovault1573]

Ricky - in AZ we have Summer, Summer Peak and Winter time periods. How do I adjust your spreadsheet to add a 3rd constant section for Summer Peak?

[@tompaquette7138]

Nice video! I have some beef with your request and a solution for a more persuadable request. You let the cat out of the bag! Shame on you. We want to be able to charge our power wall from the grid so that when our solar isn't producing for long periods, such as winter, we can still always have back up power, which is most likely going to be needed at least once in the winter.

[@thomasheisler]

wow, incredible video. if i ever get the money i will a couple. super informative thank you

[@bergonius]

That regulatory ban of on demand charging is just plain stupid. It denies battery energy arbitrage which help stabilize the grid and lower electricity prices. I hope those regulations will get taken down one day.

[@jamesenglish9736]

Thanks for the thoughtful and interesting video, it great to hear an honest and unbiased view.

[@samusvi2693]

lol way too funny. another raving about savings how come there are no videos of solar systems over 10 -12 yrs and solar has been around over 20yrs. is it maybe because reality sets in and most of the expensive components have to be replaced. oh what about the really expensive cost to replace the roof and having to take the entire panel system down and put it back up. could go on but most should get the point.

[@yourgooglemeister6745]

The watt price you have listed you mean kwh Correct? Why would you write it as watts? That makes it very confusing for newbies.

[@AshleyWilsonAU]

You haven't taken into account the time when appliances are running, it seems, when you also pay more buying electricity than feeding it back to the grid. I have a flat rate throughout the day, but I am still saving money with my powerwall because it lets me use most (if not all) of my solar electricity, which is the cheapest. Self consumption is key to savings if you don't have a 1:1 feed in tariff (aka net metering), because you're typically not using the energy at the same rate and at the same time as your panels are generating electricity. Powerwall lets me do that, saving me the difference between by buy rate (20c/kWh) and my sell rate (6c/kWh) - I'm in Australia.

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

great point!

[@irag34]

Powerwall is way too expensive. Tesla makes its batteries for $150 per kwh. Power wall is 3 times more expensive than it should be.

[@jakk609]

I live in Los Angeles and am in the process of getting solar design finalized with one power wall. tesla told me since one power wall will not big enough to support the power need for my AC. Therefore at night the ac will not utilize the power wall or the ac will not connect to the power walk. Does this make sense?

[@gene8172]

I’m sure a reasonably skilled electrician can rig up a switching system to enable the PW to charge from the grid at midnight….

[@gjforeman]

What sort of degredation over time happens to the PowerWall battery cells? Do you anticipate having to replace cells during your 11 year payoff period?

[@ajm1776]

You're not supposed to ask piercing questions like this.

[@Son37Lumiere]

Tesla is overpriced, you can get equivalently sized batteries for less from other companies such as LG, sometimes a lot less.

[@IAKWBOS011]

Have you done a comparison of the Powerwall vs. the EcoFlow? I’d like to see such a thing.

[@Mr_Mumble_PSN]

How have you found the new updates. Work better for you now? Also how do I change season to be comparable to my location

[@zekechen3930]

7 months later it's 12,500 😭😭

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

True! :(

[@teslafudge1585]

Like that subtle hope “peak hours are 4pm to 9pm when people are home”. 😅🤌 c19

[@dea7hr0w]

Is your Powerwall Calculator updated to 09/26/2023 new pricing ?

[@kihmjones2176]

Sending utility current through your solar array wiring may work .. need a little hardware to fool the powerwall into thinking it is daylight coming in 🤐

[@11000038]

Other battery storage solutions are available? This feel like a 20 minute advert for Tesla. No like this time.

[@MrApostolicman]

If it takes about 11 years to break even in California with a Tesla battery 🔋. How long does a Tesla battery last?

[@neeneeintexas]

The tax credit also helps offset the cost of the power wall and solar panels for now.

[@VitorMMoraes10]

Hey Ricky, fellow San Diegan, which software are you using to monitor your solar/powerwall energy? I’m putting it in my house and want to know. Also, any referral code for Solar/Powerwall? Thanks and thanks for the awesome content!

[@enermaxstephens1051]

Screw the grid. I'll just get a solar system and store my own power. Let everyone else be on their own.

[@peterwang8251]

Tesla Power Wall Original OEM factory Shenzhen Cleva Power

[@kurtchristopher7392]

Thanks so much for creating this video. Excellent information!

[@1mw4tch1ng]

My Powerwall is made up of Honda EU3000is and soon will be Honda EU7000is. Where I live my SDG&E bill stated we are not included in a rolling blackout unless the entire southern grid goes down back in 2013-2015 the grid was down for 13-15 hours due to a worker working between Cali and Arizona shorting the grid.

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

well no a powerwall can actually make you money but sending energy when the grid needs it. a generator cant do that without your own software

[@Iamtheman325]

So if you have a power wall solar combo how much of your power goes into the power wall and how much goes to grid

[@CreaseysWorkshop]

In Australia we can charge from the grid. My powerwall starts charging as soon as off peak rates begin. I think your figures don't allow for the degradation of capacity over the 10 years or the 10% loss of converting DC to AC and then back to DC. Also my energy company pays me to let them use my battery using peak times.

[@markhendrickson2610]

You can absolutely turn a nuclear reactor off and on. The Navy does this all the time.

[@drsuppan]

I own one. Financially it is not worth it, ROI in 20 years or so (in NZ). But it makes the whole installation work much more smoothly. The emergency part generates a big problem for me: how much capacity do I have to keep for a backup situation. I set it at 35%. I big problem is that Tesla does not offer charging the battery from a generator. That would be the ultimate efficiency. I could use a 3KW generator to charge the battery in an emergency situation. Usually a generator would even in ECO mode not run very efficient and after 12 or 24 hours depending in the model you will have to refuel. But a combination would be great

[@johnd01]

Will your solar charge the power wall white the grid is down?

[@drsuppan]

yes, @@johnd01 as far as I know. That was the main reason why I bought the battery

[@Rickydbaby]

I live in Northern Ca and am currently seeking quotes for solar. Going to NEM2 with the Tiered pay structure, would it make more sense to go with a smaller 4.25kw system with a powerwall for a couple thousand more, or a larger 6.66kwh system with no powerwall. My goal is to pay $0 in PGE at the end of the year. I know Powerwall can't create energy, but on the smaller system could it be leveraged to make up for the lack in production in billing? I'm leaning toward the larger system but the powerwall is interesting and hard to wrap my head around in my situation.

[@MH-Tesla]

Charge power wall with grid. I can't for the life of me see why you couldn't make this happen? If you can Charge it with solar, just input the grid power as of it were solar. The power input is just that... the powerwall can't determine its source! Maybe not as efficient, but if I understand the physics of electricity, it's possible.

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

It’s a legal reason with the utility here. So there’s no engineering reason :) as 99% of the time is the case, it’s lawyers not engineers

[@Swampster70]

As a control systems/network engineer, I'm having a hard time time figuring out how the Powerwall and PGE work out how your house uses the electricity from your Powerwall during peak use. Does the Powerwall power the house at all times and charges from the solar?

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

The meter measures current in and out of your home. During peak times, the powerwall measured your home demand and supplies it. As a result it’s as if you’re not even home to the utility.

[@robertb5948]

Thank you, informative and very nicely done.

[@travisr70]

Just had large Tesla solar installed last month just above sandiego. Did not get power wall because I do not get power outage and not cost effective but would love one otherwise. One change with Tesla solar is the Tesla solar app. They stopped the power flow visual in th app for solar install only. If you get power wall they do have power flow in app. Was disappointed with this as I feel deceived because I was not told this changed when I purchased. But Tesla solar production is great and great prices

[@cstevens818818]

I just signed a contract to finance 2 powerwalls & 8.16 kWh solar over the next 10years through Tesla. $3,500 down, approx $280/month. Based on my current ToU which is about $0.25 higher than base, I did the following math and find it makes economic sense. Am i missing anything? Tesla Solar & Powerwall Need 2 powerwalls If we ran 12 kWh @ peak pricing = $0.25 cheaper per kWh = $3 … $3 x 30 = $90 per month potential savings $280/ month before tax deductions ($9k tax deduction fed) $200/ month after tax incentives -$90 savings from ToU with powerwalls ----------- $110 net cost $110 x 12 months = $1,320 annual cost $1,320 / 12,000 kWh annual projected production from panels = $0.11/kWh + $350/ year ($3,500 down payment amortized over 10 years) = $1,670 annual cost including down payment $1,670 / 12,000 kWh = $0.13 kWh < $0.17 kWh lowest SCE rate

[@maitlandju]

Can you use a Tesla to power your house ?

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

Not yet.

[@brianwade-french1148]

Hey Ricky, love your channel and content. I just wanted to point out an issue with your general statement that a Powerwall doesn’t make since if you have a single rate tariff. Here in Australia where rates are 30-40c/kWh, and feed in tariffs are (soon to be) 6.7c/kWh, it makes more sense to store the energy in a battery that sell it back to the grid at 16-20% of the cost you pay to buy it. In other words the differential between import and export rates can make a Powerwall viable even if you don’t have a time of use tariff.

[@TwoBitDaVinci]

Great point!

[@teslapower3646]

The only way the Tesla Powerwall can "sell" that energy back to the grid legitimately is if one is on a VPP (I'm on one in Australia). I've only had one event when the Powerwall discharged to the grid during a "event", I got paid my normal FiT rate (21c) for the discharge (it occured just before sunset, so it was interesting to see the PW2 discharge to the grid with no solar). But otherwise, there's no way I can charge the PW2 up on offpeak and then try to sell it in peak. There's no option to do that in the Tesla App where one can at will tell the PW2 to discharge to grid. I guess there's some other ways of doing but requries a bit of programming to control the PW2 directly without the app. Don't know if retailers will pick up exports occuring at night which surely must put up a red flag. I've read that in some states in the US, it's not allowed if the PW2 was purchased with Federal rebates??? At one stage, my off peak was 6c cheaper than my FiT, so I could have charged the PW2 at 15c at night, so that it was 100% charged in the morning. Then all excess solar went to grid at 21c. But that plan didn't last long, I think the retailers realised that wasn't a good thing. So, now I'm on Seasonal ToU which only two periods Peak (4pm-8pm M-F, and there's Hi Peak for summer and Lo Peak for Winter) and off-peak which is for all other times (ie., 8pm to 4pm next day and all weekends, so I have 20 hours of off peak). But off-peak is 26c/kWh with 21c FiT. However, I export 4x more than I import, so I come out with a nice big negative bill each 12 months. But the 21c FiT is to end in November. I will have to wait and see what will be on offer for FiT. So, I just leave the PW2 at self-powered and 0% reserve. Last year, I only imported about 12kWh during 12 months in peak periods, so my grid peak usage is virtually 0. Most of my grid import is in Winter for 4 months and on off-peak. The PW2 mostly dishcarges during peak hours in Winter.

[@JunYamog]

Thanks very much this and your spreadsheet has been helpful. Even if my situation is a bit different still very useful content/spreadsheet. I differ by southern hemisphere, Powerwall more expensive purchase, no winter/summer rate change, however no charge off peak of 9pm to 12am and can charge from grid. Hoping the calculation on the spreadsheet will be the worst case for me, more expensive electricity bill and ability to charge for free off-peak should make my ROI faster however my initial cost is bigger. On a rainy gloomy day: Powerwall just have enough charge 6am, by 10am solar can power home and trickle charge the powerwall, by sunset the Powerwall only has about 15-20% charge but just enough to give me some power until 9pm comes, it charges enough for the next day from grid for no cost. On a sunny day I export 2x or more of a typical home usage, but my export cashback is like 1/5 of my import charge. What would be useful to know is the upgrade path: add more solar panels, add more battery or both. Hoping that add more solar panels might be the better path, but need to get more data we only had our system install in the last few weeks.

[@YeshuaAgapao]

My inverter (Schneider / Xantrex Connext XW) can charge from grid, solar, or generator, or a combination (solar charging has separate MPPT charge controllers). Off-gridders use Schneider / Xantrex Connext XW even though they have no grid because of their awesome generator support - the ability to use small generators at efficient levels of utilization to, not power everything, but to reduce drain rate on the batteries. Nothing matches these inverters in their ability to mix and match power sources (inverted DC from solar/battery, grid, generator) on a whim.