Understanding Calvinism/Presbyterians - Denominations Explained

[@grex7374]

"Not just the men, but the women and the children too." 💀

[@BenjaminAnderson21]

What's funny about that?

[@angelakirby9847]

i was thanking the same thing

[@Dead_guy138]

@@BenjaminAnderson21Star Wars quote

[@manualboyca]

@@Dead_guy138 I knew I had heard that phrase somewhere before! Thanks

[@SMILETAPPER]

bro thought he was slick

[@TheTankArtist]

I was genuinely researching Presbyterianism and it autocorrected to pride festival, this is a Godless world

[@jade_orb]

Bro those words are barely similar. And by barely I mean not at all.

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

There are liberal churches within Presbyterianism that don't follow their confessions of faith and there are conservative and confessional churches. The Presbyterian Church of Brazil (my church) has 200 years, has more than 700k members and 6k congregations and is still conservative.

[@WarriorcatGerda]

Sad

[@jorgebeltran342]

Google helped you out because heresy is worse than homosexuality

[@Orthosaur7532]

:(

[@AustGM]

“Most intellectual societies on earth” Shows a picture of Scotland

[@windradyne8724]

Well, you know what they say about genius and madness.

[@lanesmith1465]

Until recently, Scotland was one of the most educated countries in Europe and produces some of the most important Enlightenment thinkers.

[@unit2394]

@@lanesmith1465and the “Enlightenment” led to their destruction.

[@EliB207]

​@@unit2394 same for everyone else

[@rebeccalindley153]

@@unit2394 A good thing the Scots moved to America and contributed to Western Civilization here.

[@TrueCatholic697]

If I had to say one thing good about Presbyterians They know a lot about theology

[@TheScholarlyBaptist]

Yet there still liberal.

[@JustusWpiano]

@@TheScholarlyBaptistnot all

[@TheScholarlyBaptist]

@@JustusWpiano I wouldn’t say not at all ever heard of the PCUSA

[@axelportillo7558]

@@TheScholarlyBaptist He didn't say "not at all" he said "not all".

[@TheNabOwnzz]

​@@TheScholarlyBaptistNot as they were originally.

[@drewzinn779]

I died when you said “But not just the men but the women and children too” 😂

[@shuatock8216]

I thought I would be the only one who got that lol

[@fabulouschild2005]

And then there's the Free Presbyterian Church of Scotland, which is so conservative it doesn't even fit on the compass

[@matthewsoules7193]

There are many hyper conservative Reformed denominations. The PRC (Protestant Reformed) is one of them, and I like that he put them on the compass -- yet, they occupy the same space as the RPCNA did for Presbyterians lol. The PRC is FAR more conservative than the RPCNA. Other conservative denominations include the FRC, the HRC, the actually hypercalvinistic NRC, as well as, on the Presbyterian side, the PRC (Presbyterian Reformed) and the Free Church of Scotland Continuing. The Netherlands actually has THREE hypercalvinistic Reformed denominations. THREE. In a country of that size -- and at least two have some presence in the US.

[@TheNabOwnzz]

@@matthewsoules7193 If with those THREE hypercalvinistic Reformed denominations you mean HHK, OGGiN, and GGiN, you are rather evidently mistaken. Hypercalvinism is a more modern movement; these three are not hypercalvinist but traditional calvinist.

[@matthewsoules7193]

@@TheNabOwnzz Of course they would say that. No one wants to admit to being a hypercalvinist. A few genuine markers of hypercalvinism -- first, a denial of the need to preach the gospel to all; second, a form of fatalism whereby the possibility of someone desiring to be saved and yet being unable to come on account of not being elect is posited; third, a denial of duty-faith. From all that I have heard and read, the second of these positions would appear to be the existent in that strain of Dutch Reformed thought. Of course, I am more familiar with the Netherlands Reformed Congregations (the United States), but they are sister churches with the Gereformeerde Gemeenten. If 80%-90% of your (hypothetical "you," not you personally) congregation doesn't take communion because they don't have assurance of salvation, that would seem to indicate a serious problem. If your teaching holds that we must wait for an unmistakable (and borderline mystical) internal feeling before we may come to Christ, you are sorely mistaken. Indeed, how many in the NRC are waiting on their knees even now, hoping that they would be regenerated, yet refusing to simply trust in Christ to save them because it would be PRESUMPTUOUS to come to Christ until one thinks himself to have been made regenerate?

[@hey-xb9qn]

​@@TheNabOwnzzThose churches are with no doubt very conservative, but what I have understood is that the Dutch make a distinction between "Orthodox Reformed" and "experimental Reformed" folks? The experimental Reformed are more pietistic and find personal religious experience very important, even seeking assurance for their salvation from it. I have heard that in churches like the NRC, almost nobody (except for maybe the elders and some older people) in the services partakes in communion since they are careful in not eating and drinking for their damnation even though they want to follow the faith really closely. To my knowledge, not many people in the confessionally Reformed/Presbyterian circles hold to this position: the sacrament is instituted for believers who have laid their trust in Christ. But it indeed is pretty interesting how the most conservative reformed/presbyterians come from these ethnically-affiliated churches from Scotland and the Netherlands. A Dutch Wikipedia page about the experimental Reformed: nl.m.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Bevindelijk_gereformeerden&diffonly=true

[@Stallander]

​@@TheNabOwnzzI think he means GG, GGiN and OGGiN. GG and OGGiN are not hypercalvinist by definition, although it does occur in these denomonations. I would call GGiN hyper calvinist, because they formally believe that the Gospel only has to be preached to those that feel their depravity. While they really appreciate theologians from the Reformation and firmly stick to a traditional form of church services, their beliefs are based on modern theologians (ds. Mallan, dr. Steenblok).

[@AlignWithJesus]

I got saved in a Methodist church (that left the denomination to become Wesleyan), spent time in a Baptist church after, and just got back tit he US after a 6 month stay in Korea where I attended a reformed PCK (Presbyterian church of Korea) church. Now that I’m back home, I’m checking out a reformed PCA church

[@OrthodoxTitan]

Are you a Calvinist?

[@Adam-xr3zp]

> "the most successful and intellectual societies to ever exist" > shows Scotland

[@zuarbrincar769]

What's the problem?

[@PloFilms]

@@zuarbrincar769Its not known for being intellectual

[@justinwashington-z3j]

Actually, the Scottish enlightenment had a profound impact on the development of the U.S's founding fathers e.g. Thomas Jefferson. Many of the instructors at the early universities during the colonial era were Scottish. After breaking off from the catholic church Presbyterians believed all Christians should be able to read their own bibles and thus Scotland's literacy rates ended up being significantly higher than Britain's. Which led to many teaching over seas in the English colonies. P.S. not a Presbyterian lol (but like actually I'm not)

[@stanthebamafan]

The far left PCUSA church I grew up in didn’t teach most of these points. As far as the images of Christ, they had a massive stained glass portrait of Him at the front of the sanctuary. I didn’t really learn about Calvinism (or the Bible, for that matter) until I moved to a PCA church.

[@PeterBoggs]

"Is means is, as long as the definition of 'is' is not is"

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

It would be better to say that we don't believe the Divine Nature of Christ can communicate its attributes to the Human nature of Christ, but both can communicate its attributes to the Person of Christ. While Lutherans and Catholics believe the divine Nature can communicate its attributes (like "being everywhere) to the human nature (Christ flesh and blood). For us, this believe mixes the natures and violates Calchedon.

[@DrGero15]

Patrick? Bill Clinton? Hard to tell!

[@loganpeck5084]

Body means body.... As long as the definition of body has all the qualities of a spirit and none of the qualities of a body.

[@Gondor149]

Yeah it's tough. Like when He says He is the vine. If we takes "is" means "is" then He is a literal wooden door, a literal physical gate, and vine as well. I'm not even necessarily against the Lutheran interpretation but I find the "is" argument a little muddy in light of what else we are told He is.

[@Thatoneguy-pu8ty]

Abandoun ze zacrements? Zacre blue! huw vould do zuch a sing?

[@daisybrain9423]

Hello Zoomer, as a Catholic I want to say you taught me a lot about Reformed teaching and cleared up many misconceptions I had about it. I can now safely say that to me it is the Protestant denomination that makes the most sense!

[@valeried7210]

We have a family visiting our church and she was a Catholic who married a Protestant. She said she felt comfortable in a Reformed Church as it was similar to Catholicism. I didn't really get it, because I was thinking in certain theological terms. But it makes sense in a lot of ways.

[@jahnvantuttlesma8215]

Yes, regardless if one agrees or disagrees with Reformed theology, it is consistent and logical.

[@flatouttruthpodcast]

I hope you find Jesus Christ. Join an IFB church near you! 😊❤

[@cheynewillingham2107]

Me, a Scotch-Irish, hearing "Calvinism produce the most successful and intellectual societies" than seeing a Scottish flag up there couldn't help push out a barking laugh. There is a lot of great stuff that has come out of Scotland(mostly soldiers, engineers, and John Locke), but I wouldn't be so bold to label Scotland in such words. That being said, you did finally answer a question in history I've been puzzling over for long time. King Charles of England preferred Arminianism over Reformed Theology which led eventually to Puritans leading a civil war against him and eventually taking his head. I never saw anything in Arminianism that could explain his draw to that, but it was the rejection of holy saintly kings of reformed thought that convinced him that he should go the other way. Thanks for that.

[@TheNabOwnzz]

It may have indirectly led to it because of the challenging of Rome's authority, but the Reformed definitely did NOT believe in societal equality or democracy. Calvin's ideal form of government was an oligarchy similar to Plato's, and he believed a democracy more perilous than a monarchy. And they all emphasize the importance of a distinction in social positions, also in manner of comportment and dress; that is, a king should never act like a commoner and a commoner never act like a king.

[@DrGero15]

Yeah, but if he said that Calvin was not for democracy then he would have to admit Baptists (who were born out of the Calvinists) get credit for Democracy.

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

@@TheNabOwnzz He is talking about Calvinism as a tradition and not about Calvin especifically.

[@TheNabOwnzz]

@@pedroguimaraes6094 As a tradition the same applies. The Scottish and the Dutch were certainly not in favour of Democracy, in spite of their issues with English and Spanish kings, respectively. It's a post-Enlightenment nonsensicality based on pagan (mostly Greek) notions. Neither Scotland nor the Netherlands ever considered it a good idea to establish a government based on the majority of a benighted populace, and so a set group of people (regents, who came from wealthy merchants, and not from the people's vote, in the Netherlands for one) were invariably the ones who ruled, and they were not picked by a majority of the general populace.

[@HistoryNerd808]

It's kind of an annoying thing. I do personally find his previous claims(in other videos) that Calvinists were responsible for the Am. Revolution a bit overstated: they played a role but it was really Enlightenment ideals in general that influenced the Founders so if Presybterianism influenced them, it wasn't direct. Also, maybe it's my own Baptist priors but I do find his not mentioning in his previous video the fact that Baptists were the main driving force between religious freedom and the separation of church and state here in America, a bit annoying. Roger Williams, the radical founder of disestablishmentarianism here, who got kicked out of the Massachusetts Bay Colony by the Calvinist Puritans for it, and founded Rhode Island as a haven for all kinds of religious dissidents, was the founder of the Baptist Church in America.

[@DrGero15]

@@HistoryNerd808 The chain is Anglican Monarchy, to Puritan, to Baptist Democracy/Separation of Church and State. Both Presbyterians and Baptists are types of Puritan. Presbyterians held what could be seen as a king of halfway position on Church and State. The Anglicans held to the traditional view of Church & State, the Puritans/Presbyterians held to Church and State Separate but the State does what the Established Church tells it too and the Puritan Congregationalists/Baptists held to a separation of the two. It was Presbyterian views on their right to overthrow and kill the King, which they did, that led ultimately to Baptist separation, but they themselves didn't hold to it as even a brief survey of history will show, and I am sure you are aware of, since Calvinists persecuted Baptists here more than the Anglicans did back in England.

[@2x5brickstudios93]

As a Sydney anglican, I always feel left out of the party. We're evangelical and calvinist down here as well, you know! When you do a video on Anglicanism, can you mention GAFCON? It's like a group of biblical anglicans to protect the preaching of the word in anglican churches in opposition to the liberality of the CoE. (Global Anglican Futures CONference)

[@JenniferoftheSea]

Gafcon is such a blessing in their faithfulness.

[@tiggerjoy7899]

Sydney Anglicans are FIRE

[@max-pb7or]

Anglicans are woke and pro LGBTQ

[@stephenbarry7102]

Amen brother, amen

[@unprofessional7206]

My family and I became members of a local PCA church and my children were baptized, in part due to RZ's good content! Thanks RZ

[@mezke.official]

Please put these in a playlist God Bless 🔥🙏✝️❤️‍🔥

[@uncagedzebra6941]

True these very informative and have very little bias if any

[@DrGero15]

@@uncagedzebra6941 Are you deaf? “Calvinism is the most God centered form of Christianity” and “most successful and intellectual societies to ever exist were Calvinist"

[@Elemented]

​@@DrGero15 Hes literally started like every video in the series by saying something nice like that about the denomination hes covering

[@DrGero15]

@@Elemented That isn't "nice" that is deeply arrogant.

[@Elemented]

@@DrGero15 he also said "Baptists have had the biggest impact on the modern world" and "Orthodoxy has conserved their tradition the best of any Christian denomination"

[@Dsingis]

6:35 a little more context on the lutheran view here: We do believe even unbelievers objectively recieve the body and blood of Christ, but is has no value to them, because they don't have any faith. It's the same for baptism. Luther says something along the lines of that we only recieve the "treasure" of what is in the sacraments through faith. An unbeliever can't claim to be saved based on his baptism or that he recieved the body and blood. Only believers can, and for those it is an assurance of salvation. So, again: Even though both objectively recieve the body and blood, it only has an effect for the believer.

[@DrGero15]

The Anglican view is very much the same. The unbelieving reject the grace that is objectively offered to all in the Sacraments.

[@WittenbergScholastic]

"only has an effect" in so far as a bestowal of grace. We do believe one receives communion at their own spiritual detriment if one is faithless, so we would say there is a negative effect.

[@DrGero15]

@markstein2845 No one unbaptized or unbelieving can receive it in any tradition. Why would an unbeliever want to? And if you are in unrepentant sin you must confess and repent first, apostates are unbelievers.

[@ellybean7354]

This was so helpful! The idea of predestination is still hard for me to grasp and is something I will continue researching and praying about, but I can definitely see the beauty of reformed theology and deeply appreciate Calvinist churches and their contributions

[@andyontheinternet5777]

The Bible is full of tension between God's sovereignty (predestination, elections, etc) and human responsibility (free will, need for obedience, etc). Don't try too hard to resolve it. If you remove the tension you will fall into all kinds of heresies.

[@danielcrouse6515]

I'm sure this will be a completely fair and unbiased video....

[@JustinCage56]

It's surprisingly unbiased to be very honest.

[@yosiyyahu.bar.stephen]

@@JustinCage56Redeemed Zoomer is usually quite charitable. Even with Catholicism, he did incredibly well not misrepresenting them.

[@shuatock8216]

I’m Catholic, I think this was incredibly fair!

[@prof.allangallo]

Pure gold. Thank you. Prebyterian Church of Brazil.

[@JenniferoftheSea]

This was incredibly helpful. I'm Reformed, but grew up Baptist. I'm still wrapping my head around some things. This helped!❤

[@J-ky8qg]

Watch Soteriology

[@JenniferoftheSea]

@@J-ky8qg Thanks. I've always been reformed in my soteriology. It was studying the Covenants in ALL of scripture and seeing it as one book that made me fully Reformed.

[@ikemeitz5287]

You should check out the London Baptist Confession. A surprisingly large amount of he says here is within historic baptist teaching, along with a credobaptist view. "Only a symbol" doesn't represent the historic baptist view of the sacraments. (Also, Gavin Ortlund's channel has helped me a whole lot!)

[@indy_the_awesome4615]

I just saw one of your videos recommended on my computer and said. "Oh hey Resumed Deemer" And that was the funniest things Ive hear today. Thank you

[@sebastianbendyna2363]

Dude I just love your videos. I’ve been sitting on the fence of Lutheranism for 4 years and your Lutheran video has made me decide to go for it. Thanks.

[@isaiahwlong]

Love this man!! So glad you did us!!

[@christinehall1316]

This is my favourite youtube Chanel! Thank you for sharing this knowledge with us!

[@CYTBlitz]

I’m really enjoying these denomination-introduction videos. Maybe there’s already one and I’m simply overlooking it, but I’d like to see one on Anglicanism as well.

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

1) The strongest view of human sin. 2) The strongest vision of God's grace and mercy. 3) The balance between Sola Scriptura and Systematic Theology. 3) Christology and a view of the Sacraments more consistent with Chalcedon. 4) The affirmation of the biblical doctrine of Predestination without excuses. 5) The centrality of the majesty and glory of God in His doctrines. 6) The Christian tradition most targeted by straw men and false testimonies from other Christians for placing man in his rightful place of total vulnerability and dependence on God. Yes, I am a Catholic reformed by the Word of God.

[@SeanusAurelius]

Limited atonement pushes pretty hard against having the strongest view of mercy, IMO. I lean Lutheran.

[@EliB207]

This comes out on my Bday!!

[@mezke.official]

God Bless You Happy Bday ❤️‍🔥🙏✝️❤️

[@nine7702]

Omggg happy birthday

[@christianfillysecretagents4477]

Happy birthday!!!

[@TheScholarlyBaptist]

Happy birthday 🎊

[@fallenkingdom-zd8xh]

Happy birthday! How old are you turning?

[@thomasc9036]

That was actually pretty good. Correction on the predestination. Luther, Calvin, Bullinger, and other early Reformers view predestination in terms of who initiates the salvific grace. Nowadays, we always talk in terms of who is saved and who is not (man focused). Early Reformers were about God's char (God focused).

[@martijnnvermeulen7515]

That is really interesting. Do you have some materials I can read on this distinction?

[@thomasc9036]

@@martijnnvermeulen7515 Ryan Reeves who is a professor Gordon-Conwell Seminary has a KZbin channel. Search for "Luther and Calvin on Predestination". I like Zoomer and he is very knowledgeable. However, if you really want to learn theology, you should learn from pastors and professors (conservatives churches). That's why God gave "teachers/pastors" to the church as the Scripture teaches. While Zoomer is good, he is influenced by his New York Jewish upbringing. He focuses on non-essentials too much and too much of his opinions and misses the mark. Zoomer is good for introductory teaching but if you are really interested, search for those who are pastors/teachers.

[@VTdarkangel]

The biggest gripe I have with Calvinism is the idea of the elect. I've always believed much more that anyone can be saved, but that person must choose to accept it. Some could call this a radical free will view. My view is we are all corrupted, but there is a part in all of us that can see that and, therefore, we can choose to pursue Christ. The path to justification and sanctification is open to all, but the individual must choose to walk down it.

[@shaddjimenez4524]

Read Romans 9!

[@BurgerBoyda3rd]

​@@shaddjimenez4524Takeoff your Calvinist goggles and read Romans 9😂

[@StudioBasili]

You can only be saved through God’s grace.

[@GoDawgs-nh1kp]

It’s a matter of perspective. From our earthly and chronological point of view, anyone indeed can be saved because we can’t possibly comprehend who are the elect and why. Only from God’s eternally existent, outside-of-time, POV do the elect exist. So any half-decent Presbyterian would never give up on someone as simply not being one of the chosen. Because to us (not to God) the future hasn’t happened yet, thus, everyone could potentially be graced by God at any point in the future. Not my best explanation, but hope it helps🫡

[@jackboehm8408]

@@GoDawgs-nh1kp Exactly bro, thank you

[@KobeG24]

I found the TULIP and PEACE slide very helpful in my understanding of those points. Thanks Zoomer!

[@TonyKalashnikov]

Great video as always, blessings and greetings from Dutch Reformed

[@fallenkingdom-zd8xh]

As a Catholic, I have notifications on for when this premieres! Also, what’s your opinion of Eucharistic Adoration/Procession? We literally worship the Eucharist.

[@averagecroat196]

@@ProtAmericanz st paul would not agree with you bro

[@TrueCatholic697]

Same with me

[@fallenkingdom-zd8xh]

@@TrueCatholic697Nice pfp. I see you have the Catholic seal Zoomer made!

[@mattd398]

@@fallenkingdom-zd8xh Why must there be an agreement with St. Paul?

[@2411509igwt]

@@mattd398 Probably because he was inspired by the Holy Spirit, that's a big incentive right there.

[@TrueCatholic697]

I can't wait to see the Presbyterian Videoo

[@noahtylerpritchett2682]

Any plans on doing Anglicanism, Methodism, the Armenian church, the Coptic Church? Etc the rest

[@rooderoo12]

As a Dutch Reformed guy myself, well done.

[@SirMicahBroch]

You should make a video on some of the unsung heroes of the reformation like Oecolampadius, Bucer, and Vermigli. As always, great video Zoomer

[@JenniferoftheSea]

You forgot the RCUS.💀 It is one of the oldest Reformed denominations in the States predating what became the PCUSA by 60 some years. Love the videos!

[@cassidyanderson3722]

Calvinism created societies so intellectual that they ultimately concluded that God doesn’t exists, or Christian morality is relative The overwhelming majority of Calvinists today support women’s ordination and gay marriage and are buried in humanistic rationalism (which makes sense considering Calvin himself was a humanist).

[@cabriniryanvu]

Not in defense of Calvin but humanism at that time was not secular like today. It was Renaissance humanism which was pretty much Christian-based classical studies. Erasmus was a great humanist and moderate reformer, unlike Luther, Zwingli and Calvin.

[@cassidyanderson3722]

@@cabriniryanvu How would “renaissance humanism” differ from secular humanism. While humanists of the past may have professed Christianity, the rationalism employed by humanists of all stripes is the same - that’s what defines them as humanists. And it’s that - their rationalism - that the Church has always found incompatible with the Christian faith.

[@troyhare6312]

A liberal calvinist is an oxymoron. They may claim the title Reformed, but their doctrine proves that the claim is just a facade.

[@isaacsandoval9316]

Yes, let us all be anti-intellectual idiots. Or you can just realize those liberals aren't even real Christians.

[@SeanusAurelius]

Name a branch of Christianity that isn't dealing with mass apostasy and indifference. Catholicism? Look at France and Ireland. Lutheranism? Look at Sweden. Baptists? The USA. Calvinists? Scotland. Anglicans? England. Orthodoxy? Greece (yeah, it's got single digit percentages of actual belief in God and is starting to trend liberal *fast*. Don't get me started on the actual faith of Russians). I don't even like Calvinism but this is a silly objection.

[@blackswan7568]

9:18 "They're like geniuses, and I tutored them like geniuses! I LOVE THEM!!!" -Redeemed Zoomer, probably

[@MrGeoSim]

I think you need to speak to more Reformed Baptists. Everything you just explained would be heartily affirmed by my church. I mean, the LBC1689 is basically a carbon copy of the Westminster Confession.

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

Except the Baptist view of Baptism and Covenant Theology.

[@ikemeitz5287]

Came here to say this as well. The 1689 Baptist Confession affirms a huge amount of what he's saying in this video (especially about the sacraments). A gigantic number of Southern Baptists also affirm Covenant Theology. They just adhere closer to the biblical example of credobaptism. Also, Gavin Ortlund's channel has helped me a whole lot!

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

@@ikemeitz5287 1689 London Confession affirms a slightly different covenant theology than the Reformed. Infant Baptist has been seen as a fundamental issue for the Reformed Tradition. Whatsmore, the very few baptists church that affirm the 1689 London Confession also usually affirm the Philadelphia Confession, which affirms an explicitly memorial view of the Lord Supper. So,it is very rare, even among 1689 london Baptist, to find someone who affirms spiritual presence (Gavin Ortlund is an exception). And even among those, they never claimed to be part of the Reformed Tradition until 1980 during the New Calvinism movement.

[@palfizoltanlevente150]

Isn't the lower middle picture in 9:43 the Reformed church of Szilágyi Dezső square, Budapest, Hungary? Greetings from a Reformed Hungarian. God bless you! Edit: I looked up for it. It is.

[@lcs684]

Do Anglicanism next plz

[@thomasthellamas9886]

0:39 Bro just can’t admit Reformed baptists have more in common with him than Catholics 😂

[@MrAndyhdz]

Do you baptized babies? that's what I thought

[@DrGero15]

They were literally born out of the Calvinist Puritans. They take Calvinism to it's logical endpoint. Have you heard of the "Halfway Covenant"?

[@thomasthellamas9886]

@@DrGero15 yes sir!

[@DrGero15]

@@thomasthellamas9886 "If we have to wait for God to convert them to let them participate fully in the church, then why not wait to baptize them until after that happens?" - a Calvinist Puritan capable of logic, 12 seconds before starting a Baptist Church.

[@LTDLimiTeD1995]

@@DrGero15 I was raised baptist, but the more I learn about Reformed Tradition, I'm drawn to it for it's more rational, thoughtful foundation, and for it's lack of (IMO, downright evil) teachings like The Rapture and Dispensationalism which are common in Baptist/S.Baptist churches. Then they get to baptizing babies, and I'm just like... "WHY?"

[@juliansandoval3399]

I like your videos and think this is a great outlet for me to dive deeper into God’s word. The only thing that frustrates me with this video is usually you are very informational and explain what different Christians believe, but understandably, I feel like this was very defensive of Calvinism, and a ton of(Calvinism is not) comments instead of (Calvinism is) comments. I think I speak for most of us when I say that you do not have to prove anything to anybody. Just keep doing what you’re doing!

[@ShepherdGuyIsHere]

The Lamb at 7:23 is the closest we'll get to an Understanding Moravianism video

[@WittenbergScholastic]

this comment section is like the catholic catechesis-in-progression groups got early access to the video just to sperg about Calvinism. gotta give respect to the office of ecclesial soy, they really do use their resources lol

[@richdorak1547]

Very informative and thought provoking to this former Roman catholic turned Baptist . God bless you Brother.

[@JamesGaoist]

what's skibidi is that there's a lodge right next door to a local presby church. some presby cemetaries even have obelisks as gravestones on the church ground. skibidi ties from freemasonry in scottish history and presbyterianism. wild, and im a 5 pointer and see dat predestination.

[@bobsbobbs]

please do not ever use skibidi like that again

[@JamesGaoist]

@@bobsbobbs why? It’s linguistic

[@PloFilms]

im a baptist and i still need holy water to clean my eyes

[@ilauvu]

i honestly expected a 30 minute video

[@Anonymous-bj8nn]

2:38 was very helpful for helping me understand this, because I was starting to get confused because of the Lutheran videos saying that Irresistible Grace can't be true.

[@zuarbrincar769]

8:53 Curious how the territories of Protestant societies correspond closely with the territories of Germanic societies. Is there something in Germanic culture that attracts them to these traditions?

[@Israel.donovan]

Hey zoomer, love your videos. Would you consider posting on the podcast platforms for people who want to listen while driving or working?

[@Rivian_Jedi]

This confirms that I will never embrace Calvinism. The notion of double predestination means that God knowingly created most people without even the free choice to come to Him. It means He made most people to suffer eternally in hell. Meanwhile undee Catholic theology, indeed some are elected for salvation, but none are elected for damnation. You are free to choose or reject God.

[@HumbleRustic]

You believe in the same thing as the Calvinist does unless you’re an open theist. Hypothetical: Did God create blasphemous bob knowing he would go to hell? Yes he did. Why then would God create him knowing he would be dammed? Why did he just not create him? He was under no obligation to right ? You also believe in double predestination. I know you’ll say he loved us so much he gave us the choice. But if he’s so loving why did he not just not create the unbelievingly? Wouldn’t his love overridden their terrible choice? But no, God owes no man salvation. If God was fair, we’d all go to eternal punishment. For some he showed mercy to the others they received his justice. Read Romans 9 and then Ephesians 1

[@Rivian_Jedi]

@@HumbleRustic God is all knowing, so yes he knows what we will choose. That doesn't negate creating us with the ability to choose. It is not unjust to create someone who will willingly choose evil. It is unjust to create someone who has no choice but to be evil, and then punish them for it eternally.

[@HumbleRustic]

@@Rivian_JediUnbelievers have free will, not just libertarian free will. Man is dead in sin, not just sick. Man hates God , there must be a supernatural act of grace in order for him to be saved(Ephesians 2:1-10). But at the same time man is responsible for his sin and actions and will be judged accordingly. Read acts 4:27-28. How this all works we cannot truly understand. But scripture makes clear that God ordains the salvation of both the elect and non elect. Your arguments are exactly what Paul anticipated in Romans 9:19. Paul makes clear from an Old Testament analogy of the potter and the clay , that it is irrational and arrogant for men to question God’s choice of election and reprobation as for a piece of clay to question the purposes of the potter.

[@Rivian_Jedi]

@@HumbleRustic Saint Paul and Saint Peter make it clear that Christ came to save EVERYONE in 1 Timothy 2:4 and 2 Peter 3:9. However the saving Grace of God must be received and maintained by man. Matthew 19:16-30 and 25:31-46 make it quite clear that we need to cooperate with this salvation. In the proper context, Romans 9 is referring to God's unfolding plan in history. Not predetermining the fate of souls for eternity. Were I to accept Calvin's warped version of God, I would be accepting an imperfect deity. One who is in fact not all-loving. This view also immediately falls apart when we consider Adam and Eve. They were born free from Original Sin correct? So this would mean they had free will right? Does this mean that Adam and Eve were neither part of the elect or the unelected? Did they ever have the true choice to not take the fruit from the tree or was that predestined?

[@Rivian_Jedi]

@@HumbleRustic The letters of Paul and Peter as well as the Gospels make it clear that Christ came to save everyone, but we must receive His salvation and maintain it. In proper context Romans 9 is about God's plan of history, not the predestination of souls. Were I to accept Calvin's god, I would be accepting a false god. One who is not perfect, because he is not all-loving. Apparently this god of Calvin gave precisely two people in history the freedom to choose, and then created most other people to punish eternally.

[@Dfwnic]

I’m pretty new to theology.. this video almost made my head explode

[@DylanCampbell-tc9nm]

Outstanding video, Calvinism is based

[@planes3333]

Great videos, I learn a lot about the denominations from you. I am baptist but really I am more of a JEsus/CS Lewis christian.

[@RedeemedMusicanOfGod]

9:19 Star Wars! Luke was predestined to be the chosen one lol.

[@user-em7ig3lk7l]

Please mention Euler! The greatest mathematician of all time and devout Swiss Reformed

[@TheScholarlyBaptist]

Not Presbyterian tho.

[@redeemedzoomer6053]

I know I’m disappointed I forgot him

[@PloFilms]

@@TheScholarlyBaptistHes reformed. This video is about reformed tradition. Presbyterians are reformed

[@TheScholarlyBaptist]

@@PloFilms yeah I realized that after I commented lol. Also cool stop motions, I’m assuming you’re more of a prequels guy like me. God bless

[@donovangardner1325]

I'm a baptist who believes everything about calvinism (tulip) except your view of the sacraments. we still call ourselves reformed but aren't fully reformed

[@travisdestro870]

Would be cool if you could do a video contrasting each denomination’s views of something like evangelism? (Campus Minister here, so I’m curious how others think about the great commission/other evangelistic verses!)

[@KamaAnthem]

most followed denomination in Indonesia ✝️🇮🇩

[@kishascape]

Do Methodism next plz

[@AltKuyperian]

I will continue to say this until RZ recognizes the truth that Particular Baptists are more reformed than they are Baptist.

[@xdMatthewbx]

5:32 "Body/bood of Christ" I'm finding this way funnier than I probably should

[@lukas54cz71]

"Creating successful and intellectual societies" Also Calvinism: *gay*

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

Point to me where this exist in any Calvinism Confession of faith.

[@drewzinn779]

Gayness is the product of the fall, not Calvinist theology or any type of theology for that matter. LGBT Affirming individuals exist in every theological tradition including Roman Catholicism

[@lukas54cz71]

@@drewzinn779 Really? I haven't seen appointed officials supporting sodomy and gay marriage - they get excommunicated

[@HumbleRustic]

What a dumb response

[@lukas54cz71]

@@HumbleRustic No.

[@Profeowentprs]

Please do Methodism next!

[@chosenone2048]

Was that a Star Wars reference hidden in there?

[@virginlamo8202]

The Calvinist idea of the elect is messed up Sounds very Islamic

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

Not at all

[@Shiranu17]

A lot of Protestantism ends up regressing into things that sound like Islam. If I had to take a *purely* uneducated but slightly observant guess, it's largely because Islam itself is just a rip-off of Christianity and Judaism and knock-offs are going to have similar signs.

[@TheNabOwnzz]

How, exactly?

[@DrGero15]

@@TheNabOwnzz Islam has exactly the same teaching of Predestination and Election, as did the ancient Gnostics.

[@Rivian_Jedi]

Specifically, very Sunni. From what I understand, I think the Shia Muslims don't believe in double predestination.

[@AryanNaik1415]

Next one Pentecostal pls

[@danielkingsley7142]

Can you please make a video on the Methodist Church like this

[@joshs2138]

How can liberal churches be Calvinist? To be a liberal church, you have to have a low view of the bible and low view of a bible based church. So if Presbyterian is a Calvinist denomination, liberal churches should come up with their own denomination. But we do live in a time where you can call yourself anything and disregard the truth.

[@troyhare6312]

They're Reformed in name only.

[@martijnvandervelde2166]

Although 🇳🇱 The Netherlands is just a small country, there's a lot of 🌌 SPACE for ⚘️ TULIPs, because we're Calvinists.

[@Uknown__]

I dont understand calvinsism so hopefully this helps

[@TheScholarlyBaptist]

He has a whole series of mastering reformed theology. You should watch them. Or read Calvin’s institutes.

[@timcox9650]

Focus on the Bible and you’ll be fine.

[@Uknown__]

@@TheScholarlyBaptist thanks for the help!

[@Uknown__]

@@timcox9650 thanks for the help!

[@C0untFapula]

I don't completely understand the point of using those creeds or any creeds, for that matter. They basically state what's already in the Bible. I mean explicitly on pages, not inferred or deciphered. Also, TULIP still seems nonsensical to me. I still reject the notion that, if we were predestined to by saved or lost before the foundation of the world, that we should bother with evangelism or going to worship. God's grace is irresistible, you say? If that's true, then a person who was already predestined to be saved does not have to go to church, otherwise they can resist God's grace by not going. They also don't need anyone to reach them with the Gospel. They don't need the Gospel. Nobody does. If God wants you saved, you are. If God wants you lost, your are. Jesus died for NOTHING. That's what TULIP says. That's heresy. You made a statement that Calvinism doesn't deny that we have free will, then you instantly explain that it says that our will is so corrupted by sin that we can't choose God. That's called not having FREE will. So Calvinism does deny that we have free will. Also, you indicated that God won't change the hearts of everyone so that they can choose him "because if he did then everyone would believe." A: That isn't true because of sin and free will. B: Jesus and the Apostles all tell us to believe all throughout the new testament. C: How could it be bad if everyone believed, if not for that pesky little thing? You know that thing? It starts with a C or something. Uh. Calvinism! Yeah, that's the problem, not people having free will and choosing God. Just take that heresy out of the way and then it all makes sense suddenly. You have, of course said that those who were predestined simply won't completely fall away, they may go through a time of disobedience, but because of Preservation of the saints, they'll come back eventually. Calvin and people who believe his words don't realize that what they're doing is over thinking it. It need not be that way, so why would it be? Why, scripturally, can it not be that those who believe can be saved if they continue to follow the instructions left by Jesus, through the apostles? God never once wasted his time or energy, even though he has unlimited power. What Calvinism says is that God wastes his power and time. It also makes God a very bad dude. He's not a bad dude.

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

As Chapter 1 of the Westminster Confession of Faith states, we do not believe that for a doctrine to be biblical, it needs to be explicitly expressed in scripture. If that were the case, we would not believe in the doctrine of the Trinity, for example. The Creeds and Confessions are a systematization of what is in the scriptures and which the Reformed Church has historically accepted as a faithful representation of biblical teaching. They serve as a useful consensus for teaching and as a reference for biblical reading. Precisely because we believe in the perspicuity of Scripture, we accept that other Christians throughout history have reached a correct understanding of it. Regarding TULIP and Evangelism, we believe that God acts through means, which we call means of grace (the Word, whether written or preached, the sacraments, and prayer). God chose visible means to communicate His invisible grace. Therefore, the Church and evangelism are means used by God to spread His grace. Additionally, we do not know who the elect are spread throughout the world, and the Church is responsible before God for spreading the Word. Therefore, we evangelize because we believe that God uses us for this purpose, we believe that we will be held accountable (punished or rewarded) for our service to God, and we believe that the elect, when they have contact with the means of grace, will believe at some point. The Reformed Church has a very strong tradition of missions (perhaps the strongest alongside the Catholic and Baptist traditions). Interestingly, the claim that Reformed theology devalues ​​evangelism does not match the historical evidence. Finally, Calvinists do not deny free will in the sense that man has the freedom to make his own decisions, except in accepting God. I chose the shirt I wore and to drive to church today. I am not a puppet in the hands of God. Chapter 3 of the Westminster Confession states that the freedom of secondary causes has not been annulled and no force is exerted on the consciences of creatures. However, repentance and faith in God are only possible if God regenerates the heart, which is clearly a biblical teaching.

[@Mic1904]

"I don't completely understand the point of using those creeds or any creeds, for that matter." You will never encounter a single situation in your Christian life wherein you are not adhering to or professing some kind of creed. Your very presence here, stating this belief about creeds, is itself a creed.

[@alangivre2474]

Why does God chooses to not save some people? Not even free will. It sounds like we are his puppets.

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

Read Romans 9.

[@shaddjimenez4524]

God is all-knowing

[@HumbleRustic]

Read acts 4:27-28.

[@TolzXaarghaart]

To paraphrase Romans 9:18; "because he wanna"

[@jahnvantuttlesma8215]

The better question is "Why does God save anybody?" The gospel if offered to all, but because of our spiritual state only those who have been regenerated by the Holy Spirit can possibly believe. I dead man can't rise from the dead on his own, regardless of what medical care is avaliable. A proper doctrine of both God and man is needed in order to understand election.

[@sunkissedprincess]

Bravo, young padawan.

[@Alden-Smith]

Very interesting thank you for the video

[@Thatoneguy-pu8ty]

Jesus 🗿✝️👑

[@mezke.official]

Based 🔥🙏✝️❤️‍🔥

[@timboslice980]

Calvinism is like a house of cards. Its a very elaborate theology based on a few biblical principles but it’s foundations are based on extremely contradictory concepts. For instance, PSA turns the father against the son but they affirm the trinity. How can god be set against god even temporarily? Christ wept for Jerusalem saying it was because they would not choose him. Imagine the potter weeping for vessels he made for the garbage and as he was throwing them away he was weeping and blaming the pot for not choosing to be a vessel worth keeping? Lastly Calvin said god is in no way the author of sin and is responsible for no evil. He also said god decrees all evil and sin, for Calvin this is a central mystery. He could not reconcile this in any logical fashion but concluded this must be true because he would not accept a different theology. Did god cause adam to sin? Was adam the last man to have free will? The calvinist is free to espouse either position but cannot reconcile them. Either god caused the fall or allowed it to happen. If he caused/decreed the fall then humans cannot be truly responsible for their sins. If the unelect can do nothing to avoid hell, how can they be at fault? If the elect can do nothing to avoid heaven, whats the point of them choosing to do good works? Calvinism falls apart on every doctrine when you really think about each one. The point is they like to feel like they have superior theology but really its a facade based on inconsistent interpretation of scripture. One more, Calvins view of the eucharist is totally illogical and he himself couldnt really explain it’s nature. He believed in real presence but not in transubstantiation or con substantiation. He never really articulated how christ is present, just that he is. Calvin basically built a complicated theology on a handful of passages taken out of context. When the rest of scripture is brought to bear, it simply reinterprets clear passages or ignores them to maintain the theology.

[@DrGero15]

Exactly, I would add that in their attempt to raise God and lower man they horseshoed back around and made God the only sinner and freed man of his responsibility for evil. Calvinism is pseudo-intellectual.

[@timboslice980]

@@DrGero15 amen! You can’t take such contrary and extreme positions and then claim you have the truth. The thing is St Paul only talks about the elect as people who choose to remain in christ. God saves that person but it has to be their choice. With calvinism god is the only one making choices that pertain to salvation. They grasp at straws and prooftext scripture, they’ll say see! Our good deeds are as filthy rags but fail to see how that passage praises good deeds as well. Only through context can you understand why those people’s good deeds were as filthy rags and why other’s good deeds were praised. The calvinist just ignores the praise part, focuses on the negative part, applies it to everyone, and then uses it to bolster their theology. This is the worst part of calvinism if you ask me, it’s complete nonchalance when it comes to harmonizing scripture. The reason? Simple. It would cause them to abandon their broken theology.

[@DrGero15]

@@timboslice980 Indeed. The most logical and consistent ones become Baptist. There is no way to split Baptism into two different things which are separated by time and have a good reason to say that it saves or that you should do it to children. Have you heard of the Halfway Covenant?

[@timboslice980]

@@DrGero15 No tell me more. Is that like pre augustinians?

[@DrGero15]

@@timboslice980 No it is Puritan, you can read a brief overview here : en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-Way_Covenant

[@trentholio]

I encouraged them. I encouraged them all to study theology and the bible. And not just the men, but the women and the children too.

[@konstantintheodosius8685]

Ok, this is quality content.

[@zoedevvv]

9:19 ha...i understood that reference

[@654_nosneb]

9:15 I have predestined to hell, all of them. And not just the men, but the women and the children too. 😂

[@Robert_Sparkman_03]

"Rapture" depends on how you define the word. I Th 4:17 uses the phrase "caught up" (Greek harpazo, Latin rapturo). So, there is an event that occurs which could properly be called a "rapture"....however it is not the event that dispensationalists call the rapture, which allegedly occurs 7 years before Christ's return. I believe it is talking about the glorification and "catching up" of the living righteous at Christ's return to meet Him in the air.

[@ChristosisCardinalis]

You're (deliberately?) conflating all premillenials with dispensationalists

[@MrAndyhdz]

There's a strong correlation between the two

[@lunarpanda77]

@@MrAndyhdz Historic Premillennials are not dispensationalist. A whole new eschatological stance called Dispensational Premillennialism needed to be created for them.

[@hermanessences]

What do Calvinists believe about damnation? Is it extreme torture for all eternity, like an actual lake of fire, or worse? That's horrible in and of itself, and even more so if you believe that God created people to be sent there, with no real chance of escaping it (determinism). That's why many critics have rightfully pointed out that Calvinism portrays God as worse than the devil.

[@lanesmith1465]

How? Do you have the same criticism of the Passover in Exodus? If not, why? It's fundamentally the same exact thing.

[@hermanessences]

@@lanesmith1465 You mean that God hardened Pharaoh's heart? Well, he didn't burn him for eternity.

[@Socrates-apologist]

Here’s Paul’s response: “What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there? May it never be! For He says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” So then it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I raised you up, to demonstrate My power in you, and that My name might be proclaimed throughout the whole earth.” So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires. You will say to me then, “Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?” On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, “Why did you make me like this,” will it? Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use? What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction? And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory, even us, whom He also called, not from among Jews only, but also from among Gentiles.” ‭‭Romans‬ ‭9‬:‭14‬-‭24‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

[@hermanessences]

@@Socrates-apologist That's not "Paul's response", that is something Paul said which you assume is a reference to the Calvinistic view.

[@Socrates-apologist]

@@hermanessences Fair enough. For the record, I was not trying to be rude. What I will say is, the helpful thing about Paul in this chapter of Romans is that he gives us the response that he expects to hear from the reader. This is helpful for us to interpret it correctly, because if your interpretation of Paul here does not match the objection that Paul raises, then the odds are that you’re not interpreting it correctly.

[@NisalLiyanage-i9e]

He just blocked me rn blaming me as a papist and cursing me.//////////

[@Tyde343]

hey RZ, important question for you. How do I know if my theological beliefs are biased and not really mine? Im a little worried that everything I believe as a new Christian isnt what I really think. any advice?

[@lunarpanda77]

Speak to your pastor and elders. RZ is not a proper spiritual authority to direct these types of questions to.

[@PloFilms]

Lunar Panda is right. Also, Read the Bible.

[@ikemeitz5287]

Your theological views probably ARE biased if you're a new Christian! But you have the Holy Spirit in you and God's word through which he works. God promises that he will "sanctify us in truth," so trust him and learn about him, and let him guide you based on what the text says. It's also worth talking to the leaders in your church about this. They're, ideally, going to be able to show you how their beliefs come from God's word. A study of hermeneutics (how to read the Bible and understand it) is also super helpful! Ask your pastor about some authors he trusts.

[@CKR000]

Orthodox and catholics will say : just talk to the priest man.

[@TheScholarlyBaptist]

Reformed baptists are reformed!!!!!!!!!

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

Not they are not and this term only started to exist 40 years ago.

[@TheScholarlyBaptist]

@@pedroguimaraes6094 ever heard of the 1689 London Baptist confession of faith. Idc if the term only started 40 years ago it is simply a literary expression not of doctrinal significance

[@drewzinn779]

Agreed

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

@@TheScholarlyBaptist Baptist that believe in the 1689 Confession never claimed to be part of the Reformed Tradition and they called themselves "Particular Baptist". The term "Reformed Baptist" and the Baptist association with the Reformed Churches started 40 years ago during the " New Calvinism" movement. And the 1689 LCF don't have the same theology of the sacraments and the same covenant theology as the Reformed Churches.

[@SirMicahBroch]

No you are not. Reformed does not refer to an idea of predestination. They have always referred to themselves as baptists.

[@nikul_thedisciple]

I might convert to Presbyterianism as a Catholic

[@JESUS_Saves3747]

The Roman Catholic Church contends that its origin is the death, resurrection, and ascension of Jesus Christ in approximately AD 30. The Catholic Church proclaims itself to be the church that Jesus Christ died for, the church that was established and built by the apostles. Is that the true origin of the Catholic Church? On the contrary. Even a cursory reading of the New Testament will reveal that the Catholic Church does not have its origin in the teachings of Jesus or His apostles. In the New Testament, there is no mention of the papacy, worship/adoration of Mary (or the immaculate conception of Mary, the perpetual virginity of Mary, the assumption of Mary, or Mary as co-redemptrix and mediatrix), petitioning saints in heaven for their prayers, apostolic succession, the ordinances of the church functioning as sacraments, infant baptism, confession of sin to a priest, purgatory, indulgences, or the equal authority of church tradition and Scripture. So, if the origin of the Catholic Church is not in the teachings of Jesus and His apostles, as recorded in the New Testament, what is the true origin of the Catholic Church? For the first 280 years of Christian history, Christianity was banned by the Roman Empire, and Christians were terribly persecuted. This changed after the “conversion” of the Roman Emperor Constantine. Constantine provided religious toleration with the Edict of Milan in AD 313, effectively lifting the ban on Christianity. Later, in AD 325, Constantine called the Council of Nicea in an attempt to unify Christianity. Constantine envisioned Christianity as a religion that could unite the Roman Empire, which at that time was beginning to fragment and divide. While this may have seemed to be a positive development for the Christian church, the results were anything but positive. Just as Constantine refused to fully embrace the Christian faith but continued many of his pagan beliefs and practices, so the Christian church that Constantine and his successors promoted progressively became a mixture of true Christianity and Roman paganism. Following are a few examples: Most Roman Catholic beliefs and practices regarding Mary are completely absent from the Bible. Where did those beliefs come from? The Roman Catholic view of Mary has far more in common with the Isis mother-goddess religion of Egypt than it does with anything taught in the New Testament. Interestingly, the first hints of Catholic Mariology occur in the writings of Origen, who lived in Alexandria, Egypt, which happened to be the focal point of Isis worship. The Lord’s Supper being a consumption of the literal body and blood of Jesus is not taught in the Bible. The idea that bread and wine are miraculously transformed into the literal body and blood of Jesus (transubstantiation) is not biblical. However, several ancient pagan religions, including Mithraism, which was very popular in the Roman Empire, had some form of “theophagy” (the eating of one’s god) as a ritualistic practice. Roman Catholicism has “saints” one can pray to in order to gain a particular blessing. For example, Saint Gianna Beretta Molla is the patron saint of fertility. Francis of Assisi is the patron saint of animals. There are multiple patron saints of healing and comfort. Nowhere is even a hint of this taught in Scripture. Just as the Roman pantheon of gods had a god of love, a god of peace, a god of war, a god of strength, a god of wisdom, etc., so the Catholic Church has a saint who is “in charge” over each of these and many other categories. Many Roman cities had a god specific to the city, and the Catholic Church provided “patron saints” for cities as well. The idea that the Roman bishop is the vicar of Christ, the supreme leader of the Christian Church, is utterly foreign to the Word of God. The supremacy of the Roman bishop (the papacy) was created with the support of the Roman emperors. While most other bishops (and Christians) resisted the idea of the Roman bishop being supreme, the Roman bishop eventually rose to supremacy, again, due to the power and influence of the Roman emperors. After the western half of the Roman Empire collapsed, the popes took on the title that had previously belonged to the Roman emperors-Pontifex Maximus. Many more examples could be given. These four should suffice in demonstrating the origin of the Catholic Church. Of course, the Roman Catholic Church denies the pagan origin of its beliefs and practices. The Catholic Church disguises its pagan beliefs under layers of complicated theology and church tradition. Recognizing that many of its beliefs and practices are utterly foreign to Scripture, the Catholic Church is forced to deny the authority and sufficiency of Scripture. The origin of the Catholic Church is the tragic compromise of Christianity with the pagan religions that surrounded it. Instead of proclaiming the gospel and converting the pagans, the Catholic Church “Christianized” the pagan religions and “paganized” Christianity. By blurring the differences and erasing the distinctions, the Catholic Church made itself attractive to the idolatrous people of the Roman Empire. One result was the Catholic Church becoming the supreme religion in the Roman world for centuries. However, another result was the most dominant form of Christianity apostatizing from the true gospel of Jesus Christ and the true proclamation of God’s Word. Second Timothy 4:3-4 declares, “For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.”

[@OVOFloyd]

@@JESUS_Saves3747Holy cope 😂😂

[@HumbleRustic]

The comment section on this should be a fantastical thread of many straw men arguments/ philosophizing/ isogesis/ emotionalism/and straight up ignorance from the Reformed Derangement Syndrome folks!! 🍿

[@MrAndyhdz]

Exactly.

[@HumbleRustic]

@@MrAndyhdzI’m looking at it now, and oh man , the Reformed Deranged Syndrome folks are out in full force. They really are just like the trump derangement syndrome liberals. Maybe even worse.

[@stephenderks1209]

its the most "how can i force scripture to fit into a theology i made up" centric theology

[@HackManJay]

wait, this isn't about catholics!

[@lanesmith1465]

Why would anyone force it to fit the most uncomfortable doctrines?

[@TheBanjoShowOfficial]

@@lanesmith1465because it’s not uncomfortable to those who already believe they are saved

[@troyhare6312]

Not even remotely.

[@troyhare6312]

​@TheBanjoShowOfficial They are definitely still uncomfortable doctrines. They buck up against the flesh and human pride.

[@holdenennis]

7:40 in Scotland, Switzerland, and the Netherlands, where Presbyterians/Reformists took over from the Catholic Church during the Reformation, did they destroy the Catholic stain-glassed windows and also statues and relics?

[@guavaguy4397]

As a Catholic I find predestination so confusing. Does it mean that you can be a good Christian all your life but you will screw up in the end or does it mean that you are inherently bad?

[@pedroguimaraes6094]

Actually, if you don’t believe in the doctrine of predestination, what would happen is exactly what you mentioned: salvation would depend on you and your choices, and since you are a sinner, that’s not something very good, right? Now, if salvation depends on God and this God wants your good and is trustworthy, then you can live without panic. Redeemed Zoomer did a series called "Mastering Reformed Theology," and in Chapter 6, he explains in greater detail what we mean by Predestination (i also recommend Chapter 5 about the Sacraments). Basically, we believe that human nature is completely corrupted by sin. This doesn’t mean that we are as bad as we could be, since God limits our evil and grants us what we call "common grace." Nevertheless, all of our being (body, will, desires, and thoughts) is inclined toward sin and is an enemy of God. Therefore, if God were only just, He would send all of us to hell. However, in His mercy, He chose to save humanity, by sending His beloved Son to die for us and regenerating our will to believe in Him and unite us spiritually with Him through faith, by His saving grace. So, some are saved by God's mercy, while others simply receive His justice. Those who God chose will definitively believe at some point of their lives and will persist in the faith until the end. However we shouldn’t speculate about our own election or that of others. So what should I, as a Christian, do? We must be united with Christ. And this union occurs normatively through the Sacraments and the other means of grace (God's Word and Prayer). By being united with Christ, we will inevitably be sanctified and bear fruit, which will only further reassure us of our salvation. So, essentially, while predestination is an important doctrine and, when well understood, comforting, the center of Reformed Christian life is in union with Christ through the means of grace. That's why it is important to have a higher view of the sacraments.

[@crownwire7468]

"Calvinism...is the most God-centered form of Christianity." The absolute confidence these heretics have when making baseless claims like this is hilarious

[@TheNabOwnzz]

Nevertheless it's quite true.

[@shaddjimenez4524]

What do you say is heretical about Reformed

[@MrAndyhdz]

God the father centric he meant.

[@crownwire7468]

@@shaddjimenez4524 They reject the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church, and replaced it with man made doctrines where everyone can freely interpret scripture however they see fit without an authority passed down through apostolic succession. The irony of Zoomer wanting to “reconquista” Protestant churches when they’re just being reformers

[@HumbleRustic]

@@crownwire7468like the bodily assumption of Mary, the immaculate conception, indulgences, holy water, not eating meat on Fridays, nuns and monks, the rosary, last rites, celibacy. I could go on

[@mjgtmkme123salternate]

Atleast you didn't make any offensive messages.

[@elijahroffaell2124]

Oriental Orthodox next!

[@mommytheape]

Yeah! All Presbyterians come together!

[@katieharwood9189]

Sorry if this has already been asked and answered, Zoomer, but would you recommend Robert Shaw's book The Reformed Faith?