Varnish and Epoxy~ a Professional Wood Finish for Teak Part1

Part 1 of a tutorial showing a modern take on an old maritime tradition; varnishing. This episode covers the materials and process necessary for getting a wood finish that will make anyone say "Damn, now THAT'S nice...."

[@leebonifay5767]

This guy does the BEST instructional videos

[@dondonofrio621]

it is such a pleasure watching your shows

[@boatworkstoday]

Thanks for the kind words! If you're using epoxy and glass on the pontoons the bottom paint won't really add anymore water-proofing protection. The main purpose of bottom paint is to help prevent things from growing and sticking to the hull. The level of fouling in the water you'll be using the boat will determine the best kind of paint to use. A good starting point would be to look around the marina's to see what others are using and see how well it works. Hope this helps!

[@richardberryhill718]

Nice video! I've varnished boats since around 1958 and worked on some of the best yachts on the West Coast, but never used epoxy so wanted to learn. Impressed by the West System and nice to learn that epoxy is first then varnish. CAUTION TO VIEWERS: ACETONE IS DANGEROUSLY FLAMMABLE, NEVER USE AROUND ANY FLAME, WATER HEATER, SPARK, IT WILL EXPLODE!

[@boatworkstoday]

Well, I guess I have nothing else to say; sounds like you know all there is to know about refinishing brightwork. I do have to ask though, if my videos are so poor and lacking vital info then why does West System post my vids on their FaceBook page and refer their customers to my site for proper instruction? Hmm, I have to wonder if all the times you "found out the hard way" if maybe you were just doing it wrong? Guess I'll never know.. Please feel free to show me how it's done.

[@Living_Lodka]

I will be using this method on my bow pulpit on my 88 sea ray 300 weekender. its a nice teak piece.

[@boatworkstoday]

I haven't but I talk with the tech guys from West System a fair amount. Their suggestion was that oil stains would probably be hit or miss on the adhesion of the epoxy, but water or alcohol based stains would work well. Something along the lines of TransTint (you'll have to Google it :-) This might be a good follow up video for this Winter? Thanks for the comment!

[@johnwasielewski7011]

Does the epoxy varnish combination work equally as well on mahogany?

[@boatworkstoday]

If done correctly the brightwork IS completely sealed (top and sides with epoxy and varnish and the bottom sealed with bedding compound). The small amount that the wood does expand and contract, the epoxy and topcoats move with it. Exterior brightwork typically does not have joinery with opposing grain patterns. If it does it is separated by a caulk seam to allow movement. As long as the grains run directionally as with lap joints, scarf joints, etc everything moves together w/ no issues

[@boatworkstoday]

@Darknights7 I'd still use acetone, without a clean dry surface the epoxy won't get a good bond. The 205 hardener will work just fine, but will darken the maple a bit. Are you making the boards or fixing them up?

[@Nauti-Nuff_Time]

Thank you for all the videos that you put out. You are probably one of the most informative channels on KZbin, hands down. I'm using this technique to refinish the wood on my Olympic Dolphin 23. But I'm running into a small issue that you did not touch on in this video. A lot of my surfaces are two-sided. How do you handle the line or the buildup on the bottom side?

[@boatworkstoday]

Usually compressed air to blow the dry dust off then tack rag, or solvent wipe with the varnish thinner (mineral spirits works as well) and tack rag.. In a pinch, clean water will work as well...

[@boatworkstoday]

@valeriemd2b Yes.. As far as adhesion this will work with all woods (some like teak that are oily require a little extra prep as outlined in the video). However I would test a scrap piece to make sure it gives the color and tone you're looking for when finished.

[@svsalserenity4375]

Just my 2 cents. I did this on my teak toe rail , it looked wonderful , but eventually the sun got to it and the epoxy failed and stated to lift . Took 5 years and im not in the tropics. Heres the hard part , try getting that epoxy off !!!! I went through two heat guns , this stuff is tenacious !!! It dosent sand you have to strip it with a heat gun and it is slow going! The toe rail I did on the other side of the boat I did with just a polyurethane clearcoat. Imron Elite actually . over reduced for the first coat and then just three coats after that . This stuff is tough and very high UV protection. But it started to fail in about the same time period . The difference here is , and its a big one , a quick sand with 180 around the failing areas and recoat , you dont have to remove it all just the places that era giving up . Its sand easy !! no heat gun and it dosent discolor the wood like the epoxy did , it went very dark .

[@salbal777]

Thank you for advice it works fine.

[@boatworkstoday]

Yup. Many kayak and paddle board manufacturers will do this to provide a layer of protection. You can sand and repair scratches in FG; you're pretty much hosed if you try to do this directly on CF

[@legend343]

Just found your channel... it's great thanks..

[@boatworkstoday]

Yes on the sanding between every coat (320 - 400 grit) and depending on the size of the area you're finishing a little thinner (10% or so) will give you a bit more working time before you lose the wet edge for blending. With poly, apply thin coats as it can have a tendency to run. Foam brushes work well with this...

[@boatworkstoday]

The first coat will look a little rough, but the 2nd coat of epoxy will flow out like a sheet of glass :-) If it's not curing there are likely 1 of 2 things going on. Mixing ratio: the West System 207 hardener is mixed with the resin 3:1 (3 parts resin to 1 part 207. Also temperature. I believe the minimum temp for this hardener is around 65F.. Hope this helps!

[@tateabney5557]

I love your vids man!

[@jdgunner75]

Very helpful, I am doing my first strip build Adirondack guide boat and about to do the first coat of varnish. I appreciate you sharing your experiences and look forward to seeing more from you.

[@JoelSimbrow]

Cheers. you the man! not sure how, but will try to share photos of results with you once the bar is done up. did I mention we're in Shangrila, Yunnan province China?? welcome any time for free drinks and tour!!!

[@eskashoo]

Thanks for the videos.

[@EastteakFineHardwoods]

Great video!

[@rootsofone]

Much appreciated!

[@russellcole3549]

If you would like to use epoxy to create a mat (rather than glossy) undercoat you can wipe it on/off with a cloth, so that the epoxy absorbs into the underlying food fiber without building on the surface to the point it starts to show and look slick/glossy. I did this with some floor hatches which, because they were inside the cabin and were not going to be exposed to sunlight, did not need a U.V. layer such as varnish in addition to the west system epoxy.

[@paulmryglod4802]

I just finished 3 coats epoxy in a day, followed by 6 coats varnish over 6 days. takes for ever, but looks great.

[@Melo.0111]

paul mryglod wich varnish with high UV protection it is the best to cover resin? Don’t crack?

[@boatworkstoday]

@Darknights7 You would just have to buy the 207 hardener; the 205 does not cure clear. The 105 resin is what you need. As well, you'll need some acetone, sandpaper, and west system rollers and / or chip brushes to apply the epoxy..

[@damen6914]

Good afternoon Andy, I would like to thank you for your fantastic videos. I have learned so much by watching all of your videos. I'm hoping you can answer this question for me. I have an Egg Harbor with teak gunwale caps and I would like to try this technique to finish them. However, I'd rather not remove the teak from the boat. If I were to finish the top and sides of the wood in this way and then run a bead of sealant along the wood to the fiberglass to stop moisture from entering the unfinished bottom of the wood. Do you think I would run into problems with moisture getting under the finish? Thank you in advance, Damen

[@rjacksonr1]

Great videos and a great help. how long would you expect this to last on a boat and what happens in the future if it starts to peel?

[@boatworkstoday]

@Darknights7 Good luck! Happy to help!

[@tarpon22]

Great video, thanks for posting it. Have you refinished any wood that was finished in this manor? How much more difficult would it be to remove the epoxy coat one it failed.

[@pwijland]

Hiya Andy, If I'll use this method will this also strenghten the wood. Thanks and keep up the good work with your video's Cheers, Patrick

[@boatworkstoday]

Labor rate depends on a few things. Your area, level of experience, operating costs (insurance) and reputation. It's a fairly difficult thing to just jump into without references. But a starting point would be to contact a few of the local marinas and ask what their labor rate is for brightwork finishers and check to see what their liability requirements are for outside contractors to work in their yards. :-)

[@mileslapeyre6457]

Great video, super helpful! Going to follow this process on my 15' whaler's Teak benches. Do you have a nonskid recommendation for varnished teak wood? I've seen some people use a course salt after the last coat and then wash off... We used soft sand around other areas but want to keep the clear finish of the varnish here. Thanks again for the great videos

[@doitbobsdguajardo1045]

Great video, thanks for doing this. My question is, would you recommend this for a toe rail on a sailboat. Ours is teak and lots of it, 46' boat. I wondered if using epoxy as a base would cause any problems down the road if we had to go to bare wood again? We bought this boat recently and the finish is down to bare wood in spots, other spots it was good. We used a heat gun to remove the old finish and it wasn't too bad. Will the epoxy come off with a heat gun as well if we ever had to do that again? I would prefer to just maintain the varnish top coats but thought I should ask before making the decision to go varnish or use the varnish / epoxy technique you describe here.

[@Charlies644]

Bloody heck! Look how young you look in this!

[@rootsofone]

Thank you for your wonderful instructional tutorials. I am doing a white oak topped outdoor dinning table with a red oak base.; there will be no roof overhead to protect it from the weather. I am wondering if your application of epoxy and then a high gloss extra uv epifane (maybe 4 coats) would be the most durable finish? I have also considered using a fiberglass finish over epoxy. Your thoughts are much appreciated.

[@robertstafford1302]

Love the video. Very instructive. Can I use Cetol Marine finish over the epoxy for similar results to your's?

[@hotttt28]

Love it

[@ksjdhg]

Great job explaining this, and you do great work. Do you use a drum sander for wood prep, and if so which ones do you like? Cheers

[@boatworkstoday]

One of the tricks with using this system is that the wood should not warm as the epoxy is curing. As the temp of the wood increases (either from being in the sun, heat lamps or air temp) it 'gasses out' which creates the bubbles. Best thing is to do this indoors in the shade, or after the temp has peaked for the day and is starting to cool. Give this a shot and the bubble issue should not happen :-) After everything has cured it's no longer an issue..

[@azoresmarine]

Great job thank you. You say do not use acetone after final wipe down of the epoxy, so how do you clean the surface after sanding each varnish coat. Thanks

[@sv.scintilla]

I liked this idea so much I did it 40 years ago. It lasted six months before water got under the epoxy at a joint in the teak and caused it to lift the epoxy up ruining the finish. Then I realized the mistake as it was darn near impossible to remove the epoxy finish and go back to varnish. With natural varnish I used to use `12-16 coats. With urethane I use half that many. If you put two coats on a year and do spot repairs a good varnish job will last 10 years. I would like to see you do a test sample and throw it out in the sun for ten years to see how this holds up. If the new epoxies last that long....or longer... even with tune-up yearly coats. this technique would be worth it. If it does not, removing the epoxy if it must come off prematurely will make this totally not worth it.

[@caliwator]

I agree with you. If the epoxy cracks some time it will be a paint to fix it.

[@boatworkstoday]

@ihsan2011 Hey, thanks! If the 'image' is going to be exposed to sunlight, then it needs to have some other type of coating on top of the epoxy (with UV absorbers) to prevent dis-colorization (yellowing). If it is something that is going to be kept indoors (out of sunlight) then just using the epoxy itself will give a clear, non-yellowing appearance. The background colors should come through very clear with little / no change over time :-)

[@Melo.0111]

BoatworksToday what can I use on top of the resin? Thank you

[@kevinsweeney5836]

Not sure if it was the high heat but mine completely blistered off a year later. I used Boatworks for the first time, always used West in the past.

[@valeriemd2b]

@boatworkstoday Cool. Thanks I'll go ahead and try that. Keep up the good work :)

[@kellyg1019]

Great Job!! I will use this method on my boat. My question is the teak that is outside the boat is weathered and faded. Inside the cabin still has a nice deep color to it. I am striving to have it all match. Should I do a teak stain on the outside pieces prior to this process? There has been some teak "restorer" product applied inside, any special prep work other than a good 220 sanding?? Thanks again!

[@FreedomSalon1]

Andy - Should I use this technique on my teak and holly sole in my saloon? I have used on my brightwork and it seems to hold up pretty well. I does seem to have failed at a few joints after one year on the Penobscott. Thanks.

[@boatworkstoday]

Epoxy as a base would offer good protection, but may be a little pricey. Also, using a high gloss finish for the topcoat (varnish) may not be the best choice. Varnish is relatively soft for 'working surfaces' like table tops, chairs, etc. It will scratch easily and being a high gloss EVERY imperfection will stand out like a sore thumb. Exterior finishes are tricky trying to find a balance between protection and appearance. I'd look at Sikkens stains or decking products w/ UV protection :-)

[@boatworkstoday]

Unfortunately I do not have a drum sander and I've never used one (although my shoulders wish that I did sometimes). So not much help there.. I typically run the wood through my planer, a light sanding with some 180 - 220 and it's ready for finishing :-)

[@blindekuh8891]

Andy, very interesting video. Did things change in the last 7 years? One big question I'm looking for anwers: Why varnish on the epoxy? UV - hardness - gloss -> what is it? There are some yachtbuilders (e.g. Fleming) offering epoxy coating as the best, for a lot of money - do they also varnish at the end? Have to do some wood planks and handrails this winter and wonder, what the best way would be ...

[@airwolf61970]

This might be a little if topic but I figure your the guy who can help. Question: I want to use red oak as a rudder for my Chrysler buccaneer. The reason is. I've never made one before, and the wood is a little cheaper and I like the grain pattern. But I know white oak would be better. A freind told me to shellac the rudder. Because the wood is going to move and expand and contract and shellac would be better. The rudder will not ever stay in the water unless I'm useing it. Maybe a weekend. Is this good advice? Or would you do this different. My rudder blade is 39" long, and around 91/2 wide roughly. And the wood is not quarter sawn. Thanks for all your videos.

[@ksjdhg]

Cool - have you tried epoxy over stain? I've always been afraid to try it, for fear of lack of adhesion or reaction between the two in the case of oil stain.

[@guelo757]

I know you like your Pettit products. If using Pettit 2018 cear sealer, do you sand down untill there are no shiny spots? don't know how hard to sand. I'm asking everyone for advice... thank you, great vids and comments

[@JoelSimbrow]

Hi Andy.....much thanks again for the lesson. We're doing teak bar top and shelves in our bar. Question: do you use 220 grit in between the Epoxy coats? (also..any recommendation as to what grit to sand the wood to before first coat? We're using the same epoxy as you)

[@boatworkstoday]

Joel Simbrow 180 or 220 between epoxy coats. I prefer sanding the bare wood to about the same grit. 320 between coats of varnish except for the last knockdown; that's 400 :-)

[@boatworkstoday]

Nope. Just sand the epoxy down with 220 grit, wipe with acetone and coat with straight varnish. Sand in between coats of varnish with 320 and wipe down with mineral spirits.. Hope this helps!

[@EquipIntegration]

Hi, great video on applying the West epoxy. I'm installing a new cabin sole (old one became black due to water instrusion through the edges of the old floor). So, I'm using the West Epoxy for the underside and edges of the new marine plywood and then will apply spar varnish to the top/exposed surface. My question is - how would I prepare/rough the surface of the Epoxy before I apply the adhesive and set the new floor in place (I'm using Sikaflex 291 on the new marine plywood and will lay it down onto an existing subfloor in my boat).

[@boatworkstoday]

Don Voigt If using west system, the only thing you 'd need to do for adhesion would be to remove any possible blush with warm water and a scotchbright pad. Giving it a sanding certainly wouldn't hurt, but not really necessary for this application :-)

[@Guitarman3348]

would you sugest multible coats at one time to speed things up or not and why?

[@mr.morgan5643]

Andy, Hope this note finds you and yours healthy! I'm just wondering, do you totally encapsulate the teak or just the top surfaces? Thanks, Doug

[@valeriemd2b]

Thanks, this is very informative. Does this work for Cherry Wood as well?

[@bobthedude9322]

Would it be usefully to put light fiberglass cloth (4 or 6oz) in between one of the epoxy coats for increased durability ?

[@spencerflynn7743]

Sweet

[@youcandoittech3591]

would I add stain before or after putting on penetrating epoxy

[@drummermayne11]

would a regular gloss polyurethane over an epoxy clear on a table be ok? Can this be done?

[@PatJHeffernan]

Hi, great video. Is the epoxy base OK exterior exposed to UV? Is it the varnish topcoat that makes it OK for UV exposure? Cheers,

[@bigguix]

does epoxy "self levels" or do you see much brush strikes after its cured ? also, i tried to sand epoxy (filled some nots) and it was impossible, the heat was "melting" the epoxy and it remained tacky all the time. I probably didnt mix it well enough or didnt put enough hardener in it ? tyvm, nice video !

[@johnwood9914]

Ive sanded down the teak wiped it with acetone and then have coated my teak with west systems but i got a lot of bubles on the wood? What could i possibly be doing wrong?

[@boatworkstoday]

@Darknights7 The epoxy shouldn't effect the glue used for laminating the boards, and once cured the epoxy needs to be sanded before painting. Although, I don't know how much just coating the sides of a pre-laminated board will actually strengthen things? Won't hurt, but not sure how much it will actually help... Only thing to do is experiment and see what happens...

[@austinkoov9686]

Just to be clear, two coats of epoxy is all you need? Also, between the coats of epoxy, do you need to sand and use acetone? I ask because you had the saw dust issue in your video.

[@mattgloss8580]

Thank you for posting. How do you deal with the amine blush in your epoxy coating?

[@jkg6211]

It's humidity

[@boatworkstoday]

@Darknights7 I apply 2 coats for depth and durability. 1 coat gives a nice finish, but two make it look like a mirror. A topcoat w/ UV blockers is needed for protection from the sun (varnish, etc); I wouldn't leave it bare. As long as the surface isn't hot when applying the epoxy, no bubbles. It flows out beautifully! Roll and tip with a brush, or just brush it on like I did in the video. 1 coat at a time, and wait until it's tacked over before applying another. Use ONLY clear epoxy WS207

[@codybruno]

Question. If I’m restoring original teak an holly sole flooring with some new pieces, should I varnish the new to match the old before adding epoxy or can I just add a couple extra during the varnish stage on newer pieces ? Thanks for any help

[@timlamacchia7070]

Is this technique suitable for a teak veneer flooring in the interior of a sailboat?

[@wthomas5697]

I have a covered teak deck on the front porch of a home. What about adding a layer of fiberglass to provide added protection? See any problems with that?

[@fishingismydrug1]

What is the purpose of sanding between coats? I'm new to this .

[@boatcopso]

I have a vanish fighting chair and want to redue to cover in a epoxy paint can u help

[@boatworkstoday]

Very slippery unless something is sprinkled in for texture or some strips of grip tape are applied.. the tape might actually look nice, 3M makes a clear 1" grip tape..

[@GNT35]

Getting bubbles in my apoxy not sure what im doing roung? Maybe temperature? Or brushing it on? Help!

[@salbal777]

If I'm using Polyurethane varnish do I need to sand between coats? do I need to add thinner or spirit to Polyurethane varnish?

[@piotrbrandt]

Hi i just wonder if this method can be used for the whole wooden sailing boat restoration. I want to buy a wooden Omega (polish sailing boat) remove all paint and varnish layesrs built up over years and secure wooden hull with Your method. Hull construction is backed from 1942 and basically it is made from pine slats (approx 0.5 x 0,25 inch). I could send You some pics but do not know how to do that over KZbin.

[@SailingSpyridon]

hey there. I'm doing my companionway and wasn't planning on removing it from the boat. is varnishing upright bad?

[@mystuff1464]

Hello, Trying this method on swim platform. First time using epoxy. Blew it first time;too cold, had to sand it off. Second attempt came out nice. Put two coats on bottom side. Problem with drips around edges when I flipped it, will have to sand them off. When I coat the top side can I tape the bottom edges to catch the drips? Thanks

[@boatworkstoday]

PM'd ya :-)

[@vikingwhite]

I picked up the West Marine system you're using to finish all the outside and inside trim on a small wooden weekender... the gentleman there said this was easier than varnishing and didn't mention need for it nor sell me any varnish. Will it turn horribly yellow if I don't do the varnish especially on the outside trim in the sun?

[@boatworkstoday]

You will need to have some sort of UV coating over the epoxy to prevent clouding and pre-mature peeling. The 207 hardener does have a certain level of protection but not enough for long term exposure to the sun.

[@steveemery2880]

Hi, I've waited this long to ask you how well those boards held up because my 42' of 50 year old teak caprail are in my shop, all repaired and ready for treatment. I'd love to use 207 then varnish but I need to know how yours turned out if you don't mind?

[@hellkell8693]

What did you end up doing and how did it turn out?

[@boogerking7411]

What kind of glove are you using?

[@greatlakescruiser5720]

Andy....I have seen a variation of your technique using a "penetrating" epoxy made by mixing the two part epoxy with some type of solvent in mix ratios as high as 50:50. I was wondering what you thought of this "penetrating" epoxy technique?

[@boatworkstoday]

Generally speaking I don't think it's as good as using what was shown in the video. By diluting the epoxy you're accomplishing two things. It does make it thinner so it does soak into the wood a bit deeper, but the downside of doing this is that you're also diluting the characteristics of the epoxy making it less effective. Personally I think you're better off using straight epoxy mixing it the way it was designed to be used :-) Hope this helps!

[@randomfandom53]

I know it's an old video, but I'm going to restore the wood on our 1961 Boston Whaler Nauset - which has mahogany. Can I use this technique on mahogany?

[@sipitak8702]

Everytime I apply 105 + 207 epoxy, I have lots of tiny bubbles. What is your trick?

[@jimbaldwin]

How slippery would this be on a ski storage lid when wet?

[@treymarrs6860]

Can you use birch on boats?

[@boatworkstoday]

I'm very familiar with West System and have spoken with them on numerous occasions. Sorry, but couldn't disagree with you more. Bedding compounds are a sealant (key word, SEAL). Moisture does not permeate this material, otherwise it would not make a very good choice for water proofing now would it? :-) Properly refinishing a floating paneled door does NOT entail locking the panel in with epoxy or finish. You lost me there.. Dozens of boats, hundreds of parts over 15 years. Not 1 failure ;-)

[@katejackson524]

How do you feel your technique with epoxy would fare on a boat's brightwork while moored... would the movement make it impossible to do the three coats of epoxy in a day?

[@0718dm]

Yes, difficult even on a calm day. I work on my boat while moored all the time.

[@mjosendale]

do you ever use polyurethane on teak floors?

[@ashbucharon8263]

You did not wash amine blush before sanding epoxy coat?

[@boatworkstoday]

The 207 clear hardener is a blush free hardener. No need :-)

[@kennysyachtmaintenance]

Why didn't you do a thined out coat as a sealer coat first?

[@neiloboidicin5815]

Hi Nick. Big fan. I take it this epoxy method can only be used on flat wood? I am renovating the inside of a boat. The wood has been damaged with black mold on teak veneer. I have stripped it and used oxcalic acid to take out the mold spots. I would love to epoxy it, but i cannot remove the walls of the boat to lay it flat.

[@boatworkstoday]

Niall O'Bodicin It's the same process; just thinner coats (and more of them ;-) If it's a large area try using a foam roller and tip it off with a disposable brush. Good luck!

[@neiloboidicin5815]

Thank you. You cant believe how much your videos have helped me.

[@krayne9411]

Have you tried this on Ipe?

[@pjwahine]

How does one charge for services like this? I'd like to give it a whirl here in Virginia...It's absolutely stunning ;D

[@kadeenewton6407]

Hello - I am trying to come u with creative ways of protecting my deck from my dogs nails. We have a large Shepherd and his nails do some significant damage to the wood of our deck. We currently have the deck stained but want more protection. Would varnish be an option for a deck?

[@boatworkstoday]

Varnish would not be a good choice for this application; it's actually pretty soft and scratches easily (but looks nice!)... With a big dog like that, unfortunately there really isn't much that I can think of other than laying carpet pads along the deck when at dock. That and try keeping him / her confined to areas of the deck that you can manage with some sort of covering. Maybe foot booties?? Guessing that would not go over well :-O

[@thomasuras]

What do you think of the German product coelan ?

[@boatworkstoday]

Unfortunately haven't ever used it :-( Sorry