Romulan Politics Explained...

[@joshpetersen5968]

After watching this, I realized something. In the DS9 episode "Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges" Starfleet Intelligence managed to infiltrate an operative, Koval, onto the Continuing Committee. With the way Venom Geek Media has laid out this version of Romulan politics, this would've been an even bigger coup than it seemed watching the episode, since through him they could gain information and possibly shape some of the policies in the Federations favor, within reason of course.

[@Mrs.Grave5433]

I think Gene making the Romulans a totalitarian democracy really made them so much more interesting and brings up important questions about us without being childishly or preachy. I love in the non canon FASA lore about them where they not the Klingons where more honourable and how they has a manifest destiny for the entire alpha quadrant to the core of the galaxy.

[@jonathancampbell5231]

Not sure Roddenberry was really in charge of that; it was other writers who really fleshed out the inner workings of the Romulans and other civilizations.

[@Matt-yg8ub]

The Romulans always struck me as being far more intellectual and calculating than the Klingons. Klingon society was all about war and wining glory in battle…. The Romulans were strategic and weren’t just a cliché warrior society

[@Mrs.Grave5433]

I like Klingons both TOS and TMP/TNG versions. But after looking into the Romulans I’ve got to say I see why everyone loves them to the amount they do. Especially with their manifest density and at in the non-canon enterprise books some Romulans had an obsession with finding Iconia. I did wish we got to see more of Romulan culture. Their totalitarian expansionist democracy and policy of poison your enemy before attacking. Which would be very cold and logical…

[@occultatumquaestio5226]

The Romulan political seems to be a mix between the Late-Republican/early-Principate Roman senate and the UK Westminster Parliamentary system, with a small hint of the US system. An intriguing overview. Compared to the governments of the UFP or Klingons, the extent of the government of the Romulan Empire is relatively unexplored in audio-visual Trek media beyond a few scenes. Power politics is a complex labyrinth, to quote a Romulan saying: *_"If knowledge is power, then to be unknown is to be unconquerable."_*

[@classic.cameras]

I wont lie, I loved the opening scene of the Romulan Senate in the movie Nemesis. As a guy in the west, we think about the Roman Empire about 17 times a day and it was cool seeing that the Romulans were in fact the Space Roman Empire we always suspected them to be. I hate in the Kelvin Star Trek and later Picard they destroyed Romulus. The odds of that sun going super nova over others seems a bit stretched. Anyways...

[@jimbojackson9975]

You might say the destruction of Romulus was a conspiracy theory.

[@classic.cameras]

@@jimbojackson9975 I think Samatha Carter just dropped a Star Gate into Romulus' star. But that would be even more a conspiracy LOL

[@jimbojackson9975]

@@classic.cameras that would definitely explain a lot.

[@Chronix-]

If they weren't an "interstellar Rome," it would be weird because their two planets are named after the main characters in the Roman creation myth. If I remember right, it's about a pair of twins (romulus and remus) who were abandoned and sent down a river, and the place where they came ashore is where they founded the great Roman republic. I also agree that destroying romulus with an unexplainable supernova was a lazy choice. Oh well, it's canon now.

[@joshpetersen5968]

I kind of like what they did in Star Trek Online regarding the Hobus Supernova. It was essentially enemy action. Basically the central conflict of the first part of STO is the Iconians were manipulating events and eventually beginning a war with the Federation, Klingons, Romulans and Dominion. They basically used a Romulan catspaw to build a device that triggered the Hobus Supernova as revenge against the Romulans since, thanks to time travel shenanigans, Sela was on Iconia during the attack that drove them away and she killed or wounded several Iconians as revenge for Hobus. I know that the time travel parts are shaky, but I can definitely get behind the supernova being triggered by an unknown enemy trying to destabilize the Alpha Quadrant by basically knocking down one of the three major powers in it.(In STO the tensions that eventually lead to war between the Federation and Klingon Empire were started by the collapse of the Star Empire. The Klingons saw a weakened enemy ripe for conquest, the Federation said no and things started to snowball from there.)

[@followerofjulian1652]

I love the fact that you treat the Trek universe as an entity that operates according to the same basic, fundamental principles as our own -- principles based on rational thought. It gives your analyses a wonderful depth that is … fascinating! 😉 "We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow." Lord Palmerston - speech, House of Commons, 1 March 1848

[@jacksavere6988]

Fantastic, I could watch an hour long version of this 👌🏻 the romulans are my favourite “villain” faction in science fiction

[@archades115]

Romans in space. Then Shinzon had to come along and play Caesar.

[@bloodysimile4893]

"You know good about a dead hero? They never live to disappoint," -Romulan Predator

[@brandonlordbaltimore5182]

Your channel is criminally underrated brother. Always something entertaining & insightful to talk about. That any real Trek fan can enjoy.

[@jeffhallam2004]

I always get chills when you go back to your Romulan roots!!!!

[@LongTran-kp3kz]

Wow. Never has this video been more relevant to the present than right the fuck now... Damn, nice timing, and just what I was looking for as far lore content goes. Like, I don't like the Romulan culture all that much, but they are a fascinating people and there's no doubut they can teach us about how we ourselves view the world, in a metta commentary kinda way... Thx for the vid.

[@stevenewman1393]

🖖😎👍 How very totally truly cool and very nicely greatly wonderfully well done and nicely informatively explained and executed in every detail way shape and format provided on "Romulan Politics Explained" and on how well that their Orwellian Athoriant Democracy truly works Indeed!; A job very nicely fabulously well done by you indeed Sir!👌.

[@philly83]

For the Praetor

[@andrewclark8880]

Too bad that perfect status quo system didn't save their civilization from JJ Abrams.

[@Adelina-293]

His films and series are non-canon to many.

[@andrewclark8880]

@@Adelina-293 Anything after Enterprise is non-canon to me.

[@TheRezro]

@@Adelina-293 No one care. They are actually semi-canon. They are canon alternative timeline to be specific. Only thing what is not canon is size of the ships.

[@TheRezro]

@@andrewclark8880 People were saying the same about TMP, TNG, DS9, Voyager, Enterprise, etc. You aren't original. Fun fact, design from Discovery is actually called Phase 2. It is literally the same as design of Cheyenne.

[@andrewclark8880]

@@TheRezro LOL wasn't trying to be original. I just think it's all crap.

[@chissstardestroyer]

The books indicate their imperial family tends to operate largely behind the scenes, that tidbit shows up in the novel "Vulcan's Heart"- and reveals an interesting detail about "the Enterprise Incident" involving why that particular commander had 3 battlecruisers in her first independent command; who her cousin was is a huge clue to how come she had that much clout when almost universally on your first series of commands you've got only a single low-powered frigate.

[@AluVixapede]

This was a great episode.Some 15 years ago I probably would been like "oh man, politics :(" but now I'm like "Yes, I want to see how the ENTIRE system works :D". I really like it.

[@merafirewing6591]

Aside from romulan politics, they have quite the unique architecture in Star Trek. Also would the Romulan Republic have a different political structure?

[@joshpetersen5968]

I think that at the moment, the Romulan Republic's political structure is basically just a copy of the former Romulan Senate(especially since D'Tans title is Proconsul) with the Proconsul wielding a lot of the powers that the Praetor did as well. The Republic is just too new that it hasn't had a chance to evolve anything different to the old RSE especially since the Star Empire evolved into a more traditional monarchy after Hobus and Sela taking over(if you follow STOs timeline,) so they just used what they knew worked previously while stripping out things like the Tal'Shiar.

[@vortega472]

You know what's a brilliant point - 13:40 you make the point about the Romulans not being a violent species. And you're right, they are aggressive, cunning, and if they can get away with it, they will strike, but they are not bloodthirsty. Never really thought about that until this video. In their own way, them embraced paranoia as their philosophy the way the Vulcans embraced logic.

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

Before the federation vulcan came close to fighting several devastating wars.

[@sodadrinker89]

@@venomgeekmedia9886 But with some kind of Romulan involvement.

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

@@sodadrinker89 possibly...

[@vortega472]

@@sodadrinker89 Probably one of the factions in the war. But I like how @vemoneekmedia9886 mentioned that the Romulan "tribe" decided to depart because I think they wanted to escape a conflict that would drive their people to extinction. A Romulan - even before a fighter is a survivor.

[@TheRezro]

It is Purely my opinion, but I have personal guidelines how Romulan space politics should look: So first of. Romulan Star Empire is not as strong or as weak as people in universe may think. First of actual population of Romulans is relatively small and while most Romulan commanders would be willing to die for cause. They ships are famous from self destructing to cover they secrets. Romulans can't really afford that. At the same time unlike Dominium they can't rely on the slave races. Because they almost always mistreat them and use for slave labor. So what is real structure of Romulan Star Empire? Well, in many aspects resemble Galactic Empire from Star Wars. So Romulans love massive, extremely powerful overguned ships. But in reality they have few of those. Usually used for asserting dominance and use clever methods to create illusion that they have more of those then they actually do. Meanwhile majority of actual Romulan fleet is composed from really light and fast stealth ships. What puch above they weight. Earth-Romulan War crucial, because Romulans suffered during this conflict crippling losses. Despite having on paper advantage over Earth. Humans used clever swarm and traps tactics to overcome Romulans. Especially as those refused to reveal they identity and in many cases ships self-destruct avoiding capture. While with swarms of small ships, it was actually quite easy to launch boarding actions. And humans realized that even ineffective attempts may trigger self-destruction. Romulans overplayed they card and lost huge hunk of most experienced staff what crippled them for a century. Especially as they heavily rely on Mega-Shipyard fearing leaks of they secrets. What just happen was build in "safe" region, what actually border UE controlled regions. Romulans come with free of prison card, because they pretend that entire conflict was border skirmish and that they signed truce because they didn't care. After Earth agreed to they demands. Anyway. Core concepts of Romulan politics are smoke and mirrors. Small numbers of powerful ships. Faking power with large numbers of decoys. Misinformation, manipulation and espionage. Ironically the truth is that modern Russia is way closer to Romulans then the Klingon's. And I'm not saying it in positive sense. Romulans always were in disadvantage. Even if they pretend to be superpower. Hell! They were technologically behind Federation in 23'th century, buying warships from Klingons! Though they designed few technologies, not available to competition what were not strictly better then regular technology, but obfuscated they capabilities.

[@joanrojotorrebadella8772]

This video is a pure 💎 very ilustrative!

[@chissstardestroyer]

You had something quirky in Imperial Japan though too: while they had basically a true absolute monarch, they also, pushed thorough by their ruler of the time, an elected legislature; maybe something similar happened in their case: perhaps to make responses to hazards faster and more practical as well as to avert insurrections, and it proved the most effective way to administrate the country and it just plain took off. Basically the first of their absolute rulers was S'task, a student of Surak- in fact: *neither* man wanted the Vulcan Civil War that happened to happen; and the Romulan leader himself didn't even want this sundering to occur; and he basically was their first absolute monarch, according to the Star Trek novels.

[@wedgeantillies66]

Despite being a authoritarian democracy as you call it, this hybrid system seems to be exactly the best form of government for the empire and kept it prosperous, stable and a first rate power. While avoiding the civil unrest and political infighting that has afflicted the other big empires of the alpha quadrant; the Klingons and Cardassians in the last two hundred years.

[@shanenolan5625]

Cheers

[@jpaulc441]

I'm glad that the Romulan square shoulder pads went out of fashion eventually.

[@MizoxNG]

house of commons and house of lords, except the house of lords is tiny

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

you mean its not stuffed to the gills to the point of it being a joke... and thus actually works... i guess.

[@EcclesiastesLiker-py5ts]

And the power balance iss flipped in the lords favour.

[@enterprise-h312]

4:04 Do you know Mussolini's definition of fascism? 4:32 I take it that you recall Q's mention of a Romulan Empress in the episode where he's trying to court Captain Janeway?

[@Gymbro_069]

i love this consept and how you explained it, could you do an indeepth look into federation politics or klingon politics ?

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

possibly. although i'd think i'd actually like to look at the cardassian system next.

[@Gymbro_069]

@@venomgeekmedia9886 LETS GOOO !!!!!!!!

[@mathewweeks9069]

Your awesome dude and awesome video be safe out there big fan of star trek

[@ThatSlowTypingGuy]

VGM: True Romulan Bread for True Romulans! I was worried you were going to miss the opportunity there for a second.

[@MakotoAtava]

More like "True romulan ale for true romulans".

[@WalterOtterly]

You can look at the Soviet system where they had "elected officials", but a small group that basically made the decisions.

[@gilbat1]

Now I'm curious how the Romulan Republic presented in STO functions. Do they have some substitute system for the Continuing Committee, or is it dominated entirely by the Senate? I don't think the game itself ever elaborates on that, but it's interesting to think about how that change in the structure of the government might change (or not change) Romulan culture and society.

[@jaredcolon4535]

"I wanna try Human Creole food" ::::Talshiar in the corner::: "Him to the camps".... "What camps?".... "Him too he knows to much!".... "Um please enjoy your soup from a loyal establishment".... "yeah get the soup guy too!" "Why what he do?" "Don't like my soup spicy he made it spicy"

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

You will eat your bland soup! And you will be happy.

[@sklaWlivE]

"...propelling them into being one of the major powers of the 24th century. So they must be doing something right." *HOBUS SUPERNOVA WOULD LIKE TO KNOW YOUR LOCATION*

[@johnn9977]

Good information

[@stewartbugler]

I'm still interested in what you are guna talk about... but People shape politics. Yes poltics does exist solely to influence the shape of other peoples internal compass their personal policies... If you remove the people politics doesn't exist. If you remove the politics people still exist and eventually spawns politics. So the answer is People Shape politics indefinitely.

[@mattpurgare5678]

The following thought of mine is out of left field and not related to this video... But why didn't the Borg make an appearance during the Dominion war? Were they busy with species 8472?

[@abelardlindsey7579]

The Romulans are modeled after Rome. The screen writer who created them did so because he wondered what the Roman Empire would have been like if they had never fallen and gone on to be a space-based society.

[@howardlanus8467]

It sounds like they use the Senate as a sounding board for the people to let their frustrations and concerns be known, which is actually very pragmatic. Charles I of England tried to rule England without calling Parliament for over ten years, and when he was finally forced into calling them they had a LOT of issues to discuss with him. By letting the people in on the debate, at least in part, they feel like they have a stake in the state and are thus less likely to resort to violence.

[@KJAkk]

How are the non-Romulan subjects managed and organized? Are they assigned governors or allowed to run their own local affairs as long as it does not conflict with Imperial law?

[@captainyossarian388]

Love discussions of the politics of the Star Trek universe. I always thought of the Romulans as being all about duty, while the Klingons are all about honor. Duty to their people and duty to the state. They chose the concept of an all consuming sense of duty as the solution to their martial drives, as opposed to Surak's logic. Also have you read the old TOS/TNG era novel The Romulan Way by Diane Duane? Great novel on Romulans and their origins. Especially love the bit about S'Harien and his swords.

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

Duty makes them sound rather Kantian, i think the cardassians can be better discribed as dutiful a romulans first duty is to themselves

[@Rick79LUFC]

Were the latter Free Romulin Republic was a representative democracy in the form of a republic and unlike the former RSE the FRR was happy to work with other powers using true democracy 😊

[@grahamturner1290]

Let's not forget the humiliation of the Romulans by the inflatable Enterprise in "The Practical Joker" (TAS). 🖖

[@FrakkinGaiusBaltar]

Friends, Romulans, countrymen, lend me your ears; I come to bury Vreenak, not to praise him.

[@sodadrinker89]

So...the Roman Republic/maybe early Empire?

[@chissstardestroyer]

They kind of blundered upon a true and effective republic.

[@claytonwestphal682]

Unfortunately one with eugenics and subjugation ingrained into it.

[@chissstardestroyer]

@@claytonwestphal682 Yeah, weirdly at that, but these guys're paranoid psychopathic vulcans. Go figure.

[@michaeljames9892]

The Continuing Committee reminds of the Venetian Council of Ten.

[@Texgenwayne]

A long time ago I came up with a story and I've been doing concept stuff for a little bit but I inadvertently made a similar government. It's ruled by a leader there's also a vice leader and the other governing body is the council of six. As well as the senatorial and representative committees. The leader is the only position not elected all the other positions are except for the council of 6 which is the similar type of government you just described. The leaders authority is not ultimate but is there but he does not use it this only goes for the first one. At the beginning of the story the second one was chosen but is also a son of the first. The third was elected

[@evan316]

This sounds weirdly similiar to the canadian system lol, with the senate being like the hoc and the continuing commitee being like the senate

[@thestanleys3657]

Strange how regimented the Romulan government is but somehow Shinzon was able to do a coup d'etat seemingly without much protest particularly strange for a non Romulan/Reman aligned group

[@ZontarDow]

Well he did have a planet destroying weapon and only wanted use it on their enemy.

[@thestanleys3657]

@@ZontarDow Shinzon hated the Romulans for there betrayal and enslavement he'd have turned on them eventually

[@joshpetersen5968]

He made a decapitation strike against the Senate and, since he took the title of Praetor, I think he took out the Continuing Committee as well. I think the only way it would work logically is if his strikes were surgical.(For example his assassination of the Senate was, for all of its over the top nature, limited to just the area of the senate room.) And for any stragglers he could have used infiltrators disguised as Reman servants or bodyguards to dispose of them around the same time the Senate got roasted.Then Shinzon could have used the existing infrastructure to basically cover up his coup. Basically with certain exceptions, anyone off Romulus(and most on planet as well) would be unaware that there were any changes with the Senate or Continuing Committee. It would be business as usual until Shinzon and the Remans could consolidate power, which never happened thanks to the events of Nemesis.

[@OllamhDrab]

He was able to abuse that system through a couple complicit Senators and some Navy commanders, recall.

[@OllamhDrab]

(Also you might classify that as a coup de main, more like, since he simply had a Senator murder the Senate.)

[@tommytwotacos8106]

Did anyone else think it was a missed opportunity to not have settled the Sela issue in Nemesis?

[@bartlester591]

Romulans have all been said to closer to the Chinese or old Soviet Union style of communism

[@jaredcolon4535]

How does the romulan government set up political and policy wise but functions compare to Soviet union communist and United States of America Constitutional Republic, and then to the Roman Empire on which the romulan seem to be emulated too

[@crownprincesebastianjohano7069]

I wonder how the Cardassian political system worked in the short period between the fall of the Central Command and the Dominion annexation. Who elected the Detapa Council? The Cardies seem like people who would enjoy long campaign periods immensely.

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

i might have to cover the cardassians next...

[@Mrs.Grave5433]

Oh hell yeah! I’ll be there for that.

[@sydneysmith1521]

As the screen shot shows 8 members on the Continuing Committee, I can only assume the chairman votes only in the event of a tie.

[@macguffinmuffin1156]

My first thought on authoritarian democracy: Military service guarantees citizenship.

[@WarNoob755]

Having a democracy alongside a deep state reminds me of modern America.

[@NashmanNash]

authorian democracy...Someone send this to Nancy Faeser

[@StevenHughes-hr5hp]

The Romulans were basically modelled after the Soviet Union. They even have a Politburo and a KGB. Not only that but communism was the enemy when the original Star Trek got started.

[@farshnuke]

I will say this as nicely as I can. That was a very well delivered speech from an indoctrinated citizen of Romulus who believes all the propaganda the fascist government puts out. You're talking about a fictional empire and this is your take on them. You clearly like the Romulans in a way I don't. To me they are an interesting adversary that highlights Starfleet's flaws and the nature of Star Trek is to make friends with enemies so I like the idea that they can become allies of the Federation over time but I also like the discomfort inherent in the Romulans being that friendly adversary that could be an ally because so much of their world building is bristling dystopian arch villainy. The Klingons were basically rewritten from whole cloth when they were introduced as allies so it's kind of okay that they were the villains but the Romulans are painted in every well as an irredeemable empire of fascist scum with the Star Trek twist of the knife that the actual people are still people capable of being perfectly nice if they can be separated from the empire or convinced to change it. I don't think I can give you a real world point of comparison to the Romulans because I can't give you a real world point of comparison to the Federation and that very much impacts who the Romulans would be in relation I think you are right that the Romulans were not the evil that destroyed vulcan around the time of Surak. I think you are right that proto vulcanoids caused it and then two different species and cultures diverged from there. I think that there is an unelected group of nobles by blood and right of conquest that make up the romulan senate and they elect the dictator. Maybe certain families on Romulus can be swayed by petitions from the public or bribes but that is where the Tal Shiar come in to ensure the current system remains. As inefficient, corrupt and incompetent as it demonstrably is.

[@killingragethrowback]

Limited citizenship. Limited democracy. Romulus has it's inspiration in it's namesake the, Rome pre-empire.

[@ZontarDow]

Given how large the Romulan population across the Empire is and how few Sneators we see, the part of the Romulan population who are franschised is likely very small.

[@lynngreen7978]

Novels indicate the Senators come from The One Hundred Families, the Patricians. Making them equivalent to the British House of Lords (or the Roman Senate). Very much the 1%.

[@calorinedarkness5232]

It's equally possible each planet has its own local senate, dictating local planetary policy, though likely ultimately under the pretext that Romulas has the final say in things. Od at the very least, colonies of a certain size might have their own planetary senate. Small resource colonies might just be controlled by a governor of sorts, if it's not slave labour. Also remember than romulans don't reproduce quickly in the slightest, given they are vulcanoid, and the amount of people each senator represents is unknown. A giant number senators would simply bog Romulas down in beauracracy and given how romulace political system works and how romulans are culturally I doubt that would be acceptable unlike in the Federation.

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

but if we're taking from roman history you also had the tribunes of the plebs which were important to placate the increasing unemployed roman working class (Because of the growth of slavery in the empire) you'd need similar checks and balances in this system

[@Matt-yg8ub]

No, not necessarily. Tank the Galactic Senate of the Republic from Star Wars, millions of worlds in that galaxy, and yet they all fit in one big building….. because it was rare for a single planet to have its own senator, entire star systems usually had a senator or a representative. The Trade Federation was several hundred world at least and they only had one senator. Romulan senators, probably represent factions and groups within the empire. Don’t think of them like the US Senate, think of the more like Cabinet members in the presidents administration …. They carry a lot more power over their individual areas of expertise. But also consider this there are only 100 US senators …. you’re probably used to saying the state of the union address where all of them are in the same room at the same time, but that is actually rare most of the day-to-day operations of the house or the Senate are conducted by a scant few people while most of the members are off doing other things mostly fundraising.

[@trazyntheinfinite9895]

Head of state, head of government. Not so difficult.

[@sixofnine9407]

I always thought the Romulans would back stab each other when given a chance. your video has me think that some of my assumptions may be to narrow minded..

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

there's stabbing in the back and Stabbing In The Back. thats politics.

[@OttoKreml]

So why did the senate have the ability to influence the front on the dominion war and shift it to short term goals that were strategically non-viable? Isn't that exactly what this system was designed to prevent? Also I would sum up the romulin system as 'fixed autocracy'. They clearly have autocratic goals. They want to maintain a specific direction for the society, maintain their dominance, and want the ability weed out any dissent in the process. But they don't want the system to become out of touch and lose the support of and information about the population. They don't want a stagnant society of yes men. So in essence yes, it is just an attempt to fix the flaws of authoritarian systems, and to get a stable society situated around the singular objective of domination.

[@Allosaurus87]

that's more oligarchy than democracy

[@Mrs.Grave5433]

Why did I get an election ad before this….

[@logicplague]

Because heels-up needs YOUR help....lmao.

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

Do you duty for the State...

[@joeg1915]

Vote Koval.

[@Mrs.Grave5433]

I mean look all I’m saying Woodrow Wilson was a Romulan.

[@tullyDT]

The federation is a place where you have a choice. The Romulan Empire is a place where you have the illusion of choice.

[@Mrs.Grave5433]

Perfect description.

[@ReasonablySkeptic]

Totalitarian democracy could not exist (for long) as the totalitarian would take full control. This has historically happened in MANY democracies. But star trek was never too cleaver in the way of politics. They often talked about being above capitalism and that's just *PEOPLE TRADING GOODS AND SERVICES, AKA WORKING TOGETHER!* That's like being above language, it's just a ridiculous idea when thought out. Still, fictions is all about exploring the crazy and impossible.

[@thomassalois3508]

Don't forget the Tal Shire oversees all

[@Overlord10ca]

Is the Romulan Empire a Democracy? Do we know that Senators are elected and not appointed? How fair would the elections be on Romulus? How do we know the Senators are not just members of powerful families and don't face elections? I doubt you have something similar to the Bill of Rights on Romulus if the Tal Shiar can disappear you in the middle of the night.

[@lordMartiya]

I liked Diane Duane's version better.

[@Valturean]

Look at the name romulan craters of Star Trek were going to crate the Roman Empire in space, specifically the Roman Republic. Do you happen to have a degree in political science because your analysis goes like that

[@yyz1335]

red vs blue is better than green vs purple

[@chissstardestroyer]

Well, about the problems of the powers of the state being in your opponents' hands: that's where checks and balances come into play- there've been some quirky events in my home republic, such as our Civil War; and the factor that the democrats were the party of secession kind of killed their capacity for influence in the Republic for a while at least.

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

nominally yes there should be checks and balances: consider the countries that have fallen to revolution France, Imperial Russia. theres one thing they both had in common: Absoloute power, if you come out on top of the revolution absoloute power awaits. compare that to more dispersed devevolved systems .

[@chissstardestroyer]

@@venomgeekmedia9886 Yes, and here's another detail: political parties aren't absolutely binding for the members, and the individuals can more easily be addressed, via speeches and the like. Plus absolute power does seem to be culturally feared by them, much like the USA's foundation documents.

[@chissstardestroyer]

@@venomgeekmedia9886 Especially in the novels; these guys are REALLY in favor of checks and balances about governmental overreach- interestingly enough, they don't seem to object to speaking out by and large- plus the Tal Shiar's primary weapons would be rational arguments. The primary details of Romulan vs Vulcan societies amount to the same debates between Surak and S'task on how to handle the external problems- that also really does explain how come these guys're so prone to violence as a response, but also cautious. Then the detail remains that these guys have developed the culture they have, not a direct democracy really at all, but a republic; the difference is that in a democracy everyone votes in every single issue, in a republic, you *hire* one or a few of your neighbors to speak for you. Plus you might find it interesting to read the novels- and again, about their dynasty: how come that Romulan Commander in "The Enterprise Incident" had *3* battlecruisers in her own self-admitted first independent command? That would only make sense if she's profoundly, as she is described as being "high-borne". Plus, you have a surprisingly high number of absolute monarchs who've for their own reasons employed a more distrubited power structure.

[@Rick79LUFC]

The government of the Romulan Star Empire is best described as an aristocracy. Rule is by an elite group of upper class citizens who earn their positions through wealth, heredity or military service. Common citizens have little direct say in policymaking.😊

[@Matt-yg8ub]

Which is as it should be ;) most ordinary people have no business meddling in things they haven’t the slightest clue about.

[@Rick79LUFC]

@@Matt-yg8ub lol very Romulin

[@Matt-yg8ub]

@@Rick79LUFC perhaps, but it’s also very Roman Republic, where the senators made all the decisions for the millions of peons, who could neither read nor right and had never traveled beyond 10 miles from their home had literally no clue about the other aspects of the empire or outside of their own daily life. 2,000 years later…. The average voter embodies the dunning Kruger effect …. AND the Peter Principle….. but still knows next to nothing about the operation of government of society beyond their daily life.

[@charliedontsurf334]

"Why would I trade 1 tyrant 3000 miles away for 3000 tyrants 1 mile away? An elected legislature can trample a man's rights as easily as a king can." The Romulans are a great example.

[@timesthree5757]

Just because they have a senate doesn't mean they are a democracy. Well they are a democracy in the same way The DPRK us a democracy. It is just a Totalitarian regime. However unlike Cardassia it is not a Military Dictatorship. It is not a feudal society like the Klingons. Nor is it a Constitutional Federal Republic like the UFP. But a Democracy it is not.

[@norm3380]

So its not all that different than modern Iran.

[@darienevans6229]

how does Nog vote for. he is in Starfleet fighting and risking his life. he better have someone representing him in the federation counsel.

[@sodadrinker89]

I think if you serve in Starfleet, you automatically get Federation Citizenship.

[@Mrs.Grave5433]

If that’s true that makes the federation ironically like starship troopers.

[@nealsterling8151]

21:50 Which one is the better system? In the Federation you are one of trillion voters. In the Romulan Empire you are one of several millions... better ratio, nice. Except for those billions in the Empire who don't have romulan citicenship, who have no vote at all. Too bad, i guess... 🤔

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

yeah sucks to be them i guess.

[@Kyoummi]

i wish we had this style government is real life just look at the uk my god it was and still is an unstable mess here Well with caveats i guess the romulan first bit might be abit hard to digest in a real government who would be the prime voter in that system

[@jayburn00]

That chin though lol

[@robertkalinic335]

Im sorry but Von Clauschwitz? 🤣

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

"Gentlemen, von clauswitz, is about to tell us who the real enemy is..."

[@warwolf88]

u sure know alot about romulan politics for a human im sure section 31 would love to sit u down and have a slightly unpleasant conversation with you 😊

[@OllamhDrab]

(I'm gonna hit you on the thumbnail while the ads are playing. 'Pro-Choice' does not mean 'Don't Get Caught Defying Authoritarian Eugenics.' And I think you know it. )

[@johnlavery3433]

What the eff are you talking about. That says pro consul, that’s a poltical office

[@Ensign_Nemo]

@@johnlavery3433 He saw one thing and thought it meant something completely different. That's a pretty interesting combination of a verbal version of a Rorschach test and a Freudian slip.

[@OllamhDrab]

@@Ensign_Nemo Uh, it was a reference to the Romulans saying to a pictured Geordi, 'Why didn't your parents stop you from living' (for being blind at birth) and the words that were there. (VG clearly was referring to that TNG episode and labeled it 'Pro Choice.' )

[@OllamhDrab]

@@Ensign_Nemo (Or he changed it cause damn, he probably had to expect that. )

[@OllamhDrab]

(And yep, the 'Pro Choice Utopia?' thumbnail is still there. Really how much 'choice' do Romulan workers actually have when the working class lunchroom Spock visits to speak very clandestinely at is serving thin gruel for a day's labor? It's actually probably more referring to the custom of exposing 'defective' children in Imperial Roman days, rather than the current RL politics and BS about *that, and bodily autonomy before anyone's even born,* ....Apart from the Romulan supremacist mentality, how much could you really expect those 'plebes' to to be able to even raise them to fit into that conformist system long enough to probably be rejected? How much 'choice' would they really have, never mind enough to think Geordi's the one to be mocked about it as the chief Engineer of the flagship? The 'little people' are clearly nobody there,never mind in any real democracy when they don't dare look up from their soup. Authoritarians tend to want to keep people stressed-out, paranoid, and weakened. However they may manage their upper-level power games.

[@RogueSabre]

the catiline conspiracy

[@FiveofDave]

United kingdom

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

don't know why you'd think that....

[@TimothyChapman]

You should research the difference between a democracy and a republic. Democracy is essentially authoritarianism under a different name.

[@Broockle]

wat

[@samuellove9619]

No? If anything it's the other way round with so called peoples republics, social republics and national republics. Republic simply means that the government is at least partially elected, the electorate can be anything from the aristocracy, plutocracy, or the citizenry. That being said, democracies can become authoritarian either by restricting citizenship or embracing majoritarian politics as is seen in Hungary and Turkey I.e. populist policies that on the surface favour a perceived majority and suppress all opposition.

[@tra-viskaiser8737]

Authoritarianism of the masses... the masses are far more dangerous than the individual. Thats why representative democracy was picked by the US founders. It was easier to check and balance..

[@OllamhDrab]

Uh, no, unless maybe people vote against people voting.

[@logicplague]

Yep, mob rule with great PR. All it takes is 50.1% to flex on the other 49.9%. In the US, the original intent was that most things in Congress required at least a 60% majority, meaning at least SOME consensus had to be reached, and there are still checks and balances. Is it slow? Yep, but I'll take it over the alternatives.

[@ssyn6626]

Yay good job Romulans the closest thing I got to a democracy that a bad guy. Really annoying that every time the bad guys are a dictatorship make a bad guy force a captailist democracy for once.

[@venomgeekmedia9886]

i think that old Binary really comes from the 20th century whereas modern authoritarianism has become more sophisticated.

[@sodadrinker89]

So, modern day Russia? A sham democracy ran by oligarchs.

[@chrisbeauvais7499]

Lmfao democracy

[@Relav1364]

YAS. ROMULANS. RU VATHIL!!!!! I love Romulans. Klingons are like "blahgh bblahgasjlkhfgjsa HONOUR LIQUOR QAPLA" *headbutting noises*.... But what did the Romulans have? The State that *rivalled* the Federation for nearly 500 years. Because the complexity, the intrigue... it all serves a better purpose. The preservation of the State. Even if you have to whack some shifty spies late at night. I pick a slight bone with the early Romulans, I don't think it was a group that disagreed with the Proto-Vulcans, rather they *were* Vulcans that accepted logic, but also believed that strength and military skill were of equal importance, and they chose to leave with Surak's blessings. Consider every Romulan military commander we've known. Cunning. Sneaky. Calculating.... LOGICAL. moar Romulan Stuff kplsthx