Vet's Take: Norway's Decision to Ban Bulldog & Cavalier King Charles Spaniel Breeding

Join Dr. Em to learn about why Norway has banned breeding more purebred English Bulldogs and Cavalier King Charles Spaniels. This is about the genetic pools these breeds currently have, and why it won't be possible to get rid of the prominent health issues that plague these breeds with the current population of dogs. Learn about the health issues present in these breeds, and how it severely affects their quality of life.
Here's the previous video series on ethical and excellent breeders:
Part 1 Red Flags: • Vet's Tips: How to Spo...
Part 2 Detailed Questions: • Vet's Tips: How to Spo...
Part 3 Fad Dogs: • Vet's Voice: The Dange...
Part 4 Litter Evaluation: • Nurturing Healthy Begi...
Info on brachycephalic syndrome: www.acvs.org/small-animal/bra...
Info on Chiari-like malformations and syringomyelia: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti....
Summary of the Norway news: www.google.ca/amp/s/www.thisd...
Genetic assessment of the English Bulldog: cgejournal.biomedcentral.com/...
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Please comment suggesting any subject that you would like Dr. Em to cover next and like this video if you learned something today!

[@which_witch975]

Thank you for telling truth about these breeds. I have king charles spaniel and he suffers from so many genetic issues 😢😢😢. He is a perfect friend but we constantly feel so much stress because of his health problems😫

[@VetMedCorner]

I'm so sorry to hear about how stressful this is for you. My heart aches for you and your dog. It's so very difficult. Thank you so much for your comment, and welcome to VMC!

[@Lemonade_Stand_]

Thank you for explaining the cavalier king charles issues. Im not that familiar with that breed so was unaware of the health issues and honestly didnt even know they were considered brachyphalic until i saw the article.

[@VetMedCorner]

Thank you so much for your comment! As I said in the video, I also learned a lot about the CKCS while researching. I was previously very familiar with their heart, eye and ear issues but did not realize the prevalence of the Chiari-like malformations in the breed!

[@siriusley13]

As a former breeder of Cavalier King Charles and I adore the temperment but they need to open up the stud books and extremely carefully breed for better health. Many breeds are at the point the health and standards need serious attention

[@rylanblack8571]

The photo you show at 7:42 is not a Cavalier King Charles spaniel. It is a King Charles spaniel, also known as an English toy spaniel. Cavaliers have a more elongated snout, whereas the English spaniel was crossed with pugs for the shorter snout. They are two entirely different dogs.

[@rosewoodsteel6656]

You are absolutely correct.

[@cjdflkj]

Yea, Cavaliers do have problems but that photo was not a Cav!

[@imle9279]

I’m Norwegian, and even after this ban has been made, people are still breeding. I’m so confused. People these days are so selfish

[@VetMedCorner]

I'm not Norwegian so I find this very interesting! Do you know who's responsible for enforcement of the ban? I hope that as more time passes the popularity of the two breeds decreases and that they stop being bred as they currently are.

[@imle9279]

@@VetMedCorner in the court it was the Norwegian kennel club (against the ban) and the Norwegian rescue organization (who wanted the ban). I’m totally on the rescue’s side on this, because the breeding of these breeds are only causing pain and problems for the dogs. The rescue organization (dyrebeskyttelsen) has been expressing the problems of these dogs, and how it’s not humane. While the kennel club says they’re “working on fixing the breed” but even the dogs who are registered in the kennel club are having these issues. The rescue won in the court, and the ban was made official. The kennel club is now expressing how sad the ban is, and how it’ll make the breeds go extinct. They’re constantly posting about pugs and bulldogs being healthy and such on their website and social media. They’re gonna take it to court again to stop the ban, which is kinda idiotic in my opinion, just shows that they don’t really care about the ban or the vets who are against this from happening. Cavalier puppies have been popping up on their website recently, showing that they don’t care about the ban. But the english bulldogs hasn’t been bred for a while, until recently when a new litter showed up. It’s really disappointing

[@VetMedCorner]

I appreciate you taking the time to add more detail! It's all so interesting - and the problem with continuing to breed them as is crops up with the lack of genetic diversity meaning there's to opportunity to make them 'better' without doing some outcrossing and maybe changing the breed standard as well... And judges definitely must stop with rewarding individuals who have extreme confirmations etc... It's a complicated mess! I look forward to seeing how it plays out as time passes.

[@imle9279]

@@VetMedCorner I’m extremely passionate about animals, and especially dogs. So I’ve actually been thinking about becoming a judge at these dig shows just to reward healthy dogs. For example bulldogs with a longer muzzle, even if it’s short, a small muzzle is better than none at this point. Either becoming a judge, or one of the people who register dogs. I’ve seen a woman in the Netherlands who has bred french bulldogs, and they have long muzzles. It’s gorgeous. (Hawbucks bulldogs, you can search it up!) I want more of that, so if I can make a change and choose what dogs who are registered and allowed at these dog shows and being bred, I would happily do that. French bulldogs still have variety in their genepool, they’re able to breed out the bad in one generation. English bulldogs and pugs are so deep down into the bad genetics, it’ll take way too long to save them

[@VetMedCorner]

I hope that you can bring many people who have similar passion and ethics with you and make some change for the better! All the best!

[@judithb4202]

Thanks for the video. I didn’t realize that the sleeping positions shown were to protect their airway

[@VetMedCorner]

So many people don't realize that. I don't think I included a picture, but it's also common for them to sleep with a toy in their mouth or with their chin resting on a toy. Every time I see a picture like that it makes me incredibly sad. The best these dogs ever breathe is when they are still intubated, during recovery, from general anesthesia. I truly hope this ban is the start of better things for brachycephalics everywhere. They deserve a life where they can breathe without struggle.

[@judithb4202]

Yeah. I know they hang on to their ET tubes. Sigh :/

[@BelindaTN]

I think any animals that are purposly bred for their deformaties is just wrong and cruel.

[@VetMedCorner]

Thank you for your comment! I hope that if people understand the suffering these animals experience that they will stop buying them. If people only purchase animals from ethical and excellent breeders that will force the rest to do better.

[@jentapsell1137]

Thank you so much for this video. I have known about the bulldog for years and seen some really badly breed King Charles . Education is so important but so difficult to get seen. I agree everyone needs to do their bit. Animals need to stop being a fashion we need to think of the animal and that responsibility is the vets the judges especially the breeders but mostly the owners , if people didn’t want the extremes there wouldn’t be a market in it. We need to stop thinking of the looks we want and instead think of what is important for the animals. Sorry for my two pence but I just find it so upsetting and frustrating. Thank you.

[@VetMedCorner]

I also find it incredibly frustrating and upsetting. There's so much change and education that needs to happen! Thank you for your thoughts.

[@FranciscaAVior]

❤

[@rosewoodsteel6656]

Of the three Cavalier King Charles Spaniels we have owned, none of them have had syringomyelia or any related symptoms. We live in the US, so perhaps it isn't as prevalent here as it is elsewhere. An issue two of my boys did have was mitral valve disease (MVD), which usually develops in a Cavalier's later years. Fortunately, there are treatments for MVD which enable Cavaliers to live happy and productive lives. Before we decided to add two more of this sweet, gentle breed to our family, we ensured that our breeder followed all of the health protocols outlined by the ACKCSC and the AKC. We are hopeful that this screening will reduce the possibility of MVD or other health issues. As for Norway banning the breeding of this wonderful, sweet, intelligent dog, I am sorry that Norwegians won't be able to know the joy that they can bring to their lives.

[@VetMedCorner]

How many times did your veterinary neurologist do MRIs on your dogs?

[@rosewoodsteel6656]

Hi, thanks for the quick reply to my post! Since none of my boys showed any symptoms, I never consulted a veterinary neurologist. Unfortunately, in the US, a pet MRI costs between $3500 and $6,000, which makes them prohibitive as a general tool to use on dogs without symptoms. I understand they are much cheaper in Europe. Hopefully, one day, the price will come down to a affordable level here.@@VetMedCorner

[@991Weeman]

Calling Cavaliers an intelligent dog is stretching the imagination a little bit

[@rosewoodsteel6656]

No stretch with the Cavaliers I have owned. @@991Weeman

[@FranciscaAVior]

Probably the puppies the breeder reject and sell because they don’t meet the “ideal” show standard are the healthiest ones of the litter.

[@Lemonade_Stand_]

What's your opinion on "zeutering" with Zeuterin? It seems like zeutering may be a good solution to help combat stray/rez dogs in Canada and other countries.

[@VetMedCorner]

This is a great question! Zeuterin has some things that make it less ideal. First, it's only able to be given during a narrow (young) age range. Second, it has a fairly high complication rate (most often either a lot of pain as the scar tissue develops, and/or some very nasty scrotal abscesses). While it might be an option in some situations, it's not a panacea! I've volunteered for many spay/neuter clinics on reservations, and am always impressed with the willingness to learn demonstrated by the people who are doing their best to care for these dogs. Education goes a long way, and I hope that it will result in fewer stray dogs in the future.

[@jamesstenning9390]

👏 Brilliant, about time somebody took a stand on these issues

[@jodiecleary2400]

Heya thank you for the video it was very helpful so could the king Charles be fixed with out breeding or do u recon you'd be mixing problems I want to improve this gorgeous breed I got a mixture and now am looking to mix again do you think this would help

[@VetMedCorner]

Hello! Thank you so much for your comment! Unfortunately, it's not that simple and so the best advice for your scenario is to talk to your veterinarian about spaying/neutering. All the best!

[@taradid409]

there are other breeds like pugs and I think chows that are also have horrible skin issues and just look totally deformed how come they were not added to the list to either be fixed or not bred? And when I say fixed I mean outcross so they can make it healthier looking and living pug

[@VetMedCorner]

This is an excellent question! And I did wonder the same thing so I reached out to some colleagues in Europe and my understanding is that the answer involves a few factors. One seems to be the popularity of the breeds. The CKCS is not very popular where I am, but seems to be more popular in that country, and other brachycephalics (like the pug) are less popular there. A second factor seems to be that we have less research into the frequency of health issues and the genetic diversity of other breeds. We need that information so that the best recommendations for the animals can be made. Anyway, that's a summary of what I currently understand about why other brachycephalics were not included (yet). I fully agree with you that there are other breeds that also must be addressed in order to improve their quality of life. I am hopeful that time will come!

[@snoopy_J]

@@VetMedCorner I was going to ask if you could make a video about pugs. But reading this I fear there is still not enough research to do this, right? I don't know if you are familiar with the Netflix series Heartstopper, but it is very popular and I live in constant fear that they will include a pug puppy in filming the next seasons.

[@VetMedCorner]

Thank you so much for asking! I haven't heard of that Netflix show - I'll have to check it out. I can look into what research we have about pugs specifically, and if there's enough for a video I will gladly do one. All the breathing issues apply to all brachycephalic animals, and we require changes for all of them! You may note that I refuse to picture any brachycephalic animals in my videos, unless they are the specific topic being discussed as I don't want to contribute to popularizing them. I also feel immense frustration when watching tv and seeing brachycephalic animals being featured (like the horrific example in Only Murders in the Building - every time I see that dog I cringe and feel incredibly sad).

[@snoopy_J]

@@VetMedCorner I just now realised that making that kind of video and researching for it, could also take its toll on mental health because it is such a heartbreaking subject. Had not thought that through, I'm sorry. As you said in another video, it seems like we (the general public) might be more sensitized to the problem in northern Europe and I wasn't able to find a lot of "poignant" english language resources yet. With "Qualzucht" we also have a quite powerful name for the problem in german, and I feel like that (language) also shapes minds and makes it easier to convey the problem in just one word. But I have saved all the links I found under your videos, thank you :)

[@VetMedCorner]

There's no need to apologize! The load of doing this research and video editing etc is something that I willingly take on as I am passionate about getting some research based information out there for people. I do maintain my boundaries by taking breaks when I need to, and by choosing subjects when I have the bandwidth for them. There's some that are certainly more exhausting than others. I truly appreciate your consideration of me and the toll this takes, plus you've taught me a new word! Qualzucht describes it better than any other way I know! Thank you for your thoughtful contribution to the conversation around the brachycephalic breeds - it makes the effort of doing this worthwhile.

[@FranciscaAVior]

You are so right.

[@walterengler5709]

Sounds like government merely decided to be overreaching. The described problems in the breeds are due to far too many breeders not properly vetting or working to ensure such genetic issues are minimized or reduced in the breed (as they want the quick buck). Now placing some required regulations in regards to breeding for such dogs is more work of course for the government. And being rather lazy, it's simpler to ban the animals. Which just means breeders will go for the quick buck across borders and people will still bring them into the country, and then owners will breed them without proper regulations leading to making the conditions worse in the pups. Yep be lazy, get worse results.

[@GardenLove-yh3rv]

I agree 100% that the King Charles Cavalier should be bred with another breed to increase a healthy genetic pool. My King Charles will turn 7 years old this November 2023 and has had no health issues whatsoever. I am a lucky owner as when I meet other owners of this breed, most have numerous health issues. I agree with Norways ban decision as it is in the best interests of this breed.

[@VetMedCorner]

Thank you for sharing your experience and story, I appreciate it 💜

[@rosewoodsteel6656]

My boy Campo lived until age 15. I believe the life expectancy of a Cavalier is from 9 to 14 years of age. My Charlie lived until age 13. Our mixed, rescue Cavalier, Farley only lived until age 10. Farley had diabetes and MVD. We lost him this past April. He was such a sweet boy and we miss him dearly.

[@christhornycroft3686]

As a guy with Arnold Chiari Malformation due to spina bifida, this is so frustrating. Someone could have easily said my life wasn’t worth it because of my condition. I figure if my life has value, so does a dog.

[@VetMedCorner]

Thank you so much for your comment. I absolutely value your life and hear your concern. If it came across as my advocating for the immediate euthanasia of all the currently living dogs, I sincerely apologize. That is absolutely not what I want to communicate; the lives of these dogs certainly do have value. What I am trying to discuss is the future. When we purpose breed animals, we take on the responsibility of ensuring they have a happy and healthy life, to the best of our ability. That means we need to be producing dogs that are able to do things like breathe comfortably and be pain free. The current genetic pools of the English Bulldog and the CKCS make that impossible. This is especially problematic in dogs because dog-human communication isn’t as robust as human-human communication, and it impacts their welfare even further. Change is necessary because we are responsible for the welfare of the animals we breed, not because their lives don’t have value. Of course, this is entirely different from the ethics and considerations that surround the human species, something I’m especially cognizant of as a disabled veterinarian.

[@wolfgirl1659]

People who breed Cavalier King Charles Spaniels and English Bulldogs are egoistic pieces of shit. Cavaliers are prone to several significant issues including heart disease. They also suffer from luxating patellas, allergies, hip dysplasia, cataracts and syringomyelia. Oh and they also have a skull that is too small for the brain, which causes headache....Stop the breeding of these types of dogs!! It's unethical! Also stop breeding dogs who can barely breathe! These include: Bulldogs (French and English), Boxer Dogs, Boston Terriers, Pekingese, Chinese Pugs, Lhasa Apsos, Shih Tzus, and Bull Mastiffs!

[@wolfgirl1659]

People knowingly, willingly breed these dogs, just for human entertainment.

[@NikkisNaks]

There is a difference in the snout of the King Charles which you showed in the picture. Versus Cavalier King Charles who has a longer snout. This misinformation alone makes me doubt the entirety of your stance.

[@VetMedCorner]

This is a ridiculous comment to make. The body of research is the same no matter what photos are used. I have very limited access to photos/videos that I can use (considering copyright laws etc) and I simply did the best that I could with the resources I have.

[@dearlittleheart]

Toadline dogs are so cruel

[@wolfgirl1659]

People who breed Cavalier King Charles Spaniels and English Bulldogs are egoistic pieces of shit. Cavaliers are prone to several significant issues including heart disease. They also suffer from luxating patellas, allergies, hip dysplasia, cataracts and syringomyelia. Oh and they also have a skull that is too small for the brain, which causes headache....Stop the breeding of these types of dogs!! It's unethical! Also stop breeding dogs who can barely breathe! These include: Bulldogs (French and English), Boxer Dogs, Boston Terriers, Pekingese, Chinese Pugs, Lhasa Apsos, Shih Tzus, and Bull Mastiffs!

[@Starry_Night_Sky7455]

Everything you said 👍👍👍

[@FranciscaAVior]

I think I’ve read that breeders were cross breeding the Cavalier to of all breeds Pugs which have even shorter snouts in order to get that flattened nose and sharp “stop” between the snout and the forehead. Maybe after checking breeding cavaliers that have been MRI shown not to have Chiari with cross breeding them other similar breeds such as cocker spaniels or setters, they can come up with a beautiful cavalier cross that will be healthier, eliminating the harmful traits from the gene pool. So they may be bigger and not have that short nose and that dreaded sharp angled stop between the snout and their forehead, but you’ll have a pet that doesn’t suffer and make you suffer for the length of its short life. We need to stop trying to breed dogs that have the head shape like that of human babies and that look like actual dogs.

[@FranciscaAVior]

The breeding of Shar-pies should also be banned. They have terrible problems with all that excess skin and they need “eye lid lift” surgeries because their inverted eyelids cause the eyelashes to scrape their eyes.