Viewer Request - Oberth Class VS NX Class - BC Legacy - Star Trek Starship Battles

[@Daginni1]

I figured the Oberth at Wolf 359 was there to be in the back line and scanning everything it can about this new hostile cyborg enemy as it was a science ship with advance sensors in its pod. It wasn't doing any real fighting, it was collecting information and sending it back to Star Fleet. Damage done to the Cube and its regeneration ability. Damage to Star Fleet ships from the Borg. Its collected data probably was used to help build the anti-Borg starships that followed.

[@ryanbrochu3336]

Exactly, I've always imagined the Oberth's role in Wolf 359 as a AWAC of sorts.

[@crownprincesebastianjohano7069]

Actually that is a really good insight.

[@lamelama22]

I mean, maybe as a secondary mission.... but we were directly told on screen that they literally just pulled every ship in range that could make it there in time. They even had a Connie there, either literally pulled out of a museum or from being an academy training ship. Their thinking probably didn't get past "it can shoot something, bring it along, 1 extra torpedo in the volley is better than 1 less". Also we know that "it's data" didn't help build future starships, since it got immediately blowed up like the rest and the fleet barely managed to get a garbled mayday or two out...

[@DanBen07]

In the Battle of Wolf 359 at the beginning of Star Trek Deep Space Nine emissary you see one blow up and in First Contact there is one in the background firing phases.

[@Daginni1]

​@@lamelama22 Even a Connie Refit stood more of a chance than a Oberth. Its like brining a Iowa class battleship into a modern battle. She has thick armor still, and big ass cannons. Shields might be lacking, range might be lacking. She might be old, meant for a different time, but she can still do damage. Doesn't matter to the borg though. The Oberth stayed behind all these "Battleships", as the Borg Cube dispatched them like a force never seen. She recorded everything and transmitted. Then, when the Wolf 359 Fleet was turned to slag, ZAP! The defenseless Oberth was also gone with them. The transmitted data however was given to Starfleet. Scientist/Engineers got to work to avenge them. The Anti-Borg fleet followed. "Never again"

[@Jarsia]

Xindi shooting at the NX class "WHY WON"T YOU EXPLODE?!?!" Klingons shooting at the Oberth class "Why did you explode???????" And I don't think Riker cares what kind of ship he serves on, as long as the chairs are mountable. It's the real reason he turned down the Melbourne

[@atomicninjaduck9200]

Well, the Klingons are explicitly a warrior race, and the Bird of Prey, while not being heavily armed, was obviously utilizing weaponry powerful enough to take down a mere science vessel. Especially since, unlike the Nova-Class, it wasn't based off what was originally a warship design. There's also a theory (or two, or three) floating around that "Enterprise" takes place in an alternate timeline where many races had more advanced technology than they normally would've. The explanation for the NX-01 (and why it's named Enterprise, specifically) is because Zephram Cochrane was inspired after he'd seen the Enterprise-E.

[@Jarsia]

@@atomicninjaduck9200 Yeah, but remember the weapons officer got killed for destroying the ship when Kruge wanted prisoners, so clearly it was more fragile than he expected.

[@atomicninjaduck9200]

@@Jarsia "I wanted prisoners!" "A lucky shot, sir!" And one "lucky shot" deserves another!

[@victoriannordmann4333]

I believe Oberth got hit in engineering with it shields down.

[@sharonec5419]

​@@atomicninjaduck9200 Enterprise takes place in the Prime Universe that is proven and true. I think you are confusing Enterprise with JJ Trek. Yes they knew of Enterprise and Porthos but that was before the alternate reality happened.

[@joepeters5228]

Thanks for doing my request!!!! I figured it would be close but I'm happy with the outcome.

[@edwardstpowell]

@RetroBadgerGaming - Excellent video! And thank you to @joepeters5228 for suggesting it! It was epic! Also, I have another very good viewer request, as an extension of this one, for a battle, to bring back captain archer for revenge! He’s now got help! - NX01 Enterprise & NX02 Columbia (Season 4 Versions: Non-Refit), vs Oberth Class!

[@alexslgato1735]

When I saw "Star Trek Legacy", I was thinking it was that other game... glad to see it is the STBC Legacy mod.

[@slickrcbd9543]

Glad I wasn't the only one. Funny enough both the NX and Oberth are in the OTHER "Star Trek:Legacy"

[@PhoenixBird9000]

The Oberth's reputation is ill deserved. It exploded instantly in Star Trek III because it had its shields down, and the Klingon gunner's aim was off, hitting an antimatter pod probably instead of disabling the engines. It's certainly no warship, definitely no match for a Bird of Prey, but certainly had enough armament for a small-time Orion pirate to think twice about tangling with it.

[@Anarchist86ed]

Yes the NX had escape pods.

[@DanBen07]

I'm not sure if they ever called them escape pods but they called them lifeboats in shuttlepod one.

[@Anarchist86ed]

@@DanBen07 Well we know for sure the terran enterprise had them so if an empire that doesn't even care about its own people had them, then you can bet the NX had them.

[@james8449100]

​@@Anarchist86ed Oh yeah and the on if they had the in the mirror universe they must be in the prim

[@Optimusx1]

Hey, I’m the modder. I released an update to make the TOS torpedo look a lot better! I was watching TOS-R when I put this together and was trying to recreate the red bolt torpedoes that version uses. I’ve updated the mod and changed the TOS torpedo to use a classic looking, shiny white torpedo instead. It would look a lot better if you ever featured Legacy again with TOS ships!

[@haloboy456]

this is a great battle it really showcases how long an NX class can last in a fight with a ship over 100 years, it’s senior and technology, by sheer fact that it is, especially by the end of season four, a combat, capable midsize level for the era, anyway expeditionary and tactical cruiser. The Oberth is a underpowered science, vessel, likely with a war drive, not at the bleeding edge of capabilities of its era, that can’t even cover its rear firing, phaser arcs properly let alone an aft photon launcher. so I think this goes to show you that the balancing and Legacy, even if not based in BC remastered per se still doesn’t really great job compared to Kobayashi Maru, which I think does a great job of the feel on screen existing combat, skirmishes or battles we’ve seen, while only being good but fine, and sometimes kind of off in terms of canon balancing.

[@seansteinbacher6449]

Lol imagine being stuck in the delta quadrant in a Oberth class.

[@ericgraham2781]

You made me lol.

[@AdmiralKarelia]

They'd have given up and settled in on Sikaris, if they even made it that far. Trying to cross 70k LY in a 100-year-old short range survey ship would have been suicide.

[@kevinmckenzie1312]

It would have been a short series

[@southsidetattoo]

I don't think they would have made it through the Badlands

[@paulanerruhrpott6188]

We sort of saw that with the Equinox.

[@xander1052]

It'd be cool to see how an Oberth does against other 22nd century ships like the Andorean Battle Cruiser and the Suurok and D'kyr Vulcan ships.

[@deepdivedylan]

Reminds me of encountering an oberth class in a PvP arena in Star Trek Online. The player named it the USS I'm So Screwed.

[@js3599]

I once considered getting an STO Oberth class and naming it either "I'll Tell Your Mommy" or "You Hit Me I Haunt You"... Never did get an Oberth, or use either of those names...

[@Quan10Mack]

I head canoned that the ENT's hull plating was a pre cursor of all Star Trek's structural integrity fields. And yes NX-01 did have escape pods but they were only seen during "In The Mirror Darkly"

[@DanBen07]

Yes you are right about In A Mirror, Darkly they were called escape pods and launch them. I also remember in shuttlepod one Trip & Reed think the ship has been destroyed and mentioned they would have launched lifeboats.

[@manuel_k791]

Seems pretty accurate, Legacy mod seems to have very good balancing. Those shields were tanking almost everything the NX throwed at you.

[@DanBen07]

0:56 Kirk does say in Star Trek 3: "What's the Grissom up to? ...Will she join us, or will she fire on us?" And you can see them fighting the borg the Battle of Wolf 359 in Deep Space Nine emissary & First Contact. 4:01 I don't know how many times it was mentioned but one example is in Enterprise shuttlepod one. Trip and Reed think the ship has been destroyed and they mention about lifeboats (escape pods) Also In A Mirror, Darkly we see the Terran Empire NX Has by name escape pods and launch them.

[@Thy_Boss]

The first Enterprise episode you mention doesn't say what lifeboats are or whether they're the same thing as escape pods. The second Enterprise episode, as you say, is about a different ship that only appears in that two-parter.

[@DanBen07]

@@Thy_Boss In Shuttle pod one they say "TUCKER: How about the lifeboats? They could have launched the lifeboats before the crash. REED: They'd be here. They only go three hundred kph. They'd be right here waiting for us to return." Many people in the comments section have also posted about the mirror Darkly escape pods.

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

Thanks for the info! I totally forgot about the Mirror Universe Episode! It was two of the best as well 😂🖖

[@scpguy1381]

The NX class did have scape pods, or at least its Terran version did

[@crimson8795]

You think the Oberth at Wolf 359 was crazy? Yeah maybe... But what is really crazy is that there was an Oberth at the Battle of Sector 001 on screen in First Contact. You would think they would have switched to Novas by that point.... but oh well.

[@Cyke101]

Oberth in the same battle as the Akira class, the Defiant class, and the Sovereign class. Against a ship that had already wrecked a huge chunk of the fleet. Yeow.

[@thegreenmanofnorwich]

I think that it was a matter of "it has some weapons - it's going"

[@Plasmacore_V]

The Oberth class, a _science_ ship, has a perfect torpedo lock at 5km and _still_ misses.

[@stever3832]

Great match up Badger - this was very interesting and looks as accurate as you could hope for. The TMP era Photon and phasers cut into the NX like a knife through butter. The Oberth shields held against sustained attacks too. What I would love to see is a fleet of 4 NX-01 vs the original TOS Connie. I think we know the Connie will win, but I love to see it kick ass!

[@TiredTimelord]

I always love doing extreme tech matchups like this. Delta flyer vs Connie for example. Love those types of matchup

[@dannolives]

One did sovereign v shuttle craft but sovereign could only use their tractor beam Sov still one. Tractor pulled shuttle into the hull

[@sammygirlie345]

Nice mitchell and web snooker reference there

[@valor1omega]

I remember reading that the Oberth had some of rhe most advanced shields that allowed it to enter Jupiter class planet atmosphere to a decent depth so it could use its sensor pod.

[@tigdamch.6321]

I think people look at the Grisom and forget it was a lucky shot. I can see the Oberth being weak, the mission pod on the bottom is usually a science one so if you imagine how comparatively small its Warp core and reactors are inside it, quite easy to imagine the oberths are underpowered for the situations they are placed in. Oberth's shouldn't be in combat unless its the scout varent and even then it should try to run. Put a modern science ship against a warship and of course they are going to get destroyed but yeah I appreciate this version of the Oberth quite a bit.

[@atomicninjaduck9200]

Yes! 500th like! I just love getting that like meter to a nice round number!

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

Thanks 🖖

[@BoopdaBeep]

The NX class did have escape pods! We see them on screen in the s4 e18 "In A Mirror, Darkly pt. 1" (on the alternate reality Enterprise). They're also referenced by Trip in "Shuttlepod One", s1 e16

[@DanBen07]

Yeah In shuttlepod one they call them lifeboats.

[@Thy_Boss]

The reference in "Shuttlepod One" is to the Tesnian ship's escape pods, not to Enterprise. The episode does refer to "lifeboats" on the Enterprise, but what those are, and whether or not they are the same as escape pods, is entirely left to the viewer to speculate. As for "In a Mirror, Darkly," that's a different ship that only ever appears in that two-parter.

[@DanBen07]

@@Thy_Boss Shuttlepod one Trip & Reed. "TUCKER: How about the lifeboats? They could have launched the lifeboats before the crash. REED: They'd be here. They only go three hundred kph. They'd be right here waiting for us to return." I don't think those two knew the Enterprise encountered an alien ship.

[@stevelapierre4776]

I always found the Oberth class fascinating since the movie '' Search for Spock', but yes like you said, always showing it weak.. and Only after seeing the episode TNG with Riker. an Oberth.. I did not know that and THAT cloaking device, what happened to it.. that was way wicked than ANY cloak.. just saying .. Well done Admiral.. yes I looked it up and NX did have pods, but in the Mirror universe show, showed it.. I forgot that too. hmm. and the Oberth is newer than NX.. I would think could stand on it's own.. still , great video and I like underdog ships..!😊🖖

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

Thanks Steve! The Pegasus was a seriously impressive piece of technology. I'm convinced the Admiral was Section 31. Which means Riker was at some point! Thanks for the info about the escape pods, couldn't remember that! Underdog ships are cool, they are full of surprises. 🖖

[@hudsonball4702]

the NX-01 does have escape pods. At least the ISS Enterprise did. In "A Mirror Darkly" we see some of them get launched as the Tholians blasted it to pieces.

[@walruspolish]

Re Riker serving on an Oberth Class. The Pegasus was originally going to be a Cheyenne class. You can even see the engineering layout for it aboard the Pegasus in the episode. Shame they changed it last minute!

[@Daginni1]

The Pod below was exchangeable. Its why the Oberth was so useful for so long. Not the ship itself; the ship was a antique at the time of TNG, the pod however could contain whatever experimental device they needed. Even a phasic cloaking device.

[@walruspolish]

@@Daginni1 that's ace, I never knew that. Similar to the nebula in that sense then.

[@Thy_Boss]

Seems instead like a good choice for them to use the ship with a quality model instead of the last-second kitbash.

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

@walruspolish WOW! I never knew that! 🖖

[@walruspolish]

@@RetroBadgerGaming that's the beauty of trek isn't it? Even after almost 60 years I still keep finding out something new.

[@Ol-T1864]

The NX in Mirror Darkly has escape pods. They come out of the pot and starboard cargo hatch area.

[@DanBen07]

Shuttlepod one Trip & Reed think the ship has been destroyed and mentioned they would have launched lifeboats.

[@SiXiam]

@@DanBen07 Also Trip and that princess were in an escape pod, but I don't think it was Starfleet.

[@js3599]

I'm pretty sure that Captain Archer would have figured out how to ignite the explodium hull on the Oberth at some point in the battle... Even if only by accident...

[@mark__glass]

I remember the Oberth being the first vessel you could use in some Star Trek combat sim... can't remember which game it was...

[@slickrcbd9543]

Star Trek Starfleet Academy

[@dahlesa]

I'm suprised that Oberth-class was constructed when Federation and Klingon Empire were basically at semi-war state. But those were different times.

[@Daginni1]

The Oberth's is a glorified tugboat. Its customizable pod is its true longevity. You could put any experimental tech in that, and when in doubt it is easy to eject the pod from the ship itself.

[@arm514ve5]

That is a nice oberth model but I could have sworn oberth s had 1 torp a phaser aft

[@MSR-1701]

Oberth, will always live in our hearts😅

[@Daginni1]

Oberth, exploding in our hearts.

[@AussieTrekkie79]

Considering the Oberth wasn't exactly a top of the line vessel it would never have received top tier equipment since it's role was internal exploration of Federation space and logistics since some variants were used for towing and cargo transportation. It was a mass produced ship that was highly customisable to fit specific rolls so in comparison to the NX class it would realistically be about 50 to 75 years more advanced than the NX, it's weapons and shields would not be capable of defending against anything bigger than a pirate vessel maybe a small Klingon bird-of-prey if it detected them in time.

[@Saintbow]

Tripp is going to be pissed...

[@mijimonmaster]

Is there a game version of the dreadnaught class from "Into Darkness"? Would like to see that in action.

[@kenwynn3871]

Any Oberths at Wolf359 were probably there as a support role either as sensor coverage or as a relay coordinating battle group comms

[@compmanio36]

It did have escape pods. You see them launch in the mirror universe episode where they're trying to get the Defiant, as the NX class is stuck in the Tholian web.

[@Daginni1]

Borg Cube probably saw escape pods as "free drones" to be honest. Dont think the Escape Pods had very effective Protection to the Borg just simply using a transporter beam to suck the crew right into the Borg Cube. Sisko is lucky.

[@DanBen07]

I also remember in shuttlepod one Trip & Reed think the ship has been destroyed and mentioned they would have launched lifeboats.

[@AllknowingUnknown]

You were so preoccupied with whether or not you could, you didn't stop to think if you should...

[@johnassal5838]

Wait if the entire "engineering hull" of an Oberth is just an auxiliary pod then just the saucer, nacelles and that flat bit connecting them should result in a significantly more maneuverable and better shielded light patrol craft. That's an interesting little ship more like a lighter armed and armored defiant. Heck imagine a weapons pod even a quarter the size of the science pod and you've got a cheaper escort option than a defiant or Akira. By rights they ought to have turned out 10,000 of them for the Dominion War.

[@dave4803]

If you look at the ship plans you see other classes without the pod and it is described as a patrol ship or light gun ship.

[@johnassal5838]

@@dave4803 Where did you find those? That's cool, just a shame we never got to see that in the various series. Though now that I think of it that might account for the blink and you miss them system defense craft that charge at the Borg Cube when it reaches Earth after Wolf 359. Not that I ever found much on them outside blurry screen grabs and a few lines on Memory Alpha that doesn't mention any of this but they did have very chunky saucers with different nacelles in broadly similar arrangement.

[@dave4803]

@@johnassal5838 In the link I sent doesn't show try typing in oberth class variants on google pictures.

[@Renserin]

Nice to have the Oberth get its honor back. I'd actually be curious to see how lucky Kruge's shot was, by recreating the scene from STIII with full shields on the Grissom, but it'd be more for giggles, since there are other battles I'd like that are far more interesting and enjoyable.

[@dave4803]

The NX did have escape pods as seen in the mirror universe eps towards the end.

[@ransom182]

But do they exist on the prime universe version?

[@dave4803]

@@ransom182 In an ep where they were telling ghost stories they mention two older classes of star fleet ships had them. If older classes had them it stands to reason the newer flag ship most have them. And I think in the ep "shuttle pod one" where they think Enterprise was destroyed they mention escape pods. And in the blueprints for the prime universe Enterprise it has them listed.

[@Thy_Boss]

@@dave4803 They mention "lifeboats" in Enterprise (and escape pods on a different ship), but whether lifeboats are the same as escape pods is entirely open to speculation. The episode only makes clear that "lifeboats" might contain survivors.

[@DanBen07]

The prime timeline they had lifeboats & is mentioned in shuttlepod one where trip and Reed think the ship is destroyed and mentioned they would have launched lifeboats.

[@dave4803]

@@Thy_Boss They are the same thing, just a different term for them.

[@Toycoma]

You did it when I asked the first time lol

[@Adarkane325xi]

To be fair, it gets one-shot in ST3. It’s such a cool looking ship, Leonard Nimoy shrewdly allowed ILM to design the ships and spacedock themselves, and what do we get? 4 popular designs from one movie that have endured for 40yrs - spacedock being in Picard S3.

[@slickrcbd9543]

Although it was a sucker punch with the shields down, and even the gunners were surprised it blew up in one shot and said it was "a lucky shot". I liken it to the WWII British battle-cruiser Hood which also got blown up with a lucky shot to the magazines in the first volley.

[@b003]

Oberth class equipped with "dramatically advance the story shields."

[@MarinaSally]

Yes the NX did have escape pods in the episode A mirror darkly they where used 😮😮

[@DanBen07]

I also remember in shuttlepod one Trip & Reed think the ship has been destroyed and mentioned they would have launched lifeboats.

[@tra-viskaiser8737]

The grissom was hit while its sheilds were still forming up.. or so i like to think. Edit - also its not known what exactly hit the grissom. Was it a photon torp? Or was it some plasma torp like balance of terror? Wolf 359 was scraping the barrel. Thats why the constitution class and federation refits in the fight. The oberth(bonestell?) Was probably there for sensor jamming or escape pod retrieval. And after it was seen how bad the fight was going, they got their dander up... and went in for a run or two. Then got swatted...

[@kevinwestrom4775]

I'm surprised you didn't do it both ways. It might have been a good matchup.

[@Optimusx1]

Thank you so much for featuring the Legacy mod! One request: can you refer to this as Bridge Commander Legacy, instead of Star Trek Legacy? I don’t want the mod confused with that other game or the show Terry Matalas wants to make 😊

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

Your very Wellcome! It's so much fun. Of course! Apologies for the Mis-naming. I'll update the descriptions as well 🖖

[@dougsmith6262]

Every time I see an Oberth, I seethe since I'm reminded of the damned USS Banting from Starfleet Academy: Starship Bridge Simulator for the SNES. That was one criminally under powered ship, lol.

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

LOL! I always wanted to play that game. Was it good? I'll avoid the Oberth if I Try it 🤣🖖

[@dougsmith6262]

@RetroBadgerGaming It's not a bad game. But your starter ship is an Oberth, and it sucks ass lol. The game gets better as you progress and get to use the Constitution and Excelsior classes.

[@slickrcbd9543]

To be fair, it was a science ship, not a ship of the line, and it was an older one. That said, the game is partially skill based and it is possible to beat some of the other races' heavy ships (probably not the Phoenix, but everything else) with it.

[@TBG_exe]

How about the Oberth vs the NX Refit?

[@gragvar]

Different schools of thought on the Oberth pod

[@paulbeaney4901]

To be fair, the USS Griffin takes a klingon torpedo (which is stronger than federation torpedoes of the time) directly to its engine. Which im guessing means reactor considering where it hit.

[@acebrandon3522]

The NX does have fully functioning escape pods. As seen in the 2 - part episode of the Terran Empire "Defiant". The Oberth refit has rear phaser bank as well as a forward ventical phaser split bank that equals 6 cannons total and a rear launcher for probes and torps.

[@DanBen07]

I also remember in shuttlepod one Trip & Reed think the ship has been destroyed and mentioned they would have launched lifeboats.

[@s.patrickmarino7289]

Two things about the NX and escape pods: First, what use would they be? I doubt they would have warp drive. They would be very far from help. They would be very lucky to be in a system with a habitable world. Even if they were, they might not make it. The space might be better used for redundant systems and supplies for repair. Second, if they never needed them, would we have seen them on screen? We never see the compartment where they store the dog washing supplies. That's not to say they did not have it on deck 6, forward section.

[@Thy_Boss]

_Enterprise,_ like the rest of Star Trek on TV, was usually as close to a friendly (or hostile) presence in space as the script demanded. There wasn't a season of the show where they didn't bump into a Vulcan ship.

[@DanBen07]

The NX Enterprise in prime timeline has lifeboats as mentioned in shuttlepod One. In A Mirror, Darkly Terran Empire Enterprise has escape pods and launches them.

[@ransom182]

Seems like a logical result. Though the phaser re-charge rate seems a touch slow on the Oberth, but too be fair I subscribe to the idea that the Oberth is a gunship with a science module bolted to the bottom...

[@thegreenmanofnorwich]

I've always been very fond of the Oberth. No it's not a front-line combat ship or anything, but they are starfleet ships, and they are armed and have crews that will fight somewhat competently with what they have if called upon

[@darrensmith6999]

Don't fancy going up against the Borg in one of those (:

[@Werewolfmage]

they were fun to use in klingon academy. super fast ship good for hit and runs and most the time you can dodge any torps. same with the Bop. going up against them was a pain if you had a slower ship say like a connie. 2 of them would completely wreck you if you knew how to fly them right

[@denbaker7358]

Was there an option to select the enemy ships on PC for star trek legacy as on 360 all you could do was set the ship points available

[@adcraziness1501]

They [Oberth class] are much weaker than the larger ships of the same time period, that is for sure. It was picking on the NX class here but it has better weapons and it had shields. The NX bravely explored the vastness of space without "any protection at all" according to Shran, which I agreed with. Took an Andorian to put the Vulcans in their proper place. How can you you call humans your allies and let them explore space with your own officers without sharing shield tech? The most basic of defenses. Thank you Shran.

[@ace1gl]

The NX had no shield. Just polarized hull plating. 25 photos from the tos would destroy that thing 5 times over. The phase cannons of that era wouldn't even dent the tos shields. Always hate these battles with future tech, because it wouldn't even be close.

[@stever3832]

Oberth is TMP (movie era) not TOS.

[@darkmatter1152]

They upgraded those phase cannons. They'd still lose but cause more damage. Remember they destroyed a mountain on a moon.

[@Heretic451]

To be fair, the Grissom didn't have its shields up. And those seen in TNG era have undoubtedly been upgraded, though still old ships.

[@NexusSeries6]

I always thought that the NX01 never looked old enough

[@Optimusx1]

The Pegasus was originally going to be a new class of ship, but they didn’t have time to build the model. Check out this length to see what it would’ve looked like. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKG5lXWLhqaAbrcsi=2BW0gl44Jh0cOAsy

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

WOW! I've never seen that before. Thanks for the info 🖖

[@ThatMetalheadMan]

it is possible an Oberth can be kitted out with some mean stuff. Supposedly some of the most advanced tech is tested on them,including a lot of what went into the Galaxy class.

[@vardicd1477]

I mean a lot of it depends on how the Oberth in question is loaded out. Not all Oberth class ships were built the same. It's a common misconception that if you've seen one you've seen them all. A lot of Oberth class ships were handed over to civilians for use as personal ships or civilian science ships, so they have lesser weapons and defenses.

[@zoberraz]

I would have thought the NX class would have had the Oberth a little more on the ropes. It was really until that last frontal torpedo volley that the Oberth sustained any damage.

[@KJAkk]

Oberth Class vs a TOS movie bird of prey head to head instead of by surprise. Also are the Jester and Orca variants of the Oberth available?

[@jyralnadreth4442]

USS Bonestell was at Wolf 359....in STO it was used as bait but in the Beta Canon it was used to record tactical data on the battle. No idea why the Borg would fire on it though as its hardly a threat.

[@Daginni1]

Locutus of Borg knew what the Oberth was doing. Destroy it before it could discover a weakness. A Borg without him wouldn't of known.

[@Bu2Spike]

Would you a few more battle of the oberth classes, i know that they had many more types of oberth without the science pod, id like to see them and see if 3 oberth class ships without the science pods could take out 1 Miranda class from the motion picture movie time period

[@brianmitchell6210]

Oberth is a match for NX since it has shields and improved phasers (even if defensive rated only) that will give the Oberth the ability to overcome NX outdated tech. NX was still advanced for its time but not enough to compensate for a 100-year technology leap. Now the NX-refit could have been more challenging for the Oberth.

[@Co3471]

I think everyone expects the Oberth to get 1 shot, because it pretty much did in ST III, lol. But to be fair its shields were down at the time, and I would hope Starfleet would have improved it's defences by the TNG era.

[@thereare4lights17]

Why didn't the Oberth just explode at the start of the game?

[@toryunaminosaki1022]

NX defeating an Oberth? not without some ridiculous plot armor. a mirror NX, though...maybe

[@draconiangaming4856]

Id like to see the oberth go against a nova class Also on enterprise episode mirror mirror it showed that nx to have escape pods so id think the normal one would have as well, yes there the argument why did they use it when it was being attacked by the xindi but enterprise was to badly damaged to use them

[@jyralnadreth4442]

The Nova would smash multiple Oberths 😂 Nova Class ships are well armed and tough especially since the Equinox survived several major beatings for different races and still kept flying

[@chippers9912]

I requested originally and I was pretty shocked by the outcome then I have to admit though I still think the oberth would have had a easier job than that to beat a nx class. Do you know if the oberth is tng era or original movie era

[@jasontechlord]

NX-01 escape pods were features in an alternative version of the Enterprise in the episode Through A Mirror Darkly part 1. I would assume that if they were featured in a society that doesn't care about their crew in general they would be on the prime universe ship.

[@Thy_Boss]

You could reason the opposite way: Empire ships are divided among self-interested factions, and each are each more likely to defy orders to survive than is a Federation crew willing to sacrifice for each other; escape pods are necessary as an uneasy compromise to prevent near-immediate mutiny if the captain's gang puts the other gangs in jeopardy by doing anything dangerous with the ship. It would really come down to how the writer for the script chose to write it.

[@DanBen07]

In the prime universe the NX had lifeboats it was mentioned in Enterprise shuttlepod one.

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

Thanks for the info 🖖

[@1stprinceoflite]

Wasn't the Oberth more a support vessel?

[@Raso719]

Oberth swarm vs Scimitar! How many Oberth to take out a single Romulan dreadnought?

[@tyro244]

I used to play Star Trek: Birth of the Federation ( styled on Civ ) and the Oberth is the first ship you could build. I often ended up with entire fleets of 20 Oberths taking on and one-shoting a lone Klingon Cruiser or a Romulan Warbird. so now I'm wondering how a fleet of 20 Oberths could handle a cruiser of each Empire of the Alpha Quadrant.

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

HAHA! That's crazy. I never thought of doing it that way. Pretty sure it took 1 turn to build an Oberth in BOTF. I'll add that to the list, sounds like an awesome idea 🖖

[@TrentonBennett]

The only problem I have with the Oberth is that there are NO visible sign of any armament. At least this version of the Oberth shows phasers and a torpedo launcher. There's definitely a time gap between these two technologies. You: I guess we all got to start some where. -Yup you're right on that one. The Enterprise had escape pods in "In A Mirror Darkly". I don't think it officially had them in our universe. This result is more accurate.

[@DanBen07]

The Oberth USS Grissom was mentioned to have weapons in Star Trek III. And they fight the Borg in DS9 emissary and first Contact. In our universe the NX has something called lifeboats that they would have launched as mentioned in Ent Shuttlepod one.

[@Mikethemerciless11]

One of the things that kind of irritates me about Star Trek is that the idea that something is more advanced means automatically that it's generally better than previous designs, and that whatever came before is somehow weaker or cannot do much to the new design. This is very simplistic thinking, and doesn't reflect reality. What matters is what a vehicle, a ship, or whatever is designed for. To be fair, Star Trek hasn't always done this, but that's the general train of thought. For example; a Nimitz or a Ford-class aircraft carrier is a very advanced ship by comparison to the Iowa-class battleships. But these are totally different vessels. One carries more than 90 different aircraft. The other is a gun platform, featuring nine sixteen inch guns. If you were to put an Iowa up against a Nimitz, without the NImitz using its aircraft, that Iowa will rip a Nimitz apart, and it doesn't really need its sixteen inch guns to do it. A few broadsides of its five inch guns, which can fire out to like nine nautical miles, will make short work of an aircraft carrier, because the carrier is not designed to be able to fight like this. On the other hand, an aircraft carrier can strike a target from hundreds of miles out thanks to its aircraft, and can hit it multiple times as needed, but with modern armaments one or two sorties is enough. Star Trek doesn't really define what any of its weapons or shields or other systems do beyond the basics. If you consider that, we really don't know how much more advanced Picard's Enterprise was versus Kirk's Enterprise. We presume it's more advanced, because of the Galaxy's look, and some of its features. But, a phaser is still a phaser, right, and a photon torpedo is still a photon torpedo. We also presume the Galaxy-class Enterprise can channel more power to the phasers and shields than the Constitution-class Enterprise, but how much we really don't know. If Kirk's Enterprise were to fire a fully charged phaser at an unshielded Picard's Enterprise, how much damage would it do? We don't really know. In one sense, if the firepower of a Galaxy isn't that much better than a Constitution, that makes some sense. Because, if you think about it, weapons technology in our day and age really hasn't changed all that much, fundamentally speaking, since the Vietnam War. Other aspects of that technology has changed, has made things a lot better in so many ways, but not the guns and armament generally themselves. Better sensors, better guidance systems, better communications and advanced computers, and other things, have made the technology better. Until there is a major fundamental change caused by a new kind of tactic or weapon that gets around enemy defences in a radically different way (stealth, satellite technology, and now drones come to mind), not much would change. Star Trek ships fight, really, not much differently in the 24th or even 25th Century than they did in the 23rd. What I'm saying here is that, by rights, the NX-01 probably ought to be able to defeat an Oberth-class, because the Oberth is not meant to be fighting at all. The purpose of its armament is to give the enemy something to think about while the ship gets away. Similarly, I always thought that the NX-01 Enterprise's armament was meant to do likewise; it's not a combat vessel, and wasn't really designed to be one. The NX-01 is, perhaps, more combat capable than the Oberth in certain ways, because it's meant to be a bit of a jack-of-some-trades, so to speak; maybe like a light frigate with exploration capabilities.

[@jamesk9321]

You've made some interesting points and I just want to.chime in a couple of things. In the Star Trek universe, phasers, torpedoes and shields are constantly being upgraded. Various technical manuals specify "Type 1, 2, etc" but the gist is they all become more powerful. So weapons become more powerful to penetrate shields, shields become more powerful to repel the weapons and back and forth. So Kirk era weapons wouldn't really be a threat to TNG era Starfleet ships for the most part. You brought up Vietnam War technology. The 70 year or so gap between Kirk and Picard is probably more appropriately framed by WW2 to today. Think of US Army Air Corps planes going against the Air Force of today. While bullets are still principally the same, think of how much lighter the rifles are, their rate of flre, and the ease of target acquisition.

[@Mikethemerciless11]

@@jamesk9321 I think you might be misunderstanding what I'm saying here. The truth about these systems portrayed in later eras of Star Trek is that we presume that they are better in certain ways, but those are presumptions. Those upgrades to those systems could mean a lot of different things, such as better accuracy, more efficiency, possibly greater range, etc. Not necessarily better overall firepower. One thing, for instance, about the "collimator phaser strips" used by TNG era Starfleet vessels versus the phaser bank turrets used by Kirk's era is that I think they obviously offer better firing arcs, to be able to put multiple phasers on one target. However, they're also kind of a big target than the phaser banks Kirk utilized. We don't really know what happens if there's damage taken to one section of those strips; does the rest of the system continue to function and cannot function in that particular arc, or what? The TNG era features a higher warp speeds, and their warp engines can recrystalize dilithium crystals right inside the chamber, which means, to my way of thinking, a design that allows the TNG era ships greater range because now it doesn't have to constantly change out crystals as needed before. Which means that what they're carrying will last longer, without the need for tenders to constantly resupply those, and now you can have tenders go out to replenish matter-antimatter pods and deuterium, along with other necessities, thus reducing a ship's logistical needs considerably. This makes the TNG era Starfleet ships a bit more versatile. They also feature torpedoes that can separate into multiple torpedoes. That's pretty good, and I gather that increases a ship's overall firepower that it can bear against a target. However, we don't really know if they, from an individual firepower perspective, all that much better than a torpedo from Kirk's era. Does it really need to be better? Because, as I said, when I compared Vietnam era weapons to today's weapons, I wasn't talking so much about other aspects of modern technology so much as I was talking about the guns, the bullets, and the warheads themselves. We still use munitions that aren't all that much different than what we used in Vietnam. The M-4 rifle is really not much different than the M-16 rifles we used in Vietnam, and much of the ordinance we used back then is, by and large, still the same things we use today. All we've done is make how we deliver and deploy these weapons much better. What took hundreds, even thousands of sorties in Vietnam to destroy one bridge over the course of like three years and the losses of several aircraft can now be done using the same explosive yields, but with one sortie, thanks to things like better guidance, satellite technology to be able to see the target and assess damage and defences, stealth, and other things. Communications, also, has radically changed; and thanks to computers, we can direct fire from someone who may not have any weapons to engage, with pinpoint accuracy, upon a target using a different platform by sharing that information with that platform. We couldn't' do that in Vietnam. So, what I'm saying is that while I think TNG era Starfleet vessels are better in various aspects, Kirk's Enterprise could still pose a threat to Picard's Enterprise. If Kirk were to pull an ambush, and strike Picard's ship similar to how Khan did so to Kirk in Wrath of Khan, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Picard would have a mess on his hands. There was one episode of TNG where the Enterprise-D had to track down an older 23rd Century era Klingon K'tinga, hopefully before the crew woke up from being in stasis. That ship was able to take a shot at the Enterprise, even kind of rattle them, before they cloaked. So, their weapons can be dangerous. Again, I'm not saying Picard's Enterprise is out-matched here, at all, but I'm saying that it seems to me that the weapons and tactics used from one era to the next haven't changed all that much. Could a squadron of Kirk era vessels handle one Galaxy? I think it's very possible.

[@nicoferguson1215]

Remind me, what happened to the oberth that was in Star Trek III? Didn't it get one shot?

[@stever3832]

Yes, but Klingon offenses are powerful and it was of the same era.

[@nicoferguson1215]

@@stever3832 fair

[@walruspolish]

It did indeed!

[@reecedrury4145]

Mirandas got one shotted in DS9

[@southsidetattoo]

Put the same weapons and shields on the NX. Just out of curiosity where's Reid and the overloaded phase cannons ?

[@james8449100]

NX escape pods are mentioned in season 1 episode 16

[@joelker41]

The War Canoe is undefeated.

[@MrComicalmoodydan]

Would be nice to see the Oberth face an NX-Refit.

[@sharonec5419]

The Oberth class just like a connie or a ln Execelsior or even a Galaxy class has two hull. It has the primery hull and that part you think is the sensor pod lol is its secondery hull where its engineering snd warp core are. No way you would fit them all into the tiny primery hull.

[@boogaboogaboogaable]

I always assumed the science pod was just a cover and that 50% of Oberths had a single use planet killer mega torpedo.

[@DanBen07]

I'm not sure if in one of the movies we saw one without the pod and it had a warp nacelle.

[@getothechoppa114]

I agree, No federation ship would be that weak. They make the runabout seem more powerful. At wolf 359 I would have used this ship as a warp reactor war head kamikaze missile 😅🖖

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

😂😂😂 smashing a few of these into a Borg Cube could be quite effective 🖖

[@src6339]

In theory, the oberth class should be equiped with better, more developed, highly reliable, mass-produced systems with all the kinks worked out. Even in the event that it didn't stand a chance in a straight up fight, the crew should be able to detect and identify more primative oponents and, if need be, escape before they're spotted, even vs primative ships with "invisibility screens". If you take the movie "generations" and the ds9 tos tribble crossover into consideration, they should even be able to just detect the older ships' shield modulations, recalibrate their weapons, and fire straight through them. The fact that this simulation forces a "fair confrontation" is really nurfing the oberths less obvious advantages here. 🤔

[@tigerbread78]

"And that's a bad miss" Mitchell and Webb fan, I see

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

Indeed! I'm so happy someone finally spotted that 😂🖖

[@samspeed6271]

The NX has escape pods, or at least the mirror universe NX does. I'm satisfied with the result. I assumed that Grissom hadn't raised her shields in time when she got one shot killed by Klingon Doc Brown in ST-III.

[@DanBen07]

The NX has something called lifeboats that they would have launched it was mentioned in shuttlepod one. And in Star Trek 3 Kirk does wonder if the Grissom will open fire on them.

[@samspeed6271]

@@DanBen07 oh yeah, I remember now about Lifeboats. Shuttlepod One is such a fantastic episode. Also, given the state that Enterprise was in when she entered Genesis orbit, my money would be on Grissom in that fight. Enterprise was in no fit state for a fight.

[@IceGavel]

The only reason the Oberth was at Wolf 359 is because they needed every ship that could get there in time. They rushed one of the two Akira testbeds, USS Kaneda, out of Utopia Planitia early, as they did with the Nebula-class USS Melbourne that was about to enter service to replace the Excelsior-class Melbourne that was _also_ destroyed at Wolf 359. The USS Republic, a Constitution-class _training ship_ that had long since been decommissioned from regular service was also present. An Oberth being sent to Wolf 359 isn't a sign that the ship's combat capabilities were impressive, it's a sign of just how _desperate_ Starfleet was thanks to the golden age of the Federation causing a lull in Starfleet ship construction. If you haven't, go look up the Wolf 359 Project, it's a fanmade in-universe documentary novel detailing a lot of the events of the battle, some of which is admittedly less than canon but is of high enough quality that I'd say it _should_ be canon. Give it a read when you can.

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

Thanks for the info. I'll check the Project out 🖖

[@brianburke3460]

Bingo's pretty good battle x class is pretty powerful

[@crownprincesebastianjohano7069]

Re: Riker. Pegasus was a test-bed ship, so not the ordinary Oberth. Getting assigned to a ship like that would be semi-prestigious. In fact, I am surprised they assigned new ensigns to it. Usually test programs are manned by the best and most experienced officers and men.

[@RetroBadgerGaming]

Cool! That's a fair point. The phased cloak was mighty impressive. You have to wonder if Admiral Pressman was Section 31. We know he was Intelligence, but they never say S31. 🖖

[@crownprincesebastianjohano7069]

@@RetroBadgerGaming It is a good bet that he was, or at least worked with them on occasion.

[@crownprincesebastianjohano7069]

The Oberth isn't the only ship that gets one-shotted. It really depends on the parties involved. Generally speaking a battleship or station may be able to one-shot an attack ship. DS9 could one-shot B'Rel BoPs and Bug Ships with its Type XI Phaser Emplacements. Certain cruisers have Lances, like the Galor IIIs and IVs that are noted for one-shotting ships from attack ships to heavy cruisers. In "Sacrifice of Angels," we see a Miranda, Steamrunner and even an Akira one-shotted by Galors. They also one-shot BoPs, Bugs and Breen Frigates. A Jem Hadar battlecruiser one-shots a Miranda. No shame in an Oberth being merked like that. The Oberth is not designed with battle in mind. Much more rugged ships have been killed thusly.

[@dazlovescarter]

The NX class had escape pods, we saw the in ‘In a Mirror Darkly’ the Terran Enterprise. It was obvious the Oberth is gonna win, technically wasnt a fair fight. The NX was clearly going to be destroyed

[@DanBen07]

The prime timeline NX class had lifeboats mentioned in Enterprise shuttlepod one.

[@dazlovescarter]

@@DanBen07 of course the Prime universe NX had them lol