War Thunder VS Reality: MiG-21

[@miquelescribanoivars5049]

0:17 Gunless MiG-21's were dedicated all-weather interceptors models (PF and derivatives), the even earlier prototypes and MiG-21F and F-13 day fighters had guns.

[@Lightning_Mike]

And, funny enough, those didn't have radars! Just rangefinders for the gunsight

[@noviceThelizard]

@@Lightning_Mike im a bit curious. if they didn't have radars, how do their missiles lock-on to a target?

[@Lightning_Mike]

@@noviceThelizard They used the missile's own infrared sensor. Just point the nose at the target and wait for lock tone.

[@danko8983]

@@noviceThelizard not all missiles uses radar to guide them to the target, and even less at that time, the early MiG-21s used R-3S which is a reverse engineering AIM-9B, a IR guided missile

[@Registered_Simp]

Additionally, while the Mig-21's in War Thunder are known for being quite capable of very high-alpha maneuvers, this actually took a rather skilled pilot to pull off and maintain in real life, as the plane was less stable in this state than you may think playing the game.

[@DerSpeggn]

In War Thunder every plane handles like a modern fly by wire plane though. Even the props... Even though these planes have super stabilty, they can become unstable due to battle damage but the "instructor" fbw system compensates for that in the game.

[@abroamg]

In RB realism is not required

[@irgiefarras]

@@abroamg i thought spotting system and 3rd person view are already not realistic enough

[@squidwardo7074]

you can see this in action in DCS even

[@nighthawk6755]

@@DerSpeggn not in sim so when 4th gen will come with fbw it will become far easier in sim cuz i can tell you rate fight in mig21 in sim is not easy to much roll during an hard turn flat spin if you don correct with the rudder or just break your wing with g overload

[@theScottishKoala]

A pointer on the MiG-21bis’ second stage afterburner - currently the thrust output is roughly halfway between the historical output of the 1st and 2nd stage, rather than being accurate to either

[@lamborgatti-4783]

Who gives a fuck,the f4e top speed and acceleration isnt even modeled right,

[@mudmud.]

@@lamborgatti-4783 Yeah like most of top tier jet so who give a fuck ?

[@152mmapfsds]

Bruh: (

[@pjayx7320]

While the afterburner use in WT's 21bis is unlimited, keep in mind that it produces nowhere near the thrust it produced irl. They also significantly nerfed the flight model multiple times now.

[@vaccuumrolls7243]

That’s because it used to have an over performing model in which unlimited use of the 2000kgf emergency burner was allowed, while in reality this could be used for 2 minutes before the engine would sustain significant damage. The afterburner in game now is just the first stage one. Gaijin said in a devblog it was easier to model that way (only stage 1 or only stage 2) due to how the game engine was coded, but removing it is more accurate historically as well.

[@collander7766]

literally who cares, the BiS has a 1.07 TWR in a standstill. The numbers are technically wrong but the acceleration and climb rate match.

[@ГеоргийМурзич]

If there was a 2 min limit for a special ab Mode then that means that the engine wouldn't get any damage during that period of time

[@FuturPaladin489]

@@vaccuumrolls7243 its 3 minutes with a 30 secondes cool down, if the 2nd stage was used at any point the entire engine would be disassembled when the jet came back

[@l.a.xgunner]

Mig-21s are also notorious for their engines stalling out if you pulled Gs too hard.

[@anonanon3385]

Mig-21 in war thunder : aoa and twr that rivals 4th gen aircraft Mig-21 in real life : "The widow maker", absolute horrible aoa performance at high speed (very, very unstable) would get obliterated by a phantom in a turn fight if the emergency afterburner isn't used.

[@FuturPaladin489]

The widow maker was the f104

[@appa609]

Honestly afterburners need to get an overhaul. There's no reason to retain the acronym wep. Plenty of afterburning plames use AB routinely for takeoff and climbout in peacetime. More modern planes like the F-15A that's on the horizon should have 7 stages of afterburner plus a limited time V-max. Scroll to 100%, then one scroll wheel click for each successive afterburner detente.

[@lexthemystic3541]

As a Romanian, I am very happy you mentioned the LanceR variant! I do hope we see it as an Israeli Premium in the future, as it was an Israeli company that modernized their MiG-21s to the LanceR As (CAS), Bs (Trainers), and Cs (Air-to-Air).

[@retardmoguss]

LanceR is a sexy name too for a mig21. Lovely jet y'all got there.

[@moravianmargrave6509]

In Czechoslovakia there was a joke among MiG-21 pilots that if you wanted to turn around 180, you'd be turning above Poland. This is how maneuverable the aircraft was - not at all. In fact Vietnamese pilots also learned that the hard way so they often stayed hidden in clouds or behind mountains and would hit and run American fighter-bomber formations instead of turnfight.

[@Lightning_Mike]

About the LanceR: It can fire Python-4s, which can be slaved to the helmet. We were likely the first NATO country to use a proper modern HMCS, the Israeli DASH-III

[@antonytheocharidis9576]

Question about the two stage afterburner. The one we have in-game is unlimited, but is it not also just the first stage one, rather than the dangerous second stage one?

[@piscessoedroen]

Yea pretty sure up until mid 2021 the bis were always using 2nd stage. Then they got patched and uses 1st stage

[@miquelescribanoivars5049]

@@piscessoedroen I think that's how its modelled now to since the game can't handle 2-stage afb

[@dyren7437]

The video explanation is partially incorrect. The MiG-21 has an "emergency afterburner", which is only usable by flipping a switch in the cockpit, not by pushing the throttle more forward. This is different from for example the viggen which has 3 stages of afterburner, all accessable by moving the throttle further.

[@ukoctane3337]

@@piscessoedroen its still 2nd stage. Performance of the 21Bis roughly matches that of one slamming its 2nd stage afterburner.

[@loopoval2066]

@@ukoctane3337 I think that’s due more to Gaijin still not being able to get the MiG’s drag profile right, not the engine thrust though

[@Sultan-cf5wf]

0:58 the SMT has this modeled in game, too. You can tell if it's active by observing fuel flow rate.

[@llx-red_oppz-xll7.62.51]

He forgot the fact that phantoms kicked Mig ass in Vietnam but in war thunder there horribly outclassed

[@abroamg]

Yeah the phantoms in warthunder think furballs are the way to go 😂

[@eaststarling7805]

The radar inside the nose of the mig 21 could move back and forth, controlling airflow and drag at higher speeds

[@nighthawk8104]

It's not the radar, it's the nose cone and yes that is able to move, otherwise the engine would suffer a flame out from too much air inlet

[@FuturPaladin489]

@@nighthawk8104 to be fair the radar moves along with the cone on a rail

[@wolfroze9703]

Make more videos like these theyre kinda like a short version of spookton's "historically accurate" series with more info in it with less time

[@jediknightanakin4079]

Can you make a video about Anymore modern vehicles that could be added to the UK tree, it feels like it’s reaching an endpoint when we have three challenger 2s and 2 phantoms

[@AboutThunder]

There is something similar in the works, stay tuned

[@kajmak64bit76]

There is a tornado... but that will never come because Panavia xd

[@generalalexandre6451]

@@kajmak64bit76 so its true what they say ? panavia did blocked gaijin from add the tornado ?

[@kajmak64bit76]

@@generalalexandre6451 Panavja bloxks everyone now Especially gaijin given it's a RUSSIAN company... you know... their ENEMY because of which they had to design the plane to fight them lol

[@appa609]

@@kajmak64bit76 They're not supplying any data... literally just rubberstamping the use if the name for a simulated asset.

[@TakNuke]

Need part 2.

[@sndrc9]

Engines should heat up and slowly get damaged like Bf-109s on WEP.

[@StealthyShot]

1:18 funny how it took them 2 years to add that skin

[@grass123]

1:14 = Is because the MiG 21Bis does not longer have the 2 stage afterburner, Gaijin nerfed it.

[@collander7766]

Still has 1:1+ TWR in AB, I think it’s fine

[@grass123]

@@collander7766 at very low altitudes, almost entirely clean and min fuel, and even then it loses performance fast Also IRL it had 1;1 TWR

[@collander7766]

@@grass123 yeah that’s how it is. Jets don’t have 1:1 TWR at high alt and high speeds, it’s modeled ok in terms of how well it would perform kinetically despite lacking thrust on paper.

[@msrtaha6174]

The missile knows where it is at all times. It knows this because it knows where it isn't. By subtracting where it is from where it isn't, or where it isn't from where it is - whichever is greater - it obtains a difference or deviation. The guidance subsystem uses deviations to generate corrective commands to drive the missile from a position where it is to a position where it isn't, and arriving at a position that it wasn't, it now is. Consequently, the position where it is is now the position that it wasn't, and if follows that the position that it was is now the position that it isn't. In the event that the position that the position that it is in is not the position that it wasn't, the system has acquired a variation. The variation being the difference between where the missile is and where it wasn't. If variation is considered to be a significant factor, it too may be corrected by the GEA. However, the missile must also know where it was. The missile guidance computer scenario works as follows: Because a variation has modified some of the information that the missile has obtained, it is not sure just where it is. However, it is sure where it isn't, within reason, and it know where it was. It now subtracts where it should be from where it wasn't, or vice versa. And by differentiating this from the algebraic sum of where it shouldn't be and where it was, it is able to obtain the deviation and its variation, which is called error.

[@turbogamerxd329]

About the Emergency Afterburner: according to DCS, you shouldn't use it longer than three minutes, yet u can. I broke my engine once by that I think.

[@constipatedwhale5040]

I read a forum on that Emergency Afterburner saying that it was (likely) used for Max Load Take-off's. which is why I presume it was limited to such a short timespan and the stress it puts on the engine, though I don't even play DCS yet so this is all my speculation.

[@turbogamerxd329]

@@constipatedwhale5040 I gotta try how that goes (for max load takeoffs I use the SPRD-Takeoff-Rockets). But I know that Su-33 uses its second stage afterburner for carrier takeoffs.

[@FuturPaladin489]

@@constipatedwhale5040 its used for dogfighting to prevent the jet from losing too much speed and keep the turning rate from going down

[@solid_fire9388]

veri nice, wish it was done with the mlg meme like voice !

[@vlga8917]

id be hella mad if i noticed the game took away my cannons

[@nicholasjensen8016]

forgot the fact that the mig21bis in warthunder doesn't have the 2-stage afterburner. the 9900kgf of thrust they boasted about when it got released was a fucking lie.

[@152mmapfsds]

Spookston liked

[@potatoemaster1049]

37 seconds lol

[@Dan86130]

37 minutes. We are not the same

[@Winterm00n333]

@@Dan86130 yep

[@wakintgn]

Epic vid

[@152mmapfsds]

Ur missing the halo music

[@tiagocosta8992]

More videos like this pls.

[@BasTSLA]

About thunder if you see my comment this guy name War Thunder Meta is putting your videos in his KZbin

[@AboutThunder]

Thanks for letting me know, but they have my permission to use the content

[@HoChiMeme]

0:50 nah this is completely realistic I fucking hate the Mig-21smt and the dogshit stock grind for the r60s

[@at335pro]

The engine dieing mid flight osnt modeled either qhen you do some wack manuvers

[@hades1890]

Gaijin is open to improving it's machines of war as long as it fulfils two requirements ONE photographic proof and statistical data to back it up and TWO not be classified military data "even though the whole world knows everything about each nations machines there's nothing secret on them at all only undisclosed machines are truly SECRET" if it fulfils these two simple guidelines then take it to the forum and in a couple of years they might all be implemented, for one the rocket boosters would be interesting seeing as we already have them in game for other aircraft's but removing its gun no that cant be done until gaijin gets off there @#$ and makes the AAM's worth something as they stand they are literally useless. Pathetic range, terrible turn rate, and easy to avoid the radar locked ones are no different only those the radar systems are even worse, they cant lock onto something RIGHT INFRONT OF THEM.

[@mamarussellthepie3995]

Cough cough f4e radar and aams xd