Warhammer 40k Faction Tier List | Pariah Nexus Edition

#Warhammer40k
More TacticalTortoise: linktr.ee/tacticaltortoise
Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
01:28 Space Wolves
02:35 Genestealer Cults
02:58 Adeptus Mechanicus
03:59 Adepta Sororitas
04:57 T'au Empire
06:13 Black Templars
06:59 Blood Angels
07:51 Astra Militarum
08:32 Grey Knights
09:10 Aeldari
09:54 Deathwatch
10:59 Drukhari
12:46 Thousand Sons
14:03 Chaos Daemons
15:44 Death Guard
16:33 Space Marines
17:37 Tyranids
18:56 Adeptus Custodes
19:50 Necrons
21:17 Dark Angels
22:19 Orks
23:47 Chaos Space Marines
24:07 Knights
26:08 World Eaters
27:18 Leagues of Votann
28:48 Outro

[@nikot.9920]

As someone who's been playing World Eaters for all of 10th edition the new mission pack is definitely helps out the faction a ton. They can compete with the top factions and thats what makes me happy

[@NoxInABox69]

Can confirm, Death Guard still slap. Deathshroud with a CL in Terminator Armor for re-rolls to hit and a MW AoE you can buff with enhancements. On a Strike profile you can get -3AP with Rattlejoint and the -1T from Contagion makes them really scary once they get close. Get yourself 3 of these for a tidal wave of Termies and it's soo cathartic when they Deepstrike in. We're not the Imp Guard, the Crawler's Indirect Fire was nice, but not entirely necessary to win. Grab yourself some Defilers or Annihilators for anti-armor. Helbrutes for ranged Contagion application to pair with those shots, and you're laughing. My stinkers remain undefeated so far!

[@liammurdock89]

Love how fast this video moved

[@AlainPilon]

I won a small tournament with my nids and the second player was an AdMech and it took everything I had to win. The Admech can be brutal and have all the good stat lines to destroy their opponents: a lot of dam3 weapon and vechicules and reroll everywhere (with the proper detachment). But they would struggle against (very) fast melee.

[@birblord3409]

I love the AdMech aesthetic but they're so expensive to build

[@captaincorundum9788]

​@birblord3409 a bit of advice from an admech veteran Run the big vehicles

[@maverick1191]

Drukhari in S Tier depends a lot on what kind of cheese your TO lets you get away with.

[@gangrel7674]

Do you mean following the rules as they're written or TOs making up what they think the intention should be?

[@LA-hx8gj]

I love where my nids are. I'm not interested in my armies being meta; i just love how fun they are to play, setting up combos and increasing odds for battleshock. Plus, their new models this year look great.

[@snakemont]

Gonna watch now!

[@Swordsmansmith87]

Eh...DG best build is mechanized, it was never indirect. Theyre still winning GTs, not world beating but definitely not C tier.

[@jerryking9767]

I believe that World Eaters should be in A. In the hands of a good player, they can hang with any army in the game.

[@NegativeNezzy]

And in the hands of a mediocre player they can beat any other mediocre player. They're just so objectively strong and virtually impossible to interact with that if you don't go first and know exactly how to handle them 2 turns ahead they just crush you. If the WE player gets 5 up FNP and Advance and Charge on 1 the game basically ends 70+% of the time and if they get Angron back the game ends 100% of the time (which is a 16% chance btw). WE is fundamentally a feels bad army and always will be because of the RNG of it and Angron coming back. If he doesn't come back it feels bad for WE and if he does, it feels bad for the opponent. Why do we have to play into 2400 points of an army with 2000 because you hit a 16%?

[@jerryking9767]

@NegativeNezzy I never get him back. There is an argument for an MSU style World Eaters army that doesn't have him. I tried it a while back against a Nid army that went 4-1-1 at Cherokee. Only barely lost and honestly it was due to my own mistakes.

[@Swordsmansmith87]

@NegativeNezzy WE are really good but not unbeatable even if angron ressurects. If you're losing that badly to them then the problem is your list or your choices in how you deployed etc

[@bastionwargaming7965]

Dark Eldar/Drukhari are A at best!

[@piotrjeske4599]

How are custodes, if you don't have access to FW ?

[@jamcam5180]

How can the thousand sons fire flamers indirect with warp sight.. isn't the indirect for phycis attacks only.. warflamers are not .

[@Nerodarkangel7]

For anyone curious as to one subtle buff DW got is lord of deceit, and since watchmaster isn’t an epic hero you can run three models with that 12” aura that also grant advance, charge, and shoot 🙃 not to mention our battle line being pretty solid into xenos

[@Badbufon]

Look at that beautiful bell curve... And then people have the nerve to say this game is not balanced

[@leSmokySmoke]

I am genuinly surprised that you didnt overhype tyranids as many others! they are certainly good at punching down now, but it is still very hard or next to impossible to punch up against better armys

[@mattvucu6706]

Can you do a video about how custodes mortal wound protection helps against devastating wounds? Also please rank Tigerius led space marines separately as he is such a transformative character.

[@IHADTHECAKE]

As Mech points increases made little to no sense. Kastelans and kataphrons got worse?! Did middling robots need to be increased? Melee is still meh, the tactic is still take lots of cheap skitarii chaff and move block. Sulpherhounds and raiders are gonna be goat.

[@atomickrispies]

4:15 - Correction for those interested in Sisters. They're "incredibly powerful" if you own 2-3 Immolators, 2-3 Castigators & 15+ Seraphim... and play in one specific detachment lmao. Otherwise the rest of the codex is roughly a B tier.

[@Blondguyification]

Black templars, in my opinion, are fine. Righteous crusaders with a good build can really mess someone up if they aren't paying attention. 60 primaris crusaders and 30 sword brethren can teach people to respect the choir boys

[@sgthunt118]

99 templars and the librarian ain't 1 ;)

[@willogsdon7092]

Im glad a dark angels fluff list is a feasible option in the current balance environment

[@biguschungus3989]

I wish more types of detachments in everyone's army could be a bit more viable

[@maximusest40kwarfare73]

sisters see the return of codex creep,,we need the editions to slow down there is no need for new editions every 3 years for such a ultra premium priced hobby. Thanks for the upload.

[@mcsniper180]

And with GSC we saw the return of codex slide. Agree 3 years to fast.

[@Krachbumm-Ente]

Sororitas are fine. Only the Triumph is overtuned and probably needs a datasheet fix

[@Syst3m04]

I agree, I think they compress the codex release to 2 years (all at once would be ideal), and then just small adjustments as the season goes.

[@maxmagnus377]

Funnily enough early winrate stats suggest that they got it pretty much bang on the money in terms of balancing the sisters codex. It's very early days, but it would appear that they are hovering around a 49% winrate right now.

[@sgthunt118]

It's not just that 1 army gets a codex release every 3 years, but that you have to account for all the other 20+ codexes that release throughout that same time frame as well.. makes it a nightmare to just build an overall decent list for pick up games. I appreciate gw trying but we're hobbyists for the most part. It's not our full time job, which you'd need it to be, to keep up with all the new changes and releases

[@marceldass1130]

Hi your statement about TS indirect it only works on bolter weapons not torrent weapons like flamer can’t get indirect …to get the indirect shots you have to have psychic weapons and the other stratagem makes on bolter weapons psychic

[@ArioKhodadadi]

You can never get bolters to become indirect as warpsight asks for "Psychic weapon equip by psychic models" so only aspiring sorcerers and attatched characters can indirect, namely the infernal masters with psychic flamers and magnus

[@Aselore]

Unless he's the stratagem to make all bolters psychic weapons​@@ArioKhodadadi

[@jamescococokelet6668]

what is that program they are using, and could you use it to play battles really fast.

[@Wes-xk6hl]

The new maps are real rough. Theres almost 0 line of sight I literally dont have enough terrain to even make a map at home anymore

[@BR4IN1N4J4R]

Glad to see Knights getting some love. Always a fun faction if anything to build and paint (I prefer working on vehicles to infantry). Still not going to include Canis Rex in my army because he's very much "flavor of the month" but at least 90% of the army is viable (Valiant, Acheron, The FW Questors, and the Acastus knights notwithstanding).

[@hivefleetmurder8770]

After playing a few games against dark eldar it is clear you measure from the flying base and not from the hull.

[@Wes-xk6hl]

Man still calling them dark eldar. You must be as old as I am

[@Aselore]

Why would they measure to base their vehicle on a flying base? They go by Hull

[@smthomas2000]

​@@Wes-xk6hl they are Dark Eldar, with Guard, Sister of Battle, Space Marines etc.

[@lamhuynh7201]

Kinda feels like the buff to hellblaster last patch would allow DA utf to be able to do a lot of things to hard counter the top of the meta

[@Paranormal-Stupidity]

Buff? Are you talking about the insignificant points drop, which in no way makes up for the over-costed characters that marines have to take?

[@user-oo5sb9gz9h]

The armies at the lower ends of the espectrum are incapable of winning events, gotcha

[@davidjones4772]

Space wolves still have a 60% win rate in nexus. C tier is a strange ranking.

[@juanl3297]

Didn't he place them in B?

[@miztahmonstur]

They aren't in C...

[@jacket2848]

​@@juanl3297 Even then that's a stupid ranking when they're still winning and topping tournaments

[@littlefoot4417]

Don’t forget it is his opinion, a top space wolf player will make that faction S tier, a decent player will not

[@jacket2848]

@@littlefoot4417 then what are the rankings even for? The only thing we can truly judge this by is "how often do they win or top 8" frankly. That's the only important thing. For example, I love deathwatch, and I do very, very well with mine (over 80% wins in a highly competitive local meta, some of the best UK players around) but they're objectively a lower performing army. Now, I clearly do very well with my army, but they rarely get top 8s (one was very close to a win the other day) so they're essentially objectively bad right now

[@Francisco.Figueiredo]

Cool man 👍🏻

[@tacosamurai1]

This list seems pretty whack. Custodes arent great, GSC isn't as bad as it seems. DG are perfectly average. Might just be my play group but we play all those armies and non of us are particularly overpowered.

[@atvaldor]

Best tier list I've seen so far! Votann seem a little high to me but everything else feels quite close.

[@fernandomoralesmorales7831]

I've found very funny that no one really knows how mechanicus works, admech have some stuff going and builds that could be troublesome for the opponent, sadly there are like 5 of us 😆

[@IHADTHECAKE]

6, I’m here too! Skitarii cohort is still only viable, I’ve tried the 3x4 kastelan list but it’s WAAAAAAAY to expensive. Kataphrons going up another 20 pts is like da fuck?!

[@maxmagnus377]

Early days still of course, but the win rates for the first 2 weeks of Pariah Nexus seem to suggest you're close on some, but way off on others in terms of tier placements here. Just gonna point out a couple where the numbers seem to be going against your judgment quite heavily & see if others here have thoughts about it: - Space wolves so far are averaging out at about 56% and are clearly one of the strongest factions in the game, and have been for a couple months now. - GSC honestly seem a lot more solid than they're being given credit for at about 48%. I'm quite surprised by this, as almost all of the reputable sources suggested that they got a garbage codex. Appears not to be the case at all. - Sisters are the complete opposite in terms of how the pros judged them and how they turned out. They appear to be much more middle of the pack than a lot of content creators here think, being at around 49% winrates. And that is even more surprising considering most of the wins would have been achieved with the most "broken" detachment in the game, according to some. - Grey Knights are doing too well for a middle of the pack rating, being at about 52%. - Aeldari appear to be the 4th worst faction right now, just above CSM, DA and Deathwatch, so not sure what the B rating here stems from. A 46% winrate, with how close the meta is right now doesn't mean they're unplayable in any way, but I still find it odd how they got some pretty substantial nerfs when before Pariah Nexus they were already at the tail end of the meta. "Almost a full year of being the undisputed masters of 40k" is a bit disingenuous as well, as they've been booted off the top spot and gradually sinking for the past 5 months now. - "Deathwatch do have a high winrate right now" By what metrics? As far as I can tell, they're just above 40%. Placed in the correct tier, but weird commentary on this one. - Drukhari being S tier right now is absolutely warranted, the top faction by some margin right now. I do think that some of this winrate comes from using a lot of "rules as written" shenanigans. Pivot and the CP cost increasing Archons being the 2 main ones. Both I believe will be addressed soon, and they'll end up closer to where they were before Pariah Nexus, around the 50% mark. - Thousand sons appear to be firmly on S tier still, as they were before Pariah Nexus. Currently at about 56% winrates. - Death Guard being in C here surprises me as well. They seem to be doing just fine in the first 2 weeks of the new meta. - Sadly, Dark Angels still look dreadful. Second worst after Deathwatch right now. - CSM are one of the very few factions below the goldilock's zone. Their 10th edition experience has been wild, similarly to Custodes, flip-flopping between the very top and the very bottom of the meta. - Imperial Knights are currently looking much better than you'd suggest, being in the top 5 strongest factions in the game. Overall appreciate the insight though! Always fun to see how players who are much more practiced than myself evaluate a new state of play!

[@NegativeNezzy]

There are like 8 players in the world who can 5-0 with Drukhari, I really don't think it's anywhere near as hyped as everyone is making it out to be. Unlike most tiny factions, one small mistake literally IS game ending, not "has a chance to be".

[@archonwut1624]

i think it's just comparing the armies with the idea that they are being piloted by the some of the best if not the best players in the world. With that in mind, Drukhari are 100% A+ Tier, they always have been even in 8th-10th edition. Drukhari are the staple "bully army" faction; terrible when played by the masses, almost unbeatable when played by the 1%. That's why drukhari players (me being one of them) like it when mid players tank the win percentage because it smokescreens their lethality in the right hands. Just watch Skari games, 10/10 one of the best players ive ever seen, his total win percentage in all Leviathan tournament games combined with dark eldar was 90.2%

[@juultoo]

There's a reasonably high element of luck involved in going X-0 so it's almost never as good a metric as "X-1 or better." That said, tier lists are always made with the notion of performance with the best pilot, and Dark Eldar are obviously very good in the hands of an even moderately competant player.

[@jerryking9767]

@@NegativeNezzy Drukhari are mean in my local Meta. The guy playing them has a very high win rate.

[@ThereItis99]

Brutal to see CSM at C... Just give us medium strength and leave us alone. We don't want an A or S tier. Just a Solit B and let us there. This A+ to D to C and back to A just so we can get back down to C and all within a few months

[@snugglemittins166]

It kills me to see BT so low. I believe we were already that low, just propped up by the iron Storm detachment.

[@sawomirkubas7946]

Thousand sons cannot fire flamers using warp sight, it applies to Psyker models using Psychic weapon. It work mainly for Magnus and all Sorcerers or SOT with stratagem that turns thier bolters Psychic

[@ArioKhodadadi]

SOC cannot indirect with bolters, only psychic models with psychic weapons, so their aspiring sorcerer or attatched termi sorcerer can indirect their own bolters, but the 4-9 other terminators cannot.

[@danielbishop6743]

I'm doing pretty well with Assimilation Swarm. No one sees it coming and then BANG 4+++.

[@wyatttyson7737]

Admech aren’t bad, Admech players are just suffering from a mind virus that has prevented them from reading their own datasheets. Skitarri Rangers are without a doubt one of the best Battleline units in the entire game, and units like the Dunecrawler are crazy but almost always overlooked. They are capable of insane damage, but Admech players, for whatever reason, can’t figure that out. I say that as a Guard player. Our index is the rules equivalent of of rotting Cat Corpse clutching a 50$ bill. But we can turn that corpse into a 45% win rate consistently.

[@blitzrw450]

Think you might have that mind virus bro. For their points it's a good set of abilities, but that's really meaningless unless isolated to itself, but I get your sentiment.

[@wyatttyson7737]

@@blitzrw450 “For their points they have a good set of abilities” in other words “they are good.” They mesh well with the army rules, they do the purpose they are designed for both in context of the faction and the in context of the broader game, they mesh well with *at the very least* one detachment (I’d argue most of them, but I’m giving you the most leeway possible) they have good synergy with other units through the Battleline Keyword abilities, so on and so forth. Thank you for proving my point. You readily admit that what I am saying is correct but still hold it to be incorrect.

[@blitzrw450]

@wyatttyson7737 First of all, you have a mean attitude. It's just a discussion on a game. Second, you skipped the part where I said it was isolated. If every game was admech v admech the sheet would be fine, but given the broader context of the game, and given how in the video he refers to the fact that new terrain layouts mean shooting armies may suffer, scout 6, sticky and cp/ignores cover is just average. They're cheap because they're not good relative to other armies. You need more of them because they don't do a lot, and relative to the rest of the army, they're cheap because the rest of the army can not perform. On paper, anything can sound good, but only when you look at it as a sole, isolated entity.

[@wyatttyson7737]

@@blitzrw450 I have a mean attitude? For point out how you agreed with me even if you ultimately denied it? Someone disagreeing with you doesn’t mean they are being mean to you. Secondly, I “skipped” the part where you said it was isolated by pointing out it wasn’t. Skitarri specifically are *super* strong, and get *a lot* from the army rule. Plus they synergize well with most of the rest of the army due to the sheer amount of other units getting buffs when near battleline keyword units. As for the rest of the army not doing a lot, that just goes to show you don’t know what the army does. Heck, the Dunecrawler I mentioned has a 3 Shot, S16, AP-4, D6+2 damage. Give it a good sightline and it reliably 1 taps anything smaller than a Leman Russ. Put it in the Protector Doctrine and get goes to Bs3+ with Heavy. Put it in Conqueror and it gets Assault and goes to AP-5. Its basically a long range super-melta. And thats just 2 datasheets. That doesn’t even touch upon the sheer utility of things such as the Skystalker’s 12” move, plus 6” Jump-shoot-jump move which can be a 12” under the right circumstances. How about the sheer tankiness of the Kastellan Robots when you give them a Datasmith? Do I even need to mention the sheer power of the Kataphrons? Admech aren’t S tier, but they are good. Period. The reason they’ve been doing so poorly is that the Admech community has been making terrible lists and leaning only in to Chicken Walker Spam, and with how new the Dataslate is they are still trying to adjust.

[@blitzrw450]

Again, you're isolating specific datasheets and situations and calling them strong which, again, on paper they are. However we have months of data that show the opposite. You cannot be suggesting that every casual and tournament player attempting to use the army since it's codex dropped are simply not utilising the armies rangers etc. abilities properly? Skitaari rangers are now viable because of the changes but strong? These guys are not taking anything down reliably, and sticky/scout6 is not gonna win you a game without sheet numbers. Kastellans are over costed and don't benefit from your army rule without a specific detachment, theyre tough, but so should anything that costs 200+ points? The onager already has heavy on the weapon you're referring too and yes its good but utilising heavy is not something that's also always possible. You do need to mention the kataphrons because for a long time, and perhaps even still currently, they were the only consistent source of damage for admech. These are weird single notions you're plucking at? I don't understand it. I agree they're not S tier, and the changes made recently significantly boosted their possible performance but they're still an army that requires chaff, that weren't designed to be that way. Given the changes were about to move into with pariah, it's going to be a challenge because direct line of sight on long range weapons is going to be harder to achieve on good targets. Everything is relative here and to say that the problem was that people weren't reading datasheets is just a compete misinterpretation of the problem.

[@Paranormal-Stupidity]

This edition has been brutal. If you are playing one of the low winrate factions, it's almost impossible to have fun at an event. It has killed the tournaments in my area. So, good work GW, I guess...

[@aramiscorpus9747]

If you care about win rate so bad then it’s gonna be hard to have fun no matter what you play. Also, the balance in the game is in a decent place compared to the past and like he said in the video, skill and luck are the main factors when it comes to winning.

[@thinkabouthelogic]

@@aramiscorpus9747 You don't play a bottom 5 faction, do you, lol. Fun is when you have two semi-evenly matched opponents and though you lose, maybe by even a few points, you had a fantastic time during the game, kept a good attitude, and afterwards maybe even wandered down to the local pub or out somewhere with your opponent and hung out for a while. Not fun is when you show up all the time and just get waxed right off the board, or just get completely devastated on Turn 1, or even go into the battle knowing the opponent has overall 10x the strength and AP you do, and because your saves are 5+ and theirs are 2+, they will be killing you and then laughing as your crap shots not only miss, but if they hit... are always saved. You see, the point is, there's a difference between losing... and being demoralized. People who win all the time don't really seem to understand that and then they tend to look arrogantly down on people who comment on how hard it is --not-- to become demoralized. I am not saying this is YOU, I am just making this comment for all those who win a large majority of the time.

[@MikePhumanaut]

“Mortal wound protection that custodes have in spades” some sisters squads and a strat. lol. I still can’t figure out how to win a game. Can’t hold primary objectives and stuff is just so squishy. Had 6 eldar bikes with warlocks wipe two units (wardens and custodian guard) in 2 turns. Don’t need the extra damage from shield host.

[@andresaguilar723]

Where have gone my lovely necrons! 😢

[@jan-gralsherzog1-185]

Still top of A-tier. Some placements of this tier list are completely nonsence.

[@dapeej9614]

This list feels really off

[@whomputron2072]

Love me some baseless probably incorrect speculation, hell yeah

[@tylercarr392]

Seriously, pointless video.

[@Damnedlegion40k]

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[@aaronobrien2353]

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[@chemonized]

i think your list is wack. No way daemons are A tier lol. Tbh I agree more with AOW rankings.

[@drunkenastarte5243]

Death Guard are a fething tragedy... The Legion who's entire identity is being a massive horde of tough as nails infantry? Yeah sorry, you're really just a stinky IG Armoured Reigment with some bolted on Wardogs. :P 10th is such garbage... None of my armies are any fun any more, on top of half of them being strait up auto-lose with how GW have gutted all options & heavily sterilized units in general. :(

[@jacket2848]

If you think any faction is an "auto lose" you're probably not skilled enough at the game yet. I play deathwatch and currently sit at 83% win rate, in a highly competitive based meta with some of the UK's best players here. It's down to you, not the army.

[@Billuhhanks]

Well now their identity is debuffing the enemy and blowing them up, that’s on you to make it work

[@drunkenastarte5243]

@@jacket2848 Not everyone wants to play 'meta' lists... My Orks for example are Blood Axes. Lots of Kommandos + Tank Bustas because those are the iconic Klan units. Tank Bustas are literally unplayable at the moment, while Kommandos are 10-or-nothing. My entire list was blown up by 10th's asinine army construction mechanics of basically just "here's some cookie-cutter datasheets, enjoy!" My SW's are built, themed & painted as the Firehowlers Great Company. Yes, it was never 'tournament worthy' in 9th, (I don't give a flying rat's ass for competitive 40k), but at least it was fun and halfway decent in casual settings! In 10th? Skyclaws are a joke and Jump Pack Wolfguard hit like a wet noodle... sure I could go and buy 18 Thunderwolf Cav, but then I'm not really playing Firehowlers anymore. I enjoyed DG for being tough as nails *infantry*. Now our infantry drop like flies and you're better off bringing in all vehicles?! If I wanted to play tanks, I'd have gone say for Iron Warriors or IG, not the DG. 10th is just bland, boring cookie-cutter crap. I'm glad tournament players are enjoying it, because they seem to be the only ones who are?!

[@AdeptusTacticus]

Horrible rankings lmao