The Producer Commmunity has a MASSIVE Shill Problem

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#musicproducer #musicproduction #musicproducers

[@Time4CakeAndSodomy]

As someone who only started taking music seriously about a year ago, it's so hard to tell who's legit and who's just a shill.

[@Mike_Benz_]

Most of them are shills and just want their audience to make them rich

[@justinschwieger71]

My minimum before spending any money on something for music is to find at least 3 pieces of review type content from completely different types of creators (different genres different personalities different workflows whatever, you be the judge here) and make a decision based off that. The more the better but if something is out there and you can't find at least that much content covering it you shouldn't spend any money on it imo. The biggest red flag is when a creator comes out with a product they're sponsoring and has it available right now (not a prototype or something) and you cant find a single piece of media on it outside of that. At that point you have to wonder if anyone has even tested it yet or has it only ever existed a bubble of yes men.

[@ohno6325]

you know what else only started being taking seriously within this last year, but in any industry? ...ChatGTP 😬

[@damiana5268]

Basic stuff is good enough to get you through tbh. If you really want analog color, its worth experimenting with bouncing out to simple gear and recording back in to digital. I like VCRs. Hell people had a washboard and made it work, we have a lot more tools now. Google is your friend also

[@lukeGGlee]

could just stick with the bread and butter like Waves plugins

[@NavieD]

I do agree. Seems like a conflict of interest when creators 'review' things while also being incentivized to get people to buy it

[@no1semach1ne]

Salute to you Navie D, you are a real one ☝️

[@Weaverbeats]

I've been saying that for a while you cant have an affiliate link paired with a review video. It's as bad as a paid review if not worse. There's too much to be gained from a lazy or poor review.

[@Nightowl427272]

Exactly, bogus “reviews” that are really just commercials in disguise. It’s deceitful, plain and simple.

[@Taylor370z]

@@Weaverbeats Honestly, affiliate programs are nothing more than a blindfold over the creators. "Affiliate program" is just a fancy label that companies put on their scam, that is they are getting *free* advertising from all the creators. But creators feel its good for their brand, and think it's a revenue opportunity with the 5 or 10% kick back for purchases through their link (that's even if anyone uses the link vs just looking the plugin up). The most devs are missing out on is 5 or 10% discount on a probably already over priced product that has zero manufacturing costs. Accepting "affiliate program" deals is just being bait for them. I would think ideally, saying no to affiliate link royalties or whatever and instead taking a flat fee would be more ideal.

[@Phosphor_Sco]

Navie (Big) D, we meet again

[@prestonmoney]

“Its only a 5 minute trial because they don’t want you to catch on to that this thing sucks” well said bro

[@BennJordan]

You know what's funny? Peel is an incredibly useful, stable, and snappy plugin that everyone (Zplane included) markets as some sort of stem separation magic trick, when in reality, it's just a super easy-to-use band isolator. For example. you have a drum loop and want to sidechain the kick, send the loop to another muted track, select the kick in the animated graphic, send the output signal to your sidechain bus. No fumbling around with ParaEQ faders. Or as you mentioned, adding reverb to only a snare or something when you don't have stems. If that is of use to you, it's a good deal. But Zplane is a company that makes 90% of their earnings from licensing their pitch and timestretch code/algos to Ableton, FLStudio, Bitwig, etc. They're trying to breakout as a VST company and IMO going about it a bit deceptively, which when coupled with an affiliate program makes it shill bait.

[@apoplexiamusic]

You know you've made it when Benn Jordan comments on one of your videos.

[@Nightowl427272]

Extremely well stated…

[@Noisa]

Nice you’re trying to think of the positives, but just isolating the kick region with a parametric isn’t difficult as is, and trying to put a snare reverb on that garbled mess would sound bad anyway.

[@CJnull]

That's funny. I just have seen your video about YT Influencers a few days ago and thought about it right now.

[@therealist-ub7td]

You know what's funny? Ben being in the same class as other KZbin product reviewers who, unfortunately and even unintentionally, cause people to buy unnecessary things due to their (at best) partially biased reviews. They are partially biased because they have received the product for free and do not have a monetary attachment to it the same way an actual consumer would. Subconsciously you are not going to be as critical of something.

[@JhazzyMusic]

Sold us bandpass filter for £40 😂😂

[@tk-zh3dd]

Amen brother. I had to stop following a bunch of channels recently because it's just gotten ridiculous. And anyway the engineers worth listening to certainly aren't spending their time making KZbin videos.

[@justincaldwell2527]

The most exciting thing happening right now for content creators is that the community is starting to turn on each other.

[@Linguae_Music]

@@groovylou8611 Like Led Zeppelin big :0

[@Quimmoo]

@@Linguae_Music not that big. If you Led Zeppelin big, you can afford a couple million worth of watches. Look up John Mayer watch collection.

[@Crypto_prod35]

@@groovylou8611Facts. I make music as a hobby and I never saw myself apart of a community. I just see myself as someone who happens to make beats as a hobby

[@extabytez3148]

It's crazy because the producers that aren't disclosing that they are affiliated with the company are literally breaking the law. You HAVE to disclose your sponsors.

[@DashGlitch]

You get 2 types of content creators in the music sphere, those who educate and those who promote. If a channel has very few useful tutorials, I don't take their promo seriously. It works.

[@PRIDEATH]

simply said, the real educators who care about the community and then the promoters disguising as educators

[@JonValtandtheEvilRobots]

There are three. The two you mentioned, and people who actually play music.

[@JoshMobleyMusic]

Ultimate vocal remover five. It’s free and splits everything out.

[@DaddaPsy]

"No song is mixed like this" The Beatles Mix engineer: *hold my beer*

[@Music-tg5is]

"No song is mixed like this" ... In the past 50 years then. Or at least, not enough, to justify using this plugin.

[@DaddaPsy]

@@Music-tg5isExactly.

[@dksdmusic]

In The Mix recently released his own plugin, it’s called Reviver. Would love to hear your thoughts on it.

[@killyourself]

i think he reacted to it on his second channel

[@kickcloudstv]

@dksd this is his reaction to the announcement and promo vid kzbin.info/www/bejne/bZTYlomNbL-UpMk

[@tmw3489]

He did and called it a useless gimmick.

[@Genital.Wartzenegger]

I think there’s an old plug in too called reviver and apparently it was incredible.

[@lando199]

​@@Genital.Wartzenegger perhaps you're thinking of Slate Digital Revival?

[@88keyz]

👍🏾 keep doing you ❤👍🏾 this is very helpful

[@Mr_Audio]

Yes these videos are necessary! Love your channel man!

[@2KCustomerService]

FL gang! Thanks for the info you share

[@justinegbo4869]

Almost fell for it, appreciate the honesty!!

[@DaddaPsy]

I stumbled upon your channel randomly a while back, never missed a video since I think. I like the fact that you're honest and try to debunk a lot of sh*t like this while being funny at the same time. Keep it up!

[@iterativeincremental]

yes, so much yes. Thanks for speaking up about this.

[@everytongueconfess]

the shills have lies

[@tresporros]

agree with you bro 100%, your work is needed in the community

[@thegoldenseed]

I'm so glad you exist. You are the most honest person on YT so far. God bless you.

[@JethroDAvis024]

❤ yeah I feel it man. Also having just recently making digital music, I understand the shilling that happens in the music industry. I basically have a few extra instruments outside of my DAW's stock stuff. I also have a somewhat poor man's laptop, so I have to take it easy on my processor anyway. I mostly rake KZbin for ways to do the thing I'm trying to do, as opposed to shopping for gear.

[@SarisChannel18]

Opinion: Buying and using 3rd party vsts will lengthen your years learning music production. Easy solutions rarely provide you the final answer. Overriding your instincts by using a vst on your tracks that causes a myriad of effects you don't truly understand is gonna hurt you in the long run.

[@HitTheRoadMusicStudio]

Man, I 100% agree - Thx for pointing this out in your video! Many YT creators actually don't do music BUT they are the ones who tell us what's hip? ^^ twisted, good-running business unfortunately on the cost of many young producers and a lot of confusion which is the opposite of education

[@twitcheyspleen]

yes Weaver - great stuff! :)

[@pipelineaudio]

Thanks for doing this...I'm trying to fight the good fight on the actual testing of audio claims, but DAMN it is a fine line trying to navigate the shill thing

[@sixsense6161]

Weaver bro! You doing God's work out here keep em coming.

[@mydyingdream]

Yup, man. Regarding to the very beginning of the video, you're the first one to accurately articulate what's been on my mind for a long time. Keep doing it. You may be the first channel I will support with real money. Of course, that's after I stop starving myself XD

[@jackharjani]

another Weaver W - keep going :D

[@steverachmadofficial]

Damn, you made some really good points here. You are so right. And yes, I also fell for it

[@Motizzie95]

U know it's FL Gang fam! 😂 Yeah, this one got me awhile ago. They sold me on the "isolate individual elements", never got a usable sample and what I did get I ended up running through a couple EQs and gate to remove the leftover noise and freq. Not trying to "bash" it and I'll keep an eye on Zplane. Side note, pretty decent job cleaning up dialogue but I honestly still think I was faster and more accurate with EQs and gates. Right on brotha! I always appreciated you being willing to take the shots to keep it real. I easily have closer to a thou-wow $$ in plugins not even installed on my system, and damn near 90% that I do use often, you've given good reviews to. Sorry so long, just want to appreciate and say thanks man. 🤘🏾👍🏾

[@rspatel9655]

I always had doubts about many plugin and Plugin Companies, U r confirming that. finally someone has guts. Keep up exposing bad companies and keep Supporting Good Companies as well

[@igorbeuk4068]

This plugin exist in Cubase, iZotope,ect. and it's a different way to separate sounds without using Technique with two indetical signals hitting each other ( Colliding to same signals will cancel each other) Negative Correlation and EQ to extract sounds but it's working in Specially produced Music where Bass is mono , Drums are mono and basically Audio have to be Mono compatible for better results. You can do it in every DAW , just reverse phase on one Audio and leave other in original and then with EQ you can do something i was using it for TV commercials and that's the way how we cleaned Audios . I know that Weaver Beats talked about week ago when he analyze Tracks, that's the way you are separating frequencies or you can buy plugin for simple way without needing to understand what is happening.

[@joesalyers]

This is why when I demo a plugin I have bought it with my own money and I have to really like as well as think it is useful for other people. I also will shoot it out with similar plugins that do the same sorts of things.

[@Skyverb]

Same. Some plugins I own, my friends love-- but they are stupid expensive. So I try others to see if I can make similar results with free or cheaper alternatives so they can get the same-ish results for much less.

[@PabloGarcia-sf7bn]

Dammit! You fell into the woo! Greetings from New Mexico!

[@pygmalionxxx]

Yeah this is honestly how I fell out of love with waves. This exact same trickery.

[@ErickMcNerney]

You are quickly becoming one of my favorite YT content creators.

[@DashGlitch]

Btw, White Sea's link sends to Plugin Boutique, which he mentioned he is an affiliate for. All his reviews he does on the demo, and doesn't receive money upfront. White Sea is one of the very very few who are not shills, unless I'm wrong. Yes he has featured some useless plugin, but he's just giving his opinion, the rest is on you - my 2c.

[@drindy5166]

This video did it for me! I absolutely love your sarcastic humour! Your vids are always so on point and enjoyable! New Sub right here! Even though I have been following your stuff for awhile. Keep up the great work brother! Cheers 🔥👊🧡👍🔥

[@commodore74]

Spot on man! fortunately the best plugins now are the free

[@kirkybeats]

It really sucks when people go about this stuff in a deceptive way. I mean I appreciate the “negativity” because it prevents people from buying useless plugins. Instead of spending $40 on a low grade plugin producers could use that for marketing themselves to help grow. Most of us do this as a hobby, so anytime we end up spending money on useless things that influencers say are great, it sets us back further from promoting ourselves

[@ShuShuShop]

Making art stopped being about art and more about how much money and fame you can get. I miss when people made art for the love of art, not status.

[@greeneyes66]

..and btw phew, thanks for this reveal! tend to have a loose trigger finger and was on the fence of getting Peel myself for that seemingly affordable price.

[@larsb.nielsen4481]

Thanks you for the heads up 😎

[@otherworldsnaps]

KZbin is literally suggesting that White Sea Studio video to me beside your video 🤣

[@apoplexiamusic]

It's cool that you sampled Blade Runner Blues in your one of your songs :D Also "FL Gang", since i got last fall after not using it since 2008, but i use Ableton mostly.

[@carbonvibes]

Good job Weaver 💪🏻

[@RJ1J]

White Sea Studios has long since sold out. The fact that he has to say that the makers of the plug-in have "no say" in his review, and then goes on to give it a good review every time, with one minor criticism, says it all.

[@Genital.Wartzenegger]

And then says decapitator is snake oil.

[@Arcessitor]

@@Genital.Wartzenegger Isn't decapitator the #1 rated distortion unit of all time?

[@Genital.Wartzenegger]

@@Arcessitor it has to be up there.

[@natesommers1316]

Yessss I now only bye on black Friday or Xmas sales lol...how many compressors do I need???.

[@ErickMcNerney]

12:35 - Healthy skepticism should always be welcomed.

[@gakiNEMO]

"it's a little bit funny when I'm mad" relatable lol

[@Drrolfski]

There's a huge uproar going on atm between professional producers and professional KZbin content creators about the new MPC X SE, its perceived sound quality, but also about these content creators/influencers really being honest and not some tool of the industry. I think you should check it. Main producer involved here, E-A-Ski.

[@rivaltheproducer]

I’m not fl gang. But I be staying watching you. I do appreciate this content.

[@djsusan00]

So we all panning our basses to the left now?

[@nntblst]

That “blade runner blues” sample!!!! Lovely!!!

[@notsure1135]

I love your videos, your idiosyncrasies are devoid of any bullshit.

[@GwizProducer84]

Finally someone calling this shit out, if it’s an ad or you get a commission from a link below you can’t take em seriously, They prey on upcoming producers that don’t know any better

[@rolobotoman]

YESSSS

[@PorchBass]

I also was surprised at white sea studio choosing the jazz track with easy to isolate guitar - and presumed BS. Same with Roland S-1 videos e.g. jorb

[@tmw3489]

S1 is very nice.

[@PorchBass]

@@tmw3489 I can't wait to see one in the flesh. It does look good especially for live use.

[@tmw3489]

@@PorchBass it is awesome, i got one. It is stupid value for money if you care about synths.

[@fredtimothy940]

For mastering, I Love Blue Cat MB-7 7 separate bands of processing. And it can separate mid/side too. The only thing it cannot do is process a single point in the stereo field. I wish that Peel would give you the ability to mirror processing on the other side of the stereo field- like process 30% left and right the same. At any rate, I think it does have a certain use case even with its limitations.

[@Taylor370z]

Keep up with calling all this shit out. FL Gang gang

[@Skyverb]

6:40 Tbh this is how I ended up buying most of my plugins. Did that and ended up liking them, so I bought them all.

[@ismailerencetinkaya336]

funny, this video made me want to buy this plugin even more because it looks useful for my spesific needs

[@mass-1128]

If you're a full-time music producer, you got to be careful of falling into the trap of buying too many plugins (especially if you don't really need it). Not just is it wasting your money, but it's destracting you from finishing any music at all, and that's the problem I have with KZbin influencers. They sell you crap and say "this plugin is a must-have and game changer" and make you feel that what you're already have, is not good enough.

[@Boggsy.]

Ah shit, I didn’t realize that you also sampled that Vangelis track. Though I’m sure plenty have, now that I think on it. Sounds dope.

[@Weaverbeats]

ya it was from a beat battle a couple years back

[@tupapa7230]

Yo are those police shades official issues oakleys??? You kill me with the vids brother keep doing your thing and watch out for Sanjays girl man bwajajaja!!

[@NathanJamesLarsen]

Dude I've been so pissed with this exact same issue with creators. The incentives are too hard to turn down for most. We'd probably make an additional 6 figures/year if we did sponsorships regularly - but we don't. We MAYBE do 3-5 sponsored videos per year and it's never with a brand I don't have a close relationship in terms of me actually loving the products personally. But think about that - if you have an audience you can legit bring in 6 figures just from sponsors if you're good with just making tons of sponsored content... most are not gonna say no to that. I'm not against sponsors but it's GOT to be ethical and GOT to be something you genuinely love and use.. too many are making videos and then never using it again. It's horrible

[@AutPen38]

Benn Jordan's video opened my eyes to just how much money can be made via the affiliate system and I can understand why so many channels get sucked into churning out paid content, but those videos leave me feeling empty. I love your video tutorials that AREN'T just shilling. Please don't ever turn into a shopping channel!

[@revelashan]

You a real one. FL Gang

[@mingomarrero]

I am so glad that you have made this video. The plugin, unfortunately, is not what is seen to do what they claim it does, I'm not worried about KZbin influencers, I will not buy a plugin if I can't try it as a demo first. My number one rule is: Don't buy a plugin without trying a demo first.

[@MS-1]

Been using that awhile as a filter. (I knew it was a filter when I trialed it. Zplane should have advertised it as what it is from the get-go (a filter).

[@thekingsmatter5845]

🤣🤣🤣 Bring that heat bro! 👏👏👏🫡

[@sxipshirey]

Thank you, bummer about White Sea.

[@Ambrosia2830]

yeah I heard about this plugin a while ago and got excited, turned out to be mostly unusable because its very imprecise for almost everything. A good seperation is almost impossible because nothing is going to be so seperately placed in the spectral field for that box to make any sense. Maybe if you could paint out the areas to EQ that would make sense, even that would not be very precise.

[@jmac2050]

repacked EQ

[@alchemistrpm82]

Right below this in my feed is Sanjay C’s “Arturia, Take My Money!” video 😂😂😂

[@legacyShredder1]

All creators are selling something. No one is online purely from the goodness of their heart.

[@danstuckie2115]

keep keeping it real. you're one of the top tier "producer" KZbinrs. Don't let that green screen console behind him fool you people! Weaver is out there spending his money on lame plug-ins so you don't have to.

[@ready_red99]

Fl gang 👺

[@aceincarnate]

deceptive marketing is marketing

[@dirtychump]

Social Media 'influencers' are just marketers under a different name... which is why marketing dept LOVE them. Unless we can move to social media sites that aren't advertising platforms primarly that priorotize profits above all else it will never get better.

[@KINGBENJOE]

As someone who uses samples (allegedly). I kinda saw right through this plugin.

[@murat_buyuk]

LOL... bass mixed to the left. That spectrograph looks very specifically made for this plugin right away.

[@johnanthony9923]

This is even worse with guitar KZbinrs. Nearly every single "review" you can find on KZbin is a paid promotion that's either barely mentioned, if at all. There are nearly ZERO negative "reviews" (or even anything less than absolute praise) for guitar gear....ANY guitar gear...anywhere on KZbin. A good example is Positive Grid. Nearly every single guitarist on KZbin has praised this thing. But, coincidentally, you will never...ever...under any circumstance...see any of them use it again in a non-sponsored video.

[@brandoncrabtree7273]

I actually got deceived with this one about a year ago myself

[@EricJohnson-fh8zj]

Mad respect for calling this out. You just saved me $40 because I saw it and thought it looked bad ass. Turns out it's just ass. I completely missed the deceptive marketing and was on track to buy it. I saw it on white sea too, and hes normally a trustworthy source. Weaver beats is the man....just waiting for the day you take a shill deal to pay the bills, like everyone else does eventually lol. We will forgive you 😅

[@embersandash]

“Only $40.” LMFAO

[@christopherrossi3861]

Roland released an almost identical standalone program a decade ago called "R-Mix". It was cool at the time, but had all the same problems including heavy artifacts and limited uses.

[@Music-tg5is]

It's been that way for many years now.

[@88keyz]

It's not negative to be more in depth and honest and give different insight more examples at the end of the day people should do their own research even after watching any KZbinrs videos about products they give good or not so good opinions about that my prospective 👍🏾🙌🏽👍🏾🙏🏾

[@r2beat2taylor35]

I’ve had peel for about a year now and I’ve only used it once in that year

[@GG-zv9ku]

I just recently unsubscribe from many of those channels like White Sea studio when I realized they start with “ the problem with the industry is” and at the end of the video “and here is a plug in that fix it” The worst one is the recent one titled “I need to tell you something” Starts with “no snake oil” then there’s a snake oil at the end of the video

[@nthly9980]

He pretty much is the penguinz0 of production content.. much love

[@bolttracks]

EQ can never properly isolate an instrument / track and that someone would think that let alone promote that is plain stupid

[@kassemir]

I fully agree that it can be very hard to tell what is legit, and what isn't. Now, this to me, just looked like something I didn't need. But, there's been other times where I've looked at something, and thought to myself, maybe this is legit. In general this whole influencer marketing thing is just kinda bad. At this point, honestly, if a KZbin creator is promoting something, I just assume it's either a scam or a very bad product.

[@gilbertgarnica7896]

Fl gang

[@skrabio]

I can maybe see this being useful if they built in using it to swap and learn from a reference track...? Maybe...? lol

[@cta.k.a.barrychan2460]

That shit sounds like a cell phone call with music in the background

[@epigon1]

Reality is... most of us (musicians).. we all wanna be producers.. we all end to consumers

[@Diamura]

11:32 Gotta love that piano panned hard left. Makes no sense

[@TROYVIXIOUS]

I can see how this plugin can be useful for some creative applications but yeah definitely deceptive marketing