What are selective androgen receptor modulators (SARMs) & why do bodybuilders use them? | Derek MPMD

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This clip is from episode 274 - Performance-enhancing drugs and hormones-risks, rewards, & broader implications for the public with Derek More Plates More Dates. Derek is a fitness educator & the entrepreneur behind More Plates More Dates & an expert in molecules commonly used & misused by bodybuilders & athletes.
In this clip, they discuss:
- The difference between SARMs and SERMs
- Why do bodybuilders still choose to take testosterone over SARMs?
- What are the most potent or commonly used SARMs?
- And more
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About:
The Peter Attia Drive is a deep-dive podcast focusing on maximizing longevity, and all that goes into that from physical to cognitive to emotional health. With over 90 million episodes downloaded, it features topics including exercise, nutritional biochemistry, cardiovascular disease, Alzheimer’s disease, cancer, mental health, and much more.
Peter Attia is the founder of Early Medical, a medical practice that applies the principles of Medicine 3.0 to patients with the goal of lengthening their lifespan and simultaneously improving their healthspan.
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Disclaimer: This podcast is for general informational purposes only and does not constitute the practice of medicine, nursing, or other professional healthcare services, including the giving of medical advice. No doctor-patient relationship is formed. The use of this information and the materials linked to this podcast is at the user's own risk. The content on this podcast is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Users should not disregard or delay in obtaining medical advice for any medical condition they have, and they should seek the assistance of their healthcare professionals for any such conditions. I take conflicts of interest very seriously. For all of my disclosures and the companies I invest in or advise, please visit my website where I keep an up-to-date and active list of such companies. For a full list of our registered and unregistered trademarks, trade names, and service marks, please review our Terms of Use: peterattiamd.c...

[@alphacause]

Derrick is proof positive that with an unrelenting curiosity, you can know more about a subject and elucidate it better than many degreed professionals.

[@dronepocket325]

Most degreed professionals don’t even have 1-10th of his knowledge.

[@markd4768]

It’s Amazing eh

[@markd4768]

Derek should’ve went to med school ! He’s got a great memory and understanding of the science’s 👍🏻

[@markd4768]

Fucker should be a medical specialist at the Mayo clinic 😂😂I’m sure Peter must be thinking how does he have just as much knowledge as me or more and never been to medical school 😂😂

[@MrOrthodox13]

More of this guy, please.

[@Cas_anova]

I love lgd at 5 to 10mg a day with a test base. Feel and work out great on it. Increased vascularity, endurance and strength. I've gained a few kilos on it.

[@louisedwards7042]

should gain more than a few kilos on a 12 week cycle on lgd and test

[@krisroberts1500]

I am currently on trt treatment for about 2 years now and started the Warrior Labs Rad 140 about 3 weeks ago. I'm doing a daily liver and kidney cleanse as well to prevent as little harm as possible and so far I feel great! My gym regimen has increased as well as my strength and now I'm starting to see my gains a little more apparent each week...

[@4242brvrdbd]

Wow. Watched that whole thing. And I’m pretty sure 99% was over my head.

[@rehmsmeyer]

Derek has like a Masters or PhD level of understanding in pharmacology.

[@Permuh]

Derek keeps impressing me with how detailed his knowledge is on these topics. He's speaking like someone who's taken biochemistry at uni, how long will it be until he's on the level of a urologist subspecialising in testosterone therapy?

[@prokeyavaimausa9412]

He has.

[@saganspirit]

Love the knowledge even though it's over my head

[@BigQuadsOnCampus]

I loved taking SARMS for the couple months I tried it. Fun stuff 🤟🏻

[@LabinotBahtiri]

How does that work. What happens if you quit after awhile?

[@joshyazg2120]

@@LabinotBahtiri They suppress HPTA just like AAS. Your natural test production will still take time to come back, but usually quicker assuming the dose isn't large enough to make a given SARM lose selectivity.

[@BigQuadsOnCampus]

@@LabinotBahtiri nothing happened... I just remember the pump and the drive really well. but its that effect where you know a more intense pump and a better workout session... you know you wont feel that way again unless you take more of it. :( just gotta live without it or take more I guess haha

[@ScroDiddly]

Muscle growth? I have s4.

[@ScottDreyfus]

Ostarine and ligandrol are fucking rocket fuel on top of testosterone. I’m 4 weeks into this cycle and I’ve cut another 6 lbs of fat 2 lbs of visceral and my body fat has dipped below 16% for the first time in my life. I’m a distance athlete as a caddie so I walk over 100 miles a week and hrt has supercharged my recovery on a day to day basis. I have nearly doubled my athletic output in the last two years… lost 80+ lbs and feel better than I did when I was 20.

[@Emotionlessxartist]

That’s fire I wish I could find!

[@austra1973]

Have you heard of Cardabol ? I'm thinking of trialing it

[@SKDREYFUS]

@@austra1973got blocked for some truth on my other account 🤦‍♂️. I’ve never used cardibol but I do cycle carderine 8-12 weeks on and at least 4 off. It’s great for what I do with the volume it really cranks your cardiovascular threshold but then best benefit is the lipid profile. Ligandrol is dirty and it really made me strong but it wrecked my lipids. Four weeks on carderine I had my bloods done and my cholesterol had pushed above 370 total/ with 350 triglycerides. 4 weeks later 235 total with hdl actually normal for the first time ever at 52ng/dl and my triglycerides dropped all the way back to 135. Total cholesterol dropped all the way down to 239. I’m adding in Lipitor in a half dose 3x a week to try and avoid the leg cramps but everything is in a good window right now. I have to donate once a quarter to keep my hematacrit under control. I’m a week out from new 12 weeks to get 110 loops in the next 90 days! 120mg test cyp, Ipamorelin/cjc1295, bpc 157/thymasin beta 4, mot-c, carderine , and Ostarine . I should lean out pretty nicely over the next 12 weeks. I dropped 27 lbs last summer on nothing but trt but I’m flying back today lighter than I can home last summer so I’d love to put another 3 to 4 lbs of lean tissue on and still drop another 10 to 15 lbs of total weight. You rocket from 30% body fat to 15 but diet has to be so perfect to really get below 15% body fat. I’m just happy clothes are starting to fit cause I was busting out of 2x and couldn’t button a 42 when I started hrt two years ago and now I need a belt within 34 waist and a large shirt fits perfect

[@JordanLewis-e3l]

Tren cough is the crazy amount of alcohol they have to use to keep it stable, getting into the blood if you nicked a vein etc. its crazy these guys don’t know that but have a podcast on anabolics and sarms

[@No-ky3kb]

What he said about tren cough, I had that with testosterone once, apparently I hit a blood vessel and the oil it was in instantly got into my lungs. I now aspirate to prevent that. I wonder if it's the same

[@SmokyKoolAid]

No way this guy asked if bodybuilders “still even take test”😭😭

[@Ssethtzeentach_enjoyer]

I couldn't believe it, either; that's like asking if the military still takes recruits.

[@austra1973]

Does anyone have any feedback or views on Cardabol ? Your input would be highly valued

[@non9886]

derek is better than most of scientists which just claim they are scientists but they (compared with derek) lack of passion, common sense and usually neutrality as they tend to be very biased or just thinking inside some kind of "science universe box"

[@patrikzakoucky7191]

I allready had testolone and rad 150, i cant really say about some side effects, just weird feeling like a cant explain it, but i really wish more research comes out about sarms is nearly nothing out about it

[@VernCrisler]

My lab rat is using Ostarine at 30 mg daily plus MK677 at 20 mg daily. Haven't seen any dramatic effects yet but this is only the third week. I understand that it may take longer for results. After Ostarine, my lab rat will run LGD4033 ( Ligandrol), and then RAD140.... I hope it's not just all hype.

[@OleSevers]

Without a test base that’s likely gonna be a rough cycle after about 4-5 weeks

[@LoganKing4]

Highly regarded, tell your rat to hop on real hormones

[@young_herc]

Bro just take some Test, jesus christ. Or you could run solo small doses of Anavar in a pulse if you wanna maintain endogenous production.

[@VernCrisler]

@@OleSevers Maybe, but I've heard you can run a cycle for 8 weeks without too many problems. As long as you resist the temptation of giving your lab rat really high doses. And of course what's the point of doing a SARM if you run testosterone? The whole point of a SARM is to be an alternative to steroids.

[@OleSevers]

@@VernCrisler yea it’s just not great at running alone without a testosterone base. You will get results but if for sure lowers your natural testosterone a considerable amount

[@wakeup6778]

Are there any long term studies about sarms? Like are there any long term side affects etc

[@Dram1984]

I really think end of the day most people who want to do this are better off just using real gear. More and more we see the effects of SARMS is underwhelming and the side effects and long term effects are at least as bad and maybe worse.

[@Dragosarusrex]

How long do sarms stay in your system?

[@ScroDiddly]

Will muscle growth happen when using Sarms S4?????

[@holdingW0]

AFAIK SARMs can give you dramatic, steroid like results but can have some of the same sides like suppression of natural test production. Also, they're newer and less tested than traditional steroids

[@Dram1984]

I honestly think most people are probably better off just using gear.

[@jahmanborneo1343]

@@Dram1984 or...hear me out, JUST GO NATURAL. When the gains are gone and your health is failing.....you'll wish you never touched gear. Fitness freaks with a drug addiction. THAT'S THE TRUTH.

[@Dram1984]

@@jahmanborneo1343 I agree. I was trying to say I don’t think SARMs are any “safer” and may in fact be more dangerous.

[@jahmanborneo1343]

@@Dram1984 I'm with you!

[@Juiciejuice]

If your happy do what you want. It's your life do whatever the f*ck you wanna do.

[@christosp.9163]

Just so everyone knows, none of the main cGMP supplement manufacturers in the US will accept to produce sarm products. If you are buying sarms, they are made in a sub-standard facility. Don't jeopardize your health for a couple of pounds of disappearing gains.

[@Emma-sf5my]

And test and other steroid compounds are all made in standard facilities in the US. Do you have any idea the number of UGL's in the US with horrible hygiene and bad products?.

[@DirtyDemon917]

How safe is LGD4033?

[@VernCrisler]

I think they're all pretty safe as long as you don't screw around with ultra-high doses. Most recommend that you also do a PCT after a cycle. [The nitwit YT Algo isn't allowing me to comment on this topic. As far as long term goes, as long as you don't run a SARM for more than 8 weeks or so, there shouldn't be any problems. Also, you need to do some online research to see if a company is safe to buy from.]

[@DirtyDemon917]

@@VernCrisler Thank you! I’ve heard sarms lower DHT on cycle. Is that an issue long term? Also, are there any quality brands? I know a few of the safe proven brands from years ago aren’t available anymore. Enhanced athlete. Proven peptide. Etc. thanks!

[@VernCrisler]

@@DirtyDemon917 The imbeciles who run YT won't let me comment on this, but let me just say do your research before buying.

[@SmokyKoolAid]

Rad 140 seems to be significantly less liver toxic. They both probably affect your blood lipids the same

[@somethingginterestingg4275]

Safe in what way? It ewill effect you like steriods.

[@DavidSanchez-cc7sq]

Im 49 and on TRT at 210 lbs trying to buid muscle after a few years working out, what is the best sarms for me? Thanx

[@kfranklin308]

I’m no expert and you should definitely do a lot of research but if I was already on trt then just blast test for 16 week cycle. Then return to your trt dose.

[@DavidSanchez-cc7sq]

@@kfranklin308 blast test? As in?

[@ScroDiddly]

Will Sarms s4 help with muscle growth?

[@lordfrieza3982]

Not much

[@DGTH1992]

Just do test

[@ScroDiddly]

@@DGTH1992 I can't get they shit

[@TaoLIOTTa]

Sarms are pretty good

[@OleSevers]

They definitely work

[@michaelmcfadden396]

They can still shut down your system though. It isn't a free lunch.

[@RhetoricalMuse]

Agree. I'm on a prolonged PCT because of it.

[@bryantc2899]

Yes they are delicious especially LGD 4033. My lab rat enjoys injections

[@bryantc2899]

​@@michaelmcfadden396TRT😊

[@antonypacan5849]

AmSure using these gave me a stroke and ended up i hospital for 2 months

[@ShowMeWhatINeedToKnow]

For real?

[@Emotionlessxartist]

More details

[@Lucas_Jeffrey]

very possible with its effect on lipid profiles. You have to check your HDL, LDL, APOB. If they get bad, you must stop. Low dose SARMs (like those in clinical trials) are superior for this reason.

[@ShowMeWhatINeedToKnow]

Did you get the jab?

[@somethingginterestingg4275]

It def can mess up all the health markers stetoids do. Cholesterol, liver, bp, water retention, etc

[@crushlimitsTm]

Where do i can buy SARMs

[@DGTH1992]

Just do test

[@ciscotango1308]

F*** that! Not worth it! Unless your competing as professional level making tons of money!

[@jahmanborneo1343]

Still not worth it. Drug addicts that happen to work out.

[@Snoopydogg743]

U have to stop talking so much with scientific facts that no one understands what your saying ur too complicated for lots of people just make up shit or make it easier for other to understand what you’re saying bro !!!

[@iliketocomment8144]

Levan Saginashvili brought me here. 😆 Who knows what else he’s doing.

[@philliphans]

does Derek still take TRt will he do it for life

[@dronepocket325]

If you keep your levels under control with microdosing, there is no reason not to do it for life. No negative side effects of any kind. It’s life changing!!!

[@ShowMeWhatINeedToKnow]

Gainzzz!!!

[@rytiskurcinskas7179]

What are sarms ? Well they are shit and not worth time/money

[@jimmybaker4821]

Terrible for your health

[@VernCrisler]

What evidence do you have for this?

[@Cas_anova]

So are cookies.

[@MrOrthodox13]

​@@Cas_anova Just ate three cookies, and my testosterone production is the same as it was before them. Now if I took 3 LGD's... that just might lower my test.

[@VernCrisler]

@@MrOrthodox13 Temporarily...

[@dronepocket325]

@@MrOrthodox13no its not the same. You obviously don’t understand metabolic health.

[@Reutzel507]

Peter. When putting this information out you will push more people to use them. Most comes from garbage sources. You are taking advice from a child who is a shill.

[@VernCrisler]

You can get good SARMs by doing a little bit of research on the companies who are selling them. The garbage sources were a few years ago, not so much now. Why is Derek a "child" or a "shill"? He's actually done a lot of steroids and SARMs.

[@VernCrisler]

The YT yahoos deleted my original comment on this. But why insult Derek?

[@MrOrthodox13]

That "child" was definitely a PED abuser, but I think he might have learned more from it than any other PED abuser, and now tries to both educate people about it and get them on it too. I like what he said, and I'm not considering taking any SARMs, Peter should have asked about the downsides of them more to make people stay away from them.

[@Reutzel507]

@@MrOrthodox13 a lot of his information is subjective and have little to no merit in medical literature. Many of the SARMS he mention failed drug trials. Look up GTx, they were the company that developed many of these.

[@VernCrisler]

@@MrOrthodox13 Yep, Derek has abused steroids and he's taken SARMs. But why does that make him a child? He's discussed all the pros and cons of steroids and SARMs on his channel, and in my opinion scaremongers a little too much about them. Teens will listen to Derek. But then they'll take one look at Sam Sulek and say, "that's' for me."

[@GotDamBoi]

more plates more dates is such a cringe name lmao

[@MrOrthodox13]

He thought of it about 10 years ago, when he was still in college, so...

[@humanspecieseradicationmedia]

He's a cringepiller (blue/red/black/whatever)

[@TrollerOfWar]

It’s not at all, it’s funny.

[@PinningSteroids]

@@humanspecieseradicationmediawas* when he was a college kid.