What Does "Gay Christian" Actually Mean? Greg Coles, Part 2

#GregColes is back!
Actually, he never left. We just split our conversation into two parts. In our first conversation, Greg shared about his coming out story and what advice he'd give to parents with gay kids, and to gay Christians who are thinking of coming out.
Speaking of "gay Christians," that phrase is super debated, misunderstood, and has become the subject of much turmoil in the evangelical community. Greg helps us understand what people mean and don't mean by the phrase.
We also talk about other words and phrases like "homosexual," "the gay lifestyle," "practicing homosexual," "same-sex attraction," and "the gay agenda." And we discuss whether same-sex attraction, or "being gay," is itself a morally culpable sin from the perspective of a traditional Christian sexual ethic.
Here's the blog series Greg and I referenced in the video: www.centerforfaith.com/blog/g...
#gaychristian #PrestonSprinkle #SameSexAttraction
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[@donnasievers2675]

Thanks for being such a blessing! Both of you! Your bold and truth filled conversations can help bring understanding and unity to the body of Christ. Which, will hopefully help us walk out the Great Commission with deeper compassion.

[@philipabraham4613]

Whether I am a Christian gay man; whether I am a gay Christian man, these statements describe me : I am a gay man. I am a Christian, by the grace of G-d. I am a man who is gay, who, by the grace of G-d dearly wishes to be a follower of Christ.

[@collfam]

Dear Greg: I’m praying that you will see that Preston sprinkle is a false teacher and that you will recognize the power of God can deliver you and me from all of our unholy passions and pride and that by the power of Christ and his holy spirit we can crucify our flesh and walk our identity in Jesus alone.

[@loramarks9193]

I am so grateful for your videos, and I especially found Greg Coles a delight! This was so informative, raw, and kindhearted. I am grateful for your resources!

[@inYTbio_SiteLINKs2Verses_Bruv]

I have a more Biblical testimony.

[@addisonbyrd6878]

So good man!! Refreshing convo and perspective!

[@salem.sigh.bostrom]

Really really love and appreciate this conversation!

[@michaelcalle2981]

Don't pay too much attention to these type, they are basically saying you can be gay but not have sexual relations or marry someone from your same gender.

[@janetdavis6473]

Thank you Greg for this enlightening conversation.

[@danieleaston2729]

My parents love to say “God is not the author of confusion” - while Greg isn’t confused, I’d be interested in his/your comments on this. Glad to have discovered your ministry, Preston.

[@darrenwithers3628]

I'm gay and it isn't confusing.. I'm attracted to men. It's really quite simple.

[@jenisebrooks4308]

​@@darrenwithers3628correct it's the others who don't experience the attraction who are confused

[@carlosalbertoarcefajardo761]

Please it would be great if the book were translated to SPANISH. There are MANY latinamerican gay christian who really need it.

[@inYTbio_SiteLINKs2Verses_Bruv]

Trust me, this leaven doesn't need to go further.

[@terryandisanders5433]

Thank you so much for this! It gave me a new loving perspective and I write this with tears in my eyes as I ask Jesus to forgive me!

[@charitytinnin3581]

I appreciate the breakdown of linguistics here. I really wish there weren’t so many ad breaks (10+)

[@mtns4me117]

I appreciate that you addressed the whole "gay Christian" thing. I have other struggles with sin that are different from being gay, but I would never put that in my identity. My identity is a Christian...period. Now I will admit that I struggle with gluttony, but I will never put that as part of my identity. Just in my opinion, saying you are a "gay Christian" can give the impression to others that acting on that impure impulse as being approved by God because it's your identity and who you are. To me it just unnecessarily muddies the water. JMHO

[@cyndawinans8315]

Yes, I would agree because Paul described the Corinthians "as such WERE some of you" so wouldn't you want to not embrace that identity...especially in this culture where being a part of a group means you are proud of that tendency? )ie: gay pride)?? It's soooo confusing...and to dissect the words doesn't really help.

[@eddiejones5702]

Amen mtns4me117! Homosexuality is NOT an identity! I don't know if Greg believes that or not, but that's part of the problem. If I say I'm a "gay Christian", it sounds like I am saying my identity is gay, that's how GOD made me, but I reject and refuse to "act on" that part of my identity, because that's what HE wants! No. I struggle with SSA myself. Have for most of my life. But I would never identify myself by my emotional, or sexual feelings and urges. That's NOT Biblical! The Bible doesn't use the term "orientation". It uses the word "DESIRE". That's what I struggle with. Desire for the same sex emotionally, and particularly, sexually. That's NOT an orientation! That's a desire. And it comes from somewhere! Whether it's from sexual abuse, detachment from parent of the same sex, fear, whatever. It's not just part of who you are from birth! JAMES 1 talks about that desire coming from ourselves. We have to be careful not to let the world's definitions and ideologies influence us as believers. And I don't understand why a believer would even WANT to call themselves "GAY," UNLESS you believe it's an identity. Which is an Un-biblical ideology. I don't believe he's a heretic or anything like that. But I do believe it's bad theology to label yourself something GOD would never call you. It's almost like some people who call themselves gay Christians, WANT to hold onto some aspect of their desire if you will, without committing the actual sin of homosexuality. I'm not saying that's what Greg wants. Please don't accuse me of that. But I do believe some do, and that's unfortunate, and really suspect if you ask me. As far as the other topics of "gay agenda", "gay lifestyle", etc. etc. Well, that's for another post! 😂 GOD bless. Good conversation Preston! Appreciate it.

[@mtns4me117]

@@eddiejones5702 thanks for the honest, well thought out response. God bless you and I will hold you up in prayer as God lays you on my heart ❤️

[@eddiejones5702]

@@mtns4me117 Thanks so much! I really appreciate that! Much love in Christ my friend! 🙂

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

@@cyndawinans8315 Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Simple as that.

[@lanceallenmcginnis1105]

8:48 The temptation itself would not be sin. If I understand correctly entertaining the thought/temptation however, would be sin based on when Jesus said "lusts or hates in his heart". The old bird over the head analogy. You cant stop the thought from flying over your head, but if it builds a nest in your head that becomes a problem that needs to be repented of.

[@alexlindstrom555]

I like using “gay” to describe my attractions in some circumstances, and I like to use “same-sex attraction” in others. I have friends who reject the term “gay” and I have friends who reject the term “same-sex attraction,” and yet many of our perspectives and commitments to a traditional sexual ethic are the same. Sometimes I just want to through all terminology off a cliff, but nevertheless, I need to language in order to accurately communicate my experiences and my testimony. I think God understands.

[@politics4816]

Why would anyone put any word in front of Christian? Especially the sin they are tempted by. To me it is like saying I am an Alcoholic Christian

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Simple as that. Also, Greg is just being honest, just as any alcoholic Christian should be honest about their reality.

[@alexlindstrom555]

Ok more from me. Although I personally use gay, I also sometimes use “gay agenda” and “gay lifestyle”. I feel like I generally know what people are talking about. For me it means normalizing and overturning peoples’ beliefs about marriage. I realize there are different interpretations of these terms and it helps when there is respectful dialogue about what we mean. I agree on partnering to help reduce LGBT bullying and homelessness.

[@dr.markmcnear2380]

Thanks

[@darrenwithers3628]

The obsession with sex started with the puritans and the Pentecostal Church arose from that movement. Sexual morals were not always as rigid as they are now.

[@JohnVandivier]

I was glad to hear him say that based on the sexual definition the question "Can someone be born gay?" Is an obvious no.

[@darrenwithers3628]

That doesn't mean what you want.

[@JohnVandivier]

@@darrenwithers3628 You don't know what I want.

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Were you born a sinner ??

[@stevenrogersfineart4224]

I find the body language interesting. Usually people turn in towards each other whilst speaking.

[@lanceallenmcginnis1105]

yea... its an awkward dynamic. If they turn towards each other they are too close. Preston mentioned earlier that they only had one working mic. Preston normally interviews via skyp.

[@bhickman6]

Yep. Crossed arms note that he wants to make sure he's not guilty by association.

[@majacobs]

I really appreciate the info about the stigma surrounding the term SSA. In regards to the discussion on euphemisms, I don't think all of them imply that the thing being avoided is too "heinous" to speak about. We create euphemisms to avoid speaking directly about sex between heterosexual married couples as well. The reason for this is because sex is a private thing that should not be spoken of lightly in public. The problem he is addressing is really about the stigma surrounding the term "gay" and "gay lifestyle" is not only too private to discuss in public, but also with close friends and family. That is more a cultural problem in the church than one of inappropriate creation of euphemisms. Thank you for this discussion! I've learned so much!

[@danielwilda8167]

The proper terminology is CHRISTIAN Gay men ✝️🌈🏳️‍🌈💙🇺🇸⭐️🙋‍♂️👍

[@timconley2787]

OK, so from what I hear, we are wrong to assume that a Christian who proclaims: "I'm a gay Christian", is involved with same-sex activity,...agreed. The complication I see is that how would one get clarification from this person whether or not they mean or do not mean they are involved with same-sex activity? If you are in ministry leadership within a church with a historically orthodox view of same-sex activity and a "gay Christian" who wants to be involved in ministry, then it must 1st be determined whether or not they are living out a traditional sexual ethic. So how does the pastoral staff approach this dilemma? It would seem that no matter how welcoming, loving and accepting the pastoral staff may be, this kind of "vetting" might be offensive and off putting to the gay Christian. Someone in ministry who is having sex outside of marriage would be absolutely as concerning and would be a reason to deny them a ministry role. In my mind, the one "sin" is not greater than the other and in no way does the heterosexual get a pass. If I insist as identifying as "gay" as a Christian, it seems that I'm setting myself up for hearing questions about what one means by this from the church. I cannot buy the idea that if the church puts forward questions about this that this equals bias, judgmental or unwelcoming. There are quite a number of people who identify as "gay Christians" who are practicing same sex activity and support gay marriage. This is why I'm personally not able to assume what one means when they say they are a "gay Christian".

[@lanceallenmcginnis1105]

I agree, "Gay Christian" can be confusing and misleading. It could lead one to believe they are acting sinfully on the gayness. It caught my attention and so I think it is doing its purpose in this case and in the title of the book. Ministry would be prohibited for fornication (premarital sex) and acted out gay sex amongst others. If someone was open about being a "gay or same sex attracted christian" and wanting to minister or even attend, the church would be allowed to dig into the details. 1 Cor 5 implies all unrepentant sexual sinners be shamed and removed for the preservation of their own soul. If they had Gregs perspective a different strategy would be discussed. Also, Sin does have degrees. Planning on stealing gum is sin and needs to be repented of. In addition, actually stealing a piece of gum is less severe than Bernie Madoff stealing 65 billion. Sexual sin has degrees as well. Gay sex would be considered more severe than fornication because it is unnatural. 1 John 5 differentiates sins that lead to death and those that don't. All sin is graciously forgiven when acknowledged as sin and repented of. THANK GOD for his kind mercies!!! Greg is unique in that he has "come out". Many who have his perspective could keep the temptation low key and minister perfectly well in a traditional church setting without it being part of their identity.

[@endswithme555]

Fair point!

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Straight Christians in huge numbers are having sex outside of marriage as well. Perhaps all of the straights need vetting !!

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

@@lanceallenmcginnis1105Sounds Like you are suggesting that Greg be dishonest and shove himself back in the closet 😢

[@lanceallenmcginnis1105]

@@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife It was about a year ago that I listened to this. I dont really remember the context. I suggest we love Jesus with all our heart and forsake anything the bible identifies as sin. If I am struggling with a particular sin I think it is healthy to confess it to someone who can help me overcome and stop the sin. I personally struggle with several types of sin. I am not always the most motivated worker. It would be odd if I identified myself as a slothful Christian.

[@cheryleverett2318]

Scary, scary - Scripture about repentance, dying to ourselves, identity in Christ goes missing under the avalanche of redefining words to comfort ourselves in what God calls sin. “You’re so good at being gay”, Preston says, Greg says jokingly, “that it’s a natural gift, what can I say?” Not funny guys - you will discover that if you don’t have a change of mind and heart on this topic - because God has made things pretty clear.

[@daveswavely6642]

Honest question... Should people who have always had a strong orientation toward multiple partners (and great difficulty being faithful to one partner, especially in desires and thoughts) refer to themselves as "poly Christians"? And should they "come out" as poly?

[@darrenwithers3628]

No, anyone can be attracted to multiple people, it isn't an orientation. Multiple people tend to become more attractive when you haven't had sex for a while. You could come out as insationable. lol

[@LifeandLifeMoreAbundantly]

@@darrenwithers3628 -Sinners need to orient to God. We need to turn our back on the world the devil and our flesh nature.

[@lanceallenmcginnis1105]

That is a pretty good take. If you wanted to write a book, do podcasts and talk about faithfulness to one woman it would be more appropriate to "come out" as having a past with sexual brokenness. Identifying as a "poly Christian" but not acting on it would be controversial just like the title of Gregs book is. Also, bringing sin to light is a good way to overcome it. If you "come out" the enemy is not able to shame you. Most people that have Doug's perspective probably don't "come out" but it is refreshing to have someone who talks openly about it and how to overcome.

[@lanceallenmcginnis1105]

hmmm, I didn't know "homosexual" was not cool.

[@anxiaati4464]

Can you also give a topic about slavery and how I was used by white against black?

[@rayray5999]

When straight people introduce themselves they don’t say, “ Hi, I am a heterosexual christian.” Or, “ Hi, I am a straight Christian.”

[@endswithme555]

So here’s a question. The gay person that believes in God, how should they classify themselves?

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Greg is simply being honest about his reality. Simple as that.

[@shelleythomas1046]

Not sure if I missed it but was the question "what does gay christian actually mean "? even answered? Lots of happy friendly talk. Not so much of even 5 minutes of reading New Testament easy to understand scriptures on the subject of same- sex sex by two christian men? Sorry if I did not hear Greg answer if he was " "practising" gay sex " or "living the life style" (you get it). Is this do not ask do not tell while having a conversation on the gay christian topic? Ok

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is celibate. This is very clear.

[@lezzimars6061]

Why still use the label gay?? Our identity should be in Christ being a new creation please stop mudding the meaning to the word Christian who is a Born again person who now lives for Christ. No such thing as “gay Christian” I rebuke that word.

[@Ben-jf6it]

Did you watch the entire video?

[@darrenwithers3628]

You rebuked a word... that makes sense. lol

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Greg is simply being honest about his reality. Simple as that.

[@zacdredge3859]

23:35 I'm curious, what are the 'many reasons' that the comparison is "problematic"? If my looking at a woman lustfully is adultery of the heart then it's no less valid to define the vast majority of Christian men(and likely women) who are married as Adulterous Christian's as it is to define a celibate homosexual as a Gay Christian. I also have never called myself a straight Christian. I think the problem with Greg's distinction isn't so much his view of adjectives but that it doesn't consider what Christian means; if I am in Christ then I am a new creation and anything in me that desires that which is contrary to God's will is a remnant of the old man and not a valid modifier of what 'kind of Christian' I am. I wouldn't use my nationality either, even in the way that doesn't align with a given politcal view, whether in line with Greg's or not. The word Divorced, in contrast, is implicitly referring to something in the past; you don't need a bachelors to know that words with that 'ed' suffix aren't talking about the present. Would it be just as reasonable to casually refer to some in the process of terminating their marriage a 'divorcing Christian'?

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Greg is simply being honest about his reality. Simple as that.

[@SeenAndKnown]

This is the most terrifying conversation as you try to pervert grace.

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Greg is simply being honest about his reality. Simple as that.

[@rayray5999]

Why do you feel you need to use the term, Gay Christian? Why use gay at all??? Why preference the identity Christian” with a sexual orientation? Can you not just say, I am a Christian?? I understand what you say about two different Americans. But when meeting people from other countries I have never said, “ I am an American Christian.” I just share who I am, “ I am a Christian.” And they either know I am an American , or it comes out by the question, “Where are you from?” , or, I mention in our conversation, “ I am an American.”

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Greg is simply being honest about his reality. Simple as that.

[@ThalitaPontes]

So can gay Christian get married (same sex marriage)?

[@inYTbio_SiteLINKs2Verses_Bruv]

Yes.

[@lezzimars6061]

No, the Bible is clear God created men and woman.

[@inYTbio_SiteLINKs2Verses_Bruv]

@@lezzimars6061 He also created cute puppies, un-popped popcorn, and people who are gay.

[@lezzimars6061]

@@inYTbio_SiteLINKs2Verses_Bruv we all sin but not willingly, same sex relationships/marriage is against the order of God. We don’t act upon our flesh desires simply because we feel certain urges. That’s the whole idea of being born again and then new creation, we now identify in Christ and He helps us overcome temptations. Pick up our cross deny ourselves and follow Him.

[@alexlindstrom555]

I typically say that as a gay Christian, I can get married...to a woman...lol. But I believe in marriage between a man and a woman and that sexual relations are to be kept within than bond. That doesn’t mean I can’t still have love in my life in many other forms. I’d go as far as to say that celibate partnership is in harmony with the gospel I believe in.

[@caryt59]

So, being called "gay", as a Christian is fine as long as you're not engaging in sexual activity? Would the same thing apply, to being an adulterer, (in name only), but just not engaging in sex with anyone besides my wife? "GAY" is a lifestyle, not a race or a biological condition! So what does 1 Corinthians mean, in chapter 6, speaking of sins including homosexuality, when it says in verse 11, "...,and such WERE some of you!"? Serious question! As far as "not being the result of the fall,..." - There is nowhere in scripture that homosexuality is not viewed as sin, and spoken quite harshly as such. Since "sin" is a result of the fall, homosexuality would definitely be consequential result along with all other sins. The real danger is, when we make light of what GOD calls an abomination.

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

1 Cor 6 is referring to sanctification from sin. It is not referring to being changed from gay to straight.

[@cheryleverett2318]

Except homosexuality is a sin, as categorized by God.

[@truthrock9548]

very long talk for a simple truth. The answer is No! you cannot serve two masters. You cannot be gay and Christian. Either you can I sin or repent and be an x-gay. If you say you are still gay and you love Jesus, the truth is not in you. This is a deception because you are saying that continue to have the same lifestyle as before is okay. It is not okay.

[@rosamenchen9084]

He clearly stated, that he has had same sex attraction on occasion. He chose celibacy, and is not "living the lifestyle. He also explained that he used the term as an adjective, to describe himself. Attraction is not lust, attraction in and of itself is not sin. He also states that he supports the Christian idea of one man one woman marriage. I think you have missed the point that our current natures are corrupted by sin, and thus our struggles in this life. Believing in the Savior is not an instant cure, but a process to become more Christlike.

[@1aundulxaldin]

@@rosamenchen9084 You actually understood the message, well done.

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Greg is simply being honest about his reality. Simple as that. So, are you saying that Greg is not allowed to exist ??

[@shelleythomas1046]

Does God hate me like this being gay? No, God does not hate anyone. God says homosexuality is an abomination? Yes. Does God say we are overcomers thru faith in Jesus. Yes

[@westyso.cal.8842]

“Gay Christian?” Sorry guys, it’s simple; Read your Bibles and do not be deceived.

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Greg is simply being honest about his reality. Simple as that.

[@garypreston]

stop spread hate

[@NavarroMedia]

Being gay can be part of a persons biography, but it’s not to be a part of their identity.

[@KevinBrowneenjoyinglife]

Greg is a new creature in Christ. God redeemed Greg. God just chose to not make Greg straight. Greg is simply being honest about his reality. Simple as that.

[@orangeandslinky]

Words speak louder than actions, so let just play with words. Skip the subject. No one wants to know about that anyway.

[@shelleythomas1046]

"Same sex attraction" or "being gay " are both vague words, they are toy words like " gay christian". Are you out of the closet if you still have a foot in the door?