What I have learnt about the LFP battery in the Tesla Model 3 Standard Range Plus/SR+/RWD!

Use my referral link to purchase a Tesla product and get free credits you can redeem for awards like Supercharging miles, merchandise and accessories. ts.la/matthew72330
When I decided to buy an EV I didn't know how much the battery chemistry would matter. I thought of the typical factors such range, charging time and cost. The change to LFP battery chemistry in the Tesla Model 3 affects all of those factors and more. There are some pros and cons to this change but as I discovered, it is mostly pros. LFP is short for Lithium Iron Phosphate and describes the chemical make up of one half of the battery called the cathode (-). The other half is made of graphite and called the anode (+). This battery does not contain Nickel or Cobalt and because of this the battery is less energy dense, heavier, and more sensitive to cold temps. On the positive side it has a higher cycle life, consistent energy output, low internal resistance, can be kept at 100% SOC, is cheaper and much safer than other chemistries. I have been impressed with the performance so far and thought it would be great to make a video on my experience. I have some videos in the making of what this battery is like on longer trips too. I feel that this car will be sought after in the second hand market and will have a better resale value due to lower degradation. If you are deciding on whether to take the LFP option for your order hopefully this video will at least help you better understand the option.
Hop in and join me on my commute to work and learn about the LFP battery that more and more manufacturers a choosing for their shorter range EVs.
If you found this video helpful please like and subscribe to my channel.
My referral code: ts.la/matthew72330
0:00 Intro
2:20 Pre heat/Pre condition
5:08 LFP chemistry
7:00 Capacity and range
12:07 Thermal runaway
14:05 Higher cycle life
14:30 Charge to 100%
16:30 Slow charge and balancing
18:00 State of charge (SOC). How this is calculated
24:27 Benefits of low internal resistance with LFP
26:37 Final thoughts on LFP in Australia and in general

[@Kermit26297]

Excellent video about Tesla and their LFP batteries. I’ve done a lot of research on this and read a lot of technical papers, and you hit it out of the park. Learned several new things even, and also enjoyed your perspective on the LFP technology. We live in the US and have a M3 with the LFP battery arriving April - May. I keep trying to talk myself into getting the AWD version, because of the additional benefits like more range, better stereo, etc. But I can’t make the leap because I think LFP batteries are definitely the wave of the future, and their benefits for outweigh the detriments. Keep up the good work!

[@notinthemanual]

Glad you got something out of this video. I appreciate the feedback. My aim is to share what I’ve learnt from a technical perspective as it can be hard to find accurate info on these topics. Time will tell how good these batteries are. Cleanliness during manufacturing and assembly of LFP batteries is important for long life too. Tesla have pretty high standards for their components so I have no reason to doubt this. I’ve been impressed with the build quality of this car!

[@notinthemanual]

In regards to the long range decision. There are a lot of factors. It’s easy to become obsessed with range when shopping for an EV. If I lived in a regional area and fast charging was few and far between I would consider it for the range. If I lived somewhere with Ice and snow I’d consider it for traction. Even then the traction control system in a Tesla is by far the best system I’ve experienced so RWD would be fine for the majority of people. Your then left with performance, sound system and footwell lighting. I couldn’t justify that. You will be very impressed with the RWD and LFP.

[@manni1998]

@@notinthemanual Don‘t forget the eight year (160.000km) warnte on battery and motor. If it lasts eight year it‘ll last also fifteen years!

[@Rosewood185]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/qabaY2OthdeVgpI

[@sydjaguar]

Probably the best video on LFP pros v cons

[@hayden8693]

Thanks for the video. On model 3 Facebook groups I asked LFP vs the lithium-ion and people were like “LITHIUM ION IS BETTER BECAUSE I HAVE IT AND BECAUSE AWD IS BETTER AND BECAUSE THE CAR GOES FASTER AND FASTER MEANS BETTER” damn it pissed me off. So many idiots in those groups.

[@notinthemanual]

Haha. The RWD is still pretty fast anyway if that’s your thing. It also gives the same performance down to very low SOC & it’s a massive amount cheaper. The only reason I would consider AWD would be if I needed more range or if I lived somewhere the extra traction was needed but people survived without AWD for decades.

[@O000hShiny]

Great video with your explanations, one of the best if have seen so far. Coming from an electrician, I think you had made this pretty easy to understand from anyone's point of view without being to technical. This video has helped me know for sure that i had made the right decision in ordering a RWD M3 and cant wait for it to arrive .Great stuff, many thanks

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks for the feedback Joe. I was a technical trainer for many years with battery electric forklifts and provide tech support for various products to this day. It can be very difficult to simplify some concepts so everyone can understand. I am happy i have been able to do that with this video. I really didn't expect this video to be as popular. In saying that I never think I'm the smartest person in the room either. Everyone has something to contribute and I often learnt new things from my students. Also none of these things are new concepts on their own I just want to try and have it all in the one place. You won't regret your purchase. The car puts a smile on my face every time I drive. I am waiting for it to come back from the smash repairers and its killing me!

[@kvitoroulis]

Hi Matt - getting back to the cold part... 🙂 I have had the car for ~7months now and also had a chance to test it in the Canadian winter... (RWD/LFP). Some experiences: 1. From memory, at -35C (!) the consumption rises to about 200-220watts/km with reasonable AC. At ~ -20C i was getting about 160-180watts/km give or take. Car does quite well in cold weather even for longer trips of about 300km. 2. Superchargers at very cold temps are harder to use because the cable is really stiff! ...and they are out of order much more often... 3. Some issues with vapour condensation in the right pillar camera - Tesla technician fixed it by re-aligning something on the AC venting in that area. Other than that - car is great and saves a lot of $ being electric and all! Fun car! Cheers.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks k v. That’s really great information. Especially since I have no experience at those temps 🥶

[@Hhkkk7979]

Do you charge after every use (daily) to 100%?

[@kvitoroulis]

@@Hhkkk7979 yes, every other day to 100% battery is LFP.

[@justice1902]

Excellent video, your memory recall is amazing.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks. It helps if it’s a topic you know well and your not just reciting info you’ve read. My wife wouldn’t agree with you on the memory thing though 😜

[@jaydnisevil]

Really enjoying the videos mate, love how in-depth you go; especially in the settings. Would like to see a V11 software walkthrough if you get the time.

[@notinthemanual]

Its on the list Jaydn. Would be a long one. So many features.

[@blablatesla]

Thanks for this video, learned a lot from it! Looking forward to what’s to come.

[@notinthemanual]

Glad you enjoyed it! More videos to come. I'm new to video editing. It takes me a while to shoot and edit but its getting easier each time! The positive feedback is motivating though!

[@kvitoroulis]

Thanks Matt, nice video; gives a great sense of what those longer trips are like with this car. I imagine with the autopilot on for 99% of the time you would arrive at your destination less tired as well. Happy to see the channel growing by the way, keep up the great videos! You wouldn't have anything to post from those bridge base jumping days would you??

[@notinthemanual]

Haha I wasn't the crazy one base jumping...it was a work mate and at least 25years ago pre GoPro. They never used to have the tall fence on that bridge. Apparently it was very scary in the left lane on a tall coach bus. Autopilot definitely reduces fatigue and having to stop and charge is a good thing too. It forces you to take a break. I think most EVs will be better for long journeys but the Tesla has a combination of comfy/supportive seats, autopilot, air filtration and smooth driving that sets it apart from other similarly priced cars. One negative is the back seat is a little tight for my three teenage kids. We wont be doing any long family trips in this car. Thanks for your support too.

[@sporkeh90]

Very informative and interesting video, to add a note on the safety aspect vs Nickel cobalt manganese batteries, in a runaway condition in a LFP battery only the electrical energy gets released (like a short), in a NMC battery both the electrical energy and the chemical energy is released, basically it when it gets hotter it releases oxygen, making it even hotter releasing more oxygen etc.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks Julian. I think we have all learnt so much more from the discussions in the comments than my actual video 😂 Yes I have read what you mention in your comment. This is one of the reasons why LFP cells perform well in the nail penetration tests.

[@Kevin-yj6dq]

great video for new tesla owners with the lfp battery. much appreciated!

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks for watching Kevin. Glad you found it useful.

[@vijigopi2]

Great Video. Enjoyed listening the complete details about LFP batteries on Tesla Model 3 Standard Range

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks Sadagopan!

[@cristianoyl]

Thanks for the video. You went through a lot of research. Many of those tesla videos are built on hype, it's nice to watch videos like yours.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks CristianoYL. I’m passionate about EVs in general but try and keep hype out of the equation. Tesla M3 SR+ was the right car for me at this time and where I live. I think facts tell a good story anyway. Thanks for the feedback.

[@thorbjornmoe758]

Nice video about LFP and I hope Tesla will offer mode models with this chemistry. Thanks!

[@BatteryAddicted]

As a 2018 M3 owner here in the USA, was a blast listening to your experience and research on the LFP Tesla! Thanks!

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks Paul. I am glad this video is still relevant over a year later. LFP is proving itself to be the best choice.

[@shazzshank6393]

is 2018 m3 LFP ?

[@BatteryAddicted]

If I remember right, Tesla put out an LFP M3 in 2020. And 2021 the standard ranges had that option for everyone. @@shazzshank6393

[@Dan007LoveKhmerMusic]

Look forward to more. Hey you do a great great job.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks for the encouragement Daniel! I appreciate it.

[@johanotter9580]

Great video, good commercial for the lfp version 😀. Greetings from the Netherlands

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks for the nice feedback Johan. Great to hear from the Netherlands too! Yes. The LFP has been fine for me here in Sydney. It’s cold weather limitations are not the end of the world and the car does a good job at managing it. Most of the earlier problems were due to it being released too early before the software was fully developed.

[@TheMedianGam3r]

Very interesting video, thanks for all the info, i just bought my first tesla, went with model y RWD

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks. Congratulations on your Model Y. There is no going back now! Driving a petrol car will become a bit of a chore. I will upgrade to the Y soon. More practical for me.

[@yeha7242]

Thanks for the information great video!

[@oldcarstuff9844]

Great video, it's hard to find good information on the LFP chemistry. I noticed you've also got an EV tyre video. I'll check that out before I get my new tyres. 👍

[@slyguyaction]

We just bought our first Tesla - a 2022 RWD Model 3 with the LFP battery. There are cons to this chemistry and I understand the risks but overall, the pros outweigh the cons. It's a great battery and overall well suited to a daily use Model 3. Thanks for the info.

[@notinthemanual]

That’s awesome. Congratulations. I totally agree. It’s even great on long trips too. I am yet to find a real con to this chemistry but I don’t live in a cold climate.

[@PeterJames143]

Great explanation thank you

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks Peter!

[@davewells2244]

Great video. I just got my Model Y with LFP here in Canada. I prefer the LFP and ordered right away once Tesla announced they would come here. What happens in winter won't matter. I do all my long road trips in the summer.

[@notinthemanual]

That’s great Dave! Enjoy. I’ve got a Model Y RWD on order but my delivery just got pushed back till the end of this month 😩 My 3 has been an awesome car and yes you will have some reduced range in winter but the only thing that matters on a trip is enough to get to you to the next charger and that is pretty easy for most unless you drive somewhere super remote.

[@notinthemanual]

@@Ben-vy1ob Hi Ben. That is a good question and something that I considered. You can always use that argument with Tesla as they are constantly improving. I need the bigger car now and it’s already a huge improvement over the 3 for many reasons. I have 3 teenage kids and it’s a very tight squeeze in the M3 for passenger comfort and storage. I’ve never gotten used to the sedan either. I don’t care about HW4. The refresh on the Y will mostly just be about Tesla saving production costs so I feel that there will not be a significant enough improvement for the user to justify holding off another year. The only thing that would be nice would be ventilated seats. I feel the timing is quite good now. It’s the cheapest it’s ever been and the price of my 3 will drop even more when the new model 3 comes out. The current Y has a few improvements from last year. From another point of view I’ve actually put off buying the Y for a year now since it was released in Australia. The 3 was always just a car to fill the gap until the Y came out in Australia and yes I know I’m lucky to be able to afford to do that.

[@aviationboy8]

Great video. I live in Canberra and the LFP is much more sensitive to cold temperatures. As you mentioned, anything under 20c and you have limited regen. Also the way the car heats the battery is a bit of a mystery to me. I charge at work so I have compared heating the cabin remotely via the app, both plugged and unplugged. Unplugged the car doesn’t seem to precondition the battery at all, unless the ambient temp is below 8 or 9c. Plugged in this value seems to be higher, I assume to save energy used from the battery? I don’t have SMT so it would be interesting to see more data.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks. Check out my video on preconditioning. Well it’s actually a series. I explain all of this in the first video. Plugged in the motor will work as a battery heater by powering up the stator windings but it also uses the heat pump. Unplugged it is not as aggressive but will randomly use the rear motor to heat the battery. The combination of the rear motor and heat pump when plugged in heats the battery much faster. The heating and cooling system shares the heat between systems. If you cool the cabin it takes heat from there and uses it to heat the battery and if you heat the cabin is sucks heat from the battery.

[@mamadelta5608]

Nice video. Very informative on the new LFP batteries. What Amperage do you recommend for EVSE charger?

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks Mama Delta. It depends on how often and how fast you need to charge on a regular basis. Fast DC charging should be used only when needed. I just use a mix of the mobile connector with 240V 10A (2kW) and a wall connector with 415V 20A (11kW) while I’m at work (solar powered at work). Both of these are fine to use on a regular basis. Most people travel short distances to work each day and the mobile connector will be fast enough. This may not be fast enough if you have a small off peak charging window. I also made a video on the mobile connector which gives you a bit more info on this.

[@need4speed998]

Nice, you're doing well 👍

[@notinthemanual]

Cheers need 4speed99

[@yggdrasil9039]

Thanks for this. How have you found navigating potholes in a M3 RWD? I heard the tyres/wheels are quite expensive to replace/repair and there's a lot of potholes in Sydney at them moment so I wonder if you are being extra careful (I burst a tyre in a huge pothole on Epping Road/Delhi Road a few weeks ago, but fortunately it only cost me $90 for the tyre).

[@notinthemanual]

Haha yeah roads have been like Swiss cheese lately. I was lucky enough to only hit some small ones. M3 handles pretty well so dodging them is easier than a bigger car. It’s crazy watching everyone swerve around them. Bummer about you bursting a tyre. I haven’t had to replace a tyre on the M3 yet so not sure how much it would cost but it would be a lot more than $90. Definitely being careful 😬

[@asiboy2912]

Nice video! My dream EV is a Tesla Model Y, I just can't afford here in NZ but at the moment I'm enjoying my Leaf as my daily♥️👌🙏

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks. At least your in an EV now! Nissan Leaf is a good car. Just a bit small for me. Model Y will be my next car. It won’t take long for some to get to the second hand market once hardware version 4 comes out on the 3 & Y.

[@vasil7410]

Thanks for the video, good to see someone with actual technical experience and knowledge reviewing Teslas. I had one question that I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to. I know that Tesla wants the LFP battery fully charged to help with its SOC calculations but is this best for the battery health? What if I don't care so much about the accuracy of the SOC? I have read that even the LFP should be charged to 80% on a daily basis and only to 100% once a week. It's better than the NCA in regards to degradation but still not perfect.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks Vasil. Firstly all batteries degrade, just at different rates. This depends on their chemistry, build quality, thermal management, charging management and SOC they are stored at. Tesla manage most of this for you but they can’t control the state of charge you keep it at or how much DC fast charging you do. LFP also has a much higher cycle life due to it being robust and lower internal resistance which keeps cell imbalance in check. The main thing to think about when comparing LFP to other chemistries Tesla use is how stressed the battery is when fully charged. This is basically the energy density. The LFP battery is fully charged at 3.65v/cell where Nickel Cobalt chemistry is 4.2v/cell. Roughly 365v and 420v total. Charging an LFP battery to 100% is similar to charging a Nickel Cobalt battery to 70-80%. To sum this up I wouldn’t put to much thought into it. Just charge when you need to and top up to 100% once every week or so. It really depends on how fast you can charge at home or work and how long your daily commute is. Main things is don’t get to hung up on it. DC fast charging still remains the biggest killer of battery life as it eats through your battery cycle life faster. LFP cycle life far exceeds other chemistries.

[@notinthemanual]

Also SOC accuracy really only matters when you run down to very low states of charge in my opinion.

[@vasil7410]

@@notinthemanual Thanks for the feedback. I certainly don't need to be fully charged every day, infact I can probably get away with only charging once or twice a week. So if this is a good charging profile for the LFP batteries then that's what I will stick to. Regarding fast charging, I doubt I will ever have to fast charge, which is great because slow charging is best for the batteries anyway. And a power point at home delivers cheaper electricity. In fact, one of the appeals of an EV is never having to visit a service station! I am sure most people think the same way so this leaves me doubting the economic viability of public charging stations in an EV world, but that's a discussion for another day.

[@notinthemanual]

@@vasil7410 Yes. Once you own an EV you realise that public charging isn’t needed for most people. If you live in an apartment building without a charging option and can’t charge at work then you will need to public charge.

[@haicokaspers7214]

Thanks for the reale good Technical explanation. In to the Future chemistry of battery’s for car and power packs. Tesla is setting really high on this chemistry as-well for the 4860 cells. Australia is really nice country show to us wen you drive to work.

[@figueiredoeduardo7252]

Excelent vídeo!! I have a 2024 Model 3 SR with LFP. Do you think that the battery beneficts from charging only until 90% most of the days. And charge 100% only once a week?

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks. Yes that sounds like a good charging routine. The point is not to stress about it. If you don’t need to charge everyday then don’t worry about it. Now I have an 11kW wall connector at work I just charge once or twice a week off the solar there to 100%.

[@brucehawkinson8901]

Love the info, I’m torn between the standard range and the long range model 3, here in the northern United state where I live, the winters are quite brutal, winter temps are often -20 C. 3 months of the year. What are your thoughts? Would the pre conditioning you mention help that out or would that just reduce my range even more

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks Bruce. Pre-conditioning while plugged in is best as it doesn’t eat into your battery charge as much. Pre conditioning makes the drive feel more consistent with regen and more efficient during the drive. Pre conditioning when you aren’t plugged in uses between 1-2% charge and could be worse in super cold temps but it’s not the end of the world if you don’t. It’s mostly for comfort and consistent drive feel. I’d go for long range for the all wheel drive more than range. You only need enough range to leap frog superchargers so if you don’t have many chargers around then maybe range matters or if your drive to remote areas. Non-Tesla EVs need to worry about range slightly more as they don’t have the supercharger network. Here in Australia Teslas have CCS plugs so can use any fast charger. I am editing a video on pre conditioning at the moment and compare pros and cons. You will find the results interesting.

[@brucehawkinson8901]

@@notinthemanual thanks for the reply, the delima is the long range is $9000 more

[@notinthemanual]

@@brucehawkinson8901 Yes. That’s an expensive dilemma. It’s one I can’t help you with as I have never lived somewhere that cold and don’t know the driving conditions.

[@SidelerMN]

Bruce, curious if you decided to to buy and if so, if you went with LR or SR? I ask because I’m in the market for either a new SR or used LR. I live in Minnesota and would have to do a couple of winter round trips in the cold.

[@pkerry12]

Lfp also can always be recharged to 100% all the time

[@jordangutteridge4737]

Thanks for the video. Like yourself, I am also intrigued with the different chemistry batteries being introduced in to the EV market now. I have ordered a Tesla model Y from the Chatswood branch which is due early next year. I am very pleased it has the LFP batteries installed, I feel the advantages far outweighs the disadvantages, especially in our climate. The one question I do have for you which I’m hoping you can answer. I understand that by charging the car to full the BMS will then have a benchmark/reference to work from and give a SOC readout accordingly (predominantly based on net power usage) What I haven’t worked out is how the system will take into account battery degradation over time which as far as i know relies heavily on the voltage scale. When the battery is new it is quite simple because the BMS knows it has X amount of kWh when full. With LFP do you think it is necessary every so often to run the car to a point where the voltage begins that sharp drop off so the BMS can determine the remaining useable capacity from that point to 100%? Cheers

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Jordan. Congratulations on ordering a model Y. You won’t regret it. I’d say you will get it earlier than expected based on how Tesla are ramping up production. I wouldn’t worry too much about degradation. I have some other videos on this. My car is over a year old now and has 18000km. So far I haven’t seen any effects of degradation. There has been a reduction in predicted range at 100% charge but I have so much feedback now of other cars with same spec as mine that I know it is just where Tesla set the range in the software. So many people now have said they have exactly the same range estimate as me. During an update Tesla reconfigure the calculations used for range so it changes over time. There is a top and bottom buffer in the battery capacity that can absorb what little degradation you will have over time. The BMS in the car is continually upgraded too. It is a pretty smart system monitoring individual cell health as well as whole battery health along with charging. You don’t need to worry about doing anything yourself. The only thing I would recommend for longer battery life is limiting DC fast charging to long trips and just AC charge most of the time. We actually don’t know the true capacity of the batteries in our Teslas so can’t measure a realistic degradation without pulling the battery apart and doing individual cell capacity tests. I made a video on load testing the battery and give my thoughts on degradation and the LFP. The BMS will monitor degradation using voltage and other methods. As the battery degrades the internal resistance will increase and affect voltage sag under load, charging speed and output. All of this is thoroughly monitored by the BMS.

[@notinthemanual]

Sorry. I don’t do short replies. Main point is don’t stress over the battery. Tesla are so much more advanced over other EV manufacturers that your battery is in good hands. Don’t get obsessed with charging to 100% all the time. Only when you need to and at least once a week is my own policy. SOC accuracy really only matters if your running the battery low. Honestly once you have the car for a while you won’t worry about this stuff.

[@jordangutteridge4737]

Thanks for the reply Matt, no problem at all I enjoy long informative replies. my question was more out of interest than concern, Obviously Telsa use us as test pilots and so was intrigued how they would collect degradation data from us for their own benefit, as you say this will be through various methods. I should mention that I was one of the early adopters of EVs back in 2013 at the age of 19 with my Nissan Leaf mk1 (when I lived in the uk). With a maximum range of 160km you could say any range or degradation anxiety has been well and truly knocked out of me, I had the Nissan Leaf for 2 years before moving here to Australia. In comparison to what is on the market today (Including the new Nissan Leaf) it was very limited but it was an honour to own such a car when EVs weren’t mainstream, I have closely followed the industry since and can’t wait to finally get back In to the EV lifestyle. I really hope you are correct about my model Y coming early 😀🤞

[@notinthemanual]

@@jordangutteridge4737 Wow. That would have been cool owning a leaf back then. Most people only use a small portion of charge for a commute so people don’t need massive range but it’s drummed into us by the EV haters that you will have range anxiety. In reality it just doesn’t come up unless your doing a long trip. The. The SR 3 or Y are fine with the supercharger network. You only need enough range to leapfrog the DC fast chargers. That is why efficiency wins over huge battery capacity. Even if my battery degraded to 80% in 10years I could still drive to Melbourne or Brisbane without issue.

[@jordangutteridge4737]

@@notinthemanual Yeah It certainly had that pioneer feel about it, the big difference i see now is the level of acceptance to EVs has really improved. 10 years ago i had people telling me that i drove a milk float and that the concept wouldn’t catch on, how wrong they were! You are absolutely correct about only using a small portion day to day, i even found that with the leaf. Its amazing how many people suddenly have the need to drive from sydney to Perth when you talk about EVs, at the end of the day there’s horses for courses but as time goes on and the infrastructure improves more and more people could easily use an EV for everyday life. The biggest issue is not cost, its mindset.

[@2024301]

Sunshine? Are you sure this is Sydney 😂. Great video.

[@notinthemanual]

Haha yeah you wouldn’t know it at the moment. I’m wishing for that February weather to come back and for all the potholes to be fixed fast!

[@terryrodbourn2793]

You should have talked about the charge draw when typical driving!

[@notinthemanual]

Sorry Terry I thought I mentioned in there that my return trip to work uses approx 8-10% charge for half hour (22km) journey each way. I have another video in the works on efficiency. My commute averages 130Wh/km. My overall average consumption is at 140Wh/km which is slightly above published consumption but the acceleration is addictive and hard to resist. A friend of mine has the same car and he averages 135Wh/km and has also done much more freeway driving than me.

[@vanjames1984]

What about a video talking about the new Li-ion 12v battery and the differences vs a traditional lead acid one? I picked up my model 3 end of Jan and it had the LFP plus new Li-ion 12v battery. I know it's to help minimize the 12v battery dying problem, but curious to know more about the how and why.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi James. Good idea. This interested me too. I know why they did this but I’m not sure what was actually failing on the old lead acid batteries. Maybe that’s irrelevant anyway. A lead acid battery was always a bad idea in my opinion as the standard non-deep cycle start batteries are not very robust. I’ll be happy to upgrade mine in the future but I’d want to be sure the car is setup to charge an LFP 12V properly before I did. LFP can be damaged if overcharged so the charging cycle would have needed some tweaking. They don’t work well with alternators providing a constant charge voltage but this should be an easy software fix for a Tesla as they don’t run alternators. I don’t know if Tesla have just made all Model3’s compatible with LFP 12v or if they need to make a specific software setting change in the car at Tesla. I’ll do some research and put something together.

[@vanjames1984]

@@notinthemanual awesome looking forward to it! From what I've heard the dying 12v battery issue isn't exclusively a Tesla problem but other EVs are also having similar issues. Not sure why. Also I heard something about the new Li ion 12v battery not being 12v exactly but slightly higher, also not sure why.

[@notinthemanual]

@@vanjames1984 Hi James. Sorry. Just realised you sent this reply. I think it could possibly just be a quality issue with the 12V lead acid batteries. They are a very small lightweight battery and possibly it was underestimated how much strain they would be under. I think EV manufacturers will learn how to manage this issue pretty fast. The trouble for Tesla is they have sold so many cars with lead acid batteries that would still be under warranty. I never used to get more than 2-3years out of a start battery in my ICE cars with the exception of my last car that had stop-start function. These cars have heavier duty batteries with more capacity.

[@notinthemanual]

@@vanjames1984 I can also explain the voltage for the new 12V LFP battery being higher than 12V. The 12V is just a nominal rating. It is actually made up of a number of 3V cells. The LFP cells can be charged to a maximum of approx 3.5V per cell and 2.5V at discharged. Lower than 2V or higher than 3.5V can damage LFP cells. Knowing this 3.5V x 4cells = 14V. This 14V is the same as an alternator puts out on an ICE car so is perfect compared to 10.5V that you would get using only 3 cells. Most components designed for 12V systems will run happily at approximately 9V-20V so 14V on a fully charged 12V LFP is no problem. A 12V LFP chemistry battery is robust and readily available as they are widely used in DIY solar and backup battery systems. They are more expensive than lead acid but cheaper than other chemistries. If you want to see inside one of these LFP batteries search KZbin for Will Prowse DIY Solar.

[@SuperKeane]

Great video, thanks. Do you lose much range in hot weather running the aircon? Say 30 Degrees+.

[@notinthemanual]

Not that I’ve noticed. Efficiency on my work commute doesn’t vary much all year round. This car is super efficient. If you keep it on auto and set to around 21deg it’s fine. It’s a trade off. In summer the car doesn’t need to put as much energy into heating the battery and so it’s more efficient from the start. We had a pretty mild summer last year so not sure about 40deg but we will probably have a few of those days this year.

[@SuperKeane]

@@notinthemanual Thanks for your response. Was thinking of getting one for uber, but when working a 12 hour shift I do around 400km, plus running the aircon for this time in Queensland heat might not work. I’ll hold off for another 2 years for the battery technology to improve!!

[@notinthemanual]

@@SuperKeane Yeah don’t let that stop you. It will be the perfect Uber car. Charging is a breeze and so much cheaper than petrol even if you supercharge. So many free charging locations too for in between jobs. If you stop for a bite to eat at a supercharger you can top up most of your charge. After you own one for a while you realise how silly some of your concerns were. No maintenance cost would be a massive plus for Uber.

[@eddiexiang3606]

During snow season, my family go to Perisher weekly. Do you think the RWD will be good enough? I want to pre-order one to replace my current car just in case MYLR is not coming in the coming year.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Banana. Sorry but I can’t be much help with this question. I’ve never driven my M3 RWD in snowy or icy conditions personally. The traction control is pretty good and I believe the car limits regen automatically in snowy and icy conditions. It would be better than normal rear wheel drive cars as the weight distribution is pretty good and has a low centre of gravity. In saying this I’ve driven other rear wheel drive cars to Perisher in the past without issue. I’ve also watched a few videos on KZbin from UK and Europe about the Model 3 SR+ and it seems to be fine if it’s a maintained road and not some back country road covered in ice. Hopefully someone will read this that has had some experience in this situation and be able to give more accurate advice.

[@eddiexiang3606]

@@notinthemanual thanks!

[@markraahauge5255]

Nice video man :D How much does your range say in km or miles when the battery is at 100%??

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Mark. 414km without Aero wheel covers and 420km with them on. You change a setting to tell the car which wheel configuration you have. Range is tricky though. That is absolute best case and why a lot of people call it the guess-o-meter. There is an energy app built into the main screen and gives you a more realistic figure based on your average consumption for the last 10,25 & 50km. Also this is your range down to 0% which you never get close to like running out of fuel in your petrol car. After you own an EV for a while you realise that range only matters when you travel outside the city and you don’t really need to be overly focussed on it. Even then you only need enough to comfortably leap frog the fast chargers. Around the city I rarely get below 60-70%. That’s just me though and everyone’s circumstances are different.

[@markraahauge5255]

@@notinthemanual Thank you for the quick and helpful response :-)

[@markraahauge5255]

@@notinthemanual And is it a 2021 og 2022 LFP you've got? :-)

[@notinthemanual]

@@markraahauge5255 I’ve got the 2021 Model with a 55kWh battery.

[@rjr214]

hi. yüu will never have big problems with range because the weather not often colder than -5 degrees

[@choongta]

The right side of the display shows live view of the many cars (and such) surrounding the Tesla. I'm wondering what your opinion is in terms of the usefulness of this area of the display. To me, I think the information may be necessary for some sort of processing (say, Autopilot) in the background; however, the information itself doesn't appear to be of use most of the time to me as a driver. When driving, I don't really need the display presenting to me that there are so and so cars ahead of me and around me. And, say, even if I do need to know, by the time I LOOK down on the display, there is no way what I can do with such information - while on the move.

[@notinthemanual]

Yes I agree that most of the time this is not that useful until the car needs to warn you about something. When the car beeps a warning you can quickly glance down and see the reason for it. It’s also useful to see that autopilot is engaged with the ‘tram lines’. I know these things can be displayed in other ways but it’s a unique way of doing it that adds to the experience. It’s handy for when you are parking too. These visuals are purely just for display and not needed by the car to operate. If something isn’t shown it doesn’t mean that the car doesn’t see it.

[@kenargy7675]

Good info. But Not sure why so much brake pedal use.

[@notinthemanual]

I normally don’t use the brake pedal at all but I have noticed myself using it while while filming. Bit of a nervous habit I guess. I had just gotten back into the car after driving an ICE ute for a few weeks while my car was being assessed. Also concentrating on talking so braking too late for regen alone. Didn’t use autopilot as there are some tricky spots where i have to take over and didn’t want to be distracted for those.

[@mohammadshalakhti]

first of all thank you for the video. i have a question, i only use about 5% to 10% daily, so what is the best way to charge the car ? like charge it once to 100% and wait to the next week to recharge to 100% or what? and thank u for your time.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Mohammad. That’s a pretty similar usage to me. It really depends on your charging options and if you have time of use rates for your electricity at home. For SOC accuracy and balancing the cells, it is good to charge up to 100% at least once a week. This is easier if you have a faster charge option at home or work. I charge once or twice a week off the solar system at work and normally wait for the charge to get down to 10-20% before I charge it. We have a wall connector there so can charge at 11kW. If I only had access to a 240V 10a point I would have to charge more often but not everyday.

[@mohammadshalakhti]

@notinthemanual oh i get it. Thank you very much for the reply 🙏🏻

[@NaughtyGoatFarm]

Hey mate. Now that the long range model y has been released in Australia what are your thoughts about the nmc chemistry vs lfp? I have done a fair bit of research and trying to decide. The extra range of the LR is sort of not such a bonus due to not being able to charge the nmc to 100% regularly due to battery degradation issues. I'm also thinking that for longevity the LFP is the better choice. It's a really hard choice.

[@notinthemanual]

I would only do it if I needed AWD traction or if I had to drive regularly out to remote rural areas of the country with limited DC fast charging. Range isn’t an issue for most people in the city or on long journeys with superchargers. For city use it’s a lot of extra money for range you won’t use. Even for journeys where it would mean less supercharging stops I don’t see a massive advantage. The RWD is more efficient and will charge faster at V2 superchargers. It’s all about kWh used between stops. The more you use the longer you have to charge for. I drove to Port Macquarie from Sydney recently and I could have made it without stopping but it would have been very close. I decided to charge for 10mins at Heatherbrae to add some safety margin. I would have saved 10mins with a long range. It’s also a 3.5hr drive which is at the bladder limit for a lot of people. It’s also good to take a break every couple of hours. Once you have owned a Tesla for a while you realise how much we are conditioned to unnecessarily worry about range. Range anxiety is only for people that take risks.

[@NaughtyGoatFarm]

@@notinthemanual yes good points. If lfp genuinely has much longer shelf life and charge cycle life then that might be the deciding factor. We will likely have this tesla until the wheels fall off so longevity is important.

[@notinthemanual]

@@NaughtyGoatFarm I’ve got an update video almost ready to post on my current state of battery degradation, range and charging habits with LFP. I’m just struggling with time to get videos done right now.

[@NaughtyGoatFarm]

@@notinthemanual give me a hint. Good bad or ugly?

[@notinthemanual]

@@NaughtyGoatFarm 😂 All ok. But it depends how you interpret the data. I’ve lost some range but some of that range was artificial in the beginning and I didn’t understand where the initial battery capacity came from in ScanMyTesla and to be honest they don’t either but it isn’t an accurate figure and gives an inflated degradation figure. I’ll explain in the video. I still don’t have the latest update which reactivates service mode. I’ll then be able to run a full battery health check.

[@ozone7]

I'm not an expert on Tesla, but measuring the magnetic field around the wires from the battery would seem like a better solution for measuring the current flow in and out! Introducing a resistor in series from the battery as a "shunt" to measure a voltage drop, however minimal, seems both old fashioned and energy wasting in my opinion. The magnetic field around wires are directly proportional to the current flow.

[@notinthemanual]

That could be how they do it. I haven’t opened up the electronics. When I worked on electric forklifts it was done with a shunt and most EV conversions use a shunt too. They are very common. I was just explaining one example of how current is measured. Either method would have energy loss at some point but a shunt would possibly be a cheaper method??? I’m not experienced too much in the design stage, mostly troubleshooting.

[@EPeltzer]

Tesla now recommends charging at least once a week to 100%. I assume this is to help balance the cells, but not sure. What is your take on this? I have a recently acquired used 2023 with 30k km. First time I charged to 100%, the last 1% took nearly 10 min. at a supercharger, rate slowing to around 1kw at the very end. This seems quite different from our other car, an ID4 with NCM battery. It will charge to 100% maintaining much higher charge rates like 15 kw or more to the very end. Not sure if this was because cells of the M3 were out of balance or if this was just normal for LFP. It's possible the previous owner didn't charge to 100% very often.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Eric. This has always been the recommendation from Tesla for LFP batteries. Its hard to say exactly what was happening with your car but at a supercharger the last 1% can take a very long time depending how the earlier part of your charging curve went. This is most likely the SOC calibration being a bit out and not matching the individual cell voltages. The car will charge at a lower rate to top off the lower voltage cells and it needs to do this carefully so it doesnt overcharge the higher voltage cells. If you could view ScanMyTesla you would see a large cell imbalance just as the charge is finishing. Total battery voltage often goes over 400V which is high for LFP. It will then settle down as the higher voltage cells relax and slowly discharge the excess voltage. My understanding is the DC-DC power converter is used for this process but any slow voltage discharge would have the same effect. After an hour of rest you will see the overall voltage drop to about 365V and the cell imbalance drop to around 4mV. This is a totally normal process that takes longer depending how out of calibration the BMS is. You often wont see this delay with the last 1% on lower power chargers as they tend to top the cells up more evenly. LFP is also more prone to imbalance and BMS calibration issues which would explain the difference with your ID4. Teslas BMS are much more advanced than others. A good thing to do for range and SOC estimate accuracy is to let your battery drain down to 10-20% and rest for an hour or so. Then you can AC charge back to 100% which will calibrate your cars BMS. This will often open up a few more kWh of capacity if it hasnt been done for a while.

[@JohnSmith-pg7eo]

Good informative video, thank you. You said that Tesla recommends charging the LFP battery to 100% at least once a week. Ideally, for battery health, how often should you charge to 100%? Each day or or few days? Cheers

[@notinthemanual]

Once a week is fine. It’s just to reset the battery management system (BMS) 100% reference point to keep the SOC as accurate as possible. LFP is not as accurate using voltage alone for SOC readout as the voltage range from 100% to 0% is narrower than other chemistries. LFP is less stressed at 100% charge which is why Tesla say that it is ok to keep it charged to 100% all the time. LFP batteries can still degrade over time they just don’t degrade as fast as other chemistries.

[@bytemark6508]

I personally charge my LFP model 3 to 100% anytime I need to charge it. Sorry, one time I did only charge it from 110V @ 1kw (I'm in Canada, and house plug delivers 110V, or 240V for home applicances), but that's only for testing more than the need, and that only added around 20% more from the 24% that I had at the time.

[@notinthemanual]

@@bytemark6508 Thanks for the feedback. I do the same at work and just leave it plugged in all the time. Some people have had questions about extreme cold weather and the LFP battery that I just can't answer living in Australia. If you had your car over the winter period in Canada it would be great if you could share your experience. Thanks.

[@bytemark6508]

@@notinthemanual I had my car since the end of January and it was freakng cold, -40C at times, but let's just say an average of -20C in the February - March months. I don't have a garage, so it my sat in my driveway the whole time. The only thing I did was to keep it plugged in (this what Tesla Canada recommends) even if I didn't charge it. I only need to heat / defrost the car for 5-10 minutes before driving it, and it all worked well. The heat pump seems a little loud, but it makes sense to run harder when it's that cold. Now we finally got to have some positive temperatures, and I can finally enjoy it without having to heat it up before. Cleaning up the snow on the car is the biggest struggle, but in those cases I just use the defrost function for 10-15 minutes to help the snow melt from windshield and windows. Oh, one more thing. my car didn't come with the wiper heaters (the new ones will have that function), but you can leave the wipers in the middle of the windshield by putting them in service mode (check on yt) and when I use the defrost function, the ice and snow around the rubber will melt, instead of sticking to the glass and tear. You can't clean them up otherwise, they will get frozen under the frunk and there is no way to use them.

[@notinthemanual]

@@bytemark6508 thanks for replying. Sounds pretty extreme where you are! There was a guy in Poland @Piotrek Sz asking questions about energy usage to pre-condition while he was away from his home charger. He has a M3 with 60kWh LFP battery on order and is worried about how it will be in cold weather. I wasn’t sure. I’d imagine 10-15mins pre-condition would use approx 3-4% charge in those conditions. When you hear that heat pump screaming it’s probably drawing around 6-8kW so yes it’s working pretty hard. You should also hear the rear motor buzzing too.

[@obelisk9999]

So all Tesla model 3 SR in 2021 came with LFP batteries?.. as I'm looking at one that was built in October 2021.

[@notinthemanual]

Only the ones built in the Shanghai factory. You can tell by looking at the charge level adjustment setting. Non-LFP will say daily and trip charging level where the LFP will just have 50% and 100% marked.

[@K12beano]

In the UK - having been starting to understand the LFP technology for a while, I have been drawn to what the Chinese have been doing, why they see the LFP to be safer all round, understanding its limitations etc. this is culminated in me, somewhat unexpectedly, jumping on the latest UK deal for an inventory M3 RWD just last month. It has adequate performance (and OK sound system) and is just wonderful compared to the line of non-Tesla EVs I’ve been enjoying over the last 20 months. I feel - especially with info coming out like your explanatory video - very confident in an LFP M3 being a good long-term bet! Thank you for this video!

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks. I appreciate your feedback. The best thing Tesla did was embrace this technology and setup the Shanghai factory. This LFP chemistry and the huge leap in build quality has been the key to Tesla dominating the EV market. I am so happy that this video is still relevant over a year after I made it. I really just wanted to share what I had learnt. The weaknesses of LFP aren’t insurmountable. Thank you for sitting through this long format video and I’m glad you are enjoying your model 3. I am about to change to a Model Y RWD with the same battery chemistry as this one. I plan to keep the Y for a lot longer and have confidence in LFP!

[@southauckland8095]

Could you please explain to us, power charging output station, does the battery cell experience damage if you charge at 50KW, it should we only charge at 7KW with Tesla wall charged?

[@notinthemanual]

There are a few ways to look at this. Remember we are talking long term effects. I don’t want to overstate these sorts of issues and have people worrying unnecessarily. Some regular DC fast charging is ok to do. We are talking best practice to optimise your battery health and degradation over a period of years. I also don’t want to over complicate this either. Basically, only charging an EV battery at high currents will produce some imbalance within the individual cell voltages. The cells with lower voltages will have to work slightly harder than the others. This is ok short term but every now and then it is good practice to charge at 11kW or lower. This will use the AC onboard charger in the Model 3 and give a gentle balancing or trickle charge of the individual cell voltages. This can also be achieved at a supercharger/DC fast charger if you let the car charge to 90-100%. The car manages the charging cycle at a DC fast charger and will taper off the charge current at higher states of charge automatically to protect the battery. What I mean by this is if you have no choice but to use DC fast chargers on a regular basis, it is fine, as long as you allow it to sit for a longer 90-100% charge cycle every now and then. The LFP battery is more robust than other chemistries but for accurate battery SOC it should be charged to 100% at least once per week. Everyone's circumstances are different. I am lucky to have a short commute and am able to charge my car at home & work so have no need for regular fast charging or even a high power wall charger at home. Hope that answered your question.

[@notinthemanual]

@Glenn Stimson Congratulations on ordering your car! Shame the wait times are so long right now. Hopefully with the new factories opening up some load will be taken off the Shanghai production. I don't have a wall charger at home but have charged at many of the shopping centre 3 phase Tesla wall chargers. Yes you can change the charging current from within the car or the via the Tesla app. I wouldn't be too concerned with 11kW charging rate damaging your battery. For example at the battery 11kw @ 350volts works out at 31amps. (11000W/350V=31A). This low current would be unlikely to cause cell imbalance. This is very different to DC supercharging at 140kW and 400A. I am not saying that dialing it back to 3.5kW wouldn't be better long term but its not something to stress over in my opinion. Also the LFP chemistry is more robust so all we are talking about here is best practice to maximise the life of your battery. Its like the old ICE thing where best practice was to let the engine warm up before driving. How do you measure the difference that makes to the life of your engine? Time will be the biggest test for LFP batteries in EVs. The battery in an EV is the most expensive component so I want to do everything I can to maximise the life of it. I am monitoring my battery health using the app called ScanMyTesla which i have a tutorial video on. It displays the voltage of each cell and gives you a reading of the voltage imbalance so you can monitor the health. Maybe this is worth a video on its own....... The only reason I don't have a wall charger installed is I don't personally have a need to charge that fast. My return trip to work uses 10% max which is easily topped up using the UMC that came with the car. I don't have a 3-phase meter at home so cost is a factor. Everyone's circumstances are different. For example if you live on the Gold Coast and commute to Brisbane everyday then you would benefit from installing a higher power wall charger at home. In reality most people wont run their battery close to 0% around the city and can put up with slower charge rates. I don't do short answers haha.

[@southauckland8095]

@@notinthemanual Thank you for your insights. In simple terms, only charge at DC 50KW+ if you have too. Otherwise charge with the free charging cable unit or install a Tesla wall charger at 7KW out put. 80/20 ratio is fair for charging? 80 percent 11KW or lower charging and 20% 50KW+ charging?

[@notinthemanual]

@South Auckland I wouldn't try and put a set figure on it but that sounds like a fair ratio to me. Don't stress too much over it. Remember its just a best practice sort of thing. Its easy to go down the rabbit hole on this issue and get too complicated.

[@notinthemanual]

In comparison I used to work with large lead acid batteries in electric forklifts in the days of pretty simple timed battery chargers. Operators used to opportunity charge while on breaks. These short charging cycles at high amps used to damage the cells and cause material to build up in the cell and short out the plates over a short period of time. Lithium batteries are much more advanced than those old systems and have a lot of protections built into the hardware and software for both safety reasons and to minimise damage to the battery. The car automatically manages most of the things that can cause short term damage to the battery so what I am talking about are things you can do to maximise the long term life of the battery.

[@piotreksz5713]

You mentioned that it is worth preparing (preheating) the car even at a temperature of 22 degrees Celsius so that the battery has better performance while charging. And do you know what charging speed can be achieved when the battery is about 5-10 degrees C or 10-15 degrees C without preheating, riding a charger other than SuC? I live in Poland and we only have a few Superchargers here .... This is very important to me as I ordered TM3 SR from LFP 60kWh and I am a bit scared. I am currently using Kia eNiro 64kWh.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Piotrek Sz. When I say pre-heating I am talking about purely for fast charging. The car will try and pre-heat the battery to over 40degC as you approach the supercharger. You need to navigate to the supercharger for this to happen. Pre-conditioning is different and more about having consistent regen braking while driving and generally a more efficient drive if you have pre-conditioned while the car is plugged in. Please take a look at these videos by Bjorn Nyland in Norway. kzbin.info/www/bejne/hoelemyvf7JsaM0 kzbin.info/www/bejne/oZLWh56un9JkjsU

[@notinthemanual]

The fast charging speed with LFP at 5-10degC or 10-15dagC will be very slow. Once connected to a fast charger the car will attempt to heat the battery so will eventually speed up but it will take some time and extend the charging session by a long period.

[@piotreksz5713]

@@notinthemanual I don't know if I understand well. Does the car heat the battery differently (up to 22 ° C) if we prepare it only for the road, and differently if we prepare it for quick charging on the Supercharger (above 40 ° C)?

[@piotreksz5713]

@@notinthemanual I know, it is very important to me how long it will take to warm the battery (5-10 ° C) when I connect it to the 100-150kW charger, but other than Supercharge. In Poland, we only have 9 items! Will the car heat the battery to the same temperature as SuC (about 40 degrees C)?

[@notinthemanual]

@@piotreksz5713 Yes. The pre-heat for fast charging is more aggressive with use of the heat pump. It allows the motor to heat up to 60-70degC too while driving and directs the coolant flow to the battery inlet. If you watch my second video for ScanMyTesla app you will see a demonstration of pre-heat for supercharging.

[@darylfoster7944]

One website stated that LFPs lose 10% of their charge after only 50k miles.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Daryl. There is a lot of mixed information out there. Degradation is difficult for owners to measure accurately. You are often only seeing the useable capacity set by the manufacturer which they can change with each software update. They can also reduce the upper and lower buffer to increase your capacity if needed. Based on useable capacity set by Tesla in my car it has degraded 4% of it original useable capacity but some of this is not real chemical degradation from what I can see. I have feedback from a number of similar cars to mine and the available capacity is almost the same to a decimal place. Very strange. LFP batteries can degrade between 5-10% in the first couple of years then they will stabilise and degrade very little after that. The LFP chemistry is still fairly new to modern EVs. They have been used in other applications for many years and this degradation trend is common but to be 100% sure we need to see these LFP Model 3s in 5-10years time. A big part of long battery life is the initial build quality and being able to keep moisture out. This is one of the unknowns.

[@Dave1955ist]

please use larger fonts for your "pros and cons" Great info!

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks for the feedback David.

[@fredfrond6148]

The BYD tang, with the LFP blade battery, beat out all comers in a cold weather test at 11% degradation. Not familiar with the design of the test however.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Fred. Thanks for the info. This is just proof of how fast battery tech is progressing right now. It’s hard to predict where it will be in a few years. I’m pretty happy with where it is right now for my current needs. It definitely needs to get more affordable for the masses. One of the things I like about LFP is it frees up more Nickel and Cobalt to be used in the more energy dense applications like trucks and longer range vehicles. China is such a huge market and making the transition at a very fast pace. They would have so much data on different battery types.

[@fredfrond6148]

@@notinthemanual the tesla long range, which I believe has the NCM battery was second by like .1%. So could very well be within acceptable testing error and not really decision point on which vehicle to get. Great point about LFP allowing nickel and cobalt to be used for other uses. The sodium ferrous phosphate battery will free up lithium for vehicles and will be a wayy cheaper than using NCM for backing up the grid. Your car is proof that Elon is technically diligent, he switched to the LFP battery for half his production, because it was cheaper and not as raw material constrained. Something that legacy auto will only clue into and follow Tesla after it is too late.

[@pkerry12]

So i am picking up my model 3 RWD on the 18th of march 2023, and so is it ok to just charge the LFP battery to 100% every day?

[@notinthemanual]

Congratulations and yes this is fine to do and what Tesla recommends. Remember they are warranting this battery so they would not tell you to do something if it will harm the battery. LFP batteries at 100% SOC are not stressed like Nickel -Cobalt batteries are.

[@notinthemanual]

Most important thing is to enjoy the car and not stress about things like this.

[@MR-jt2rh]

All model 3 RWD use LFP battery including USA? My m3 coming soon. Thanks for info

[@notinthemanual]

Hi. It depends where your car is being built. I believe the only cars being made with LFP are coming from Giga Shanghai factory. If you have your VIN number already then you will know where it is being built. There will be an MC before the last 6 digits of the VIN if it’s made in Shanghai.

[@notinthemanual]

Sorry I just remembered it’s also the LRW in the front of the VIN that signifies Shanghai factory.

[@figueiredoeduardo7252]

Is there any study about charging using 32A single phase or 16A 3 phases? What would you recommend (battery health)based on your knowledge?😊

[@notinthemanual]

In regards to battery health either option will be fine as they are both low kW. It’s just DC fast charging above 1C that is best to avoid on a regular basis although LFP is more tolerant of this as long as the battery isn’t too cold.

[@notinthemanual]

This is just based on my knowledge. I don’t think you will find a study as this is such a low charging rate.

[@figueiredoeduardo7252]

@@notinthemanualspeaking about battery degradation, I saw some study showing that the best is to maintain the battery between 65-75%…. If possible of course ….

[@notinthemanual]

@@figueiredoeduardo7252 Not with LFP. It needs to be charged to 100% regularly. 100% on an LFP is only 3.65v per cell so it is not very stressed like other chemistries that are at 4.2v per cell at 100%. There is a lot of misinformation out there. The best thing to do is limit DC fast charging above 1C rate to only when you need to and drive normally without flooring the accelerator all the time. The BMS takes care of the rest and the Tesla thermal management system is very good.

[@Hhkkk7979]

Do you charge after every use (daily) to 100%?

[@notinthemanual]

I used to when using the UMC to charge at 2kW but now we have a Tesla wall connector at work I just charge to 100% twice a week as it gives us 11kW charging speed. I don’t charge at home unless I go for a big drive on the weekend. If you want to charge to 100% daily this is ok too. I did this for the first year of owning the car and my degradation is actually slightly better than the fleet average on TeslaFi. When I first got the car it was also my first EV and you can’t help but have some range anxiety based on what non-EV owners tell you to expect 😂. You soon realise that even at low SOC you have plenty of range for the city and on the odd chance you need to make a last minute long trip it’s just a 10min fast charge before you go.

[@pbasswil]

When an Australian says 3 or 4 degrees, I'm guessing they mean °Celcius, right??

[@notinthemanual]

Yep

[@J3sus1sL0rd1]

Only barely few of electric vehicles home charging off the off-grid solar for free power from the sun light.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks Stan. Good news is that is not the case for every country or region and it’s changing very fast. Buying an EV makes you think about where your electricity is coming from and solar systems are getting cheaper each year. In regards to cost I have several shopping centres near me that have free 11kW charging in comparison I can’t fill my wife’s car up with petrol for free anywhere.

[@pkerry12]

Why do u have your foot on the brake the car automatically puts on the brake when stoped.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi PKTV. Just a bad habit from driving ICE cars for over 30years. It’s also not easy to drive and explain things in detail at the same time so I find myself doing weird stuff like this when I watch the videos after.

[@notinthemanual]

When I first got the car it was useful to have the car set to ‘roll’ mode instead of ‘hold’ until I was used to one pedal driving. When my wife drives the car she still has it set to roll as it’s more comfortable for her changing from her ICE car to mine.

[@stefanomancini6569]

does heating the cabin preconditions the battery

[@notinthemanual]

If you are driving the car or you turn climate on remotely the car will try and heat the battery to its operating target of 30degC. Any excess heat from the cabin is shared with the battery to save energy. If there is no excess heat to use from the cabin then the heat pump and heat from motor is used to heat up battery.

[@stefanomancini6569]

@@notinthemanual If understand well the morning before I take my car to precondition the battery I can go in Climate and turn on the heating on my phone and it will precondition the car or do I need to go to Schedule pre condition

[@TheSanien]

You are forgetting that with LFP batteries you can fast charge all you want without having to worry about degradation.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi San len Jao. Thanks. Yes, LFP is more robust when fast charged at ideal operating temperature. It can be damaged if charged at high current when cold though. Luckily the car is programmed to protect the battery from this damage which is why the LFP will charge so slow if you do not pre-heat before fast charging. All batteries will degrade over time. The LFP has a higher cycle life than other types of batteries. My opinion is you can worry less about degradation but it will degrade eventually, just slower than other types 👍

[@billligon4005]

Thanks for the info on LFP batteries - I've installed two 12v LFP batteries in my partners EV scooter. Previous batteries became 'memorized' and would only hold about 2 minute of charge. How does that happen? I understand any battery only really delivers 50% of it's stored energy before it's needs to be recharged. Is that true? Your discussion was very interesting if a bit long. And why can't 'regen' breaking provide more useable power to the battery (is it 1% or 2%)? Perhaps you can break your talk up into segments for each topic. I love the Aussie accent. Bill in San Diego.

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Bill. Thanks for the feedback. I put chapters in to help break down the video. As I get more practice making videos I should be able to be more concise. Driving and remembering technical facts off the top of your head is much harder then I first thought. I wanted to make it a pretty relaxed format as if you were coming along for a ride with me. In regards to your scooter battery I think it could be more degradation than memorising. Lithium batteries start degrading from the day they are made. The quality of the manufacturing and the chemistry determine how fast this degradation happens. Most lithium batteries are damaged if discharged below 2 volts per cell. 2.5v/cell is a good place to stop to avoid damage. They are also stressed if overcharged. Each chemistry has its sweet spot for voltage range. For LFP chemistry the battery is not under as much stress so takes longer to degrade. It’s weak spot is cold but that can be managed to a degree. EV batteries have buffers built into the upper and lower end of the state of charge. For the LFP M3 it is approx 2.5kWh. When your car reads 0% it actually still has some power to give but you don’t see this on the display. I am not sure about the 50% figure of energy supply but if you were to try and discharge to 0v you would likely cause major damage. Even lead acid batteries don’t like to be run totally flat. Most components in circuits need a minimum voltage to function so to run a battery fully flat really isn’t practical from that point of view either. It’s more about the usable energy. Voltage is like pressure similar to an inflated balloon. That last bit of air to come out of the balloon is not very powerful. I have small 11.1v & 18v lithium ion and lithium polymer battery packs I use for mountain biking headlamps at night. If I store these at 100% for long periods of time they degrade pretty fast over a couple of years but the better quality cells take longer to degrade. In the summer when I don’t use them I discharge them to 40% and store them in the fridge. I have packs that are over ten years old that still have useable capacity. Some of the cheaper packs I bought lasted only a year before they were not useable. These smaller packs have protection circuits built in for safety and sometimes those circuits play up too when the cells are still good. It’s hit and miss. You may have just been unlucky with your scooter. I too would like to see more power go back into the battery during regen braking. Tesla have limited this for a reason. Other EV manufacturers offer much higher levels of regen but most are FWD or AWD. I feel my RWD M3 would lock up back wheels if it was a lot stronger. For dual motor M3 and Y. I think it could be much higher. Sorry, I don’t do short answers either!

[@billligon4005]

@@notinthemanual Thank you again. Since batteries are the most important part of any EV vehicle I want to know more about them. I'm glad the LFP batteries have a very 'high' thermal runaway threshold which makes is good for airplane travel.

[@hwillia204]

Tesla udes little cobalt as bond not what your cell phone uses Nickel Cobalt which is dangerous ask Samsung. Telsa uses LFP and Lithium iron battery.

[@notinthemanual]

Yes the majority of Tesla cars sold now have LFP batteries.

[@gohumberto]

For regular mixed driving the 60kwh LFP version means you have >400km waiting for you on your driveway every morning. I mean what's not to love about that? I'm happy to never visit a fuel pump ever again.

[@notinthemanual]

It’s actually a hassle when I have to go and fill up my wife’s ICE. An EV charges while you get on with your life or sleep. These people that say it takes 5mins to fill up a car are wrong it has never taken me 5 mins to fill up. You have to drive there and wait in a queue half the time and also queue to pay. An EV turned out to be less of an inconvenience than my ICE cars even on a road trip.

[@moredark100]

How LFP can track battery degradation, if it only track how much energy has output?

[@notinthemanual]

The BMS estimates total battery capacity during discharge & charging cycles. It then compares this to the initial battery capacity when new. Its not super accurate which is why people find they have either a lot or very little capacity left once they hit 0%. My new Model Y had an 8kWh energy buffer for safety until it could calibrate and balance the individual battery cells.

[@notinthemanual]

It is also measuring energy going back into the battery.

[@Rothbardo]

How do I know what type of battery a m3 that’s in teslas inventory?

[@notinthemanual]

If they list the VIN then there will be a C before the last 6 digits that denotes China. Also the beginning will have LRW which is Tesla Shanghai factory. All standard range M3 out of Shanghai are LFP. You might also be able to identify by the range but I am not sure of all the facts for that.

[@notinthemanual]

Doesn’t look like they list VIN anymore. As far as I could find all new RWD M3 sold in the US have the CATL LFP battery.

[@KrisMclean]

I don't get why they deliberately use inefficient phasing on the rear motor to generate heat for battery warming? Surely the heat pump would provide more heat for a given kwh of input than the motor?

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Kris. Not my area of expertise but Tesla Model 3 is one of the most efficient EVs around so they must be doing something right. They do also use the heat pump at times where faster heating is needed like preconditioning for supercharging so this actually boosts the overall heating. The heat pump at full speed draws over 7kW and the rear motor uses 2.5kW when used as a heater.

[@KrisMclean]

@@notinthemanual I guess there's a good reason, shame the detail is so hard to come by. I'd like to grab a 2023 model3 with the catl m3p pack but so hard to make informed decisions with all this new battery tech & most review videos more interested in how many cup holders there are.

[@notinthemanual]

@@KrisMclean Yeah no one else comes close to Tesla tech wise for battery and HVAC management. I’ve been so impressed with this car. They aren’t the best cars out there from a style point of view but it is super consistent efficient which impressed me more.

[@notinthemanual]

@@KrisMclean My thoughts are LFP battery cars will hold their value more than other chemistries. I’ve had the car for 18months now and wish I had done it sooner but then I might not have got an LFP.

[@KrisMclean]

@@notinthemanual That's my problem, go for standard LFP with probably a lower long term capacity loss (watched a video showing LFP early decline is actually faster than ternary) or take a punt on CATL m3p LFP with higher voltages, more range but maybe capacity loss somewhere between LFP & ternary. Reminds me of the betmax/VHS dilemma back in the day.

[@Mkkkk38]

I order a model 3 rwd but i m scary about the power what you think about the speed and the acceleration ??

[@chrisboxsell4981]

Use standard mode and you will shit your pants if you are not careful

[@notinthemanual]

It’s a very fast car but most electric cars are due to the instant torque. If you have it in chilled mode the acceleration is reduced and smoother to drive if your new to electric vehicles. My daughter drove my car while she was learning to drive without any problems. You will be fine. As a backup the traction control system is one of the best that I’ve experienced. It reacts very quickly to any wheel slip and you hardly notice it working.

[@notinthemanual]

A rear wheel drive Tesla M3 is better than a front wheel drive Kona or Leaf or Ioniq. They wheel spin very easy being FWD.

[@Mkkkk38]

@@notinthemanual in 2019 i own one model s 75d i hope it will give me the same feeling

[@notinthemanual]

@@Mkkkk38 haha I got it backwards. I thought you were saying that it would have too much power 😂 Model S is faster but you will still enjoy the model 3 RWD. If your model S had induction motors and not the newer IPMSYNRM then the Model 3 should feel more responsive between 80 and 110km/h for overtaking. Will also have more consistent acceleration through full SOC with LFP.

[@McCarterly]

Have you noticed reduced Regen braking when the car is at 100% vs say 90% or lower?

[@notinthemanual]

If the battery is warm (above 25degC) no but if it is cold yes. In saying this during extended regen periods down a hill with 100% charge, the regen strength drops off but not for short regen periods. I made another video on pre-conditioning and you will see some figures there.

[@vincentpoole7588]

N/M. Do you think the new '4680 series' battery for all new Tesla Motor Company automobiles make yours now obsolete ? This is a pattern we see with all previous generation cars from "Electric-Jesus" ! V.

[@notinthemanual]

@Vincent Poole Hi Vincent. Good question. Firstly buying a Tesla is like buying an iPhone. Within a year of you buying it there will be a new model coming out with better battery life etc….The battery in my car was obsolete within 6 months when the 60kWh LFP came along. I’m not up on every detail on the 4680 batteries but I’d say for the US market LFP might be short lived. It really depends how fast they ramp up the 4680 production and the redesign of the different models to take the structural battery. Looks like Model Y will be the priority out of Texas. I think it will be a long time before the LFP in the Model 3 will be made obsolete. Especially when the LFP is produced so cheap by CATL in China. LFP cell technology is rapidly changing too so who knows where either will be at in a years time. The 4680 cell design saves money both in the production time and the amount of parts used in the pack and car. I have no idea how this compares to LFP cost. I don’t ponder on the future too much right now as I am more than happy with the range and performance of my Model 3. If I was thinking about buying a Model Y and lived in the USA I would probably still just go ahead and order one regardless of whether it had 4680 or not. The current cars are still amazing in performance and range. My main thought with the 4680 design would be cost reduction for the consumer. For example. Is the 4680 going to make the cars $10000 cheaper? I doubt it but I still think it’s a step in the right direction and will be a big step forward for battery tech. LFP chemistry will still have some advantages over NC batteries so time will tell. With the speed Tesla moves at anything is possible in a year or two!

[@kadmow]

Lithium Ferro Phosphate would be a less ambiguous on the "pronunciation"... (yes, ion vs iron - hard to tell the difference) Cobalt mining in Australia - and in the DRC, hopefully Glencore doesn't use kids in their pits or leach piles.

[@notinthemanual]

Definitely. Maybe I should start saying it that way! Heard some nasty stuff about DRC. When people are living in poverty they get desperate and there is always someone there to take advantage unfortunately.

[@CoralSea]

Have you heard of any Tesla Model 3 with LFP battery caught fire? I heard all the good things about the LFP battery but tbh I'm still can't believe there's no Tesla with LFP caught fire.

[@notinthemanual]

I’ve never heard of one. Trust me we would all hear about it if one did. LFP batteries can still catch fire but the risk is extremely low due to the higher thermal runaway point, cell construction and lower energy density compared to Nickel Cobalt. I’ve even seen videos where LFP batteries are crushed in a press and punctured by steel with no fire.

[@notinthemanual]

There is a massive density of LFP batteries in China so I’m sure they have had some fires but may not be Tesla.

[@SuperBartet]

Is it really safer? If for some reason the battery gets shorted, don't matter what the battery type is, it is going to burn. Yes it's thermal runaway is 450c, not 300c as in a Lithium ION battery, so you have more time to run away from the explosion. Hydrogen fluoride, hydrogen chloride, and hydrogen cyanide, are just some of the very dangerous gas's given given off by a lithium fire. L-ion battery 28% are these are hydrogen gas's, LFP battery 51% not only are this type of hydrogen gas's very deadly to breath, but they are extremely explosive. So a LFP battery is just a bigger bomb. Also Lithium Ion Burning velocity is 51 cm/second, LiFeP04 LPF Burning velocity is 112 cm/second, so it's going to set fire to more cars or buildings around it. LFP is also heavier than a L-ION battery. So when they say LFP is safer, they are bending the truth a bit. But you are right on all about LFP being much better at charging and discharging, so a better battery to use.

[@notinthemanual]

Once any Lithium Ion battery is at the point of burning it is catastrophic. The key thing to remember is LFP batteries are much less likely to get to that point. LFP cells can take a lot of damage without a short causing them to burn, even when punctured with a metal object. There are many test videos showing LFP cells being crushed without shorting and burning. In addition to this a battery in an EV has a few additional protections in place like pyro fuses, HVIL circuits, external casing and frame work. My biggest concern with batteries is more the build quality of the pack than chemistry. This is something that will be proven over time. Physical cell construction/configuration also plays a role in safety and some cell configurations can be safer than other when physical damage occurs. I don’t have any concerns about the safety of the LFP battery in my EV. Now if we were talking about very cheap e-scooters bought from aliexpress this might be a different conversation.

[@SuperBartet]

@@notinthemanual The videos you talk about tend not to be in the open and not have a enclosed environment to vent the gas's into like a car. There is a good video of firemen at a Jeep EV fire and they were lucky not to get injured as the car exploded shooting the roof over 40 foot in to the air. This is what happens when you have Hydrogen gas's in a confined space. A short will get a LFP to the point of thermal runaway, this can happen due to a fault or damage cause by hitting something in the road, or maybe a serious crash. Accidents do happen, owners of EVs need to know about this possibility, and how to get out of the car when it shuts down and locks you in it. And yes I know some cars have manual over ride on electric door locks, Tesla have them hidden in the front door trim, but not all know this. A guy had to kick his window out when his Tesla started to go into thermal runaway, he did not know about the hidden release, and when I say kick it out, I mean it. Tesla fit laminated glass on side windows. But Tesla don't fit manual over ride on the rear doors, so shame about your kids in the child seat in the back. Anyone that has a car with electronic door opening, EV or ICE car should read the manual and find out how to get out when all shuts down.

[@notinthemanual]

@@SuperBartet Ok. The LFP videos I’m talking about never get to the point of generating gases. That was the whole point I was making. My Tesla has manual release in all doors so I’m not sure what you mean by that. Even my previous Tesla. This all seems a bit alarmist. In reality these scenarios are extremely rare. It isn’t so easy to short the cells in an EV battery either even in an accident. LFP even more unlikely. I am definitely not saying an EV battery can never catch fire. There are many other things I’d be concerned about with a car in general before I even started to worry about a battery. It’s a very long way down my list of worries.

[@Alrukitaf]

Simpler systems equal cheaper car. But I’m not going to hold my breath to wait for Tesla prices to come down.

[@notinthemanual]

Yeah like any business some savings go to profit and some to consumer. Credible competition and government regulations are the only way to drive down the prices. To Teslas credit before the current issues they were reducing the prices. It’s what made the model 3 affordable for me.

[@chrisboxsell4981]

Last year they dropped prices massively due to many factors. Back up again now due to same factors.

[@notinthemanual]

@@chrisboxsell4981 At least we know Tesla will drop them back down faster than other manufacturers when things calm down.

[@JohnnyShoes802]

How about learning that learn’t is not a word than I will listen.

[@notinthemanual]

Congratulations on being the first person to write a negative comment on my channel. If your going to be negative I’d rather you don’t listen. Learnt is the word I actually used and it’s acceptable as I’m from Australia and we speak British English not American English. This is one of many words that are different between the two languages so I am sorry if it offended you. But it’s like centre and center. My main reason for starting this channel is because I enjoy helping people not putting them down.

[@DalisYn]

Stop being grammar police

[@JohnnyShoes802]

@@DalisYn stop policing the grammar police!

[@Rosewood185]

The 100 percent charge all the time is a misnomer 🧐

[@notinthemanual]

LFP at 100% isn’t as stressed so it won’t hurt if you want to do it but i agree it isn’t necessary to do everyday. I’ve been told that LFP degrades if not kept at 100% which lines up with Teslas mantra on keeping it plugged in when not in use but I could t find much evidence to support this.

[@Rosewood185]

@@notinthemanual kzbin.info/www/bejne/qabaY2OthdeVgpI

[@notinthemanual]

@@Rosewood185 Yes. I saw this video a few months ago and commented on it. This video leaves out a bit of information and the degradation calcs are based off information that may not be accurate. My LFP video doesn’t cover everything either and is now a year old. Apps like Tessie and TeslaFi only receive a limited amount of info from the car. The useable capacity and range @ 100% are set by Tesla. The range calc is set and is not based on driving style. When Tesla improved this range calc there was a reduction in the range prediction at 100% along with useable capacity in ScanMyTesla. This was not due to battery degradation so how are we expected to use this figure. If you overlay updates with range prediction you will see range drops line up with the update install. Degradation is something that is difficult for a regular owner to measure accurately. When my car was new it had a range prediction of 424km it is now at 410km. 3.3% range deg after 25000km on a figure that is not entirely accurate. I polled multiple owners of cars of a similar age to mine and they were all the same kWh for nominal full pack figure even with big differences in km. Even ScanMyTesla stopped using these figures for their degradation estimate as they saw this was not accurate. All we have to go by is the amount of energy available for us to use whether it’s deg or a figure Tesla sets. As long as this is enough to get us from one fast charger to the next on a long trip with some headroom then it’s fine. Unless you work for Tesla or CATL then we can only guess what is happening in the background. LFP chemistry has been around for decades but in its current form it is very new and we have no long term data. The other variable is build quality and this may trump all other concerns in the long run like we are seeing with moisture ingress on the older Model S batteries. John’s video is great but it does highlight how little we understand what is going to happen long term. For now unless some new data comes to light I have no problem charging to 100% whenever I can.

[@shanewilson2484]

I'm a geochemist. Nickel and cobalt are not rare-earth minerals.

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks for clearing that up Shane. Not my area of expertise only what I have heard. Are they as cheap and abundant as iron? That was the point I was trying to make. I know we have plenty of Nickel here in Australia I accidentally bundled that into the statement. I was thinking more about Cobalt. Maybe it’s not rare but the ethics of where it comes from and how it is mined is a hot topic but I guess same could be said for Lithium. I’m also still trying to master the skill of driving and rattling facts off the top of my head 😜

[@shanewilson2484]

@@notinthemanual Nickel more expensive than iron but substantially less expensive than cobalt. The rare-earth elements are the 15 lanthanides plus scandium and yttrium. A few of them are not particularly rare but they all have similar chemical properties, that is why they are assigned this grouping. The 15 all have f orbital valence electrons giving them similar properties. Here is the wikipedia page: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare-earth_element Some of the rare earths are essential for use in the permanent magnets that are used in many electric motors for EVs.

[@notinthemanual]

@@shanewilson2484 Thanks again for clearing that up. I’ll have a read of that link. Shows how a small slip up can mean something g totally different.

[@Ferrastar]

I think there is an issue with how they are typically reported on; you often see them list it as “Nickel, Cobalt, Rare Earths…” and people then start associating the Nickel and Cobalt as Rare Earth minerals

[@apn42]

LFP batteries are great when you have a home charger and live in a warm climate. Otherwise you are better of with NCA or NMC.

[@notinthemanual]

I’ve had mixed feedback but the majority of people that have LFP in cold climates have said that they are fine. Obviously pre-conditioning is more important with LFP but I can only go by the positive feedback once had on the channel as I live in a warm climate. There a pros and cons to both batteries and it really depends on your personal needs.

[@Sunsuperman]

Why is this guy got his foot on the breaks? Tesla doesn't need to use them, just creating wear and tear 🤣

[@notinthemanual]

Regen isn’t always strong enough especially with a cold LFP battery. You actually have to use the brake pedal from time to time. Non-LFP batteries have no regen at close to 100% charge too. Which Tesla do you own?

[@squidbeard492]

Cheaper car.... Yep that's why they just increased prices

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Squid Beard. I filmed this video before the latest increases. Early last year Tesla were doing the opposite and dropping the prices dramatically when other manufacturers were increasing. This made the SR+ affordable for me then. It’s crazy that they are increasing the prices now as it doesn’t help EV adoption and has probably taken the model 3 up over a lot of rebate or tax thresholds for some countries.

[@justinstewart3248]

Not trying to be a troll, but it’s “learned”, not learnt.

[@notinthemanual]

Sorry but I’ve already been trolled on that and learnt is fine if your Australian. We don’t speak American English here, we speak British English. Like centre/center, colour/color, analyse/analyze…..etc….etc.

[@justinstewart3248]

@@notinthemanual interesting! I just looked up what you have said, and I have learnt something today!

[@NaughtyGoatFarm]

Yep it's much better ethically for a child in a poor country to NOT have the opportunity to feed themselves by mining cobolt or nickel. This political correctness is just ridiculous sometimes. Excellent video by the way.

[@notinthemanual]

I’m not an expert but I think the situation is more complicated than a child picking up some rocks and selling them at the local market. The main point is this chemistry doesn’t use Cobalt at all so it is not contributing to that particular problem. I am not naive in thinking that buying an electric car is totally ethical and will save the world. This is just one small fact about this battery chemistry.

[@NaughtyGoatFarm]

@@notinthemanual yes I understand. I drive an electric car with a battery that has Cobalt. While it is terrible that people live in poverty, I think this whole Cobalt is bad narrative is potentially limiting people's ability to do what they can to survive. I know it's not ideal and I wish we could change it. The way to change it is to allow companies to mine Cobalt as long as they give back some profits to the people that live there. And meet certain environmental requirements. The solution can help those same people who are currently having to mine the minerals by hand.

[@notinthemanual]

@@NaughtyGoatFarm That sounds pretty reasonable to me! Unfortunately 3rd world countries rich with resources are often taken advantage of and the profit rarely filter down the people that need it the most.

[@NaughtyGoatFarm]

@@notinthemanual I guess there is the issue. Cobalt is not the problem, corporate greed and lack of compassion is the problem.

[@atifkhalid9655]

Talk short.....too much repetetion

[@notinthemanual]

Thanks for the feedback. I wasn’t planning on making scripted and rehearsed videos. Just being myself.

[@idonotcarenow]

Holy moly man, I fell asleep 13 minutes in, thank you, but no thank you. Too monotone, I can’t, sorry.

[@notinthemanual]

That’s fine if my videos aren’t for you but why be nasty? I don’t understand why people do this. I would never leave a comment putting someone down for trying.

[@idonotcarenow]

@@notinthemanual constructive feedback.

[@notinthemanual]

@@idonotcarenow I’d be ok if it was constructive. I’ve had constructive feedback on this video. Nothing nice about your comment.

[@idonotcarenow]

@@notinthemanual grow a pair. The world is not nice and rainbows, and I was brutally honest, not like your fake friends that told you that you were great. This will only make you better.

[@notinthemanual]

@@idonotcarenow The fact that I’m standing up to a bully contradicts what you said. It would have been much easier to ignore you. I’d rather call people out for what they are. Same goes to you. If you can’t handle someone calling you out for your behaviour don’t do it.

[@AORD72]

If you are driving at a constant 100 km/h how far can you go? (That was with a 60kWh battery aye?)

[@notinthemanual]

Hi Sabretooth. No. My car has the 55kWh battery. In perfect conditions (no wind or rain) my car averages 130-135Wh/km cruising at 100km/h. There is approx 50kWh available from 100%-0%. This means 370-380km if you run it down to zero which you don’t. For 60kWh battery add around 30-40km. This would only be the first leg of the journey. After that you don’t charge to 100%. Just charge enough to leapfrog to the next supercharger with a safety margin of 10%. You should aim to charge every 250-300km. You just ride the 80%-15% roller coaster until you get to your destination. If you have longer legs to do then you would have to charge to 100%. Apps like A Better Route Planner allow you to plan and simulate your trips beforehand. You can pick different car makes and models for the simulated trips.

[@tsourekis]

Love the relaxed format. Easy to follow along. To my understanding, you may wish to brush up on rare earth knowledge. Nickel an cobalt are not classified as rare earth elements. They only really cover the lanthanides. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lanthanides

[@notinthemanual]

Hi George. Thanks. Glad you like it. @Shane Wilson pointed that out earlier in the comments. I realise that they aren’t rare earths. It was a slip up of words that I missed during edit. The point I wanted to make was iron is abundant and cheaper and hopefully I got that across. It’s not easy to drive and rattle off information from the top of my head. I’m bound to mess up every now and then. I missed that one in the edit. To be honest I didn’t really think my videos would be this popular. I’m just trying to make content that I wish I had when I was doing my EV research. Thanks for keeping your feedback positive. I am someone who appreciates people contributing. I was a technical trainer for many years and you soon learn that the people your teaching always have something to teach you 😊

[@tsourekis]

@@notinthemanual NP. always happy to help where I can. Like you when I was deliberating buying the model 3 I was consuming as much data/info as I could. I will be keeping an eye on battery degradation over the years.