What if Fëanor Survived? Theory

[@MenoftheWest]

Merry Christmas to all! I appreciate you, my friends. Thanks for watching!

[@rickybobby9886]

Merry Christmas to you my brother. Love to all

[@THCAtomicjuice]

If I wanted to read all of LotR, everything cannon. What order should i read everything? I know there is the trilogy, the hobbit, i think something else that they used to make the amazon show. Help!

[@Makkaru112]

Happy Yule to you.

[@Makkaru112]

Blessed be our Solstice.❤

[@Makkaru112]

@@THCAtomicjuice Hobbit, Trilogy, Silmarillion, Children Of Hùrin, Of Beren And Lùthien. Book Of Lost Tales, Unfinished Tales, Morgoth’s Ring, Lay Of Leithien, Fall Of Gondolin, Fall Of Numenor, Laws And Cuztoms Of The Eldar, Road To Middle Earth (the last one by Tom Shippey. It will pave way to “how to approach Tolkiens works and so on. To prepare you. He was one of Tolkiens good friends and is the ultimate Tolkien Scholar and he too is a great writer and scholar himself in his own right. Amazon BS is not the actual story and it spits in everyone’s faces and pisses on Tolkiens grave “we will write the story that Tolkien never wrote” and worse. Research.

[@likac92009]

"Valar mourned not more for the death of the Trees than for the marring of Fëanor: of the works of Melkor one of the most evil. For Fëanor was made the mightiest in all parts of body and mind, in valour, in endurance, in beauty, in understanding, in skill, in strength and in subtlety alike, of all the Children of Ilúvatar, and a bright flame was in him. The works of wonder for the glory of Arda that he might otherwise have wrought only Manwë might in some measure conceive." I don't think that Feanor would enslave Men. I believe he would establish (after initial distrust) a good relationship with humans, the way his son Caranthir did. He who fought for freedom from Valar would certainly not rush to enslave others.

[@jamaigar]

I agree. I see Feanor in this timeline as a demanding ruler maybe even oppressive, but more like a paternalistic "I know what's best for you, you short lived children" feudal lord, more than as a slaver. He would ask much from the humans and he would have little tolerance for failure or dissent, but he'd be honest, upfront and just in a way, and he'd truly try to protect his humans vassals against morgoth

[@federicaesu8580]

Fëanor was proud and stubborn, maybe quick to anger, but he certainly was not stupid . He hated Morgoth fiercely because he was deceived by his lies and he was still infuriated to having been fooled . He was smart enough to understand that his followers could not attack Angband alone so he needed to reconcile with the host of Fingolfin. On the other hand, Fingolfin was aware that the Noldor could never get back to Valinor and so they have to find a way to live together in Beleriand. They both knew that if the Silmarils were rescued, there would be strife and clashes, but it was such a remote possibility that why worrying about that

[@orrointhewise87]

"And there, it consumed him." Very interesting theory 🤔 In cannon the best thing that ever happened to Feanor was ultimately his death. But if he lived the fire in him would have burned all around him and eventually the world. Tho! He would have been the chief enemy of the forces of darkness. His hatred of Morgoth runs deep. Either way death, drama, and tragedy would have followed him. Merry Christmas to all the peoples of middle earth ^_^ 🎄

[@shadowofchaos8932]

You have no idea what kind of power you have unleashed. Feanor could have crafted a powerful weapon and supplant Melkor. The sons could be lords in Middle Earth if Feanor won a civil war. I may go on forever with this gift. Merry Christmas, Yoystan! Stay safe everyone!

[@likac92009]

Feanor and his powerful sons, with the help of mighty Dwarves of the First age and Men (who are prone to following a strong leader, as we know) would be a formidable opponent of Morgoth's. Feanor's wisdom and powers would only increase with age (similar to Galadriel). I truly believe those three races combined could overthrown Morgoth - because the Prophecy says Noldor couldn't do it, but with help I'm sure it would be achievable.

[@shadowofchaos8932]

@@likac92009 agreed. I think Feanor could craft a dangerous weapon and be corrupted by his Oath and need for the Silmarils.

[@socialaccount0000]

Perhaps *Faenor* is the one to craft The One Ring in this timeline, this way, if he is killed by Morgoth, his spirit remains. An ever vigilant threat to the the forces of darkness, although with his own darkness, his eventual slaying of Morgoth would not free Middle Earth. In fact, they would simply be under new management

[@brianmiller1077]

I would say that Feanor's power comes from the Valar and since they are now separated from them, Faenor's powers would diminish, not grow.

[@likac92009]

@@brianmiller1077 Feanor's power comes from Eru Iluvatar Himself. Spirits (Fea) come from Eru and Valar have no say in that. Although, I would agree that a big part of his knowledge comes from Valar, especially Aule.

[@FrodoACM]

Quite a nice theory, although knowing Feanor's temper and considering how his oath would affect his actions, I am pretty sure Feanor would not wait a few centuries content with the stalemate against Mortgoth's forces. I think he would be doing everything possible to reclaim his Silmarils and to avenge his beloved father. I would say he would try to hasten the final war with Morgoth despite having fewer followers than other Elf forces, which also could lead to Noldor's doom. Merry Christmas!

[@thekiatty6953]

Agreed. At some point we would see Feanor vs Morgoth in single combat instead of Fingolfin with similar results, though I think Feanor would do even more damage than Fingolfin did. Then Feanor would become some sort of martyr-hero that would confuse loyalties withing the Noldor further, since some would see him as a rash, arrogant, treacherous yet powerful fool who met his end due to his arrogance and would be a cautionary tale, while others would see him as a guiding beacon of determination and valour against an insurmountable foe. This would result in some sort of cult of Feanor and thr curse would work its foul deeds through them

[@FrodoACM]

@@thekiatty6953 i like your theory a lot, I feel like exactly that would happen if Feanor lived longer. :)

[@kauetadaieski3131]

Feanor has more followers than Fingolfin and his sons, only when you add the sons of Finarfim is that they have more. And not by much.

[@FrodoACM]

@@kauetadaieski3131 You might be right about that, it's been some time since my last reread of Silmarillion, but for some reason I though Feanor took about a third of Noldors with him.

[@wedgeantillies66]

So basically it was best for the forces of good, that Feanor died a heroic death, that allowed his passing to be the balm that healed the wounds between his kin and the Nolder and allow for united front to be presented against Morgoth.

[@bx0xd]

I enjoy these videos so much, not only because of the deep understanding of the lore, but the fact that you always end on a theme. This was another well made video and I truely appreciate them. Also Merry Christmas, Arda! And a Happy Yuletide!

[@ericgiguere1618]

Thank you, that was super interesting. I have a soft spot though for the mightiest of the Eldar... Fëanor is a complex character but he's nowhere near the villain you make him to be, turning into a tyrant and enslaving the Edain, which is too simplistic imo. Yes he is arrogant and proud but so were the Valar in asking for the Silmarils, especially since one of their own murdered Finwë and walked off with the Silmarils. Fëanor feels misunderstood and let down when he seeks justice. The least the Valar could do is help Fëanor catch Morgoth and judge him again. Mistakes were made on all sides in handling the Silmarils which resulted in tragedies and blood spilled. Also, let's admit that the Silmarils belong to Fëanor - lots of blood would have been spared if the Elves had given them back to his sons (or to him in your theory). Fingolfin should be wise enough to understand Fëanor's point of view and work with him instead of splitting the Noldor further as by doing so, Morgoth would have the upper hand. Fëanor saw through Morgoth so I think he'd be perceptive enough to see through Sauron and wouldn't fall for that trick. In any case, I would like Fëanor to reclaim his Silmarils and redeem himself somehow - perhaps by reaching a compromise with the Valar... Happy Christmas!

[@TheJmlew11]

Feanor is absolutely one of the most fascinating characters in Tolkien’s legendarium. That said at the time of his death he had already crossed well into villainy. Sure there are complexities to him, but that doesn’t justify some of the horrendous actions he takes.

[@painlord2k]

The problem with Feanor is his Oath. Its damn him and anyone touching the Silmarili.

[@tominiowa2513]

There is redemption. "Thereafter shall Earth be broken and re-made, and the Silmarils shall be recovered out of Air and Earth and Sea; for Eärendil shall descend and surrender that flame which he hath had in keeping. Then Fëanor shall take the Three Jewels and he will break them and with their fire Yavanna will rekindle the Two Trees, and a great light shall come forth."

[@vickielittleton6373]

@@tominiowa2513 could you give the source for this quote? Probably never be able to dig it up myself.

[@tominiowa2513]

@@vickielittleton6373 - "The Later Quenta Silmarillion" from _Morgoth's Ring_ .

[@claytonbarnett7084]

"If you fight dragons long enough, you become a dragon. If you stare too long into the abyss, the abyss stares into you." ~ Nietzsche

[@Myrkyllinen]

that happen sadly Fëanor mightest of all childern of the ëru.

[@jeffreygao3956]

I think I prefer the “Good will always rise up against evil.”

[@TheJmlew11]

Cirdan and so many other elves are the perfect counter to this statement

[@Disgruntled_Grunt]

If you drunk-dial the Void to often, the Void will start calling back.

[@gargoyles9999]

@@Disgruntled_Gruntthen you show up to Voids house for a booty call and clap them cheeks

[@painlord2k]

If Fëanor had survived Morgoth would have played the "let's talk" card he used against Maedhros. As Fëanor was recovering from his wounds (being mortal wounds it would require a lot of time) Maedhros would be captured and hang from the Thangorodrim. After that, Fingolfin would arrive and Fingon would save him. Presenting the maimed Maedhros to Fëanor, Fingolfin would tell him he and his people were not there to recover the Silmarili, just to fight Morgoth and avenge their father and king as they would put family and kin before any trinket and jewel or star in the sky. They will assist Fëanor in fighting Morgoth but he will not be their High King anymore as he abandoned them when he burned The Ships and forced them to travel thru Helcaraxe where many of them perished.

[@keyboarddancers7751]

If Fëanor, Fingolfin and Thingol despite their differences, could somehow find a way to work with one other in opposition to Morgoth, it's doubtful the latter could defeat them. The only threat to such an alliance would be Fëanor's corrosive lust for the Silmarils which would lead him to misjudgements, fell deeds and artifices and, most importantly, his greater susceptibility to the deceitful wiles of Sauron.

[@joechang8696]

My thought is Feanor and Fingolfin probably could have gone toe to toe with a balrog. Had enough of the great Noldor been together for this. That said, none could stand against Morgoth, but then he would have had to come out and fight, which he did against Fingolfin.

[@SWOTHDRA]

​@@joechang8696Finwe, feanor, fingolfin, finarfin would totally destroy morgoth. Let alone if feanors sons would jump in

[@ponder421]

An interesting choice of video for Christmas, but it was great! One what if video I would love to see is: What if Ar-Pharazôn had successfully attacked Valinor, and Númenor was not destroyed? Without Ilúvatar or the Valar intervening, what would have happened? Anyway thanks for another great video Yoystan and Merry Christmas!

[@mustlovedragons8047]

I heard somewhere the Undeing Lands actually accelerat the ageing of mortals "like moths too close to a flame." The reward of Billbo, Froddo, Sam, and Gimli, was soul-healing (that could only happen there.) Not to live for-ever there. ( I personally guessed that Gandolf would have brought Gollum to Valinor for this healing as well, had he survived.) There for, if Illuvitar had not intervened, the whole host of Ar-Farazon would have _aged to death_ in a year. Maybe two given Numinorians long lifespan. And considering their hostility to the source of the soul-healing, I do not think they could recive it through the walls of hate around their hearts. Leaving their souls permanatly in their marred state. Being imprissoned in the Halls of the Forgotten untill the remaking of Arda is a mercy by comparison. They're still alive they can still change. Also "They wanted immortality, _and they got it as a punishment."_ has a lot more impact.

[@ponder421]

@@mustlovedragons8047 I've heard the same. But I'm also concerned with what would happen to the rest of Númenor and Middle-earth. If Ar-Pharazôn and the Great Armament did not return, would the Númenoreans send more troops to Valinor? Would they attack the Elves of Middle-earth out of revenge? What would Sauron do if he still had his fair form and the Ring? So many possibilities.

[@mustlovedragons8047]

@@ponder421 You've given me a lot more to think about than I anticipated! I shall ruminate on the possibilities. :)

[@kauetadaieski3131]

It would be a dumb what if. Ulmo or Osse alone would sink all their ships...

[@ponder421]

@@kauetadaieski3131 I said no Valar or Eru intervening. The Valar appealed to Eru because they needed his permission to deal with the Great Armament. Without consulting Eru, they could do nothing. If Ulmo could have sank their ships, he would have before they ever made landfall. The whole what if is only possible if the Valar do not ask Eru for permission to deal with Ar-Pharazôn.

[@ebeneezerscrooge8394]

What a great "What If Scenario"!!!!!! Well done.

[@TheSaneHatter]

This speculation, alas, shows up the one great weakness of Feanor as a character, and as a foe of Morgoth: he really wasn't a leader, and his hold was greatest over his own family. At best, he was a rebel, but he was always a disruptive influence, even in his finest hours. He couldn't unify the elves, only start events rolling before he burned himself out, and leave the burden of leadership to others who did not ask for it. Coincidentally, this actually fits with a news article I read only this past week, about the failings of self-styled "natural leaders." Many such people are not seen that way at all by the people around them, and even drive away would-be followers. Indeed, the best leaders often seem to be those who learned how to follow, the right way, before leading. Feanor, to come back to the point, was someone with no idea how to follow, and he alienated even members of his own family before he ever set out from Valinor. I do commend you, as well, for remembering the such pivotal events as the quest of Beren and Luthien and the War of Wrath were probably inevitable, for even Melian spoke, in the former case, of a doom greater than hers being at work.

[@WhoIsCalli]

Brilliant. The theory video I’ve waited so long for. Great Christmas present ☺️

[@shanenolan5625]

Interesting subject. Merry Christmas to you , your family and your subscribers.

[@MenoftheWest]

I have forgotten to shoutout Robert Bogue for his Valar tier patronage. Sorry, and thank you sir!

[@apdarkness3027]

A most fascinating look at the life of Fëanor that could have been, as great a king as he was his own ambition and resentment would have been one of Morgoth's greatest assets, in that regard it is perhaps best that he fell on the battlefield, great king or no, his own lesser darkness would have led the much greater one.

[@Sunnyflowerpuppy]

Despite the dark tone on Christmas, it's nice to see what if theories on Lord of the Rings as they provide interesting ideas and topics to talk about. They have us think and talk about how things would change if one thing happened differently then in canon.

[@visceralhit3721]

I often wonder what would happen if Beren took all of the Silmaril from Morgoths crown. Probably just an all out war destroying middle earth because of Morgoths wrath.... wonder if the Valar might have done something then or just been all "meh"

[@talesoftheeldar8688]

Please do more first age theorys!

[@charlesphilips2045]

This was a well thought out "what if" scenario, and I really liked it. Merry Christmas Yoystan.

[@therealelderking5830]

A great theory, as always. Personally, I think Feanor would indeed fall further into darkness, but his power and wisdom would only grow in Middle-Earth. I think Feanor could have defeated Morgoth (if only temporarily) and become the dominant power in Beleriand. In the end, though, I believe Feanor would go out in an even greater blaze of glory than he did in canon. My favorite idea would be for Feanor to sort of find both his redemption and revenge by taking out Morgoth once and for all, without the aid of the Valar, but destroying himself permanently in the process, so that he could never be re-embodied, even if Mandos were to allow it. Perhaps he would destroy the silmarilli themselves, to deny Morgoth, thus releasing the light within them, destroying Morgoth's spirit and his own spirit that was stored within the jewels. Perhaps this would also cause Beleriand to sink, thus creating a more familiar scenario for the Second Age.

[@jeffreym8503]

I have a hard time believing fingolfin would be so civil with feanor apon first seeing him especially considering that the bitterness he felt is what pushed him to make the journey across the ice

[@minatodroger7890]

Same a civil war was inevitable

[@MMBlizek]

This was really fun and well thought out. I think the other path hinted at would be Feanor would create the One Ring in his desire to reclaim the Simalrils (possibly with the influence of Sauron). Then Feanor defeats Morgoth but just ends up being a new dark lord himself.

[@GnosisZX]

Or a bright lord hehehehe

[@littlezombie9621]

these “what if… survived” are my new favorite series ob my lord! CAN YOU DO FINROD FELAGUND? that would be eeepic

[@ashaide]

First, Merry Christmas to you, too, sir. Second, this actually sounds plausible. No greater agent the Curse and Morgoth had than Fëanor himself, hate one and scoffed at the other as he did. The Noldor Civil War would be interesting. Once I've learned the rules of The One Ring 2nd ed enough, I just might run that as a What If campaign.

[@00martoneniris86]

Thank you for making this what if video and Mary christmas What if Finwe survived What if Beren took all the silmarils from morgoth What if morgoth returnd during the Lord of the Rings What if Sauron never Turned Evil What if celebrimbor married Galadriel What if morgoth Never Turned Evil What if Azog took the One Ring

[@pavelslama5543]

1) Finwe would probably calm down Feanor. Also, Feanor would be much less agitated in the first place if his father survived. So, Finwe would probably use diplomacy to get the complete elven army from all the houses and would also likely wait for some Valar to join the quest (or at least Tulkas). 2) Morgoth would probably go all out immediately. And considering the immediate infighting between the elves and men, he might have hastened the end of the first age, or alternatively just conquer Beleriand altogether before anyone could dispatch messengers to Valinor. 3) If Morgoth returns through the gates of night, its Dagor Dagorath time, no matter when it happens. 4) If Sauron stayed Mairon, he´d most likely be the smith creating weapons for Finarfin´s army at the end of 1st age (if everything else stayed the same). His actions during the original 1st age were ultimately inconsequential. The only difference is that king Finrod would likely survive. However I find it likely that if he made it through the final battle for Beleriand and War of wrath alive, he´d just return back into Valinor. You may say that with Sauron/Mairon´s ingenuity, Morgoth´s downfall and loss in the War of wrath would be quicker, but we don´t know many details about that war anyway... 5) The Elven kingdom in Eriador would be much more powerful, and would probably survive Sauron´s attack. This would likely strengthen the kingdom of Khazad Dum as well. However it would severely weaken the realm of Lothlorien, which would likely fall completely to Sauron´s rule during the first war of the rings. This would also likely cause destruction of the Woodland realm ruled by Orodreth or Thranduil. All in all, unless Celembrimbor came up with some superb inventions of his own, its likely that the forces of elves would be worse off compared to the original timeline. 6) Its hard to predict what would Melkor do if he didnt fall to evil. At this point, I find it likely that Eru intended for him to cause discord, otherwise the world would be rather boring. But if he really stayed good, I find it likely that he would be simply tasked with the creation of some challenge to the children of Illuvatar. 7) Azog was an orc chieftain, but ultimately he didn´t possess the will the hold the ring, and would ultimately be brought before Sauron. It would probably take a few more days or weeks compared to a regular orc, but he´d fall under Sauron´s influence rather quickly. Especially if you remember that as a creation of Morgoth, he´s not supposed to have a free will at all.

[@beezelbuzzel]

Merry Christmas to you! 2022, I hope you've had a wonderful year. You've made my Sunday afternoons wonderful for years now. Thank you sir, I'm happy to have found you!

[@michaelsavage7884]

I'm excited for the next video. This was an interesting one.

[@marionbaggins]

Man Damn Mellon, Fëanor just Wreck'd Arda...Whom let that Fiery Elf Loose?!!! JK, but I came up with a cousin or sibling theory to this: What If Fëanor didn't cause any Kinslaying?!!! That one will have a different result!!! Merry Christmas again Mellon, Here's to a great 2023... Until 10 Powerful Characters 1st Age Edition...Marion Baggins Out!!!

[@dmdebruijn]

I can see now why people think Yoystan is so much more careful with Lore than the “Nerd” of the Ring.

[@kaidorade1317]

Merry Christmas Yoystan to you and yours!

[@Amondil1]

I definitely see the Noldor splitting into two camps if Feanor lives. I don't see Feanor or Fingolfin falling for Sauron given they have the light of the two trees and thus would be able to see through him. I don't see Feanor being able to break the girdle of Melian. And I don't see Feanor enslaving Men. I see him making them his subjects and Lording over them directly but not enslavement.

[@TarMody]

As long as the Curse of Mandos exists, the death or non-death of Fëanor will not positively alter the fate of the Noldor. If Fëanor had not died, things would still have happened as they should have, but in different ways. Because in the Music of the Ainur the final fate of Arda is drawn. This is not just a case of Fëanor. It applies to everything that exists in lore.

[@Comicnut64]

Merry Christmas Yoystan

[@mateuszslawinski1990]

Feanor was arrogant and proud (more than average Noldor of that era) but I don't see him as petty slaver. Callous, yes. Stupid, no. Humans at this era were mostly auxiliaries (aside some notable figures) anyway so there wouldn't be any difference here (aside no friendship between Edain and Feanorians). Quest for Silmarils might not happen or happen differently (i.e. Thingol might just give up the jevel in exchange for help against Carharoth or simply to avoid immediate invasion). In the end, it might be (ironically) less dark than in original timeline (because everyone would be aware of powerful hot-headed elf).

[@baxtermortimer1550]

"What if Feanor survived?" *Nuclear bomb goes off in angband*

[@charleslathrop9743]

I really don't buy Feanor getting more evil and enslaving humans, and I don't believe Sauron could have deceived him either since even Morgoth's supposed repentance didn't fool Feanor in Valinor.

[@Makkaru112]

Yeah. He gave a Poetic and strong response back to Melkor and told the ninny Morgoth to take a hike. And he did. That’s when Morgoth targeted his father instead I believe.

[@c.antoniojohnson7114]

​@@Makkaru112Don't forget he slammed the door in Morgoth's face.

[@pavelslama5543]

Yeah, if Sauron went to Feanor with the idea of creating the rings, I can imagine Feanor´s answer to be like: "Oh if anyone´s making such rings, its gonna be me. Why should I need you, the best-for-nothing loser? Say hello to Huan from me and be on your way to bother someone else, before I finish what Eonwe couldnt, and send your soul west by myself!" He was just way too skilled and too powerful to ever accept help from someone like Sauron. What´s more likely is that he´d provoke a conflict with Sauron just out of spite and hate for Sauron - someone who helped the enemy to prolong the conflict so much. And considering the sheer difference between him and his grandson, I think that he would immediately start a great re-arming program, introducing new alloys, new armor types and weapons of war, and before long, the whole Eriador would possess an army powerful enough to hopelessly outmatch the one of Sauron.

[@Jackiesbeenhere]

Man, I Love the way you narrate the stories!

[@Matt-ij7pe]

This is super random, but I have for many years been hard at work at crafting my own Epic in the same vein of high fantasy as Tolkien did-- and I will readily admit I could never and would not think to be compared to the Professor's acheivement. That being said, the enslavement of Men by Feanor, and the eventual collapse of Elven glory in Middle-Earth that his survival would cause very much mirrors my own worldbuilding, Where the "Ancient Races" are destroyed by the machinations of a "Great Deceiver" style enemy, and Men are set adrift into centuries of ignorance-- a sort of 'Dark Age', if you will-- with little to no record of the greatness that preceded them, or the true nature and identity of their gods. The depth of thought and detail you've put into this video is super appreciated, and i think It will help me in making my own work more refined, as well as in allowing me to set myself apart from the greatness that inspires it so heavily. Thank you for all your hard work, and i wish you the very best new year!

[@unicornwitchprincess1004]

I NEED a Feanor movie! How has nobody created this as a film yet?? Amazing!

[@MultiAshfaqkhan]

I don't think anywhere in the story we can assume Feanor was so arrogant and ruthless that he would imprison people. He had his flaws but i dont think he wouldve turned out to be that

[@koreanelvis]

In contrast, I believe this was a perfect video for the Christmas season!! It inspires hope; foreseeing the best IF Feanor survived. Thank you for this video. Happy New Year Mellon.

[@hazbojangles2681]

Great video Yoystan! I really like this style of video! 😊

[@whiteknightcat]

What a wonderful Christmas story this was.

[@Makkaru112]

Time for a what if video where he goes good as he has the potential to as he was never ever evil in the first place and those who place him in the one dimensional villain category really need to look into him and others more deeply. I don’t buy he’d do that to mankind at all either.

[@johnbaker9912]

Merry Christmas! Great video; I do think you have it pretty accurately.

[@dwalker420]

Great video and Merry Christmas! ✨

[@Drifter2025]

This is so rich with lore, I need a spoon to drink it.

[@paulohalderic2322]

I saw the video popping up. My immediate thought reaction was: - Jesus Christ... It is Christmas, but, seriously: - Eru, give strenght to Middle Earth!

[@jeffreygao3956]

I think he’d keep harassing Galadriel and keep asking “How about a strand of hair?”

[@haldemarest]

Feanor was brash but when he was calm he could think so well. I don't see him enslaving men as he could use them against Morgoth in Exchange for lands. Also the girdle of melian still existed so a kinslaying would not be automatic as the Feanorians found it impossible to reach Doraith. The only reason the 2nd kinslaying happened was because Melian had left with her girdle after Thingols death. Lastley Feanor had fallen for Morgoths lies once I doubt he or his sons would let it happen again.

[@erikbender1967]

Great video. Merry Christmas!

[@tinaswafford1985]

Merry Christmas! Good theory!

[@LockeCPM4]

I love your Tolkien what if videos.

[@spencerschneider3730]

I’m glad there are people out there that love Arda as much as I do

[@randomnessrules4971]

Maybe you could do the theory what if Deagol never found the ring while fishing with Smeagol/Gollum??

[@specialk8888]

I wonder if the Valar would intervene in the War Of Wrath if Cirdian sailed to the West. The only reason they did intervene was because Eärendil represented man and elf which was one of the key reasons for the Valar finally sailing to Middle-Earth

[@c.antoniojohnson7114]

We NEED a Fëanor/Noldor movie.

[@antonioiglesias427]

If Feanor lived… everything would be right in Middle-Earth. Feanor was always on another level. Fingolfin was just an Elf-Bro.

[@aaroneckhoff1748]

How is Fingolfin a bro? He always used his strength for others and his fight against Melkor was more righteous indignation and anger than anything pompous, booooo.

[@thedreadtyger]

merry Christmas, Yoystan and all!

[@socialaccount0000]

What if Santa/Christmas was in Middle Earth? Would Gandalf, or perhaps one of the Blue Wizards take the role of "The Gifting Wizard"? Would Gandalf have the balls to deliver a lump of coal to Sauron?

[@Makkaru112]

Bombadil. ;)

[@upschutt4842]

Maybe you already answered this one, but what happened to the spirit of Durin's bane after Gandalf finally slew him?

[@glennross85]

Here I was hoping for a redemption arc for my boy 😓

[@varyar77]

Nice if bleak video - Merry Christmas!

[@anniebiggs1217]

Wow very interesting theory great video as always

[@GuyUnderTheBridge]

I doubt Feanor would fall as far as Melkor. I do see him being a dark stain in the history of Middle-Earth though. He was surrounded by nominally good-aligned persons so the depth of his fall would be limited. His sins though would be hard to overcome.

[@janrudnicki6111]

Fearnor was smart I think in this time line he might try to get along with Fingolfin and teach men the art of war then treat them as allies and get along with the Dwarves then attack Morgot with them.

[@gilanbarona9814]

I'd like to think, though unlikely, that Feanor had repented and turned into a force for good.

[@jesuscoyt-munoz2753]

Merry Christmas Yoystan and don’t worry I don’t mind the gloom tone of this video at all. Although perhaps for next year you could make a Christmas video on how the holiday of Christmas would exist for each race of middle earth. I hope you like this idea and again Merry Christmas namarie.

[@_Hamler]

Sounds like a very good timeline!

[@sageofcaledor8188]

Thanks for the video! I will say Faenor's greatest weakness is his pride, paranoia, and obsession. I think you are right, his obsession with Morgoth will consume him. Nevertheless, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

[@hansi48]

Interesting, but, I think you ignore two primordial facts. First, Turgon's wife died in the helcaraxe, after of that, Turgon promises to himself never forgive the act of Fëanor to burn the ships. Then, after of they arrive to Beleriand, probably would began problems between the families (Feanorians/Fingolfians). Second, the doom of Mandos or doom of the Noldor was sweared before to any of that's events (the arrived of the Noldor to Beleriand). So, I think anyone of the noldor would fall anyway. Sorry for my english and thanks, because always is nice to talk about the eldar.

[@Kalafinwë]

Very interesting, but we must consider the self-destructive nature of Fëanor. If he ever survived the inital skirmishes with the Balrogs, he would have gone to make another harsh decision which would either lead to his or his sons death. Edit : I do not believe Fëanor would have been keen to smithing weapons against Morgoth or to create some sort of League as his eldest son did. He would have probably sunk Beleriand in both elven and orcish blood, in a more drastic manner than of his sons.

[@tfjohnson55]

“… and after extra misery for eons, Sauron would conquer all. 😢 Merry Christmas 😂!”

[@toddkurzbard]

Your tales are always welcome, whether dark or not.

[@Semmelweckle]

Good video

[@dominushydra]

Oof.. Fingolfin would have killed Feanor instead

[@Jboobsi]

Thank you for making great videos. I personally don't like "What if?" videos though. Learning from the past is one thing. But the "What if?" question implies that you can change the past. I don't believe that is, or ever will be, so. If it were possible to change the past, there would seemingly be no purpose to the present. I believe there is a purpose to the present. Regarding Tolkiens world, I believe the same thing. I think he wrote his stories with a purpose in mind. And reimagining them in "What if?" videos changes his purpose. I prefer the story to be told as it was meant to be told.

[@janrudnicki6111]

Merry Christmas.

[@candicecarter581]

I think feanor passed away at right time. Good work on the video.

[@paulwagner688]

And Happy Anniversary of the beginning of the Quest of Mount Doom and the departure of the Fellowship from Imladris.

[@joannakleinheksel-horn3494]

That was a beautiful story! 🙂

[@lynneglendenning947]

I actually took Feanor's Oath.

[@xXArtemis5Xx]

Would Beren really be asked to obtain a Silmaril in a timeline where Fäenor was alive? Especially when it's given to somebody else with its owner and creator living, it's definitely stealing. It just sounds unwise and unrealistic to me.

[@Makkaru112]

Lùthien could beat him up like she did Sauron himself. Not to mention could put him in a deeper slumber than even Morgoth. But yeah that would make things more complicated if Fëanor was still around.

[@KizTheo1]

Interesting theory! I also thought that if he had survived he would be sort of a tyrant. Cruel to the edain and would create a scism to the elves of beleriand! Where can i find the picture withe great swords at 7:10?

[@UnderhillKoufax]

Feanor was bad news for anyone who followed him.

[@LocalHeretic-ck1kd]

Merry Christmas to you all.

[@AgentBlakk]

Feanor did nothing wrong.

[@Endme264]

Next up faenor vs magnus the red, the blunder wars

[@davidoneal4132]

better question is would there even be a lord of the rings if he just gave the valar the silmarils when they asked after the trees were destroyed would that have avoided everything

[@BK5250]

No way would he become worse than morgoth himself

[@tundegordian7273]

one thing I don't seem to understand is why you underestimate human, I mean, if some elves enslave men then men can enslave some elves as well

[@Byenie0912]

i bet he will find a way to extract an elf or a maiar's spirit from the body and use it as energy or enchanted weapons

[@torshavnnewell]

The Noldor are the Florida Men of Arda. Even the fair and wise Galadriel. I assume Feanor would basically accomplish what Sauron wished, but an era earlier and in his own design. It is my personal interpretation that the Noldor left Valinor because they did not wish to live in a post-scarcity society. I believe the Noldor had the most internal force within them. This is different from Fea and Hroa. What I mean to say is that they have the heaviest pairs of balls and the most powerful of ambitions. Even the ones you would not expect like Finrod and Galadriel - not just Feanor. A bit of a tangent, but I think it's that internal force that allows them and drives them to commit Florida Man shenanigans. That same desire is found within Sauron. Remember, the Noldor were also the favored of Aule, just like Sauron was. The Noldor were the most skilled in word and hand, just like Sauron. Even moreso Feanor because we see a lot more parallels in specific instances. Feanor will most likely usher in an Industrial Capitalist society all over Middle-earth, except for the Shire. I doubt Tom Bombadil would allow it. I honestly think Feanor is stronger than Fingolfin, but I don't think Feanor would high diff or even defeat his brother. Either way I think Feanor could put up as much of a fight as his brother against Morgoth. Either way, I think Tom Bombadil scales much higher than any of the Valar. He could probably no diff Orome or Tulkas. No idea about Manwe yet, but he's getting bodied. Feanor's influence definitely won't spread to the shire.

[@kauetadaieski3131]

The Shire was taken by Saruman and some bandits lol

[@torshavnnewell]

@@kauetadaieski3131 You got me there. I still think Bombadil is busted AF, but he doesn't have future vision like Feanor. He's not busted in that way. He's not really the kind to have some sort of master plan. It's probably something Eru Iluvatar allowed tho. Not even the Valar could understand his big picture design. He has the widest master plan out of all the characters. The main reason why I still doubt industrial society would spread to the Shire is because the Shire is supposed to represent the good in Middle-earth. The one incorruptible place outside Valinor. Honestly I don't see what's bad with industrial capitalism, but Tolkien sure does. He put a lot of cosmetics and symbolism in the cottagecore-hobbithole-toke of the pipe weed Shire living.

[@chucknorris202]

@@torshavnnewell Well Tom Bombadil was more about protecting the Old Forrest, his personal domain, right? And he had absolute power over it, from what we see. But Glorfindel, in the council of Elrond, says something like, Sauron can destroy the very Earth itself with his power, and if he came personally, with all his power, not even Tom could fight him and win and keep the Ring from him. Tom is prob a Maiar, or some kind of Spirit of the Earth; and he definitely has Eru's blessing. And he's also the oldest living being in Middle Earth. Tom Bombadil is described as a moss gatherer by Gandalf. Meaning someone that just stays in one place and never leaves. That's also prob why he didn't directly help the hobbits when Saruman sent his bandits to take the shire. Of course, it's also possible that he like Gandalf wanted Frodo and the other great hobbits returning from the quest to fix the problem themselves, since the quest was basically "training" for those four hobbits to become great lords(over other hobbits, that is). Tom's motives are very simple for someone with so much power and knowledge, though. Protect the old forest and the surrounding territory; take care of his wife and land; and entertain the occasional traveler in his land, or near his land; its said that Tom was close with Farmer Maggot, who either came to the Old Forest himself or Tom would make small trips to the shire(it wasnt far away esp not for Tom). And I agree about the Noldor. Def have the biggest balls, the most courage, and also the most ambition, of all the kinds of Elves.

[@torshavnnewell]

@@chucknorris202 Mm, thanks! I learn something everyday. Glad to see you agree on things. I find Sauron's ability to corrupt being that powerful very interesting. Mostly because it fits in well with Tolkien's views on industrial society. Negative externalities can definitely ruin the environment, and Tolkien probably thought that as well.

[@licmir3663]

By the time Feanor had reached Middle-earth, he had become completely evil. Since evil can only corrupt or make mockery of what exists and cannot create something new, I assume Feanor would actually witness his power and abilities diminish, as happened with Morgoth.

[@LEGOMANIAC419]

So basically, Feanor dying early on was probably for the best. ...Yeah, that checks out.

[@minatodroger7890]

Yup no doubt

[@lfr234]

I like to think that Feanor would have come to smith rings of power himself in this timeline ..

[@gargoyles9999]

Could Faenor destroy the one ring? I mean he reached a level of crafting where even the Valar Smith couldn’t figure out how to destroy the silmarils