What if the Whites Won the Russian Civil War? | Alt History

[@Plys3n]

Honestly, I can't come up with the reason of Germany committing such a suicidal act. If they had the backing of the Uk and Italy, I might believe it, but it's just unbelievable by themselves.

[@mappingowo3966]

In my opinion, if Russia is that strong, the British may stay neutral even join the side of Germany. And Finland, Poland, and the Baltic states(Especially Lithuania in the three of Baltics) won't willingly be part of Russia or Russian puppets.

[@janfranek9782]

true

[@plusxz821]

I agree bud

[@Amen-Magi]

The communists industrialized Russia so that Russia empire could not build a single tank. The Nazis defeated them

[@beanclan12345]

What I also (imo) find weird is that UK and France went to war. Originally UK and France would give Sudetenland to Germany to *prevent* the war. And Germany would never agree with being split up in Hannover etc like they did in the Morgenthau plan.

[@coopereddie9612]

You can restore the whites in no step back hoi4 and eventually the tsar

[@talentlessnonless9013]

A bottle of government issue wine!

[@finexlegend5270]

How much is that mod?

[@finexlegend5270]

@Petr oh ok, thanks. I have only Man the guns

[@finexlegend5270]

Ok

[@coopereddie9612]

@@finexlegend5270 it’s dlc it’s 40 bucks

[@voxbour6018]

There would be no way for Poland to ally with Whites, because both Reds and Whites directly opposed Polish Independence.

[@mappingowo3966]

Yes But they may help White and force White to give them independence and some land, White will be weaker than Soviet, Poland may even not need to make war against White and get lands in 1922's size.

[@niepowaznyczlowiek]

@@mappingowo3966 Piłsudski refused to ally with the whites in 1919 and in 1920

[@kerim.s8801]

agreed. This video makes no sense either. France could have not attacked germany like in our own timeline. There was no offensive plan to invade germany to that extend.

[@gengarzilla1685]

In this timeline then, another change should be that he never comes to power.

[@5Penkets]

Well Poland is considering “white allied” since they mainly fought the Reds and the Blacks. Also I don’t understand how did Russia annexed All of Eastern Europe, it looks like if whites won their army somehow got better or something

[@phantom894]

Meanwhile in another universe: What if the Reds won the Russian Civil War?

[@kirillassasin]

It would be kinda interesting seeing comments like “Reds were much better, I wish they won it”

[@justacat2]

​@@kirillassasinlol

[@Yo-ps2pf]

@@kirillassasin in the end the Reds actually were better

[@icedoutgecko9607]

@@Yo-ps2pf no

[@Yo-ps2pf]

@@icedoutgecko9607 Economically and militarily yes, look up statistics and history

[@jamessparkes4215]

This is the first alternate history of Russia that I've seen that isn't hypocritically pro-western and actually makes logical sense. Good job

[@ChipKorp]

Чел, это сделал западный чел который даже не углублялся в гражданскую войну и сделал так что после победы белых вернулась монархия и появился какой-то царь Кирилл, ты тупой?

[@kirilll7806]

​@@ChipKorpзакрой свой рот ❤❤❤

[@ChipKorp]

@@kirilll7806 С чего бы?

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

If Russia had plot armour, there would've been no October Revolution in the first place.

[@kirilll7806]

@@Azarian771 shut up commie

[@ME262MKI]

Ah world without communism.... What a dream

[@kinggodzilla309]

Some nations would still turn Communist but not as many

[@gengarzilla1685]

I don't know about that. Without Mussolini around to be inspired by and to be a baseline with which his own movement is formulated, would Hitler have established the German Reich? I'm thinking this is the definitive early end for communism; its radical ideological crusaders within Russia are killed, the movement is totally demonised and delegitimised, and by the modern day it's known as a failed idea that ultimately never got a stable foothold anywhere.

[@adamkerman475]

@@kinggodzilla309 I doubt it, most communist nations only had communist governments because of soviet “support”.

[@kinggodzilla309]

@@adamkerman475 I said some nations would turn communist like small Countries not big ones.

[@adamkerman475]

@@kinggodzilla309 There was only really 2 “large” Communist countries and those were the Soviets and the Chinese and you could argue that the Chinese only won because of soviet support and most “small” countries only had communist revolutions at all because of soviet existence and provocation.

[@Cesme8008]

I like this video but the one things that I have an issue with is that Russian industrialization was not included. Russia was a largely rural nation after the civil war.And would have need to massively industrialize in order to compete with the western powers .

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

I skim over it, mainly for time reasons, if I'd made the video longer I'd have included more on the industrialisation.

[@ivanserov1846]

1929: begins Jazz music stops. And with it,the industrialization.

[@plusxz821]

The soviets literally killed their most productive peasants

[@ivanserov1846]

@@plusxz821 No one killed the Serednyaks,they were mostly integrated into collective farms without much issues.

[@thepat6369]

@@ivanserov1846 Is a Serednyak a middle class farmer?

[@alifaiman3578]

I'm actually jealous for those who live in this exact timeline. It's not as messy as ours 😢

[@socialistunionofafrica9263]

My brother is a scientist and i'm an engineer so i think i can create you know a machine to take us to another timeline will take about 3 years but just wait

[@kinggodzilla309]

@@socialistunionofafrica9263 Is that true

[@dianafuenzalida3035]

@@socialistunionofafrica9263 hahahhahahahhahahaha

[@mongolianares]

@@socialistunionofafrica9263 yessssssssssssss take me there

[@Onetruenugget]

Same I feel very mad and envious but maybe you can try reality shifting to a reality with this timeline but it's not confirmed that if shifting is real or not

[@Dark.Phoenix]

Germany would've probably united by 1990 under Prussian rule, like in our timeline wiht West and East Germany. Königsberg would probably stay under Russian rule because it was a Baltic state originally tho.

[@mappingowo3966]

Though I think this video is unrealistic if the world truly comes to that situation, France and Britain may put west Germany and Austria together to build an economically strong Germany against Prussia which is in Russian control...

[@Aureus_]

I think the russians in this timeline would treat königsberg nicely and the rest of Germany instead of the cruel ways they did in ours

[@mappingowo3966]

@@Aureus_ Maybe, Nazi didn't do much in this timeline

[@Aureus_]

@@mappingowo3966 yea the war was relatively short and the russians weren't Bolsheviks

[@samlosco8441]

Yeah I thought the dismantling of Germany was particularly unrealistic. I imagine that, without the duration and sheer brutality of WW2 in our timeline, Germany would have been treated more leniently at the negotiating table. I think they would still lose East Prussia to the Russians, but aside from that would remain a united nation - retaining Pommern and Upper/Lower Silesia. The difference this time being no Polish Corridor, a more fair treatment that would not create the bad taste of Versailles, and more watchfulness from both the Western Allies and Russia over Germany to ensure German irredentism doesn't rise again. Also an exodus of ethnic Germans from East Prussia, the Sudetenland and Danzig to the new German mainland, this time a much more peaceful affair due to the aforementioned lack of genocidal brutality that the Nazis brought to the war in our timeline, which brought inevitable violent reprisals against ethnic Germans at the war's end

[@aguywithahelmet]

The end result looks slightly like 1984…

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Yeah it does to be fair

[@yourlocaliino]

First time seeing this channel. Really like how you utilize maps to create a short, logical explanation as to how an alternate history may come about, rather than creating a thirty-hour verbal dissertation on why Myanmar sucks and could have been annexed in 1230 B.C by the Scottish Empire without any really solid reasoning.

[@RedPawner]

But Myanmar should be a Scottish colony

[@joaopedro4609]

My English is not very good, so I used Google Translate. That video was interesting, but the setting is also extremely upbeat and fanciful. It is strange that no country reacted to Russian expansion (Crimean War) and that the White Government/Monarchy prevented the famine, with the Russian Empire being marked by mass famines and political persecution (not unlike the Soviet Union).

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

No worries about using translate, glad you found the video interesting, and I can understand what you mean about it being upbeat, think of this as "best case scenario" preventing the famine would be easier without Stalin, though I admit there may be more resistance to Russian expansion. Thanks for your comment.

[@comrade_commissar3794]

@@patrioticbritishmapper8352The Russian empire was having a massive famine roughly at the rate of every six years. In this timeline there would be a lot more starvation and a lot less industrialisation. This Russia would not be able to win a war agains the Germans.

[@ivanserov1846]

Well,the video is certainly good,the plot is here,map,music-everything fits But history...well,as a man from post-soviet space,I will try to make some things here 1-Death of Lenin would surely be tragic,but it wont be like Kaiserreich scenario,mostly because it was the centralized AgitProp which ran the propaganda and news for the soldiers so the Red Army while perhaps would collapse,would do it much much later than 1920 2-A number of new allies. Definetly not Finland,hello Karelian uprising of 1921 Ukraine-Pavlo Skoropadsky regime was not by any means pro Russian and stood for Ukrainian independence,just like regimes in Belarus and especially the Baltics 3-Poland Closed within the borders of the XVI century, cut off from the Black and Baltic Seas, deprived of the land and mineral wealth of the South and Southeast, Russia could easily pass into the state of a second-rate power, unable to seriously threaten the newfound independence of Poland. Poland, as the largest and strongest of the new states, could easily secure a sphere of influence that would extend from Finland to the Caucasus Mountains- - Y. Pilsudsky Point 2 and 3 combined to the new annexations made by Russia 4-Constitutional monarchy A good half of Russian white generals supported the idea of the Republic and fought for the constitutional assembly. 5-Tsar Nicholas and grand Knyaz Mikhail Both would be dead,Nicholas shot with the first signs of Whites victory and Mikhail Alexandrovich would be abducted from the hotel and killed. 6-Resurgent Germany in 1925. In 1925. Resurgent. 7-Panslavism was mostly approved only by Russia and Yugoslavia,Czechs,Poles,Bulgarians and for some reason here-Greeks had none of that. Even if due to religion or hate for Turkey(Which would also lose more of its north east because of Russian intervention and of course-supporting Armenians,and Ataturk having harder time fighting without his only supplier-Soviet Russia) Greece was stuck between England who for all times did not wanted Russians close to Medditeranian and Russia. Also yes,Finland declared its independence with the abolition of Russian monarchy,so why is it in Russian alliance. 8-They would not neglect Russian agricultural base 1500 tractors for entire Russia by 1913,most of them are used as cargo transport that is what I call a neglect of industry. No mechanization,no fertilizers,a third of land is still in the hands of aristocracy,and neither the tsarist government,nor the provisional seemed to care,and it was one of the first reasons why peasants rebelled. 9-Preventing soviet era famines They would still face the famine of Transvolgan region neverthenless. And now would have the repetition of famines of 1840.1842.1873, 1880, 1883,1891,1905 and 1911 and what leaded to them-epidemics(thanks to no mass vaccinations which the Soviets irl enacted),no literacy programs for spreading methodics(Thanks comrade Lenin for LikBez-liquidation of illiteracy), hoarding of grain by the Kulaks(Forced confiscation of grain started in 1916 for the exact same reason) And the fundamental land problem which collectivization solved. Peasants are not farmers,peasants send to the market only part of their products while the rest feed their families. When father dies,his land is splitten between the sons. And what happens next-correct,more men,same amount of men-the amount of products to the market drops. You can counter argument me by presenting Stolypin reform-but no,the reform was one of the fuels for the peasant riots as it tried to break apart their many-centuries old communal farming and made them vulnerable to kulaks who most peasants hated. 10-Kulaks as political opposition I see that Whatifalthist content made it here. Which is very sad because its simply wrong. Lets start with definition of who were the Kulaks,no not the most hard working-such honor belonged to Serednyaks or Middle peasants. Kulaks got a lot of their wealth through banal usury,and lending their land and quipment at high interest rates or corvee works. Why Soviet government started collectivization only in 1927-the answer is simple. Bread preparation programmes for the cities and exports failed because....right,Kulaks never agreed on state-imposed prices and simply held grain until the price would rise. Plus,the collectivization allowed for massive mechanization of agriculture. Most of peasant lands were of small square,2-3 hectares. Kulaks-more but not astronomically high. Peasants did not had the money to properly buy any agricultural equipment,price is simply too high. And cant use it properly-most of the land plots are too small. Collectivization simply did what was done in the west just at a much higher speed-concentration of assets. 11-Slightly slower No,it will be a lot slower,to get the necessary rates of industrialization,Russian Empire will have to do what it did in 1900s-Export grain but starve "We wont eat enough,but will export!" -Alexander Vyshnegradsky,minister of finances. The Russian Empire ranked 5th in the world according to the index of industrial production. This is what supporters of the monarchy are mostly proud of. Production really developed. But this is due to the backwardness of the country, where the vast majority are peasants. The late development of industry gives a high growth rate in any country. One of the main factors-effect of low base. Where even slight increase of production would result in high percentage increase. And while economy progresses those percent numbers are more and more complex to achieve. Example: To double yearly production of cars from 100,we would need to add in 100,then 200,then 400,then 800 and the numbers would grow leading to lower and lower growth by percents. But there are subtleties in the development itself, which are not always mentioned by the apologists of tsarism. Yes, the resources necessary for the development of industry were extracted. Mining was one of the successes of the Russian government, but the trouble is that the resources were mainly used not for development, but for sale. Most often they were mined by foreign companies. The Swedish company "Nobel" not only extracted oil on the territory of RE, but also used its own equipment, with the help of which production increased many times, but clearly not in the interests of Russia. This was beneficial primarily to foreign capital. Investments in oil production are an illustration of the influence of foreign capital on the Russian Empire. From 1910 to 1914 . Britain invests 134.6 million rubles, and domestic investments for the same period - 9.58 million rubles (Vavilin I. Foreign capital in Russia. L.: Priboy, 1925. p. 67). It was foreign capital that monopolized the extraction of individual resources. British and French capitalists were engaged in the production of platinum, their share in the Russian Empire was 90%. Foreign capital actively participated in almost any production and extraction of resources. And RE became a sales market, a source of resources and cheap labor. Domestic industry developed poorly. Basically, equipment and machinery were bought in the West. In many spheres from engineering to chemistry estimate Russia's dependence in terms of production capacity from 70 to 100% (Rozhkov N. Russian History in comparative historical Coverage (fundamentals of social dynamics) Leningrad - Moscow, 1926-1928, vol. 12, pp. 166-167). Therefore, when they remember "prosperity", do not forget that the lion's share of everything that was mined simply went to the west, because foreign corporations owned the production. There was still development in isolation from them, and impressive, but this is clearly not the 5th place among all countries of the world. 12-Much wealthier population Where do I even begin...with 40% literacy? With 27% child mortality before 1 year? With medium life expectancy of 35 years? From child labour which took 17% of all labour force? 10.000 people-1.3 doctors Pay for 1914-most prosperous year was only from 10-25 rubles for 60 hours work week. England by comparison-41 for 52 hours.Germany:31 for 56,US:72 for 53. No centralized healthcare,and only a nascent central education system which was for most people outside of Moscow and petrograd simply too expensive. "If we recall how much of the national income comes annually to the treasury, how much is absorbed by the clergy and other social groups that are not involved in the production of material values, we cannot but come to the conclusion that the share of the main creators of the national income accounts for an even smaller share of it." -Rubakin. Russia in numbers.1912 13-Social programs Labourers of Lensk mines would like to hear that story. 13.5 Both you and Whatifalthist forgot about one little detail in 1929 which caused entire world economy to collapse and Russian would collapse too. Not only because of global integration,but because the Reds succesfully cancelled all debts of Russian Empire,and I mean all of them-national debt,civilian debts and the Enormous War Debt. 14-No purges I mean those generals already lost to Reds which didnt had many experts,while Whites got the cream of Russian officers. But I give you a credit for starting the war earlier and with aid of allies,because otherwise if things went down OTL,Russia would end up behind the Urals. 15-Intimidate Moldova Hello ww3,Romania is guaranteed by France and England 16-Chinese Republic Hello warlordism,but neverthenless-far better than Mao.

[@Fortunato7]

Ay man, although it is not worth it to spend THIS much of your time commenting an entire essay on a random video, i would like to thank you because i read the whole thing and learned a fk ton of stuff

[@whyamihere5732]

Damn you brought the data

[@hiredmurderer6228]

Now this is a good dose of REAL history

[@cortorrealjean6242]

You just make my day Happy Merry Christmas

[@ivanserov1846]

@@HansleyLucky a really,really flawed one. Kulaks as political and not economic enemies Social programs during the great depression Anti-Russian regimes letting to annex themselves. I don't need to be a cook to say if something is wrong with the meal I am currently eating.

[@cocindaucocindau354]

It is funny how in this scenario the Russian Empire takes half of the World and dosent even stop after, but yes it is fiction. Something like this, even if the Reds had lost, would never happen, and the Whites would have a colossal debt to the Western Allies even in the Civil war, not even mentioning new power hungry Nations to fight against, which truly desired land in the East, as for example, Romania, Poland, Czechoslovakia. Then Japan and the lands they occupied in the Civil war, plus the Japanese Imperialism, and the will to expand. Then Fascism in Germany, which was based not only against Communism, but against all Slavic Nations seen as Eastern Hordes. And many factors ,which would have reduced White Russia into ashes even before the 1950s. Not to even mention the Effects after the Civil war, the great Depression and the Crushing debt to the Americans, French and English for Aid and support in the Civil war.

[@mappingowo3966]

I agree with you, even White won the civil war, their power will decrease a lot and lose control of his neighborhood. Poland won't be supposed to be a Russian puppet, the Polish-Soviet war proves that. And White maybe even weaker than red at the same time with the different parallel spacetimes. Ukraine, Belarus, and the Baltic states would be independent, too.

[@cocindaucocindau354]

@@mappingowo3966 I truly believe that if the Whites would have won, even the Todays Russian Federation would not even exist, And the only Russian State that would exist if Nazi Germany would had lost the War in that Scenario, would be a Mini Russia in Europe, only with the lands mostly populated by the Russian People..

[@mappingowo3966]

@@cocindaucocindau354 I don't get what Mini Russia means

[@cocindaucocindau354]

@@mappingowo3966 Maybe the European Part of Russia until Volgograd.

[@mappingowo3966]

@@cocindaucocindau354 You mean Russia will lose its power and shrink to the European part of Russia, which does not include Ciscaucasus

[@KenKenston]

Проблема в том, что непонятно какие именно "белые" победили бы. Потому что белыми называли вообще всех, кто против большевиков: бунтующих матросов в Кронштадте с которых началась эта революция, Колчака, Деникина, социал революционеров, которые интернационал пели, анархистов, бунтующих крестьян и тд.

[@avansi5621]

Не совсем. Бунтующие крестьяне - эти зелёные, а анархисты - чёрные.

[@CAProductions051]

I would prefer this world over the present world.

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

I think we all would.

[@CAProductions051]

Indeed

[@theanomaly2587]

As would I

[@zyanego3170]

@@patrioticbritishmapper8352 Me not that much.

[@gamerslifelp8430]

yeah especially as germany

[@GanjaMasterBlaster]

Long Live The Tsar! Also thank you for this video, it was good :] But except for the part that Greece is under control

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Your welcome.

[@GanjaMasterBlaster]

@@patrioticbritishmapper8352 👍

[@karimonarrezkm]

GOD SAVE THE TSAR LONG LIVE TATIANA LONG LIVE NICHOLAS II LONG LIVE OLGA LONG LIVE MARIA LONG LIVE ANASTASIA LONG LIVE ALEXANDRA LONG LIVE ALEXEI LONG LIVE THE ROMANOVS LONG LIVE THE MONARCHY!

[@jancerveny7502]

Right after watching this video, I immediately gave like and subscribe. As Czech and patriot, I have always considered the question of whether Czechoslovakia should defend itself against Germany in 1938, when United Kingdom and France refused to help. I know that the vast majority of German tanks in 1938 were obsolete PzKpfw I. Furthermore, most of the German air force consisted of obsolete biplanes. And most importantly, they only had supplies of fuel and ammunition for one month. Half of the German army and up to two-thirds of the German generals regarded the attack on Czechoslovakia as stupidity. Czechoslovakia had a numerically weaker army, but our men were perfectly armed and trained, and especially determined to defend their homeland to the last breath, just like the Finns in 1939. Although it is said that in the event of war, Poland and Hungary would attack us - that is just a myth. Hungarian regent Miklos Horthy was afraid of Romanians and Polish leader Ignacy Moscicki was afraid of the Soviets. The Romanian army was much larger and stronger than the Hungarian. It even had dozens of our tanks LT 35, which at the time were among the best in the world. Although the Soviet Union had a non-aggression pact with Poland at the time, Stalin threatened to repeal the pact in the event of the Polish attack on Czechoslovakia. This would be an ideal opportunity for Stalin to reconquer Poland, which belonged to Russia 23 years ago. Therefore, I am convinced that we would successfully defend ourselves and the German army would be exhausted by their attack. If Hitler did not make a truce with Czechoslovakia in this case, he would be in danger of being forcibly removed. Then, sooner or later, there would be a civil war in Germany.

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Indeed, I think we screwed you over by not standing to fight, I think had we done so, it'd have been over in a year. I agree on Poland and Hungary not getting involved, the polish wouldn't want to lose the favour of the British and French in case of a future German or soviet invasion and I don't think Horthy would've been dumb enough to invade. Also thanks for liking and subscribing, great to have you joining us.

[@justnatsuki9027]

Even though I'm Polish, i have to say that Czechs fell mainly because of Poland. In 1938 Poland and Czechoslovakia weren't allies, but their common ally was France. France asked Poland if it can send some troops on german border but Polish government refused. Instead of helping our ally and southern neighbour we chose to become "friend" of austrian painter by sending Czechs ultimatum to give back Zaolzie. Even Czechs historians like Jan Němeček and Eduard Stehlik say that Czechoslovakia did surrender because it was afraid of polish intervention and war with both Poland and Germany. Taking Zaolzie was the biggest mistake in whole interwar period.

[@jancerveny7502]

@@justnatsuki9027 It is true that if interwar Poland relinquished its claim to Zaolzie and helped Czechoslovakia, it would not be conquered by Germany and the Soviet Union a year later. But I think the Munich Agreement, on the other hand, is our fault. Interwar Czechoslovakia was very nationalistic, even though it was a democracy. Germans, Poles, Hungarians, and even Slovaks lived in appalling conditions, especially during the Great Depression, when they were most affected by unemployment. I further condemn the war in 1919. After we defeated communist Hungary, we should immediately find common ground with Poland. President Masaryk wanted Zaolzie to remain in Czechoslovakia at all costs, because of the coal-fired power plant and the railway connecting the Czechia and Slovakia. That's why the war for Zaolzie began. I think that if we handed over Zaolzie to Poland in exchange for an alliance, and helped you fight the Russian Bolsheviks, there would be an immortal alliance and friendship between us Czechs / Slovaks and you Poles. Unfortunately, President Masaryk and Edvard Benes were selfish idiots who cared more about politics than the happiness of nations.

[@RainyGryphon]

*UK and France not England and France

[@bongomeister9965]

If the Czechs chose to resist the Nazi regime would collapse, see the Oster conspiracy

[@Matrix_985]

The based Russia we all wanted.

[@The_Devil_Chariot]

Yeah

[@Ipolitelyaskyoutodie]

Based lambda symbol enjoyer

[@The_Devil_Chariot]

@@Ipolitelyaskyoutodieit was actually the psi symbol on my profile

[@MihailzRO]

All based except being a little unrealistic and the useless demand of Bessarabia

[@DwarfVG]

кроме русских рабочих

[@ME262MKI]

1:24 what a beautiful view

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Indeed it is

[@EmoPineapple]

My only issue with this is that there were barely any monarchists in the White army, most were trying to uphold the republican regime and the legacy of the February Revolution. There were quite a lot of socialists as well.

[@void7mapping711]

this video was only 9 minutes yet somehow it seemed to last so long... this is the first time something enjoyable has gone by slowly for me. -Very good video -Underrated creator -10/10 would recommend

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thanks, you had me worried for the first few seconds lol

[@morsecode980]

Interesting, plus I see you kinda implemented my Balkanized Germany idea so cudos for that 😂 I had a few other ideas I came up with recently: • What if Duke Konstantin Pavlovich of Russia traveled to Greece during their War of Independence and used it to restore the Byzantine Empire in the 1820’s with himself as “Emperor Constantine XII?” • What if France had another revolution in May 1968? • What if the “Golpe Borghese,” a planned neo-fascist coup in Italy, actually happened in 1970? • What if Mikhail Gorbachev’s reforms succeeded in saving the Soviet Union but transitioned it out of communism into democratic socialism?

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Nice ideas, I'll get them made

[@googs8869]

@@patrioticbritishmapper8352 this is unrealistic and stupid my god reupload this

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

@@googs8869 it is not stupid or unrealistic, it is simply an interpretation, in Alternate history we all have our opinions as we are simply speculating, if you have a different opinion on how things would've have played out than I do, that's fine, and I'd be happy to hear your opinions.

[@springyguy]

@@googs8869 This is called Alternate History for a reason

[@theappel]

@@patrioticbritishmapper8352 I’m confused, did Russia invade the eastern and central Asian countries? Because them peacefully uniting wouldn’t happen.

[@Raul_Menendez]

Basically we're in the bad timeline....

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Unfortunately yes

[@gengarzilla1685]

I'd say we're in the neutral timeline. Bad timeline would be something like TNO.

[@filipesugden1982]

) ews destroyed Russia

[@pro-hz7kx]

Total nazi Germany victory would be worse, but yeah we live in a pretty grim outcome

[@someone-wh2rb]

one problem in this scenario is russia splitting konigsberg with poland makes no sense. in our timeline the reasoning behind taking east german lands was the deportation of germans west as revenge for the holocaust against slavs. however in this timeline with the nazis apparently dying in 3 years, and not being able to even take poland they wouldnt have been able to genocide as many people as they did in our timeline meaning there would be no revenge from russia

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Russia had wanted Konigsberg prior to that, in the seven years war they wanted to take it, quite likely they'd try do it again

[@sidpascua2237]

I love this alternate history Even after 2 years this video is still great

[@Печеньсколбасой]

На самом деле Россию бы ждала раздробленность и анархия в стиле Китая 30 и воевали бы с Германией как Китай с Японией ,то есть прое***в буквально 2/5 страны. Да и даже в лучшем случае никто монархию не стал бы возвращать, т.к. многие белые были республиканцами. Так что в случае возвращения царя в белой маршрутке начался бы сущий кошмар .

[@beanmanbutchina]

No Step Back DLC is too TNO in my opinion but it’s still amazing and this reminds me of it when you can restore the Empire and do what Taboritsky wanted to do

[@ГеоргийТолмачёв-ф5в]

As a Russian, I support this scenario more than the communist path👍

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Glad to have the Russian seal of approval 👍

[@canaluludorel5838]

You're a chad rus

[@gnas1897]

It's an impossible scenario. Your country would have been turned into a dismembered collection of Western controlled banana republics upon white victory.

[@Yo-ps2pf]

How old are you? literally a disgrace to all Slavs lol

[@Jacelikesillicats]

This is a really nice video keep up the good work 👏

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thanks, I will!

[@todeswalzer1184]

A bit random but BASED

[@mutem7]

i love these scenarios, keep it up!

[@noidea8710]

Hey,can you please make more videos? Ever since I found your channel,I'm addicted to it. I wish for more videos from you.

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thanks, and don't worry more videos are coming soon

[@DarthJarJar6]

This is the only realistic one I have seen on yt

[@aurelius7455]

This was A really good video thank you

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

You're welcome, glad you enjoyed it

[@Kakapuuks]

The baltic states would of not rejoined the russian empire. Estonia already got it’s independence before the russian civil war ended. This video is not accurate at all.

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

The Russians would retake them, just as Stalin did.

[@Science12197]

The world would be much more peaceful

[@MCLegend13]

I doubt in timeline the empires would fall because no 6 year long world war 2 would make them likely to hold onto their colonies not till the same time as our timeline but likely seeing them still to this day and if Russia was seen as a big enough threat France and Britain might unify into the Franco British Union making the collapse of their empires impossible. Very good video I hope one day you will do one on the Franco British Union

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

The Empires probably don't fall completely, they probably keeps parts of their empires and decolonise the rest at a much slower pace, also the Franco British Union is definitely a timeline I plan on making

[@averagerobloxiansocialist4070]

I thought World War 2 lasted 6 years not 7.

[@MCLegend13]

@@averagerobloxiansocialist4070 yeah true it was a mistype ma bad I know it was 39 - 45

[@MCLegend13]

@@patrioticbritishmapper8352 can’t wait to see your next video

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thanks

[@joestephen3756]

Idk about Pan-Slavism - the idea never had a huge amount of support outside of the Balkans (beyond small intellectual circles in the Bohemian lands), and unlike shown here would never have been accepted by non-Slav Greece or Finland. Apart from this, Poland had never subscribed to Pan-Slavism, having been partitioned thrice by Russia and very roughly Russified in the 19th Century, with Russia brutally suppressing the 1831 and 1863 uprisings. Also, do you think they would have attempted to reassert control over Finland militarily?

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Greece is there mostly for religious reasons and them both hating Turkey, its not due to pan slavism, sorry should've made that clearer, Poland is essentially like post ww2 Poland in that its a Russian puppet just not communist, as for Finland, I don't know if they'd actually fight a war there, as the Soviets found out the Fins aren't ones to mess around with, however, the white movement did win in Finland so maybe they remain allies due to that along with the "army in being" doctrine acting as a threat to them.

[@fkjl4717]

Actually Mannerheim was a loyal general of Russian imperial army. Why would they go to war? In opposite Finland would be a very first ally of White Russia.

[@jakubkarczynski269]

@@fkjl4717 Probably becouse he wanted to be independent. Fins colud capture Piotrograd. But decided that it wolud help whites. Who didn't acepted free finland.

[@yurivii]

@@patrioticbritishmapper8352 One thing is certain in all timelines. Poles hate Russians and it goes way beyond the communism thing or even partitions. This rivalry got started in medieval times and its just keeps going. Poles hate Russians more than Germans and Germans wanted to exterminate them.

[@patrickweber3954]

You can play as the White Russians in European War 6 1914's 1917 Conquest campaign.

[@gnas1897]

Oh wow I wasn't expecting that game to be mentioned here

[@Garnou_Hargon35]

Russian empire: helps Poland Soviet Union: invade Poland

[@schnitzel4584]

Sometimes I feel like there are so many good endings of the history after ww1 but we have the worst ending

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Maybe not quite the worst, that's a world ruled by fascists or communists, still there were many chances for a much better world

[@mappingowo3966]

​@@patrioticbritishmapper8352 Though the Soviet Union is bad, but Russian Empire isn't better... And you're right, we still have chances for a much better world.

[@schnitzel4584]

@@mappingowo3966 You mean the monarchist, yes tgey were also not good but whites where republicans and monarchists

[@mappingowo3966]

​@@schnitzel4584 Oh, yep. You're right, but this video lets Russian Empire still exist, which means Monarchists still controlled this country, isn't it? And Russian Empire is economically poor, even Russian government have a great ruling skill, it's impossible for a weak and needs to recover's country to put that much country into its puppet. (Especially Poland, Polan was strong when it got independence) And other European countries isn't always nice, they helped Russian Empire once, the Russian need to pay back or even more. If Russian Empire still controls the Baltic, Belarus, and Ukraine, they must often face rebellions, a country in a confusion is difficult to get stronger...

[@Mehmet_Ergin]

@@mappingowo3966 I think if the whites had won, Russia would have borrowed and tried to get better, but people still inspired by lennin would have rebelled. (I am afraid here, I am afraid that he will be worse than the tsar's len and commit even greater rebel massacres) Russia would be worse because of these debts and would be a puppet of England and America. In World War II, it would probably invade. Even if the generals were good, because for those who did not enter industrialization, the weapon problem would be more than the Soviets.

[@BrazilianDreemurr2008]

The True Ending, a Perfect Russia and a Perfect World without Communism

[@leMiG31]

Ww2:*starts * Kiril 1:*refuse to elaborate and die *

[@The_Blessed_Regent]

As Russian: Best timeline ever!

[@brf493]

Скорее как шкила три годика + навальнист-даунист

[@MeathMapper]

Keep up this work! Its intresting.

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thanks, I will

[@jamesbryanswan_aohi678]

I miss Russian Empire so much,love Russka from USA 🇺🇸💖🇷🇺😍😘

[@jamesbryanswan_aohi678]

@Eternal Seventeen nah,I like Russian empire more than Soviet Union.

[@gospodinkrasnov1516]

Okey, let’s go! P.s: I watched the whole thing and it was fucking epic, keep your work up my man!

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

I will, thanks!

[@_steamfunk_2271]

If only this was the true world we lived in :(

[@hiredmurderer6228]

Ha,say that to Estajanov. Go back to kindergarden,stupid anticommunist.

[@BruhBruh-nn6vc]

Ну ты и дебич конечно

[@OverLord115]

@@hiredmurderer6228 There's nothing wrong with being anticommunist :D

[@iberia169]

I dont like communism, but such a polarized escenario wont be good either

[@Onetruenugget]

Same I wish that the Russian Empire still existed and India never partitioned, I'm sure the US and Russia would have some rivalry after world war 2 but they would probably have worked to together in advancements in technology like space travel, cure to cancer, significant industrialization etc as well as solving world hunger, protecting environment etc and with India never be partitioned it could have been a huge world player and would have been a major supporter and assistant of the US and Russia along with it being very developed and having an extremely low poverty rate but yet again we should be thankful that we were born in this timeline because we could have been born in bad timelines like a world destroyed by nuclear war and very primitive or in a world that is very undeveloped and many countries are under tyranny

[@thanasisrks4944]

What a wonderful and much better world would that be! A united Eastern and western Europe just like this time line would be better! 🇬🇷☦️🇷🇺

[@idontknowlololol]

No

[@Holymackarel_babadoogaming123]

​@@idontknowlolololIn this question is, idk

[@maximjachmar8629]

​​l​@@idontknowlololol Russian Empire: 97% Christian)))☦️ in 2021 Atheist 1%, Buddhism 1% and others (Islam 0%)

[@thegangstachimp]

​@@idontknowlolololname one good thing communism did for the world

[@idontknowlololol]

@@thegangstachimp Free healthcare No illeteracy No unemployment Free housing The right to work 8 hour workday Equal gender rights Equal rights for all nationalities Defeat nazism Free education Free universities Free public transport Free water Free electricity

[@hanshenghuang402]

The Tsarist Empire represents the real Russia, just like the two-stroke stands true for motorcycle racing.

[@rhy40official]

2:40 better then the present one honestly

[@MistaHassan]

This would make a great alt history mod for hoi4 “What if the whites won the civil war?”

[@punk1987]

Есть такой уже

[@punk1987]

Перевод на английский кстати там есть

[@joshstainton8207]

Honestly I'm surprised that Russia and Greece didn't partition Turkey as both countries would want land from it

[@gengarzilla1685]

These two would inevitably both claim Istanbul, Greece because Constantinople and Russia because it's the gateway to the Mediterranean. No way could this be done to the satisfaction of both sides.

[@joshstainton8207]

@@gengarzilla1685 assuming they're allies after the partition, Russia wouldn't have to lay claim to Instanbul. 1. Because it's back in Orthodox hands and 2. Because a Greek client state would allow for them to access the Mediterranean

[@zakaryloreto6526]

Wow Tsaritsyn Russia’s theme is very pleasant

[@grumpyguy2877]

Good video and what you present is plausible.👍

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thanks

[@HEKVT]

This is interesting, however - would the 1945 Nuclear bombs still happen? I assume the Japanese did the same as in real life, Pearl Harbour, and further expansion, so they're at war with the US. However, Germany was overwhelmed relatively quickly - would their top scientists still have the time to work and develop nuclear bombs, and would they be able to escape to the US, seeing as the US wasn't involved in the European Theatre (I assume so, since Britain did not have support of the US in keeping Germany united.) So would the Manhattan Project be started, and completed in time to drop the bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

[@Lukdnuke_Narson]

Pretty good. I feel as though there would be more of a friendly, occasionally tense rivalry with the US and Russia though.

[@boikart8694]

Hey man, i've been wanting a vid on this scenario of quite a while, thanks for making it!.

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

No problem, glad you enjoyed

[@_ils0mm0p0ntefice_8]

I always liked alternative histories, nice video 👌🇮🇹👌

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thanks

[@wisigun]

Как бы я хотел чтоб так было

[@theenforcer3667]

this is so heartwarming that the russians helped poland against the nazis

[@АнгелПетров-я5ь]

In 2021 period, you made a mistake If the ruller is a woman, it isn't tsar it's tsarica, someting like king and queen

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Indeed I did

[@PaoloCavestro-ey9bb]

What if Russia had adopted the cult of Makima, Revy, Cutie Honey, Marin Kitagawa, Trixie Tang, Judy Neutron, Marge Simpson, Wendy Corduroy, Lois Griffin, Sailor Moon and Maddie Fenton instead of Abrahamic shit?

[@kevinthetree6407]

Wow, a Cold War between the Authoritarian Totalitarianism monarch east and the democratic capitalist west is the most creative shit I have ever seen, round of applause to this man right here🎉

[@kirilll7806]

who said it would be authoritarian?

[@thiagomoreira5287]

The Tsar monarchist was not totalitarian

[@gengarzilla1685]

Russia at least would have tough constitutional bindings on its monarchy here. Already it sounds miles better than the authoritarian Putinist mess from our timeline.

[@Onetruenugget]

Basically a cold war between monarchy and democracy, intresting and would also mean that the US and Russia could still be engaged in a cold war but I think it would be a better timeline overall

[@CHURCHISAWESUM]

"Authoritarian Totalitarian" lmao Americans pay like 35% taxes, Russians paid 10%

[@ronanferguson4451]

In this scenario would the german milatary would carry out the oster conspiracy remove h1tler and make whilhelm ii grandson kaiser which the allies would likely accept

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

I'd say the Oster conspiracy being carried out is quite likely.

[@bubblesandblåhaj2763]

life could be a dream...

[@kingkong_4221]

Nice video

[@niallglundub2225]

Interesting video. However Poland could no agree for Russian influences in there Country becauce Russia made Russification of Poland and generally was her Partitioner (sent away Polish patriots to Sibir, fight with Polish culture and nationality etc.)

[@niallglundub2225]

And Polish post 2 W.W border is terrible. Poland have half of Prussia, but no have Upper Silesia?

[@UmarKhamdamov]

I was looking for this my entire life

[@spikethompson2000]

I would say my only issue with the video is Yemen remaining disunited, it was only split during the Cold War due to the southern half being controlled by communists, which wouldn’t have happened in this world

[@jebise6656]

i find it more realistic that germany goes communist in the scenario than it going fascist on of the biggest talking points of the nazis was judeo-bolshevism

[@Dejroslaw2448]

This is actually very realistic because yes there is no communism but yet still some countries lose also very much

[@supremeleaderdracovish3415]

8:38 this map has some similarities to the What if the Whites won map that I created in Discord

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Indeed, you made a good map, I just made a couple of changes due to stuff that happens in the timeline.

[@olegpelykh5875]

Truly pleasant to watch!! With brilliant terms. This may be also to provide the world better view of Russian Empire being more brighter, bigger, stronger and wealthier than soviets. Really appreciate both YOU and this video!!!🙏🙏🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thank you so much!

[@historysam8611]

What happened to Alexander Kolchak since he never took power?

[@whateverthisis389]

I generally don't believe that there would be a new Tsar though. Before the Communists, there was already a revolution to force the Tsar to abdicate and form a Republic. It wouldn't really make sense if Russia just completely forgot about that and reinstated the Tsardom.

[@gottvot8955]

I think czechoslovak legion would play pretty big part in this

[@SUPABROS]

I'm actually thinking the world in 2022 might be less developed, since there wasn't a Soviet threat everyone was worrying about, i mean there was still the Russians but it likely wasnt at the same level of the cold war.

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

In certain parts of the world I think you might be right.

[@megarussel231]

На самом деле я не думаю, что всё пошло бы таким образом. Под конец существования РИ, она была полуфеодальной державой, да и курс монархии был довольно устаревшим, так что Россия при монархе или при парламенте должна была бы семимильными шагами (такими же темпами, как и в СССР) пройти 2 индустриальных революции, чтобы одержать победу над Рейхом

[@therokenyk8062]

вот только вопрос о существовании Рейха при победе Белых до сих пор открыт.

[@luksovec2578]

I like how Czechoslovak legions helped White russia against bolsheviks, and now White russia helps Czechoslovakia against germans. A true friendship! But as we know its only alternative history.

[@jayp9672]

nice video dude, really liked it. could you possibly link the world map (the world war 1 type map) that you use in your videos? that would help a lot. if you could also, explain what you use to colour and edit these maps. thanks in regards

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Hi, glad you liked the video. To colour and edit the maps I use paint 3d. The ww1 map is an edited version of the modern world map, (I had to redraw all the borders) I can put it in my discord and you should be able to download it from there, maybe once I learn how to upload images to the internet they'll be an easier way to get it.

[@keravavantaa2886]

this is actually a good thing for my country finland because we wouldn’t have got some economic depression shit in the early 90’s and the thingy with soviet union so yea

[@Mehmet_Ergin]

look at me man be grateful for your independence living under another nation is the best thing that can happen to your race

[@keravavantaa2886]

@@Mehmet_Ergin in europe we don’t have races, people insult each other by country and after country it’s province after province it’s city/town/village after city/town/village it’s a part of the city/town or village after the part people insult eachoter by house after the house people insult eachother by what floor they live in lol yea

[@Mehmet_Ergin]

@@keravavantaa2886 yes means what you wrote but is your answer clearly yes or no

[@keravavantaa2886]

@@Mehmet_Ergin you didn’t even ask anything on ur first reply

[@CrunkusGlunkus]

the video is good and all but there's no way that poland and finland would willingly support the russians. you can try to make an argument for finland but the poles didn't support the white or red army. and if you include the russian expulsion of jews + the large jewish population of poland at the time it wouldn't make sense at all.

[@ovca410]

It's more like - what if czechoslovak legions helped the whites and saved them, as they helped them

[@Kaban125]

Страна была бы разделена Антантой за долги, а может быть просто была бы завоеванна соседями...

[@crispgeneral3462]

Respectable ending have a nice day

[@nikolaireinard5466]

Communist didn't exist, well i guess hitler will face to face with tsar

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

The ultimate battle lol.

[@olegpelykh5875]

This is the great masterpiece I enjoyed to both reading and watching world getting pleased with Russian Empire. Thank you SO MUCH Great brilliant British mapper!! You really made my day go light! And I hope more grand masterpiece stories certainly from YOU will proceed🤩🤩🤩🤩😍😍😍🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻

[@Alessandro_Batistuda]

I guess Russia would retake Finland and Poland as part of it's territory after Civil War. And of course it would become constitutional monarchy at least after WW2

[@elfbeaned]

Russian empire was already constitutional monarchy in 1905 to 1917. Also if White army had won, it would have made Russia be in crisis, protests, because Russians never like the foreign army stay in their state. Not to tell, White armies only had one similiarity, anti communist, other than that, they just loot people's weath, had different ideas, even turning Russia to absolute monarchy not to tell they coorperated with separatists, made Russia lost a lot of lands

[@Alessandro_Batistuda]

@@elfbeaned but the monarch still was the leader of the country. It wasn't like in UK or in Japan rn. And what about foreign army? I don't understand

[@elfbeaned]

@@Alessandro_Batistuda do you pretend you don't know anything? This is exactly how wiki writes: Brest-Litovsk Treaty was considered as a treachery of the Russians by the Entete, and they decided to intervene the civil war after the Great war ends. Not to tell they relied on separatists governments, make Russia lost a lot of lands. The intervention wasn't to prevent communist at all, it was mainly for their own benefit.

[@elfbeaned]

@@Alessandro_Batistuda forget to tell you a thing, Nicolas II won't be able to flee to any country, since the "bloody Sunday".

[@Alessandro_Batistuda]

@@elfbeaned no doubt about it. But i told about The Emperor's power. The Emperor before Civil War still had pretty big power even if officially Russia was constitutional monarchy. And even if Whites had won in Civil War Emperor eventually would have become just a symbol of power like in tge UK or Japan. And the main figure would be Prime Minister

[@RonaldTrumpOfficial]

no way bro I remember this

[@tanyasingh5485]

Wtf USSR was as south as Indian borders

[@technoimperialist9509]

?

[@تركييونس-ذ1ض]

So it's basically like our own world but less bad

[@tacomuncher]

Great video, I just dont agree with what would happen in WWII. I just don't believe Germany would do something so stupid, it's unfathomable to me. Even if it did happen, I 100% believe that France and the UK would side with Germany by that point and germany would probably get the Sudetenland and their lands in Prussia back.

[@Amen-Magi]

The communists industrialized Russia so that Russia empire could not build a single tank. The Nazis defeated them

[@thunderbird1921]

This is personally how I see World War II and its aftermath happening in a democratic Russian Empire timeline: The Baltic States (Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania) would be independent nations out of gratitude for assisting the White Army in the civil war against the Bolsheviks (which did happen in real life, at least to an extent), and become protectorates along with Finland. Poland would be a neutral country by the terms ending World War I. While they would share similar anger over Germany's resurgence (possibly still under Hitler), the western European powers would be distrustful of Russia due to its own rivaling (and rapidly growing) strength and high nationalism. Thus, Russia would not intervene during the invasion of Poland or Czechoslovakia (which would prove to be a serious mistake on their part, and make many Poles hate them for years after for having abandoned their fellow Slavs, though the hatred is less strong than in our timeline). World War II until 1941 would likely have followed an otherwise similar path, with France falling to the Germans (much to the growing horror of the Russians) and Britain fighting the huge air war. Then, having driven Britain off the continent and needing resources, the Germans confidently turn their sights eastward. In order to provoke Russia, the Wehrmacht invades the Baltic States (intending to Germanize them into the Reich). After giving the Nazis an ultimatum to pull out their forces, Russia declares war on behalf of their protectorates. The war is utterly brutal (due to German ethnic hatred of Slavs), but skilled generals in the Russian army avoid most of the wasted casualties of the real world Soviet effort and contain the German threat. After Hitler's idiotic 1941 declaration of war on the US, the Allied powers move quickly, with Hitler falling even faster in this timeline (since the western powers would be less scared to support Russia substantially and let them advance westward, the 1943 Italian Campaign dooms the Germans and the war ends in early 1944, with the Russian Empire's better army and air force roaring into the Reich to completely smash it). Japan is taken down in similar fashion to our real world Pacific War. Despite the western European powers having hesitations and distrust, no Cold War really develops since America welcomes a democratic Russia as an alternative force to the colonial powers. Germany is thus punished 3x harder in this timeline, being stripped of a true military and forced to accept a pacifist constitution, having much of its industry slapped limitations on, and the four occupying powers force the German people to go through complete de-Nazification and reeducation (war criminals with few exceptions are jailed or exiled). Japan suffers a similar fate or harsher. In the end, China becomes ultranationalist and attempts to invade both Mongolia and Tibet by the late 1950s, much to the anger of both the US and Russia. While US-Russian relations are turbulent at times, and each sees the other as a rival for influence, in the end both unite against China in the name of defending their interests. After Chiang Kai-Shek's death, the Chinese hatred of them grows even stronger out of bitterness for the Boxer Rebellion, seeming imperialism in Manchuria and the Pacific, as well as the idea of Cultural Supremacy. This is the "Cold War" of the timeline, and it is unclear if it leads to a World War III or not.

[@ozymandias3329]

Blessed ending

[@JackOLennaAcademy]

Only thing I didn’t like was how the Germans were stopped that easily and how weird it would’ve been that they suddenly invade Poland which would open up Russia even more and give a worse situation.

[@thatrandomguyontheinternet2477]

If the Checkoslovak legion choose to help the White Russians and march on Moscow they would probably have won

[@exogen211]

Briliant video

[@patrioticbritishmapper8352]

Thanks

[@latro6205]

This is what every American wants

[@yoyo93103]

The Tsar installing Puyi to power in Manchuria, Puyi : « but i already am the emperor »