What is it like to race a 125 at a Pro Motocross National? "UNFATHOMABLE!, a third of the power!"

Stankdog is one of the only guys in the world that is still qualifying for AMA Pro Motocross Nationals on a 125 2-stroke. I have always wanted to ask him just how hard it is to race a small bore 2-stroke and I am stoked I finally got a chance!
//
Gared Steinke races f*cking dirtbikes... 2-Stroke dirt bikes to be exact. He is a cult figure in motocross and one of the most universally loved guys on two wheels. I have always wanted to have Gared on the podcast and I am pumped we were able to make it happen. If you don't want to rip a 125 after listening to this podcast we can't be friends.
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[@GYPSYTALES]

FULL EPISODE LIVE ON OUR SECOND CHANNEL 🤟🏻 Give us a sub over there if you can, would help a lot! kzbin.info/www/bejne/fmPUpaKqn81kq8k

[@johnjunkin7646]

Good stuff jace

[@Max-it9kz]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/eIetkKloorygidE Roczen competing on 125 in Italy mxgp

[@seantamke3108]

FIST

[@renehofman5638]

1

[@GT-mn3bx]

Stewart was the best 125 rider we've seen. His speed and momentum that he kept was something else.

[@jonruger]

So true

[@stevedouglas1654]

Travis Pastrana was awesome on the Suzuki RM125 ! I remember him winning the Washougal 125 National and doing a vertical wheelie thru the whoops on the final lap and the fans going nuts ! 💯👍

[@johnnyskied]

He used to do combos that NO ONE else did on his 125.... including RC on his 250.

[@johnnybgood774]

Facts the fastest to ever race a dirt bike

[@johnnybgood774]

@@johnnyskied facts

[@jondoe7901]

Stankdog bringing back the smell & sound of the 2-Strokes at the Supercross event's! 🤘

[@Coyotethumper5]

Carson Brown did well at Washougal on a two stroke and he had a injured shoulder if I remember correctly he got 11th in moto one he couldn’t go out for moto 2 due shoulder injury hurting but damn that kid can ride

[@blooiefps9304]

I thought he had a wrist injury or something from a crash in practice. But yeah either way the guy even got like top 30 with a DNS it was badass

[@Coyotethumper5]

@@blooiefps9304 I got to talk with his girlfriend and another friend of his while at the races.

[@blooiefps9304]

@@Coyotethumper5 oh sick so it was his shoulder then ig lol

[@crawlz6226]

And he still took home the 2 stroke purse correct?

[@Coyotethumper5]

@@crawlz6226 a year ago no also there was no 2 stroke purse this year there was and yes he did.

[@nottingham82]

He should be allowed to ride a 250 2stroke vs the the 250Fs

[@robertrishel3685]

100%!

[@johnwilson1794]

I agree but can you imagine the malding if he starts to have success? It's a tough one.

[@MotoRevelations]

@@johnwilson1794 so be it

[@cristescuandrei688]

the EMX (european mx championship) allows stock 250 2 strokes against 250 4 strokes. The current champion won on a fantic 250 2 stroke

[@robertrishel3685]

@@cristescuandrei688 as it should be👍

[@brokenlegz]

James Stewart was on another level. Loved watching him.

[@bradthackston2323]

Stewart would take a 125 to the absolute limits of what it could take every time I’m sure his mechanic stayed busy rebuilding engines

[@jasontietnan5447]

2 stroke singing is the greatest thing,he is a legend for keeping a smoker in the premier class fair play to him

[@johnschauder]

I go to budds creek every year and I remember stank dog racing in 2015. The crowd goes crazy for the 2 strokes. A 2 stroke can be in last place and the fans will be cheering like the leaders are going by. It’s so fun to see him out there.

[@lonehilladventures5969]

Hell yes! Thank you for keeping momentum in the 2-stroke movement! I miss the sound, the smell and the true talent that is brought to light on these bikes.

[@macj9858]

Damn straight! Everyone loves the smokers! 😂 crazy watching these pro guys hop on a two stroke for a KZbin video and say they haven’t rode one since they were on a 85…. Then when they hop off the bike they always say how much more fun they are than the 4 stroke 😂😂

[@soulfulterrain3143]

Not 125's but, 250 2-strokes should compete against 250 4-strokes, end of story.

[@goldmx1229]

Did you see Emig in lorettas? Everything is possible on a 125, Loretta is not Pro level but they were same guys with same experiences, They are ex pros, I do same thing every Weekend on my 125 between all 250s and 450s, Definitely is the rider, Steve Lamson on the desnations? Won against all 500s aboard 125cc, JS and lot others.

[@messiona]

@@goldmx1229 JS, best 2 stroke rider ever, said multiple times that the difference between 250 2 stroke and 450 is huge.

[@shawntblin5423]

Emig was on a modded out 150 2T, but yeah… previous supercross title holder, pro rider mod, goes a long way.

[@jonruger]

It makes me feel so old that this generation didn’t grow up on 2 strokes and they want to love them. My generation was so happy to move on from them but they are bringing them back.

[@cjorgie1]

Me too…I remember watching (or should I say listening) to Doug Henry on a 4 stroke in the old King Dome (Seattle). That bike was obnoxiously loud! At the time I never thought 4 strokes could compete! I would like to see them come back, manly to lower the cost of racing for privateers… maybe just the lights class, or a third class?

[@jonruger]

@@cjorgie1 no got to let them die if we want to keep riding gas bikes let them die. Governments will keep restricting things hanging on to out dated oil burning engines isnt a good idea. Not to mention they just are not competitive I had the exact opposite experience I remember getting blown by on my YZ250 by the new YZ400 and thinking that’s a way cooler sounding loud than this shit box. My bike sounds like a box of silverware that thing sounds like a muscle car not to mention we had zero chance of keeping up with them coming out of tight corners they would rocket away. I hung on because of cost of parts and bought my last 2 stroke in 04 but traded that thing in 2 years later for a 450 I was sick of losing races.

[@cjorgie1]

@@jonruger good points and I think you’re right! My main reason for wanting the 2 strokes back is that the cost of racing is out of reach for most families! I know it’ll most likely never happen though!

[@jonruger]

@@cjorgie1 yeah that’s why I’m glad the youth classes still use two strokes 60s and 85s let’s families get into the sport without to high of cost and see if it’s the sport for them.

[@socaljimmyd]

I always wanted a 2 stroke as a kid. My dad hated them! He said they were too loud so my first bike when I was 5 was a Honda Z-50, then I outgrew that and my next bike was a 1978 XR-75. I was just stoked to have a brand new bike. Then I got an 81 XR-100. Willie Surratt still has it. He put a CR-80 motor in it. When I was 16 I traded a Kenwood CD player for a KX-80 and I loved that bike! Growing up on a four stroke when all your friends have YZ-80’s sucked! But I was happy to just be riding. Later in life I got a 01 YZ-250 and loved that bike, I would always say I’d never ride a 4 stroke! I’m a 2 stroke guy. Then my buddy let me ride his YZF 450 and I was immediately hooked! I had a 2018 YZF 450 and that bike was siikkk! Fuel injection! Now I wanna buy a new 450 and a new 250 two stroke. That way I can switch back and forth. But Stankdog on a two stroke being competitive is just bad ass!

[@maverick2242]

People said the same thing about 125s vs 250 2t and didn’t even compare against 500s until a dude named Johnny O Mara embarrassed the best riders multiple world champions on 250s and 500cc on one of the biggest and hilliest tracks in the world at Maggoria Italy, that was a big bike track, not a 125 track, people forget. Always been a Stankdawg fan for riding the 2t though, props and love the idea of you 3 starting a revolution next year. But today most people are lazy, they don’t want to ride a bike that’s challenging, fun, they want easy to ride lazy power. All the best next year Stankdawg keep giving em a taste of 2t 🤘

[@moparone7962]

David Thorpe is still pissed.

[@matjj676]

O Mara's epic ride! MX history!

[@scott729]

Excellent! I raced armature back in the early 1990's and occasionally we would get a privateer at a local LL regional qualifier who would just blow the doors off of guys that routinely blew the doors off everyone locally. My friend and I would go to Red Bud and Troy and see these "really fast" guys get their doors blown off by the pros .... all of this happening on 2-strokes. Nowadays I go to Red Bud and Ironman and it is amazing how the 4-strokes scream through every section of the tracks and here and there will be a two stroke and they look like they are dragging a tractor pull sled. Point is, you describe the reality of the power difference to a T ..... but I am with you, I just love watching and riding two stroke mx bikes. Thanks for keeping it real and alive!

[@ThePeoplesFabricator]

This is an important conversation. All-out speed torque and power is one thing but wide open throttle clutch fanning high corner speed 1-2-5 riding/racing/dicing, cannot be compared to on the fun scale

[@richardupyurass2379]

I’ve been calling for them to bring back two bangers in supercross for a few years. It would create much better and closer racing. Many more riders would have ability to compete. A really good rider can’t compete with factory teams simply due to money.

[@DirtBikes_MathGarden]

Not only because of money but also because of how the rules are written. A 250 2t should be allowed to race in the 250f class, period. There’s no reason for such a meaningless distinction. Displacement over all else! This would be great for the sport. There’s no possible way in hell a 125 will keep up with factory 250f’s, but it’s engine is HALF THE SIZE!

[@adriangow106]

They should at least allow the 150s to ride against the 250f would be awesome

[@Antholography]

I disagree. They should make the classes based on pure displacement at this point. 250 2T's vs 250 4T's. You can say that "that's not fair" - but there is *literally* zero factory support for the 2 stroke bikes anymore; and the 4 strokes were 100% allowed to cheat for years when 2 strokes ruled the roost.

[@vaughanhodgson]

@@Antholography a 250t still wouldn't beat a 250f around a track these days

[@jackmedford8369]

I’m selling my 250f to get a 2 stroke and I can’t wait!!!!!

[@cristescuandrei688]

Go race 250 2 strokes against 250f's in EMX, it would be amazing! The current champion rode a 250 2 stroke

[@artvarnson8009]

You just nailed! StanDizzle is popular cause he is out there having fun and thats what us mere mortals can relate to.... Great interview they keep getting better, keep up the good work bro !!

[@GYPSYTALES]

Thanks heaps mate

[@cknorris3644]

Grew up riding two strokes and its definitely a different monster, especially a 125. Its pretty much balls to the wall so you can stay in the power. Fun times!

[@mikearmstrongofficial1725]

G.S is a legend 🙌 in MX saving the industry! A 125 class mixed into the 2fiddys would be INSANE!!! One for the real back of the van privateers!

[@matthewwest1262]

Smokes the top new guys smoking on a 125 then gets back to the van then continues to out smoke the industry😂😂 only guy he probably cant smoke would be twitch😂

[@THEPAULFOOT]

Can't wait to hit the full cast on Monday in work keep it up dude loving all the guests 😁

[@joenowell4628]

In the UK the last couple of years, 2 strokes have made a resurgence. I think if the US promote 2 strokes and follows the UKs resurgence I believe the whole mx and sx scene benefits.

[@MXECSA]

Thanks Stankdog. You put 125 vs 250f in perspective. I always wondered now I know its day and night difference. 100% Incomparable 🤪

[@jared6163]

One of my favorite shows for sure

[@ronaldtravis970]

Stankdog is a fucking Moto Rock Star 🤘 Hell Yeah! 2 Strokes !!💀🏁🏴‍☠️🏁🏁🏁🤘

[@MattTradesLife]

about time this sport starts giving fans what they want 🤘

[@Burntrice747]

Before this I didn’t really know much about stank dog but now I have a huge respect for this dude 👊

[@hamonrye9823]

This stankdog podcast was so good

[@craigkosters9852]

Stank brought it to light, those 4/strokes have the power so when he's passing you its time to up yer game lads. 🤦‍♂️ Looking forward to seeing Stank and Carson rip those smokes!

[@jonruger]

Everyone knows they are slower that’s why we went away from them. It’s only the generation that didn’t grow up on them that think they are power monsters. A new crf450 makes the same HP as a CR500 but does it from top to bottom instead of a tiny band of useful power in each gear.

[@vaughanhodgson]

@@jonruger to right. But try telling that to the hardcore 2srrike fans

[@GreanBicycles]

I raced in the early 80's, mostly at Carlsbad..Stankdog would have fit right in..cool dude. He has a new fan.

[@avzeolla3960]

Stank dog is the most admirable motocross racer in the country ! 👍

[@mortenlarsen4016]

Stankie, love your coment about the Cab´s .. the Keihin is SO good a Cab, if you´r gonna ride fast, KH is the one to use .. Pretty fun but I have done your suspension a couple of time when I was at MXT US .. I´m the MX-Tech development and tuner in Denmark.. Besides suspension, I build what you can call Factory bikes , and most 125 and 250 2-strokes ..Day and night more fun that the 4 strokes ..I have raced 125´s since the 80´s and raced in the wet pro class as the only one in the class .. Way more fun, and I have been on the podium more times on my 125´s than anything else... you are sawing the MX sport doing what your doing .. thx

[@TheImtoomuch]

Steinke drops the F bomb almost as much as I do! Keep ripping those 2-strokes!

[@Dillonpickle]

Thanks never knew about this dude. So I watched his vurbmoto series, awesome 👌

[@ribbledean4111]

My dude was BAKED 🤣

[@manga7727]

I raced a 250 2st at the Canberra auspro mx in the lites class, I don't do it as much justice as stank dog but the old 2 banga definitely turned some heads

[@slpn9t]

There was a young kid racing a YZ250 2st in the 450 class at lorretas this year. Think it was b class, the dude got third from 15th! He done well through the week too.

[@GreyeTate]

Stank dawg is a time traveler from the 1970s

[@ryanlorance6168]

Stankdog is the man 🤘🏻

[@garymallard4699]

Back when i started racing ( 1975 ) there was a Pro National 125 class and a World GP 125 class too....they had 250 & 500 classes too...all racing the same track on the same Teams ( Factory ) ....and No Age restrictions.... Factory Riders sometimes would move down to 125 from 250/500 during a career and it wasn't a Demotion as it was a Premiere Class too...you guys need to learn History on Motocross?? It didn't start with the Second 4 Stroke Era !! As 4 strokes were used in the beginning of Motocross but 2 Strokes took over in the 70's fully....

[@ethankane6213]

Stank’s my fave rider of all time, he’s what mx is all about!

[@scottpeters8640]

While we are never going to get to see it, but I would love to see Tomac ride the YZ 250 at a National track that offers the best chance to succeed, like Ironman or Unadilla. If he were up for the challenge I feel he could certainly be Top 10 but he would surely get a poor start.

[@jrod1076]

It's all about having fun. I have both 2 and 4 strokes and 2 stroke is harder to ride but way more fun. I'm waiting for a badass electric motorcross bike to add to the collection. Can't go wrong w all 3

[@ivtec4fun55]

Hell yea, ride what you love and at a pro level!

[@joeyholthusen6495]

Not just dirtbikes my buddy races mini sprints he was getting 147hp out of his 600cc 2-stroke arctic cat motor while racing against guys with R1 yamaha rocket motor and he was still winning.

[@kevinmilner1762]

STANK DAWG!!!!!!!!!! Make motocross StanK again!!!

[@Jb-mp1in]

Yea the 4 strokes make u develop becoming smooth I grew up racing 125s and just like stankdog said you had to work everything you could out of those bikes pinned seat bouncing every technique u could to clear certain jumps launching with the front high leaning over the front fender lol

[@doubleoddbuck00]

Stank... The People's Champ!

[@ttt69420]

A fully built screamer can make as much as a fairly modded 250f but you'll only have about 3000rpm to work with. It's not the power as much as it's just the range of rpm you're limited to. A more linear powerband over such a wide rpm rage just makes the 250f straight unbeatable on a tilled torn up national track. They can hang gears and short shift and dig in and maintain momentum, a 125 just can't no matter who is riding it.

[@TheShift1313]

2stroke in an sx!!! Tracks are so different. The first time i rode budds creek in the 90s was on a 92 kx125. The hills are no joke on a 125 2 stroke! Back then they had a nasty off camber that sucked.

[@Lracer61]

Would love to see more two smokes out there for sure

[@UncleSarkis]

You gained me that same day lol. I hope to see you scoring points on a two stroke.

[@nickhutchins2124]

Mad props to stank for battling on 125cc hardcore. Grow up watching Bubba absolutely the GOAT on that 125

[@jymjess]

Let's hope he's making a KZbin series to follow the outdoors and indoors 😁😁

[@dontcallmejerry5077]

When he got into the main sx last weekend , I was so happy for him and me !!! Grusse aus Deutschland keep the Hufo screaming

[@jr6676]

Everyone loves the underdog

[@jeffpallaro6952]

Stankdog.... if it ain't smmokin it's just joking. Long live the 2 strokes.

[@johnnyskied]

Crazy to think that JS259 used to pull quads and other combos that no one else did.... including RC.

[@mx500a4]

Dude your name cracked me up! Totally forgot about that Hahaha

[@johnnyskied]

@@mx500a4 I'm actually kinda surprised that I haven't been kicked off KZbin. Lol If you want a good laugh look up Chuck Schumer's "wife." Lol It's a man man....said in my best Austin powers voice 😂😂😂

[@davidcels9162]

Shot stankdog! Bringing it back yo

[@JaredHIll13]

2 stankin for life!!

[@thejet7201]

I remember watching him growing up and they start the race and hold him back 30 seconds and he’d still come back and lap the field

[@jakeforeman4854]

I would love to see a 250 2 stroke in Supercross

[@vaughanhodgson]

No you wouldn't as sad as it Is it would get beat by the modern 250f and get mauled by the 450s

[@thejet7201]

He was a fucking legend to us 😂 it’s funny to think about now

[@GreyeTate]

Finally a 2 stroke in sx!

[@splitrockfence]

Beast

[@Lakesidephotography007]

The Reckner’s love stankdog 🤷🏻‍♂️ stay humble dawg!

[@robbie7574]

I just bought a 2021 yz250x 2 stroke for life

[@trevonbrown5084]

if you’re born in the wrong era it’s cause you’re here to help fix the new one!

[@tomvanheeswijk5560]

Look at lapucci in the 250 emx , hè rips on his fantic 250 2stroke !

[@davebrown7174]

are they actually on 125's? or do they get to run 144s?

[@CoolcatAMA-Pro]

Will definitely be looking forward to seeing the smoker back out there people need to subscribe to his channel so He will start making more content

[@jcsquared1111]

Wonder what Stank wouod say about a 250 2 strike vs the 250F would it be close wpuld the 2 stroke have the advantage then? 🤔

[@vaughanhodgson]

It has been discussed. A 250f these days would still be at a advantage over a 250t on a race track

[@johngrislis187]

Give the fans a 2t class for outdoors 👌 would be awesome to see or maybe a round that is 2t only

[@EkonRekon]

2 stroke equals fun factor for fans and rider

[@Mineratron]

I didn’t realise until recently that the KTM 250SX-F factory edition (2022.5) makes 47bhp out the box! 😳 At 14,000rpm too, make the two stroke loving engineer in me feel all confused. 😵‍💫😅 Ride a 300 in the desert and there’s points where the 450’s have a massive advantage but the 300 is much much more fun. Got the Mrs into riding two wheels on a KTM 150SX rather than a 250F. Cutting your teeth on the two strokes is a better grounding, four strokes feel easy afterwards but it doesn’t work in reverse. 😅👌

[@rickrossi4468]

Really think with the 4 stroke thing, you really need to get aboard. I love 2 strokes in every way, but they figured out how to make them faster than 1/2 the displacement. WAY IT IS! SUCKS Get aboard. Way it is. Way to go Gypsy, great interview. Love the content. Count me in!

[@TheShift1313]

What is the cc limit on a 125 vs the 250f. Will they let you run 150cc?

[@underthetrees4780]

I don't think so but they should

[@bbqgigi5510]

blessed

[@joenobody2580]

STANKDAWG 👊🏻🤙🏻💪🏻

[@DMDphotography]

Can we get a GoFundMe style purse for the two strokes? Top three two stroke finishers get paid out. If the AMA can't do it let's do on our own. And yes of course they should be allowed bigger than half the 4 stroke displacement. Stupid stupid rule.

[@slpn9t]

I bought the 250 2st over the 4 to work me out more. So much more fun but

[@derekbooher2583]

Just think how the guys feel that don't qualify on a 250f and he does on a 125!

[@jjca926]

2 stankin in vurbmoto, the best

[@brendanbutkus2392]

I remember hearing a 2 stroke during the budds creek broadcast and i literally told my girlfriend shut the fuck up this is important i need to know who this mad man is 🤘🏼🤘🏼🤘🏼

[@eaglestrikeman194]

question to all the MX and SX Experts. so when it started with 2 strokes back in the days and changed to 4 strokes through its history. and its a 250 and a 450 class. why is the 250 2 stroke not in the 250 class with the other 250 4 strokes???

[@GYPSYTALES]

I’ll do a hacky job of describing this for ya but maybe someone else can jump in and do a better job. Basically it’s to do with the combustion cycle of the motor. A 2-stroke will complete one full combustion cycle in one up/down motion of the piston. A 4-stroke takes 2 full cycles or 4strokes to complete a combustion cycle. So the early theory when they were first racing these bikes is if it takes twice as long to produce power you should have twice the CC’s… Modern 4-stroke development took over and it only too a few years to make a way better engine across the board. Power, torque, reliability etc.

[@eaglestrikeman194]

@@GYPSYTALES i kinda new about the development in racing performance between the 2 and 4 stroke but the thing with the combustion style and so on was totally new for me! thanks for explaining that :) i still would love to see how 250 2 strokes would perform vs the 250fs in mx and sx. in the emx250 the 2 strokes are really competitive in europe. in this series its doesnt matter if 2 or 4 stroke as long as its between 175 and 250cc. best 2 stroke is 2nd in standing's right now. would be really interesting to see the same in AMA series!

[@Neopaintballofficial]

I’m here for Stanky

[@farmerjae443]

It’s funny in XC AMA let’s the 250 4 and 250 2 strokes compete in the same 250 class but not in MX or SX.. 🤔

[@remotecontrol9874]

There should be a new rule to let guys race 2-stroke 250s in the 4-stroke 250 class.

[@boots2488]

Now I Needa find a 125

[@richardelfrink6483]

They should change it from CC’s to horsepower. That way anything under say 40 horsepower could be classed as lights.

[@briantruxtonjr.6108]

Hell yea get everyone on board screw placement if half the field rode 2 strokes I'd just consider that a separate class. Dude I hear a 2t (like at budds this year) and I look like Tyrone Biggums when he heard that baby crying like radar haha

[@destroyall24]

STANK DAWG SX TWO STROKE LETS GOOOOOO

[@jeffreymoran6234]

Flying threw them gears on a 2-stroke, there's nothing like it,bring it back stank dog please.

[@two_stroke_abuser]

Can he not run a 150 2t?

[@UncleSarkis]

Unfortunately, in about 20 years we're going to replace 4 stroke with electric and two stroke with 4 stroke and have this same conversation.

[@nickstewart6602]

I bet it will happen much faster than 20 years. Im actually excited to see full size electric race bikes (from Yamaha, Honda, Kawasaki etc.) some day.

[@mixalis6168]

@@nickstewart6602 naaaaaaaaaa, go awaaaaaaay !

[@jonruger]

I know I hate to be that guy but the young generation needs to let them die and embrace 4 strokes if we want to keep having gas powered bikes. The government wants cleaner vehicles not 100 year old technology oil burning engines that are even worse for the environment.

[@Marc757]

@@jonruger Na, a 2 stroke engine isn't the problem. You do something with the 6 million semi trucks operation on the road right now and maybe you can fly the flag of helping the environment.

[@nickstewart6602]

@@Marc757 don't get me wrong 2-strokes are the coolest/ most fun bikes to ride. I have just come to terms with the fact that electric power is a better technology. I believe those 6 million semi trucks on the road will also be electric much faster than people are anticipating. In the not so distant future the vast majority of cars on the road will be electric and at that point MX bikes will transition to electric as well.

[@dannnyw111]

I’m the European mxgp class, 250 2 strokes compete in the 250f class.. 125 have their own category

[@HansZuerner918]

I could maybe see 150's running with 250f's.

[@CoolcatAMA-Pro]

Don't the AMA allow the 250 2 stroke with the 250f in Pro sport

[@chriscurbstompscm]

Yeah you can race a 250 2t in the 250f class in amateur races. But the AMA Pro Nationals and AMA Pro Supercross won't allow any larger than a 125 2 stroke in the 250 class. I'm guessing because the manufacturers don't want it, since a privateer 250 2t and factory 250f would have similar horsepower numbers and would make the 250f's look bad to the average consumer. Especially since YAM is the only Japanese manufacturer still making 2 strokes. I wish they would allow 250's to compete together in the both AMA Pro series, since it would make it easier and cheaper on the privateers.

[@jenpsakiscousin4589]

Let 125s use the exotic leaded fuels needed to max out the motors capabilities then they would be a lot more competitive vs the works 4 strokes.