What JEDI Used To Be

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Күн бұрын

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@casualfanatic4217 2 ай бұрын

Just started the video and already the analogy of “If you focus on how stupid a vinegar cupcake is, you forget how to make a good cupcake” calls out Star Wars discourse perfectly.

@MFG1076 2 ай бұрын

Yep, one minute in for the fastest like I ever gave a KZbin video.

@al112v4 2 ай бұрын

Except it adds nothing to the conversation lol like, what it's supposed to mean? Another "DISNEY STAR WARS BAD" take?

@latbil 2 ай бұрын

@@al112v4tf are you talking about? He’s explaining that “DISNEY STAR WARS BAD” is a shitty take itself, so people should talk more about what makes old Star Wars good if they want to properly analyze and learn what makes a show good

@JonCrs10 2 ай бұрын

The funny part is a vinegar cupcake has potential, you just need to know how to use vinegar properly in baked goods like a proper rural grandmother. In Star Wars terms, setting up the state of the Jedi as having a reformation period 100 years before the Clone Wars after some particularly bad Jedi actions hurt their galactic image, that's a great idea. Because it shows that even when they fail terribly, they can bounce back and it foreshadows Luke bringing the Jedi back while also showing how the galaxy was primed against the Jedi just enough for Sidious to weaponize it. Anti-clericalism happens all across history and you can follow the trajectories even when steps were taken to prevent it. Shame what we got was an unironic "Jedi were always bad and the Dark Side is just misunderstood." And not even in the interesting Paradise Lost way where the author expects you to be smart enough to realize that Satan's POV is objectively deceptive and evil.

@hartthorn 2 ай бұрын

@@JonCrs10 That's not what we got. We actually got a lot of what you talked about and it was made in direct text of the show. The show did not say the Jedi were always bad, they give SO MUCH evidence to the contrary. They also don't say the Dark Side is misunderstood. And there is oodles of textual evidence making this clear. Instead, what the show is saying is that they're all PEOPLE, nuanced and complex and hypocritical. That institutions claiming to be infallible are the ones you should watch the MOST. And that part of resisting the Dark Side is that sometimes it CAN sound like it's making sense. It's not mustache twirling evil. If it was JUST that, there wouldn't be temptation. The only Jedi we see on screen actually being nefarious is Vernestra. And its because she has become a politician, just for the Jedi. For all their mistakes, none of the 4 Jedi on Brendok are BAD people. They're just PEOPLE, with ideals and worldviews, that caused a big problem with the best of intentions. And the Witches use the Force in unfamiliar ways, but they aren't just "of the Dark Side". They are shown as a community that has been hunted and persecuted, but maybe not entirely for no reason. And Qimir talks a good game, but we know he's not in this for noble reasons. We see his callousness and cruelty.

@Wax_Man 2 ай бұрын

27:22 that’s why I love the Gandalf quote, “Saruman believes it is only great power that can hold evil in check, but that is not what I have found. It is the small everyday deeds of ordinary folk that keep the darkness at bay. Small acts of kindness and love.”

@TreeHairedGingerAle 2 ай бұрын

YES! ☝🏾✨ There are parallels here to examine

@MiraBoo 2 ай бұрын

Beautiful!

@Thelnquisitor 2 ай бұрын

I thought the same thing when I watched this video. The idea comes up a lot in epic “fantasy” which is the most similar genre Star Wars has.

@mpalfadel2008 2 ай бұрын

👍

@jakekeys88music 2 ай бұрын

That's one of my favorites, too. Gandalf drops so many good nuggets like that in the films that grant hope, not just for the outcome of the movie plot, but for real life for the audience to internalize.

@AdamSmith-jb2lf 2 ай бұрын

When I realised what you were getting at with the “Everything is the same” point, I actually paused the video and paced around my house for a few minutes, it blew my mind so much. If you can lift a rock, you can lift a plane. If Vader can turn to the dark side, you can too. Luke needed to learn That lesson, and when he didn’t, Yoda was terrified that he’d go to Vader and turn evil.

@milesCarmany Ай бұрын

It definitely draws the zen and dao influences that Lucas seems to have intentionally included.

@shieldgenerator7 26 күн бұрын

also because this literally is what happened with anakin. he was supposed to save the galaxy but then he turned to the dark side

@eliasscorsone3220 9 күн бұрын

"If Vader can fail, you can, too." Yes, but the hope is also more powerful: if you can succeed, so can Vader. Also "If Vader fails, we all fail", if there's ultimate connection.

@cloak211 2 ай бұрын

"Why is this a more compelling way to do power progression?" Andor: "Power doesn't panic."

@wingsoffreedom3589 2 ай бұрын

Andor remains the goat of star wars tv

@BeaglzRok1 2 ай бұрын

It's kind of crazy the variance in how different stories use this fact to their own effects. You can have the nervous protagonist in over their head and rightly feel powerless because of it. They gain competence and by extension confidence and stability. Clash them against an able but uncontrolled antagonist, and they realize that keeping a cool head can overcome strength wielded inefficiently. The protagonist can face a villain that is truly powerful, that is so insurmountably composed that their own training breaks to the character they started as, and they have to come to terms with their failure. You can have the powerful, unshakable villain finally be overcome by a moment where they lose their control in the face of new adversity, showing they are no longer as powerful as the protagonist; or the villain cleanly defeated by the unshakable protagonist, they are shown as a great obstacle that is successfully overcome. It kind of ties back to the Super Saiyan example: Goku's best friend is killed, and instead of breaking down and getting lost in his emotions, he focuses up and is able to restrain his sorrowful rage enough to tell his son to get to safety and even offer to spare the man responsible for the murder. His head is clear enough to figure out that for as much as he wants to and literally can use his emotions as fuel to beat Frieza into paste, the worst wound he can inflict is making him live with failure. The whole arc, Frieza was confident in being the strongest in the universe, then Super Saiyan Goku forces him to realize that despite 100% strength being able to harm the hero he feared, he never had the control he thought he did and his lack of discipline wore him down enough to make one fatal mistake and get done in by his own attack.

@maximuscryptosx9424 Ай бұрын

@@wingsoffreedom3589 F Andor. Never will watch.

@wingsoffreedom3589 Ай бұрын

@@maximuscryptosx9424 everybody is wrong sbout something Andor is up there with breaking bad and early game of thrones for writing quality.

@maximuscryptosx9424 Ай бұрын

@@wingsoffreedom3589 Boycotting Disney Star Wars means, do not consume any, i repeat, any Disney Star Wars created content. None, nada, no bueno. If you want change, boycott. Its your only hope.

@sakurap95 2 ай бұрын

Everything comes together in the end. Ben not being afraid of death. Yoda pulling the ship out of the swamp. Luke bringing his weapons with him into the cave and facing his fears of becoming Vader. It all comes together when he faces Vader for real and he finally gets it.

@thewhite8uard 2 ай бұрын

Ben was not being afraid of death because he's already dead and he wasn't there at all, hence empty robe.

@esdeathsenpai5128 2 ай бұрын

It's just annoying at this point because Disney is adamant about going from "flawed" to straight-up villainous. I'm beyond ready for a story where we're not being preached to that they're the real bad guys of the story. But The Acolyte tells me we're not course correcting yet

@wandrillelamy5233 2 ай бұрын

You're right ! Yoda pulling the ship out of mud as Luke believes it impossible - at first - to pull his father out of the muddy dark side he is plunged in, I just reflected on that

@greyfoxninja1239 2 ай бұрын

@@wandrillelamy5233 Wow!

@thewhite8uard 2 ай бұрын

@@wandrillelamy5233 ‎The ship pulled out of mud itself, it can fly. Joda just drive it via Force, brain-computer interface. There is at least three ways to communicate with smart machines in Star Wars universe, via android-translator like 3PO, on a deeper level via droid like r2d2, and on the deepest level via Force, which is brain-computer interface. That's why when r2d2 was hit Luke hear the voice of digitalized Obi-Wan through the Force "Use the Force, Luke!", so he can aim the target precisely.

@e.l.norton Ай бұрын

The cave scene is obvious. When Luke asks what's in there, Yoda tells him "Only what you bring with you." Luke is bringing HIS fear, his anger, his hate, his impulsivity, his quickness to fight in there with him. He isn't confronting Vader. The figure of Vader is his fear and his object of anger and hate manifest. His real enemy is himself and the weaknesses and flaws he brought in there with him, hence seeing his own face in the form of his enemy.

@FattyMcFox 2 ай бұрын

Obiwan always struck me as "Powerful, wise, important, but understated and kind" which was something that I at the age didn't have and had never seen. No pomp, no dramatic lighting, just a kind greeting. I didn't realize it at the time, but i thought something akin to what you articulated so well here.

@changvasejarik62 14 күн бұрын

It was reading this comment I realized Yogurt from spaceballs was a composite of Yoda and Obi Wan.

@neilhannan5112 2 ай бұрын

A Jedi is never lonely they live on compassion, and they live on helping people and people live them and they can love them back but when that person dies they let go those that cannot let go become miserable that the lonely place -George Lucas

@unvergebeneid 2 ай бұрын

What?

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

Bro was getting it right and then had a stroke at the end

@unvergebeneid 2 ай бұрын

@@LordVader1094 yeah, looks like it... man, poor George Lucas!

@JonahNelson7 2 ай бұрын

@@unvergebeneidso funny to think he said it like that, so close George!

@officialthomasjames 2 ай бұрын

You gotta edit this

@patrickholt8782 2 ай бұрын

I love obi wan’s hut. I love his line about how the Jedi were the guardians of peace. The second they are gone someone gets to work on a mobile super weapon.

@francischambless5919 6 сағат бұрын

That weapon was under construction while the Jedi existed. It was under construction during the clone wars.

@undisclosedmusic4969 2 ай бұрын

…but you're so vinegary, like a cupcake

@schnee1 2 ай бұрын

LOL

@taylorparis7228 2 ай бұрын

@@schnee1 literally LOL.. League of Legends😂

@aetherwolf9288 2 ай бұрын

Snap back to reality wups there goes gravity. Like this is such a good line Really made my day thank you

@jeremiah6462 2 ай бұрын

@@schnee1 I just want to say, your analysis so perfectly embodies my thoughts about the OT amd why those 3 movies are the only movies that I believe should be canon. I also believe Timothy Zahn is the only other writer who has been able to capture the lore of Star Wars so closely to what Lucas did with the OT. Great video.

@mksmike Ай бұрын

@@undisclosedmusic4969 I would've made the analogy with salt.

@AmazingMrMe123 2 ай бұрын

Quick comment but in the OT (and PT as well actually) there isnt a single mention of the light side. The original vision is that The Force, is inherently balanced and Jedi serve rhe balance, the Darkside is distorting the force to your own goals and unbalancing it. Kinda wild that there was no light side for so long but we sorta assume and create dichitomies where none is found in the source

@eccentriastes6273 2 ай бұрын

There is a mention of the light side. When Yoda first brings up the dark side, Luke asks "How will I know the good side from the bad?" Granted, Luke doesn't really know what he's talking about. But Yoda's response isn't to challenge this dichotomy, it's "You will know." Seems like he's implying there is a light side opposite the dark side.

@AmazingMrMe123 2 ай бұрын

@@eccentriastes6273 it's hard to say how reliable Yoda is as he's such an oddball and he later literally dies rather than answering a question so concise and clear answers aren't really his thing. But it's true and interesting that he does not reject good and bad as a dichotomy. Although it would still not appear that the force is balanced between good and bad. Definitely want more good than bad. The lightside if we use the term would be balance with the darkside being unbalance. Luke's question shows the right understanding by attributing 'bad' to the darkside showing he doesn't want any darkside, which would be why Yoda doesn't have any need to correct terminology. You will know is an interesting answer, it speaks to being your own authority on right and wrong as opposed to looking to external sources. I just think it's interesting how for most of my life I thought of the force as light and dark, when this is a vaguely implied dichotomy at best and none of the star wars media (6 movies) I grew up with contain any mention of the lightside. Kinda blew my mind a bit when I learned that

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

Functionally, it is a very cool concept instead of the usual generic Yin/Yang balance of good and evil, but that the light side IS balance.

@fast1nakus 2 ай бұрын

@@LordVader1094thats not what ying yang concept is. The important part is that ying has a part of yang and the other way. It tells us that there is no perfect good or bad and the balance is also inside of us.

@lordbiscuitthetossable5352 2 ай бұрын

@@eccentriastes6273 But I wouldn't expect Luke to be an authority to know what the force is about, particularly not at his point in life. Just that the Force is everything, and the dark side is only created out of evil. Just naturally Yoda doesn't really correct him as it's really just a tiny technicality that helps Luke follow him; because he will know Force from it's dark side when the time comes. Which is why Yin-Yang doesn't work when it comes to the force. The dark side was never apart of the natural cycle, it's the part created by immensely evil creatures who will warp destiny to satisfy it's endless hunger. The force is everything life is; therefore the only balanced force is the one where there is no Sith to manipulate destinies.

@MaxxusDrago 2 ай бұрын

First minutes and you're already extremely coherent. That's why you're one of my favorite analysis channels, schnee. Not only are your analysis good, but the way you frame and observe everything is really logical and empathetic.

@sfkeepay 2 ай бұрын

Luke’s family situation isn’t “…uncaring.” (05:20) His aunt and uncle raised Luke from infancy; Owen is worried for his beloved nephew. He believes keeping Luke close is the best way to protect him. He comes across as harsh (though hardly unusually so) and he has very good reasons to be concerned.

@slackingstacker 2 ай бұрын

Yeah for real, Owen loves Luke like a son and the entire reason he's dismissive about the Jedi stuff is because he doesn't want Luke to turn out the way Anakin did

@gonkdroid8279 2 ай бұрын

Agreed, his take was surprising

@Allronix 2 ай бұрын

Yeah. Factoring in Disney canon, he also doesn't want Luke used as a weapon for the agenda of the powerful people who don't give a crap about working class people. He knows that the Jedi treated his stepmother like crap, and his stepbrother was also used for war and discarded. He didn't want Luke to end up like them.

@1MHCS Ай бұрын

A kind family would trust the person they raised. Thinking that not talking about something is the height of 1940's/1950's America home life, may not uncaring, but most certainly unkind. We are also shown that Luke becomes the man he does because of the connections he makes after he leaves his family.

@sfkeepay Ай бұрын

@@1MHCS , I appreciate your perspective, and I’m forced to agree that, broadly speaking, “not talking about something” is almost begging for a cornucopia of problems to thereafter arise. But any ~ 19 year old is very, very far from a blank slate. In fact, by 19, most of us are very far along establishing the personality, values, and physicality that are the foundations of our adult selves. I think you must right that for some people, those foundations come to reflect an opposition to parental influence. But that’s almost certainly not the case with Luke. One could readily argue many of Luke’s most admirable qualities were modeled by his aunt and uncle: loyalty, concern for others, modesty, reflection, persistence, empathy, independence… His adoptive parents love and care for him. He’s not rebelling against them, he’s rebelling against the life he happened to be brought up in - farming. His aunt and uncle, like all parents, are torn between wanting to protect him and letting him live his life. Trusting him, an aspect you’re right to bring up, is a process…letting go is a process. I would argue then that the “man he becomes” incorporates elements taken from the whole of his life, most of which was spent with his parents, not Obi-Wan or Yoda. Those Jedi mentors helped build on a foundation laid on Tatooine.

@hazza4954 2 ай бұрын

Starwars video be catching me off guard

@Jammakesjunk 2 ай бұрын

LUZ NOCEDA CATCHING ME OF GUARD OMG

@FunkatronicGeek 2 ай бұрын

Was Hailee Steinfeld in any of the Star Wars movies?

@hazza4954 2 ай бұрын

@@FunkatronicGeek must be if Schnee's making a video on it😂

@FunkatronicGeek 2 ай бұрын

@@hazza4954 Has to be. He doesn't cover anything sans Steinfeld

@hazza4954 2 ай бұрын

@@FunkatronicGeekREAL 😂

@andre429 2 ай бұрын

I think for Yoda's perplexing teaching it would be helpful to consider some Zen-Buddhist philosophy / teaching methods. In the west, we operate on the assumption that everything can be taught and understood on an intellectual level, where this is not the case in Buddhism. That certain truths can only be gained through direct experiences, and often these experiences are impossible with our preconceived notions. Setting Luke up to fail, in this context, makes perfect sense. Luke is holding on to preconceived notions that need to be removed before he can experience the truth of the Force. Whatever the flaws of Last Jedi, this line is pure Yoda "The greatest teacher, failure is."

@TheInfintyithGoofball 2 ай бұрын

HELL TO THE YES.

@Dagenspear 2 ай бұрын

PLEASE, you, and EVERYONE, if you haven't already, embrace the One True Only God YHWH Jehovah, Only One Jesus Christ His Only Begotten Son and Lord and Savior of our souls and the Only One Holy Spirit. God is good. God is love. Jesus is Lord. Jesus IS coming. Your soul depends on it! I have seen God act in my life. He saved my soul, changed my heart, changed my mind, helped people through me, took care of people in my life, people I hurt before I found God. God is the only reason I was able to reconcile with my dad before he died. God worked through Jesus Christ to save our souls. Jesus Christ died on the cross for our sins. Believe in your heart and confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus, and that God raised Him from the dead and you will be saved. Be baptized in The Holy Spirit, and if He wills, water as well. Repent of your sins, accept God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit into your heart, that Jesus Christ died on the cross for your sins. For God so loved the world that He gave His only Begotten Son Jesus Christ, that all who believe on Him should not perish but have everlasting life. Jesus Christ is The Way, The Truth and The Life. No one comes to the Father Jehovah God but through Him. Not long after I got saved I prayed to God for help understanding the Holy Bible, and that same day someone knocked on my door asking me if I wanted to understand the Bible. The Holy Bible says, "love thy enemy", "turn the other cheek", "If your enemy is hungry, feed him", "if he is thirsty, give him a drink", "pray for those who persecute you", "do not repay evil for evil". LORD willing, all humans may commit sin of almost every kind (gay, straight), and that's wrong, and all humans sin, as God tells us through the The Holy Bible, "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and all are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus." The Holy Bible also says, "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness."

@Dagenspear 2 ай бұрын

@@TheInfintyithGoofball PLEASE, you, and EVERYONE, if you haven't already, embrace the One True Only God YHWH Jehovah, Only One Jesus Christ His Only Begotten Son and Lord and Savior of our souls and the Only One Holy Spirit. God is good. God is love. Jesus is Lord. Jesus IS coming. Your soul depends on it! I have seen God act in my life. He saved my soul, changed my heart, changed my mind, helped people through me, took care of people in my life, people I hurt before I found God. God is the only reason I was able to reconcile with my dad before he died. God worked through Jesus Christ to save our souls. Jesus Christ died on the cross for our sins. Believe in your heart and confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus, and that God raised Him from the dead and you will be saved. Be baptized in The Holy Spirit, and if He wills, water as well. Repent of your sins, accept God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit into your heart, that Jesus Christ died on the cross for your sins. For God so loved the world that He gave His only Begotten Son Jesus Christ, that all who believe on Him should not perish but have everlasting life. Jesus Christ is The Way, The Truth and The Life. No one comes to the Father Jehovah God but through Him. Not long after I got saved I prayed to God for help understanding the Holy Bible, and that same day someone knocked on my door asking me if I wanted to understand the Bible. The Holy Bible says, "love thy enemy", "turn the other cheek", "If your enemy is hungry, feed him", "if he is thirsty, give him a drink", "pray for those who persecute you", "do not repay evil for evil". LORD willing, all humans may commit sin of almost every kind (gay, straight), and that's wrong, and all humans sin, as God tells us through the The Holy Bible, "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and all are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus." The Holy Bible also says, "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness."

@TheInfintyithGoofball 2 ай бұрын

@Dagenspear I agree with what Jesus believed/believes in (ie: world piece, helping people, based off the Bible verse you commented it seems he believes in non-violence as well) if I'm being honest I'm kinda scared of what some sects of Christianity have done in the past "in the name of God"... I prefer to have my journey with God in private... and sometimes I worry that donations to certain churches are used more for (🤢) selfish wealth than to spread good around the world... I DON'T BELIEVE ALL SECTS OF CHRISTIANITY ARE LIKE THIS but I've learned what goes on behind the scenes of say... the prosperity gospel I just... sure I've been baptized but I still have alot to figure out before I'm sure what... I'm not even sure how to end this sentence 😂 Honestly for alot of people they believe they can carry on Jesus's teachings of compassion and piece without being part of a specific church or religion and I atleast semi agree... I believe in God but I kinda... don't like to retrain my beliefs to what certain pastors say... because though Jesus's followers well... FOLLOWED him I think that his followers then and his followers now can still make mistakes so I kinda just keep to myself about the whole... "thing"? PS: is this because I said "Hell"? 🤭

@barkley8285 2 ай бұрын

TLJ is the purest SW since ROTJ

@triplezeroxz5875 2 ай бұрын

At the end of the video All of this, unironically, is exactly what made the EU special to me: the lessons from Kreia in Kotor 2, Luke's progress with the New Jedi Order after the events of Return of the Jedi, and many other stories about connection. Thank you for putting into words what I and many others could not for so long. And for even articulating things I never considered as well.

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

Also the Jedi as portrayed in the prequel-era EU, like pre-2008 TCW. They still felt like the Jedi who both came before and after.

@magnenoalex2 2 ай бұрын

Exactly the expanded Universe was beautiful

@gonkdroid8279 2 ай бұрын

KOTOR 2 just in general is fantastic, with the Exile being a broken person who can manage to find meaning again alongside her companions

@coreyander286 2 ай бұрын

I hate how so many people assume that Luke used the Force to telekinetically curve the proton torpedoes. Maybe he used the Force in a purely "mental", zen way. The use of the Force was knowing when to pull the trigger, and even just mastering his stress.

@AmoebaInk 2 ай бұрын

I think this is far more likely.

@HeavyMetalJesus02 2 ай бұрын

This is something that is reinforced within the prequels when we first meet Anakin and learn he's one of the few or only human that can podrace. He has higher perception and reflexes than the average human through the force. Also arguably foreshadowed during Luke's first training session blocking blaster bolts through foresight.

@simbelmyne7767 2 ай бұрын

That's what I've always thought. In fact I'm positive that you're right about this because if Luke physically moved the bolts with his mind, that would mean none of the other pilots ever stood a chance of making the shot, which I will never believe was the point of that scene.

@OdaKa 2 ай бұрын

I always saw it this way. He used the force to know what to do on such a sensitive high-skill mission

@Strideo1 2 ай бұрын

People actually thought that? I always thought it was just him using the force to know when to make the shot, not physically manipulating the torpedoes. Even as a kid I intuitively knew this.

@randomdragons 2 ай бұрын

omg the visual gag of the others’ input transcribed through the opening crawl is so fucking funny 🤣

@ticijevish 2 ай бұрын

Obi-Wan Kenobi takes Luke Skywalker to a Chinese restaurant for lunch. Obi-Wan is deftly manipulating his chopsticks and eating his food elegantly. Luke, on the other hand, is making a mess, keeps dropping his food and chopsticks everywhere, it's embarrasing. Obi-Wan looks kindly at Luke and says: "Use the forks, Luke."

@alexroselle 2 ай бұрын

Dad, is that you?

@ticijevish 2 ай бұрын

@@alexroselle 😅

@simbelmyne7767 2 ай бұрын

@@ticijevish*stage whispers* no no your line is, "I am your father" ;D

@jnnx 2 ай бұрын

A succulent Chinese meal?

@Patcannistan 2 ай бұрын

Effing boo.

@SirDomulustheBrave 2 ай бұрын

This video came out at the perfect time. I rewatched the OT recently and I didn’t realize just how much I missed how the Jedi used to be portrayed. Thank you for this!

@itsasquid 2 ай бұрын

Okay, ngl, I got really nervous when I first saw this video's title, lol! I'm a huge Star Wars fan (both new and old) and the fan discourse has been terrible, especially online. That being said, I think you broke down what I love so much about the OT and especially the Jedi: the kindness and restraint. It showed what the Jedi were meant to be from the beginning: peace keepers. It never shied away from showing how flawed they were (especially now in canon), but I think what makes characters like Luke, Ahsoka, Obi, and Kanan resonate with me the most is that they get back up and pursue that ideal anyway. Great video! I'm still a little nervous about your other Star Wars vids but I've also been watching your content for years since Arcane came out, lol! I can't wait!

@PsychicAlchemy 2 ай бұрын

What frustrates me the most about it is that, the moment I say I don't like Disney's trilogy in certain communities, there's a swarm of people who try to beat me down through social manipulation. "Oh, you're one of _those people!_ You must listen to XYZ! You can't think for yourself!" and that sort of thing. I've just given up on trying to reason with people. I'm just going to carve out a new community in my own little corner of the internet.

@SetreeAnimus 2 ай бұрын

@@PsychicAlchemy And then someone comes along and says they like Disney's trilogy in certain communities and get called a communist or a DEI hire or some shit like that. Sometimes, you can't win with star wars fans one way or the other.

@espo221b Ай бұрын

@SetreeAnimus because why else would you like the trilogy that shits all over Lucas star wars?

@SetreeAnimus Ай бұрын

@@espo221b You can like or dislike something without being a walking self report actually

@moscanaveia 11 сағат бұрын

A lot of online discourse about Star Wars does not come from people who value kindness and restraint. That's a pretty interesting thing to consider when analysing the discourse in general

@AssasinZorro 2 ай бұрын

It feels so strange that this is what it used to be and how it has been changed later. Being connected to the universe and seeing that everything is the same and everyone is you. I don't think that the low framerate Vader was only representing the actual father, but anyone you consider an enemy. This sense of unity sounds very appealing and aspirational

@feathercompressor 2 ай бұрын

Yeah this video is my first time hearing someone talk about cave Vader like that. I would've said the cave was to show that what Luke thought was a threat was his father, but that the real threat was Luke's own mindset (part of which is to be reckless, ready for violence). So literally, inside the mask of his father was Luke. Not that complicated, I thought. He ended up using his weapon because he insisted on taking it with him, and was confronted by a vision wielding... the same weapon. It just shows how far his thinking is from where it needs to be, especially when Luke himself doesn't get the point. I find Schnee to be generally very insightful so it threw me when he described his initial confusion and distaste for the scene.

@Lt.GonvilleBromhead 2 ай бұрын

Old Jedi; your wise, kind father. New Jedi: your bratty siblings.

@bankuei 2 ай бұрын

Fundamentally, the Jedi of the original trilogy are Taoists. You work around problems, you adapt, you appear useless or pointless and then you are free to do things in unexpected ways. Power is not as useful as awareness and ability to meet the moment. It is why Return of the Jedi has Luke achieve victory by simply not fighting. ("non-action" in Taoist terms). The sharp contrast, for the comparison for the prequels, is that the Jedi there, are the Catholic Church. They're tied into politics, they're controlling, they have lots of hierarchies and literally lead a slave army to fight a war.

@StarwarsNut2 2 ай бұрын

So true. Though, I would compare the prequel Jedi more to Buddhism, which also made political connections in eastern countries. That's where Lucas got the "no attachments" rule from.

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

Ehh nah you were right in the first paragraph, dead wrong in the second. Tbf I can't blame you, since the franchise itself has been pushing that silly idea of the Jedi for 10+ years now. But the prequels themselves do not support it.

@1MHCS Ай бұрын

I'm gonna say you just nailed both points. Well said! The prequel Jedi are so weird about family and love and sexual encounters. VERY Catholic Church. Looks like you may have touched a nerve with a few people with that statement though haha.

@tjmcfadden5137 Ай бұрын

@@1MHCSbecause he is attacking a people right now borderline racism. I don’t expect a black person to take black people being called this and not say something. Why should Catholics being called something bad just sit back and take it?

@1MHCS Ай бұрын

@@tjmcfadden5137 Catholics aren't a race...

@rojh9351 Ай бұрын

Interesting to note that Luke comes close to the lesson about harmony before the Battle of Yavin, where he is able to think of a wamp rat and the exhaust port of a moon sized battle station as being the same thing, albeit in a simplistic way (ie physical dimensions)

@cid_of_krebs 2 ай бұрын

You explained why I've always wanted to become a Jedi even though I've never believed in the magical side of the Force. You put all of these intuitive feelings into words and that was beautiful

@MrAxelotl 2 ай бұрын

When you came to the ultimate conclusion on the themes of the Force and sameness and how it relates to the plot of Star Wars and said "if I can choose good, he can chiose good", it literally made me want to cheer and applaud. That's how powerful that theme is. God I love the original trilogy.

@muffintime9302 2 ай бұрын

I LOVE that you include all these other voices. It really shows how much of a dialogue the process for making this video was

@mattobranain 2 ай бұрын

Let me explain the cave scene: Two clues from Yoda. Luke asks him: "What's in there?" Yoda: "Only what you take with you." Then Yoda tells him not to take his weapons. But he does. So he takes conflict fear and physical violence in, and that's what he finds. When he sees his own face in Vader's mask. that's a CLEAR indication Luke is afraid of his potential to become Vader. I'm surprised you didn't get this, because in your opening you said the Hero is afraid of attaining the power to save the world. Because it could come with the potential to destroy it... this theme.. of Luke basically struggling with the lure of the Dark side, is clearly played out in the finale of ROTJ... Vader says he feels the conflict in Luke. Luke is lit red on one side of his face and blue on the other.. when he sees Vaders hand cut off and looks at his own replacement robot hand, it says he has equalled the ability of Vader had but also the that he has the potential of the Dark side in him. as we know he stops there and chooses to throw away his weapon. ['your weapons, you will not need them]. That's what changes everything and completes his journey. The Cave scene is great. Star Wars can be condensed down to one word: compassion.

@ggdynfytugfy6892 2 ай бұрын

OT Jedi are Warrior Monks, as grounded in being a relaxed chiller at one with the universe as they are in being a bad enough dude to rescue the president, and I think what happened is that the prequels showed the Jedi order in a state where they’d become to involved in and complacent with the republic, and everyone took the Jedi order that was so bound up in the political world that something like Anakin’s fall became an inevitability as the baseline from which other considerations of the Jedi would originate

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

Tbf Prequel Jedi are also Warrior Monks. They also are pretty relaxed and chill, but can rescue the president. They're just rescuing the president on the regular, being the guardians of peace and justice in the Republic. It's only the last decade or more of material that's consistently tried to twist the Jedi into being complacent or "too involved" with the Republic (what does that mean anyway? They have to be involved, they're the literal guardians of peace and justice in the Republic, many simultaneously argue the Jedi's flaw is not being involved enough in Republic politics) rather than accepting that most of it was just the Sith hiding out and manipulating affairs for a very long time. Reading the prequels EU pre-2008 TCW gives a picture of the Jedi much of those in the OT and their grounded, logical philosophy and spiritualism. Furthermore, they're far from complacent or too involved, they oftentimes make decisions counter to the Senate or do things as required rather than within the strict laws of the Republic. And most of all, they come within an inch of actually discovering Palpatine's entire plot in Labyrinth of Evil which causes him to launch the assault on Coruscant to cover wiping out the investigation team. The prequel era Jedi Order (as depicted in the material originally tying-in to the movies like the CWMMP) is insanely underrated.

@sheol8989 2 ай бұрын

@@LordVader1094 They're not Warrior Monks in the Prequels, they're more like Monk Cops tbh, at that point the Jedi Council is so arrogant and tunnevisioned on politics that they don't even follow most Jedi doctrine outside of their facade. The Prequel Jedi Council was probably one of the worst moral representations of the Jedi we've seen and their lackings is (by the media's own accord) what lead to the birth of Darth Vader, this is obvious since the Prequels released and didn't need any extra material to be made clearer, although the novelizations say it outloud. This is exactly what The Acolyte's entire point is, that the Jedi doctrines can't coexist with the council having a political influence at all, the detachment from greed and desire can't be present when they need to be aware of their every move and outwards appearance since they're politically attached to the government

@jmwilliamsart 2 ай бұрын

@@sheol8989Exactly, the Jedi were supposed to be serving the people of the galaxy (outside of political bodies) and the will of the force. The Jedi had become too close to the politics of the senate, essentially they were nothing more than enforcers for corrupt senators.

@1MHCS 2 ай бұрын

Also in the prequels, the jedi have this weird hang up on not loving or even thinking about your family, where the first 3 movies are all about how connections make you stronger. Should have kept them as rare and needed to be sought out instead of the jedi discount training academy.

@justinAclark2075 2 ай бұрын

The editing is so creative and deep. Love the Spider-Man clips while you're talking about attainability of the "hero" narrative. Brilliant addition, which really solidifies the point you're making

@serrion1394 2 ай бұрын

This is why Himmel from Frieren hits different as well! He is a hero that is relatable and a "power" everyone can achieve!

@yondaime500 2 ай бұрын

This helped me understand why Strawberry Shortcake feels like a jedi to me. She's just a regular person without any powers, but she has an uncanny ability to connect with everyone and everything. Everyone she meets ends up becoming a better person just from spending time with her. And that makes her a very compelling character.

@moonblaze2713 2 ай бұрын

Because of the cupcake thing at the start, it took me a moment to realize you meant the character and not the literal cake. XD

@zenebean 2 ай бұрын

I was not expecting Strawberry Shortcake to pop up in a Star Wars discussion, but hell yeah, she'd make an awesome jedi!

@benmcreynolds8581 2 ай бұрын

This is actually hilarious because when I was a kid in the early 90's my parents got me a used Strawberry shortcake castle from a garage sale and I would play with my star wars action figures around the strawberry shortcake castle model lol I wish I could show you that I'm not bullshitting you with this. I really did have an Absurd mismatch of kids toys in the early 90's. Random I know but your comment brought back a core memory lol

@greyfoxninja1239 2 ай бұрын

@@benmcreynolds8581 Perhaps unconsciously you knew these characters were living the same story.

@andreweckford6319 2 ай бұрын

Also made without vinegar.

@myronballard1520 2 ай бұрын

Wonderful video Schnee! Truly inspiring! I would love a deeper dive on the "connectivity" aspect of the Jedi. One of the most pivotal themes I've noticed while listening to you is that the Jedi strive to partner with the Force and therefore strive to build harmonious connections with others. That's a very unique relationship even in our world and in fiction b/c the chosen one or hero's journey becomes a lot about the one person overcoming on their own merits, by dominating their adversaries. Ironically, this "domination" theme seems similar to the Sith, who seek to dominate the Force so as to use it as a tool instead of partnering with the Force. Lastly, that dominating element seems to produce a sense of "separation", when it comes to building healthy relationships, which is the opposite of the Jedi. Sorry for the long message, but I'd love to hear more about Jedi and the "connectivity" theme. It's so relevant in America where we applaud the individual who achieved success single handedly while ignoring the persons who helped that individual along the way.

@jcshanghai07 2 ай бұрын

Dude, I watched the very first movie in theatres when I was around 10. It changed my life. I watch the current shows and know that ... they are just ... missing something?? But I couldn't put my finger on it. THIS is what the franchise lost. The profound wisdom that the spiritual journey is about coming to a deeper understanding of our unity with all of existence. The Jedi were basically Taoists. Now, they're another type of generic Avenger power hero. Or whatever the hell they were on The Acolyte. I miss the Taoist Jedi. In fact, I've done a bit of a dive into the je'dai (I think that's how it's spelled) and they strike me as more what Obi-Wan and Yoda were. Great video. Thanks for clarifying and offering me back something that I had lost.

@moscanaveia 11 сағат бұрын

The actual Jedi philosophy drawed its inspiration mostly from buddhism

@GUNDAMURX73 Ай бұрын

Something your analysis made me think of... when Obi Wan says that striking him down will make him more powerful than ever before, it's funny how even in what's been added on to Star Wars that gets interpreted as "ascending to a power beyond life". But you made me think, maybe what he's getting at there is that Obi-Wan knows he could have never defeated Vader... but that Luke could, because in Luke he sees how Anakin once was. And he recognizes that if Vader strikes him down, it will be the catalyst to Luke embracing fully the lessons of the Jedi to stop Vader. Vader sees it in terms of "I will defeat you in combat, and I will have won." But Obi-Wan maybe sees and embraces the greater harmony, what his death will set in motion, and knows that by striking him down Vader is setting his own downfall in motion. In other words, the connection Obi-Wan formed with Luke in kindness and friendship was more powerful and galaxy-changing than any lightsaber duel could ever be... and he smiles, because he realizes he has already won. And he lets go. Interesting food for thought.

@darquidarqui 2 ай бұрын

That emotional progression discussion at the end was fascinating, it's what really makes Luke's journey so memorable and inspiring. I'd love to see your take on She-Ra (2018) regarding the magical warrior trope, I believe Adora's journey as the main protagonist shares very similar ideas to Star Wars and the concept of the Jedi. Great video as always!

@andre429 2 ай бұрын

Thank you so much @schnee for providing some kind and thoughtful context to such a toxic space.

@TheInfintyithGoofball 2 ай бұрын

oh this 100%

@wingsoffreedom3589 2 ай бұрын

The space isn't toxic star wars is toxic the fans reacting with negativity isn't toxic don't conflate the two.

@ChrisPTenders 2 ай бұрын

Okay. Quite possibly one of my favorite Star Wars videos ever.

@gearmonger8616 2 ай бұрын

This is a good attempt to move the discourse forward. Obi-Wan ia a sample of one, I would like to have seen that addressed.

@bellaneedsabreak 2 ай бұрын

Finally a Star Wars video, LET’S GOOO! 😭🎉

@joshuabonesteel2303 Ай бұрын

Another point to look at in Obi-Wan's intro is that he could have dealt with the raiders in a hundred different ways, but he just chooses to scare them off. In fact, the only time we see him resort to violence is when he is attacked in the bar and when he ultimately has to fight Vader. Both times, he is forced to make this decision, and he always seems to aim for the most non-lethal ending.

@Aisha_Luv 2 ай бұрын

1:27 the fact you acknowledged she ra brings joy to my heart

@28starwarsfan 2 ай бұрын

The vinegar analogy... That was great.

@Lucifer_Abysseum 2 ай бұрын

that's amazing ! i never tried to understand the Force more than that and this video is amazing to lead us through understanding it. Also, if Squircle did explain why Yoda might be an Apex predator i wanna hear it-

@AllThingsBrightnBeautiful 2 ай бұрын

👀

@schnee1 2 ай бұрын

@squircleworks42 HEY, go

@squircleworks42 2 ай бұрын

Yoda picking swamp as place to live + Baby Yoda eating all the creatures that would definitely live in a swamp + Yoda being an insanely powerful master of the force = entire planet being terrified of the apex predator in the hut

@Notsogoodguitarguy 2 ай бұрын

@@squircleworks42 Yoda is Nibbler

@Lucifer_Abysseum 2 ай бұрын

@@squircleworks42 Well now I see it x)

@Froscav121 2 ай бұрын

"For over a thousand generations the Jedi were guardians of peace and justice, before the dark times." - Obi wan Kenobi

@ImNotHereEither Ай бұрын

We like the Jedi because they’re the good guys in a fairytale. SW is a fairytale not sci fi. If Disney did what they’re good at, they’d be raking it in. But they forgot what they’re best at selling, happy endings where the good guys win.

@EJofKC 2 ай бұрын

Man, I feel like Schnee has enough of a backlog to make a video about why watching his videos feel so good. I always leave these with a sense of settled “knowing” almost. Like, there’s a catharsis to put to words exactly how I feel about the different media he covers, and then made more settled at knowing why I feel that way. This channel always brings me back because of that simple, but difficult to execute idea, put to words how and why I feel a way about these things.

@VASM160689 2 ай бұрын

The new format with the inclusion of the discussions and other points of view is really good, I like it! Keep it up!

@Dagenspear 2 ай бұрын

@thomas399-t2o 16 күн бұрын

This video is really a breath of fresh air. Just analyzing the good ole' days of star wars :)

@the_darker_fonts554 2 ай бұрын

"Have you ever considered the fact that Yoda might be an apex predator?" Next video. Now.

@cjh.1920 2 ай бұрын

Incredible work. I’d like to add that the fact they show Yoda as the penultimate form of a Jedi, it shows that any and every kind of person big or small green or otherwise can be a Jedi.

@bruhdon4748 2 ай бұрын

For some reason people never seem to get the cave scene with yoda, it’s literally just luke confronting his shadow self, it’s one of my favourite scenes in the movies, Yoda told luke he won’t need his weapons but out of fear he brought his blaster and light sabre, due to that fear his shadow self manifest itself in the form of Luke as Vader, luke could’ve easily went down the same path as Anakin & basically was until the last moment, luke failed to confront his shadow self just because he brought his weapons.

@X05JaEchtMan 2 ай бұрын

1:26 SHE-RA 2018 MENTIONED

@carmacksanderson3937 2 ай бұрын

RAHHH FOR THE HONOR OF GREYSKULL

@jgonsalk Ай бұрын

I used to want to be a Jedi when i was a kid. I'm 39 now and the prequels and sequels killed that desire. But now its back. I'm going to be kind and calm and connect with people because that is real magic.

@wisdommanari6701 2 ай бұрын

Lol I love your stuff so I'm so excited to see your POV on this particular subject.

@jammydodger222Xxd 2 ай бұрын

The symbology in the cave scene and when trying to lift the ship may well be deeper than you think. Remember when Luke says he can't do it, 'you ask the impossible'. Then later when Yoda lifts the ship and he says 'I don't believe it' Yoda replies 'that is why you fail'. The clear theme here is that Luke needs to let go of his preconceptions about what he thinks being a hero is. A Jedi needs ot be more than that. Up until that point it's been all about Luke's progression and Luke's powers and Luke's ambition. All very self centered. Yoda is trying to teach him that he needs to let go of this focus on self and trust in a greater power. In this case, the force. Yoda even lists off all the things a Jedi doesn't crave that we usually associate with heroes. When you think about it they're all about our own experience and not about the greater good. When Yoda tells him not to take his weapons into the cave, Luke ignores him and takes them anyway. He tries to overcome what's before him by his own strength trusting in his lightsaber over the force. As such he fails and only succeeds in defeating himself. As is demonstrated symbolically. When Luke doesn't feel he can lift the ship because it's too big Yoda tells him that the size of the object doesn't matter 'judge me by my size do you?'. Luke 'tries', again under his own strength, to take on this approach depsite Yoda's other advice 'do or do not there is no try'. He starts to succeed but again becomes fixated on his own perceived strength vs the size and weight of the ship and fails. If he just did, allowing the force to work through him rather than 'trying' to use the force he would have succeeded. Which Yoda then demonstrates. When he says 'I don't believe it' Yoda says 'that is why you fail' because he's still focused on his own strength and his own perceptions of what's possible rather than rejecting self and trusting in the force. To truly be powerful a Jedi must reject their sense of self, their desire for power and their own ambitions of heroism, they must give themselves to something greater than they are. This aspect of the Jedi draws inspiration from Christian theology. Yoda's training is much higher level than Obi Wan's hence Yoda being introduced as the Jedi master that trained Obi Wan.

@jamesabernethy7896 2 ай бұрын

Amazing video, great points, well structured but also so much fun too.

@stur3366 2 ай бұрын

I think one of the big questions that needs to be asked is if it was all intentional. From day one, did George Lucas want people to have a certain view of the jedi only for that view to be absolutely destroyed by the prequels? Or did the idea come to him after episode six? Because the prequels pretty much change the perception of a lot of things from the original. Lukes mother goes from a character with no name that is barely if not ever mentioned in the originals but after the prequels she gains a name and becomes one of if not the most important character in the story. Vader goes from a terrifying robotic monster that earned redemption to one of the most sympathetic villains that is in literal pain every second he is in his armor, that found his way back to the light. Obi wan and Yoda are now painted as liars somewhat, etc, etc.

@StarwarsNut2 2 ай бұрын

I really think that Lucas lost his way. His concept of The Jedi and The Force changed on a fundamental level. That being said, the prequals are not all bad and have some really good stuff.

@az-kalaak6215 2 ай бұрын

I would consider as following: Lukas wanted to show us something we haven't seen yet, and so he did. the difference we see are due to the fact that jedis were practically extinct during the reign of the empire (well, except if you reed the books or comics as it seems there are a few thousands jedi that survived, but let's not count those). he linked both when he said (through yoda mostly) that the jedi were getting complacent, arrogant, full of hubris. the jedis you see in the 4-5-6 are nothing like that, and their version from the prequel, while flawed are still the same characters, they simply are younger. plus, he depicts a full on war, with jedi intervention. considering the episode 1 is criticized for having too much politics and low rythme (in which you see qi-gon, which would be the jedi that resemble the most the ones of the 4-5-6), i'm unsure the public reaction would've been at the rendez-vous

@Notsogoodguitarguy 2 ай бұрын

Didn't Lucas originally plan only the OT? I thought it wasn't meant to go beyond that, but then they decided to continue. If it was the case, then it wouldn't surprise me if there's a biit of a disconnect.

@allowableman2 2 ай бұрын

@@az-kalaak6215 Grammer

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

Prequel era Jedi (as in the movies and their tie-in material) are actually consistent with the OT, they're the same chill zen warrior monks. Them being "flawed" and "fallen" was something brought on rather needlessly by retcons starting late in 2008 TCW's run and continuing (and increasing) to the current time.

@X05JaEchtMan 2 ай бұрын

Imma make a vinegar cupcake now

@golgarisoul 2 ай бұрын

This video essay just made me rewatch Baby Cakes Coffee Line video. I've always felt that video, like this one, is really eye-opening in relation to the tropes of Chosen Ones and related topics like hidden worlds or hidden magic.

@John-ct9zs 2 ай бұрын

Obi-Wan was actually in his 60s, not 50s. But then again, I'm having a personal existential crisis being in my late 40s and hearing 50s being old. And then I remember when I was a teenager and up till 25, I thought people who were 40 were older than dirt, and 50 was a crypt keeper. So yeah, kids today are doing what I did in how they look at "older" generations, LOL.

@gonkdroid8279 2 ай бұрын

Yeah, him saying 50s being old threw me for a loop

@D-RAY97 17 күн бұрын

I know I'm probably nitpicking a small thing of this video, but man. It is sooo badass to see multiple women intelligently articulate these points of philosophy, the jedi, and storytelling. Way better that the writers of the acolyte. I love this video so much.

@Lucke1370 2 ай бұрын

What a perfect way to encapsulate how the Jedi, hell episodes 4-6, work so well. They arnt a hegemony but a sect of individuals looking to better the world, "seek balance in the force," or as you said that differences are illusionary. There is no difference between the light & dark force, only what you, the individual, do with it.

@sebrussell 2 ай бұрын

While I don't love the execution of the prequel trilogy, it is kinda trying to continue in that vein. The Jedi of that trilogy aren't like that, but that failure isn't one of concept, it is the concept. The Jedi of the Prequels have lost their way, and as the war progresses, they lose more and more of what they are supposed to be (and it can be argued that Sidious' manipulations are fuelling that loss). The closest thing to an Original Trilogy Jedi is Qui Gon, and he is demonstrably not the norm of Jedi in that era. And in the Clone Wars TV show, Yoda eventually realises that Qui Gon's way was the right way, and how lost the Jedi have become.

@Lucke1370 2 ай бұрын

@@sebrussell I actually never really thought about the prequels that way. That makes a lot of sense that the jedi order of that era had become so used to sith being in the past that they had come to believe that balance was achieved by only light prevailing, not true balance. Even the prophecy of Anakin bringing balance to the force, they seemed to believe it would lead to the eradication of the sith not the jedi.

@mpnuorva 2 ай бұрын

What you do with it *is* the difference.

@allowableman2 2 ай бұрын

@@sebrussell That's not really how Qui Gon came off in TPM. Especially since GL said that Qui Gon was wrong to take Anakin from slavery and the Jedi were ultimately right about Anakin

@allowableman2 2 ай бұрын

Most of the dark siders we see in the movies are cartoon villains who only kill people we like, so I think there's a difference

@shelby2561 2 ай бұрын

The second half of avatar is basically like a less confusing and arguably more profound version of episodes 5 and 6. We have the fear, leaving training, injury, more training, anger and then a profound relization that leads to victory (my brain is huge)

@AJ-dt3pz 2 ай бұрын

The sound Obi-Wan makes is the sound made by a krayt dragon, which many Sand People are afraid of.

@Wax_Man 2 ай бұрын

Yea, I think he used the force to do so. Don’t quite remember though

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

@@Wax_Man Most certainly.

@Crazael Ай бұрын

4:00 I think it really helps that when Obi-wan is talking to R2 at first, he is looking directly into the camera, so it's like he's talking directly to the audience. 17:30 It is a Force vision, just like him seeing his friends being tortured. He's both seeing what he could become if he doesn't complete his training, and he's also sensing his connection to Vader. There is also a strong Dark Side influence in the cave which is also influencing his vision.

@lakshaykochhar6799 2 ай бұрын

Man, the fact that you and the people that you brought along in this video managed to crack the Jedi's restraint rule without knowing the lore behind it and their inspiration from buddhism is quite funny to me.

@Dagenspear 2 ай бұрын

@Impossible_Emporium 2 ай бұрын

Thank you. I enjoy most of your videos for their interesting view into writing and character and everything else. This one dived to a deeper level with its insightful breakdown of the Jedi. Summarising the philosophy of their spiritual quest with such clarity.

@MatthewOfGilead Ай бұрын

The Dark Side Grotto scene is meant to show where the dark side can lead you even now as you are so convinced that you would never not in a million years be a bad guy, while also foreshadowing the good person falling to darkness that was anakin to vader. The reason it is troubling is probably because You have not accepted how that is also a possible future for you and that subconsciously you might know that you are not living in a way that will avoid the outcome.

@piotrjanukanis4459 2 ай бұрын

Damn! I love your analysis. It made me look with fresh eyes on one of my favorite stories of all time and appreciate it on a completely different level. I'm usually against thorough analysis of art pieces (In my opinion it often kills the joy of experience), but your take on it somehow combines logic and methodological thinking with passion. Thank you!

@jeffmiller6025 2 ай бұрын

I enjoy newer SW and I totally agree with your analysis. As someone who saw ANH as a kid in 1977, this precisely encapsulates what has always attracted me to the Jedi. So why do I like newer SW? Because I don’t have an issue with complicating these things, showing how messy they can be. At my age, I relate very deeply to Luke’s characterization in TLJ, and his turn around by the end of that film. In the PT and High Republic eras, I have no problem seeing the Jedi trying and sometimes failing to live up to these ideals. I’m fascinated by the implications in Ahsoka that the way the Jedi organized in the HR to PT eras were not how they organized prior to the end of the Sith Wars; that they used to train anyone who wanted to train, regardless of age, and didn’t care at all about m-counts. And so I’m interested to eventually see the explored in the inevitable Old Republic stuff we get. And, perhaps most controversially, what I found compelling about Rey was precisely that the power bits came very easy to her, but the emotional arc still had to be walked (arguably, this wasn’t very well executed throughout the films, save TLJ, but like the PT, the story is there and is compelling, regardless of execution). Which is to say: I see everything you’re describing in this video woven throughout newer SW, but made significantly more complex by the politics at play, the differing social issues of the Galaxy, the sheer number of different types of people trying to be Jedi, etc. Again, I’d never argue the execution is always great (or even good). But as someone who’s been a SW fan as long as there’s been SW, that’s nothing new.

@blackshard641 2 ай бұрын

"At my age, I relate very deeply to Luke’s characterization in TLJ" Same. Luke struck me as that gifted kid who peaked early and became jaded at how little everything he accomplished ending up amounting to. The galaxy not only backslid back into its endless cycle of war, but he inadvertently played a part in turning someone to the dark side. His bitter withdrawal was a very realistic response. TLJ was by far my favorite of the ST. IMO, the deeper mythology it hinted at (spontaneous Force sensitivity in individuals not tied to a "special bloodline", balance as "balance between light and dark", political factions that profit off endless war) actually improved the PT retroactively.

@Drivenby 2 ай бұрын

I wish comments still has downvotes . Both of these comments are just SMH

@Lanman106 2 ай бұрын

Fantastic analysis! Never really looked at the Jedi this way. I understood some of the concepts but never got to this full picture.

@alexhansen2102 2 ай бұрын

There are a few showrunners that desperately need to watch this video.

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

Particularly of the Acolyte.

@joshuawesteros5345 2 ай бұрын

Damn. You and your friends are very insightful. Excellent take. 👍

@jryannorton Ай бұрын

Thank you! Excellent video. This is the exact stuff that makes or breaks SW content for discerning fans.

@simbelmyne7767 2 ай бұрын

I love the cave scene! There's tons you can draw from it, all leading back to the main lesson Luke has his breakthrough about in the throne room in rotj. "What's in there?" "Only what you take with you." Luke takes his weapons with him, against Yoda's advice. He ignites his saber first, and the phantom Vader takes its cue from him. Luke fears and hates Vader, so he immediately lashes out and strikes to kill. The phantom fights back, after all who wouldn't? What Luke 'took with him' into the situation was a willingness to commit violence, to murder. He also took with him a distrust of his teacher, a lingering belief that Yoda would send him into danger he was unequipped to handle. If you can't trust others you isolate yourself, become vulnerable. (Relying only on yourself is what the sith do.) If you enter a scenario thinking violence is the answer, violence is what you will find and perpetuate. Luke didn't trust Yoda and he acted aggressively out of fear and hatred. He failed to behave as a jedi should. That doesn't make him a bad student, the goal of learning is not to get it right on the first try. Luke seeing his own face in the helmet is how the failure teaches the lesson. Ok, you killed your enemy, do you feel better? Have you triumphed? No. There is no glory in murder. Revenge will not bring you peace. The Vader Vision in the cave also represents simply an enemy. Luke's greatest enemy. Unmasking the apparition slaps Luke in the face with the realization that his greatest enemy is...himself. The thing he will be asked to conquer is not Vader, it is not even the empire, it is his own darkness. And that's not something you can dispatch with a sword. You can't just make it go away, you have to face and overcome it, or it will haunt you. What's the betting Luke saw that image in his dreams a few times after that happened. Talk about creepy. Video already touched on the "Luke and Vader are the same" angle so I won't get too deep into that. Just to say yes, exactly. The lines between Good People and Evil People are not set in stone, check your arrogance, unlearn what you have learned, do not dehumanize your enemies and do not be blind to your own shortcomings lest they destroy you. Things are not always as they seem. There is more to know. All lessons from that moment. All this comes to a head when Luke throws his saber away. Luke has learned from his failure, very nearly fails again in the same way but stops himself. Looks at his father's severed hand and at his own, and flat out REFUSES to play this game anymore, this kill or be killed thing the Emperor sets up as the only way forward. This lie that he believed when he raised his blade first against a shadow in a swamp. He finds the third option: connection. He does not have to kill his father, and his father does not have to kill him. They can break the cycle together. Just as his phantom self did, Vader follows Luke's lead. Luke shows him mercy, shows him it is possible, and Vader for once in 20+ years chooses compassion. Luke found it in himself to give to Vader what he couldn't fully give Yoda, Trust. What Luke does that is so incredible is he asks for help. He does not insist on relying only on himself. In the end he is just a boy in pain, asking his father to protect him, to love him. But even before that, he said again and again, "I will not fight you," "let go of your hate." ('I trust you, I believe in you, I trust you not to hurt me.') That kind of faith in someone else has power. It is deeply moving. It is so, so brave and it inspires others, from Han Solo to Darth Vader. That is why he is a hero, to me. And in star wars, the word for that is Jedi. "Children teach us compassion" -George Lucas "Attachment is forbidden. Compassion, which I would define as unconditional love, is central to a Jedi's life." -Anakin Skywalker

@shadowgamer4306 28 күн бұрын

Beautifully said!

@simbelmyne7767 27 күн бұрын

@@shadowgamer4306 thank you!! :)

@jlwbrickz6044 Ай бұрын

This feels a lot like Timothy Zahn's take on Jedi in his Thrawn trilogy and Hand of Thrawn Duology. Well done. Goodness is kindness and doing right

@laioren 2 ай бұрын

I literally cried while watching this. Thank you.

@natanluiza2936 Ай бұрын

The cave wasn't so much of a test as a "getting his feet wet" experience. Luke was having an open vision, interacting with the dark side. The "test" would have been a different vision if he hadn't brought his weapons. Keep that in mind. The vision was an act of the dark side forseeing Luke's success and giving him a false prophecy in the hopes it would convince him to believe he is destined to be sith. Then the dark side could use him to further its will. Prophecy is a part of the force, and Yoda knew Anakin's son was even stronger than them when Yoda was counciling Anakin on his visions.

@silentvoice2776 2 ай бұрын

This video makes me want to see you analysing TCW, TBB, Rebels and Andor. (I don't know if you like them or not. Anyway great video as always)

@JohnSmith-ip6kc 2 ай бұрын

So- ok… I’d like to point out and clarify a little bit about the cave scene. A lot of it was confusing to me, as well, when I was younger, but after watching and reading so much about Star Wars over the years, I think I can confidently explain this scene, and can do it by using the Obi Wan quote that explains how the force exists in everything. Basically, what you have to remember about Luke is that, even though he’s young and reckless and can barely force a lightsaber into his hand, he’s also the son of force Jesus. Anakin was able to use the force almost without effort at the age of 19, during the events of Attack of the Clones, and by 23, Anakin was experiencing Force visions, which was an ability that took most Jedi a long long time to accomplish. Luke almost has that same potential to do all that if he really understood that he had the capability to do so, but, because he’s not yet aware that Anakin is actually Darth Vader, and Luke’s own dad, Luke is set up perfectly to be a clean slate for Yoda’s training. The Force is an energy field, which exists everywhere. It exists not only as a conduit, but also within a space. There’re places where Force energy is stronger and then also places where it’s weaker. The cave that Yoda tests Luke in is one such place where Force energy is strong, but the type of energy is dark side force energy. Yoda’s test for Luke is designed to help Luke understand that if he gives into fighting and defeating that energy with his anger, that not only will it “dominate his destiny”, but that it will also lead him down the same path as his own father. The cave scene is supposed to foreshadow that Luke is related to Vader, in some way, but it’s also actually a force vision that Luke, like his father, was unconsciously experiencing. Yoda knew Luke had his father’s potential. Yoda saw that potential when Luke almost lifted his X-Wing out of the swamp, so when Yoda tested Luke again, in the cave, Yoda wanted Luke to understand that if Luke approached the problem he was going to face with brute force and in anger, that it was going to cost Luke his future, his potential, and his success in destroying the empire

@bowwing333 2 ай бұрын

You all do not understand Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru at all if you think they are cold and uncaring.

@PenguinLord10 2 ай бұрын

It's not unreasonable to characterize Owen as cold. He's gruff and has a stern demeanor, especially compared to the other important male character at that point, Obi Wan. He's not uncaring though, that's true. He does what he does to keep Luke out of trouble. It's more like the parent of a teenager going through a rebellious phase.

@Notsogoodguitarguy 2 ай бұрын

I don't think Owen was cold. He was stern when it came to the subject of Anakin and was trying to conceal it, but I wouldn't call him cold, especially when we see little to no interaction outside that subject.

@lumbagoboi1649 2 ай бұрын

Owen had a point. I wouldn't want to see my kid run off and join some galactic war as imperial cannon fodder. It's only by chance that Luke doesn't go to the imperial academy and instead joins the rebs and is saved by the force multiple times. Owen simply couldn't have known any of that would happen. He just saw war and chaos off world and wanted to look out for his kid like any parent.

@tylermacgregor1320 2 ай бұрын

He’s talking more from Luke’s point of view. Obviously we know in Owen’s mind he’s just protecting him from the dangers of the galaxy, from the Empire, Darth Vader, all the conflict Obi-wan would bring. But in Luke’s mind, he’s emblematic of his isolation there. Like that one Robin Williams quote, worse than being alone is to be surrounded by people who make you feel alone.

@Morganlord-hc7wz 2 ай бұрын

I love watching your videos. Every time I watch them I have a new appreciation for whatever movie/show you’re covering.

@river. 2 ай бұрын

"Pretend new starwars doesn't exist" ~Schnee 2024

@Notsogoodguitarguy 2 ай бұрын

What new Star Wars?

@Kaede-Sasaki 2 ай бұрын

Imagine if star wars was in story-chronological order Starting in 1977

@DoctorXXIV 4 күн бұрын

This was incredible. This is why i love your channel

@Kami_Jojo 2 ай бұрын

I feel for Yoda because sometimes it's really not the teacher's fault. Sometimes, the student really isn't ready to put in the demands it takes to actually be one of the best at something and thats not about teaching Adventure? Heh. Excitement? Heh. Luke didn't really care about bringing balance to the Force. He couldn't comprehend what it meant. He just wanted to make friends and fight bad guys

@petrius658 Ай бұрын

This video is so profound, the last 10 minutes is incredible

@4125tech 2 ай бұрын

The best written video essay I've seen in months and a refreshingly non toxic take on Star Wars. KZbin needs so much more of this.

@l24ub 2 ай бұрын

I'm eating salt & vinegar chips to this lol

@troyfiss9332 Ай бұрын

This was a refreshing video on an idea that I thought might be forgotten or consciously ignored, that Jedi are laser-samurais or maybe space-templars, and that's cool and flashy, but the whole point is a moral one, that they serve the good. Also to not put too much vinegar in cupcakes. A little goes a long way, in say a red velvet, but don't go crazy.

@Bonko78 Ай бұрын

Beautifully put. The point about aspirational stories is very important today. So many hero stories are cynical and often showing anti-heroes because implicitly we can't relate to actual heroes. Even though there are probably many movie makers who would agree with everything said in this video, Disney just aren't likely to hire them. At best, they hire people who think jedi are superheroes and the force is a superpower. At worst, they hire people who can't stand heroism, who only want to see heroes fall.

@NightWing1800 2 ай бұрын

I think this view of Jedi also fits really well into what the stuff that came shortly after then used as the flaws of the Jedi. In the prequels why do we see the Palpatine rise? Because the Jedi were being judgmental and they were lacking in compassion. Their role as essentially galactic police made them stray from their spirituality and so they couldn't empathize with who they believed to be the chosen one from the prophecy, a concept that already goes against the idea of connection of all life by setting him apart, enough to deal with a kid mourning his mother and growing to fear losing his loved ones, understanding his love and connection with Padme enough to teach him to love without falling to the dark side, and not enough to where they would take the sith threat they were hearing about seriously before Palatines plans began to come to fruition. They got caught up in their status as Jedi, their status setting them apart from everyone, and because they were Jedi they were right and good and wise and if their were Sith, they'd know about it. Meanwhile in the Kotor games, which goes heavily into deconstructing the light and dark side, we again see the Jedi fail when they stop being compassionate and stop being humble enough to see themselves as one with everyone and instead grow arrogant and believe themselves special in some way. Revan goes to fight the Mandalorian because they Jedi are being too passive and letting people die, and he continues his path to the dark side not because he loves war and violence and loses his compassion, but because he recognizes a greater threat the current Jedi wouldn't be willing to handle and he gets in this headspace of "I am the one person who sees this big picture and has to stop them. Just me and I will manipulate things to minimize harm and make us strong." Kreia criticism of the Jedi masters also touches on this when she confronts them when she says that one of the masters was so close to giving up the force because he was on a planet so teeming with life. She frames this as the Jedi clinging on to the force and their status as a way that pulls them further away from others, because if they truly were in tune with all things they would see the cyclical nature of all things and would be abhorred as she was. If they were truly compassionate, they would be able to see things from the sith's perspective enough to understand things in the dark side that they refuse to see because they're dogmatic and afraid. In these two pieces of Star Wars fiction that show us where the Jedi fail, at what point you stop being a Jedi even if you are a master and lead the order, it's that you stop having a calm, controlled, and serene sense of self that lets you connect with others and be compassionate and see through the illusions of division. You stop being a Jedi when you sit in your ego and it becomes about you, the individual, and your status and identity as a Jedi.

@LordVader1094 2 ай бұрын

And sadly that entire analysis of the Jedi isn't actually how they are in the prequels, nor as conceptualized by Lucas. They basically got retconned into being that way in the past 10 or so years. Palpatine didn't need that to win, he was just very smart and bided his time. He had the advantage of building on 1000 years of secret sith manipulations too. The prequel Jedi's rules were well founded, logical, and in the end were proven undeniably right, simple as. It's not the Jedi's fault that Anakin failed to learn and use them despite them making every effort for him to understand. The only true mistake the Jedi made was breaking their rules and making an exception for him, specifically because of the respect they had for Qui-gon. But in the end, that worked out too in a roundabout manner.

@NightWing1800 2 ай бұрын

@@LordVader1094 The prequel Jedi definitely werent undeniably right, because people had been poking holes in them since they released. Above board the reason for that is George isnt perfect and makes mistakes. But its much more interesting as a story to take those missteps that people noticed and build on them as part of the world. Like for examples theres scenes where the Jedi lose fights they shouldnt have based on what we see of them, and its much more interesting to say "The galaxy had been at peace for so long that the Jedi stopped training seriously for real combat and they assumed, in spite of the evidence they had, that there was no longer a sith presence to fight" than "George needed them to die in that scene" Its cool to yes and unintentional short comings when they fit into the larger story. Then in the future you write those short comings intentionally, like in the clone wars where Windu makes the same mistake with Asoka as he does Anakin.

@Allronix 2 ай бұрын

Speaking of the KOTOR games, it was a telling choice on Bioware's part that the party members who had the highest alignment score were NOT Jedi, but two relatively "ordinary" citizens; Carth and Mission. It also started the game with another citizen-soldier (Trask Ulgo) aiding and sacrificing himself to get Revan to safety. Without to help of these "ordinary" people, the biggest Force wielder of that era would have been dead on the Endar Spire or eaten by rakghouls. The Jedi of the KOTOR era are very much of the "above and apart" mindset. Bastila is what they want; conscripted as a child, powerful with the Force (especially a power that lets her decide who lives and who dies from afar), says all the right words (it doesn't matter if she can't fully believe them), and looks at the people who aren't wielding Force as lesser beings it's an obligation to care for, not equals. She gets back to the apartment and instantly starts throwing her weight around. She also is super rude and patronizing to Carth (and if inclined to go there? Remember how the Jedi were using Carth's home planet as a dumpsite?! Yikes!), and trips Mission with the Force after Mission asks a valid (albeit kinda childish) question. This whole theme of not treating the ordinary people very well keeps up on Dantooine where a miniature version of the Mandalorian Wars rages in their backyard for months. Yet, how does Revan succeed? By doing a lot of small acts of good (or cruelty) around the galaxy. By working with a crew, and aiding them with their broken connections (Carth's son, Mission's brother, Bastila's mom, Zaalbar's crazy family drama). Even the climatic "now or never" decision as far as alignment is not made alone, but choosing between your team members. And if you go Light, you can bring Bastila back through romantic or platonic love, depending on your character. Or, if you botch it, Bastila chooses to sever the connections entirely in favor of isolating power and dies. In the context of this video, Malak's declaration "Savior, conqueror, hero, villain. You are all things, Revan... and yet you are nothing. In the end, you belong to neither the light nor the darkness. You will forever stand alone," isn't an acknowledgement of Revan's badass status - it's a cruel taunt.

@crystalqueen3601 2 ай бұрын

I've been into star wars since I was a kid (I met Kenny Baker when I was a literal infant), but recently I discovered a friend of mine had never watched it and also has no idea about ANYTHING except the whole "Luke i am your father" and it is really eye opening seeing his reactions to star wars! this look into star wars starting from the beginning, with no meta of the future is so insightful

@hilasup 2 ай бұрын

Thank you! It felt so good to watch the vid and remember the old Star Wars that I love so much.

@TheCatsLibrary_1 2 ай бұрын

One of the flaws in modern movies, that people in analysis videos tend to point out, is that the characters don't face consequences for their actions or don't have flaws that would require consequences. Why are consequences/suffering important to a story? What defines good suffering from something for the author to get out anger issues? What does that mean for Spiderverse?

@justadude3789 2 ай бұрын

Consequences in stories is all about managing stakes. It keeps the events and the world feeling real because their are results to the actions and inactions the characters take. It's what gives the drama and the conflict emotional power. It's why using "Deus ex Machina" in a story is a big no no. Because why are we the audience supposed to care when any problem the hero faces can be swiped away as if it was never there. Or vice versa where logically the hero should win yet to keep the story going the antagonist pulls an ability or previously unknown resources out of nowhere. There's also a sense of justice that we all like in stories where we want to see characters get what they deserve. Whether that be good, bad, big or small. We like to see bad behavior or characteristics be punished and good behavior/characteristics be rewarded, at least in the end. Like with the Light Side and the Dark Sides for example. Sure the light side is a harder more arduous path, but in the end it's more fulfilling. Whereas the Dark Side is a quick easy path to power, but in the end it fills you empty always wanting more. Now imagine if the light side was the still long and arduous but never fulfilling, whereas the dark side was quick, easy, and always rewarding. Wouldn't you feel cheated in a way. This is the point of consequences in story telling to keep the world feeling real, keep the drama and stakes powerful, and give the audience a sense of fairness. Of course these can be played with and twisted for different narrative power. Like the sense of fairness for example. However it's best to know why a rule is a thing before you try and break it.

@monthc Ай бұрын

This video is such a breath of fresh air omg. Thank you, thank you, for understanding Star Wars on this level and articulating all of this.

@tangero3462 14 күн бұрын

Fantastic perspective, I think you really nailed it

@akselsrensen3935 Ай бұрын

0:46 the what people?

@Cjak001 Ай бұрын

He said the vinegar cupcake people

@atomicnectar 2 ай бұрын

I LOVED THIS PLS keep doing more star wars talks it's so refreshing to here how positive your are about the jedi. Dark times my friend these are dark times May the Force be with You ALWAYS