What Makes a Leica a Leica? The Leica SL Review Three Years After Launch, Part 2

Is the Leica SL a "real" Leica? What does that question even mean? My answer may be very different from yours. In this episode, we go deep into Leica's history. There is a LOT of it, some familiar, some surprisingly not. More episodes coming!
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[@85Dragonball]

oh man.. i honestly just wanted to click into this video and listen for a minute or something but you made it sooo interesting! I couldn't turn it off!! Great video and great way of storytelling!! It's so good that you're recording everything in one piece without any of these annoying jump cuts. I think that's what made it so much better.

[@3BMEP]

Hah! Glad to confound your goal. :)

[@stephenscharf6293]

That's because Hugh's videos are exceptionally well-planned and executed, but more importantly, his thinking process and comments providing that thing that lets us have informed thinking, called "insight" is compeletely fleshed out as a "functional script" before he rolls the camera.

[@eastondominik292]

I guess it is kinda randomly asking but do anyone know a good website to watch newly released tv shows online?

[@diordrama]

Your videos are the literally the BEST reviews and discussion about cameras and photography on KZbin. I always look forward to them. So thoughtful and intelligent and well organised.

[@stephenscharf6293]

100% agree! Its like "intellectual comfort food"! Ha!

[@MiahandKitty]

I enjoy your videos! Your way of storytelling coupled with your voice just keeps me tuned. Keep it up!

[@lifetimesofamultiplemediam1003]

WOW!… this guy had me on the edge of my seat!… I don't even know why!… I mean I shoot a Canon 5d mk2 for Pete Sake!…

[@adrianricardo100]

My Admiration paused video at 4:55 . The context that You just gave is precise and beautiful. Thanks

[@3BMEP]

Ricardo Mora Thank YOU!

[@josecolon8143]

Sorry posted a comment in the wrong language. For some reason can’t delegated it (may be bcs I’m at the office computer). Here is what I was trying to write in English: I am very impressed by your very eloquent explanation of what makes a Leica! Thank you for teaching!

[@floriangodovits5166]

Best Storytelling AND Best Sound (not to mention the Voice!) of any Photography-KZbinr out there. And that says something.

[@3BMEP]

😊🙏🏻🖖🏻

[@DaneBrammage]

Hugh, I never really understood the esoteric features of Leica until I had the opportunity to shoot with one (an SL2) and even then not immediately. A few hours later I was reflecting on my experience and it became crystal clear. The camera so beautifully occupied the space between the scene and me as to become an invisible extension of my vision. Now I get it. Thanks for your passion towards Leica and encouraging me to go and experience one for myself. Time to bust open the piggy bank ;-)

[@3BMEP]

Happy to be of service - enjoy!

[@nicholassaephanh4407]

Loving the storytelling style that represents you so well. Have you ever taken on any educational roles? I would love to hear your take on how you would make content specifically for education while adding in current cinematic trends. It's something I've been trying to solve: How to take something inherently text based and make it cinematic/story focused and interesting. I am just asking you specifically because I respect and awe what you do, especially in these times of atmospheric b-roll and shallow depth of story.

[@3BMEP]

First: love that turn of a phrase! Next: thank you so much for your encouragement and kind words. Finally: yes - I was a teaching fellow both as an undergraduate and graduate student; my father was a university professor; and I love learning (which is at LEAST half of what teaching is all about).

[@nicholassaephanh4407]

Yes I teach programming in the SF Bay Area and would love to do something similar to this. Though I find myself not being as interesting nor eloquent. I also feel visual content along with great writing is the future of education.

[@josecolon8143]

Nicholas Saephanh He is in another league, he’s knowledge is simply amazing!

[@3BMEP]

Nicholas Saephanh well, if you ever want a new teacher out there... :)

[@stephenscharf6293]

I can relate to both of what you and Hugh are talking about, because I spent the last decade of my professional scientific career teaching as well, except it was Voice of the Customer and Design for Six Sigma for technical product development (in corporate biotech, specifically) to scientists and engineers. I really love teaching...

[@stephenscharf6293]

Really great piece, Hugh. As a Voice of the Customer professional, I really appreciated how you discussed that the Leica's design inspiration was driven by a clear and unambiguous user need to....solve a problem. That alone is a very key attribute for successful product development. Also loved the Bauhaus design tie-in of form following function as the result of a very clearly understood and realized "design embodiment". Cheers, Stephen.

[@3BMEP]

Stephen Scharf Stephen, I always enjoy your contributions. Thank you for joining in.

[@stephenscharf6293]

Thanks, Hugh!

[@ccbphoto]

Dear Hugh, Despite the fact that I do not give a crap ( noun. usually vulgar. syn. Feces) about the enormously expensive cameras you review, save the Sony A7iii, I adore your videos because of their plodding gate and the mellifluousness of your voice. It’s such a nice and welcome change from the hyper, gyrating videos produced by the Millennials. Keep up the excellent work for the camera community and the entirety of mankind!

[@glenncharles6622]

Love your videos, and this one does not disappoint. As a lover of Leica, I learned a great deal. Thanks!!

[@3BMEP]

Glenn Charles Thank YOU!

[@davidwendelrobinson]

Fascinating Story. Been taking photos for more then 50 years and a bit of a fan of photographic history. This was all new to me though. Loved it.

[@3BMEP]

David Robinson So glad you enjoyed it!

[@SKLAD_UMA_18]

Nice speech! Clear, step-by-step, logically structured... etc. I could even say more: when I need a sample of how to build your perfomance with a simple and healthy minimalism but in a very strong internal energy along in contrast with its wrap (what seem... or seems... or maybe... - never judge the book by its cover, huh? :) - I always recommend these videos. YOUR videos, man! Which essence I can define in just a bell of a word - "the humble charm of wisdom". Cheers! Bless you!

[@Pulsonar]

I give the highest award that for this production - The Pulsonar prize, for achieving the elusive 3Ps: Poised, Polished, Perfection. You thoroughly deserve it, this is the pinnacle of your media career well done.

[@3BMEP]

Pulsonar So glad you enjoyed it!

[@saymyname218]

This is just fascinating and Great narration by the way .....I love the quality of Leica camera`s ...I bought a 111a film camera ( 1936 ) and took it to the Le mans classic race ...I could not help but wonder if this camera had taken shots of the same cars before and in a different time

[@williammobbs3502]

As you know Hugh I am a huge fan of your videos. Being the proud owner of a Leica SL2 (35mm Film) camera, which I purchased in about 1976 I can completely understand and appreciate what you mean about the Leica camera's DNA. I also own a copy of the Leica Manual 15th Edition by Morgan & Morgan, which corroborates much of what you explain in your history lesson of Leica. Having high-end Canon cameras (1DX, 5D etc with many lenses) and now Panasonic GH4, GH5 and G9 with Leica lenses I can honestly say I still get great enjoyment when I get the Leica SL2 out for brief encounters. It's the tactile feel and the shutter sounds, which in my opinion are like no other. It saddens me that Leica cameras are so cost prohibitive these days and in my humble opinion lagging behind in technical innovations and merit. It is a far cry from whence they came as outlined in your video. Thank you Hugh for your outstanding contribution to those of us who have an insatiable thirst and appetite of all things photographic.

[@lucasdallecrode6376]

Hello!!! I still remember the video where they put the leica sl in your hands! Your eyes and gestures said everything! Thanks for the work you share. I'm still in love with the leica sl, I could only try it with canon L lenses. Beautiful experience !!! Leave the plastic for a moment and have a premium body in hand. Thanks again and greetings from Argentina.

[@3BMEP]

Lucas Dalle Crode Stunned and humbled that you remember!

[@lucasdallecrode6376]

LOL!!!! I even remember your expression in a low voice to the camera ... I love it ... or something like that !!!! It was a good review of the camera's specifications and it was the first one I saw.

[@eandrade672]

Well produced content... elequent, well researched.... best leica review ...

[@VariTimo]

Love that video. Knew all that stuff already but the way you tell it is so enjoyable. I stoped shooting digital photos for the most part and now shoot on an M5. Just got myself the Canon 50mm f1.4 LTM wich is do gorgeous! It has all the flaws I want like some slight barrel distortion (wich gives the image some nice three dimensionality and I’m a sucker for anamorphics so that’s a nice parallel). It flares so beautifully, it’s very very slightly dreamy at f1.4 but very sharp and contrasty for f2. The rendering and color rendition is superb for a lens of its time. And it handles so well with an ergonomically superior focusing ring to the once from Leica. Maybe even more conferences inspiring to those of today.

[@3BMEP]

VariTimo The M5 is apparently a bit of a polarizing camera. But you like it?

[@blazintommydblazintommyd4416]

I viewed La Notte the other night - there's a brief scene where Marcello is speaking with the Industrialist; the latter say something like, don't worry about the money, I never did, the money's always there, worry about what it is you want to do. That was an issue of that time, the old giving way to the new. La Dolce Vita explored it more. It is amazing regarding the devolopment given the circumstances of the times or so we see from our Brave New World viewpoint - cool. Your vids are awesome ♥♥ :)

[@Chris-wj4ze]

La Notte is a great movie and Michelangelo Antonioni was a great artist. Leicas are overpriced and the German camera industry is pretty much resting on its laurels. You have better options. Have a nice day.

[@mks0]

thanks for a pretty nuanced insight into of the history of leica, which, arguably, is pretty intertwined with the history of photography itself

[@ryanvacation7319]

The time that I typed this, Leica seems to be the only company that offers full frame range finder style digital cameras. The M series and the Q. The other camera companies have only crop sensors in their rangefinder style offerings.

[@3BMEP]

Ryan Villanueva Good point!

[@douggottlieb]

Wow! Fantastic videos on Leica. Thanks for creating these

[@3BMEP]

Douglas Gottlieb so happy you enjoy them!

[@JohnArmstrongMillar]

can't wait for part 3. very engaging..

[@anthonyakana4518]

What a beautiful conversation .

[@Jez1963UK]

Yessssss! 4:38s and that famous phrase came in....... made my day :) And then again..... at 10:01s :))))

[@OAK77uk]

Great Hugh, thoroughly enjoyed the DNA speculative of Leica and how much I Lika the Leica... never got over my IIIF RD DA back in the 1960s - in those days as these Leica Lenses were expensive from the soft Summicron to the Elmarit et al. A workaround for me coming through a gamut of learning from the Canon FTQL to Leica before the heraldic move to Rollei 2.8F Planar and the pre children mind rage of mortgaging myself on a Hassel - like all mortgages and the venture into family entertainment - the Hassel gave way to a close cousin, names now long forgotten but 'hold that thought' - the workaround - Ruskkie influenced, from the Eastern Bloc, Zorki lenses... albeit a workaround - some stunning pics ensued & I loved the early Zorki's having had several of the bodies up to the Zorki 4... however where East meets West and who was whom and the whys and what wherefores... you've triggered some long lost, deeply buried memories - as always - thank you and keep on keeping on. Now about Part 3 - you're not going to go all modern are you? 😇 Michael /OAK77uk Tweeted out for you - Twitter.com/OAK77uk

[@3BMEP]

Michael Dixon Oh! Just saw. Thank you, Michael. FT-QL was the first real camera I bought (with help from my dad).

[@jimhansen9233]

When will you post Part 3? Did anyone come up with the font name?

[@3BMEP]

Trying to get it out tomorrow afternoon or Friday AM. No, no one has come back with a positive ID on the font!

[@NetvoTV]

If money isn’t an issue, will you choose Leica CL/M10 or Lumix GX9 as your first camera for long?

[@3BMEP]

NETVO TV If money weren’t an issue for whom? If you’re asking for a recommendation for yourself, you first have to ask what you want to shoot; what are your priorities; where are you in your imaging journey, etc. if you enjoy shooting with manual focus only; will only ever shoot between, say, 35mm and 90mm; shoot stills only; derive pleasure from the tactile quality of the gear you hold: are inspired by and are a student of the history of photography, specific photographers and specific images; don’t need to preview your image in real time: derive pleasure from rangefinder focusing; want a simple software interface: don't mind the absence of in-body-image stabilization; and want the best image quality of the three, the M10 is your answer. If you want the Leica heritage, industrial design and menu but in an even smaller package; do want to preview your image with a WYSIWYG EVF; don’t mind a slight penalty in image quality that comes from the smaller APS-C sensor; don’t mind the slightly deeper depth of field and narrower field view that comes with that sensor for a given focal length; want autofocus; do not weight as highly the classic Leica M lens experience (though you can always adapt them); generally prefer newer, fly by wire AF lenses; want a wider selection of AF lenses and do want to shoot outside 35-90 FF equivalents: and don’t want to shoot video, the CL is your answer. Otherwise, the GX9 is a stellar little jewel of a camera with access to most every lens ever made through adapters including Leica mount, and may actually do a better job simulating classic black and white imagery. It will be the worst in low light, however. Now - if you’re asking me what I’d like for my birthday, it would be the M10 with 35, 50 and 90 Summicrons. :) EDITED TO ADD: I do want to write one more thing, in all seriousness: if this is a gift for a young person or a person not of independent means, I urge you NOT to start him or her with an M10. Or even a Leica. If this is a gift for a person new to photography, I urge you NOT to start him or her with a Leica either. Not because they're too complicated, but because I don't believe one can appreciate what they are -- and it is easy to appreciate what they are NOT -- if one does not have a certain level of experience and maturity about material things.

[@NetvoTV]

Three Blind Men and An Elephant Productions well, I love Leica M experiences, the aperture ring, shutter speed dial, manual rangefinder focusing experiences, sad that most camera manufacturers switch to the spinning rings for those function, no one try to bring that experiences to a cheap body so more people can access that M experiences, I’m sure it will sell well if someone do. GX9 is great but if it has shutter speed dial like Fuji doesn’t then it’s no brainier for me since it’s good for video too and there’s IBS and more lens choices. I tried the CL and it sure scream solid and quality in your hands, but what pulling me off is the limited TL native lens, and no aperture ring or shutter speed dial, but take away this 2 “down sides”, it sure is a good experiences camera. But if money is no problem again, my first choice is Leica M10 with 21/28/35(sad there’s no zoom lens), GX9 with Leica 15/12-60/8-18 and last choice is CL

[@3BMEP]

So now that we are I agreement, what are you going to do?

[@NetvoTV]

Three Blind Men and An Elephant Productions by the way, about the CL/TL system, it always looks like a casual camera system for the rich who just shoot daily or casual photo, this statement even truer if you check out Facebook CL group, and compare what and how they shoot to a Leica M/Q group. Like those user doesn’t know how to take art, and people who do use it for real work only use the 35mm F1.4 lens, Leica don’t make any “serious” lens, only those casual use lenses, this maybe is one of the reason no real photography I’ve to this system for serious work. Imagine a Plastic/Aluminium cheap robot made Leica M/Leica M wannabe, how big the market is!

[@NetvoTV]

Three Blind Men and An Elephant Productions 2 cases, first is limited money sources, will get GX9 bcuz it’s more practical since cover both photo and video, if I win lottery then I will get Leica M10!

[@josecolon8143]

Being with you for at least 8 hrs, will definitely provides a behemoth of knowledge comparable to that of a graduate degree!

[@3BMEP]

julio hernandez Hah! I’m reading Behemoth right now - the history of large factories...

[@josecolon8143]

Three Blind Men and An Elephant Productions 😊

[@brunoexclusive9189]

Question, are you doing something with mousse?

[@dunnymonster]

I do find Leica interesting. I'm under no illusion that the Leica digital of today doesn't have the kudos of its film cameras that to this day remain legandary. That said there is is " something " indearing about the brand and whilst I personally can't afford to buy into it I do kind of " get " the aspiration to own it. Now of course even if money were no object, I can purchase any number of cameras today that would outperform essentially any digital Leica for considerably less money. That much is not in doubt. Of course I can buy a Casio watch that keeps perfect time but hey, it's never going to be a Rolex now is it? I recently visited the Leica store in Manchester UK and it was a good experience. Before I entered I thought I'd be met with an uppty snobbery, the like of which I've experienced from Leica owners, but you know what...nothing could be further from the truth. The staff were friendly and unassuming, but also self aware. Make no mistake, Leica know their customer base, they know their gear ain't cheap and rightly play on the legacy and pride of ownership their brand illicits. But I was never made to feel like I didn't belong there, yes this lowly Nikon shooter felt a kinship, we were just a bunch of guys who all like taking pictures. Now I don't own any Leica gear but that tiny bit of aspiration gripped me. I don't have the mega bucks to buy any of their cameras or lenses but you know what, I bought a £15 camera strap ( for one of their Soffort instant cameras ) and a 10 pack of Leica Instax B&W instant film, both intended for my Fujifilm Instax mini 90 Neo Classic. So I left the shop ( with my snazzy designer Leica bag ) with my tiny selection of Leica items, so I guess that makes me a paid up member of the elite club....well maybe not but humour me lol. So what did this experience leave me with? Well if I'm ever fortunate enough to have a huge disposable income, you know what, I'll buy me a Leica camera....just because I can 😊 Maybe, just maybe I'll understand what all the fuss is about, maybe they really are that magical! Or maybe I'll just convince myself it's the best photographic experience I've ever had, heck it'd be the most expensive photographic experience I'd ever had!! Anyway Hugh, excellent insight into Leica, your poetic tones kept me gripped throughout. Oh and by the way, I'm holding so many thoughts I'm getting biceps like Arnie 😋

[@3BMEP]

dunnymonster I always appreciate and enjoy your commentary. Stay tuned!

[@thisislife9911]

as a german guy i like the recovery of leica, it doesnt look to good about the begin on the digital sensors.

[@BarryMaskell]

Leica is a Leica is a Panasonic - What’s in a name “Others are rebranded as Leica cameras with different cosmetic stylings. Leica had a similar relationship with Minolta in the past, where late model Leica SLRs (and some 35 mm point-and-shoot models) were strongly based on Minolta bodies”. Panasonic produces most of Leica's branded digital point and shoot cameras in Japan, but not film cameras. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumix

[@3BMEP]

Stay tuned!

[@BarryMaskell]

Always creates some comments ... Leica is more than a Panasonic but some of the entry level models share technologies thats for sure - Optics are a bid deal and Leica has its own look thats for sure - that "Leica Look"

[@ropersix]

Yes, and Hasselblad had to rebrand a Fuji for their 645 H1 film camera. The post-WWII global economy and finance changed everything, and will continue to do so. Witness the very cheap Chinese lenses, flashes, etc, on the market today.

[@stephenporter101]

What's with the overt Jeff Goldblum impression?

[@joevenuti1797]

I had to check the comments to make sure I wasn't the only one who thought the same thing. And its not just the voice, but also the stares off in space and breaks. Definitely the cadence of A Goldblum :)

[@d.y.358]

A: The cost. In money and in limitations. Which is why it's so good.

[@OlegKorzun]

I wish it was 5 minutes in length and used more B-roll to illustrate the subject. Otherwise, great story telling.

[@twatjerk]

Don’t let this guy anywhere near your GF

[@eastgreenlander5016]

Wonderful talk. I enjoyed that leica historic run through

[@killahbong]

Now i understand what leica experience means 😉 I used a leica x2. Everytime i go shoot for street photo it gave me not only a retro feel but superbe pictures. My Instagram © MikeC Just to show critics that better camera doesn't make you a good photographer.

[@BilBrown]

Dr. Kaufman couldn't say it better!

[@3BMEP]

Would love to meet the man -- meet the whole team, actually.

[@johnhjic2]

What an interesting video, thanks.

[@vicibox]

Fantastic video Hugh, loved it. Yes the DNA is vital and is fundamental to where Leica is now; their innovation in management and their humility. The popular camera fanboy assumption is of elitism and arrogance. Well no here you are talking about Nikon and that is why they are where they are, virtually bankrupt and certainly bankrupt of ideas. No Leica has no qualms about opening up to new ideas from Bauhaus to electronics; innovation is always key, without change you die. The essential thread is precision which they have never lost and all their products are made like swiss watches. They and Hasselblad alone of the old guard has seen that the future of photography is electronic. Whilst the masses go out of their way to clone retro Leica (goodness I hate retro but then I am a scientist), Leica has commisioned AUDI to design cameras for the future and made strong aliances with Panasonic and their stablemate military high tech sensor designer TowerJazz. Whilst the D5 is a bloated disgrace set next to the F3, the M10 is the same size and erganomics of the M6 and made to the same standard. That is attention to design and detail. With the SL, Leica tore up the book and started with a fresh playing field and teh result is stunning. Alas a tad out of my needs. I have settled on the T range, which takes all my old Nikkor primes with an adapter and my new Panasonic GX9 (gosh I am loving this camera) with cheaper yet still excellent lenses with the Leica influence clear. Both of my cameras are truely modern, beautiful and a joy to use. They come from collaboration and innovation which no single company can now achieve alone. Leica leads the way with a grateful panasonic benefitting in its wake. The 2020s will be fully electronic and Leica will be at the centre of it, wherever you look you see their influence. I have never regretted switching to Leica and Panasonic after a lifetime of SLRs, for me its a win win and an adventure, gosh I love adventure ;-)

[@3BMEP]

Vici Martynov I love YOUR journey and your perspective. GX9 is a fantastic little camera and absolutely reminded me of a Leica.

[@srkgv]

What's the Leica Font? Anyone

[@sotocine99]

Best wishes from Wetzlar.

[@3BMEP]

Soto Cine Thanks. Will have to make it over there at some point!

[@BboyGraphicx]

Great video

[@sayharris1361]

Did you go to RISD🤔

[@3BMEP]

Cornell and Wharton. 😊

[@SaddyTrue]

I always wanted a Leica, I just counldn't justify the cost. I currently shooting with Canon gear.

[@3BMEP]

If Canon works for you, that's all that matters!

[@babikova123]

GREAT THANKS

[@richardt1792]

I have 5 Leica cameras, all film cameras. I have not made the leap to digital Leicas. The technology changes way too fast for me.

[@3BMEP]

Hey, what works for you is all that matters! My question to you: what glass?

[@richardt1792]

@@3BMEP My IIf has a Summarit 50mm f1.5, my M3 had a collapsible Summicron 50mm f2.0, & 135mm Elmar f4. for my SLR's (R3 and R4) I have a 60mm macro Elmarit-R f2.8 and a 80-200mm Elmar R f4. I also have a Tamron adapter that allow me to adapt all the Tamron lenses from 17mm to a 200-500mm to any Leica body. I also found a Leica 110 camera with case and chain. I am a bit of a value shopper. I like quality but since photography is a hobby, I stay on a budget. All told, I spent less than $1000. for all this gear.

[@3BMEP]

Outstanding!

[@mrpwd7322]

Great history lesson

[@MontageProduction]

Great story

[@andrewfrost8866]

What an excellent, informative, and wonderfully presented presentation.. Fascinating.

[@3BMEP]

Andrew Frost so glad you enjoyed it!

[@flappospammo]

Magical

[@lins-barrosomarcusvalerio422]

🥇

[@streetphotography.globetro7744]

Thats why Leica is the only camera with SOUL.

[@Chris-wj4ze]

No-one who has any real appreciation of photography or any knowledge about its history would say that.

[@TheMarsgia]

Dude thatLeica Mechanic looks like you

[@jeansicard3517]

sensitive and rich!

[@Sabundy]

What makes a Leica a Leica? The price! 😅

[@Rationalific]

Leica is a lot like Modern Art and Modern Architecture. It is artificially profound. A rip-off for what you get. A brazen assault on appropriateness. Eloquent words trump actual merit. Unworthy of any consideration by the masses unless they can be swayed by an adept salesman that the emperor is, indeed, wearing clothes that they are too inferior to see. It is so expensive...so there MUST be something to it...right?

[@3BMEP]

Rationalific l understand your perspective. But don’t you think that at least half of art is what each of us brings to the viewing of it - whatever it is? I certainly agree that there is a lot of modern art or architecture that doesn’t work for me personally, but that is quite different from a universal condemnation of the entirety of it.

[@Rationalific]

Thank you for responding. I think that to some extent, art is in the eye of the beholder, as you are alluding to. However, I feel that some people are misguided and believe that they must see merit where none (or little) exists. For example, I heard a story of a case where someone left a pair of eyeglasses on the floor of a Modern art museum. Later, people gathered around it and "ooh"ed and "aww"ed over the brilliance of such a simple yet profound work of art. (In reality random person just left glasses on the floor...) If the joke had gone on, don't you think that those glasses...that work of "art"...could have commanded a high price? Maybe remove the floor tile it was sitting on and put it under glass, and a $150 pair of sunglasses could command hundreds of thousands of dollars on the auction block. So maybe some things really shouldn't just be in the eyes of the beholders, as a lot of beholders see something profound in something that is less worthy, as long as they find someone else to start gawking at it first. Concerning modern architecture, the "brilliant" Le Corbusier (who wanted to knock down a large chunk of traditional Paris to make way for soul-less blocky highrises) created "Villa Savoye" upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/3c/VillaSavoye.jpg Villa Savoye has received a lot of praise by those who deem their tastes to be above that of the common man/woman...but just look at it. That won awards and is a "national treasure"...because some high-highfalutin person said it was great. I have seen Wal-Mart supercenters with much more character. Usually, I don't mind if people fall for tricks and get ripped off. If they are happy in their own minds, so be it. It's not for me to say what they should get, because sometimes, it's not about actual performance to them. I do mind with architecture, as the 1950s to the 1970s in particular destroyed a lot of our cities. (Compare New York's demolished "Old Penn Station" to the modern "Penn Station" that replaced it, for example.) With a Leica, it's not the end of the world...unless it ever got so popular that I'd have to give up my features and ergonomics of far better cameras, all for triple the price of what a better camera would cost. Some people say, "You're just angry because you can't afford one." But that's not the point, as even if I could afford one, I would still look elsewhere and just buy a second camera and an assortment of new lenses for the same price (or save for retirement). In the end, because of its price, it will remain a niche product. And if rich people don't mind paying for "German design" (exclusive to "ubermensch"?), then so be it. They can be happy doing that. I do deep down believe, though, that like the "Wizard of Oz", Leica is a company that is deathly afraid that someone, at some point, will pull back the curtain and expose them as (in the year 2018, at least) just another camera company, with specs that can be had for 1/3rd the price elsewhere (while also lacking some advantages of some cheaper rivals). That's why it's all about the "feeling" of a Leica...because objective tests alone cannot support such prices. No offense, though. You are very eloquent. The history (even if all of those people are long since dead and buried) is quite fascinating. And I know that you like other cameras as well. I'm sure that Leica owners will enjoy your poetic review of their preferred brand.

[@jas_bataille]

I don't think that's how Leica users see things. It's not "there must be something to it"; it's more like, you pay for a Leica to *get that something*... I don't own a Leica, I'm an Olympus guy but there is a feel in the camera having this premium build-quality and the buttons and dials that's like... I don't get this kind of connection with a standard DSLR. Never did. I don't think, too, that Leicas are bough by "rich people". Leica photographers I know saved their money for a long time before they could afford it, and they *stay with one camera much, much longer than the average photographer*. There is a timeless feel to a camera like that... just like I use manual lenses - I use them also because the older ones are mostly inexpensive these days, bargain for great glass - have this beautiful genuine quality that I just don't find in almost any modern AF lenses. It's not bollock : I won't pay 2000$ upward for a lens made from damn plastic...! Also, I think you are going a fair tad bit far with your "Leica-Modern art" comparison... I mean, we all know Leica makes amazing camera. And we all know that a pair of sunglasses left on the ground of a museum is NOT a fantastic work of art. See? Leica make fantastic cameras - whether they are overpriced or not is another debate. They might not be boasting all of the latest technology, but they are made for manual shooters, and in that regards, the optical quality and *confort and feel* of their cameras - which is much more important to me than the latest 160 points AF and what not this type of features being waaaay overrated IMHO - are premium. Premium as to justify the price? Perhaps not. But, it's a ridiculous comparison you did, with all due respect.

[@Rationalific]

+Jas Bataille: Well, you say that people pay for Leicas to "get that something", whereas I thought people bought it because they believed "there must be something to it". But for me, the cameras do not have that something...so I still think that "that something" exists only within some people's minds. I mean, there might be some people out there who only eat with wooden forks because for them, wooden forks have "that something" that metal and plastic forks don't. It is more common for people to prefer metal forks to plastic forks, because that is often a simple quality issue...but the wood vs metal preference is another thing altogether, regardless of quality. Both metal and wood can be high quality, but wood may just...I don't know...elicit some kind of emotion that they can't get with metal. ...Make some think that "this is pure, REAL eating"? I don't know, but I'm sure that preference exists out there somewhere. If you prefer Leica, I don't think that you're necessarily wrong. You just have different preferences. Yet those preferences will cost you. For me, yes, I would prefer a 693 on-sensor phase detect array coupled with 425 contrast detect points and Eye-AF ability in continuous focus over, say, a digital rangefinder (or in the case of the Leica SL, 529 contrast points with no phase detect points). To me, I see a technical advantage when comparing those. If the superior product costs less money, so much the better. You are somewhat right regarding the Modern Art comparison, as at least Leicas have some substance which is unequivocally present. They do have specs. It's not a cardboard box with cow manure inside it that an "artist" calls a "camera". It IS a camera. And I don't see much of a problem, as the price is very high, and the sales are pretty low...as one would expect. It is a niche product. But I must admit that I do respect companies more for offering great specs at a great value than for offering products that, objectively tested, do not warrant such a high price tag, but are granted that prestige because some people "get that something" from it. But yeah, if some people "get that something" from Leica cameras and no others, and they have saved up enough money and they are really sure that it is worth it for them, go ahead. We all just have to evaluate our purchases for ourselves. We're not all alike, so different products serve different types of customers.

[@garryclarkson9084]

first rule of filmmaking and photography 'show don't tell' a 20 minute talking head video.