What NEEDS To Happen In Season 2

[@KeeperoftheChronicles]

For me, the biggest failure of the first season was the failure to adequately translate the abject horror of what it means to be a male channeler, let alone the Dragon Reborn. I hope that comes across better this season.

[@larryjones558]

Now I’ll have to go back to teotw to see how important this was to the plot.

[@jayb8934]

I think what ruined this is that they made it so that the Dragon Reborn could be female, which they did to further play up the mystery of which of the 5 characters was the Dragon, instead of there only being 3 possibilities. Since the Dragon could have been female, it makes male channelers inherently less special from that alone. It also raises the question of why no particularly powerful Aes Sedai ever become False Dragons themselves. Also, we don't see an insane Lews Therin and the start of the Breaking like we do right off the bat in the books. So it never shows how dangerous a male channeler is to themselves and others,

[@larryjones558]

@@jayb8934 great point about female false dragon. And I thought when Rand mentioned Dragonmont seemed familiar:how? I thought the mountain rose after Lews’ death. (A small bump but did make me wonder about the line)

[@kmicheller24]

Perfectly said, since in the first book, that was what hooked me

[@DrakeBarrow]

​@@jayb8934yeah, if they'd mentioned female False Dragons, that would've been an interesting change. Or the idea that the Tower would have a protocol in place if the Dragon Reborn showed up as a woman (a training program set up, chambers, regalia, and most of all the fact that they'd keep them leashed tighter than any da'mane ever was...but definitely NOT in the same way they'd treat a man).

[@haplozetetic9519]

Ultimately, I think it comes down to 3 things: 1. Amazon didn't allow enough time to tell the story properly, and from what we've heard, meddled in other ways as well. 2. Rafe made some bad choices, changing some fundamental things that could have been better done otherwise, and wasted time on unimportant things. 3. The writers didn't understand the story or the characters well enough (*bears??!!* Good grief!), and seem incapable of translating the story from page to screen. I wouldn't expect writers to be able to match something as complex and subtle a story as WoT, but others have done such things much better, and WoT deserves better writing.

[@fusionev0]

I'm sure more time would be better.. but I'm sure someone with enough skill and care could of got "the soul and spine" (if i remember that quote)of it across...

[@haplozetetic9519]

@@fusionev0 Agreed.

[@larryjones558]

Did I miss bears in the show? Conversations in the work room shouldn’t be shamed. Especially if you’re working on one scene in one episode. Toss out ideas who cares as longs as they don’t make the entire story fall apart.

[@testsignupagain7449]

​@@larryjones558you missed bears in the show because they decided to stick with wolves. For Perrin. 🧐 seriously.

[@haplozetetic9519]

@@larryjones558 Valid point, but writers should know the story better. This is one of the main problems with the show. They either don't know or don't care.

[@viceroy_raygun]

I think the whole "who's the Dragon?" plot from season 1 really killed character development for the Emond's Fielders, for the most part. Rand and Egwene especially felt so boring because of this, and by the end of the season Nynaeve was the only one who truly felt like her book counterpart to me. Hopefully now that Rand knows he's the Dragon we'll see some real development for him and everyone else.

[@NaeBlis]

Agreed

[@Harldin]

The only criticism I have of Nynaeve, is she was far too nice to Mat, maybe Mats actions at the end of E6, will see more of Nynaeve seeing Mat as a delinquent.

[@viceroy_raygun]

@@Harldin That's fair. It certainly not a 100% perfect adaptation of Nynaeve, but even in the books she definitely cares for Mat as strongly as the rest of the gang, even if she's more likely to tell him off most of the time, lol. And we know Mat has a ton of respect for the Wisdom, too.

[@Harldin]

@@viceroy_raygun And both would assault Shayul Gul itself to save the other, one muttering Mat bloody Cauthon, I'm going to box your ears for this and the other, I'm no bloody hero, and the bloody wisdom will box my ears, because I swore while doing so. One of my favourite scenes is when Aviendha told the girls they had Toh towards Mat, because of their attitude after Tear.

[@viceroy_raygun]

@@Harldin Oh yeah, it was so satisfying to see Elayne and Nynaeve put in their place there! If only Egwene had been along to share in that...

[@the_well-known_stranger2275]

Amazon needs to win back book fans, they’re going to convince their non reader friends to watch the show. Their treatment of the books in season 1 burned a lot of bridges with the fandom

[@Novagenesis]

I feel like most book fans enjoyed the show. It's hard to be sure because only extreme views go out of their way to be vocal about the topic. The readers I know in person did not love the show as much as I did, but they still gave it good ratings and committed to watching it until the end. In fact, what I've found is that there's this bell-curve. The biggest reader fans of the show are largely people who learned about WoT from it and started reading it from that, and the lifers like me who know what the "stupid covers" complaint means all the way back to the first editions (and it has nothing to do with art).

[@DB-zp9un]

@@Novagenesis I feel if book fans are being honest, there is no way they could have enjoyed the show as an adaptation of the WoT series.. Or they are just so happy something is out there a dumpster fire would have given the same reaction.. I was SUPER excited and about 5 minutes into the show that changed to abject disappointment. I did watch the season, but kept getting more and more depressed as I did..

[@Novagenesis]

@@DB-zp9un That's a pretty unreasonable take, man. I can see how well-written, well-acted, and how big of fans the showrunners and cast are. Unlike you, I *can* understand why someone might have not enjoyed the show, but considering S1's shockingly good viewership, it's a bit late to pretend it's impossible for a fan to enjoy the show. I AM however curious how you felt at the 5 minute mark that an 8 season show was such a failure to trigger "abject disappointment". But you do you, I guess.

[@DB-zp9un]

@@Novagenesis we'll see if it holds viewership thru s2.. Like I said, I watched them all, so I am part of those numbers.. But I really have no desire or excitement about s2 like I did for s1.. You do you too..

[@GodFirstnl]

@@DB-zp9unI fully agree with you. I'm a diehard book fan, but the show just ain't it. Even from a non-book perspective it's barely above average. Nothing like the books. Let's hope season 2 changes that, but I'm just doubtful. Too many objective errors in s1, like resurrecting Nynaeve, or giving the girls the win over the shadow in ep8. A lot of really cheap choices by the writers team. Some folks on the writers team haven't even read the source material. Like honestly.

[@OlversEars]

Thanks Naebs. You hit most of the main topics. I would also like the addition of more intrigue. The antagonists need to be cunning and truly dangerous. Our protagonists need to be realistically reactive and making mistakes. As Rafe indicated, there will be much more character development this season which you focused on.

[@nikolaitodorov1234]

So I just wanted to share my opinion: I started watching the show having 0 knowledge of the books and I almost quit it on the cold open with the red sisters but I decided to give the season a chance. From a non book reader perspective I think it did a decent job at explaining things and immersing me in the world. When it ended I realized I was actually invested in the story and started the books (atm I’m reading knife of dreams). Tldr: the show is far from perfect but it was interesting enough to make a non book reader invest himself into 11 books and probably finish the entire story, so maybe we can try to be less negative and enjoy the positives it brings.

[@NaeBlis]

I love that!

[@testsignupagain7449]

Shill. Seriously, who believes you're a non reader showing up to this niche channel to defend the show. 🗣️

[@JPFalcononor]

I rewatched Season One and I have to say that I enjoyed it much more than I did the first time around. I think during the first viewing, the old crumugeon in me was too busy yelling at the clouds how this and that was wrong. While not perfect by any means, I shelved those book expectations and simply watched it at face value and found it to be an ejoyable experience overall.

[@nicodemogawronski2052]

Season 1 was awful. The more I think about it, the more I get annoyed. They had time to write a good script and i cannot believe that there was no adult in the room saying: "We need more time. Dialogs don't make any sense, we are making shit up instead of using source material, we introduce characters that are not in the books and give them so much time (stepin), special effects are not up to standard." Covid was just an excuse for a poorly executed show. Do you really think it would have been that much better without covid? I really hope they took the feedback in from S1 and tried at least to make something watchable.

[@aldan7812]

Nope, im with you on the casting - I have no problem with any of it, in fact I think whoever is responsible for casting decisions deserves a raise. Unless that person is also writing the scenes. Then, not so much. The strength, of early GoT, was the characters all felt like the same people from the page. They trusted, the vision of the Author. In this show mate, they are not interested in that for any of the fellas, and that is the problem. I have, zero problems with any of the arcs or characterizations for any of the girls - even Moiraine which is where i probably depart from my bookcloak mates - I understand why they wanted to put Pike front and Centre (which is why they really should have not cast her tbh) - but the lads, this is where all the characterization, the motivations, the foreshadowed arcs is different, and ridiculous imo. That is not going to right itself, in fact it can only get worse - domino rack meet gust of air. You don't DO this if you love the characters that RJ spawned in his mind and dedicated to the page. You do this if you think they need fixing. And if that is the case, you have no business pretending to be 'adapting' a piece of much-loved art. P.S - apart from Loial, I loved his characterization and performance. He just needs a better wig and some eyebrows ffs.

[@mattwinjum4234]

My biggest nock on the entire season if you take away the covid stuff is by far the Stepping episode. We all knew we had to make cuts and skips in the story. But yet we spent an entire episode on a storyline that we don't see in the books " except somewhat in New Spring." Why could we not spend that episode in The Wastes or another town traveled by Rand and Mat

[@ramspencer5492]

Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings show what's possible with adaptations.

[@robinirie98]

What are we to make of the fact that the trailer for this "popular" show has had only 3.5 million views? Or that KZbin videos about the show barely get into five figures unless they're critical. I'd be interested in the completion rate. About 10 people in my circle started it because i told the WoT is great. Only two completed it. I cannot be the only one in that position.

[@hrbacon]

They can get back on track in season 2, but getting new viewers is going to be a tall order if you have to tell people it's a great show, but they have to slog through season 1. Thinking season 3 is going to get cancelled especially if season 2 sees less viewers than season 1, which is likely, due to the absolute atrocity that they ended season 1 with.

[@nfirest]

Sorry man, this is not the wheel of time.this show is a joke. It has more in common with g.o.t. than wot. I understand you are trying to make the best of a dumpster fire. But Amazon lost the viewership of 99.9% of the fans of the books. The only people who like this garbage are people who have never read the series.the changes that they made completely changed the story and characters.this is not in anyway even close to the books. At all. People who think the show is good are gas lighting themselves

[@staffski]

7:05 "I care about the product that I'm given, not the excuses for why it wasn't great" - Word brother.

[@whiplash231]

People might not want to admit it but what made people watch Game of Thrones was that it had nudity in it. This made the characters believable as nothing was being hidden from the viewer. The wheel of time leans more into the off screen action in typical fantasy as the antagonist is always a shy farm/village boy (Frodo, Rand, Pug...) with morals. Also take the first book and ask yourselves does it teach me all about the magic system or the expansive nature of the world and cultures and the answer is no. It took 14 books to do that so what were we really expecting from the first season.. Apart from the CGI and Amalisa burnout in episode 8 i give the first season a solid 8 and I have watched and enjoyed the season on 6 viewings at this point.

[@christianrapper]

The series grew on me but it took a lot of shortcuts. Having Perin kill his wife was asinine. That’s the one charge that bothered me. They did a horrible job showing Perin dealing with that. Honestly, that’s something that should haunt him for years. There should be no way that he should be able to transition into his next arc with a certain character that I won’t spoil.

[@randlebrowne2048]

I want to see Rand actually be the main character....

[@LindaDias-y9i]

so more changes is what you want? Because, he is not THE main character in the books...

[@rheakelly87]

@randlebrowne2048 im always bemused that people think there is a single main character in the series. Even Jordan aludes to it not being so - "Here is your flaw, Shaitan, Lord of the Dark, Lord of Envy, Lord of Nothing, here is why you fail. It was not about me. It’s never been about me.” It was about a woman, torn and beaten down, cast from her throne and made a puppet. A woman who had crawled when she had to. That woman still fought. It was about a man that love repeatedly forsook. A man who found relevance in a world that others would have let pass them by. A man who remembered stories and who took fool boys under his wing when the smarter move would have been to keep on walking. That man still fought. It was about a woman with a secret, a hope for the future. A woman who had hunted the truth before others could. A woman who had given her live, then had it returned. That woman still fought. It was about a man whose family was taken from him, but who stood tall in his sorrow and protected those he could. It was about a woman who refused to believe that she could not help, could not heal those who had been harmed. It was about a hero who insisted with every breath that he was anything but a hero. It was about a woman who would not bend her back while she was beaten, and who shown with a light for all who watched, including Rand. It was about them all."

[@frankcasamento74]

Hahaha hahaha hahaha no they won't

[@seanharrison3482]

⁠@@LindaDias-y9iyou can say that there are many IMPORTANT characters but you simply cannot say that Rand is not the main character. The story revolves around him. Every other characters’ arc orbits Rand’s story. There are many interesting characters, some even more interesting than Rand, but nothing happens without our sheepherder.

[@JayAshkevron]

@@LindaDias-y9i You people are delusional.

[@tinshield]

One part of the book that captured my interest and fascination was the Ways. In the show was like a dark warehouse with stacked gray painted cardboard boxes. Horrible.

[@davidlavin4774]

For character development, they need to focus more on the 3 tavern (Rand, Matt, Perrin). All three characters were way too underdeveloped in the 1st season. And as to change, I get that aspects of the story need to be condensed, combined, streamlined, etc. But they need to re-emphasis sticking to the overall lore as written. Explain the background and magic system as Jordan created it.

[@LeeTurnock-zy2dg]

I'd agree but they stated in Ep8 5 Ta'veren elevating Egwene and Nynaeve. (likely to appease diversity). As such they'll get equal time (unlikely) which will make it difficult to achieve.

[@lokdog257]

5 things that need done. 1) cancell the show 2) fire rafe judkings 3) an apology from the writers 4) an apology from Amazon 5) start a whole new show, that is actual WOT

[@Luinedhel]

I agree with your insights about Perrin, and about visual effects in general. They are bound to have changes and cuts on the source material, but I hope they do it in a sensible way.

[@Iansco1]

Problem is Rafe all but said he is taking pleasure in changing things just to piss fans off. Changing it just because he can for the simple sake of changing it. Perrin is best example. "Mat's Da" too. SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER if anyone did not read! "Mat's Da" was a FREAKING HERO and PILAR OF THE COMMUNITY. Not an abusive DRUNK lecher. That was a change that effs up a MAJOR effing arc later. Borhald, Two Rivers. Perrin and Faile. Tam and Abell.

[@LindaDias-y9i]

@@Iansco1 When and where did Rafe say anything like that? Can you post a link or something? I find this hard to believe... Btw me as a bookfan, I am quite happy with some of the changes (not all, mind, but cannot expect that, right?), anyway I would find the show much more boring if I knew exactly what was coming. Like this its much more exciting, all the guessing and the theories... so much more fun 😀

[@LeeTurnock-zy2dg]

​@@LindaDias-y9iI find the comment about being bored if the story followed the books bemusing. I would love it. Seeing how they play out against head cannon and capturing the scale and gravitas of the moment. By all means cut plots that ultimately serve little purpose (e.g. the succession storyline / Knitting circle etc) but hold on to the book characterisations and plot as a minimum.

[@metarus208]

Luneidhel, love your channel and videos!

[@Luinedhel]

@@metarus208 Thanks!😉

[@CriticalxMiss]

Besides them messing up Rand's arc from the first 3 books.... I just want them to stop changing random lore. M&S dont need to go to sex hut using a gateway, the ways dont need to look like that or use the power. MS doesnt need to tell you what you 'fear' most. Circles dont need to burn people out. Just write your scripts within the convines of the lore. These should be the same characters put in similar situations with big events being as close as they can be to the books. I def get needing to cut or change things... but they should still work within a frame work.

[@sprekkt]

I agree with your point, but in my view, the complete absence of character development stands out as the most significant issue. While you did mention this concern, I sense that you might not have fully conveyed the extent of its impact. Given the current state of the series, I find it difficult to connect with any of the characters. There's very little background provided for them, and the relationships between the characters are practically non-existent. The backstories that have been introduced could potentially lead to problems in future books. For instance, it's perplexing why Mat, who serves as the protector of his family in this storyline, wouldn't return home with Perrin after their time in Tear. One of the most pressing matters lies in the complete lack of a relationship between Rand and Lan. The training and interactions between these two characters are vital to the overall narrative. To me, the most significant concern isn't just the absence of these elements in the series, but rather how this absence, coupled with the prevalence of uninspiring action scenes, reflects the writers' perception of fantasy literature. It's as though they believe that readers are drawn to these books solely for their grand magic systems and flashy action. However, I must emphasize that what truly resonates with me in fantasy is the depth of character development, which, by the way, is often lacking in other forms of literature. This lack of focus on character growth is why I'm rather pessimistic about the forthcoming season :/

[@redinthesky1]

S1 could have been on the Lifetime channel with how bad (and predictable) it was trying to portray men. If I had a quarter for every bad take in the first season itd be enough to fill a sock up and give a Wheel of Time reader enough brain damage to turn into a Wheel of Time Amazon show enjoyer

[@kirielbranson4843]

They need to work out the binary gender magic thing without ruining the story. I do not get the feeling that the show runners, Sanderson, and the writers spent a good week or so going over this aspect of the story and discussed how to handle it in regards to today's world. This required a lot of thought and planning that included all the way until the last scene of the last book. I personally don't know how this should have been handled and what could have been done or changed in order to be inclusive. I think that making this series at this time was the worst time to tackle this. They could have gotten a trans focus group to run things by and help. I think transgender wasn't the biggest problem since they might have had a few characters that could channel the wrong source. Not highlight this but include it. Non-binary was probably a bigger hurdle to decide if anyone non-binary could channel. Instead, they decided to be really vague in how the power works. Imply that men corrupt it themselves or that the reds believe this. Corrupt traveren to be the whole group taking away the agency of Nyneave and Egwaine. They altered a lot of the underlying story by putting in things that weren't needed when the original story had plenty of equality. It was tragic that the male side was tainted yet they made this so fuzzy to say ... something. They really need a lot of brainstorming on how to recover from the mistakes they made when changing the world. There should be writer stopping sessions for every change to the lore to detail how everything up to the last page of story will be affected. The current staff is short sighted. They wanted to be pat on the back on how they "fixed" Jordan's story. They didn't fix it. The introduced plot problems.

[@JayAshkevron]

So this nonsense that people defending this show where they keep saying, "They have to make cuts to the books stuff in an adaptation to a tv show" is just utter garbage. Of course we all know this. This is not a defense of the show. No one! No. one. Who is a serious person is attacking the show because of minor changes made to help the books be adapted to a tv show, like cutting out curse words. The criticism of the show is because of its awful writing, like where did they dig these writers up? Also the terrible cgi, and frankly all the stuff they cut would have been ok, IF they hadn't then filled in several episodes with their own person fan fiction version of the story. When you are making an adaptation you cut things and then add things that smooth over the things you cut. You don't change the fundamentals of the story. Period. They have changed so much of the story that it is basically unrecognizable and cannot play out the way it does in the books. So they will have to keep writing more fan fiction to fill in the gaps. I will have nothing to do with this garbage. I'm not interested in the showrunners and writers original take on the Wheel of time story, I wanted to watch an adaptation of the Wheel of Time story.

[@robbiedubes]

Casting definitely hit or miss. Mat Rand and Moraine were great. But to see who they casted as Aviendha in season 2 is a perfect example of a horrible miss. Even if she does a good job, that is not what Aiel look like

[@dfish7777]

Season 1 was absolute garbage, I will watch season 2 but wait till all episodes are available. It’s so far off the books it’s not even remotely entertaining. I convinced a few non book readers to watch and they all did not like it they won’t even be watching season 2…

[@yellow_sedai]

I really hope they improve the way gates, the way it was done in the first season was just not it.

[@akellerhouse83]

I didn't hate the show. It was just forgettable to me. My bf is not a fan of the books and will probably never read them. I'm pretty sure he hasn't given one thought to that show since the last episode aired 2 years ago.

[@MrElerem]

The finale broke the rules of channeling and power rabking by having a few untrained and weak channelers destroy ten thousand trollocs Thats my biggest gripe Nothing matters after this

[@JayAshkevron]

Not only that but by book cannon you cannot draw enough power through a link to burn someone out. That whole last episode was just utter garbage.

[@scottferry2084]

@@JayAshkevron These are the changes that really make me mad. I understand there will be changes, but at least follow the rules of the world. It is clearly stated that the link creates a buffer that prevents someone drawing too much of the one power. Also, since when can Egwene heal more than a bruise? Let alone resurrect someone with her tears?

[@jabbott6748]

I have to disagree with you on one small thing. Your point that book readers are locked into two camps. I've been reading, and loving, WoT for over 30 years. I have only 5 tattoos, all directly drawn from the book art or quotes. I credit WoT for a great deal of impact on my choice to make a career of the military. From which I am now retired after 22 years of service. These books have had the most impact on my life of anything I've ever read. Still I don't fall into either of the camps you point out. I'm in the middle. I'm still hopeful that the show can and will get better. But I don't love it or hate it. It's, disappointing so far but I'm going to keep watching and hoping it gets better.

[@NaeBlis]

I think that’s fair. I think a better way of making my point is book readers are sort of in the two camps of “going to watch” or “not going to watch”

[@wighty5860]

@@NaeBlis I mean....aren't we all?? 😉

[@wighty5860]

Here's the thing with bringing in new viewers: They've failed to utilize their very free and very wide-spread marketing system; their built-in fanbase. This seems absurd. Rafe even said the show would upset the hard core due to the changes. Because they were aiming at people who don't know WOT, or never finished it, or don't remember it. Nothing will spread the word faster than a giddy fanboy/girl flying higher than an Eelfinn huffing Ta'veren emotions. But with all the changes made, some seemingly very deliberate with questionable reasoning, you've torn out a chunk of your already existing fanbase in hopes of bringing in more. I never heard of GOT. Never saw an ad for GOT. Never read ASOIAF. What I did read, eventually were comments always saying how good the show was ( I think I was living in Japan when the show came out ). Now here I am, back in Japan and I've seen nothing about season 2. I haven't even seen anything the past few night surfing through Prime while I've been on leave. Now I've heard that this or that change needing to be made just to draw in new audiences. But this doesn't seem to have been needed. I've seen quite a few posts from non-book readers watching the show and turning to read the books....and still enjoyed RJ's story.

[@cairhieningent]

More attention to detail and trust in the story. It was disappointing to have Dana chase them around with a sword and not even have them cornered before the dialogue. Would have been better if Rand and Mat were gearing up ready for a fight before they started talking. It was dumb to see 5 female channelers take on and defeat a shadowspawn army. They could have at least tried to explain the power increase as a result of a sa'angreal even if it wasn't in the book. It was cheap melodrama to have Nynaeve appear as if she could bring back Egwene from death with the One Power. Part of why the Perrin fridging incident seems grossly superfluous is because it really isn't necessary. There should be enough trauma as it is from having to leave their home because they are possibly the Dragon Reborn. They could have used that as a springboard to talk about what the Dragon Reborn is and why possibly being the incarnation is so unnerving.

[@christianrapper]

Mostly only book readers found it divisive

[@ianvera4299]

One nitpick, GOT in general had many characters facing consequences in early, middle, and late in the series. WOT could learn from this.

[@darkhighwayman1757]

No saving it. Badly cast, written and cheap cgi

[@armandog3335]

Always so appreciative of your videos.

[@michaelbenti5383]

I agree with the things you discussed. I think however, the biggest issue is the number of episodes per season or length per episode. Wheel of time is meant to be detailed. The world needs to be built up and rules need to be known. This is a huge challenge that can be done. This way is more expensive to produce but it would be more authentic. The first season was not terrible but not great either. It felt very empty in places. Lets see what season two brings. I have low expectations at this point as they will probably cram and cut things again.

[@robinirie98]

Watch TLoTR movie and see how much world building and character development went into the first 30 minutes. We don't need more episodes. We need better writing and the right cuts.

[@CriticalxMiss]

I hope this show keeps going But I also hope that done the line we can get an anime that is much closer to the books.

[@freddielee1965]

I agree, the cities need to be explorable, the ruins need to be seen and the history explained…THEY BETTER NOT MESS UP the battle for Two-Rivers! Especially the history of Two-Rivers!

[@Merecir]

Prepare for Perrin marrying Gaul and Faile being written out completely.

[@freddielee1965]

@@Merecir I will be so pissed if that happens!

[@einnod8355]

Please stop complaining about the channeling not being detailed enough in S1. This is a thing in the books. The explanation of the 5 types of weaves is not explained until a little ways into the story. Once Nynaeve and Egwene get to the tower and begin training I am sure we will see differences in the weaves. It is so annoying that no one seems to recognize this.

[@wighty5860]

So then why spend any time on aes sedai/warder bonds? Those don't really become relevant until book 4. Or maybe spending time with the main characters a bit. Either of those are FAR more relevant than the bond.

[@einnod8355]

@@wighty5860 they cannot do certain things without explaining them. The warder bond is one of them. They have a direction they are going and limited time. Which is something that i wish would be complained more about, but amazon is making these limitations, and there isnt much that can be done to fight that. In season 1 the Aes Sedai are described as magic users, and that is pretty much all. They can now go into detail about the magic and provide more visual representation once it has been explained.

[@wighty5860]

@@einnod8355 Pretty much anything they do that's part of the lore or meta will require some "type" of explanation. All I'm saying is that the bond didn't have to be now, or at best not given the amount of time is was. Given the time constraints we all know are a huge problem, there were better things to spend that time on leaving the bond for later when it becomes more relevant.

[@colsanders4036]

Great episode. I would add stop breaking the lore for no apparent reason. This relates to your storyline changes point, but I view as different. There were a number of time where they broke how the world works for no visible reason. Indeed, many of these will force future story changes that will ripple throughout. I would think it would be easier to adapt if you do not need to pay attention to all these things to achieve continuity. Just my two cents. (30 year reader with over 25 re-reads under my belt)

[@NaeBlis]

I would argue that there were reasons they made changes that we may not know yet. There are some practical reasons for changes I don’t know of, but I don’t think from my interactions with cast and crew that they deliberately changed things just to change them. Now, that being said…I don’t always agree with their choices

[@colsanders4036]

@@NaeBlis thanks for your response. Very true that I may not know why certain changes were made, so I hold out hope. Overall, I was disapointed with S1 (for many reasons you have discussed). I will watch S2, and hope there are improvements. If they improve the 5 items you discussed in this video, I will be more likely to try S3. I am trying a re-watch of S1 right now for tomorrow, but it is hard. Haha. On this watch through, the thing that strikes me most is that it is so choppy between episodes and scenes. Yes, COVID impacted this, but that is not the entire issue. For me this might be coppy because I am a long time reader and they jump from book ajacent content to show created content. There is no way for me to determine if this is the reason, but it is jarring. I so want the show to work, but I would love to see an adaptation closer to LOTR versus Rings of power, and S1 feels more like a rings of power adaptation. Have a great day!

[@bozimsaho5590]

I don't think the books really get going until TSR, up to that point the world and characters aren't really expanded. I do agree though that they should ignore us book readers and go all out making it a stand alone show. That is what will make or break it.

[@Trogdor_Strongbraid]

Taint Puppet or we riot! Damn right. That would express so much of limitations of the power and Rand's do what he will attitude. Just watchers would however be confused from Nynaeve's resurrection from S1E8...

[@stephanhart9941]

For the "Min" They have, the whole back-story and personality has to change. Sorry Pretty girl but a different kind of pretty. Epic FAIL! She had NO Style that others would want to emulate.

[@ramspencer5492]

I don't really expect a one for one adaptation, but there were some critical missteps in the first season. I also think it's kind of pathetic to think they need to get rid of Gleeman, for example..... Can't have anything to playful. Have to be like GoT all the time.... Sad really.... Nihilistic. Resurrections... Literally WTF???!;;.... Accidental wife killing? Nerfing then stilling Moraine..... Before she's even had a chance to shine... Total untrained beginners were all more badass than her. Reversing thec stilling now, anytime soon, would just make the misstep worse. There would be no consequences for what is considered a fate worst than death by many. The defender of the blight, who spend their entire existence protecting the world for generations, unable to fight Trollics...... Like at all even! Season 2 had to be better. Not just better special effects..... Better character development.... But it had to stop making these critical mistakes that hurt the mythology and water down the world Jordan created. ....That seriously take is out of the world.

[@wotfanedit]

An outside observation that may or may not be wrong. I feel as if the longer we are separated from S1, the more critical your appraisal of the season has gotten. I don't think you were THIS critical during the season itself, but you've certainly become more critical after the fact. If this is die to you reappraising the show after some time and distance, then great. IF it's because you self-censored your criticisms to keep your audience happy or because you were afraid of backlash, then that sucks. I find that the fandom is an absolute shit show during a season, with different "camps" of show lovers and haters and no room for nuanced critique as you present here. Don't be afraid to speak up about what doesn't work for you, even if it's during the season, rather than waiting until all the dust has already settled. I look forward to watching this style of video recapping S2 strengths and weaknesses in a very blunt way. Tai'shar!

[@baardseth82]

Agreed on all counts, Nae'blis. My friend group (non book readers) that watched Season 1 made it to the end, but they were all just kind of "meh". Now that it is all said and done, I see Season 1 as nothing more than a foundation for the show to be built on, much like Book 1 (which also has some flaws). And say what you will about the writing of Season 1, they definitely set up a LOT of stuff. Here's hoping Season 2 will improve and expand and properly set up Season 3 (which I think will either make or break the series).

[@Harldin]

Basically agree with all 5 points, and it really looks like everyone is going to be where they were at the end of TGH, I think I have worked out how everyone gets there. 4 different journeys possibly using 4 different ways. The boys are the same age as in the books, 19-20yo, I think it is more of RJ ageing them down in EOTW, I think Rafe got them closer to what young adults would be like in that setting. The whole, who is the Dragon? was a massive mistake in S1, they introduce Ta'veren's early on and then ignored that in favour of the Dragon thing.

[@robinirie98]

Do you realise that if we get 8 seasons, Rand will be 40 and Min 50?

[@Harldin]

@@robinirie98 Hopefully they will start dropping every year, they are filming S3 right now.

[@frankb5586]

Dude!!! I thought you had retired!......Good job... yeah the world needs to grow but there isn't enough time for more than 3 storylines......

[@LeeTurnock-zy2dg]

I agree with what you said Nae'Blis. 1) Poor scale 2) Poor character development outside for Nynaeve (clearly Rafe's fav) 3) Didnt explain the magic system 4) Didnt explain the importance of the dragon 5) focused too much on virtue signalling 6) Made the baddies look insignificant 7) wasted entire episodes on Stepin with no pay off 8) destroyed episode 8 9) Made the vast majority of the male groups in the show ineffective for no reason. I could go on. I dont want to be negative on the show and hope they can course correct as i would love to see a more high quality return on the promise that Rafe gave to us of a faithful adaption. We may not number the millions, but Rafe cant afford to alienate the book fans if he wants to see this through. I could go on

[@ethancoster1324]

That last episode really squeezed the life out of the show. I have very low expectations for season 2.

[@jeremyvanneman8112]

One thought I hold particular animosity toward - readers either stopped watching because of the changes, or like it still. I know plenty of book readers (myself included) who have chosen to stop watching not because of the changes - but because the product Amazon put out simply wasn't good in our eyes. There was very little character development (as you mentioned, although I would argue it was more severe than you suggest). There was very little logic or consistency (as you alluded to, but I would argue this is massively more severe than you suggested). The world felt small and too clean (as you highlighted). The vfx were poor quality (aside from a few moments that shone, like the trollocs from ep 1, like you said). But on top of that, the money was used extremely obviously poorly (wigs that looked terrible, sets that were thoroughly built out despite being only ever seen once and in limited areas, going to straight to Tar Valon when they could have saved a lot of money by not including that city yet, etc). The editing, and a good portion of the cinematography in general barely passed muster for being a professional project at all. I felt the acting was generally weak, minus a few who did great (like Logain, Ila, and Steppin). But most of all, the writing was atrocious - dialogue that made no sense, implications that required am understanding of what was in the writers head (which didn't make sense coming from that character), characters being aware of what the viewer was aware of despite having no in-world reason for having that knowledge, tropes being used ad nauseum, lore-breaking commentary, immense amounts of tell-don't-show, an insane amount of death fake-outs, ham-fisted foreshadowing and metaphor, and modern colloquialisms that robbed the world of its uniqueness. And while this ties into changes, the characters were completely unlikeable (which is sad because it required a near complete flip from who the characters were in the books). Lan is completely incapable as a Warder (I counted 23 times he failed to protect and serve his Aes Sedai because of his shortcomings that were only not disastrous because of plot armor), Rand is useless, whiny and willing to sacrifice his friends, Egwene is an abusive partner and also pretty dull-witted, Perrin was a nothingburger, Mat... I can't even begin to describe how off Mat is, Moiraine is a terrible manipulator and apparently knows nothing about her 20-year-long life's mission, Siuan is a tyrant, Agelmar was a chauvinist and generally horrible leader, Loial constantly interrupted people and mansplained, and I could go on and provide multiple instances for each of those claims.

[@greeningthings]

Something that sticks with me is pronunciation. The audio books should be the canon for how to say everything, since RJ approved everything Kate and Michael said while recording the audio books. Everytime I hear Tar Valon said that way, I cringe... How will the dream world be said? Also, Game of Thrones was 1 book, 1 season. You can do a lot with that. Failures like Dresden and Sword of Truth because of leaving the story way too much. 1 book one season for WoT is 14 years. 2 years per season for 8 seasons is 16 years. They should just nonstop record per the books and force the addition of new seasons. A positive, Brandon Sanderson learned a great lesson, as any adaptation of his books will be done his way or not at all.

[@johnnyp6202]

Agree with almost everything you said especially about Maksim what a waste of time. Adaptation is necessary but cutting something to just add something new completely outside of the books was a bad mistake. The things I hated the most were the look of the blight, the eye, and having like 4 non-Aes Sedai kill all the Trollocs. And Rafe said Tarwins Gap was one of his favorite parts of the books and it was the most butchered thing in the series. I disagree on the casting. Race and culture is at the CORE of Wheel of Time. One of the biggest building blocks of the entire books is that the Breaking essentially segregated the races in large part. One of the founding concepts is that Rand STICKS OUT because he looks like an Aiel., There is nothing wrong with having a racially diverse cast and it should be but it should have followed what Jordan set up. In many ways WoT is one of the least racist books ever. If you are making a movie about Japan or China or India as example should that movie have a racially diverse cast? The story works much better if all Aiel are basically Irish tall, red haired people. The borderlanders are Asian, the Sea Folk black, the rest of Two Rivers are something OTHER than Irish. Still a super racially diverse cast and the story works better. Just my opinion. And Sheriam has RED hair. Jordan uses it as a defining characteristic of her character, why change that of all things? Also the show was not really in a terrible spot all the way up to the Waygate (minus the Maksim thing) but the last two episodes were just beyond awful. To be honest they should have recast Mat for 7 and 8 and maybe had the dagger distort his features so that when he is cured and a different actor there is a slight explanation for it. I was encouraged by the trailers as I see a lot of book stuff but then you said you heard it really does not follow the books at all. Guess we find out in 2 days

[@avanz2885]

The ways, channeling in the ways, not needing Loial, the character of Loial, Lan having no presence and being so emotional... The ridiculous "who's the Dragon". Min so bland, zero chemistry with Rand. Rand not standing out as an Aiel. The lame channeling then Nyanaeve being so Op, Egwene healing death. Moraine swearing to the Amryllin seat on an oath rod. Forgive the spelling but these changes showed a lack of understanding of the fundamentals of the story

[@mistersl8647]

All in all my major disappointment with Season one is that it all felt low budget. Having read the WOT several times it always felt epic in scale and the detail Jordan / Sanderson wrote with gave it a true realism within the realm of the fantastic. This adaptation just feels generic. Just visually, compared to GOT or the new version of Dune, Season one felt like a B version and was a big let down. For me GOT set the bar on how fantasy should be visually adapted from presenting the scope and world-building, to the nuances of costume and clothes to bring authenticity and realism, to how each character minor and major drew you in. Season one of WOT fell short on all of this and felt like something that was made for Prime Time TV. I understand the pandemic had an affect which is why I'm hoping Season two begins to correct some of this, but so far the show has been a huge disappointment for me. My wife never read GOT but everything about it drew her in immediately. I told her if she loved GOT then wait until WOT. Then when it was released she couldn't get into it and felt it was corny and had very low production value. Oh well..

[@nickjordan8996]

I didn't even know this was coming...doubt I'll watch it tbh. What they did to the text is season 1 was pretty unforgivable.

[@Eric-1701]

I like your content but I almost choked on my ice cream when you said the casting was good. For God's sake. The casting was terrible in the main group. The only ones that were any good for me were Rand, Moraine and Lan. All the others...meh. and all the two rivers kids were too old. Blah. Sorry

[@KerryFP]

I think most of us understand and accept that an adaptation will consist of changes but unfortunately that whole wasted episode with Stefan or whatever his name was, completely turned me off. I was already so annoyed when they revealed Rand and Egwene were having sex was pointless. They're supposed to be naive, sheltered kids and I loved how each of the boys thought the other 2 were so experienced with women. It was charming and funny. They made the characters so unlikable. I don't care about those people in the show. That doesn't mean I don't like the actors, they did very well with the trash they were given. The writing has nothing to do with COVID. You're either a great writer or not, they're not. It would take a week for me to document all the mistakes. I don't plan on watching season 2, I didn't finish watching season 1. I enjoy your channel and a couple others, you're much more interesting than the show.

[@js2727]

I have been trying to decide if I was going to hate watch season 2 or not. I have chosen not to watch. I understood that things was going to be left out and changed. It doesn’t work for me I would not watch this show if I never read any of the books. I think it is just bad. I hate no longer feeling apart of the WOT community now that it’s become “Amazon WOT”. A once fun place is fractured.

[@Loki087]

I want so badly to enjoy this show, but I just think that it is completely awful. I will never understand the urge of directors and screenwriters to tamper with amazing stories that have already proven themselves. I simply don't understand how anyone who enjoys the books can enjoy the show..

[@Simon-kt2lx]

First, does the cameras are still rolling for season 3 despite the strike? If so, it is good news. Secondly, I really think they need 3 seasons to really make their creative point across and what this adaptation is all about. My impression is that they needed 3 seasons to at least make a valid case for this adaptation and to see if it succeed or fail. I have hope that season 2 will be better than season 1 but to see the full picture and find true satisfaction, season 3 will be the key season for it. If they succeed, people will stand by the show and respect it more and more. But i don't see S2 as a full completion of their goal with the characters and the stake. The characters will reach their full potential (specially Rand) in S3. They are still with S2 in a journey of discovery and acceptance of what and who they are. That said, bring it on! I just want something more appealing than S1 and my real verdict will be with S3.

[@tkinsey3]

Nae'Blis, you and are basically the same person, I guess? Haha. Great video. I agree on all points.

[@cyanbloodbane1]

While I except that some changes need to be made in an adaptation I disagree that they must be so substantial and widespread. GoTs stayed pretty true to the books early on. Some of the changes made were nonsensical, like needed the power to open the way gates. They were not forced into this. The size of the gate didn't improve the story. It was a pointless change. Whitecloaks armor. No one that read the books would say that is what Whitecloaks would look like. They looked comical. The whole who is the dragon story was silly and screwed up important character development. Too many problems to list

[@danhenley9495]

Instead of a boost, Rings of Power may have hurt WOT because it was so bad. I like the changes to Moraine and Logan and I think they will pay off big time.

[@ozwelshcobs65]

It looks like selene and lanfear are too different people? The prudishness erc was actually a big part of the storyline. Also eleyas looks like a monster in season 2. Too much sex..it is like it is all just gratuous and unbelievable. The warders never interacted with the political bullshit. And liandron being a dark friend kills alot of storylines. And I hate hate hate the shows characterisation of Matt. That is the worst thing. His story has some of the best storylines and they have trashed him and his story

[@DrakeBarrow]

Perrin is just gross going forward. Doesn't matter that his story can end up in the same place, he's now and forever Perrin Wifeslayer. Violence against an intimate partner is a special kind of ugly, hard to write around on a good day, and bluntly they aren't that good at writing.

[@nevrbluffs]

Am a bookreader, i thought casting was excellent, story/plots not so great. I did like the Logain story-line and it appears it will continue in season 2, possibly replacing another male channeler as his instructor??

[@JacobSky]

Maybe this was implied in a “bigger world” but I might add bigger stakes too. The “last battle” rhetoric of the characters rang hollow in S1. I don’t feel the reality shattering stakes of the conflict yet… that adds tension and drama to everything.

[@straighttalkwithkyle7947]

The first book largely played out like that. It was largely just scared kids on the run until the very end. Now that Ishamael has been introduced I think it will help with that. We get Lanfear this season too. I have always compared this series to slowly stretching a rubber band until the point of absolute tension then abruptly letting go and watching everything snap into place. The last battle is the snap into place.

[@DeadsySedai]

I would say this is the case in the books too.

[@JacobSky]

@@DeadsySedai Super fair… and yet, thinking in Naeblis’ terms of what would improve viewership…

[@t20sgrunt36]

No one has ever expected a 1:1 adaption. That is such a moot and tired narrative. But to add sub par fan fic scenes at the loss of character or lore/world development, is the biggest (of many) flaws with the show. Still going to watch upcoming episodes and seasons, but they need to step up their game. I think you made very valid points with the lack of character and world development. This series was a very slow burn, not some Twilight-esque expositions in between jump spin, sword slash battles and cheesy cartoon level antagonist. First season was maybe a 5/10, never expected a 9 or 10, but a 7 would seem like a home run at this point.

[@NaeBlis]

I will disagree with you a bit here. I get comments from people all the time that don’t seem to understand that it won’t be 1:1. Lol

[@fredcole6844]

SOOOOOO Hype!

[@Texans23]

only required changes are required lol. Most of the changes I disliked were not needed at all and just wasted time to check boxes and fulfill random fan fiction fantasies. Really hoping we get less of that but I doubt it sadly

[@henrikgafvert5983]

1 Get the Plot right. 2 Get the characters right. 3 Get some character development at all. 4 Fire their writers and get some good ones. 5 Make the opposition interesting. Wrote this before the video got started.

[@grootbaas9104]

This channel will blow up the longer the series goes on. Never heard of the books until the series. Learnt alot from this channel. Earned a subscriber.

[@JAFTW]

This show is a burning sewage plant. The best we can hope for, is that it gets canceled. Seriously, make the pain stop...

[@ryder9]

Bro, you gotta understand. This is a series and Not a theatrical release I’m cool with saidin and saidar being black and white. Budgetary issues also have consideration

[@jediredeyex]

I enjoyed the season for what it is, but my biggest complaint is… We don’t need new characters or story arcs. We don’t need screen time for characters that are not in the books. There are so many things that are going to be cut, there’s no room for newcomers. Just my opinion

[@gnomeandgarden6157]

Stepin not paying off...... we know when that will pay off, and having it established this early is better than having it only a few episodes before it's needed. We got aMoL foreshadowing in EotW, for the Light's sake! As to book readers not watching the show.... nah, the bookcloaks will watch. And hatewatching is still completion.

[@testsignupagain7449]

You came into a video about how the show should improve and talk about bookcloaks? Are you shoved that far up? You should NOT label people who want the show to improve as 'bookcloaks'. It's derogatory and you're trying to associate reasonable people with bigots and racists. Trtying to discredit any criticism. An appalling attitude to have.

[@SuperMirer]

Get rid of the show runner. Make lan less of a wussy, honor the source material, define the gender roles that construct the entire setting of the book and conflict within magic users...

[@scottferry2084]

I am a book fan that will be hate watching season 2 and I got to say that the cast has nothing to do with why I don't like the show. It's all about the terrible writing. To me it feels more like mediocre fan fiction than an adaptation. Needless changes that don't follow the rules of the world that RJ created.

[@derekwatkins9277]

The thing that made Game of Thrones so great was how closely it stuck to the books, until they ran out of material. The five Ta'veren and the Dragon could have been reborn a woman kind of defeated the concept of has to be a man and go insane and rebreak the world to save it.

[@tarisedai9573]

I'm excited for season 2. I think the channelling we've seen looks way better

[@ogar0524]

0% chance for this to be faithful or make any attempt to bring the series back to the books. This is losely based on the books and the EPs priority is to push his fan fiction and agenda.

[@fusionev0]

Uhh we dont actuality know that wot has a high watch time. I dont think they really showed that... i think the boys Reacher, terminal list, and the rangs of power did better

[@johntaylor1032]

Well said. Don't tell me how you can't but how you can Amazon!!

[@alanthompson2063]

Let the Dice Roll. Matt must trust them, even if we don't trust Rafe, yet....

[@jeffturner2975]

I agree with you, but as a huge book fan, this adaptation is a train wreck and I won't be watching S2+

[@rheakelly87]

@nae'blis yay your back. Love what you do!

[@tanonicoletti8856]

Can not wait, fingers crossed.

[@stevenadams9887]

I cant wait for season 2! Excited!!!

[@tylerhamilton9056]

They simply need to explain saidin and saidar much better including the "taint"

[@undeadamerican1107]

You really should revisit this video post-season 2 and see what amazon hit and missed.

[@frankcasamento74]

What needs to happen is they jeed to cancel the show because its a complete bastardization of the source material

[@rainbowsprinklez]

"I want changes to make sense." Me too, but I'm worried there will be too many changes. Eh, just my worry. Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised

[@Harldin]

Lack of people I thought was pretty consistent with where they travelled, not many people live between Andor and the Borderlands.

[@kmallory100]

Have you seen the IGN Sneek Peak from this week? Rand is talking to Logain in I'm assuming Caemlyn because he says he escaped Tar Valon. He tells Rand that men who can channel "glow". What are they doing?!!!!

[@NaeBlis]

Be careful what you listen to. I don’t think a couple of those statements are accurate…

[@kmallory100]

@@NaeBlis It's a clip from an episode of the upcoming season.

[@ethancoster1324]

Yeah, seems like they're drastically changing Logain, or should I say Lotaim's character.

[@kmallory100]

@ethancoster1324 He absolutely better not be combined with Taim. I think he might replace Asmodeon as his teacher though maybe.

[@TheBods666]

They botched season one. They need to fire Rafe and the "writers" and start again.

[@marcushazlewood7283]

100% agree with the character development thing, and as you said perrin was the perfect example. Instead of allowing perrins character to come thru, and give us an empathetic bond to him bc of who he is, the writers chose to add an unnecessary expansion to the lore to make us feel for him, and honestly, it felt very flat and forced. Stop trying to force us to like characters, and give us a reason to like characters.

[@tingtaiji]

They need to treat the world and the lore as a main character. If they had in season 1, I think that would have better guided the adaption and would have lost fewer book fans.