What's the right choice? Bookshelf or Floorstanding Debate Ended!

[@chrislj2890]

I don't like to compromise or take any chances, so I put bookshelf speakers on top of the floor standers plus use active subwoofers. My motto is go big or go home.

[@sheek1982]

😆

[@fredbloggs6080]

"How can you trust a man who wears both a belt and suspenders. He can't even trust his own pants." -- Frank (Henry Fonda) in *Once Upon a Time in the West* .

[@induction7895]

Put a bluetooth speaker on top for extra security.

[@roybatty-]

The active subwoofer is the patron saint of wallets.

[@williamkramer9069]

I was worried there wasn't going to be a punchline. You are the best.

[@connorduke4619]

It is a very "scientific" punchline as well.

[@sidesup8286]

I have a very big room. I find that my sound is nearly twice as spacious sounding (open), with the speakers 6 feet out from the wall behind them than when they are only 2 and 1/2 feet out. I have a subwoofer a foot or so from the wall behind them. So I get the best of both worlds; Space & Bass. If I moved floorstanders 6 feet out into the room I would get great spatiality but almost no bass; as speakers need a wall closer behind the woofer to reinforce the bass. Another advantage is that small speakers tend to do a better sonic disappearing act than big floorstanders. They make speakers thinner now, to decrease cabinet diffraction; less surface area behind the drivers = less cabinet diffraction. Cabinet diffraction is one of the main things that are a give away that the sound is coming out of a cabinet. Keep in mind however that cabinet diffraction can occur from the wood front baffle below the drivers also, which reflective area floorstanders are more likely to have. Efficiency, dynamics and power handling are usually in favor of floorstanders. IN MEMORIUM: One of my favorite high end audio dealers has passed away. He had several stores from the 1960s to 1990s. He had a very unique sales strategy. If he would play you a speaker or something and you couldn't tell that it was superior to a cheaper speaker; he would dial 911 and an ambulance would arrive and take you to the hospital. They would give you a full examination, especially neural and ear exams and testing. When the patient would be released from the hospital in a few days, it was a logical part of their recovery to go back to the store and buy the speaker or amp whose superiority their faulty perception missed the first time. He got sued occasionally, but garnered many sales by doing things this way. He retired many years ago... he will be missed!

[@apparaoapparao]

I married one of Diane’s daughters and she sneakily sold my floorstanders and one of my subs on EBay; replacing them with those little cute smart speakers. I volleyed by purchasing even larger floorstanders for the bedroom so she can enjoy The Glory of the Organ at full merlot levels.

[@dwaynepiper3261]

Another point for the bookshelf plus subwoofer is it allows better bass positioning options for room acoustics than the floorstanders which is fixed.

[@StrangeBrewReviews]

Neither, I prefer Large standmounts with dual small subwoofers.. A little more versatile than either options.

[@crazyprayingmantis5596]

There's no replacement for displacement

[@frank1431]

Best analogy at the end, thank you. Bookshelves it is.

[@scientificaudiophile]

Glad you liked it!

[@V1NCH1INZ0]

Another excellent video. Thank you Scientific Audiophile. Bookshelf speakers are the way!

[@ArtificialDjDAGX]

Great to hear that my intuition that bookshelf speakers + subwoofer would be more worthwhile than floorstanders was correct.

[@scientificaudiophile]

Absolutely!

[@NicolaDiNisio]

Absolutely, but more true in three way designs and if you hi-pass the amplifier accordingly.

[@simonupstone4924]

Very good, made me laugh out loud at the end 😂 bookshelf speakers and a sub here

[@sloboat55]

The room being fifty percent of the sound equation. Choose wisely my friend.

[@rookie962]

Yep, deep bass with floorstanding. As in too much. Floorstanders add too much personality. Ive always found book shelf size more accurate and less tiring. And most brands dont sacrifice volume.

[@asx1248]

A good topic for debate. But there is no debate! Floorstanders or for the same price standmounts plus stands plus subs, then the floorstanders lose every time. Reason, with standmounts plus sub, you can positions the mains for optimum centre image, soundstage and midrange while positioning the sub(s) for optimum bass. Also i think that unless you have the crossover before the amp, the amp still produces the full frequency range it’s just that the filter inside the cabinet turns some of the power to heat.

[@scientificaudiophile]

An integrated amp or a preamp with sub output shouldn’t be sending that signal to the sub, but you are correct because many stereo only products lack sub support.

[@CarlVanDoren61]

JLA cr-1 active crossover 😊​@@scientificaudiophile

[@sighheinrich]

I bought book shelf speakers.. and two matching powered subwoofers. So I have a "slim" speaker tower but with dual 12" subs with their own 400 watt amp. Very budget friendly setup.

[@leegranite2920]

Helpful. Thank you.

[@scientificaudiophile]

Glad it was helpful!

[@IanKnight40]

Do I need the the cabinet "thrum" that comes as a freebie with floorstanders?.... Only if I drive a Honda Civic with basic trim.

[@JordanPhegley]

I'm pretty sure I agree!

[@rm-mastering]

Now this is a very good topic for discussion, in my experience over the years, subwoofers have come along way with regards to integration with main monitors (bookshelf type speakers), yes they definitely have their advantages, for example you can generally get great performance on a budget equaling floor standers many times the price. Their are lots of scientific advantages too when on a budget such as bookshelves from company X can and often outperform their floor standing brothers as a result to cabinet resonance from a larger box built to a budget - less cabinet bracing and slim thickness of the cabinet etc. Smaller speakers with less cabinet resonance teamed with an appropriate active sub can yield less boomy and more accurate very low end bass (and less taxing on the power amp) which a floor stander can't always compete with, also to note, you can experiment with placing the sub(s) away from the main speakers to help alleviate problematic room modes and really enjoy hearing Diane Bish getting down on large pipes. However, if money is no object then yes, invest in floor standers assuming the money is spent on better construction and so on.

[@scientificaudiophile]

Thanks for the comment!

[@connorduke4619]

Your last sentence logically contradicts everything you wrote before it. A pair of good bookshelfs with good subs will outperform floorstanders of equivalent quality, every day of the week.

[@rm-mastering]

@connorduke4619 You've missed the parts - on a budget and money no object. Look those up and you'll see the light💡

[@connorduke4619]

@@rm-mastering I would argue money no object a top notch standmount and subwoofer pair beats a boomy, poor imaging, incoherent driver matching, bass node inducing floorstander.

[@rm-mastering]

Connorduke, have a look at (money no object) The Kii THREE BXT System, a well designed floorstander like this (and many others) will out perform similar priced stand mounts with subs in most cases. You must find a place or studio equipped with these to understand. Also check out Genelec 8318. These have advanced DSP optimization rearly found if not impossible with separate stand mount and active sub installations

[@steverino5054]

True. If going a floorstander route still doesn't give you what a sub can do and you're good to add one anyway, then just get the best bookshelves you can afford and add sub(s) to that.

[@robertmoi8400]

From my experience, with all things equal i.e. drivers, crossover components e.t.c., towers will always outperform bookshelf in every category. Deep bass because of larger cabinet volume and better soundstage and imaging due to extra woofer/woofers which works together thus reducing distortion.

[@donquixote4630]

I see 3 solutions here : bookshelves with sub for smaller rooms and if you don't suffer from my bias for large floorstandings, my car analogy here being a MiniCooper, then floorstandings for larger rooms, perhaps like a Lexus and lastly, competent floorstandings with 18" subwoofers for palatial spaces, and this may conjure a Bentley isn't it ? The engineer in me discards the second option due to Schroeder room response considerations, see the very different behavior of woofers (room mode) and the rest of the audio spectrum that are subjected to reflections, diffraction, absorption, comb filtering and so on. Great video, as usual, thank you !

[@russellparker4568]

My approach is buy the biggest speaker you can before it starts upsetting your room. It most cases its floor standers.

[@rejean2744]

I love my Revel floorstanders with my dual Klipsch subs. I never use them in my Toyota Camry.

[@timharbert7145]

Dude, in the Camry just replace the rear deck speakers. Infinity Kappa's strongly recommended!

[@noturnleftunstoned72]

Such great, simple and meaningful points. My Ascend Acoustics Sierra-1 bookshelves are stunning, some of the cleanest best sounding mid-range I have heard in any speaker in my 51 years.

[@scientificaudiophile]

Couldn't agree more!

[@gdwlaw5549]

I listen to my loudspeakers hanging upside down wearing a large onion in my crack. They sound great.

[@CarlVanDoren61]

Kodak moment 😮

[@crazyprayingmantis5596]

If it's not a red onion you're not getting the most out of your system

[@mrpeterfromgodknowswhere]

@@crazyprayingmantis5596 But(t) something's getting _into_ his system though..

[@mikedinno8413]

Another great option are vertical MTM like Ascend Acoustic 340SE2. You get the sensitivity and dynamics of a tower speaker.

[@HarakiriRock]

The right choice is the one that fits best in your room. As much as I'd love to have some big sexy floorstanders, my bookshelfs + small subs are more than enough for my small room. Love your channel sir.

[@simpsonbergman2185]

I tried stands for my bookshelf speakers but how do you keep them from falling off? (I have Elac DBR and the monolith stands. The cat jumped on the speaker and it almost fell off.)

[@scientificaudiophile]

A big base helps. Cats are dangerous to stand mounted speakers.

[@unclelou3523]

Bookshelves with a good sub has more upgradability, if you're on a budget today and not buying your "forever" speakers.

[@writenamehere0000]

Any system out there needs a woofer. Woofer adds that magic layer. Bookshelfs or standers, woofer is a must.

[@vvidover]

Twist ending with the Hondas! I like it!

[@carminedesanto6746]

GM…☕️ An interesting conundrum…both have similar footprints ..BUT performance is the thing.👍

[@carlb86]

Bigger is always better. The law of diminishing returns doesn't apply to audiophilia.

[@JoelHernandez-tz3vk]

Which I'm pretty sure this implies your ears are Krakatoa-proof.

[@Bob.martens]

I get very good results with bookstanders.

[@metatron007]

Take a look at the size of the Graham Audio LS5/5 Bookshelf/stand mount speakers. Take a look and then think about low end. You may well be very impressed.

[@gratmatassa5432]

i have stand mount with sub, works superbly.

[@CarlVanDoren61]

Fourth baby mama's rugrat tippy happy Tower's may end the nightmare 😮

[@apparaoapparao]

Subwoofers are great for watching movies…but I feel they are unnecessary for 98.69% of music listening in a home office or bedroom. I made my own speaker stands for $30 each (32.5 inch vertically oriented shoe rack + acoustically pure mounting tape + cutting board). I do not want for more bass with my Kali LP 6v2 in the middle and 1987 purchased BIC Venturi V62s left and right. 🤘

[@wegardfjeld3789]

A musical quality sub will always be worth it especially with stand mount speakers. If you haven't experienced that you need to find a better subwoofer that matches your speakers 😉.

[@HarakiriRock]

I think subs are a requirement. Unless you have huge speakers that can cleanly play in subwoofer territory then you're missing a crucial part of the music. No reason to short yourself like that if you can afford it.

[@apparaoapparao]

I have three subwoofers and use them in other rooms and with other set ups. But, if you have smaller speakers that get down to 39 Hz in an intimate near field environment, the immediacy of the listening experience without a subwoofer is enjoyable.

[@carminedesanto6746]

Good point ..the new Borsten can go phenomenally low…but have the $60k for what is now called a “stand mount “ speaker …and yes ..the stands are expensive too 🍸🍸

[@perlman7376]

Not a slam dunk either way.

[@timharbert7145]

Bookshelf. Less to go wrong in the engineering, design, and manufacturing steps. Isn't this why Bose never made a floor standing model? Toyota RAV4 Hybrid Limited with JBL upgrade. Giant battery makes a difference in the sound.. lol.

[@Gk2003m]

It’s not a debate really. There are drivers, and there is the container of the drivers. The container cannot help but influence the sound produced by the drivers. But the entire room also influences that sound. So, given whatever environment you have, it could be any container.

[@middleearthltd]

One consideration, possibly the biggest one for me, is shipping a floor stander if you want to move on. Also, the size of your listening room is another consideration which is probably numero uno. This video is not up to SA standards and devoid of both sarcasm and humor. If I crudely apply your infinite rating to this video A 40 Ounce KING COBRA malt liquor and a circa 1973 Tijuana street taco with dog/mystery meat.

[@JagadguruSvamiVegananda]

WRONG! The only consideration is, on which speakers does Diane Bish sound better? And obviously, that would be the floor-standing ones.

[@carlb86]

​@@JagadguruSvamiVeganandaabsolutely. And I'll add the only way to rock the Bish is to have a horned speaker like the Klipschorn.

[@CurlyHoward928]

Can't wait to hear your take on Andrew's SourcePoint 8. Be serious for that review.

[@scientificaudiophile]

I'm always serious. Never any joking in my reviews

[@gusgusnft8231]

Will you be reviewing the new SVS Ultra Evolution bookshelves speaker? We need a real review with measurements. I’m tired of these other KZbinrs reviews without presenting any real data to confirm what they are saying.

[@scientificaudiophile]

I haven’t been in contact with SVS. I’ll send them an email and hopefully they’ll respond with a pair.

[@gusgusnft8231]

@@scientificaudiophileI hope SVS sends you a pair 👍.

[@TriAmpMyFi]

. Those are Tower speakers. The Everests & Klipschorns are floorstanders. And every standmount and every tower is a gruesome sonic outgrowth with direct lineage to the 1982 Sony Accoustimass Satellite Surround system for $350. That one system, paralleled with the introduction of VHS introduced America to subwoofers and tiny remote Mains. We LOVED this new format and so did Wives for it's unobtrusiveness. Ever since, manufacturers have only responded to demand for bigger, better and louder etc. Towers & Standmounts have never been a good design. Given a clean sheet of paper, no designer would arrive at either of those forms. It's circular supply/demand think. Acid Jazz, Funk & Brass 🔈🔉🔊

[@TriAmpMyFi]

. Obviously I TriAmp but conventionally, one pair of stereo loudspeakers with one amp will always outperform 2 amps & 3 speakers for hifi playback. It was that Sony system that killed all stereo speaker development. Hell, even now the designs are vintage retro throwbacks like the L100 or Heresy.

[@Starch1b2c3d4a]

Nice drop bro

[@richardwhite7208]

What’s with the cuddly cat?😂

[@scientificaudiophile]

Helmholtz is my best friend!

[@BobbyBass-x6i]

So the message is bookshelves and a sub. Wrong, for me. I have tried that vs. a tower and the towers win every time in my room to my ears. Your opinion is valid but it’s your opinion only. Not the answer for all. Nice kitty. 😊

[@wegardfjeld3789]

To each its own. I love both for what they do, but from what you get for your money pov a bookshelf with a good sub wins every time. This isn't something new thou 😉.

[@bilguana11]

Active subs with DSP have latency.

[@charleskatz2606]

Latency is no longer consider devienat according to the DSM IV

[@bilguana11]

@@charleskatz2606 DSM IV?

[@mrpeterfromgodknowswhere]

Which is why you delay your main speakers to match the latency.

[@bilguana11]

@@mrpeterfromgodknowswhere OK for music, not so much for video.

[@mrpeterfromgodknowswhere]

@@bilguana11 Oh, you mean in correlation to the image? Many TV's have delay correction today. But I have never found that to be an issue. The latency needs to be higher to be a problem perhaps.

[@jimfarrell4635]

What about Floorshelf and Bookstanders? I'm very disappointed in you this week, SA.

[@scientificaudiophile]

We need to create our own speaker company and market this genius idea.

[@catherinelugg4321]

Alas, the question also fails to consider if one has a healthy back--or not. Life time member of the bad back club?? Bookshelf speakers and a small sub will be "good enough" and will keep you out of the MD's office. Healthy back? Go get your favorite floor standers. I'm nothing if a pragmatic audio nerd.

[@realitykicksin8755]

I cannot stand bookshelf speakers with less than an 8" mid woofer.

[@scientificaudiophile]

I’m currently testing the MoFi SourcePoint 8’s. A couple weeks before that review is ready.

[@wegardfjeld3789]

Try Buchardt s400 MK2 with proper setup. Got them going flat down to 35hz in my room. CSS criton 1 td-x or Galion TS Voyager TL. All above got 6.5 to 5.25" elements and what they do at the lower end will impress you. They do all other stuff great aswell.

[@photo_n_art]

Where do you buy your jackets, Goodwill? Apparently "audiophiles" can't afford a dentist, I guess all the money goes to the gear 🤷‍♂️

[@scientificaudiophile]

I got my jacket from a bum in exchange for a bottle of Mad Dog 20-20. And yes, every penny goes to audio because science proves teeth do not help audio.