What Sonic's moveset SHOULD have been in Super Smash Bros. - SGK Discussions

[@lukemedina19]

Kels I have so much respect that as a Sonic player you’re able to acknowledge what other people dislike about the character. As someone who grew up playing sonic games I wish they put as much thought into the character as you did here.

[@willh2o701]

I wish that sonic had brawl exprssions like they were perfect

[@BlueJack222]

Unfortunately that won't be possible because of the Sega mandates

[@2F4M73]

@@BlueJack222 what you mean?

[@crisisboy5822]

@@2F4M73 sega doesn't allow sonic to be expressive anymore

[@2F4M73]

@@crisisboy5822 sad

[@LunaMinuna]

And now he’s just an emotionless hollow hedgehog

[@Mark---W]

I think Project M got Sonic moveset nearly perfect.

[@Zen-lf3jh]

Fr

[@ahmadkazan7994]

True.

[@mastrsonic375]

Almost

[@justasonicthehedgehogfan562]

What about Crusade?

[@mrcrumpet3915]

& Knuckles, too.

[@heartbreak1740]

Have him say “ur to slow”

[@thebluedevil4652]

That's the only thing we need

[@ahmadkazan7994]

Yes.

[@justasonicthehedgehogfan562]

Nintendo needs to hire Roger Craig Smith to voice Sonic instead of recycling his voice clips from 3DS-Wii U. He needs to say "Ur 2 Slow!!!".

[@reversenoobz1]

@@justasonicthehedgehogfan562 nah roger craig smith just is a bad sonic voice actor im sorry but its true

[@justasonicthehedgehogfan562]

Reverse Noobz Actually,he's been doing a great job in Boom series,Twitter Takeover and etc. Let me tell ya somethin' Jason Griffith was friends with Roger,Ryan and Jaleel. It's 100% real.

[@octoooooo8065]

The main reason why sonics moves don’t really represent anything is because Sakurai only played sonic the fighters and sonic 06, if he tried sonic advance 2 I’m sure he’ll understand sonic more and do a complete remake, similar to what this video describes

[@brandonbriggs5520]

It's kinda understandable why though Sonic is not really popular in Japan

[@ahmadkazan7994]

@@brandonbriggs5520 team sonic racing's seccond most effective market was Japan.Selling more than 15000 copies first day Forces was received much better in japan (Japan had good dialogue for infinite) And sega overhaul is one of the best companies in japan,not only vedio games,they have a shit ton of stuff in japan.

[@brandonbriggs5520]

@@ahmadkazan7994 Oh didn't know about the sales for TSR, I know there are Japanese people love Sonic but comparing the popularity in US. and especially in UK Japan doesn't come close

[@jerrisatyourwindow]

That is not true really, most of sakurai information came from a collection game about him that included the first 3 He realized that sonic changed a lot throughout the series and was kinda confused, he decided to base sonic’s character of the first 3 He called the games a one button game, a game that could be accomplish with a single button (just like Kirby apparently) So that would explain why his attacks are so simple

[@jerrisatyourwindow]

sourcegaming.info/2016/07/24/sonic-the-hedgehog-joins-the-battle/

[@redz0065]

I gotta admit, I'll be okay with the side-b being the boost. However I originally wanted it to be the light speed dash. Some thing similar to Pac-Man but he throws a trail of rings and with some speed.

[@Omen_Rocks123]

Yh light speed dash would be cool for him like he should also have wind tornado aswell like it feels like I’m playing a suppressed version of sonic in smash bros

[@tjlnintendo]

It should be like the one in sonic battle. Where sonic throws ring in an arc

[@wolfdragox5563]

Any option is better than his current side-b, ffs Sakurai WHY?!

[@tjh6678]

I think a light speed dash side-B would be really cool if it worked like a hybrid of Pac-Man's pellet chain & Fox's Phantom move.

[@orangeslash1667]

@@wolfdragox5563 Sonic side B is a reference to Sonic's spin Dash from Sonic CD. Spin Charge collides with the opponent. Spin dash goes through the opponent.

[@Sjono]

“My biggest issues with Sonic is that he has no facial expressions” That’s my biggest pet peeve with Mega Man as well

[@BlueJack222]

Well they did based him off the early Mega Man games so he didn't really have many expressions

[@Sjono]

Bluejack 22 Nearly every character on the roster that appeared in the 3rd gen didn’t show any emotions since the tech didn’t allow for it. Doesn’t make sense to single Mega Man out. Hell R.O.B. was a peripheral for that gen and he still shows more emotion than Mega Man does in these games

[@ffiiggyy]

@@Sjono Is MegaMan really that expressionless?

[@Sjono]

@@ffiiggyy In the SSB series he is. Not at all in his own series

[@ffiiggyy]

@@Sjono I'm asking in terms of Smash.

[@thebluedevil4652]

Amazing video kels, I think sonic is terribly represented in smash in moveset soundtrack and stages. Sonic is one of the biggest icons not only in videogames but also Worldwide, he deserves better representation in the biggest videogame crossover ever. But that's just my opinion NICE VIDEO :3

[@Ptscf2]

I personally feel it is partially Sonic's moves that make him not feel like Sonic, but it is also how the game mechanics work for Sonic to make him not in your face cocky and instead patient and then taking the opponent out if they make a mistake. I know that is player preference and a lot would need to be thought out to make that different, but I feel just rewarding an aggro playstyle while punishing patience and stalling fits Sonic's character much better. So while I feel the move changes here would reflect more of what he did in his games, it really doesn't do what it needs to do to represent him as a character. A big change that would work off of his games and in Smash to offset the patience would be having him skid when he is done running like none of the other characters do anymore. This would make it so your run is a commitment, but the reward is just how quick he is on the ground. What I want from Sonic is a true burst option character, point a to point b with precision would be heavily rewarded while just running around will get you clobbered.

[@Driff97]

One thing I would change about Sonic is the sound he makes when jumping. There's already plenty of jumps in smash that have that classic jump sound feel. The Marios, Ice Climbers, Wario slightly, Kirby, Villager, ETC. Like yeah, they do differ in sound but in the case of sonic I just want his modern jump sound. The "Cha" when he jumps and "whhowhowho" when he double jumps-Just look up Sonic Generations gameplay and you'll get what I mean.

[@TempestKrimps]

i can hear that "cha" and "whhowhowho" in my head

[@Kevin-tv3vp]

That’s present in his dodge animations

[@D00DM00D]

Yeah, the classic jump is outdated

[@alexbaribeault]

I getcha. Agreed

[@Mark---W]

They should gotten inspiration from Sonic Battle moveset.

[@octoooooo8065]

But the thing is Sakurai didn’t play that game, if he did then sonics move set would be different to what it is now

[@donathan2933]

EXACTLY!

[@BlueJack222]

Well if you think about a Sonic battle is obscure as well a forgettable Game Boy title

[@donathan2933]

@@BlueJack222 still shoulda played the game

[@bellebuster5057]

@@BlueJack222 Yeah... you haven't been looking on YT lately, all the uploads and HD playthroughs on the years would prove you wrong immediately, just gotta do some actual research before typing.

[@Chixel]

If this happens or if Sora gets added, i'll play the game again, until then i'll be waiting. Btw this is absolutely perfect

[@destrocore50]

Play Super Smash Flash 2 for him. It's a fanmade game

[@stevenmcburney8167]

@@destrocore50 it’s not the same tho

[@destrocore50]

@@stevenmcburney8167 yeah..

[@AGGSab]

@@stevenmcburney8167 it’s still a very good game though

[@El_Mince]

Well, sora got added

[@MikeyProHD]

It's so disappointing that Sonic is the only 3rd party character that is poorly represented. Hopefully Sakurai and the development team sees this.

[@intensifies6653]

Ngl mega man is one too

[@thoparchive6154]

Well if you think about it, Snake can also be seen as misrepresented. I mean his goto weapons are a knife and a pistol (or silenter) which are good choices for stealth. However they're both not present instead he uses explosive-base weapons.

[@MikeyProHD]

@@thoparchive6154 that's prolly cuz of smash ultimates e10+ rating.

[@MikeyProHD]

@@intensifies6653 huh, you think so? I think mega man is one of the best represented

[@thoparchive6154]

@@MikeyProHD that didn't stop joker from being in. He has both handgun and a knife

[@bluesclues9766]

Can we have sonic say, "You're too slow" back one day? I am not a fan of him saying, "Sonic speed" when using down taunt. Its less of a taunt and more of a kid running around shouting sonic speed. Anyways I found this moveset and animation change ideas to sound really cool and awesome sonic representation. I mean why can't Sonic dance, but Mario can.

[@ahmadkazan7994]

My moveset for sonic would be: -Jab:I change it so it would come out faster (frame 1 instead of frame 3,fasyest thing alive) the finisher into the one from sonic battle,it would have less range but the knockback angle allows for easier jab locks and it would be safer on shiel than his current kick finisher. -ftilt:I would keep it just to refference sonic the fighters (and holy shit what is that range),probably come out faster,sonic's frame data is okayish but not for the fastest in game. -down tilt:comes a frame faster and a knockback angle change,animatio changed to more reference the slide kick from unleashed.And make his hit box actually reach his full leg shakuria. -up tilt:Comes out 2 frames faster and PLEASE change it to his up draft instead of the captin falcon rip off Dash attack:his forward R after a spring from sonic advance 2. F-smash:This is an intresting one,if I keep it I would make it come out much faster (sonic's smash attack frame data is AWFUL),or make sonic simi transform to the werehog when charging it and releasing his hand p,range would be similar to belemonth (keep the big big range to min min,she already losses to sonic in my opinion) -up smash-up tilt but using both his feet/keep the old one but absolutely destroy the start up and end lag and decrease it's power. -down smash:obvious,sonic flare,maybe make it cover more range than shiek on the price of having longer animation so opponents can think of a better punish than with shiek. Homing attack:more like his games,quick burst to the opponents that comes outs frame 7 on the price of like you said,whenever sonic looks at the opponent a fetid would appear allowing the to shield/air dodge out of the way,it will only do 8% and can't be charged but has way less end lag,AND he would do a random out of 3 air taunts (please) Down B:keep it,May e make it more consistent. Side B:I'd say boost is a tad "too fast",maybe make it a much faster version of fox's side B with less end lag and set knockback so it can be a combo tool and lead to kill set ups,in the air it would act like pikachu's quick attack but shorter(still cancelable on platforms I really want sonic to have this type of movement it fits him so much) and doesn't put him into free fall Up B:Spring I say is too iconic to be replaced,but i would change it that sonic would do a cool trick while bouncing of it. Taunts:I don'thin them just give him his brawl voice lines and expresions(I'd say brawl sonic's model is the best out of the 3),his new moveset would absolutely deny camping but imagine how salty people would be if sonic said "your too slow" before a time out (rhough his new moveset would butcher the ability to camp" Now for the aireals my favorite part for. Neutral air:comes out faster,resembles the insta shield. F-air:A 3 year old with the IQ of room temperature would know what it is,sonic eagle is absolutely my most requested addition,it would have a hit box that can spike while the other is a sour spot that can combo into aother sour spot fair (you won't be able to land the spike I you miss the first one)giving it a bit of combo potential,and comes out faster. Up air:I will keep it but along with fixing it I would say sonic's arms will do a rock music pose after connecting the back air.Up air already has great start up frame data,good auto cancel window and so little end lag,but I am trying to make sonic the more rush down character so I will take some damage for faster up air. Back air-same,maybe comes out faster. Now for extra's Throws:maybe give them knockback angle changes they all look good. Model:back to brawl Fall (sonic has no real free fall):yours it would fot sonic so well. I would make him a fast faller so he can combo better,but being a fast faller would make spring take him up much higher and he already has an excellent recovery. So missed any thing?

[@drpeaches89]

If he had this moveset I would pick up Sonic in a heart beat. Talking about every move, the history, and even going over how you would change his taunts, pose, etc makes me wish this was what we got. Great stuff!

[@TempestKrimps]

it bothers me so unbelievably much to think that if sonic was added in melee he'd probably have his sonic adventure 2 style and moves

[@NinJaguar]

These are fantastic changes for Sonic, making him a lot flashier and representative of modern Sonic. Favorite changes here are the Boost implementation, having the Homing Attack target, the Fox-like U-smash and Tornado Jump replacing Spring Jump

[@SonicFan-nt3qj]

No I would keep spring it's too iconic to get rid of

[@espurrseyes42]

*Jab:* Keep the 1 2 Kick to mirror Mario's combo he took from SM64. *F-Tilt:* Keep. I think it's from actual Sonic material, and it's a unique attack. *U-Tilt:* If not Up Kick, keep this because it looks cool. *D-Tilt:* For reason, I'd rather this get changed to a more generic low kick. *Dash:* Slide. *N-Air:* Instant Shield. *F-Air:* Don't even need to say it. *B-Air:* This can stay, but I'd rather the animation be changed a bit to look like the Humming Top from the Advance games. *U-Air:* I'm honestly fine with this, and I'd rather he not get some kind of somersault kick. *D-Air:* Either alter the animation to look like the Battle dive kick (Sonic Rocket I think), or give him the Bounce and make it work like a Greninja D-Air. *F-Smash:* Keep. *U-Smash:* Up Draft. *D-Smash:* Don't remember what this is from (I think Battle), but I think Sonic had some kind of move where he breakdances and follows up with a handstand. Whatever it's from, I don't want D-Tilt being a sweep kick so there's less overlap with this. *N-Spec:* Only thing I really care about is that he needs to pose after the Homing Attack hits something. *S-Spec:* I'd rather he keep this Spin Dash than the mash one on D-Spec. Alter it to be more committal. No jump cancelling out of it. Also give it a gimmick to charge it up like an SA Light Speed Attack/Dash to hold onto for later, allowing him to do an armored Boost forward. *U-Spec:* Blue Tornado is what it's called, and that's not how it works. You can't really get rid of the Spring. It's an iconic item from the series, and as a move, it quickly shoots him into the air as a Sonic recovery should do. Only things I'd the launch animation (make him rotate like he does in the Classic games) and the free fall animation (just give him a normal one and not that weird tumble). *D-Spec:* Don't feel like looking up the name, but that projectile wave he had in Battle. Have him shoot that off as a short to mid-range projectile, allowing you to mash it on the ground to shoot a bigger wave that travels a bit further. And of course the air version fires diagonally. *Final Smash:* Keep Super Sonic, but turn it into some kind of cinematic attack.

[@ssbbbest]

Great video, quick mention Sonic's F-Air comes from his Hyper Mode exclusive move in Sonic the Fighters called the Emerald Dive.

[@yujirohamna2430]

Yeah Sonic is really the most incomplete characters in the game.

[@ElasticLove12]

I think this is overall an improvement I’d like to see his somersault from sonic adventure 2 as his dash attack or down tilt and also I feel he needs to keep his spring maybe rework how it functions but it’s too iconic to remove in my opinion

[@Bluelightspeed26]

I have another good idea for sonic's side B: depending on where you aim, rings will appear next to sonic, and sonic will perform a light speed dash wherever the rings are

[@Roze_aye]

I feel like the only one who doesnt like the idea of sonic eagle being his fair. I dont necessarily like the weirdness of his current fair, but i do like the horizontal carry potential it has.

[@Gianluca_GMS]

lets make a petition and make it happen! Im SO in.

[@metalhyper1929]

I love this video, Sonic is one of my favorite characters in Smash despite the lack of truly good series representation through stages and movesets. One of the biggest problems definitely was the switch from Brawl to 4 where most of his personality seemed to have been removed, I think he would be cooler to watch just from some added flair to his moves. Additionally on a smaller note, I believe during Smash 4 development Roger wasn't able to come on to record new lines which I totally understand (I could be wrong about that though, i'm speaking mostly from memory), I wish though when Ultimate was made that they would have gotten him to record a couple of unique lines at the very least for victories and taunts instead of reusing lines from other games, I feel it would've shown a bit more care placed in the character. Hopefully at some point Sonic gets the rework he desperately needs and deserves. (Let's just say it says a lot that his victory theme was ripped right from 06)

[@DangerousArmyGuy]

I really enjoyed the 06 victory theme, but yeah, Sonic needs more love like any other famous character in Smash Bros.

[@renamamiya158]

I don't mind the 06 victory theme, but they really should've added the his world guitar part after it just like 06, like cloud got his extended theme why couldn't sonic.

[@jnastee6799]

They need to bring back "You're too slow!"

[@stevenmcburney8167]

Ikr, like I know sonics already toxic as is online but it feels like he’s not as toxic as he should be

[@Tiajuan]

This video actually hits me on a personal level. I was a huge fan of Sonic he's the first character I ever played but the series went to hell and then Brawl happened and I basically tuned out of Sonic for so long. Sonic has now been in 3 games and in all 3 he feels like an imitation of Sonic. I always wanted to see some of his specials implement. Instead it's weird moves and a bunch of spinning that looks the same.

[@LexStormA]

Sonic is my biggest problem with Smash Bros. For a guy who goes out of his way to do heavy research on characters, making sure their movesets and stages are packed with references and nods to the series if not having them play close to how they play in their games, Sonic seems to be a giant, walking, contradiction. He is a character that, both by himself and his stages, seems to have been made by someone who found out who he was yesterday and threw him together in the five minutes that came after that discovery. And man does it show. It's no coincidence that the character with the most half-assed atempt at a unique moveset ended up being one of the most boring/annoying characters in the series. And honestly, the more Smash games come out with nothing being done to correct this the less inclined I feel to play them. It just bothers me so much that all these newcomers get so much love and detail put into them but Sonic is just a hollow shell of what he actually is. The amount of thought put into him, his stages, and even music selection is so incredibly lacking that I can't help but feel it was done out of pure spite towards the character over anything else. It's the only thing that makes me believe "Sakurai bias" actually exists

[@orangeslash1667]

Sonic is really good at edge guarding.

[@forever_sonic]

I thought of a new moveset for Sonic and its not very different to this one. Sonic doesn't have much representation and I think I fixed it with the moveset I thought of. Jab: 2 punches and ends with Top Kick (Sonic Battle) Up Tilt: Sonic Updraft (Sonic Battle) Side Tilt: Same Down Tilt: Sweep Kick (Sonic Unleashed/Sonic 06) It would be innovated to be like both versions of the sweep kick. Dash Attack: Slide (Modern sonic games) Only Smash attack I would change is down smash Down Smash: Sonic Flare (Sonic Battle) If done at 0% he will do Sonic Wind, a blue tornado as tall as Sonic himself wouldmove forward for a few seconds. This counts as a projectile. This is also similar to how Links side smash works. Aerials: NAIR: Humming Top (Sonic Advance Trilogy) Insta shield is a tad too simple FAIR: Sonic Eagle (Sonic Battle) His heel is the sweet spot where it spikes BAIR: Same UAIR: Its like his FAIR now but its a UAIR, similar to when he jumps off a spring in Sonic CD DAIR: Bounce Bracelet (SA2) It would work similar to Greninjas DAIR but less stiff and it would spike sometimes. If done onto a platform he would bounce only once. Specials: Neutral B: Homing attack is the same but he would do tricks if you hit it and if you press B again he would do a Sonic Storm. If you press A instead, he would do the homing kick from SLW Wii U. The reticle also appears when first about to homing attack. While charging the homing attack, when fighting 2 or more opponents, you can change who you want to target by moving the control stick. Side B: Sonic Boost (Modern Sonic games) this isn't as op as it sounds. Sonic will have a boost gauge next to his %. To refil, it would work just like Inkling refilling their ink gauge. Sheilding and holding B will put sonic in a spin dash animation and will begin to fill the boost gauge. It would be a little slow though. Up B: Same BUT, the spring would look more like how it is now and Sonic would spin spiraly with some blue aura. If the B button is pressed again, he will do the upward trick from the Sonic Advance Trilogy. (This has no hitbox) Down Special: Fire Somersault (SA2) It would work similar to how it is in the game. Pressing the special button 3 time will be needed to do the complete attack. Thoughts?

[@32xios69]

I would keep the down special the same.

[@TreadywayYT]

Tbh, this move set starts to make more sense Sonic is fast always on the run on the moves you get that feel with his character all of it makes sense this is the best move set for him

[@nesstar64]

I am a Sonic Main myself and even I admit Sonic is POORLY represented in Smash

[@sc.willis]

U saying the tornado for up special earned u a subscription and the notification bell👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾

[@NickBarrett-ko3fu]

This was great and hope that sakurai use this type of moveset for the next smash game if it does happen.

[@donathan2933]

I wish Sonic had his moves from Sonic Battle and the Adventure games

[@justasonicthehedgehogfan562]

Do Nathan What about Sonic Advance and other Sonic games where he used boosts like Unleashed and Generations?

[@orangeslash1667]

@@justasonicthehedgehogfan562 Sakurai is worried that giving Sonic a boost meter would make him over powered .

[@donathan2933]

@@orangeslash1667 so tf what? Sounds like nonsense

[@orangeslash1667]

@@donathan2933 Sonic had custom move in Smash 4 that is a reference to the Flaming summersault in SA 2. Sadly that's it.

[@crazydaysinfinte]

The efect in the sonic the hedgehog three when you press the a button after jumping is called the Insta shield

[@mipo5535]

"The spring's gotta go " ok that's too much. I don't see anything bad with this move. It's a great recovery so Idk what the problem is here sorry.

[@x2buller47]

I'm so happy to see this on my birthday!!!

[@MoonlightSama.mp3]

Happy birthday :)

[@x2buller47]

@@MoonlightSama.mp3 Thank you!!!!!!!!!!

[@Chixel]

Happi birthdi

[@x2buller47]

@@Chixel Thank you so much!!!

[@x2buller47]

@Ultra Saiyan Thank you so much!!!!

[@hektorenyioko5018]

Really well-made video, and I agree fullheartedly with this. Sonic's been done dirty in the Super Smash Bros games after Brawl to be honest.

[@GloryerPog]

As a Sonic main, this is an amazing idea of how Sonic’s moveset should’ve been throughout the course of him being in Smash! I also like how you bring up Sonic’s lack of emotion in the game and trying to give him more attitude!

[@user-uz2sj4zs7i]

love the boost gimmick, keep the iconic spring.

[@juancarlosalvaradolima885]

I'm watching videos of these type for inspirations and you, with other guy I forgot the name xD, are the ones who best describe the stuffs what will change of Sonic. Thanks so much!

[@donovandeputee1771]

What if when he died it would play the sound when you lose rings kinda like mega man

[@jamiedandy8311]

Sonic has a classic death sound I’d rather have that and have him lose actual rings with the ring loss sound after opponents big smash hits land on him

[@game84cube]

If we aren't gonna give him a meter, then here's my take on his moveset. Jabs: Remain, but the final kick could be the Top Kick from Battle, and add a kick pummel considering his speed Tilts: All except F-Tilt remain. F-Tilt could be a side kick from Fighters. Down Smash: Sonic Flare Up Smash: Sonic Updraft Side Smash: How about a Drop Kick? He flips and then shoots out his legs. That kind of thing. N-Air: Insta-Shield from Advance. Back Air: Windmill Kick from Battle F-Air: Sonic Eagle from Battle. A Spike and could provide mild footstool effect if aimed right Up Air: A flip Kick like Mario to excentuate their old rivalry D-Air: Make his current one go faster. It's the Stomp move from current games Grab and pummel remain Up Throw: Sonic runs around his opponent then punts them upwards. A take on a scene from CD's ending Back Throw: Remains Down Throw: Sonic could do something similar, but could use his Peel-Out feet to pummel his opponents into the ground Forward Throw: a Front Flip and he throws his opponent forward, like the Back Throw, but with one flip Neutral Special: Homing Attack goes faster like in Adventure, but can only be used 3 times, showcased by the trick Sonic performs like in Adventure 2 Down Special: Spin Dash. Hold the button for Side style, mash for Down style. Use in Mid-Air for Drop Dash Up Special: aim a Spring while charging from Yellow to Red. Can be used on the ground sideways for damage (Sonic rolls along the ground like in the Genesis days) Side Special: Boost Run, functions like Wario's Bike or Jigglypuff's Rollout. Either that or a Light Dash, functioning like Battle's attack Final Smash: Super Sonic Light Attack. A cinematic move. Sonic throws a Warp Ring, sending his opponents into the Special Zone, he transforms and blasts around the screen at light speed. Also I'd change the side Taunt. Sonic should spin around in place, strike a pose with two fingers up and say a random line like "Piece of cake!", "No sweat!", "Too easy!", "Bring it on!" Etc. Sonic should have way more voice lines, honestly. That's my take. Your stuff rocks!

[@intensifies6653]

Love the background music and was *looking* for a vid this specific topic bruh Thx kels

[@ManaAdvent]

Honestly one way to make Sonic more unique is too implement the Elemental Shields of Sonic 3 to his shield block and have it cycled. Electromagnetic Shield would draw in items on the battlefield close to him Fire Shield would damage those who melee attack Bubble Shield would reflect projectiles and bounce off him.

[@conair2786]

Not gonna lie, Super Smash Flash 2 gave him the Light Speed Dash as his Side Special. The move he was known using since Adventure 1. The SSF2 version is perfect at reflecting its appearance in Adventure 1; as he says "Ready?" and "GO!" when he uses it. It would be like Wolf's side special but I can imagine he can change the angle of it.

[@SwohpinPlays]

So the homing attack has the target system but when you homing attack its shows the target

[@smashblaster1-up190]

I thought that Sonic's Jab would be the three attacks he performed on Zavok in Sonic Forces, I really liked how his Up Air looked in Brawl so I'm I wanted to revert to that, Sonic's Down Smash would be great if they used that move from Sonic Battle, For Sonic's Up Throw, I would love it if they used that throw Sonic used against Honey in the Archie Comics, since we're also trying to make Sonic more like his modern incarnation I feel like his running animation should be changed to, but these are primarily my changes I would make

[@kayorego6420]

Okay... Let's say that Sonic's old up air animation from brawl actually reuses Wolf's up smash, sonic was rushed so they used other characters animations as a base, also I think that in smash 4 they had issues finding any type of effect that would fit the animation well, also the animation in brawl just don't fit the hitboxes well... But I did like it even if it don't read nicely, in smash 4 they game sonic more unique animations for his brawl moves but for some reason they don't redesigned him like they did with some other old characters, Bowser got quite the redesign in smash 4 why was sonic not able to

[@orangeslash1667]

@@kayorego6420 Sonic is really good at edge guarding, but its not easy.

[@zeroxenoverse9251]

I would change Sonic's idle animation to his advance or battle animation. I mean like, he's in a fighting games so gotta give him a fighting pose like how Mario got one, but I agree on what you came up with. Also add on the blue tornado: If Sonic is in the tornado,he will gain height but if his enemies are, not only they gain height but also take damage.

[@ashketchum6585]

OH MY GOSH, this moveset is perfect! But I think that his up B should be that ring toss move from Sonic Battle but with more air and they need to change his voice lines back to "you're too slow!", "come on, step it up!".

[@louishunter944]

honestly took the words right out of my mouth. Couldn't have made a better move imo!

[@morphstarchangeling8024]

I would love if they could sneak a reference to the easter egg in Sonic CD where if you wait around too long Sonic leaves and you get a game over. Have it be an easter egg for staying idle too long or have him reenact the scene if you stay on the win screen for a little while. Little touches that would bring sonic to life.

[@luislorenzo1581]

O what could've been :( I completely agree with lots of these ideas. Although i would keep his Up b but switch up its properties. Instead of just going upwards without moving, he could have his jumping animation from classic games like mania where he starts spinning around while going up. And then add a hitbox to that spinning animation so it could be a multi hit (Similar to his current fair but aiming upwards)

[@classicspeeder]

the homing attack reticle would also be nice because there has been so many times where it didn't lock on and I just went into the kill plane

[@Jstarredchaos]

Great video i'd basically change everything you changed except I'd make his bounce a part of his down special. When he is in the air, the spin dash will change to the bounce. Since he can't spin dash in the air.

[@mariepyre8032]

Looking back, this moveset is pretty good. However, there are a couple more things I'd change as well. Side Tilt - I'd actually keep this the same, as it just looks nice and would still function the same as your idea anyway. Down Tilt - I'd move the Sonic Flare to his Down Smash, and make his Down Tilt the Foot Sweep from Sonic Unleashed and Sonic 06. Up Air - I'd probably move his old Forward Air to his Up Air so that it actually would reference something: His Spring Animation from Sonic CD. Down Air - I'd keep it the same as it was, as it resembles both the Sonic Rocket from Battle and the Stomp from the Modern games. It'd be cooler if it had a landing hitbox, however. Up Special - A more fitting Up Special would be the Lightspeed Dash, but it behaves differently than one would expect. Like in Sonic Battle, he throws a ring in one of eight directions and then immediately follows after it. It'd have a short range, being around half the length of Falco's Up Special, but he wouldn't be sent into freefall. Down Special - In the air, this is where the Bounce would be used instead of as a down air. Up Throw - This would be the Blue Tornado instead, since in Sonic Heroes it doesn't really send him up all that much. Down Throw - About the same, but it'd use the projectile of the Sonic Wave to send foes just a bit further.

[@Velocity_YT]

Even though I don't completely agree with some of the moves you gave Sonic, they are still a million times better than what Sakurai gave him at the end of the day. Nice video. You just earned another sub. Congrats!

[@redsamuraix7705]

Great Idea of Sonic's Moveset from Bros Ultimate! It would give him more character than ever before in other Smash titles!!!

[@roryrainbow77]

Yes Kels, I love the boost meter idea so much, and having boost over spin dash would be so invigorating and change his dynamic so much. I also agree that homing attack change would improve it on both sides 👍🏻 I forgot that PM had a more faithful free falling animation, and I have to really agree the official smash version is awkward. Whenever a sonic player up bs early and high they just look super vulnerable and weird for doing it These three things are the biggest changes I'd be down to see. Alot of the other changes would be great, would make him revitalizing and he definitely needs more expressiveness.

[@Darian610]

I made my own moveset. Jab: Punch, Punch, Kick/Mach Punches Dash Attack: Spin Attack Side Tilt: Somersault Up Tilt: Sonic Up Draft Down Tilt: Spin Kick Side Smash: Wind-Up Punch Up Smash: Blue Tornado Down Smash: Sonic Flare Neutral Air: Insta-Shield Forward Air: Sonic Eagle Back Air: Humming Top Up Air: Loop Kick Down Air: Bound Jump Forward Throw: Sonic Boom Back Throw: Multiflip Throw Up Throw: Top Kick Down Throw: Grand Slam Neutral Special: Homing Attack Side Special: Boost Up Special: Wild Rush Down Special: Spin Dash Down Special Air: Drop Dash Final Smash: Super Sonic 2 jumps Can wall jump.

[@Spider-Man-257]

This along Shadow as a final DLC fighter would be perfect.

[@freedomfighter7488]

I would change his side B into Run Dash just like Banjo and Kazooie in order to by pass projectiles and give good opportunities to land his hits without being out camp and out space by his opponents.

[@wishbushwashbosh6443]

Honestly, I think the spin dash and the homing attack should both be the neutral B. Sonic never spin-dashes in air. The spin-dash has always been a thing you can only do on the ground. I would like this change because it makes sonic less campy and would be more accurate to how to spin dash functions. The homing attack would be neutral B in the air. While the homing attack and spin dash aren’t the same buttons in the adventure series, it would still carry over the core idea of both moves as they share the same button. It would also help open more slots for moves.

[@Spiney_Spinosaurus]

We can all agree that if sonic had these better attacks for his move set, he’d be more op then he already is

[@Angie2343]

12:08 You got that down pat! Jaleel White would be proud!

[@Random30276]

I feel like the number 1 thing i want going into this video is not having 2 of his specials be spindashes

[@DKSRaichu]

I wholeheartedly agree. What you're saying makes perfect sense. Sonic needs alot more attitude and clearly alot more OOMPH in his moveset, animations, and specials. It is not without any constructive opinions that I can see what the devs were trying to do for him in terms of originality, but it just doesn't click if not done right, especially without the reliance of proper research FOR Sonic. He needs pizazz, he needs certain moves that makes Sonic... well, Sonic lol.

[@murdcrockdolphin]

I really liked a lot of your ideas for changes and i'm glad i'm not the only one who thinks the homing attack shouldn't be able to be charged up since you just can't do that in the sonic games. However one idea i thought of is that if you do choose to hold down neutral b while in the air sonic would do the drop dash from sonic mania as a quick and instant burst of speed along the ground that can be charged up in the air. It could work as a great way of charging into the opponent and playing aggressively since i really feel like sonic should be a character that should play aggressively like captain falcon who quite literally plays like how sonic should in smash. As for smaller stuff I'd like it if sonic had a taunt where he would either spin around a chilidog and then eat it. Or he throws it upwards and then catches it behind him and then eats the chilidog which are both references to the intro cutscene from sonic and the black knight. Sonic waggling his finger I could definitely see as a victory animation where he runs past a sign post maybe even having a detail where it shows the opponents face (if in a 1v1) or the character that got second place (if in a free for all) instead of eggmans face like it normally does. But then sonic runs back around and quickly does a jump and begins waggling his finger. Also i agree that sonic needs to have more facial expressions again like he did in brawl and more fluid animations that could represent how sonic during the adventure era was much 'lankier' but also had more fluid movement in his artwork i think that'd be great as a nice attention to detail.

[@100organicfreshmemes5]

I think SideB would be even better and more unique if the Sonic Rush version was the main inspiration. Taking hits in Sonic Rush makes you lose boost meter and this would translate to making him more skillful in Smash, as opposed to characters like Little Mac and Cloud being rewarded for taking damage. To offset this if you fill the meter completely Sonic enters Overcharge, indicated by the meter flashing and the ring at the end spinning, granting unlimited use of Boost. Overcharge ends either when Sonic gets hit or when the ring stops spinning, which can be reset by hitting an opponent. Either way after Overcharge ends the meter is dropped to 1/3 of full capacity. Also for N-Air the change should actually affect his gameplay too, as it could make him more unique. The insta-shield could be a disjointed hitbox around Sonic to help him beat out other attacks, but of course there would be trade offs and it would require good timing. The insta-shield hitbox would be the strongest part of the move but only last around 3 frames, and then there would be 2 progressively weaker hitboxes that lack the disjoint after the insta-shield ends for the next dozen or so frames. His n-air would also come out 1 or 2 frames slower as well, if necessary. I also have to disagree about changing his up-b. If the animations are what bothers you it'd be great if he spun around while looking up after the move like in Sonic CD or Mania.

[@masteroftheocarina2709]

I was watching the video and before you talked about the side special I was like "what if he had his boost and when he did damage to people a gage fills up and lets it last longer with more damage". and then it got to the part about where you talked about it and I was like, "yes". Sonic's move set had so much potential but they completely missed the mark on a move set that could have been really good.

[@zekromfan1]

I’d say another thing would be to have Sonic do a trick after every homing attack, have the Tension gauge act like it did in Rush to where if you have it over full you would have unlimited usage of the boost for a few seconds. And for the Final Smash, it obviously has to be Super Sonic, but what if it was a cinematic Final Smash, or what if it acted like Pit’s Final Smash? As it is the a Final Smash is probably one of the worst in the game. Also what if the Light Speed Dash was his up special, it would work similarly to Pac-Man’s side special, and the PK boys up specials. It would be a two stage move which is ungimbable, as even if the opponent collects some of the rings they would be putting themselves at risk. The second stage would be the Light Speed Attack as seen in Adventure. If used on the ground you would get to choose between them, but in the air it’s a bit more limited. You would first have to store energy which could look like it does in either SA1 or 2 doesn’t really matter, it can’t be knocked out of him unless he loses a stock. And it works like a semi instant homing attack which functions like PK Thunder 2 albeit a bit weaker with similar kill potential. And the homing attack could work in two stages, maybe it functions like it does currently, or it works similarly to Lost World, and you can lock on to multiple opponents which would weaken it a bit, or you could charge it on one which would make it do more damage and knock back, or you could do a kick which does more damage on shields and does more knock back than the regular homing attack, but only hits one opponent. The theme I’m going for in this moveset is a good combo game kinda like Joker but with more kill options. His moves need to flow into each other, and he needs to be less vulnerable since Sonic would never allow himself to be vulnerable. But on those off chances that you catch him at his weakest is when you can turn the tides. Anyway that’s all for now, have a nice day, stay happy, stay healthy, and most importantly stay safe!!!

[@MetaKnuxXbeats]

These changes would of been amazing. Sonic did feel a bit barebones in Smash so I feel like more references to other games would be amazing.

[@mazoku34]

The down til to the fire bracelet in SA2

[@DrinkMilk333]

I would give my life for sonic to have a better moveset

[@Eros1078]

Actually, the falling animation for the up special looks like when you bounce off a cloud in sky sanctuary in sonic and knuckles and Sonic 3 and knuckles

[@psionics321]

3:25 Idea: Uptilt should be the 3rd strike from Sonic's melee combo in Sonic Battle (the high kick before Sonic Flare) (Sonic Flare is the 4th strike) so maybe Uptilt can combo to Ftilt

[@ahmadkazan217]

I think my only problem with b-air is that it has the exact same animation of wolf's back air,THE EXACT FRAMES.

[@jamiegioca9448]

I think his only problem is having a Side-B identical to his Down-B

[@algalax2]

This is why Super Smash Flash 2 was good.

[@DICEBOY22]

Honestly I think this subject is going to be a make or break if I buy any more future Smash games Though something else could come along that changes my mind ( hopefully that's Rex from XB2 ) But honestly I know it s probably more difficult but if League characters can get reworks I would love to see the same practice come to Smash.

[@ryku2864]

Oh you finally did A little obvious after all You're content is really good continue like that!

[@MelohRush]

You ever played that one Sonic workshop character in rivals of aether where his sprite work looks like the official rosters sprite? yea, thats how he should play

[@leogames4186]

Ayo what the shadow doing looking at sonic that way

[@Sussusflakes]

I love every part of it, No Doubt but I think we can keep the up throw unlike everybody else I like it the most they could at least use the spike sound effect when you do the move

[@moussacamara0614]

Aw man I swear from a month of playing as him I really wish they got rid of his side b and replace it with a more iconic move

[@xen3588]

id rather remove the down b cus side b u can hop with and avoid attacks easy

[@最大]

Here are the things I disagree with: Up-Tilt, Up-Air, D-Smash, N-Special, S-Special, D-Special, B-Throw, and Wall Jump animation.

[@5aturn96]

This is just my opinion, but, I kinda wish Sonic had special command grabs, like in Sonic the Fighters. He could spindash around his opponents, making them dizzy as if they're sheild broke. The problem is the move would be VERY laggy, and strict. Leaving Sonic open to attacks.

[@isaacrogers4174]

I agree with everything in this video, but for the final smash I would have Super Sonic eagle, kind of like that one scene in Nazo Unleashed.

[@Emily12471]

Sorry but personally i have too disagree with most of the big moveset changes, like I feel that a lot can be done with just animation especially with sonic, except side b. Side b should be changed

[@isaacrogers4174]

Imagine for the 30th anniversary they rework Sonic with this move set, and add Shadow but give him Sonic’s old move set. I know I’m probably going to get roasted for this.

[@LimitlessZspeed]

That’s some really cool ideas💙🌀

[@NotReallyFilipino]

Ring dash would be a cool option for side b, similar to pacman’s side b.

[@DICEBOY22]

I would want Sonic to have Excalibur just to make the anti-sword people go REEEEE.

[@ahmadkazan7994]

That would be God like. Make it a rapid jab and his neutral air.

[@unknown-ke2be]

I agree with you in everything except the up throw cause it has not been seen in the games but it makes the fact that he's a hedgehog iconic. I will change hes back throw to make it faster. I like the idea of the boost but if the boost doesn't happen I could keep side b and change down b to the attack he has in sonic battle shere he jumps back and throws an energy wave.

[@ahmedAshraf-td4iy]

I honestly have always thought that sonic side b should've been the boost attack

[@hwanniggles187]

Id be perfectly fine if they pulled an EA and charged us for a revamped Sonic with most of his moves being taken from Sonic Battle and other moves taken from Sonic Adventure/2 and the Boost games

[@orangeslash1667]

Try edge guarding.

[@Willyhoon]

Love it would like this idea for sonic a lot. Would be interested to see what you think of a redone Mario movie set

[@SpidertricYT]

YES THESE MOVES COULD WORK FOR SONIC

[@leogames4186]

Me not listening but just watching sonic fight👁👄👁