What Were Victorian Attitudes Towards Sex?

They’re famously thought of as a buttoned up prudish bunch, but we all know they loved to bump uglies as much as anyone today.
Were the spanking punishments of boarding schools really the origins of brothels? Who were the pin-ups of Victorian women? And what did the saucy portrait Queen Victoria gave to Prince Albert look like?
Today we go Betwixt the Victorian Sheets with Dan Snow, from History Hit sister podcast Dan Snow’s History Hit, to find out all about Victorian relationships.
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#historyhit #victorian #victorianlife

[@Mustlovebooks15]

I love how relaxed both of them are during the whole interview. Feels more like a conversation between friends rather than an interview

[@XaVi_ToussainT]

Thanks for pointing that out ❤

[@brooklynnchick]

I love how this woman normalizes and humanizes both the consumers and the providers. We are all someone’s baby, and we are all humans. No person should be demonized.

[@joanofarcxxi]

Consumers and providers? You mean prostitutes and johns? Normalizes and humanizes? You mean the people involved in sex trade have to be made by someone to appear normal?

[@BabyBat14]

As a historian myself I love this conversation so much. It does sound more like a friendly conversation between historians rather than an interview

[@D.H.-mg2cz]

We still say 'Englischer Sex' for spanking in Germany 😂 Always a pleasure to listen to Kate Lister!

[@lizroberts1569]

That’s so funny 😂

[@babtist58]

The things you learn on here ! Thanks for sharing that 😅😅

[@taschak3889]

No we don't? Maybe the old people? I never heard that!

[@VindalooJim]

These two have great chemistry together. More of Dan and Kate, please.

[@Perkelenaattori]

Kate is excellent. Her podcast "Betwixt the Sheets" is honestly great stuff.

[@Dave1507]

Add Eleanor, and it's gonna be a hoot!

[@mayageorge1847]

What happened in Victorian society in terms of media and documentation, is somewhat similar to what happens now in social media- where a third of the people online are puritanical and judgmental, another third have no problem displayimg everything to the masses, and the rest of the world is getting whiplash (pun intended) watching both sides going at it.

[@demonic_myst4503]

Pretty acurate but wasnt just sex and auch even food Such as did know the english syarted to eat mushrooms in a breakfast in the victorian wrra as a exotic food victorians went after exotic and weird foods as they wanted to be seen as fancy and high class

[@EvanLane-sf9xv]

I love history hit and I would love to see more Kate and and Dan on the channel

[@kariannecrysler640]

Responsible sexuality means open & honest dialogue not just in the bed, but in society too. So many fear the human they are and a lot of that comes from misunderstanding and inappropriate shaming. I’m glad you cover our historic relationship with sexuality and believe it can help us to proceed more responsibly in society on the subject. Besides I fancy Dan and get the added bonus of the history too🤭

[@mcinteer19]

I fancy many of the History Hit ladies! I’d love a private lecture with Kate, Susannah or Lucy…or all of the above! 🤤

[@kariannecrysler640]

@@mcinteer19 lol There’s just something about a history buff isn’t there? 😉

[@MithrilMagic]

So true! I used to be a social worker and the amount of clients I saw with STD’s or who would become pregnant and didn’t understand why these things happened was absolutely staggering! I was not prepared for that part of my job. I live in the states and our school systems are so backwards. They teach abstinence and that is all! It’s disgusting. I had a client who was 14 and didn’t know she was pregnant. She was at her grandmother’s house and she brought her to the hospital because she thought she had appendicitis. It was so very sad to see this young girl who had no idea what was happening. Her boyfriend was also 14 and he came to the hospital with his parents, they were just at a loss for words. Thankfully the baby was born with no complications and her labor and delivery was over quickly. But it was a heartbreaking case. And sadly not the last I saw in my 15 years. So many of the cases I had could have been prevented by good sexual education classes. I will never understand why parents think that by just telling your children not to have sex, they will be fine.

[@kariannecrysler640]

@@MithrilMagic 💯

[@danielmorris3687]

And ​Eleanor too. 😍 @mcinteer19

[@fosterfuchs]

It would be interesting to have this conversation about the puritanical attitudes towards sex in the United States. Just like mentioned in this video ("they had sex in the one-room working class apartments with a whole bunch of people in them"), I have been thinking the same thing about the early settlers. They lived in one-room log cabins and had around a dozen children. There had to be sexual activity, and after the first child, there were other people in the vicinity.

[@sheilaclemett4353]

I suspect the participants would have been more or less fully clothed.

[@dogglebird4430]

The earliest known use of the expression "lie back and think of England" appears to be from the 1930 novel "Gentlemen Prefer Blondes" by Anita Loos.

[@melissamargolese8782]

Was going to say, if you know anything about Victoria, it would be totally out of character for her to say this

[@ewanhopper4275]

Love Kate’s confidence that’s a woman who knows and loves her job

[@ladyredl3210]

“And then it became the epicenter of journalism” made me laugh out loud. This historian is wonderful.

[@infin8ee]

No matter what period of history you look at the basic principle is the same...... people are people. We live,die, love,lose, have families and sex. It's the human condition and although attitudes change, manner of communication etc is different, we like sex! Enjoy these two presenting this video

[@warmagicks]

i wasn't expecting dan snow in this but i'm chuffed! dr lister is incredible as well; great to have these two in a video.

[@TheElfishGene]

Oh those crazy Victorians 'eh! "In 1848, it was claimed that almost 2,700 girls in London between the ages of 11 and 16 were hospitalised because of venereal disease, many as a result of prostitution. In 1875, the age of consent, which had remained at 12 since 1285, was raised to 13, partly as a result of concerns about child prostitution. But concern continued and, in 1881, a select committee, set up to investigate the issue, reported that child prostitution was rampant. One police officer told the committee that, in London, children above the age of 13 could be procured "without any difficulty whatsoever". Another spoke of how it was "scarcely possible for anyone between nine o'clock in the evening, and one o'clock in the morning to walk along Pentonville Road without being accosted by about a dozen young girls between 13 and 14 years of age".

[@Canadianvoice]

And yet the church now hides all this behaviour but still practice it today...

[@thegirlwholovesmusic]

For all the OCD people… how badly do you want to dust that book?

[@Glowing_cactus]

It’s driving me nuts!

[@lisaahmari7199]

😅😂 I bit a hole in my upper lip trying to stifle a scream. 😅😂

[@dancingdingo]

I'm not even OCD and not even that tidy but it's doing my head in.

[@esztercsaki1]

I love it! One of my favorite KZbin channels and my favorite podcast !

[@innieplays]

I absolutely LOVE these episodes! More more more!

[@MichaelYoder1961]

Great discussion. Would love to hear Kate talk more about homosexuality during that period. We know what happened to Oscar Wilde, but I'm sure there were catamites and gay relationships - there was certainly gay porn

[@Omnomnomnivore.]

I think she’s covered that on her podcast before.. if you aren’t aware of it, check out ‘betwixt the sheets’.. it’s excellent!

[@ewanhopper4275]

A lot of people talk about todays young adults being the first generation to be filmed from birth well this was the first generation to be filmed full stop.

[@banannakis6723]

Honestly, when I hear about this version of the Victorians, all I can think of is the saying, "A lady in the streets, and a freak in the sheets."

[@Jay-ql4gp]

That was interesting! Thank you very much!

[@JoaoPessoa86]

oh this puts the Castle Anthrax in Monty Python in a whole new light

[@54mgtf22]

Hey HH. Love your work 👍

[@chelli6555]

I see dr kate lister in the thumbnail, i click it.

[@merylstreeplover49]

Fr

[@nocomment3677]

This inspired me to look up The Autobiography of a Flea and omg, she was not kidding. While the language is very formal it is also extremely graphic. And it would be extremely disturbing for one to write now. Not because of the sex, but because the female character is 14 years old and repeatedly called a child in the one chapter that I read. Really weird to read in modern times.

[@reneest7644]

I love this lady! She’s so knowledgeable and easygoing

[@Musiclover-dn9uw]

I agree.

[@mrkshply]

Her podcast is very good. I enjoyed it very much

[@oleeb]

There's nothing difficult about understanding the contradictions of the Victorian era regarding sex. There was the official acceptable standard of public behavior and manners regarding matters of sex, shows of public affection and the like and then there was the hypocritical reality of how people behaved in private. That's why people in the 20th century rebelled so much against Victorianism: because they were tired of all the hypocrisy and repression of human behavior in general versus honestly behaving in public as people do in private.

[@robertkraut6392]

MO u 7⁰

[@karntom101]

I haven't heard the phrase 'back crap' before 22:41 🤣 Love it! Gonna starting using it

[@princessfiona1394]

‘Bat Crap’

[@mothball5425]

They liked stories involving transgression - inter race sex, white women captured by 'exotic' types as slaves, aristocratic women running away with highwaymen or gypsies, etc.

[@dad_jokes_4ever226]

0:16 : hee hee looks like Boris Johnson !😅😅😅

[@andycap6786]

Missed that, good spot. Brilliant!

[@FrydaWolff]

*slams table* MORE DR. LISTER MORE OFTEN.

[@katherinecollins4685]

Great video

[@davewilson9738]

Nooooooo! The picture at 0;16 seconds looks like Boris Bloody Johnson xD

[@lizroberts1569]

He’s everywhere 😂

[@dancingdingo]

I😂was thinking the same!!!! 🤣

[@tomcrookes5689]

Wasn’t expecting to see Boris Johnson at 18 seconds in dressed as a woman, but I’m not surprised!

[@bradpenstone515]

Another amazing video. Was Dan quiet to anyone else or was it just me?

[@tomhirons7475]

its you

[@dannyschaible7112]

Mercury in the urethra you say? I think I might have to pass, I am busy today.

[@NebulaBull]

Dr. Kate Lister is a true hero for all woman, her knowledge and confidence is empowering.

[@ivy_1990]

Absolutely fabulous history 👏👏👏👏👏

[@Yoliplanting]

These two have amazing chemistry 🔥🔥♥️

[@oneshotme]

Would have been nice if you would have shared the link to her podcast!!!!

[@jamesmasters4255]

we've all been waiting for this one let see how much Dan can take lol

[@Whimpy13]

Not being naked infront of someone might have been seen as being wealthy as in 'having enough money to have a separate room to be naked in'. 🤔

[@williamrobinson7435]

Perhaps repression breeds forms of perceived excess.. On a semantic note, I haven't heard the euphemism 'John Thomas' for decades, and it's decades since I left my home in rural Yorkshire.. Is this a colloquialism? No one in that London seems to use it.. V interesting, this vid. Thanks, Prof Kate, Dan and team! ⭐⭐👍

[@Neddoest]

It is tempting to give the subscription service a try..

[@mypelagic4926]

Great history education

[@ACM327]

I adore Kate Lister and her podcast presents such fascinating and truly inclusive and progressive discussions about history I recommend it to everyone.

[@wcfheadshots240]

What a fun video. 😊

[@misolgit69]

I've read that Prince Albert was an amateur tinkerer and inventor, and that they enjoyed their 'alone' time so much he came with a mechanism which would allow them to lock and unlock the bedroom door from their bed, keepimg out servants courtiers and inquisitive children and I often wonder if the supposed Victorian quote..."do whatever you like in private, just don't frighten the horses or children" was real or made up by later comedians I suspect the latter 😇

[@janetpendlebury6808]

Sounds a bit far fetched, why not just lock the bedroom door before getting into bed? Where is this switch now? he would have needed wiring all around the bedroom walls or ceiling.

[@janebaker966]

One of the things the weeping Victoria said as she mourned over Alberts body just following his demise, inconsolable,was "no more fun in bed". I heard that quoted by a bona fide historian on the radio but I've never researched it's authenticity,but I can believe it true. Some think that later the obstreperous John Brown gave her more fun in bed but I don't think it went that far but she definitely liked being bossed about by a macho male,and of course she had the ultimate power of being The Queen,if she didn't want to be bossed about. Yes, I to my shame succumbed to clickbait and watched this.

[@rosiebottom3870]

​@@janebaker966 I read QV said that when her doctor told her 9 kids was enough and it would be dangerous to her to have anymore.

[@S3L3N3BEAR]

My search history is going to be weird after watching this episode 😅

[@jennifermccrary1570]

Oh, Victorian smut stories were my absolute favorite until I started encountering too many that involved...persons under age by current standards. I couldn't appreciate them after that.

[@oberstul1941]

Make the good lady a regular! Do it, Lord Snow - or you know nothin!

[@khills]

Kate’s done quite a few videos for them, thankfully! She’s got a few of her own specials on KZbin, as well.

[@SecretSquirrelFun]

Well, that puts an entirely different spin on the lyrics to the song - Lilly the Pink 😳

[@aqua-mina]

Well, gotta find me some Victorian literature… 😊

[@alexandramsh4740]

It seems Dan Snow is blushing! 😊

[@catgladwell5684]

looked down at the appropriate area when the topic turned to urethral mercury injections.

[@Speckledlillie]

Snog is definitely not a bad word over here. Lol

[@nickyfield137]

I can avow that stinging nettles are very good for heightening skin sensitivity !

[@soranaborhina8135]

Kate is a treasure 🎉❤

[@Firegen1]

Yay to more Kate and Dan. It would be fun to have a recorded Betwixt the sheets episode answering auidence led history questions. *edit* that squeaky toy sound... It always catches me off guard. It's beautifully Are you being Served esque. 😅 please find uses in other HH shows.

[@stevedavy2878]

Nay to Kate abd Dan, I think she just likes to talk about sex, its her thing, wink

[@thomasbell7033]

​@@stevedavy2878Oh f'god's sake.

[@khills]

⁠​⁠@@stevedavy2878 I’m sure you meant to insinuate that it’s “her thing” because she is a highly educated woman with a doctorate in Victorian neo medievalism, specializing In the history of sexuality, medical humanities, applied literary studies, and the digital humanities, right? You’re not trying to dismiss a smart, pretty, intelligent woman’s achievements or interests just because they happen to involve sex workers, or insinuate she must have some sort of kink just because she talks intelligently about the sex lives of people in the past, right? You wouldn’t be dismissing a woman’s intellect or interest just because it involves sex and that makes you so nervous you have to resort to behaving like a child, eh? 😒😒😒

[@stevedavy2878]

@@khills yawn shes a smart arse with qualifications, and I think she is probably good in the Lecture theatre. However, this is an online history channel with no warnings to children or none adults, If you are explaining history , remember it took 100s of years for children to game an innocent childhood. I would prefer miss qualificationa coming from her ears, not discussing kink and using the word bollocks. I cannot stand her, she is arrogant.

[@Redacted2898]

​@@khillsthey definitely aren't. MR Poopypants

[@jmc7034]

Kate is fantastic

[@sandcroft2924]

@0:16 I thought it was Boris Johnson 🤔

[@pablo19136]

0.16 boris Johnson 😂

[@370530e]

Dan, I’m trying to work out how you saw that jacket hanging in a store and thought to yourself, “That looks cool”.

[@sarahskeggs]

I really enjoy this historian, such fun

[@Whocaresanymore970]

She isn't a historian.

[@FrauWilhelmKlink]

​@@Whocaresanymore970Yes, she is. If you look at 0:30, they both are.

[@khills]

@@Whocaresanymore970 She’s literally got a doctorate, mate.

[@khills]

Kate’s books are fantastic, too.

[@casca.forgot]

Sooo... on the topic of mercury... My grandfather gained his medical degree in 1943 and went on to become a surgeon who pioneered several surgical techniques. He mentioned on several occasions that he was taught in medical school to use Mercury to treat syphilis via injection. He said that the doctors know that the syphilis was gone once all of the patients teeth had fallen out.

[@michelleduplooymalherbe2837]

you go queen Victoria - that period has such a history of prudishness - grand to hear different and that they were "normal"

[@FranzBieberkopf]

The discussion of Llliy Langtree reminded me of "The actress said to the historian"-type jokes.

[@psarmstr]

I find it rather saddening (and hilarious is an ironic way) that this conversation is censored. Can we get an uncensored version? Maybe on Nebula?

[@mohammedsaysrashid3587]

It was a wonderful historical video about sex during the victory period...

[@A861967]

Steady on old chap 😂

[@Jayjay-qe6um]

"The history of the Victorian Age will never be written: we know too much about it." -- Lytton Strachey

[@baron7755]

"sausage casing" LOL

[@AnnaAnna-uc2ff]

Thanks.

[@helenagackowska8398]

ooh Dr Kate is fab! :D

[@johnsieverssr8288]

Interesting 😊

[@johnkim791]

Anything Kate and I watch it! 😊

[@philiparonson8315]

My father used to say the hardest part about reading Victorian novels was figuring out who was sleeping with whom. There are clues in the books which modern readers often miss.

[@samabrahams7687]

What a lovley pair of chairs

[@Robert-cr8bq]

Read 'The French Lieutenants Woman' by John Fowles.

[@steveymoon]

Who is this woman in the conversation? Why isn't she mentioned anywhere in the title or description?

[@GB-TX]

The whippington papers 🤙🏼😅

[@billyshane3804]

Hard Discipline - in words and pictures

[@FlyingFrenchman57]

I like the fact that in a discussion about victorian era attitude about sex they feel the need to bleep out words. Maybe a discussion about 20th century next.

[@markfinlay422]

I bet the artist kept the initial sketches of Victoria - phwoar!

[@isabelstokes4042]

One of those pictures looks just like Boris Johnston!

[@jeffthomas3707]

This woman is legendary.....

[@codyhunsaker8924]

Hey Dan can u do a youtube video on how accurate the movie the KING is about King Henry the 5th? I onow when he ruled his achievements and what his greatest victories where but not quit sure how accurate the movie still is????

[@littleblackcar]

Work dresses, very few of which survive because they got used up and worn out, were very often ankle-length or a bit shorter--and sometimes had shorter sleeves--because it's completely impractical to do anything if you also have to manage a floor-length skirt.

[@braddavis6219]

I love History Hit! But Lord, do I want to dust that stack of brown books.

[@Speckledlillie]

I am such a fan of this amazing woman! (Dan Snow is alright…)

[@debbylou5729]

Can’t believe this is on a quality show like History Hit. A huge number of marriages and births had dates ‘massaged’. They responded like humans

[@HopeGardner3amed]

Today I learned Voldemort had syphilis

[@allanlees299]

According to current medical knowledge, mercury was largely ineffective against syphilis, though on rare occasions if taken very early in the disease progression (stage one) it could possibly have aborted further development of the spirochetaetes.

[@alexflett4395]

I remember Lie back and think of England from the 60s

[@mokster5]

In some US states (including mine) you can still get married at 14 with parental permission, and people do.

[@RicCdelP]

Loved it, Kate is amazing

[@andrewhirst8403]

Is it just me, or is that one of Boris Johnson’s ancestors, near the beginning, when she’s talking about spanking and flagellation? 😂

[@user-cu4kr1kl1b]

where’s the photo in the thumbnail from?

[@dallassukerkin6878]

A woman with just the right personality to talk about this sort of fairly taboo thing without making it seem either salacious or disgusting. Well done to Dan for .. ahem ... holding up his end too :grins: Excellent chemistry to keep the conversation on track. Horrifying to have confirmed that syphilis is 'back' - terrifying ailment. Sadly there are no prizes for guessing that a lack of border controls and checks had a part to play in that - always a shame when something preventable manifests itself via the law of unintended consequences.

[@skontheroad]

All CAN be true at the same time!! Yes!!! I think about that all the time when thinking about history! And I very much understand her "life"/the time she spent as an unhappy woman after her life with the love of her life who was suddenly gone, yet she had 40 more years to go.....no one can imagine....!!! So sad! I can't even imagine what she went through (I can. I don't want to!)