Where is the bike lane? | rewboss in brief

[@kiernanfisher4842]

yay! properly separated infrastructure!

[@Ulrich.Bierwisch]

When I travel on the bike (road bike with bags), I have often problems to find this kind of bike routes. Some are very good but there are no signs, sometimes there are signs but they go far off the road and turn into gravel or mountain bike trails. I prepare the trips with a map that typically knows this bike routes and if they are paved but there are also cases where I ended up on the main road while a much better solution was available. I also ended up on very bad mountain bike trails and had to turn around. Especially in Bavaria, the routes are often in the responsibility of the towns and in the middle of nowhere is the border to the next town. I had several cases where the bike route changed from good paved into heavy gravel at this border somewhere in the woods far away from the main road.

[@hansmeiser32]

"I prepare the trips with a map" What map? I use komoot and this app tells you amongst other things the kind of surface of a bike-path and sometimes users upload pictures of the surface as well.

[@Paul_C]

Seems to me you forgot why that road is there, right? Any cycling infrastructure is there to go from A to B, it is exactly that mundane. Those who live there know it, those who don't live there have no need to advertise the road, it is there to be used locally. 😂 Regarding the location of those roads, yes, Germany isn't ready to even call itself 'a cycling nation'. Too many cities without decent cycling infrastructure, too many villages with the same problem. Suppose the only country that comes close to have decent infrastructure is NL. But that too has some problems. Then again they are working on it. Germany is slowly getting better at it, as do France, Belgium, Danmark, Sweden, Finland, The Baltic States, amongst others. Oh well, at some point most will see the error of their ways, just it will take about 50-100 years to roll out Europe wide.n😊

[@GameCyborgCh]

This cycle road will barely see any wear since the most wear on a road surface will be cause by big and heavy vehicles. Bicycles won't even make a dent in the speed of wear. Most of the wear this cycle lane gets is from the weather

[@red.aries1444]

Don't underestimate the influence of the tractors and other farm machinery. These are very heavy nowadays and they will wear out this road eventually, especially if they drive over it in hot summers.

[@ahoannon5711]

​@@red.aries1444 Still, nowhere near as fast as a road used by cars and trucks!

[@cmmartti]

​@@red.aries1444 Tractors have massive tires designed to spread out the load and prevent soil compaction.

[@HappyBeezerStudios]

Yeah, rain, snow, and tree roots.

[@56independent]

Thanks for explaining patiently some of the nuances of bike lanes in Europe

[@Opa_Andre]

1:10 ... And the new, wider road will be partly refinanced by speeders through the use of recurring temporary speed traps.

[@WnuckVader]

And they will blame god and the world for being caught, but never themselves.

[@uweseemann8571]

🎶 Country lane, take me home to the place I belong 🎵

[@WaechterDerNacht]

I'm very glad it said "rewboss in brief" and not "rewboss in briefs" in the title... ^^

[@baritonfelix]

Good to know all the drivers who took what is now the bike route as a shortcut did not wreck the surface.

[@Bayerwaldler]

It‘s the same with my tiny very village in eastern Bavaria. The The only drawback is, that the travel distance is longer for bike.

[@HappyBeezerStudios]

As someone living in a city in the north I often have to choose between a shorter, but heavily trafficked path, and a quiet, but somewhat longer path. Usually I take the quiet path, since it's just more calm. And not too rarely cycling though these calm paths and side streets is faster than going by car on the busy ones.

[@clemensmuller2543]

1:28 Because in many cases roads for bicyclists and tractors aren't cleaned as good as roads built for cars. What about mud and dirt in spring and fall? Snow in winter time? Do they clean this particular road as good as the new road built for cars? Btw: Thanks for this additional video!

[@MrGreatplum]

I wish we had some half decent cycle infrastructure here in the uk. I haven’t ridden a bike in years on uk roads; it’s far too dangerous

[@lillywho]

The urbanist in me is getting whiplash from this... Yay for the bike road, nay for the widened regular road which on top of what you mentioned will also probably induce demand somewhat.

[@VoodooMcVee]

Except that this clearly isn't an urban area. Usually these new, wider roads help with routing heavy traffic around the village centres. As long as other traffic participants are separated from the cars, everything is fine, even if there was more demand. I mean, goods need to be transported somehow and craftspeople need to get around, too.

[@rarbiart]

i assume the motorway is a few meters shorter and has less elevation bumbs... so a lot of cyclist will -when running late- will take the motorroad. in plus, during winter those bike trails will not be maintained free of snow, the road surely will.

[@rarbiart]

so escooters (the 20km/h things) have to go via the main road, since they are not allowed on the bike path. (it was Scheuer's rule to escooters in the category "KFZ", not "bicycle" like in Austria.)

[@guzziwheeler]

De jure, you are right. But don´t worry, before the first German will catch a ticket fot using a farm road with an E-scooter, mankind will have settled on Mars. We have a saying in Germany: Things are not eaten as hot as they are beeing cooked.

[@TheMcLufus]

"Why cycle on a nicely maintained low traffic bicycle lane, when you can go on the same road as cars?" is something people on racing bikes may as well pose as a rhetorical question as they avoid said bicycle lanes/roads.

[@ElchiKing]

There the problem is sth different. The Flurbereinigungswege and the like with farming machines on them are (especially in the summer) often dirty from the tractors, which is not a big problem to commuting cyclists (albeit a little unpleasant), but can be dangerous for racing cyclists at high speeds. (And as a pedestrian, you might not want to get in the way of a racing bike as well)

[@csproductions]

One of my mates cycled from Berlin to Amsterdam via Germany's cycle network, using streets like this.

[@HappyBeezerStudios]

I still know exactly how the rules without bike lane are from back in school: Below the age of 8: on the sidewalk. Between 8 and 10: you can choose. 10 and up: on the road. And yes, I would absolutely use the calm and quiet path.

[@igel9316]

Fair answer, if the signage is really driving cyclist to this route and it is of compatible comfort. You talked about the good paving, but is it roughly the same distance and steepness?

[@HappyBeezerStudios]

The ironic thing is, over an incline a longer path will be less steep.

[@milligoree]

I have been cycling a few times in Germany (Swabia and Bavaria) this year and I was so confused by the bike paths - it felt like the signage was minimal and that bike lanes felt like it must have finished but I hadn't been told. Or that you would be told to go on the road at a point but not clearly told when to go back on a separated bike path. Has anyone else found this? While infrastructure in the UK leaves a lot to be desired, I usually feel clear on when a bike lane starts and stops. Even in Munich, the bike lanes seemed designated just by being made of brick, with very little signs otherwise. Am I missing anything?

[@robertjarman3703]

I know most of my traffic vocabulary that isn't English from Dutch, and so I knew what Verkehr Frei meant immediately.

[@OntarioTrafficMan]

Ja ik moet af en toe Duitse verkeersrapporten lezen op werk en ik kan bijna alle woorden over het verkeer raden

[@robertjarman3703]

@@OntarioTrafficMan Oh hey there, I wondered where you went. No long time no see.

[@nari5025]

So many comments "Oh, but the road is shorter and the path not indicated for bikes, so you would never..." Really? Seriously? OK, I am a bike commuter for some years now, I believe I know where the paths in my area are, where it is safe to drive on a B road when time is short, etc.. Maybe you don't know that when you start out commuting on your bike, But it doesn't take forever to figure things out. In other news, this is a valley road connecting several villages, not a major traffic hub (Its an S Road). Never been there myself, and that is the next thing to address: If I was to travel through the Spessart region on my bike why would I not look up bikepaths in advance where I don't know the area? I may not stick to them religiously, but I'd know where they are (and your parents would be able to find out as well). And at last: bikepaths are not racecourses. They are a convenience for commuting and travelling. If you want to be fast by all means use the road.

[@ElchiKing]

Tbf, the signage for these bike trails can be greatly improved. Especially the green "tour" signs are sometimes out of date (e.g. leading to a path which is no longer a good route), but more importantly often too small to be seen, poorly positioned or even vandalized. (And they often only indicate the next two villages which doesn't really help on a bigger tour) When I'm on my bike I want to be able to navigate by signs if I know the general direction. What I don't want is a tour sign leading me towards a 5km detour uphill, just because the route is more scenic without at least hinting at the more direct (but maybe less enjoyable) route.

[@misterxya8465]

As foreign with a race bike its unfortunately lottery. So if I have to turn around to many times in the region I choose the main road. But everybody else only land on a street if they dont see the sign.

[@davebowman6497]

Separate bike paths will almost always not suit the racing bike rider. They are often not enjoying the priority the main road has when intersecting with other roads. Separate bike path and not built as a fast riding facility for racing bikers. They are built to encourage and give a fair possibility for people to take shorter trips using a bike rather than a road where speed, width or other things makes the road a non-option. The average speed of z non-racing bike rider is perhaps 10 km/h. A racing biker will go at least double, and not unlikely three times as fast. And racing bikers often behave badly om a 2.5 meter wide bike path with two way traffic. Stupid overtakes, cursing if not given enough space. Etc. Racing bikers simply does not belong on bike paths. Money for bike paths are not directed as a means for sporting activity. If you wand a bike track for racing, ask your local council to build one. Just one. Good luck. Having said all that, I will acknowledge that a lot of biking-to-work commuters expect to do that at 15-20 km / h, and spew just as much venom when they can't keep that speed. They're demanding smth similar to a motorist demanding to go unhindered at 140-180 km/h on a road where the normal flow is 90 km/h. Bike paths are financed to give an alternative to driving cars. Both alternatives require considerations for others, and adapting to circumstances. One alternative is beneficial to your health, yours and your society's economy.

[@vickenkodjaian5265]

I don't have a bike. But I'll happily walk on a country road like that. Just imagine I'm walking in beautiful Germany and listening to classics on a country road.🙂

[@rashomon351]

Interesting fact about Germany: when it comes to using farming roads, Tractors come in all shapes and sizes. It depends mostly on the mindset of the driver. A Mercedes E-class has just the same number of wheels as a John Deere. So, the classification of a vehicle as to be farming related or not merely depends on the roads they're taking.

[@rewboss]

No, it depends on the use they're put to.

[@rashomon351]

​@@rewboss Well, ok, yeah, for sure, of course! That's right officer, after dropping my kids off to school I'll definitely plow the fields with the limousine I'm currently driving -- See ? I already have the towbar attached! There may be differences in cultures among all societies around the world. But there's one common denominator among all of the human race: spoil the rules as far as you can. Spoiling rules is a national sport in Germany. That's why people in the cities make so many rules for the people in the rural areas to just ignore!

[@rewboss]

@@rashomon351 Nevertheless, the distinction between vehicles used for farming and vehicles used for other purposes is the use they are put to. It's not the number of wheels or the roads they happen to be on, it's what they're used for. Limousines aren't -- and can't be -- used to plough the fields, so you won't get anywhere with that argument if you're stopped by police. A pick-up would be more credible (although not for ploughing), but if you're stopped taking the children to school you are using the vehicle to take your children to school, so you're not using it (in that moment) for farm work, and you will still be fined. It's like the myth that you can claim to be an "Anlieger" because "ich habe ein Anliegen" -- if you try to use that argument, the cop will just give you a lesson in grammar and syntax as well as a ticket.

[@transitcaptain]

I see that he is learning the urbanism lessons of Not Just Bikes. That can only be good for everyone

[@guzziwheeler]

NotJustBike is a great YT channel. I (German) learned a lot there. I strongly recommend it to every US American, in particular to their Secretary of Transportation and Infrastructure.

[@transitcaptain]

@ It’s not the lack of knowledge but the lack of political will and money. Pete Buttigieg knows all of this, the Senate, house, and president has to agree on reforms

[@consgchaos]

@@guzziwheeler NotJustBike is braindead propaganda

[@frankfurtrob866]

That is what I love about the German country side, the many many walking cycle paths! You can spend hours going all over the place!

[@EggsBenAddict]

Man, why don't we have that!?!?

[@HenryLoenwind]

That cycle road is wider than many British country roads... scnr ;)

[@guzziwheeler]

Indeed. I traveled the UK in a camper van, and I learned why modern cars have foldable rearview mirorrs. Never used mine in Germany. Never ever again. Love the British people and the countryside, thou.

[@stevendemonnin2025]

here in america we don't have alternative lanes. And peddling next to a 55 mile an hour road is scary.

[@guzziwheeler]

"Here in america we don't have alternative lanes" There is your problem, lady.

[@floris3239]

The only issue, of course, is that the Germans aren't particularly good at indicating what is what, unlike in the Netherlands. Although, I suppose German cyclists are accustomed to it. That said, it's still far better than in other countries, such as the United Kingdom.

[@guzziwheeler]

If someday I decide to commit suicide, I´ll go cycling in the UK.

[@gentsracer1845]

Genuine question: The road intended for cyclists, how many weeks a year is it covered in mud from tractors ploughing or harvesting the fields, and covered in leaves in autumn? Is it cleared from snow in a timely manner in the mornings in winter like the other road would be?

[@ahoannon5711]

My experience with similar roads in my corner of Germany is that mud and leaves are not big issues. The road is wide enough so that you can get along reasonably safely. Snow? 🤪"But nobody goes by bike in winter anyhow."😠 🤬

[@Elbrasch]

Problem is I need to know the small road, took me a year to find it in my village after moving in.

[@ahoannon5711]

In this case it should be easier as it is part of a long-distance cycling route.

[@christiankastorf4836]

The last sentence is of course a rhetorical question, but let me answer it as nasty as I can. Who would...? Well, that would be those pseudo "Tour de France" participants in tight shorts, helmets and with sunglasses that they even wear when there is no sun as on a gloomy November afternoon shortly before dusk. Their race bikes will have neither lights nor reflectors. They ride side by side and therefore block the entire road as a new law forces cars in Germany to keep an eight feet distance to cyclists when overtaking. The weird thing about that regulation is that is says nothing about their distance towards uncoming traffic. Using cycle lanes when there some is not compulsory anymore and that allows those arrogant anarchists to do whatever they want.

[@barbarossarotbart]

To answer your question: It is perhaps the same reason why some ride their bike on the street even if there is a bike lane directly alongside that street.

[@XTheCronosX]

Yes, some people are like that. On my way to work there is this one damn guy wo rides his bicicle on a car only road with 100Km/h, no streetlights and even signs telling you no bicicles. Behind the greenery and a wall/fence just next to the road is a perfectly fine path, that was build just 2 years ago. The onely reason that guy is stil alive, is that most people pay atention, when driving. But that realy is flirting with death there...

[@guzziwheeler]

@@XTheCronosX Undoubtedly a race-bike cyclist.

[@5thElem3nt]

Looks like Google Maps thinks part of the lane is private property so, for navigation, it will always choose the street. Also, if I measuered correctly the distance between both town centers, the road is 6% shorter. So, in the end you will find cyclists on the road and probably some pedestrians from time to time, too. If they had money and space to widen the road for safety reasons. It would have been better if the width stayed the same and they would have added a shared cycle path instead.

[@rewboss]

There are almost no cyclists and absolutely no pedestrians on that road. They all take the lane. Also, the lane avoids the horrible (and, for cyclists, quite dangerous) junction at the end of the road.

[@TorstenLif]

The cycling instructions in Google Maps are sometimes quite horrible and should never be trusted.

[@barvdw]

@@TorstenLif absolutely agreed, but if they're unfamiliar with the area, it's probably one of the first wayfinding sources people will use. Regardless of how trustworthy Google Maps is, it's available on every smartphone, often pre-installed, and free. And if the main road is shorter, the algorithm will automatically select that, unless manually changed. I love these quiet country roads away from traffic, but good signposting is a necessity, and even then, not sufficient as a deterrent to use the main road. I've used enough of those quieter roads where I had to inadvertently turn back because they were impassable, if I don't know the area, I'll stick to what Google Maps proposes.

[@hansmeiser32]

Google Maps for cycling isn't the best idea. Try specialized apps like komoot. You may have to pay a few bucks if you need different maps (you get 1region for free) but it's very much worth it and your experience will be much better. I use komoot for bike trips here in the Ruhrgebiet and the results (after I got some experience using the app) are amazing.

[@TorstenLif]

@@barvdw You are correct that since Google Maps is free and often pre-installed, many will use it, ignoring the warnings they get. But simply arguing that because cycling is not prohibited on the main road, is can be assumed to be safe (as they do, and seemingly you as well) simply isn't good enough. As rewboss states, the locals (who make up the majority of riders on this particular example) prefer the cycle lane despite it being slightly longer. The only cyclists foolish enough to ride on the main road are the non-locals. For my own part, I only use cycle.travel these days, but I'm a touring cyclist and I spend lots of time comparing various routes through the areas where I intend to ride. I have found that c.t provides vastly superior routes to Google Maps. I think that the best thing to happen would be if Google were to hire Richard Fairhurst (the creator and lone developer of c.t) to get access to his algorithms and use them in their cycling mode calculations. Win-win. Route suggestions in Google Maps would suddenly become very good (whereas currently they certainly don't live up to the old "do no evil" motto) and Richard would get the income, credit and respect he absolutely deserves. Meanwhile, he gets by on the meager Patreon contributions from myself and others. Yes, as a Patreon supporter I get access to some of the more advanced planning features in c.t, but for the simple "on the fly" usage that we're discussing here, the basic functions of c.t which are always free, are more than adequate.

[@tubulus22]

You probably have to know that little country lane to use it. If you don't know it, you'll end up on the road - which, in fact, you are free to use.

[@nari5025]

If you're not familiar with the area you would probably (hopefully/I certainly would) look up a bikepath map, which does indicate the country lane. If you are local and late for a thing you are free to race amongst the cars at your own risk.

[@barvdw]

@@nari5025 I'm not the only one who would probably check Google Maps, it's already on my phone, it's free, and it works, even if it's not great for active travel. Very few people I know still by maps, unfortunately.

[@dommsevanschnitzel2732]

The answer to your question at the end: Google/Apple Maps and/or no knowledge of the area Tbh though even if there is a good parallel path in my opinion there should still be a sidewalk/bike lane since the whole purpose of a road is to connect places and it should do it no matter what mode one chooses

[@herrmeistermann2426]

Why would cyclist choose the road over the cycling lane? The answer is: They would if it is shorter.

[@Nils.Minimalist]

If cyclists or pedestrians are smart and do not want to inhale the exhaust fumes from passing cars, they will choose the cycle path for health reasons.

[@razorblade1596]

"where they could just cycle peacefully down a country lane like this one." - Unfortunately these are often used for rat-racing. Aggressive motorist behaviour is also common. Doesn't matter if motorists are allowed to use the lane or not. If it is possible to drive there, people will drive there. This is pretty much universal.

[@rewboss]

No car drivers use this lane as a rat-run. There's no reason for them to: it doesn't give them any advantage.

[@jattikuukunen]

No noise, no pollution from engines and tires. These are already good reasons to use the smaller road even if it's slightly slower. Hopefully it's obvious to find, i.e. a bike path following the main road turns away and leads you to that path.

[@tarickw]

why would cyclists cycle on the unsafe road? because they don't know that there is a safer option and nothing is set up to communicate these roads properly. and no, the green cycle points system is not a good way for communicating these safer roads. a good system would lead you to the safe road from the points where the unsafe roads begin. a natural flow is what's needed, not a hardly believable string of half correct signs indicating a direction

[@floris3239]

Yes, that's what I always notice as well as soon as I cross the border between the Netherlands and Germany.

[@dbenzhuser]

This.

[@ahoannon5711]

You are right, it could be better! But considering the state of the cycling infrastructure in Germany I would call that good enough for now, there are usually more important issues that need attention.

[@tarickw]

@@ahoannon5711 depends on what your other important things are. and the way to improve it is not necessarily by grand projects but by making sure that the design guidelines are correct and that every refresh and renewal builds up the infrastructure into a cohesive network.

[@ahoannon5711]

@@tarickw These "other important things" are places where there is no safe path for bikes, so that cyclists have to use the road in between fast moving cars and trucks. It's not like Germany is going to run out of those anytime soon. Also: I got the impression that the cycling path is part of a cohesive plan - or at least the beginning of such - for how cyclists can get around. It is part of a long distance route after all. But I agree the "grand project" approach to this is *bleep*ing stooopid.

[@marcinkusiak9273]

Under 15 hours.

[@feedbackzaloop]

You don't have much road cyclists around aka Rennräder? I'd choose this lane over a path solely for its superior surface. And if it makes the route even 100m shorter, the choice is a no-brainer.

[@MATT-2033]

Germany did it right bike lanes should be no where near vehicle traffic to bad i don't have that where i live. They put bike lanes on the vehicle traffic roads indirect opposition to reality. Then pass an idiotic law saying bikes have the same rights as vehicles. Yet the dolts ride right threw red lights. Great way to become a hood ornament.

[@janh.9841]

As a cyclist (but being an #auchAutofahrer), I can tell you a very simple reason why I would take the new-built strip of road: Because it is the main road. It connects the neighboring villages, and it is open to all, even horse carriages. It is meant to be used if you want to go from A to B. Why wouldn't I cycle there! If there were dedicated infrastructure for cyclists, I would consider using it, but since there isn't, the motorists have to deal with the fact that they are demanded to be considerate and keep their distance (2 m!) to "weaker" road users. In any case, my current motivation to cycle there is none of your business (as is yours to me), and it is NOT your obligation to "educate" me for riding there. Just follow the law.

[@sagichdirdochnicht4653]

So why is there no bike lane? I get the point, but this is only helping those who live nearby or use this route regularly. If you've never been there before, you don't know about this road and / or if it will lead to were you'll need to go, or if it's gonna be a big detour.

[@alexandergutfeldt1144]

If you love long distance cycling then by all means do yourself a favor and use cycling maps or apps.

[@rewboss]

Nearly all of the cyclists I've ever seen passing through take the lane. They have either new-fangled apps or old-fashioned paper maps that show them where the cycle routes go.

[@dbenzhuser]

@@rewboss Of course we do. But just image regular roads would regularly lead cars through military training areas. And if you get hit or drive over a land mine people just say "well, he should have used the special app". That's what it feels like in so many regions in Germany 🫤

[@autokorrektor8166]

Not sure that I want to take traffic advice from a UK/German guy in Germany who doesn't drive...... What happened Rewboss? Drugs, Alchohol, a mixture of both? Successfully completing the MPU is not impossible..........

[@youtubekommentar5494]

Is cycling on the new road forbidden because of that? I'm both a cyclist and a car driver. Very often I see cyclist in situations where I think als cyclist that they took a very stupid way, which has actually no real benefit for cyclist (e.g. not really shorter/faster). So there's really no reason to drive that way. As car driver, I don't use cars which have massive problems e.g. even with lowered curbs. It's the drivers fault if he chose something like that, so don't annoy others because of that. Same correspondingly for bicycles. If there's like dirt on the farm road, there also will be dirt on the normal road in that area.

[@rewboss]

No, cycling on the road isn't forbidden.

[@rarbiart]

and escooters will have to use the road anyway, because they do not benefit from "bicycle allowed" exemptions. At least in Germany, where escooters are motor vehicles by law, not like in Austria where they fall in the bicycle category.

[@youtubekommentar5494]

@@rarbiart @rewboss Maybe you can help here with the knowledge of a native English speaker :-) A scooter is for me a vehicle that is something like a smaller and slower motorbike where you're sitting on something like a saddle. If it can do only 25km/h max, outside a village/town/... you may drive bicycles are allowed/have to drive. If's you're talking about a footboard with steering handle and electric motor up to 20km/h: The have to use bike lane. Only like in pedestrian zones where the basic rule is that they are forbidden, like bicycles. And the exception for bicycles doesn't include them. But in the video, it's just a quite normal but narrow read with only motorbikes, cars and bigger vehicles forbidden. Every other kind of vehicle that is allowed in public traffic is ok.

[@rarbiart]

@@youtubekommentar5494 the sign says "motor vehicles not allowed", and by definition those 20km/h "Elektrokleinstfahrzeuge" are motor vehicles like "Mofa25", so there is a special exemption sign for them, which is not fitted here. (if the service way would have a blue "bicycle" sign or any combination with a blue bicycle, in that case the escooter would be allowed.

[@youtubekommentar5494]

@@rarbiart Well, I read §39 (7) StVO. The motorbike symbol doesn't include "Elektroklein*st*fahrzeuge" such as footboards with steering handle and electric motor up to 20km/h and also doesn't include bicycles (including those with electric motors which are only supporting you when pedaling up to 25km/h).

[@dorisw5558]

The problem is: as long as we keep separating cars and cyclists, drivers will never learn to share road space. What we need to do instead is make it absolutely normal that cars and cycles share a road, cars must take care (and lose priority)and speeds must be reduced

[@eldrago19]

The problem is that on a rural highway linking two settlements, the difference in speed between cars and bikes means the cars will constantly get stuck behind bikes (unhappy drivers) and will come whizzing past at high speed (scared cyclists). You could have bike lanes to separate the two but most cyclists still end up feeling unsafe. You could have a protected bike lane but that means a much wider road costing more and doing more damage to nature all for a bike lane that takes a longer route and nobody wanted in the first place.

[@rewboss]

It used to be normal for cars and cyclists to share the roads, but there are now so many cars on the roads (and they are much bigger and heavier than they used to be) that this isn't really optimal.

[@floris3239]

In the Netherlands, we have a very simple rule. If motorists can or are allowed to go faster than 50 kilometres the motor traffic and cycle traffic will be separated. And this works like a charm.

[@soundscape26]

Don't agree there, if you have the option to separate them then just do it. Safer for everybody instead of forever waiting for people to change their behaviour. Oh and as a bonus the bike lane is much more scenic.

[@transitcaptain]

Anyone who watched Not Just Bikes will find it obvious that cars and bikes take different routes

[@gegessen159]

Die Frage am Ende könnte ich fast täglich stellen. Scheinbar ist es vielen Radfahrern völlig egal, dass nebenan ein super ausgebauter Radweg ist

[@janh.9841]

Die Straße ist für alle da. Deal with it.

[@OhioCruffler]

In America some bikers will take the main road just so they CAN block traffic and be a pain. It is a thing here, sadly.

[@Wildcard71]

They prefer blocked roads to separated traffic.

[@Nils.Minimalist]

In America, most cyclists do not have bike lanes or there are only a few cyclists. America is made for cars. This is understandable, given the size of the country.

[@lukasrentz3238]

@@Nils.Minimalist Well, if i want to travel from Munich to Hamburg i wouldn´t use the bike either. A Place gets too big for bikes quite fast, so that isn´t a real argument. Urban Areas in the US wouldn´t need that car dependency, if the zoning would be less strict and the neighbourhoods not seperated from each other or even gated.