"Which Baldur's Gate 3 class does the most damage?" I benchmarked them all!

[@WolfgangRP]

One other thing: coming from the MMO world, we used to say that single target dmg was rather important, as bosses have so much health. So massive AOE dmg is nice and all, but I've playing Trials of Tav a lot lately and honestly being able to burn down a 800hp dragon before it can one shot you is more important than clearing all the adds.

[@nevermindCreations]

Agreed, have the same background. I'll add multi-target benchmarks in the future though, but right now it is already tipped in favor for classes that do good AoE as well

[@WolfgangRP]

@@nevermindCreations Storm Sorc Tempest Cleric Kereska + Cull the Weak + etc can result in literally 1000s od damage after a Black Hole, which means that the true impact of AOE is perhaps ultimately unmeasurable. I see where you're going with the starting equipment but not sure it reveals much. If I were to make one suggestion, it would be do a Battle Royale video in a multiplayer game. I ran a 4 man PvP in D&D TT about 10 years ago. Cleric vs Bladesinger vs Barbarian vs Druid. It wasn't even close.

[@jeepersmcgee3466]

​@@WolfgangRP it wasn't close in whose favor?

[@WolfgangRP]

@@jeepersmcgee3466 The Bladesinger was permanently invisible, could fly, and after multiple meteor storms could go down and f*ck up the stragglers in melee and PWK them. The biggest weakness with 5e RAW AFAIC is that in Tier 4 the Wizard class moves into an ungodly level of its own.

[@The_RealWilliam]

@@WolfgangRP "1000's of damage" I would have to see that to believe it.

[@nadirafurry]

Absolute Maximum Shitposting Eldritch Blast Build: **Classes** -# +2 Warlock w/agonizing blast -# +2 Spore Druid for halo of spores -# +2 Fighter for action surge -# +3 sorcerer for quicken metamagic (and infinite sorcery points) -# +3 Thief Rogue for an extra bonus action **Equipment** -# Potent Robe for extra eldritch blast damage -# Helmet of grit for extra bonus action -# Duke Ravenguards Longsword for +2 Charisma **Stat Buffs** -# Hags Hair for +1 Charisma -# Mirror of Loss for +2 Charisma **Consumables Needed** -# A Smokepowder Bomb or Anything you can blow-up with Halo of spores -# Haste potion -# Elixir of Bloodlust **Illithid Powers/Buffs** -# The bonus action buff from the Githyanki Creche -# Survival Instinct from the friendly Mindflayer in the mycanoid colony **Stats** -# Start with 17 Charisma **Setup** -# You need to be under the effects of Survival Instinct, haste, action surge, helmet of grit and the bloodlust elixir extra action. -# You need atleast 18 sorcerery points to quicken Eldritch blast. -# If you have done it correctly, you would have used Eldritch blast 7 times in one turn -# While under the effects of Survival Instinct, you use your halo of spores reaction to blow something up that will kill you. -# Survival Instinct should revive you with all your actions and bonus actions reset, meaning you can cast Eldritch Blast another 7 times. -# With my Setup and Equipment, each Eldritch Blast projectile deals a maximum of 22, with 14 Uses of that cantrip, thats 42 projectiles. -# 12 x 42 force from Potent Robe and Agonizing Blast (504 force damage (conditionally if everything hits)). 42d10 from Eldritch Blast (420 force damage max (conditionally if everything hits)). No idea why anyone would want to pull this off in-game, I haven't... But its theory crafted from things I know in my 2k hours playing the game.

[@nevermindCreations]

The Survival Instinct synergy (or exploit) was not known to me before :D Great that you always learn something new! And don't worry, "pulling something off" is not even of interest to us theorycrafters, the journey is the reward ;D

[@The_RealWilliam]

I'm amazed at how people can sit around and devise these kinds of things. To me it just seems the set up is impossible. I would be curious how the normal KZbin optimizers are faring with the 2024 PHB?🤔🤔

[@LeoTheDarkAngel]

@@nevermindCreations It also works with death ward or the Blood of Lathander Revive. Fracture has a great video where he abuses the shit out of it :D

[@lunxs4943]

im also amazed but i dont htink the set up is that hard now that i think about it if you use ritual dagger combine this with the blood of lethander and you just got another revive and you have an easy way to suicide you/get yourself low before a fight

[@AnomalousCanid]

There's a video on here showing an infinite turn using the revival action point restoration trick

[@viggoblavarg856]

Really cool video. Good work with all of that data. I do agree that just using starting gear is skewing the data towards casters, and that martial characters in general benefit more from magic items. Good stuff!

[@shaneanigans440]

It's such a great and well delivered video. Thank you for this valuable information. It's nice to see each classes strengths and weaknesses.

[@welmorfianvm4039]

On my first play-thru I picked a moon druid.Than I heard somewhere that it is the weakest class and cannot be compared to likes of paladin, devastated I still stuck with mono moon Druid and beat the game, and now i know why I never felt weak.

[@dust7001]

I would call Moon Druid mid tier at worst. It can take advantage of Tavern Brawler which already pushes it higher than half the roster. Moon Druid's problems largely stem from issues with Larian's Implementation not that class within the vacuum of the BG3, some of which were conscious decisions they removed during the beta such as not being able to move MoonBeam/recast lightning strike while in shapeshift form (something that is allowed in Tabletop and could be done in EA) and others are related to bugs some mods have fixed such as bonuses from equipment that should trigger in Shapeshift not triggering, or all your items having to be unequipped and reequipped after leaving shapeshift. The end game shapeshifts are actually very powerful, and can easily win some of the harder fights in the game, so I don't know who was calling it the worst class but it is at worst middle of the pack. At the end of the day even on Honor Mode BG3 is a noticeably easier game than other CRPGs so by ACT 3 you should feel strong on any class. You can beat the game solo on Honor Mode as an Arcane Trickster or a Valor Bard which are probably the actual worst classes in the game, simply because Sword Bard does the exact same thing 10 times better.

[@Swageralt]

As a former WoW minmaxer, thinking about simulating all the possible variations of multiclasses, feats, gear, consumables, party buffs, pre-combat actions, fight variations(different AC, number of enemies, turn order, and so forth), breaking of concentration, e.t.c. makes me think just how much work would have to be done in order to find the highest DPR/Best in Slot build. Also, i think it's fairer to the tabletop to make simulations with Honour ruleset, as some builds could output 1000 to 3k DPR, when abusing broken DRS mechanics with non-HM ruleset.

[@AK-bm1yl]

The thing is the more I play different runs, the more I'm realizing that party build as a whole is a lot more important than individual character build. For example, fire sorlock is great, but if you stack it with a party that stacks arsonist oil and combustion, it becomes a literal god.

[@nevermindCreations]

Completely true! Right now, I was only focusing on a simple target and no companions - but will look into actual bosses, and how companions can help. Wet, Paralysis or vulnerability (e.g. perilous stakes) are huge factors - and combustion as well, if there are a lot of targets

[@ChungusTheLarge]

​@@nevermindCreations, also helpful to spec your party for crowd control so that you can go kick a god in the ribs

[@The_RealWilliam]

Everything is better with a party bid, but maybe you don't want to deal with drama and just want to go solo? Now people can see for themselves what class will allow survivability.

[@danielbrilliant3532]

Unless you use one of the broken builds like the one that does damage by flying. Then you're basically soloing the game with single round combat so the party is relevant.

[@nahuelmat]

party comp made me realise a throw barbarian wasn't exactly the best choice, even if it has higher dps. unless you have 2 barbarians, you want the member who has access to rage and an insane amount of hp to be a frontline damage eater

[@thedarkness75]

I saw the video title and thought “here we go, another owlbear from the top rope doing like 12,000 dmg video” but then was relieved it wasn’t that. Great job and appreciate all the work you put into this

[@The_RealWilliam]

There is such a video? Where? link?

[@m0nkEz]

The simplest way to trivialize (almost) every fight in the game is to have two druids/tempest clerics upcast call lightning, and a sorcerer to haste them. Chuck a water bottle at the target and they can easily do 100+ damage each per round. Not saying it's the best option (proper builds could definitely beat it), but for something that's trivially easy to do, it's obscenely powerful.

[@papperankan]

most dmg ive done in a round is well over 1000 with swordsbard multiclass against ansur. it has 30+ ac with 200+ hp and deals dmg on enemies turns, it has the best conversation skills and made solo honour mode a joke. important notes: 5 swords bard, 6 champion fighter, 1 war cleric starting score atleast 17 dex and 16 charisma gear: risky ring, bhaalist armor, gear that gives more crit chance, titan bow, amulet of greater health, that medium armor that give full dex bonus, Diadem of Arcane Synergy (corellians guided hand or strenght glove if you dont want elixirs) awaken buff so that u can spend bonus action on illithid powers the illithid power that makes it so enemies take psychic dmg while they miss (this is multiplied by 2 with resonance stone) and ability drain will drain dexterity so enemies lose dex ac bonus. luck of the far realms isnt even needed as u crit more often then not. sharpshooter, archery fighting style, tough, i think asi +2 dex auntie ethel hair (dexterity) mirror of loss dex(u can take the +1 charisma if you get it) cloud giant elixir i have minmaxed this build to be the absolute best in the game, if someone has a better build then this pls tell me it. it also is relevent the whole game with being a little bit worse having extra attack at level 6 bard( i respec into level 5 bard as soon as i get level 10 so i get level 5 bard level 5 fighter)

[@nevermindCreations]

I'll make it possible to simulate this as well, so we can just let it race against other potential minmaxed builds :)

[@thoththeraven7671]

I think you can get a bit more damage w/ assassin build taking advantage of dolor amarus and an extra attack from gloomstalker. Morgana Evelyn has a full breakdown on her channel. Your build seems super sweet tho and similar to what i used to beat honor mode except i didnt use war cleric

[@papperankan]

@@thoththeraven7671 ok thank you for that info, didnt know dolor amarus was bugged, def op combined with all crit upgrade and risky ring you crit on a ~17 and that with advatage is 111/400 dice rolls. so almost every fourth shot. It will approx do ~4 extra per attack which is good. however i dont think assasion will be worth taht one extra shot, prob for first round dmg but not overall. Always happy to find new things and i didnt test this, only theory so i could be wrong. Ive also used a lot of mods recently so my memery of this build in vanilla is little rusty. also one thing i forget to mention is the blur cloak which combined with 30 you will never get hit.

[@thoththeraven7671]

@@papperankan My impression of the damage comparison is that the stealth archer build will be highest with special arrows (specifically slaying and many targets) since you cannot use flourish w/ special arrows. Without arrows I think bard probably ends up doing far more damage turn 1. Also having spells and convo skills is more fun to play than using stealth shenanigans edit: also i don't see your other ring slot (I assume protection if AC 30?) but i like using band of mystic scoundrel + helm of arcane acuity w/ my bard build since it let's you use BA to cast pattern or similar if you are high enough level

[@papperankan]

@@thoththeraven7671 ye, I’ve never played around with fighting outside combat, it seems less fun tbf. the reason i prefer bard also is single target damage but arrow of many target is so op still and if you have enough targets to survive all the damage that will definitely be the most dmg possible. Bard flourish adds that 1d8 extra dmg i think (could be 1d6) which when it crits is 2d8 with avg of ~9 extra per shot. which because it’s per shots and flourish is 2, on a crit would deal extra 4d8 extra dmg ~18. +the normal doubled dmg from a double attack which is what u would get from an arrow of something. And ye the ring is prot but you don’t really need it. It’s more for style to accually get to 30ac. You could have acid ring, callous ring, killer sweetheart any ring you want basically

[@BouncingTribbles]

Oh look, it's the marital/caster gap graphed perfectly. Great work.

[@AlmostMeantToBe]

To many bad players completely ignore how good cc and area control is in fights. While this is useful information it not indicative of how good a class is. It ignores how much damage u prevent or enable through things like hunger of hadar or hold person.

[@KimmyR3]

@@AlmostMeantToBe tbf, this was just about 'who does the most dmg'.. which what the vid is. A class' effect and overall contribution and value to your playthrough, from damage and/or supporting, is harder to quantify with so much more variables at play. But yes, there's also value in CC (and counter CC).. sometimes even greater than outright damage on some situations.

[@paragonca9736]

Commenting before watching: my guesses are Open Hand Monk, Paladin, possibly a Fire Sorcerer build, or Swords Bard Edit: oh damn... My first ever playthrough was on a Moon Druid, and I knew the strength of Water Myrmidon, but I definitely didn't optimize it like this

[@Ashen_Night116]

You do actually have the gist of the classes that can consistently do that high of damage in actual combat. The issue with this whole set up is that it's done in a vacuum, against a training dummy, it has no resistances, nor immunities, or any bullshit that stops you from doing things. As another comment pointed out, literally all of this falls apart the moment you get into combat, lol.

[@AlmostMeantToBe]

@@Ashen_Night116 true, people always ignore cc, area denial, and mobility. Its why a lot of players think mages suck because they value the damage of two swings but not the doubling of damage a hold person lets that same fighter do. Even better is when you deny an entire group of enemies with black holes and hunger of hadars or other area ddenial spells. trivializing a lot of fights by not allowing enemies to do respond at all.

[@CyberGhostArt]

yep, my favorite class/multiclass is open hand monk + thief rogue for the extra bonus action, it can go on karlach with soul coins or ascended astarion, stack onhit effect with unnarmed attacks, tavern brawler, cloud giant elixir, and suddenly you can just deal potentially 500 damage in one turn with 99% to hit with my setup (with speed potion up), but no extra buffs at all, it could go even further if buffed by another companion, its actually kinda ridiculous. its nothing like those super optimized builds that i see people run, but its pretty solid and reliable!

[@53860]

I noticed in the Druid section of the video that you use Exposing Bite multiple times per battle. However, that ability only recharges on a short rest, so you can typically use it just once per battle.

[@barrywise7185]

Awesome video. I’m super excited to see how the heat buildup builds do in future videos.

[@drunemeton]

Wow! Thank you for putting this all together and presenting it to the community. Very well done! I've subscribed as I hope to see future videos that expand on the basic premise here, to include weapon options, companions, maybe even tactics.

[@OnlineKenji]

Nice analysis and breakdown. Kind of figured a moon Druid would stomp as I recently started my Druid play through and am really enjoying it. Very surprised by the monk ( but it is base with out the amazing items that skyrocket it).

[@DaringDan]

College of Swords Bard is the best overall class in the game. Conversation master, huge damage, CC, and magic. Master of all.

[@Ragatokk]

Great video, hope you do more advanced takes on this in the future.

[@РоманЕфимов-ю1э]

This is best video i have in a week. I am very insterested in multiclass video. Finally we would know for sure what is the best build in the game.

[@nevermindCreations]

Thanks! I'm hyped as well, just needed a few weeks to set this up. Multiclass is definitely next

[@Spartacus.D]

this is a nice benchmark for future videos, this stuff can really explode the more you get into it good work!

[@nunya_bizniz]

Perfect to listen to at work as I contemplate my class for a 2nd playthrough. 👍

[@josephhoult8445]

It's hard to grasp just how many different combinations can be considered when doing these calculations A huge undertaking and a lot of effort, incredibly impressive!

[@mikfhan]

Great investigation! Completely unrelated I set up my party to cover all attribute/skill rolls, with a DEX rogue/barbarian STR for physical skills, druid or cleric for WIS and then INT wizard + lucky halfling CHA sorcerer main character. Full-caster goodness. Honour mode can have annoying skill dice rolls you don't want to exploit task manager for xD

[@constantvigil3775]

Fire Myrmidon will probably be even stronger as you can manually drop concentration at the end of your turn and you will be instantly lethargic meaning you won’t miss your next turn from the buff running out organically.

[@nevermindCreations]

Good Call! I did not consider this yet. But this is exactly what I made the simulator for, trying things out ... So I ran the numbers and - on its own - Fire Myrmidon (106 dmg/round) is 11% stronger than Water Myrmidon Shape (95 dmg/round), but things change when adding summons. Comparison: gw2wingman.nevermindcreations.de/rotationOptimizer/bg3?sessionID=gorKjan.5019_2_1726137865051 Fire Elemental's Multiattack can benefit from the Burning just as Water Elemental, but neither Elemental nor Myrmidon have a way to create Fire Vulnerability. Thus, if you consider all summons, the Water Gang (219 dmg/round) still does 10% more than the Fire Squad (198 dmg/round). When I use both a summoned Fire Myrmidon and a Wild Shape: Myrmidon, it's even less (175 dmg/round, both doing Haste without lethargic) just because the Elementals' multiattacks are so good Source: gw2wingman.nevermindcreations.de/rotationOptimizer/bg3?sessionID=gorKjan.5019_3_1726137657014

[@constantvigil3775]

@@nevermindCreations I’m not surprised. Vulnerability really is just that strong.

[@1SaG]

If my own experience with..err... 6 or 7 classes is any indication, I'd say the Tavern Brawler/STR-elixir Open Hand Monk with a few levels of Rogue/Thief thrown in for the extra Bonus Action *feels* the most OP. Running a well-built Monk made some of the tougher encounters seem almost trivial, even on Honor-mode. It's been a while since that Honor-run, but IIRC, Orin never even got a single turn in for example.

[@RomanovDA]

Fantastic work! Telling this as a scientist myself.

[@TheMannamies]

Very interesting data, I would suggest that in the future you may want to have more contrasting colors for the vectors because it was hard to follow when they were only shades of same color.

[@The_Red_Hand]

This is really interesting. I hadn't realized Cold brought so much. I know builds with Scorching Ray and Fire Acuity are also incredible, and Psionic builds with the Resonance stone, or piercing with Bhaalist armour. Great vid!

[@wesleynewton3240]

Two things, with the Druid I may have glossed over but I don’t believe it includes damage from minor elementals. Which ice Mephits would definitely add to the chill them and the boost the damage up a bit more, likely not by much though since they are weak but it’s doesn’t cost you anything since you’ll be wild shaped. The second is the fallen lover summon that your nymph can summon, it’s not much but it’s honest work and any dmg increase is a win in my book

[@nevermindCreations]

Good point, but I included them. 38:18 The wood woad (fallen lover) is the tiny damage at the very top of the bar (from level 7+ on, so here it would be the "CoM7" bar) 38:42 Level 8 introduces the Ice mephits (free damage, boosted by chilled and a chance to prone) At Level 9, you see the benefit of Chill coming in

[@fabricedao1036]

the sim soft seems to be amazing ! good job !

[@flithbrin]

1 cold sorc 11 abjuration wizard running armor of agythis and fire shield with a cleric creating water and abjuration spells will always be my favorite, just walking around forcing things to attack you. Unfortunately it 100% does not work against things that don't do melee attacks.

[@Veto2090]

Bringing this knowledge into my next 5e game

[@RPGFan253]

For warlock, eldritch blast with an offhand +1 crossbow is slightly better damage wise. Especially with hex because of the BA attack that its damage can apply to. That lets you take pact of the chain for a very useful imp. I like to turn the amp invisible and use it to guarantee my rogue's sneak attack. With the ASI, I think it just slightly beats out pact of the blade with GWM (especially factoring the imp's damage). YMMV

[@ExecutiveGoth]

Without abusing damage riders I still think the most insane build I found was fighter with GWP wielding the trident or spear of selune with the armor that inflicts aura of murder. Haste + action surge + lower threshold Frits goes SO crazy For sorc, I really like all the equipment that stacks charisma onto ray of frost elemental amulet + potent robe + gloves + lowering crut + kereska’s favor + sorcerer 6 means you can add like 60 + 6d8 (with cold) to each ray which is insane T-T But what makes every build better is acharcter with insane control. I think maybe a way of quantifying how much damage increase a class can have would be cool.

[@nevermindCreations]

Thanks for the suggestion! Yes, some classes really benefit more from having support than others - would be great if we could calculate a metric for that (could be even as simple as: "damage with support" / "damage without support) and see where classes differ

[@ExecutiveGoth]

@@nevermindCreations there’s SO many metrics! There’s also like buffs vs debuffs, wish I had the time to dive into this more :3

[@NextWeeek]

i still think that ranger is the strongest craterflesh gloves, bhallist armor, dolor amarus, 3 levels in assassin, 5 in ranger, 4 in fighter gives you 3000+damage a round with a speed pot and guaranteed surprise round crita

[@kerr354]

While interesting from a technical standpoint I am not sure this benchmark will anytime soon produce insight into which class actually does the most damage in any meaningful way. For example: A single champion 12 fighter which makes use of several flat added damage dice, special arrows, bhaalist armor and other itemization, it is one of the few builds in the game that is actually capable of beating Raphael, all his underlings and the four soul pillars within the first round - which requires atleast a total of 1973 damage being dealt. Additionally the build can do this using only 8 of his 9 attacks (3 base, 3 AS, 1 bloodlust, 1 haste, 1 martial exertion), which means it has a damage burst of over 2k dmg. Since the buffs dont wear off for a while it could do 5 more attacks in the round after and the one after that with doing >2500 additional dmg in both those rounds combined. BG3 is extremely centric on its itemization, builds with and without them not even being on the same order of magnitude in terms of peak damage output. Eventually you will want to account for certain items, even if modelling all item combinations is intractable for obvious reasons.

[@CookieMonster-nt8hh]

thats a really good approach to the problem. Im surprised spell casters arent more powerful. Im also surprised they dont really drop off as hard as i wouldve thought once they run out of high level spell slots

[@pkthunder7008]

It's weird to measure without items though because being able to abuse the best items is what makes some of the classes top tier. That does make it extra hard to measure though so this is still good data. Plus some of the buffs can be done before combat saving your action economy (like dipping) I know you know all this already but it just goes to show how hard this is to measure

[@dianabialaskahansen2972]

I thought it would be sorcerer, because that class has an insane nova ability. But as this is sustained over 10 turns, Sorcerer loses its potency after a few turns, dropping in damage.

[@jaded-harper]

yah id like to see something like this but done over less turns. very very little of the time does combat last 10 turns or more. only time that has really ever happened for me is when I played with mods that massively buffed the hp/dmg of enemies

[@Nostromo2144]

We all know that barrelsploding dwarves beat everything! ;)

[@jumad4971]

Oh my god, please make a video explaining how to use the tool to simulate a build with an example, that would be sick.

[@Bloodsaber64]

exercise in futility imo, factors like gear acquirement, burst damage scenarios, average amount of rounds per encounter etc would tear this apart. by the time the moon druid gets going a lot of the "lower" classes could burst the encounter dead and recover all they abilities they used on a short rest.

[@DwWarWolf]

Good job stating the obvious Captain smartass.

[@willofman]

I feel like highest damage is no the best way to approach class strength and playability, which should be the main goal. I think the most well rounded class is vengeance paladin. Heavy armor, smite, heal, movement, charisma to charm npcs. The druid is probably the next best class, but they lack the charisma, although the damage and survivability are better. Although many praise the bard and cleric as well. Wizard is also nice, but I think their defense is a bit weak. At the same time, everyone seems to hate on the rouge - but their best feature is just kiting the enemies from the shadows with a bow.

[@Vagran]

I thought Tavern Brawler will distort the numbers because it adds to the attack roll and the damage. Once a character that takes advantage of the feat gets it, they won't be missing very much as opposed to Great weapon master with the -5 to hit.

[@nevermindCreations]

Its a very good feat, but I would not call it game-breaking

[@scarletowl4556]

​@@nevermindCreations From my own experience, I would say that it is, as long as you consider the Thief Rogue multiclass. Even without items, at that point, it gets really silly. Same goes for Barbarian and Swords Bard. Thief Rogue is the cherry on top of a lot of builds. Great video, by the way. Really detailed analysis.

[@BabudroSun]

I feel like a comparison of "endgame builds" of items you'd expect to have by the time you fight the Elder Brain would be desirable. You could also do one for fighting the three Goblin bosses, the Adamantine Golem, the Githyanki Inquisitor, Ketheric, and Orin/Gortash/Raphael. While there are certainly many different builds that could each compete for attention, I feel like the same way you chose Champion Fighters, you could pick the most straightforward option for each class. This could be more complicated than I realize, but a few assumptions wouldn't hurt honestly. Even if you chose the Silver Sword as a Githyanki Champion Fighter and some other option would technically get 5% higher damage because of an interaction with a ring or something, it's the obvious choice.

[@Chris_GSD]

Impressive - well done!

[@NatureFreak1127]

I am not Excel sheet type of gamer, but i bow to you.

[@anthonyeaves4145]

I would have expected monk to do better at higher levels but I guess the fear they get in act 3 is probably why they are so absurdly powerful though

[@scarletowl4556]

Keep in mind that what he showed is raw Monk, which is still a heavy hitter. Multiclassing into Thief Rogue would probably change things quite a bit, and that's without considering all the damage bonuses they can get from items. Same goes for Barbarian and and Bard. Thief Rogue is a busted complement to a lot of builds.

[@WolfgangRP]

In case you're interested, I've played several hundred hours with the level 11-20 mod, and OHM 12, Thief 4, Champion 4 is by far the most dmg I've ever come across. No Tav Brawl, just use Duelist Prerogative and the standard dmg rider gear and you will take down a 500 HP enemy in one turn easily. And unlike Sorcadin, you don't need to go home and put your feet up after every fight

[@AndrewBrownK]

Yeah if you have the patience to acquire cloud giant elixir it blows it out of the park

[@NerdGlassGamingPA]

build video please :D

[@WolfgangRP]

@@AndrewBrownK You don't need strength. It's a Dex build. I use Bloodlust elixirs and Briskwind boots.

[@WolfgangRP]

@@NerdGlassGamingPA I'll think about it. No promises

[@Chonus]

I seriously doubt it outperforms Tavern Brawler, even Gloomstalker/Assassin with double Dolor/Craterfish gloves would be higher DPR.

[@sunnycapri8544]

I was thinking to myself, hmm the design looks really really really familiar...... from gw2wingman!!

[@Ragatokk]

Think you should assume somewhere around 18 AC and use honor mode.

[@DaddySadiist]

God I would love to see you min max these just to see how much we can really push the game. Also can you explain the feats level 12 druid had and the attack order? It was too small on screen for me to understand. Larian released stats a while ago saying druid was the least played or close to it and it just baffles me.

[@DoffyDogg]

thats cos ppl only play paladin/warlock/sorcerer and most "well known busted classes from reddit/yt. Druid is broken af with 0 equipment needed.

[@DustinDustin00]

I have a barbarian with 2 levels of Rogue for more fun with bonus actions and click-heal boots for double movement. Found the reach + finesse polearm and just plant between mobs and casters/Astarian. Mobs keep running past me since I'm nothing but a pile of HP and I get to spank 'em. Am I maxed out on damage? Maybe not, but damn I laugh maniacally as I just charge into everything and area attack, then opportunity attack everything as it goes by.

[@IRedpunk]

didn't expect barbarian to be that low wow

[@jay-tee-L]

still dont know what class does the most damage ... great video

[@CyberSkelly817]

Thanks for the video. Please raise the volume of your microphone!

[@Tauriz_]

10:12 i heard "mommy" first, and only 5 seconds later i realized it's "mummy". There's probably definitely something wrong with me.

[@nevermindCreations]

@@Tauriz_ it's not impossible that it could be both!

[@Tauriz_]

@@nevermindCreations oof, please no. I pick mommy 🤣

[@RaethFennec]

I couldn't see that complex graph and wild claim and NOT click... well done! This is an interesting approach. However, it doesn't seem to include multiclassing! So you know what you must do next, right? ... >:)

[@AdrienBackSteel]

can someone make a list of the strongest to weakest one ? visually a bit too complexe to understand for me

[@thineubaut]

My poor warlock. I still love you.

[@opo33333]

10 AC is probably too low, leading to more advantage towards things like sharpshooter

[@Zerberos22]

Draconic sorcerer is the superior version you are not a complete piece of paper when it comes to armor and hp at lvl 6 you get bonus damage to your ancestry ( fire is obviously the best because burning hands is a decent aoe spell early on and fire bolt becomes a super strong cantrip who outperforms every tier1 and 2 spell except scorching ray) and at 11 beeing able to fly gives you a nice movement without the need to use misty step if you take the metamagic of quickened spell into account you can deal the most damage in one round no other class can beat that

[@viablezombie9419]

as a druid player i have to say my biggest gripe is that all wild shapes get outclassed as soon as you unlock owlbear, i dont want to say nerf it because you can still get clapped with it if you aren't playing well but i do feel like the other shapes should get buffed.

[@Demane69]

As a Spore Druid player, I bypass this issue entirely.

[@esarcox2991]

Nice video, can you do this but with the most played multiclasses?

[@nevermindCreations]

I think we have no data on what are the most played multiclasses, right? Might just check the BG3Builds subreddit though

[@joshuaks955]

Hands down up there with one of my most favorite videos all time

[@nickjunes]

You’re giving way to much odds that an enemy will become prone. In the actual game I’ve discovered that the chances of ice actually causing a fall are very low. Maybe that’s because many enemies are resistant or you’re just saying it’s 100% chance I don’t know. Another thing is that many enemies are resistant in general so you have to change up your strategy often. It’s a nice ballpark and I learned about some combinations from this but I know from the classes I play some of these strategies just don’t work in certain zones, or you just run out of magic, or items or whatever. Every battle doesn’t start with full spell slots and unlimited items. One last thing is factoring in how your character is surviving. You have to position your characters around so they don’t die. You have to be defensive as well. If you’re a paper cannon like a wizard that could mean casting a defensive spell or running out of range. Anyway thanks for all the hard work. This was very cool in any respect.

[@scottlavale1502]

the best Damage in all the game is warrior bard with 1 level of priest ... i have like 6+ attacks per round and the bard double shots with hand crossbows using the bhal armor and the piercing ability ... I'm doing 80 crit dmg per bolt. I killed every boss in the game on my first turn with that single character. If you use haste ...pre fight its even more insane!

[@kittydaddy2023]

GWM on a Warlock? LOL, oh brother

[@nevermindCreations]

Give me a better feat choice if you neglect all the fancy items :)

[@kittydaddy2023]

@@nevermindCreations you're not wrong. It's just funny looking at how important the items are for some classes.

[@Storbuki]

@@nevermindCreations The ENTIRE game is about fancy item and their combos. This information, while nice and all, is almost irrelevant to anyone that wants to utilize, the ITEMS you get in the game.

[@c_l_a_d_d_i_x]

@@Storbukithe entire game is about having fun my guy

[@Storbuki]

@@c_l_a_d_d_i_x People HAVE FUN with the items they get in the game. Right? I mean I may just be crazy in thinking so, but yeah, that's true, in almost, ALL rpg games? Maybe you haven't been playing RPG's that long and don't understand the mechanics, so I will give you a pass on that comment.

[@daveyfunk]

So going by this, I see Druid and Monk as being the most consistent damage dealer from 1-12 looking at the colour map at the end?

[@Crazyzaeven]

but like, 11 fighter 1 cleric with special arrows does the most dmg no questions asked... (usually able to solo ansur and sometimes myrkul in one turn with proper setup)

[@bobnewkirk7003]

While I appreciate the benchmarking from a DPR perspective, once you get the builds in game there are a ton of elements that play into calculations, not the least of which are limited health pools of monsters. Personally I think the "optimal" way of playing the higher difficulties is actually nova damage, so I typically run Bow (Swords) Bard, Paladin, OH monk and one slot for flavor; it should really be a thrower (EK or barb) but I cant stand the playstyle. As a logical progression of this topic I think pursuing some typical build splits and benchmarking those against these could give some insight as to why the "middling" classes in your heat map end up being some of the strongest in game. If your looking for suggestions I'll toss in: - Oathbreaker 7 + Old one 5 (nerfed in Honor mode) - Storm 8 + Tempest 2 + Wiz 2 - F2+GOO2+Draconic (fire) 8 - Swords 6 (Bow) + Assassin 3 + Gloom 3 - OH9+Thief3 - Swords 10 (2H) +Pally2 - Necromancer 6 + Spore 6 - Light 8 + Druid 1+ Thief 3

[@andrewcarter9649]

I've found that the Lightning Sorcerer build is better with Blue Dragon Bloodline Sorcerer. The bonus action Fly of Storm is cool early game but I found that as the game goes on and you get more abilities that require your bonus action it's increasingly not needed while the extra HP and AC from Dragon is always useful and the level 6 ability to add proficiency to Lightning damage is better than the AOE damage. Used to be that you needed Sorcerer 9 to Twin Chain Lightning as well as Quicken Create Water but since you can't do that no maybe Wiz 2 is better.

[@authnul]

most spell casters (sorcerers especially) are much better at crowd control than single targets in most cases.

[@cHaMp630]

Untrue actually. Phalar aluve + physic spark amulet + spell sparkler staff early game can already make magic missiles do a lot of single target damage while also proccing reverberation fairly often. By the end of the game artistry of war or magic missile upcasted are regularly doing 150-200 damage per cast while applying 10 stacks of radiant orb and multiple stacks of reverberation to targets so they can't even hit you back with that many debuffs. Warlock can similarly make eldritch blast do a hilarious amount of damage by this point with things like craterflesh gloves + potent robes + crit stacking gear. And then you obviously have tempest cleric forcing max damage rolls on lightning so lightning bolt can do around 100 damage early game and chain lightning can later on do 160-170 damage to not just 1 but multiple targets. Only thing that can beat that overall per round damage would be a sharpshooter build that abuses slaying arrows / arrow of many targets. And melee builds that aren't a monk wont compete whatsoever. 100 > bloodlust 100 > haste 100 > bonus action 100 on lightning bolt early game if you max rolled vs melee doing what? Maybe 40 > extra attack 40 > haste 40 > action surge 40 at max damage rolls each swing lol.

[@authnul]

@@cHaMp630 you can kill multiple targets in one turn that is the essence of crowd control - I mean even a sorcerer tempest cleric multi class can do some insane damage around level 3~4 twinning chromatic orbs and using destructive wrath on enemies that have been wet is extremely powerful. not to mention the meta magic option quicken spell which allows a possible 3 mob kill. all of that damage doesn't have to be put against one source is what im saying which is why i think they are good not only at single target but multi target or what i personally refer to as crowd control. (or you could just play wizard and get fireball). if we are talking pure classes then sorcerers would be in the middle of aoe and general damage they only get better with a different spell casting class accompanying it - sorlock for example. There are simply just too many ways to play a spell caster to say definitely what their strengths may be.

[@illuminati1866]

Cool data!

[@hypnogri5457]

This is amazing

[@declancampbell1277]

would there be a way to adjust this model to account for multi classing? Or perhaps BIS (best in slot) items? Im almost certain that a sorc with 2 level dips into warlock and 1 level dip into fighter outstrips pretty much all of these pure builds. Add items like potent robe and it gets even more stupid.

[@nevermindCreations]

Yep! Working on it. Single-classing is just easier to compare (for all alternatives), since Multiclassing opens up so many possible combinations

[@kraiden3]

Love it. Thank you sir

[@oooSKYLIGHTooo]

double hand-crossbow battle master ftw

[@mohamedmaatougui2469]

So the class designed to function without items, is the best class when no one has items ? COLOUR ME FUCKING SURPRIS- But on a serious note thank you this video is awesome

[@Ragatokk]

I think you could do a lot better with different spells on the bard.

[@T0ffik1]

tbh monk with rouge for extra action would do way more dmg then normal monk.

[@Kastorex]

While an interesting exercise, the fact that this doesn't account for party synergy, itemization, buffs or multiclassing, combined with a rather unrealistic simulation of ten rounds of combat, leaves us with a video that's a starting point at best and misleading at worst. If combat were shortened to 3-5 rounds (and 5 is really pushing it) + the aforementioned features included, I'd be very excited about a tool like this, though, having done wow mythic raiding, gw2 CMs, and of course bg3 theorycrafting.

[@lynx_1028]

My first and only playthrough was starting with barbarian and taking everything that gave me damage, i did reach about 36 damage per attack so 3/4 attack going 9 levels into berserk and 3 levels into fighter, really nice build imo, once i finished the game and i had the gloves of strength i respec to 8 lvl monk of the open hand with tavern brawler and 4 lvl in berserk putting everything into wisdom (including the +4 to stats that u can get from story) then put strength of gloves and i found it to be about a 12 damage per attack increase, for feat i went tavern brawler and savage attacker, monk build same as the one in the video, on non crit turns i had more or less 200 damage per turn and more if i had haste. cool video hope to see the follow up

[@InsanePorcupine]

The main thing I think of though is a character is never in a vacuum like the way you test/calculate. I guess I'm saying that the sum may be greater than the parts. If you have a warrior and he has 3 actions, and one of those I chuck a bottle of water at someone. I just doubled a casters damage with a third of one action. The caster couldn't have done it. The other thing I think of is items. This doesn't seem to account for the magical items that exist in the game, scrolls and potions. Now while if it were just dungeons and dragons, in a more generic sense I think that would be fine, but since you are making a tier list for baldurs gate specifically it does seem like a glaring omission. I'm never not going to have all the scrolls etc in a playthrough when they are so easily obtainable. Like for max damage did you calculate just spamming chain lightning scrolls on wet things? For some reason chain lightning hits the red dragon in the last fight 3 times. I did 500 dmg in a single cast once. Metamagic gives you a cast of it with a scroll with a bonus action. Tempest cleric can cast it at max dmg. Hell even orpheus can cast it lol My last playthrough i had him walk through some haste spores and cast it twice on the emperor. Seemed funny tbh So I think this is a great start but I'm not sure how useful it would be on my next playthrough? If I'm trying to be the very best it's gonna include all the thigns available in the game. Even if you exclude multiclasses, including everything else to me would be better. I would be interested in the stats of X class with full items and BIS gear vs X class with the same. And then compare multiclasses to all that. Maybe that's too much work I dunno and I like your data I just don't see how I'm appling it really.

[@nevermindCreations]

Yep, this is only a first step. I somewhere say that in the vid (but it went way too long). I like to establish a "core" ground to say how good is every class "on their own", before adding constellations and asking how good is every class "with all the help they can get"

[@InsanePorcupine]

@@nevermindCreations I mean I get that, but I mostly want information I can apply if I'm watching a strongest class in bg3 video. Also you might consider having a conclusion at the end of the video. People don't want to watch 40 minutes with no clear conclusion. You need to explicitly state which class does the most damage at the start and end of your video, and go into more depth in the middle. Like an essay. I honestly watched most of this and I'm unlclear which class you are even saying does the most lol. I'm not trying to be a dick, just sharing my confusion with parts of the vid. You seem to be doing a lot of work and I'm not intending to discourage you, maybe jsut some thigns to tweak in your formula.

[@whiterunguard4239]

@@InsanePorcupine ⁠​⁠​⁠This isn’t a “strongest class in BG3 video” though. The previous comment says this explicitly, that the point is to illustrate how each class stands individually without interference from other characters or itemization. I also found the graph at the end and heatmap to be very conclusive and easily digestible. If you were unsure by the end of this video then I am genuinely confused how you lasted the almost 45 minute duration in the first place. It’s not the creators fault for not having spelled things out for you, no offense. In your first example you claimed a caster is unable to throw water even though they absolutely can with the use of mage hand, they can literally do this from level 1 onwards without sacrificing their own action, doubling their own cold/lightning output with their own summon.

[@LFshlevin]

@@InsanePorcupine if you didnt understand this then maybe a remedial reading comprehension class ?

[@InsanePorcupine]

@@whiterunguard4239 You just said which class does the most damage but you didn't determine that. You determined which class does the most damage with no items or gear. IMO this is important. Make of that what you will. The heat map was good but I'm saying for us idiots out there you have to say things like you were explaining them to a 2 yo. I assure you this is correct lol. I know YOU get it lol but perception be like that. And yes there are many ways to put water effect on ppl my initial point was simply to point out one single example of a duo party being better than the sum of the parts. I get that's too much though. I'm saying it's too long and not explicit in your thesis enough. I'm not trying to disparrage you though gl man keep up the amazing work! In my own weird way I'm trying to help. cheers

[@crazyelf1]

I don't know if this is possible, but is there a way to determine which multiclass combination is the optimal choice?

[@nevermindCreations]

In theory, I could simulate "every" possible combination of multiclassing, but thats a few hundred million choices, so I think I would rather see which are the most popular - or let people create their own builds in the tool and rank them in the end

[@Frazec_Atsjenkov]

Very interesting data driven look at the classes. I'd have changed the rules to give each class the best +0 starting weapons for their class, not necessarily the weapons they start with. For instance i think the rogue would benefit more from dual hand-crossbows with sharpshooter.

[@stephenholmgren405]

I'd hate to use this guide as a "what character to play" guide - but I think that's what is happening here (I know bg3 is more than such dmg)

[@MilkJugA_]

Something I dislike about bg3 compared to dnd is all the information you are given. You see the enemy hp, ac, resistances, chance to hit etc. That makes it easy for you to quickly calculate damage and how long that will take. In dnd it is guesswork mixed with narration by the DM. You can find out the AC and stuff eventually after some turns attacking though. Anyways point being, spells and moves that debuffs enemies and buffs allies is at a higher value in dnd. Hypnotic pattern is a good example (also because enemies are usually closer together in dnd than bg3)

[@nokowinsidence9854]

Subbed.

[@crazysnypa]

I have yet to see anyone out damage a gloomstalker/champion build in 1 round. Many people say they "can" but they, in fact, can not.

[@Kastorex]

Fighter 11 Warcleric 1, 380 damage per arrow w/ party buffs and not much less without. Gloomstalker multiclass: 5 shots turn 1 Fighter 11: 7 shots turn 1.

[@crazysnypa]

@Kastorex 380? That's it? Still not more than a properly built gloomstalker assassin. So again, like I said, still doesn't out damage GS Assassin build

[@Kastorex]

@@crazysnypa 380 per arrow. 4400+ damage per turn fully buffed.

[@galedex5661]

Is there a feat list for the builds used?

[@nevermindCreations]

Hmm it's definitely in the simulator. For martials, I always checked if GWM or Sharpshooter makes more sense than ASI, but I think they always were (Exception: Tavern Brawler for Monk/Druid. I also look at TB versus GWM at 6:00 For regular casters, ASI was mainly chosen. Other notable feats would be Elemental Adept (especially in scenarios beyond this dummy enemy), Spell Sniper (if your main damage source is spell attack rolls) and Dual Wielder (but only if you have 2 weapons that bring you passive bonuses, which I didnt do in this benchmark)

[@TheTwober]

Also keep in mind that this is only the combat performance. While a Rogue might lack behind in damage, it can pickpocket to get your party all the loot it needs. While a charisma-based char can avoid fights alltogether, making it even the best "combat" character, by one-shotting the enemy before the fight even begins.

[@pacmanpakkas]

so you are telling me to play level 4 rogue then multiclass into wizard or druid till 12?

[@willielast]

So whats the answer?

[@LocalMaple]

Two more things. 1. Multiclass. What is worth taking a 1-3 dip into a class? 2. Ilithid powers. Which improve a build the best? Easy example: The auto-Crit Tadpole, 2 levels Tempest Cleric, 2+ levels Storm Sorcerer, 1+ levels Wizard. - Sorcerer gives Quickened Spell to cast Create Water as a Bonus Action. The opponent’s gains vulnerability to Lightning and Cold damage. - Wizard or Storm Sorcerer gives a Lightning spell with an attack roll. - If you hit (War Cleric ally?), use your Channel Divinity to maximize your dice rolls, and your Ilithid to make it a Crit. If you do the above with a 6th level Witch Bolt, and the target wasn’t immune or resistant to Lightning: - Base damage: 6d12 - Crit damage: 12d12 damage. - Vulnerability: 12d12 x2 damage. - Destructive Wrath: 12 x 12 x 2 damage. Total: 288.

[@gobro2688]

Somebody summerize it for me

[@lylefoley1779]

Great video but this feels like the most German video ever... in a good way

[@LukasSalich]

I think Fighter.

[@davidhalliday7776]

Absolutely fascinating. In reality though without equipment its pointless. Sure a melee character at L12 with a starter weapon is crap. But a good weapon could make all the difference. Caster (and summon) classes are less dependent on equipment. Their upgraded equipment is normally in the form of one extra spell so over the battle less impactful.

[@Guapter]

this is wrong, because all your melee classes have peak of power at level 5 when they get second attack, but your result says it worst at 5 and after

[@mertdag7099]

Druid gang 💚🌲🐻