WHICH IS BETTER? | 7.1.2 vs 5.1.4 | Dolby Atmos | DTS:X

[@flyinlow1]

Just set up 5.1.2 after watching your previous video on the height channels. I put the inceiling speakers a foot in front of the listening position and aimed the tweeters towards the seats. Sounds incredible. It expanded the sound stage so much.

[@ealanosborne]

Hey that’s great! Congrats! 🎊😄

[@dosmaiz7361]

Hey Ruch, which .2 speakers did you go with? I want to expand Mt 5.1 setup as well.

[@qua7771]

One ft in front of the listener?

[@Chris-hr2uj]

This is a great video. I have a 5.1.4, but I was always unsure about how effective side surrounds were at imaging rear sound effects. But I had an epiphany: when playing video games that support surround sound, you can really test out the rear speaker location imaging. I was rotating my camera view while playing God of War just to test surround sound, and what I discovered is that 5 bed layer speaker imaging REALLY makes you feel like voices and sound effect travel around and behind you, giving you that immersion and sense of direction. Its the same with Horizon Forbidden West. Sounds behind the player view literally feel like they are behind your ears. I attribute this discovery to my being able to control the direction of the sound in a video game. You dont have the same control of direction of sound in a movie. With movies, I've always just kind of accepted and perceived the noise how it was mixed and configured in my space. But i was always unsure of my rear imaging, and I've read that many 7.1 movies dont even really use the rear channels much. But to summarize, video games are a great way to test and prove that the rear imaging from a 5.1 system works. I considered adding rears, but I think I'm just fine. I agree, 4 heights give a sense of direction above with height effects.

[@ealanosborne]

Most definitely. Crazy how gaming engines work that way. So immersive! 🤘

[@VioletGiraffe]

Thank you for sharing your experience! So the immersion is 100% there with just 2 surround speakers, but what about being able to locate the source of sound? Was it travelling more or less smoothly around you?

[@Fluterra]

With a Trinnov you’ll get much better surround imaging in movies. The other stuff is not really surround.

[@VioletGiraffe]

@@Fluterra with a Trinnov I can buy a bigger house for the cost of the processor, and get better surround by spacing the speakers further apart.

[@Fluterra]

@@VioletGiraffe That still won’t correct for phase, position, and timing. Where can you buy a house for $20k? I’ll buy a few… If you factor the cost of all the upgrades you’ll be making to AVRs vs just getting a Trinnov and be done with it, then you probably could buy a house with the money you save!

[@whitecrowuk575]

My opinion is: following Dolby positioning is most important for immersive experience. Therefore whatever room can accommodate. Couch close to back wall - go with 5.1.4. You have more space in the back go with 7.1.2. That is if you’re limited to 9.1. In terms of making holes if you do go with 7.1.2 and think you might expand in the future don’t buy ceiling speakers, buy on walls they will work brilliant and you will deal with two small holes later which any self respecting man should be able to deal with.

[@calibre00]

You just keep answering those tricky questions that most of us building our Atmos systems are asking mate, another great video 👍

[@ealanosborne]

Thank you!!! 🤘

[@Cyclone311]

Team 7 ear level speakers right here! ...but I appreciate what you are representing here. It makes a lot of sense. It's expensive to go 7.1.4. Even with the cheapest receiver, you still have to buy a amp to fully power all of them. You can find 9 channel only receivers for much less, and I really think if you are going to go Atmos you have to get 4 height channels or you are not getting the true 3d audio experience.

[@lucasrem]

receiver muhahaha, wat source you use, KZbin on a TV ???? cheap soundbar is more than enough for these people! You need better sources to do ATMOS !

[@VioletGiraffe]

@@lucasrem like what ?

[@JavonDGreen]

I’m going from a 5.2.4 to a 7.2.6 I know my mind will be blown. I loved the .4 setup so much. We sold our house and are building a new one with a dedicated theater. Having the immersion of 7 ear level instead of the phantom side surrounds will be welcomed and I get to keep the height movement you also discussed. Ealan you are my favorite KZbinr right now. Your content is stellar and accurate. I wish you were around when I first got into this hobby about 4 years ago. Would have saved me some time and money. I agree with everything you say. I can confirm it all myself. Keep making this content my friend.

[@ealanosborne]

Thank you so much for the kind words! 😄🤘

[@lucasrem]

All you need is a center speaker, left and right channel., rest of the speakers, nobody cares.... Mind blowing? you freak out in Cinemas ?

[@JavonDGreen]

@@lucasrem the cinema has nothing on my home theater. I will explain further though. My last setup was in an open basement. The speakers were placed perfect but the room was not ideal. However in that space my 5.2.4 sounded 1000 times better than an actual cinema. I’m not the only person that thought that either. Better bass, more clarity, I actually heard surround movement way more clear than I ever heard at the theater. I started going to the cinema only to audition movies for my home theater. I stopped going to the theater all together after a while. (Marvel premieres were the only exception.) If you don’t believe me that’s fine I’d just question your setup. I would say most people would agree though that are into this hobby. I used mind blowing to describe my new theater do to the fact that the room was designed to be a theater from the ground up. Very specific speaker placement, room treatment, more speakers and better AV equipment. It sounded amazing in my last space and there was hardly anybody that I brought over who listened that heard my setup didn’t say the words “this is crazy, I’ve never heard sound like that, this is better than the cinema, I’ve gotta get me something like this” and that was just speakers placed as good as they could in an improper room with mediocre equipment. Maybe I’m crazy but there is a reason why people spend thousands of dollars to bring the cinema in their homes. Go listen to a proper setup and get your mind blown my friend.

[@rayking507]

@@JavonDGreen Hi there, could I ask what was your set up for both of the rooms; i.e Processor, amps, speaker&subs thank you very much.

[@JavonDGreen]

@@rayking507 sure. On the 5.2.4 setup I had a Yamaha Aventage rx2080 receiver, outlaw 5000 amp. Emotiva airmotiv speakers for bed layer. 4 Klipsch 5800c 2 in ceiling speakers for Atmos. 2 SVS sb16 ultra subs. I used butt kickers in all 5 leather home theater recliners as well. Biggest impact on the entire setup however was the mini DSP for the subs and proper room treatment. The new setup 7.2.6 I switched to in walls using the focal 300 series for all speakers in bed layer and Atmos. Same subs but will upgrade later depending on the sound of the room or add 2 more of the same. The processor and amps have been upgraded to the Emotiva RMC-1 pre-amp processor and XPA line of amplifiers. However I have my eye on audio control’s processor. This room has been properly treated acoustic wise and the screen went from 98inches to 127” the projector stayed the same and is an Epson 5050ub. Will most likely upgrade to a Sony or JVC though. I’ve added 2 more chairs as well for a total of 7

[@zalllon]

I agree with you. I have a Denon 4400, and I’ve had a 7.2 set up for a bit. Then just over a year ago got some ceiling speakers to have it as 7.2.2. It was cool to hear things above you, but as others have said … it’s like having surround sound only using 2 speakers at the front. I literally received the Emotiva Basx A3 amp yesterday, and 2 bipolar speakers. I’ll swap out my 2 bookshelf speakers with the bipolar, use them as height channels for the front and move my ceiling speakers as close to the back as possible (as seats are 12’ from back wall). The new amp will power front stage.

[@ealanosborne]

Whoa! Congrats on the upgrades! You’re gonna love the new setup! 🤘

[@jeffwagner1649]

The problem,if you don’t have a designated theater room, your living room becomes your TV center. If you add ceiling speakers your living room furniture is basically locked in. No more moving your furniture around for a change and variety.

[@lucasrem]

KZbin source in ATMOS ?? are you mad ?? Why you need TV ??

[@lassmirandadennsiewillja3943]

plus your sofa is often against the wall so forget a .4 or .6 setup. There simply is no "behind you". Only a pair of top middle is the way to go then.

[@fonkenful]

Indeed, even for those of us with the luxury of several rooms theoretically large enough to accommodate the placement of a 7 channel ear level bed layer and as many channels of ceiling mounted effects as will be the current vogue, the realities of traffic patterns, staircases, corner located doors, picture windows, etc all too often constrain our ability to do so without very extensive and expensive structural renovations. Hence, I think we’ll see an ever increasing popularity of higher end multichannel active systems such as the new Nak Dragon, B&O Stage, etc.

[@lassmirandadennsiewillja3943]

@@fonkenful i think that the creation of "phantom channels" will be much better in the future. The modulation of a speaker that is really behind you, even if your couch is against the wall. Something they kind of do with dolby atmos for headphones and htrf profiles. Iam with you, 90% of us do not have a 100% perfect layout. In a livingroom not possible. Currently i use 2 Dipols as surr back an another direct speaker right behind me that gets the SUM of both Dipols and is of course a litte bit quieter. It works now, kind of

[@tobycraft9534]

Add a painting

[@MrBill99]

In my case, I prefer 7.1.2. I have tried both setups in my space. There is not a lot of good Atmos content and I love my surround backs for most content. In my opinion, most movies have more sound coming from my surround backs than my Atmos speakers. Other rooms might be different. I like your videos!

[@ealanosborne]

Totally understandable! 🤘

[@leecaldwell1029]

I am in the same boat. I have 7.2.2 and the reality is movies utilize surrounds and surround backs way more than atmos overhead. That is why I didnt go with 7.2.4. I am sure I will get there eventually. I have in ceiling with tweeters that can be aimed, so I just put the atmos in the correct placement for 4 atmos and pointed the tweeters and everything so far sounds fantastic.

[@slide6577]

Agreed. Right now 95+% of streaming content is from 5.1.0 masters or worse; it doesn't even have height channel data. Deriving the rear channel to get 7.1.X is mathematically relatively straightforward, but there is no formula for deriving height from 5.1. Remember "simulated stereo" before TV stations broadcast stereo? They would do some totally crude processing like sending certain frequencies to the left and others to the right. It would end up sounding much worse than if you just had a single center speaker. Same thing for height channels today; the receiver has to use "simulated height" algorithms like dolby surround to make guesses about what should go up there, but because there is no height metadata, the guesses are really bad, similar to "simulated stereo". Sure, on the best Atmos mixes maybe there is an argument for 5.1.4. But for most content, 7.1.2 is going to sound much more like it sounded on the mixing stage.

[@lastsamurai90]

Exactly, even though Ealen does a great analysis and arrives at a solid conclusion from a speaker configuration and future expansion pov, it completely forgoes a significant angle which is the available content sound format, whether it’s physical media or streaming.

[@VictorSantos2k]

But isn't most current content at 5.1 especially streaming content, even with upmixing to 7.1, the source will be 5.1 that why its best to go 5.1.4 no brainer imho... It is true that more sound will come out of the rear surrounds but I believe a perfectly placed 5.1 rear surrounds at 110-120 degrees with bright speakers like svs surround elevation will be the best bet, easily attainable by moving could 2-3 feet from the wall, can even use L-bracket to provide the 90 degree mounting point. If its a dedicated theater room for audiophile then 7.1.4 will be king but if you want a normal living room without the clutter of side surrounds or rear surrounds 5.1 is king for the common folks @@slide6577

[@tonyprano6066]

Running a 7.2.4 at the moment with a 75" tv and loving it!

[@wraighsj]

Really, REALLY useful info. I'm about to install new setup with 4 heights so your video's have been invaluable. Many thanks. You sir, are my kind of nerd! 🙂

[@ealanosborne]

Hooray! Thank you so much for your kind words. ☺️

[@Foreverjazzfan]

My surrounds in 7.1.4 are elevated, no other way to do it in my room. My rear surrounds are directly below but in a couple feet from my rear heights. My front heights are directly above my front L and R. Both front and rear heights are aimed toward the mlp about standing height. You really get that submersive sound all around and above you. Sounds amazing.

[@antiWhiteism777]

​@ealanosborne --- How many speakers is the max for current movies and shows? How many channels are they making these movies in? Also, what's the max amount of subwofers a setup should have?

[@ealanosborne]

For the longest time, studios would mix Atmos in 7.1.4, but there are a lot more titles that are being mixed in larger configurations. That being said, Atmos at its core should conform to however many speakers you have, technically up to 24 ear level, 10 height and 1 subwoofer channel. And having at least 2 subwoofers is usually ideal, since it helps get bass frequencies more evenly output around your furniture, etc.

[@antiWhiteism777]

@@ealanosborne--- I've read that having two subwoofers isn't the same as having two subwoofer channels, can you explain?

[@Ezekiel43]

Tried the Atmos speakers front-high for a few years. Found that it made the sound stage too front-heavy and made it too difficult to tell what sounds were going above. Then spent a year and a half with the Atmos speakers hanging from upside-down wall-mounted bookshelf arms above the seat, pointing straight down, since I live in an apartment that I can't install ceiling speakers in and the seat was at the wall. However, I realized that having the seat right up against the wall probably wasn't good for reflections. My head is now about fifteen inches from the wall when I sit there and the Atmos speakers were slightly behind my head. Also found that having the two Atmos speakers almost directly above made the sound stage too back-heavy. So, after five or six years with Atmos, I finally removed the Atmos speakers from my system. "Downgraded" from 5.1.2 to 4.1. (No center speaker either because I could never get the speaker high enough beneath the TV and I rarely watch with other people anyway, meaning that not sitting in the center is almost never a problem and the phantom center of two front speakers makes more sense.) Almost all the movies I watch are in two-dimensional surround, mono or matrixed stereo. When I watch older movies with Atmos mixes, I almost always pick the older sound mixes because they're more tastefully done. I can point to several mixes where some of the height effects don't make sense. It's like they place the sounds there just so that listeners are satisfied that all their speakers are used. (Not to mention the LFE being too strong in some of the Atmos remixes.) Atmos and DTS:X make up such a minority of the content I consume. If you can't sit in the center of your listening space, if your seat is right up against the back wall or almost, don't bother with Atmos. The height effects will be largely wasted and sound more gimmicky than they should.

[@mptobler1]

My current 5.1 system has the couch and rear speakers on the back wall. My question is how do I set up my new TX-RZ50 I want to set up my system to a 5.1.2. No issues with the fronts and center and I understand I need to hook up the Height speakers, my confusion is which should I hook up the Surrounds, or Surround back.

[@ealanosborne]

Surrounds. Technically “surround backs” only come into play when you have 7 ear-level speakers. In your 5 ear-level speaker system, “surrounds” is what you’ll be connecting. Congrats on getting an RZ50! 🙌

[@mptobler1]

@@ealanosborne Thanks the Rz50 is a beast, and I need a tutor for Dirac...Anyway So in Atmoseese would this be a 5.1.4 or 7.1.2

[@ealanosborne]

@@mptobler1 If you have 5 ear level speakers and 4 height channels, that’s 5.1.4. 7 ear level speakers and 2 heights = 7.1.2.

[@ramonbmovies]

I have a 5.1.2 setup, but the atmos channels are at the top front near the 2 mains. I can barely hear them even though I have them turned up really high in the receiver as compared to all other speakers in the system. Only occasionally I hear them throw out distinct surround sound effects. Usually, it's things like birds or wind. Or, sometimes they help fill the room if it's a loud scene. But I believe the placement of those channels is really bad since the only way to really hear them is to put my ear literally 1" away from the speakers. The mains and center channels easily overpower them.

[@robertrobitaille320]

I have a 5.2.2 . Atmos speaker's are middle. Work for me.

[@trauma50disaster1]

maybe try room correction software?

[@evrythingis1]

If your surrounds are placed correctly in a 5.1 system (slightly behind the listening position, above your head and angled down), I feel like you have to have a large space for the extra atmos speakers to make an impact. I feel like you would have to have at least 12 foot high ceilings in a room around 30 feet across for atmos channels to change the sound as they are intended too.

[@soever]

Very interesting. Do you have any reference ?

[@roberto.gallegos]

Yeah I have my couches up at the back of the living room. It’s a funky living room for a home theatre. On top of it, I choose to go with the builder pre wire and they put 5 surround speaker position pre wire in the curling. At least the two from and two backs are in line. Only thing though is I want Dolby atoms and need to figure out a way to do it with those. And my seats being way at the back where I can’t have anything behind. Oh and on top of that. One side wall is all windows so no speakers can go there in the wall either.

[@ealanosborne]

Yeah, we all gotta make do with what we got. My current living room also has a sliding glass door to one side, so that's a no-go for any kind of eventual in-wall or something. Oh well.

[@anthowinebradford2978]

Figuration I'm looking for is having like in the front like about six seats in the front and you step up and have like about six in the back and then you have a little space behind it to put your back speakers and your height speakers I was going to have some side speakers so I can hit the level for the ones on the second year what do you think would be the best consideration gun I'm putting it in my basement and my basement totally gutted

[@ealanosborne]

Yeah, you might want 6 height speakers in total with 2 big rows of seating like that. Although it’s only worth it if the height speakers are more than about 6 feet apart. If your space only allows for heights to be less than 6 feet apart, it’s not really worth it, since they’ll bleed into each other. Just stick with 4 height channels if that’s the case. 👍

[@davewme]

I did 5.1.2 as well. from 5.1 moved paradigm dipole from rear surround, to ceiling, slightly forward of seating area. and added klipch studios, to the rear, increased my sub from 10", to 12" polk. in a small 8x12 space, with 4' walk thru area beside. I am very happy with the sound! I feel so much depends on the space. but really appreciate your videos, to help give me ideas, that will work with what I already have. :)

[@ealanosborne]

Excellent! Congrats on your upgrades. 😁🎉

[@ntlknight]

Thank you for the time you devote to helping us along, I’ve been enjoying your content! I’m new’ish to the more advanced side of home theater setups and in particular, to Atmos…but I’m in the process of buying new hardware and I have some questions which I hope are not too long or cumbersome! 1. 2 CHEAP (old) AVRs vs 1 EXPENSIVE ONE? For the budget-minded, rather than buying one of the newer AVRs that offer all the channel outputs needed to have tons of speakers, could someone use 2 (older and cheaper) machines to power the same number of speakers…and still get proper Atmos configurations? 2. DO OLDER AVRs HAVE PROPER ATMOS OUTPUTS? There are used Denons selling online, like the AVR-3312Ci for around $100. While on the back it has 1 set of “Height” outputs, it doesn’t say Dolby Atmos on the machine. Are all “Height” outputs on older AVRs sending data properly to overhead speakers? The AVR-3312Ci does say Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD amongst other things, but not Atmos. Does a receiver *have to be* Atmos specific in order to pass the data/sound properly to the speakers that would be setup as ceiling/upwards-facing speakers (not to mention the ground-level speakers that Atmos communicates with)? 3. 2 AVR’s? -or 1 AVR + 1 AMPLIFIER? If the answer to question 1 is that yes, (you can buy a cheaper AVR to receive all the HDMI (and other) inputs from your sources…and if said AVR doesn’t have enough channel outputs to power 5-7 ground-level speakers AND 2-6 ceiling/upwards-facing speakers) …would one be able to use the pre outs to power an additional amplifier? -or would it need to be another AVR, to get the proper Atmos configured output to the speakers? 4. REGARDING THE SPEAKERS. If I put together the right AVR system (whether a single unit, or a combination of 2 or more) to power (up to) 7 ground-level speakers, plus 1 (2, or 3) sub-woofers, plus (up to) 6 ceiling (or upward-facing) speakers, can I mismatch different speakers and brands? For instance, I recently bought a set of Klipsch Reference Theater pack (before I knew about the Reference Cinema pack). If I keep the Theater pack and buy 2 more ground-level speakers…AS WELL as some overhead speakers (whether ceiling-mounted, or other) …could I shop around to add to this array, even if I end up getting cheap ceiling speakers? The ceiling speakers (round ones that install into the ceiling) seem pricey compared to the set 5.1 set I just bought. If I shop around and buy other brand speakers (whether the round ones made specifically for ceiling use or not), would that yield workable results? 5. KLIPSCH UPWARD-FACING vs CEILING SPEAKERS. Which are better? Would the Reference Cinema pack be a better option for having Atmos “ceiling sound” rather than using the Reference Theater pack and adding cheaper ceiling speakers (mounted on the ceilings and pointing down)? Thanks in advance!

[@ealanosborne]

Wow! Thanks for the kind words. Truly appreciated. So...here we go: 1) The only AVRs that you could use together would be the kind that have the 7.1 analog audio input section on the rear - which typically is only reserved for the more expensive models. But regarding Atmos with that... 2) Yes, in order to get true Atmos decoding, the AVR itself would need to say "atmos" on it. Atmos isn't just lots of speakers, it's an actual codec that a soundtrack has been mixed in by professional post production facilities. 3) No. An AVR can only process a limited number of channels at once. An AVR with 11 pre outs can only process up to 11 channels of audio. You wouldn't be able to use 9 internal amps AND 11 pre outs to create a monster 20 channel system. 4) You can definitely mix and match different brands of speakers initially, if you want to save money, or find one killer sale on one brand, etc. But the ultimate goal is to have them all the same brand. That way they're "timbre-matched," all having the same sonic characteristics. Although my rule of thumb is definitely go for the same brand for the ear-level speakers first, because Atmos height effects tend to be more atmospheric and subtle, so it's not as obvious when you have a different brand for your Atmos height speakers. 5) I will almost never recommend upward firing speakers, unless it's absolutely necessary in your particular space, or your significant other doesn't approve, or you live in an apartment and can't go drilling holes in the wall or ceiling. Otherwise, either wall-mounted, ceiling-mounted or in-ceiling speakers all day, baby! 😎

[@ntlknight]

@@ealanosborne Thank you so much, perfect reply!--Just the information I was looking for. I have begun my "journey" and look forward to completing it and staying in touch with other like minded people as I progress. Have a great one.

[@wendellwendellb339]

I have preordered the 3800h, and I will be setting up a 5.4.6 speaker setup!

[@Classicman.43]

I think you’re gonna love it. I just got mine. Just a word of advice: run the update! lol it is a bit buggy without it and I’ve heard others say they couldn’t even get through Audyssey. After the update? GREAT AVR. I love it 🙌

[@ealanosborne]

Yes, run the firmware update! Shane Lee also experienced some truly bizarre bugs (like 7 height channel options) before updating. 👍

[@wendellwendellb339]

Okay, thanks guys, I will do that before calibrating!

[@pinoy1hitko]

Love Midway for Dolby Atmos! By far my favorite mix in all movies.

[@TheCatGoesRawrMusik]

Then there is me who like 6.1 and is wondering how I could be implement high channels there

[@joebidendidthat5121]

Can you please do a 11.2 system on the Denon X4700 using the Denon on screen set up assistant?

[@ealanosborne]

Does this help? kzbin.info/www/bejne/bZ-bg2eYlN-lp5I

[@jitu757]

Great video as always. Could you do a video on atmos ceiling speaker placement please? Some people are saying the ceiling speakers shouldn't be inline with the front L/R speakers and that Dolby has it incorrectly on their website. I followed Dolby's guide when I setup my 7.2.2 and now I am in the process of expanding to 7.2.4 and I would like to finalize the location of the ceiling speakers without making whole bunch of holes and patching them. Thanks!

[@ealanosborne]

Do you have in-ceiling speakers, or mounted speakers on your ceiling?

[@jitu757]

@@ealanosborne I have in-ceiling speakers that are adjustable. Have them pointing towards the MLP.

[@tonyoneill7031]

Refer to the Dolby atmos studio speaker set up(PDF), not the Dolby atoms home set up.

[@jitu757]

@@tonyoneill7031 I can't seem to find the pdf you are referring to. This is all I have been able to search for www.dolby.com/about/support/guide/speaker-setup-guides/7.1.4-overhead-speaker-setup-guide/

[@tonyoneill7031]

@@jitu757 the link that you have inserted is the home version & is misleading. The Dolby studio version refers to not placing the overheads in line with the main speakers. Watch this video for reference, kzbin.info/www/bejne/oXi9pKWLadSBd68

[@bronstet]

The correct answer is 7.2.4, of course! 🙂 The best of both worlds. My setup is 6 bipolar surround speakers for the front, side and back speakers , 2 serial connected center speakers, 2 subwoofers in opposite corners, and 4 height speakers mounted at the top of the side walls. But yes, if you must choose between 7.1.2 and 5.1.4, do the 5.1.4 setup and go for the maximum amount of height speakers.

[@Goose_Lord]

I have never heard of someone rocking so many bipolar speakers. I can't imagine that's ideal for front stage imaging, but I've obviously never heard that type of setup. What made you go that direction?

[@bronstet]

@@Goose_Lord It is in fact precisely for the front stage imaging I made this choice. It allows the front soundstage to envelop the front and front sides of the room better than direct radiating speakers. They essentially act as front and front wide speakers at the same time.

[@Goose_Lord]

@@bronstet I'd love to A/B test something like that, but I'm guessing that's what you did already to come to that conclusion. I always heard bipoles are a great solution for those who can't have both rear and side surrounds, but this is the first time I've heard of using them for front mains and front wides. Great idea!

[@bronstet]

@@Goose_Lord Exactly, Jord. When doing the research to put my sound system together, I found out about bipolar speakers and their purpose of acting as combined surrounds/rears and then figured they could serve the same purpose in front. So I went with it and am very happy that I did.

[@Goose_Lord]

@@bronstet That's what this hobby is all about - awesome!!

[@cszulu2000]

What about in ceiling speakers vs 30degree wall mounted height speakers?

[@ealanosborne]

If they’re straight above your listening position, yeah, you could get away with that. But I’ve found with front and rear height speakers, it’s a better effect with binaural hearing in general when they’re up 30 degrees 👍

[@brucemarmelstein]

I Live in a One Bedroom Apartment and can’t put Speaker’s in The Ceiling At All. What are My Options Now For Dolby Atmos Surround Sound

[@robertrobitaille320]

Unless your ceiling is concrete. I have them suspended above seating area. Also leave in 1 bedroom apartment.

[@ealanosborne]

Also, you can try heavy duty Velcro to mount height speakers. Tough enough to stay, but temporary enough to remove when you move out. You can get some at any hardware store. 🤘

[@denischo2964]

Is there a benefit to 6 height channels? Are Dolby Atmos movie soundtracks mixed with 6 height channels in mind?

[@ealanosborne]

Kind of. I’ll be doing more tests with that soon. It should matrix properly with 6 height channels, but not all mixes do it the right way. Stay tuned! 😁🤘

[@denischo2964]

@@ealanosborne Looking forward to the video. Keep up the good work. I'm learning quite a bit from your channel.

[@ealanosborne]

@@denischo2964 Thank you!

[@bryandoherty6426]

Hi Ealan , question I have a Denon 4800 and it's a 9 channel receiver ,my question is I have 7 speakers connected to it 4 Atmos connected it that's 11 speakers l don't understand as I have no external amplifier.

[@ealanosborne]

So yes, in order to power all the speakers, you would need an external amp to assist with at least 2 of the speakers - either the front left and right, or rear height speakers. If you're wanting to stick to a budget, I always suggest an Emotiva BasX A2, or possibly a BasX A3 if you want to power your entire front soundstage, for example. You'll then need to assign which speakers will be powered externally in the software, once the external amp has been acquired. 👍

[@schemkesa]

I did go for the 7.1.2 but my 2 heights speakers are in front of me on the wall pointing directly at me @30-45degrees... I'm not expanding to 7.1.4 because there is very little height info in all the movies and I have it mainly for the music.

[@XenaCarlson-ov8nb]

Thanks!

[@ealanosborne]

Wow! Thank YOU! 😎🎉

[@troyhenry3267]

Ealan, I'm one of the ones whose back seating is about 6 inches from the back wall , I have no choice but to locate my rear surrounds on the side wall to the left and right. I'm going with in wall speakers. To help save as much space in my tiny room of 12.5 x 12.5 x 9. I want to do a 5.2.4 setup. Where abouts would you locate the 4 channel atmos speakers in ceiling?

[@ealanosborne]

Rear heights I’d put pretty much as far back as they can go (so basically above the couch) and front heights somewhere in the middle between the couch and the TV, but probably leaning more closely to the TV. Not the most ideal, but it’ll still provide enough space for great movement of height effects when they happen. 👍

[@damionrowe]

My room is similar dimension, 13×12×9. I thought I couldn't do 4 atmos, but surprisingly it worked. I used audio advice planning tool to draw it up. Turned out great. My recliner is about 86 inches from the screen, so that gave me a few feet behind seat and rear wall.

[@ealanosborne]

@@damionrowe Nice! That online tool from Audio Advice is great!

[@jsmith5298]

Are there any AV receivers that would give me the option of using wireless connection for the upward firing speakers? what is your opinion of when the lowest prices would appear on that equipment? Black Friday, cyber Monday? Or have things dropped in price now due to inventory overruns?

[@VioletGiraffe]

What's the point? If they're wireless, it means they need to receive power, so you still need wires - but thicker ones (for high voltage insulation, and surround speakers really don't need much power - perfectly fine to use a thinner wire).

[@michaeltobler649]

I currently have a 5.1 and plan to upgrade to 5.1.4. This is my issue I have my front surrounds in the right and left corners of the 8 foot high ceiling, and my rears are on the back corner wall slightly behind the primary listening area. I was planning to mount 2 speakers to the left and right of the TV closer to ear level and switch them to my fronts, add height speakers half way between the fronts and backs, and use the original ceiling high fronts as my second set of height speakers. What do you think.

[@ealanosborne]

If I’m understanding your layout correctly, it sounds like you’re planning on doing what I did in my previous home: There were 4 in-ceiling speakers and one center speaker already installed as part of a 5.1 system. Then once I got more speakers and a 9 channel AVR, the in-ceilings became the height speakers and I mounted 4 other speakers closer to ear level. Do what you can with what you have, am I right? 😄

[@michaeltobler649]

@@ealanosborne You are correct except my four speakers are mounted high in each corner of the room not in the ceiling. My rear speakers are on the wall slightly behind the main seating area. I brought 2 pairs of the Klipsch reference speakers, they have the upward firing height speakers built in. Now I admit they do sound good, but the upward firing thing does not work for me, I need something more dynamic which is what I am hoping to get when I add my two or four mid height speakers. But first I need to pull some speaker wire through the walls. Wish me luck.

[@ealanosborne]

@@michaeltobler649 Good luck! 😁🤘

[@michaeltobler649]

@@ealanosborne In the last 3 months I have upgraded my receiver to the Onkyo rz50 and added 4 speakers to upgrade my system to 5.2.4. 6 of my speakers are ceiling height (7ft.) with one in each corner and 2 speakers located between them, with the exception my fronts that are ear level. So basically 6 up top and 3 in front of me In the back of the Onkyo it has Height 1, Surround, and Surround back. How should I set these up for the best Dolby Atmos sound effects.

[@tamerelsamahy9006]

Hello, what do you think about the Bose B1 Bass Module Subwoofer? Does it work for home use on Dolby Atmos receiver, especially for action movies, as it is an old model? Can it give me a great performance?

[@ealanosborne]

I’m not too familiar with the B1, but from what I’m reading online about it, I think it’s made to only work with the Bose L1 Passive PA systems, so it’s not like a standard subwoofer. 🤷‍♂️

[@tantmay123]

Hi, my soundbar says Dolby Audio; i am really confused ; what is the difference between Dolby Audio and Dolby Digital

[@ealanosborne]

Dolby Audio is the general term that it supports Dolby codecs. Dolby Digital is the streaming/broadcast version that supports up to 5.1 surround sound.

[@tantmay123]

@@ealanosborne what are the different Dolby codecs available? Does it mean , the soundbar supports 5.1, atmos?

[@ealanosborne]

@@tantmay123 If it says only Dolby Audio, it most likely only supports up to 5.1 sources. It would say Dolby Atmos on the packaging somewhere if it supported Atmos. Which soundbar do you have?

[@tantmay123]

@@ealanosborne polk magnify mini

[@ealanosborne]

@@tantmay123 Okay, so yes - that Polk soundbar system decodes Dolby Digital signals up to 5.1, which is baseline surround sound for all audio broadcasts these days including broadcast TV, sports, and streaming platforms like Netflix, etc.

[@Reggaebeatman]

Currently I have only a 5.1 set up Denon X3800 and planning to go with Auro 3D height configuration. I'm also a 2 channel listeners and have my Front L/R are 2.5 feet 30 inches out from front wall.....and wondering how it would sound with 2 heights mounted on wall. I'm concerned that having height speakers 30inches behind mains may not sound good ? Auro 3D says is not advisable to have top front hieghts further out in front of the bed level speakers....they should simply be mounted high up on the wall aimed at you at between 30 to 35 degrees ear level....sounds very simple. what if heights are behind ? can't find any info or discussion on these placement scenarios.

[@ealanosborne]

Your height speakers will almost always be placed behind your front speakers (like mine are), since front speakers will almost always be away from the wall a bit. As long as you run room correction software or dial in the distances correctly, it should be fine, since the software will take all the measurements into account. I don't feel like my soundstage gas suffered at all because my heights are not vertically in line with my ear-level speakers. 👍

[@quikspecv4d]

I heard a few people say that 7.1.2 was better for gaming. I game but my small room can only support 5.1.4 with upfiring hight speakers. I cant mount anything to my appartments ceiling.

[@ealanosborne]

Hmmm…I think that might be true, since gaming audio engines work differently, so it would be advantageous to have actual speakers behind you to create a more realistic surround sound experience. 🤘

[@andrebedard9824]

Hello, I have one question. I wonder if someone can help me. I have a samsung 85 inches tv 2022 model with Earc hdmi connection. When I connect it to my tx nr 696 onkyo receiver arc main input ; it does not recognize the avr, it switches back to tv speakers. I use the good quality hdmi 2.1 cables. Maybe the avr has to be Earc also. I don't know but I set up this system to have best quality atmos available. To finish, I am only able to have the sound come from the tv to the avr system by turning on the avr first snd secondly the television. I hope someone can help me, this is driving me crazy. Thanks

[@ealanosborne]

Yeah, the Onkyo 696 does not support eARC, so it is not capable of supporting Atmos content coming from your TV. The only way to experience Atmos is to plug a Blu-ray player or steaming device (AppleTV, Roku, FireTV, NVidia Shield) directly into the Onkyo. But to stop the TV from switching back to the internal speakers, try switching the audio output on your Samsung to PCM audio. That might help, since the Onkyo can only handle ARC from the TV. 🤷‍♂️

[@andrebedard9824]

@@ealanosborne Hello, I didn't expect such a quick reply. Really nice of you having taking the time to do so. I switched to pcm but I didnt see see any changes. I have heard that the pcm mode gives less sound quality. I also heard that you have more sound quality from earc than from just a regular arc output. Not sure about those two sayings. I am able to get excelent sound through the avr from amazon prime on the tv when I turn on the onkyo first. The serie is called THE PERIPHERAL and it sounds quite good honestly. But,I am I getting the real atmos sound?? I mean the system is only for my bedroom so I have enough of a 5.1.2, I didn't need more channels nore do I have the room for it. All speakers are SVS with 1 ultra center,2 pinacles,4 elevations( 2 surrounds,2 ceilings) and the 1000 pro sub. I am in Cancun and it is not easy to get stuff here. Everything is double the price. The only affordable avr was the 696, when I compared to the rz 50 it seemed as for sound quality very similar, of course not the same power and amount of channels. So the question is: do I exchange the onkyo 696 for the RZ 50 or a denon 960H?? will I get much better atmos sound because of the Earc ?? Here an Rz 50 is 3 times the price of the on 696 or Denon 960. the Denon 960 is 7.2 with Earc capability. I am sure you are quite busy making those you tubes videos. Quite interesting and funny at the same time. One of your videos convinced me to install the atmos speakers directly in the ceiling istead of bouncing the sound. Anyway, to make this more simple, do I need to exchange this receiver 696 for one that supports EARC? Thanks.

[@ealanosborne]

@@andrebedard9824 Yes, if you want to experience Atmos at all coming from your smart TV as the source, you would need an AVR that supports eARC. That’s the main reason why eARC was created, since ARC is not capable of handling the higher bandwidth of Atmos audio signals. The Denon S960H does support eARC, so I would maybe go with that, since the RZ50 is so expensive. 👍

[@andrebedard9824]

@@ealanosborne wow, thanks so much Ealan, You have resolved all my concerns. It is not easy, listening to all these videos that sometimes contradict themselves. Thanks again.

[@ealanosborne]

@@andrebedard9824 You’re welcome! 🎉🙌

[@JWGARCIA79]

Question if I have my system running 5.2.2 which would be the most noticable for the rear channels surround or surround back ?

[@ealanosborne]

If you mean just speaker placement, best would be somewhere in between behind you and right to the sides of your couch. Like in line with the back corners of your couch pointing inward. But technically speaking, there are no “surround backs” with 5.2.2, only when you have 7 ear-level speakers. 👍

[@JWGARCIA79]

@@ealanosborne I mean what do I set them to on the receiver?

[@ealanosborne]

@@JWGARCIA79 Surrounds. Surround backs can only be assigned when you already have surrounds as well.

[@gokzilla]

I have a 4.0 System. 2 x KEF Q750 front and 2 x KEF Q150 back. I dont want a Center because iam sitting pretty much in the Sweet Spot. I love how it sounds. Movies sounds better than the 7.1.2 system from my neighbor. :-). sometimes i have to choose in movies 5.1 , dolby atmos, which is better for my 4.0 system ? or it doesnt matter ?

[@ealanosborne]

I’ve seemed to notice that bass response is better with Atmos, and it tends to be a little louder just on its own. Not sure why that is, but I like it better than listening to the same thing in 5.1. If you have the option, might as well try both and see what sounds better with 4.0. 👍

[@gokzilla]

@@ealanosborne thank you for quick responding. Sorry my english is bad :-)

[@michaeltobler649]

I have an Onkyo RZ50, with a 5.1.4 setup. I am really unimpressed with Dolby Atmos, I am tired of waiting for a sound object to find its way to my height speakers. My ultimate goal was 5.2.6 which I am set up for. My question is what would I need to do to go Auro 3D. I think I would be happier with the immersion Auro gives. HELP😮

[@ealanosborne]

Then the Denon X3800H might be your best bet. You can still get Dirac Live by purchasing the additional license, and it’s (I think) the only AVR on the market right now (besides the x4800h) that supports a 5.2.6 configuration. Everything else in its price range only supports up to 4 height channels. 🤘

[@mptobler1]

Update 2024 I got some sweet deals on some SVS Elevation speakers for all my surrounds and heights and an Emotiva BasX A5 amp. I can now have a 7.2.4 system, but it seems my room is best configured for a 5.2.4. If I go 7.2.4 I would have to mount front heights on my front wall over my front speakers. In the diagram I see the heights are in a boxed formation around the MLP. My question is will front heights work?

[@ealanosborne]

Yeah, mounting them above the front speakers is how it’s done with Auro 3D (the pioneers of immersive audio), so that’s definitely doable! 🤘

[@mptobler1]

@@ealanosborne Thanks

[@isaacOtaiza]

why place height speakers inline with mains? Panning will travel from side surounds to heights not mains . Shouldnt they be placed in relation to side surrounds? Maybe within 60 deg or as close as possible to 60deg?

[@johnsamy3305]

I was wondering what kind of receiver I shall purchase to support the 5.1.4 setup

[@Classicman.43]

Another great video! I just got my x3800h and extra Klipsch R-41SA’s for rear heights! This was an upgrade from a 5.1.2 on a S930h with mirrored subs to, now, a true 5.2.4

[@ealanosborne]

Yayyyy! 🤘

[@daveonezero6258]

This is so helpful. I'm moving to a place and I have easy access to the ceiling and trying to figure out what the best setup would be. I'll be visiting to figure out where to put my 4 ceiling speakers.

[@ealanosborne]

Excellent! Glad I could help. And congrats on the move! 🤘

[@jefflaing5899]

Can you do a video on how you set up the angles of your heights

[@ealanosborne]

My DIY Home Theater Build Ep 3 goes over that. Skip to about 5 min in… kzbin.info/www/bejne/aITQp6Sig9aaaMk

[@gowthamk5392]

Initially usaid overhead ll b good so i mounted svs prime upside down! So shal i change it frnt heights!? And the side heights are not option in denon x1600

[@junflores7143]

Hi Elan. Can I connect a DAC to my Bluray player? I want to play SACD and movies on my Bluray player.

[@JWGARCIA79]

Question is arc or will I need the extra bandwidth of earc?

[@ealanosborne]

eARC is required for higher bandwidth bitstream signals like Atmos and DTS:X if you have a soundbar, or have all your components hooked up to your TV. ARC can handle up to 7.1 surround.

[@danny51577]

Ealan, based on this video,I could use your input and opinion. Currently have 5.1.2 with the heights overhead. Going to expand but my room is open concept and no place for ear level rear surrounds. So only option would be surround rears angled in ceiling. So either I can do 7.1.4 with front elevation, overhead heights, and rear surrounds in ceiling. Or, 5.1.6 with no rear surrounds. If I do a .6 setup then I'm going to go with the x3800h. If I do a 7.1.4 setup then I can get an avr for a few hundred less.

[@ealanosborne]

Hmmm…excellent question, my friend. If all Atmos mixes were created equal and filled with incredibly dynamic effects placed in and around and above you all the time, I’d say go with 6 heights. But since Atmos mixes are so commonplace and expected with anything new now, it’s being stretched thin a little as of late. So I would probably go with 7.1.4 with your in-ceiling surround backs. They’ll be active much more than 6 heights. But when really cool Atmos effects DO happen, you still have 4 speakers that those height effects can fly around between. 🤘 My 2 cents. 😁

[@danny51577]

@@ealanosborne thanks for the input man, I do really appreciate it. One more question - in your travels, have you had any experiences with 4 heights, where 2 are elevation in front and 2 are overhead? It doesn't have to be the absolute best setup, but if possible I would rather not have to move my overheads and start patching. If I can get an improved experience with 2 front heights and 2 overheads, with the 2 rear in ceilings being the rear surrounds, I would love to give it a shot.

[@ealanosborne]

@@danny51577 Oh for sure! In fact, I would suggest that, since your surround backs would be behind your listening position anyway.

[@danny51577]

@@ealanosborne just thought of one more thing that you may have insight to. With the avr, is it possible to assign the height speakers as front and overhead/middle? Or is there only an option for front and rear? I was just watching another of your videos setting up a Denon AVR, and it looks like it gives you only front and rear heights options.

[@ealanosborne]

@@danny51577 I believe it's just front and rear. BUT...technically you could still place speakers in an overhead/middle position. Running room correction software will time align the speakers to your listening position, regardless of where you actually place/mount them.

[@ronreeder4572]

I slowly migrated from 5.1 to 5.1.2 to 5.2.2 to 7.2.2 & finally to 7.2.4. I was genuinely surprised as I went from 5 to 7 ‘in the plane’ how much the side speakers added… & then from 2 front height adding 2 ceiling overhead (just in front of listening position) Again, difference was significant. Remember to rerun your receiver software to balance speakers. Audigy 4 Marantz & Denon.

[@ealanosborne]

Congrats on hitting that 7.2.4 milestone! What’s next, you think? 😁🤘

[@ronreeder4572]

@@ealanosborne hmm, considering I built each speaker set… & installed either in ceiling, in wall, & on wall… & since the cost of an AV receiver that decodes MORE channels… not to mention amplification!… expands exponentially… I’m a big nope. I’m done. I might try different L&R for stereo music listening. Most intriguing are the latest Magnipans … that you can’t actually buy. Have a Krell amp for those… I really enjoy pop music mixed in Dolby (Apple Spatial) with my setup it sounds really interesting. Simply a different listening experience to stereo. Stereo is king for most of my library. But, old quadraphonic recordings: The Doors - Riders on the Storm & the entir Pink Floyd - Dar Side of the Moon have been remixed into Dolby & sound stellar. So, the system isn’t just for movies. But, you need physical media for best audio results for video.

[@dracoflame8780]

I have a 5.1 setup. My avr only has room for 1 more pair of speakers. Not sure if i should get some book shelves for 7.1 or atmos for 5.1.2. But this has given me much to think about

[@pauledwards8721]

Here’s a test that would be interesting that I’ve not seen anyone comment on. For the bed layer only is 6.1 better or worse than a well setup 5.1 if you’re unable to go to 7.1? The reason I say that is a well setup 5.1 has a nice stereo image on the Side Surrounds, from a 7.1 mix it’s taking stereo rear imaging into those side surrounds as well. On a 6.1 setup the Rear surrounds become mono. So do you gain by having true sound behind you? Or loose on some mixes because you loose some of that nice stereo image in the sides 🤔

[@ealanosborne]

I guess it makes sense if you’re listening by yourself. Otherwise, it’s nice to have 7.1 if there are multiple people watching on a couch, so everyone gets decent coverage from behind. But you can also make surround backs as wide or as close to each other as you want. If your surround backs are right next to each other directly behind you, is it still 7.1 or technically 6.1? 🤔😄

[@pauledwards8721]

@@ealanosborne I keep meaning to try it and find a decent few sample tracks. My Left SS and Right SS give me lovely stereo imaging now but are slightly ahead of my MLP (due to a door to the left of my MLP). I can probably get a widely dispersed Rear channel in there (my Denon supports that config) but due to layout challenges 2 wouldn’t fit or would be a waste as they would be very close. My setup is mainly configured for the MLP and a 2nd seat just next to it (but mainly MLP 😏) I’ve tried watching the Dolby Optimiser videos Shane Lee does sometimes to see if there’s much stereo action in the Rear channels I’d be loosing if mixing that to mono (but keeping Sides to stereo 🤔)

[@estyhugo]

What's your experience with Bi-amping your front L and R speakers in a 5.2.2 or 5.2.4 system? I have the Onkyo RZ50 and the Emotiva BasX A7 so i can power 11 speakers. Do you think Bi-Amping the fronts is a waste?

[@ealanosborne]

Honestly, bi-amping makes a difference mostly when listening to music, since you’re only listening to the bi-amped speakers alone. When so many speakers are involved in a home theater setting, it’s hard to tell that there’s a difference at all.

[@estyhugo]

Thanks for the response. I have a pair of Canton Chrono 519 tower speakers as my fronts. They sound amazing musically when i set the rz50 to pure music setting. I know it sets the config to 2 speakers. Does that mean the RZ50 is using all its amplification power on the two fronts?

[@ealanosborne]

@@estyhugo I believe so! Or at least it’s actually using the power rating listed online, since that number always corresponds to 2 channels driven. 🤘

[@abelflores8132]

I have good question. Had someone do 5.1 system with a 2.1 soundbar work together?

[@suikasuika4157]

im' planing to go on 5.2.1, because my knowoledge is not enought to go further , ayway i already have the wire setup so it's too late

[@off_key88]

I'm still in the planning stages for basement theater atmos. But, the layout advice is interesting, Dolby has pretty straight forward recommendations, but there are a lot of differing opinions when it comes to 'real world' install advice. I want to do 9.4.4, but the couch position is 'fixed' and there's HVAC dirctly above and behind the couch position. The other 'problem' is that the ceiling is only 7 feet. This makes having 4 atmos channels difficult. The 2 in front are easy, but the rear heights would be 'too close' to the rear surrounds and be behind HVAC covered ceiling, so the only option would be 1. Only 2 front heights. 2. 'rear' heights directly above the couch. I'm still leaning towards that option but I'm still researching/investigating the best options.

[@ealanosborne]

Having two height speakers above your couch and two above your TV is still better than just two heights. It’ll still create the 3D cuboid that Atmos “audio objects” can move freely about in, like the mixing engineers intended. 👍

[@JoshHare85]

@@ealanosborne Good to hear! I’ve got the same problem as the couch is against the wall in a 5.1 setup. I want to go with 5.1.4 but would have to do 2 in-ceiling speakers directly above the couch and 2 on-wall heights in the front also. Just don’t know whether it’s worth it in a room that’s not a dedicated home theatre …? 5.1 still sounds amazing on movies that have great sound design (1917/Transformers/Shazam/Tron Legacy) 🔊 🔊

[@wimvandervelde1774]

​@@ealanosborne My room is: 5.7m long (Sitting at 4.7m from the front) 3.72m wide (Speakers 3.3m L to R) 2.7m high Sealing Wanne go 5.1.4 *1m back / 1.65m to each side / at 2.45m (on the backwall above a window aiming at me) =>H2-L & R [Back height speakers] * 1.7m or 1.6m Front / 1.65m to each side / at 2.6m (10cm of the sealing aiming at me) => H1-L & R * Rest 1.2m high at 5.1 setup (What i use now) Would this be ok?

[@FactNight]

What should be the room size for 7.2.4 ?

[@bornchildpilot]

So Ealan, I get that 5.1.4 is prolly the best way to go instead of 7.1.2. 2 questions, first being, I have the Jamo S805 with the bundled Atmos speakers that connect onto the top of my fronts... I also have an extra pair of the S801 speakers that I can put hi up onto the wall behind my listening position. Now having the front Atmos aiming at the ceiling to bounce back down to my listening position, would it be a good idea to connect the extra s801 speakers behind my listening position, or should I just run only 2 Atmos and rather use these bookshelves as surround rears, in a 7.1.2 as opposed to a 5.1.4. Second question is, Would the rear surrounds in a 7.1 benefit me more than having them high up behind the listening position in a 5.1.4

[@ealanosborne]

Hmmm…well it also comes down to convenience. If you’re willing to mount things up high instead of just keeping things at ear level, go for it. But also, a combination of upward firing and direct sound coming from height speakers might prove to be a little off. The timing of those two sources won’t be aligned, you know? So maybe in your case it would be more advantageous to go with 7.1.2? 🤷‍♂️

[@Nikhil4G]

I will probably be building a 7.2.4 HT setup in next few months, I already have a SONY HT in box 5.1 setup. Can I use 4 speakers from this config as ceiling speakers,? (they all have same imepdance/watt ratings) I will be spending money mainly on Front Speakers and a decent AMP + Pre amp, don't want to put money in Ceiling speakers if I can use existing 4 from my old setup. Let me know if this makes a difference.

[@ealanosborne]

Yeah, speakers are speakers (as long as they’re passive, and not powered). I’ve known some people who get the Klipsch 5.1 Theater Pack (since it’s so cheap) and use the 4 satellite speakers for height channels. Your Sony setup sounds like the same idea. 👍

[@Nikhil4G]

@@ealanosborne Thanks for the reply! Love your content ✌

[@Hipporider]

Are Atmos speakers anything special or could you just use decent bookshelf speakers mounted in the similiar position, pointing towards the listener?

[@ealanosborne]

Oh for sure you could use whatever speakers you wanted. 🎉

[@Hipporider]

@@ealanosborne thanks for the reply! 👍🇦🇺

[@nandakishorbhatt6250]

How would we know the content we are watching support 5.1.4?

[@ealanosborne]

Anything that is streaming in Dolby Atmos should (in theory) properly matrix into whichever configuration you have, whether that be 7.1.2, 5.1.2, 5.1.4, etc.

[@brucesmith1754]

My concern about future-proofing my ATMOS setup is how well the current x.x.4 or x.x.6 receivers will translate the Atmos audio mix track of the future(as you discussed in your "Dolby...Please" video. i.e. Should we be concerned about the changes in the algorithms for decoding the discrete metadata sent to the height channels which may require another receiver purchase?🤔

[@ealanosborne]

Since Atmos is metadata decoded by the processor, I’m going to bet that future upgrades will be more on the software/firmware side of things. 🤞🤞

[@brucesmith1754]

@@ealanosborne Yeah. Thats the dicey part about going too far with the future proofing. I was just looking over a spec sheet on a "THX" certified 7.1 Denon receiver that I purchased 10 years ago that was supposed to be "future-proof". The only sound field that it has that would be relevant today was DTS. Denon never firmware upgraded that unit. Im glad I ebay-ed it while it had some value. Even though manufacturers may make statements about future-proofing their products, they're still at the mercy of Dolby/DTS's proprietary firmware algorithms changing in a way that may not be supportable by the current receiver hardware. We see it with PC technology all the time. And as you've covered in your videos, the industry is way behind maintaining standards for content streaming beyond the current 5.1.2. So why upgrade for greater speaker ratios only to be given fancy emulations like AURA3D. Until Dolby/DTS get their standards in order for delivering consistent Atmos streaming content, Im laying low with my (9.2) 5.1.4. Thanks for your response. Great content.

[@garrethafer6866]

I would love to do a 7.1.4 buuuut space is limited. Seats are against the back wall of the room so no rear surrounds for me. Still need the over head atmos installed then I will have my 5.1.4! Also, your videos are super helpful and entertaining to watch. That's an impressive combo. Sometimes reminds me of my youth watching Bill Nye the science guy. Shout out from Alaska!

[@ealanosborne]

Winner! Bill Nye the Science Guy is the #1 influence with how I present my info. I LOVED that show growing up 😁🤘

[@JollyGiant1213]

@@ealanosborne I knew it!!😎🤙🏻

[@demwillams8898]

Just now starting to formulate a plan for my next upgrade. My room sucks, but gotta work with what I have. Currently 5.x and am going to upgrade to a new avr that can handle 5.x.4 or 7.x.2. I'll probably just take a picture of my room and ask the folks on forums what my best options are...but it appears I've found a new channel to dig into. Thanks!

[@ealanosborne]

Sweet! Thanks for watching! Upgrading a home theater is addicting, so welcome to the madness! 😁🙌

[@demwillams8898]

@Ealan Osborne I purposely stay off the forums until I am ready to finalize...because they are a dangerous place for my wallet. I already am setting a price limit for my 4th sub before I even go in there... Best part about upgrading is using your old stuff in a different room to continue the madness!

[@kewlbug]

I had sort of determined already, 5.1.4 is the way to go but was wondering what others thought. And just like you said 7.1.4 vs 5.1.6 is the next question.. Although easy decision for me, mid heights not possible in my room.

[@micahpauldunford2052]

I wonder if you put up firing Dolby towers behind you and 2 Dolby in front and regular tower in front..huh?

[@ealanosborne]

You can def combine mounted/upward firing Atmos speakers. That’s not a bad idea 🤘

[@micahpauldunford2052]

I've got marantz 5015 so I'd have to pre amp the height channels and move the rears 500m to the front and buy 2 towers..so the heights would all be on the same height channel.. or I'll trade you for your 7015 lol

[@Concertina43210]

In my personal opinion, Dolby Atmos is just not worth it if you only have two speakers because you only get half the experience: up and down but not forwards and backwards. I started out with 5.1.2 and I have no regrets upgrading to 5.1.4 instead of 7.1.2. I personally get a more immersive experience being in a full dome (or bubble) of sound rather than just a sound fence. A 5.1.4 setup has always felt complete to me, whereas a 7.1.2 feels incomplete. I don't feel like I'm missing out at all by not having rear channels. I would say if you're going to do Dolby Atmos, it's a better investment to get 4 channels. Otherwise, just save your money and stick to 5.1 or 7.1.

[@nonoyz4048]

I think you are right. I bought an atmos 7.1 and tried 5.1.2 and 7.1. 7.1 gave better immersion for movies. The 5.1.2 is good for gaming, but when you turn the camera the sound is not smooth, you hear it cut out to pass from the suround speakers to the ceiling. I ordered a 9.1 receiver and I'm going to go on a 5.1.4, I'm sure it will be much smoother and immersive.

[@soever]

Hi Maya . So how do you position your 4 height speakers relative to your listening area ?

[@glengatt3941]

Or going with 2 front heights and 2 middle in sealing,and 7 on the ground, tried it good results

[@CDPMATH]

Sigh…please help. So, if we compare a 5.1.4 vs 7.1.4 setup. Which one is better? I have the surround a couple feet in front of my listening position. When playing movies (7.1.4), I feel that most of the sound is coming in front of me and not much from the surround back speakers. When using a 5.1.4 configuration, I definitely hear more from the speakers that are placed slightly behind MLP. Are my ears playing tricks on me? Is 5.1.4 actually a better setup considering my speaker placement? Thank you.

[@ealanosborne]

Yeah, I think it's just the fact that in a 5.x.4 setup, both the surround and surround back information would be coming out of the surrounds, so maybe that's why it seems more active. I don't think it's just the placement, really, but how much information is being sent to each speaker. Depending on the movie or show, you will get more or less active surround backs in a 7.x.4 setup. But I personally enjoy the slightly more immersive soundstage that a 7.x.4 setup brings. But that's just personal preference.

[@princeT-369]

m looking to buy a new soundbar n samsung has the 11.1.2 channels i mean do i really need it n wld there be any significant noticeable differences n wats ur take on it, buy it or stick with 5.1.4

[@ealanosborne]

While I personally haven’t reviewed the Samsung flagship Q990C or Q990D, I’ve heard other reviewers say it’s one of the best soundbar systems out there. I’m not sure which soundbar you have now, but I’m pretty sure the Q990D would be an overall upgrade. 🤷‍♂️

[@BA3YDADDY]

What about for Headphones? Dolby Atmos or DTS:X ?

[@ealanosborne]

🤷‍♂️ It’s been awhile since I’ve demo’d those technologies, but I wasn’t impressed the last time.

[@theagg]

Hmm, given the layout of my room (a long open plan kitchen /living room) I'm not able to get a 5.1.4 layout as described here. There being no place to wall mount rear height speakers due to kitchen cabinets, wall mounted boiler, alcoves, doorway, windows etc. So a 5.1.4 for me would be front and middle heights only. Given that I can get floor mounted rear surrounds and wall mounted side surrounds positioned, a 7.1.2 layout would have those plus two front heights. So, in my specific case, which of the two would be better, as your recommendation specifically relies on those rear mounted heights. Ceiling mounted speakers are not an option.

[@ealanosborne]

7.1.2 was a close second for sure, so there’s no shame in going that route. I have an even less ideal living room with it nearly impossible to have any surrounds or surround backs on the floor, so I’m thinking of having a good ol-fashioned 5.1 system with a passive soundbar underneath the TV and rear surrounds in the form of in-ceiling speakers. Atmos is cool, but it’s not the “end all, be all” for me. As long as it sounds good to you, you’re golden. 🙌

[@paulgross682]

Ealan you kind of touch on this is several video’s but still a little unclear. I have to have my sofa against the wall but want to do the best I can with a 5.1.2 or 5.1.4 set up. For Wife approval we are going with in ceiling for rears and atmos speakers. In doing so would you recommend the rear in ceiling speakers go as close to the wall as possible? Then with the rears in place what would be the general rule for .2 and .4 atmos speaker placement in relation? Thanks for any info you can provide and keep up the great work!

[@ealanosborne]

I’d put the in-ceiling speakers straight above you. That’ll be the most versatile, whether you start with .2 or move on to .4 eventually. If and when you do .4, just add front heights above the TV! 🙌

[@paulgross682]

@@ealanosborne Thanks for the fast reply. To clarify, place the rear surrounds in ceilings close to the wall then the .2 above the seating position? Is there a distance between the two I need to take into consideration? Then if expand to .4 just add above the TV?

[@alexfernandez7529]

I’ve been running 100” 1080p Optoma GT5600 Ultra Short throw projector with a Sony STR-DH790 set up as 5.2.2. I’m very happy with both video display and Dolby Atmos. This is my 4th or 5th build. I have them set up in the following manner…2 Sony SSF7000(4 way towers). Amazon Silver ticket dual 5” Center Chanel. I custom mounted it my center console directly under my UST projector. 2x 8” angled Silver ticket in ceiling speakers at 30 degrees in front from listening position. 2x 8” angled in ceiling speakers slightly behind and to corner area of listening position for my rears. I have my kitchen directly behind living room, so no way to have any rear speakers on the floor or wall behind. I might try some tiny cube speakers for left and right channels in my future 5.2.4 upgrade.

[@ealanosborne]

I hear ya! I’ll have a kitchen behind me too when we move into our new home soon. Not ideal for surround backs.

[@mdwitt714]

Is 13 X 25 considered a large room for a home theater? Please and thank you. Love your videos

[@ealanosborne]

I would say so, yeah! My testing theater can sometimes feel a bit cramped, and it’s 11 x 16, so those two extra feet on the side and 9 extra feet in length would make a big difference in my book! 🤘

[@mdwitt714]

@@ealanosborne I am trying to decide which sub to buy. Sonos sub Gen 3 or the sub mini. I’m not sure which one to buy compared to the size of my room. What do you think?

[@ealanosborne]

@@mdwitt714 Sonos Sub Gen 3, for sure. The thing about good low frequencies is that they should ultimately pressurize the room completely. A room that length might even need two Sonos Subs - but that’s expensive! 😬

[@sethbell7988]

Thanks for this. I'm wanting to setup a full home theater and your videos are super helpful. I'd love to hear your thoughts on the Sony STR-DH790 (since that's the one I'm looking at). I'm torn between a 5.1.2 and a 7.1 setup. Anyways, thanks for the info.

[@ealanosborne]

The str-dh790 is what I recommend to a lot of people (and in my past videos) for one of the least expensive ways to get into Atmos. Although with that being said, if you plan on eventually having 4 height speakers (and upgrading to a 9 channel receiver), I’d maybe stick with 7.1 for awhile. On the contrary, though, if you want to experience a 5.1.2 setup, I’ve done well using heavy duty Velcro from a hardware store to mount height speakers without creating any holes to patch up later. So there’s that 😄🤘

[@sethbell7988]

Thanks so much for the tips. That gives me a lot more confidence in choosing the dh790 and better perspective on how to set it up.

[@pokehunter7078]

It really depends on your room and how big it is. I have a 7.2.4 setup.

[@evrythingis1]

This is literally the only thing that should be considered.

[@navid617]

Coming from someone with a 5.1.4 setup, go with a 7.1.2 if your room allows it - I wish mine did. Yes, 4 overheads do make a difference... for the 30 seconds of atmos content that most movies have. For the other 99% of content and GAMES, you'll get to actually use your two rear speakers.

[@zelko0768]

I'm running 7.1.2. The four surrounds are about 3 feet higher than the listen position with all four angled down. As for the heights, my only option was front heights.

[@jjcps3]

Thank you for your video I just have One question, Can you turn Any receiver that is 7.1.2 into an 5.1.4 atmos experience?

[@ealanosborne]

Pretty much, yes! Any 9 channel receiver should support 7.1.2 or 5.1.4. I can’t think of any that don’t… 😁

[@jjcps3]

@@ealanosborne but, will it do the atmos effect properly? I mean, Can you set It Up In A Way the receiver knows that your surround speakers are in celling? Or is that not necessary?

[@ealanosborne]

@@jjcps3 Well having in-ceiling surround speakers is a completely different scenario. But having 4 height speakers assigned for Atmos effects is going to give you a better 3D audio experience than just 2 height speakers.

[@nanau2002]

hi,is 5.1 (not 5.1.2)atmos better than 9.1(7.1 plus height) truehd?Worth the 3/4 x price difference?

[@earthhalienn1799]

Looking at setting up my first atmos system in our new house ...room is huge over 20x20. Already have 8in speakers in the ceiling lined up with the listening position on the couch. Original install was for music only. So unless I want to be making 4 new holes and patching two, I'm going with just one height channel. (would prefer 4! maybe in the future!) My biggest problem is going to be the front L/R. I have a bar on the left and a 75in TV above a fireplace and a window on the right ...no way to do in wall or space on the floor :( I am hoping the on wall Klipsch 640Ds will suffice? Then probably something like the 504C for center on the mantel with angled 500SAs high on the wall for sides and rears and I am looking at the CDT-5800s to replace what's in the ceiling now. Anyone see any issue with this sort of setup? Can't really do ear level for most of the speakers cause of the room ...hoping angled will compensate for that? Oh...and for the sub I am going to stick with my 400w self powered IL120 Infinity interlude. Still kicks arse! Don't see any reason to replace?

[@earthhalienn1799]

...oh and haven't decided on a receiver yet. Thinking maybe a Marantz or Denon ...something able to handle this setup (with possibility of adding another height channel in the future) for around $1000?

[@wimvandervelde1774]

My room is: 5.7m long (Sitting at 4.7m from the front) 3.72m wide (Speakers 3.3m L to R) 2.7m high Sealing Wanne go 5.1.4 *1m back / 1.65m to each side / at 2.45m (on the backwall above a window aiming at me) =>H2-L & R [Back height speakers] * 1.7m or 1.6m Front / 1.65m to each side / at 2.6m (10cm of the sealing aiming at me) => H1-L & R * Rest 1.2m high at 5.1 setup (What i use now) Would this be ok?

[@BigdaddyTW]

Should I buy a 7 channel receiver and then a power amp. Or just buy a 9 channel receiver and call it a day….??? Please advise

[@ealanosborne]

Unfortunately, there are no 7 channel AVRs (at the moment) that can process 9 channels with the help of an external amp. That feature starts only with 9 channel AVRs. The Marantz Cinema 70S (for example) supports a full set of pre outs to use external amps for all 7 channels if needs be, but can’t go beyond 7 channels.

[@rayking507]

Hi Ealan. Did you get rid of your IOTAVX AVX17 then.

[@ealanosborne]

Nope. Still connected right now. 👍

[@rayking507]

@@ealanosborne Ok its just that you seemed to be doing a lot of atmos videos with the Marantz 7015👍

[@bobgoldstein8092]

I have an unusual set up because of my room. I have no side walls so I have six ceiling speakers. The configuration is 7.2.2. My ceiling is 12 feet high. I have two ceiling speakers that are designated height about 3 feet from front wall, and in the back of ceiling I have two set for surround and two closest to rear wall set as backs. I mostly steam and it very immersive. I would like to try the 5.2.4 to see if I can have better Atmos without degrading the immersion of shows that are not Atmos. Which speakers in the back need to be set as height and which surround. I’m guessing the speakers that are forward which line up with front heights should be height, and the two closest to back wall designated surround. Is this correct? Than you and the video was excellent and has convinced me to try 5.1.4 .

[@ealanosborne]

Correct. I would designate your front 4 in-ceiling speakers as front and rear height speakers. Then the 2 closest to the back wall set as surrounds. Try that out. Very interesting setup indeed! Very cool! :)

[@bobgoldstein8092]

@@ealanosborne thanks Ealan for the confirmation of the speaker set up. My dealer recommends that I keep it at his 7.2.2 configuration as he says it will give me the best all around sound. He said 5.1.4 would make Atmos better but for everything else I would be losing sound content and it won’t be as immersive. Does he have a point? Thanks

[@rymack5715]

Great video! Just upgraded to an Onkyo 7100 and would like to add two speakers for 5.1.4… BUT, I have a dilemma: My four surrounds in my current 7.1 setup are ALL at ceiling height; what’s more, is that my surround backs are on the same side wall as my side surrounds…. So do I add two front heights at ceiling height (and all of my speakers will be ceiling height), or do I use my four current ceiling speakers as my Atmos layer and add two new side surrounds at ear-level? 😬

[@ealanosborne]

Hmmm…yeah, I think the easiest would be to add ear-level surrounds, if that’s possible in your space. 🤔

[@rymack5715]

@@ealanosborne thanks for the tip! I’ll see if I can make that work!

[@RagerSteveSammy]

Thanks for this video! I have 5.1.2, but with 4 atmos speakers. Will I notice a big difference if I upgrade my receiver to one with 4 distinct atmos channels such as the Denon 3800 with 9.2.4? Do you recommend this upgrade? Thanks!

[@ealanosborne]

Which AVR do you currently have?

[@RagerSteveSammy]

@@ealanosborne S940H it is 7.1.2

[@ealanosborne]

@@RagerSteveSammy Gotcha. Yes, major upgrade not only in how many speakers it can handle, but the X chip is loads better than the S chip in Denon AVRs. That and it’ll last you MANY years to come with up to 4 subwoofer support, HDMI 2.1, next-gen gaming features, Dirac Live room correction (for an extra fee) and a full set of pre outs when you decide to upgrade speakers and need external amps for more power. 💪🎉 And lastly, the X3800H supports up to 7.4.4, not 9.2.4, just FYI. 😊

[@RagerSteveSammy]

@@ealanosborne I currently have 4 atmos speakers running from 2 channels. I'm hoping I will be able to hear a difference in having 4 actual atmos channels. I really appreciate your advice! I'm going to order the Denon 3800H now!

[@ealanosborne]

@@RagerSteveSammy Yay! I’m excited for you!

[@89JAEH]

Just upgraded to a Denon x4300h going from a 5.2.2 to 7.2.2. excited to hear how that sounds.

[@ealanosborne]

Excellent, my friend. I’m excited for you as well! 🤘

[@JonBOY26]

Thanks for the vids. I have a 5.1 speaker setup but my AVR is old so I'm about to upgrade it to something that supports Atmos. I've been researching the best options for my scenario, and have watched your vid on Atmos speaker placement, but I'm in the unfortunate situation of my couch being against the back wall (so my surrounds are just slightly behind me). Could you consider a vid on Atmos speaker placement for people whose couch is against the back wall? That is, is there any point to a 5.1.4 setup, given that the Atmos speakers can only be directly above (near the back wall) and/or in front of me? Or should I just go for a 5.1.2 setup with the Atmos speakers directly above the couch near the back wall?

[@ealanosborne]

The best Atmos experience is when you create a cube of audio. And I know having your couch against the wall doesn’t allow you to be in the middle of the cube, BUT…that’s still going to be superior to having only 2 height channels. If you have 2 mounted straight above your couch, and two mounted above the TV next to the ceiling, that still allows for audio objects to move freely back and forth within that cube, as the mixing engineers intended. 🤘

[@JonBOY26]

@@ealanosborne thanks for your thoughts on that. For a 5.1.4 setup I'm considering the Onkyo TX-NR7100, which, in Australia, costs around $1,700. I know it can't be expanded but I don't see myself needing anything more than 5.1.4 any time soon. Unless there's a different entry level 9.2 AVR you would recommend instead? Cheers.

[@jjchmiel78]

My ultimate goal is to have the Trinnov with the expansion for a total of 48 channels. Of course that will only happen after I win the 1.9B Powerball. In the meantime I am very happy with my 7.3.4 setup.

[@ealanosborne]

You and me both with that 1.9B Powerball! 🙌

[@ProfessorOzone]

May I ask. . . where do you get an atmos signal? Most of the time I stream from Amazon or Neflix. Are you listening to physical media?

[@ealanosborne]

Plenty of shows or movies are delivered in Atmos on Netflix and Prime Video (although it’s only on the highest tier of Netflix), which is what I watch in my living room at night once the kids go to bed. If I’m watching something in my theater, yes, it’s typically 4K Blu-ray discs. 👍

[@ProfessorOzone]

@@ealanosborne Cool. Thanks for the reply. I have an atmos receiver, but I do not use atmos. I originally thought it was just bouncing a low speaker off the ceiling and wasn't interested, but now I'm looking into this and see that it's a lot more than that. I did know streaming shows came in surround, but I'll keep an eye out for the atmos symbol and think strongly about adding some speakers. Due to the fleeting nature of "purchased" content I also considering purchasing the physical media now too.

[@ealanosborne]

@@ProfessorOzone Yes! I’m still a huge lover of physical media and continue to collect certain discs that I know I’ll want to watch at its highest quality. That and I’ll have plenty of movies to entertain me when the apocalypse happens and the Internet shuts down. 😂

[@ProfessorOzone]

@@ealanosborne Maybe I can come to your house. LOL.

[@alexfernandez7529]

I really like your channel and content. Keep up the good work!

[@ealanosborne]

Thank you so much! 🤘

[@ilhanschen]

Great video! I have a simple 5.1 surround system setup today and wishing an upgrade soon. First and foremost I need an Atmos/DTS-X capable AVR as well (existing one is outdated). I think it will look like a journey from current status towards IMAX step by step :) next step can be 5.1.2, then 5.1.4 and maybe 7.x.4 at a later stage in time. I am pretty sure/convinced that each configuration will act as a right step forward and make sense. Thanks for the clear explanations Ealan.

[@ealanosborne]

Those are some solid expansion goals, right there! 🤘

[@youngstayoung6633]

Mines in my living room , I started with speakers on the ceiling high up on walls, I've now got atmos floorstanders( klipsch ) and it sounds better to me