Who Was The Bad Guy In WWII? | Niall Ferguson

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Recently, a narrative was introduced to the public conversation that Adolf Hitler wasn’t really interested in continuing WWII, that he offered peace to Britain and France, and that Winston Churchill, driven by some mysterious personal vendetta, refused and kept the war going for his own perverse purposes. This is a gross misreading of history, and conveniently omits key facts about Hitler’s true intentions; anyone suggesting otherwise is engaging in dangerous revisionism. On this episode of the Sunday Special, Niall Ferguson leads us through these untruths. Ferguson is a Scottish historian who is best known for his in-depth analysis of economic history, empire, and global conflicts like WWI and WWII. He doesn’t just recite history-he tells you why it happened, what could have been different, and how the war reshaped our global order.
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[@ferdinanddaratenas3447]

I'm so sick of this modern trend of "Everyone who was portrayed as bad is actually good and everyone who was portrayed as good is actually bad".

[@lsbc9666]

It’s such a dumbass mindset

[@anna-tn8mg]

We have now not only Hollywood preschool dropouts, but "podcast" preschool dropouts lecturing us on everything they desire, including history.

[@MarsiaAschierirz-wv5oq]

@@ferdinanddaratenas3447 We should have learned the truth originally and this wouldn't be happening

[@ilikepancakes2368]

Or maybe we can just agree in war there is no such thing as heroes and villains and it all depends on which side you’re fighting on. Hitler committed genocide meanwhile the US dropped a nuke on civilians. The concept of war crimes is a joke if no one follows them.

[@ilikepancakes2368]

Or maybe we can just agree in war there is no such thing as heroes and villains and it all depends on which side you’re fighting on. Hitler committed genocide meanwhile the US dropped a nuke on civilians. The concept of war crimes is a joke if no one follows them.

[@Lawrence_Talbot]

I get really annoyed when weebs tell me Japan were the “good guys” and America were the “bad guys” only because we dropped 2 bombs on them. And if you try to tell them any of the numerous atrocities Japan committed during the War, they shut it out and pretend it’s just “racist lies”

[@w.c.4818]

You forgot to mention that h I t ler offered Churchill to take the jews but it was rejected... more than once

[@CheerfullyCynical829]

BILLIONS upon BILLIONS of dollars, pounds, rubles, francs, Euros, rupees, Deutsche Marks and Shekels spent to research and develop hundreds of nuclear weapons over the last 60-70 years, and only _two_ have ever actually been used in human history. What an egregious waste of money. 😭

[@flabiger]

The atrocities of Unit 731 turn your blood cold.

[@FrankContrerasBatman74]

@@Lawrence_Talbot good point but but all countries have committed crimes and tell me what’s the best country in the world that didn’t commit crimes to outer countries or people.

[@adamcuneo7189]

Only dumb people criticize the bombings, if we invaded the mainland of Japan we would've had 500,000 American casualties.

[@ChristianWartraveller]

Britain showed their superior humanity when they declared war on Germany after the invasion of Poland. History can never be changed from their proudest moment.

[@Kilroy-was-here-d1k]

Well they didn’t show their superiority when the Soviet Union attacked Poland, did they?

[@bigbadladnamedalasad7071]

@@Kilroy-was-here-d1k Right I’m wondering where this superior humanity was when Britain allowed Poland to be eaten up by the Soviets after WW2.

[@dennismason3740]

I'm 71. Winston's speeches continue to inspire me. See The Darkest Hour. Never, in the field of human conflict, has so much been owed by so many to so few.

[@stefansekulic7903]

Exactly if Churchill had made a separate peace with Hitler it would have freed up resources and more troops would've been sent to the Eastern front.

[@kevinvsmarshall5240]

As blinkered and appalling Cooper's revisionist view of Churchill is, it appears to have more 'meat' than Critical Race Theory or claims that Isreal is committing genocide in Gaza. What Cooper appears to have in common is that he viewing evidence through the lens of prior beliefs.

[@wulfheort8021]

Ah yes, Churchill, the guy who hated Germans personally long before the second world war who used every single opportunity he had to push Great Britain towards war with Germany. Such a great guy!

[@montrelouisebohon-harris7023]

That was so good and some things that Winston Churchill did just crack me up... I think he was the bear that Britain needed for the time because he would not bow down to Germany.

[@suntzu94]

Churchill was a fat drunk Tory coward who fled Dunkirk to beg the US for help.

[@RalfAnders]

Top 2 villains of WW II: Adolf Hitler, Josef Stalin

[@anna-tn8mg]

There were many more, including Goebbels and other N^zi charmers and Chamberlain and many other collaborators of evil.

[@ARROWVERSEEDITS53]

@@RalfAnders Joseph Stalin was a villain but I don't know if he did anything bad In world war II

[@yeshua5707]

Winston Churchill also oversaw starvation camps. They are merely not mentioned due to racism because the camps he oversaw were located in southern Africa.

[@cordasuenaviolin604]

​@@yeshua5707Churchill saved Europe mate.

[@konnan442]

​@@cordasuenaviolin604by fire bombing German civilians while Hitler was asking for peace in 1940? Interesting

[@miriz4476]

I can’t believe we are having this conversation. The world has gone backwards and truth and facts that are obvious with proof are being questioned.

[@LatestMerch]

I know some Chinese people who defend Mao by saying the exact thing you just did.

[@anna-tn8mg]

Aren't Tucker and other Neo-Na^is, including Candace, actually wokists, defending the poor, misunderstood Adolfs?

[@anna-tn8mg]

@@LatestMerch huh?

[@monterreymxisfun3627]

@@anna-tn8mg He is defending critical thinking. If there are holes in a line of thinking, it's a good thing to point them out.

[@anna-tn8mg]

@@monterreymxisfun3627 Yeah, war i peace, madness is critical thinking, etc. Mad people are always critical thinkers. If someone insists that he is Napoleon and alive, he is definitely critical of accepted truth.

[@johnhynes7891]

What a great analysis and defence of Churchill and the debunking of the revisionists, but many millions of Brits have became totally frustrated by the current state of the UK. I know Ben's guest has his own personal reasons for the support and love of mass migration, but what a shame he couldn’t acknowledge that just because he is happy with it many millions of Brits are not and do not want their country culture and history to be obliterated on the altar of multi culturalism. The UK is changing and indigenous BRITS watch in despair at the views and actions of such elites.

[@andrewturner2354]

I was thinking about how to make this point in an articulate way my self. You did it for me.

[@DollfaceAl]

This is how Americans feel too. Well said.

[@Sonotfrench]

Well said.

[@ethanmoon3925]

Ben Shapiro should refer to his friend Jordan Peterson's interview with Tommy Robinson. Churchill may be great, we were the good guys in ww2, but now we're doormats and idiots and tyrannical.

[@owenfitzgerald5928]

As technically an indeginious Brit, no i am not watching multiculturalism in despair. I am watching racism and xenophobia in despair. We need migration. I want multiculturism

[@alexchapman7287]

I'm not surprised Tucker played with the guys ideas at all. It was not long ago when he somehow tried to say Americas initiation of the atomic bombings is equivalent evil to Japan's barbarian style savagery that murdered tens of millions throughout Asia and the pacific.

[@kathleenkahl]

Played with? All war is hell. Those that don’t remember and regret it are still waging it

[@Aireck174]

I think both can be true at the same time. Lincoln was also a tyrant god king, you can argue thats not good but you can also argue the democrats were willing to do anything to win the civil war so if Lincoln wasn't also willing to do anything, the republic may have lost the civil war.

[@anacc3257]

His trip to Moscow was also beyond bizarre

[@teeraw4575]

and all the ben shapiro supporter clowns were justifying using nuclear weapons on innocent women and children

[@Woodsaras]

Well, it is.

[@preciadocr1ss]

Isaiah 5: 20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter!

[@SzumaSzumaRum]

Spoiler Alert: It was Hitler.

[@Kim-by5uy]

You misspelled Churchill

[@anna-tn8mg]

The greatest historian of all times - Candace Owens - disagrees.

[@ARROWVERSEEDITS53]

@@anna-tn8mg Please tell me your joking

[@Troyper-lu3jz]

@ARROWVERSEEDITS53 yep she's onto you, and you're all panicking

[@ARROWVERSEEDITS53]

@@Troyper-lu3jz no one is panicking 🤣 Candace Owens is a joke. normal people don't listen to her and the ones who don't know that she's just mad at Ben Shapiro She just hates Jews nobody thinks she's revealing any truth not even her

[@Adir-Yosef]

33:00 ok i disagree with this, Europe today does look like a defeated continent that's being invaded, london isn't a British a british city anymore, mass immigration did cause major problems in the locations it hit, all of these points cooper made are correct. the incorrect part is who he is blaming this on, he blames Churchill the victors of WW2 who should have fought someone else and made peace with hitler. I personally blame left winged groups who planned this moral rot to aid the communist during the cold war, and most prominently the education system who failed in teaching new generations western values and adequate history, geography, philosophy and more.

[@NicholaWallace]

In WW2 many European countries were happy to get rid of their Jews. They've now been replaced by Muslims. Are they happy with that?

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

And where did those groups come from? They came from the '' let's re-engineer society to prevent nationalism from causing ww3'' crowd, who started in Germany and worked their way into the rest of the westernblock. Ironically the Soviets promoted national identities far more than the west despite being the anti-nationalist ideology. But even then Churchill is not to blame. We know he opposed such nonsense. But didn't have the leverage to stop it.

[@tb8865]

Churchill literally aligned himself and his country with World Communism to defeat Germany. Churchill, the supposed defender of England and the Empire. If you blame "left winged groups" for these problems, their ascendancy began with Churchill and his policy to destroy Germany, to the ultimate benefit of anti-colonial, anti-Western forces in the USSR and America.

[@matthewwolf3531]

You do realize Hitler wanted to defeat communism. You essentially prove the point that if Hitler had won we wouldn’t have had communism or multiculturalism. The white race wouldn’t be being raped and pillage by every black and brown person alive

[@mattboyer3385]

@Adir-Yosef and America is even worse,

[@nickconley8828]

The fact that we even have to ask this is a disgusting reflection on our world

[@sigurdholbarki8268]

I think it's fair to ask the question. Hang on... ...okay, thought about it, Winnie was a good guy, the dudes with moustaches were the baddies.

[@NicholasWongCQ]

Some people seem to enjoy being contrarian purely for the sake of it. They start with the assumption that "we've been lied to about everything", and then work their way backward, dismissing facts and evidence that don’t align with their contrarian narrative, often prioritizing skepticism over reasoned analysis.

[@KEK-dd4iu]

This guy is a Rothschild historian

[@jamesr8584]

@@KEK-dd4iu silly trolls.

[@thebargainshack6901]

I used to be in the mainstream camp like you up until 15 years ago. Then I studied the other side of the story, and was red-pilled.

[@NicholasWongCQ]

@@thebargainshack6901 There's no such thing as the "mainstream camp" or the "contrarian camp." It's silly to go through life pledging loyalty to these labels. I’m contrarian on a lot more issues than most, but I don’t do it just for the sake of being contrarian, because that would be absurd. Some of the stuff Cooper spewed out don't even stand up to the slightest scrutiny. That tells me he's either a troll, a complete ignoramus, or a compulsive contrarian.

[@thebargainshack6901]

@@NicholasWongCQ Uh, yeah there is. The generally accepted narrative (what is pushed by those in power) is the mainstream camp. The term "contrarian" means going against the mainstream. Hellooo. I don't have contrarian views just to be edgy. I embrace what my research tells me is the truth.

[@bruceleroyhoffman]

Churchill's policy was to wage war by sea, land, and air, "With all our might, with all the strength that God can give us to wage war against a monstrous tyranny never surpassed in the dark and lamentable catalogue of human crime". Churchill's aim was in one word Victory.

[@psygnosticrevenant6773]

And he took every opportunity to let it show. ✌

[@rodger7029]

😂😂

[@matthewrichmond4139]

You should thanks the Russians too

[@DarthQueefious]

His Victory led to Victory for Washington and impoverishment for Britain.

[@jamesr8584]

A good rebuttal to Tucker's interview. kzbin.info/www/bejne/mYPVonSblL5lbpIsi=XjKTYAPfDkxbA9Uc

[@Buceesfanmaarten]

This comment section gives me a lot of hope. It’s been really depressing seeing all comment sections under right-wing videos be filled with revisionist, isolationist and straight up anti-semitic nonsense. Glad there’s still plenty of conservatives out there with their heads screwed on straight.

[@paulietv2162]

For anti-semitism you have to view left wing videos

[@ca8944]

It’s frustrating dealing with those Neo knotzees/Islamists

[@sigurdholbarki8268]

Glory to God, God Save the memory of Winnie and may the anti-Semites see the error of their ways before their final judgement. ✝️🇬🇧🇺🇲

[@sigurdholbarki8268]

​@@paulietv2162based

[@matthewwolf3531]

Jews killed Jesus. Christ is king.

[@gulagbatman1318]

Next Ridiculous Argument: "The Jewish Yamaka represents a dome, signifying the Jewish ambition to take over the world." 😂💀

[@blacklupos]

Don't give them ideas 😂😂😂

[@deckardcanine]

Pro tip: It's spelled "yarmulke," despite the common pronunciation.

[@psygnosticrevenant6773]

Hehe... I'm sure we could think of more. "The Star of David points in every direction, indicating the Jewish intention to expand all around the globe!"

[@ethanwinnegrad3402]

Eh, if we put a dome over the world, that would negate the effect of our space lasers. Lmfao

[@blacklupos]

@@ethanwinnegrad3402 lol

[@FlippyD1998]

"The reason so many people died on the Eastern Front is because there wasn't enough food to feed prisoners" **Einsatzgruppen has entered the chat**

[@Rhubba]

Hitler laid out his ambitions in Mein Kampf. It's all there and the pro-Hitler revisionists always omit that book when they talk about him.

[@kaisermarxistdixie6842]

And the Anti-Hitler people like to throw it out and just say he's a Mad man, like if you want to know what he's about and what he wanted read Mein Kampf

[@nuqwestr]

Mein Kampf was published in 1925 and was not explicitly about extermination. That came in 1941 at the Wannsee Conference.

[@Letsplay222]

The Austrian Painter was a young revolutionary stewing in prison after a failed revolution when he wrote that book. He later stated that he wished he never wrote it. It would be irresponsible to extrapolate his motivations from a book written many years prior for his actions as leader of Germany, especially when he explains his actions and thinking in such detail as they are occurring .

[@Rhubba]

@@Letsplay222 One word: Lebensraum.

[@Letsplay222]

@@Rhubba Which he talks about in his book (which he later distanced himself from) but which is absent from all of his public speeches, correspondence with others and internal communications within the government. That is actually a perfect example of history's mythmaking. Inventing a fake motivation for the war on the Eastern Front because the real story is more complicated places responsibility on people adverse to it.

[@MargaretOConnorFlanigan]

The degradation of England can be reversed. The Moslems were expelled from Spain 500 years ago. The English can certainly do it now. Don't despair; don't give up.

[@PeterPeter-qc7ky]

Muslims are Not the Problem lol

[@mythsandlegends100]

Its not the Muslims that brought about the degredation of English society - they are rather a consequence of a societal move away from God to to a permissive, liberal, secular humanism. Without an objective standard of good and bad from the Bible anything and everything can be justified if they, or enough people with them say so. Everything becomes relative and everyone just does what is right in their own eyes without being able to condemn someone else for bad behaviour - which as I believe in sin and free will, I think just leads to more and more depravity.

[@morgainedepolloc4161]

Thank you Niall. Many of us in the US have been concerned. Imagine if a UK citizen was given substantial media space to argue that Lincoln was evil? We need experienced, credentialed historains to clarify. For my Jewsih friends, my condolences for this rehash of WW2 in this manner, particularly as we approach the very sad anniversary of Oct 7.

[@kerryjamesbenge1341]

I totally agree.

[@tnndll4294]

Tucker, Candace, Alex Jones. The axis of fake historians. who unforunately get millions of students per video.

[@PeterPeter-qc7ky]

​@@kerryjamesbenge1341jewish Friends hahahahhah are you a communists ?

[@christinepaige2575]

Don’t worry - the “Lincoln was evil” people are coming; they’re waiting in the wings and ready for their moment.

[@Sonofdonald2024]

Utter nonsense to portray Churchill as the bad guy in WW2. No genuine historian would make such a claim and its pretty disturbing that a man would make such a claim even if it is the only way he get attention

[@danundacuva3703]

Get a bloody clue lol... Even Jewish historians beg to differ

[@aussiegodx8629]

How was he not bad? They denied dozens of peace deals, they bombed civilian cities BEFORE the Germans did, they put the Germans into concentration camps after ww2 and let the Soviets take MILLIONS of slaves. They bombed supply lines to German camps which meant innocent civilians in said camps died. They commited far more maritime war crimes. They were evil. Tell me again how Churchill wasn't bad?

[@xLeeroycranex]

It's a paleocon (and Neo-Nazi) argument and usually done as a way for them to cancel out the pro-arguments for the post-WWII US interventionist based hegemony. It's really deconstructive, in nature, no different than what critical theorists/leftists try to do. Funny enough, Trump called their leader, Pat Buchanan, a "Hitler Lover" back in 1999 and sank his political career after.

[@SOTA-368]

That's like portraying Donald Trump as the bad guy.

[@margaretbenhamu7784]

@@danundacuva3703What “Jewish” historians? No one worth their salt would say that Hitler was “not so bad”

[@Oneironaut9]

I lost alot of respect for a very naive Tucker Carlson when he interviewed such an individual like Cooper with wide eyes, bewildered by his profundity.

[@danh.5998]

There is a certain point where being a contrarian crosses into entertaining stupidity, and Tucker is very comfortable with crossing that line

[@scott.j1]

are you a jew?

[@teeraw4575]

tucker doesnt need your respect he has 10000x the respect israel first ben shapiro does

[@anna-tn8mg]

Not naive. Evil.

[@emotional_anarchist]

Ah yes. Wouldn't want to platform people with different ideas. I remember just a couple years ago when eeeeeeveryone in media and the left made excuses for squashing the enemy. Ah yes, the enemy to covid was all the antivaxxers that had questions and platformed dangerous people. It's now the battle of elite names to smash down Darryll because his ideas of history are dangerous. In his 2 minutes on WW2 they have now drawn all sorts of narratives about what he thinks and believes.

[@Bobmudu35UK]

I truly believe Tucker has lost his mind. Great to hear a proper historian speaking sense.

[@mirandabrunskill7755]

Tucker Carlson needs to read a history book. My late parents, who were children during WW2, in England SURVIVED as a result of Churchill STANDING UP to Hitler.

[@skanderbeg1751]

England is gone ❤

[@stringer-ik1pc]

​@skanderbeg1751 worry about your own country

[@LatestMerch]

Everyone outside England died because of Churchill's prejudice...You should buy the book and read it again

[@danielfisher8539]

Go read Hitler, Churchill and the Necessary War. Churchill calls the war "unnecessary" in his biography.

[@anna-tn8mg]

No, we need asylums

[@jonathanrotem251]

Carlson and Owens are getting crazier by the day

[@paulietv2162]

Yep - lunatics

[@matthewwolf3531]

Ben Shapiro is an Israeli spy … not even a pro American

[@christinepaige2575]

I have had the same thought. It’s as though they have become almost drunk on themselves.

[@QuakerPop]

@@christinepaige2575 I think Candice has a certifiable mental health issue. I think Tucker is just a grifter

[@luthasunspell8365]

Fame is a heck of a drug.

[@stephenphillips3883]

I see Niall Ferguson, I click, I like, I watch.

[@PeterPeter-qc7ky]

Nial Ferguson is left AS fuck lol

[@rayzimmer6109]

The Carlson/Cooper view of history is a sick joke.

[@Sydney.Bright]

they think that by saying something shocking they will be seen as thought revolutionaries, intellectuals

[@berserker2716]

Did either of you watch the podcast

[@jamesr8584]

@@berserker2716 I saw clips, it was pretty bad.

[@berserker2716]

@@jamesr8584 lol look at the podcast and don’t pretend to know everything about what was said when you saw a single clip

[@jamesr8584]

@@berserker2716 Tell me you are not an Austrian painter follower without telling me you are an austrian painter follower.

[@lancehattemer6737]

So Insane people brush off the USSR when they won 87% of the battles in Europe against the Nazis like don’t have to love em but respect where it’s due.

[@EthelJung-j5w]

“It says here in this history book that luckily, the good guys have won every single time. What are the odds?” -Norm MacDonald

[@ca8944]

What’s your point ?

[@ca8944]

That’s not what it says

[@AlexCPauwels85]

Instances in which bad guys that have won: Bolcheviks, Fidel Castro, Chinese Revolution, Khomeini, Gadaffi, French revolution, Petro...

[@hugoguerreiro1078]

Bad guys create a lot of enemies so they lose more often than they win. How is this surprising to anyone?

[@katej910]

Do you have any actual factual disagreements with what Niall has said in the interview?

[@mattnewhouse1781]

Answer: every damn country. No one came to save us Jews.

[@mmccpl3934]

I listened to tuckers pod cast with Daryl Cooper and then went to Daryl's podcast channel. As someone who isn't particularly educated I knew this guy was on some B.S and said so in the comments of Tucks video. What I could not believe was how many people in the comments thought Daryl Cooper was some type of thought leader when he was more like a story teller.

[@jamesdellaneve9005]

Yeah. It was crap. I am disappointed with Tucker.

[@castlerock58]

It was clear that Tucker knows very little about WW II. Anyone with basic knowledge, like when Churchill became prime minister, would have realized that Cooper is not a historian and does not know what he is talking about. Tucker knows a fair amount about post WW II history so I assumed he knew the basics about WW II but it is clear he didn't. He seemed to think that Cooper was an actual historian instead of a BS artist and Nazi apologist. His staff did not do their homework and Tucker damaged his credibility.

[@Aviel266]

Why does Tucker Carlson really like hosting neo-Nazis? Am I missing something???

[@naysayer1238]

Big money, his fans have substantial allowances from their moms upstairs.

[@edshanks2189]

Maybe because his most dedicated fans are in fact neo-Nazis.

[@InciniumVGC]

He applied the lesson from the Iraq war too far. Not all of our wars were good wars. But he falls into the same pattern as the left in saying America bad. Its really disappointing because he could be a powerful voice for the conservative movement, but by pushing this America bad thought pattern all the way to "the Nazis were not the bad guys" he has lost the plot and alienated the boomer con audience he cultivated and any possible appeal among anyone that isn't part of the terminally online right (which is a tiny audience, as most terminally online people are leftists)

[@berserker2716]

Tell me you have not watched the podcast without telling me you did not watch the podcast

[@louisegoins7630]

I am beginning to believe he agrees with them.

[@adamcuneo7189]

Saying Churchill was the "bad guy" is a crime, he was a good man, but I think we've already learned enough about WWII, I think it's currently more important to learn about the rise of Communist China after WWII, since they're our current adversary and not many Americans know much about them.

[@user-yx9ds7ky7f]

Aaah yes. The people of India will tell you A LOT about Churchill. And how good he was.

[@el_killorcure]

Churchill and FDR/Truman stopped the evil of Nazism while saving a worse evil: Stalin and Communism. It's like budding into Alien VS Predator only to save the Alien. All of the world lost because of that (Marxism is stronger today than ever, while Nazism would not have outlived Chaplin's evil twin himself).

[@cordasuenaviolin604]

​@@user-yx9ds7ky7fThat does not negate that he saved Europe and the West from total submission to the Nazis in the years prior to the Americans' entering the war.

[@user-yx9ds7ky7f]

@@cordasuenaviolin604 wut? USA was at risk of submitting to nazis?

[@cetepeter5431]

And contributed to England entering WWI...

[@xxpowwowbluexx]

Something is off with Tucker Carlson. I don’t trust him.

[@fallenberet7955]

He gives off Lauren Chen vibes tbh.

[@nicolasacevedo2235]

Totally

[@Pepestock]

The vibe is something you aren’t used to, a conservative who puts his country and it's people above Israel😂😂😂

[@stefansekulic7903]

His wife probably doesn't trust him😅

[@polvoazul]

I think he is just selling what his audience likes to buy. He is also an American isolationist, which is a pretty naive, or at least, selfish view. He attacked Ben directly saying 'he only cares about Israel', which is just a crazy statement. I mean, he does care about Israel, obviously (as he should). But the man has like, 2000 episodes? 99% of them are wholly about America's politics or culture. I mean, its just crazy to ignore that track record. Also, the left is relentlessly pushing the Iranian narrative. Someone has to pushback.

[@dizzydabz6905]

I used to kind of like tucker. But now i see him like hes off his rocker.

[@DF-kn9yl]

Candace Owens as well

[@jamesr8584]

I started noticing him saying crazy things when he was still at Fox. And Candace, really saying some wacky things like Macron's wife and Michelle Obama are really men and talking about flat earth. They are doing more harm than good to the conservative movement if you ask me.

[@HadrianOrion]

Tucker Carlson is promoting transphobic and antisemitic nazi propaganda! He is acting just like the nazis at the first nazi book burning. The nazis raided the Institute of Sexualwissenschaft where jewish scholar Magnus Hirschfeld bravely pioneered sex reassignment surgeries for trans adults and youth. The nazis burned over 20,000 books on sexual theory which set the LGBTQIA+ movement back decades. It was an utter tragedy. If it weren't for nazis, society could have embraced trans youth decades ago and we could be addressing new issues; such as the phobia and discrimination against minor attracted persons. The nazis hated that Hirschfeld wanted to help trans adults and children. The nazis also hated that Hirschfeld revealed that it is perfectly normal and healthy for adults to be attracted to younger persons. Love is Love! It's good that the nazis lost and that now we see them as the worst group to ever exist. Magnus Hirschfeld is a hero! Along with the esteemed and brave work done by Dr. John Money, who discovered the difference between sex and gender. He fought for trans visibility and trans rights by bravely encouraging parents to have one of their trans children have corrective surgery. Sadly, both siblings later committed self-deletion, which is irrelevant to being trans. Nazis point to trans high self-deletion rates as though being trans has anything to do with it. It doesn't! Even bringing it up is transphobic and trans oppressive. Transphobic, antisemitic, nazis claim Dr. Money "violated" his clinical patients. The reality is that Dr. Money was brave enough to perform therapeutic practices of a sexual nature with both siblings in his care when they were children. Again, the phobia of older adults engaging in normal healthy sexual behavior with younger persons. Nazi mentality! Tucker Carlson, along with LITERAL nazis, have a problem with the standards of care and gender reassignment treatment and surgery for trans youth. Tucker Carlson, and anyone who agrees with him, should be ashamed! You are all Nazis, whether you know it or not.

[@dizzydabz6905]

@@jamesr8584 fr fr they spew a bunch of nonsense most the time

[@paulietv2162]

@@jamesr8584 They are no longer conservatives they are wackos and more in alignment with the left than right

[@rosemaryalles6043]

Ben is a good man, he is NOT afraid to call out his "own side" (so to speak). Bravo. Also, Niall Ferguson is brilliant as is his amazing wife Ayaan Hirsi Ali. Thank you for this episode. Necessary, illuminating. Cooper is an idiot and Tucker may need a few pills.

[@jamesr8584]

And what happened to Candance? People on the left are talking about her, no one on the right is saying anything. She has gone off the deep end, no one has noticed?

[@jonesalex565]

It's not "his side". So there's that. He's his side. You fool

[@rosemaryalles6043]

@@jamesr8584 Yep. True.

[@thewatcher_UK]

​@@jamesr8584true.. she has gone flat earth tin foil hat

[@shrewdlydonebales1650]

Ben is chicken shit. Remember how he agreed to debate Owens then called his lawyer to get out of it. Not exactly brave.

[@darthracer777]

For several months, I've put Tucker at arm's length because of his revisionist WW2 history. Now this. IMO, he's gone off the rails. Just because someone may be generally on your side of the political spectrum doesn't mean you have to accept many of their ideas.

[@miriamhakimian]

Thank goodness you’re doing something about Candace and Tucker’s madness

[@kathleenkahl]

LMAO.

[@outdoorloser4340]

Their basedness?

[@PsychoSpartan7]

​@@outdoorloser4340being woke isn't based just because it's rightwing woke.

[@outdoorloser4340]

@@PsychoSpartan7 They are getting based on Isreal and I'm happy to see it.

[@kev3d]

@@outdoorloser4340 Israel is objectively the only pro-western nation in the region and it also happens to be the size of New Jersey. But it is about 80% Jewish so that's a problem according to the internet weirdos, Islamic terrorists and people like Candace Owens. Jews on average have strong family and community bonds, low rates of criminality, comparatively few single parents, and a great emphasis on education. These are deeply conservative values, and yet some on the right consider these qualities to somehow be a problem. "They are taking over" it's said, and yet these fake conservatives claim they are for a color-blind meritocracy. It's disgusting to abandoned rational conservative values in favor of bizarre neo Anti-Semitism.

[@waynetaylor2784]

Tucker Carlson has always been anti uk , in his recent trip to Australia he constantly blamed uk for so many things it was obvious of his dislike of anything uk.

[@anna-tn8mg]

It isn't about UK or not. It's about madness. Nothing is normal in this sicko.,

[@svbarryduckworth628]

We wasted almost a whole generation saving them. Wasn't worth it.

[@waynetaylor2784]

@svbarryduckworth628 more like the world wasted whole generation on saving the USA you do realise more than one country fought in ww2 ? Not just usa. Hell you were late to WW1 and WW2 by years.

[@waynetaylor2784]

@svbarryduckworth628 what usa ? You didn't do shit by yourself, n you saved no one

[@doreenknudson2098]

Thankful you are having this conversation to refute the Tucker episode, and present sound historical truth

[@johnmarston2616]

Ben, unsurprisingly, has misrepresenting the arguments he’s attempting to counter. I encourage you to listen to Coopers actual argument before you hear out Ben’s strawman.

[@analogeit]

What is Niall's point as a conservative? Sit back and accept that his country has and will continue to change into an unrecognisable international island?

[@Aviel266]

At this point anyone who calls themselves a conservative and is a fan of Tucker Carlson should have their head examined urgently. 🙄

[@el_killorcure]

As Shapiro loves to say: two things can be true at the same time: Hitler was the very monster we are told, but Churchill was not the saint we have been told either (ask Eastern Europe)...

[@biancagadi786]

.......and why exactly is that?

[@naysayer1238]

@@el_killorcure No one said he is a saint.

[@AGoat1971]

Yes, a purity test! Just like the leftists do! That’s the solution! You must align on every single point, in every single situation, discussion, or argument! Conservatives cannot ever have a nuanced opinion! Must...be...black...and...white!

[@besniklulanaj6705]

If you listened to Ben and got the Covid shots you should have your head examined!! Difference is Tucker just hosted a convo and your man Ben was getting upset for people questioning the jab. You are dumb stop talking

[@heir8095]

To the right wing grifters, notice how Ben says at the end that: You can agree modern multiculturalism and mass migration have problems, without pulling your arguments against it from Nazi propaganda. There are better arguments against it that come from better sources and that will ultimately have a better acceptance among the people you're trying to convince

[@kaisermarxistdixie6842]

Sure I agree, I disagree with Ben's view of "conservativism" and general modern views of politics. I also think Ben doesn't care about things like Tradition, Culture, or nation Multi-culturalism is nothing more than Liberal colonialism which is something Ben won't understand.

[@heir8095]

@@kaisermarxistdixie6842 he seems to be sympathetic to that idea and he's been trending that way since 2015

[@kaisermarxistdixie6842]

@@heir8095 True, and I can give Ben credit for at least coming around to some populist ideals, it's not like I want Ben to be in lock step with the Populist ideology but if you want to be a Conservative then at least don't cheapen conservativism down. Personally me I still see Ben too much of a neo-Conservative but I'm glad he's coming around him and Tucker need to cool it and find things to unite the Conservative and populist movements then create rifts

[@Pepestock]

Yeah, Ben could move to Israel tomorrow. We can't.

[@kaisermarxistdixie6842]

@@Pepestock hey, I wouldn't go that far, because Ben is Jewish you can argue he has a spiritual connection with Israel, now the problem with that is that Ben seems to have a Political connection to. It be alot different if he just said I support Israel nothing more or less if anything I would argue I'm a bigger supporter of Israel because I'm willing to hold the nation into account, if you truly like something and supported it you should have some reservations about it.

[@domainpark4421]

I have enjoyed Tucker's "liberation" but this was the end of the fun for me. An absolutely outrageous guest who as Niall says simply rececyles German propaganda, and the Jewish banker routine is the cherry on top of absurdities.

[@John-bravooo]

Tucker takes money from Nazi Qatar so he's pushing the antisemitism. Muslims try to influence all sides.

[@kathleenkahl]

Not true. I’ve listened and learned how many Germans were treated like animals and not allowed to die by the Fascist and communist before and after WWIII. He never once excuses Hitler. Open the mind

[@jamesr8584]

Candace has gone off the deep end too. What is going on with the conservative influencers these days?

[@user-ez3fp6hu1v]

If one decided to no longer accept fixed narratives and eternal truths, and imo for very good reason, how do you know where to stop? In fact I don't think Tucker should stop anytime soon. If it turns out to be easily debunked, I don't see the problem. That's exactly how free speech works.

[@darwinodriscoll7750]

Maybe stop shutting down peoples yt channels etc and people won’t be suspicious. U can’t have freedom of speech yet someone disagrees with u and shut them up

[@StunningModelMargaretHill-p7x]

"You don't have a place in a serious discourse about World War II, unless you accept the dogma that Britain is better off entirely populated by Africans, Indians and Muslims rather than Germanic peoples, aka The English " Thanks for clearing up who is allowed to participate in the discourse Mr Historian, what ever would we do without you?

[@adrianryan5654]

The English are not Germans, you are maybe confusing Saxons with Saxony in Germany, not the same at all. Only the Royal family is German, one reason so many are republicans, the people are a mix of North Sea coastal people’s (Angles, Saxons, Friesians, Jutes/Danes, Vikings, Celts, Picts and Normans - derived from the Norse). And the British people willingly volunteered to fight “the Hun” to defend Britain and the British way of life at the time of WW1 and 2,money did not identify as of the same people as Germany - only members of the royal family did. I don’t dispute your point about modern Britain and immigration issues but Ferguson is not saying people cannot engage in debate (which Cooper avoids like the plague) just that they must use actual facts and not harebrained propaganda from Goebbels. Also this is a different time with a different enemy and a different set of propaganda vectors. Agains as I refer to Orwell “The most effective way to destroy people is to deny and obliterate their own understanding of their history.” ― George Orwell

[@Peridactyloptrix]

Britain absolutely is better off populated entirely by immigrants than by Nazis

[@Artcore103]

Spot on, this guy lost ALL credibility defending modern London and the UK at large and it's insane immigration. He could be totally right about WW2 history, for the sake of argument, and it wouldn't change this one but. It really exposed his stupid worldview and Ben should have pushed back on modern immigration issues. London, Paris, and places all over Europe are turning into complete garbage places; Europe is actively falling and headed to destruction, intentionally.

[@ryanlazarus3381]

Darryl Cooper: I’m being hyperbolic and trolling my good friend who worships Churchill, but Churchill was the real villain. Niall: I don’t know the well-documented recent history about what Darryl actually said, but let me tell you about the dangers of anti-history. Fans of Darryl and Niall: **double-facepalm** == Of course Hitler was the main villain. Darryl was making a point about the mistakes before and during WWII by Churchill.

[@jloiben12]

Adolf. This is self-evident. Mussolini. Dude was literally allied with Adolf. Nothing more needs to be said. Stalin. Dude was literally allied with the Germans. Not only that, but he could have gotten Germany to back down on Poland. We could have avoided the war if Stalin wasn’t so weak (along with England and France on that one specific matter). Hirohito. His word was that of god. If he didn’t want the events of the Pacific theater to occur, it wouldn’t have happened

[@anna-tn8mg]

Adolf and thousands of top N^zis: Eichmann, Goebbels, Bormann, Reichmann, Ilse Koch, etc.

[@jloiben12]

@@anna-tn8mg Well… yeah. I just don’t have the patience for listing everyone

[@PHUCKUSA-z3l]

Don't forget the US. The US is terrorists. I wi

[@matejmoravek4580]

Mussolini was definitely the most good of these.

[@jloiben12]

@@matejmoravek4580 When the bar is below hell, I guess only being in hell is an accomplishment

[@stephensands3485]

For fuck’s sake Darryl isn’t a Nazi or an anti-Semite. For all of the talk by Ben and the right about how all the left does is smear everyone as a “Nazi” or a “racist” without evidence, they’re doing the same damn thing here. All you’d have to do is listen to the first episode of Darryl’s Fear and Loathing in the New Jerusalem series or listen to the podcasts Darryl has done on antisemitism and you’d realize, instantly, that Darryl is most definitely not an antisemite or Nazi sympathizer in the slightest. Shit, he literally put out several response podcasts, one of which clips out a portion of the Fear and Loathing series on the Holocaust. I dare anyone to listen to that and tell me after that the guy is a secret Nazi (and to realize that Darryl is not someone who “clearly hasn’t read any sources and isn’t a ‘real’ historian”). You guys are embarrassing yourselves

[@stephensands3485]

For reference, I did listen to the entire interview and while I think Niall makes good arguments, I don’t think Darryl’s points should be dismissed either. Niall quietly admits later in the interview that Churchill was really pushing for war, but that other conservative members of the government were more hesitant and wanted to consider peace, so the idea wasn’t without its supporters at the time. My issue is more with the additional step of “the only reason he’s saying these things is because he’s got other beliefs and is a secret Nazi.” That’s slanderous

[@johnricercato740]

⁠@@stephensands3485You’re being disingenuous and, like Cooper, drawing a bad cartoon of what actually took place. NF did not ‘quietly admit’ anything. He merely said that Churchill was indeed pro-war - because by then it was clear to all but the peaceniks in his cabinet what Hitler’s intentions were and that he was only going to stop if confronted militarily. That is not warmongering. Secondly, NF did not say Cooper was a Nazi merely that he was reproducing Goebbels’ propaganda - and that is factually correct. And no, Cooper is not a real historian: he doesn’t write books with footnotes, references, sources, bibliographies etc.

[@johnmarston2616]

I can’t believe how long it took me scrolling through comments to find someone not shilling for Ben. The pro-war propaganda at the Daily Wire is so blatant. They did nothing to address Coopers actual arguments or claims and instead just strawmanned him. His point isn’t that Hitler was actually the good guy, his point was that Churchill did NOTHING to avoid war and after the fact admitted himself that it was UNNECESSARY

[@GremlinsAndGnomes]

I've listened to the first half of "Fear and Loathing" and while he certainly does much to humanize the Arab position as of 1930, he has also gone to great lengths to show the plight of world Jewry in the Victorian and Interwar Periods.

[@chrismcdonald7086]

@@stephensands3485 I suppose he's just deeply ignorant then. There was no peace to be had, and even a cursory understanding of the early war makes that clear.

[@petermitchell4523]

Was buying his arguments until he started talking about how England was better than Hungary

[@ca8944]

I think his point was that Russia/Putin is bad and Hungary is friendly to Russia. At least Ben pushed back on mass immigration. He’s still right about WW2 though

[@GremlinsAndGnomes]

​@@ca8944 England is not acting as a friend of liberty either. They are weaponizing a two-tiered policing system against their indigenous population to crush political dissent and opposition to globalism. We ought to ask what the West is doing wrong to drive these countries back to the arms of their former imperial overlord.

[@dfmrcv862]

I am tired of Tucker pretending he isn't basically an enemy agent at this point.

[@Nathan-jh1ho]

He's basically using the same demoralization tactics historically only seen on the left. Just with a different kind of spin, while claiming to be a nationalist There's a fine line between cricism of their own county's actual faults, and just smearing it with absurd standards

[@Pepestock]

😂😂😂😂😂 Israel has you so brainwashed 😂

[@paulietv2162]

Yes, I wish he would just have the guts to admit that he is Putin's number 1 fanboy and cheerleader

[@heythere4871]

Shows how little you truly know about eastern European history.

[@dfmrcv862]

@@heythere4871 projection much?

[@Poonky88USVI]

This is why it’s so important to READ history from genuinely reputable sources.

[@jaypee389]

It would be NEARLY impossible for Ben to talk about WW1 & WW2 and the rise of Bolshevism without having bias. I wish Jews the best and may they learn from history. Facts do no have feelings, but apparently Ben does. We need an unbiased discussion on this topic.

[@lakerspackers11]

Thank you for this! 🙏🏼 that Tucker podcast made me absolutely sick, as did the response

[@Cyborg-zq4iq]

So do we have a consesus on what's going on with Tucker Carlson? This isn't the first side-eyeing interview he's given in the past view months, yet people keep giving him the benefit of the doubt or they just gloss over his actions.

[@kathleenkahl]

He took a black pill.

[@Letsplay222]

The consensus is that he is extremely popular and influential. Far more popular than Ben. And he is currently giving live speeches with huge crowds. I doubt Ben could fill a high school auditorium today.

[@grumpybear5410]

@@kathleenkahl He overdosed on the black pill.

[@christinepaige2575]

I think he overdosed on himself…ditto Candace Owens. They are drunk on themselves, I think.

[@cjpenning]

And Cooper claims to have read just about every book on the subject. Hard to believe.

[@jgirlLVR]

Oh, but he did read every book on the subject, every book on the subject written by Pat Buchanan and David Irving.

[@GremlinsAndGnomes]

He is a prolific reader. His series "Fear and Loathing in the New Jerusalem" is an incredibly deep dive into early Israeli history, drawing on primary sources and multiple historians.

[@pawechwiedosik3339]

Stalin was worse than Hitler.

[@DavidMccallister65]

Let's not forget how Cooper literally argued that Jim Jones was actually a great man and a great civil rights leader throughout his ministry, but he just went off the deep end after prolonged drug abuse. His own son has explained how manipulative and ego maniacal he was. I'm completely on board with questioning the mainstream narratives that we've been fed, but c'mon people smh

[@nolkso]

If Churchill didn't convince FDR to join the war effort (albeit discretely), the Soviets would've never been able to defeat Berlin.

[@nuqwestr]

"discretely"? Lend/Lease was not discreet, it was overt US Policy. The U.S. Lend-Lease program, which provided military aid to Allied nations during World War II, officially began on March 11, 1941. This was when President Franklin D. Roosevelt signed the Lend-Lease Act into law.

[@nolkso]

@@nuqwestr I was talking about the process of convincing him. FDR basically ran on not sending troops and problems in the Pacific were more directly damaging to the U.S. around when Western Europe was invaded. I also feel like his desire (and congress' desire) to abstain from war was genuine and relatively rigid.

[@nuqwestr]

@@nolkso FDR ran in 1932 and again in 1936. Churchill did not first visit the White House until December 1941, after Japan bombed Pearl Harbor. Your timeline is not coherent with the facts. FDR and Churchill were both Navy men, natural allies. No coaxing was necessary. The Atlantic Charter of August 1941 was signed after Nazi Germany declared war on the United States 8 months prior to that Charter. These facts are only a keyboard away. Also, FDR is a prime mover in Pan Am creating an air route to the Philippines and Hong Kong in anticipation of a war with Japan. Pan Am first flew into Hong Kong in 1935, then Manila in 1937. FDR was no pacifist, he was a pragmatic realist.

[@nolkso]

@@nuqwestr Although he was not a pacifist in practice, his hand was forced in many ways. To my understanding, before meeting with Churchill (which he hid from the public anyways) America's attention was reserved for the East and Japan. He fought hard to send weapons over to Britain and did so while maintaining that troops wouldn't be sent. It wasn't until right before Germany declared war that FDR became more transparent with citizens publically, and who knows how much sunken Atlantic convoys played into his decision in doing so. It took all of Europe falling for him to do much of anything in that theatre or in Africa, and it's not like he wasn't being pressured by Western European leaders. Also, I'm talking about the rhetoric used in his 3rd run for office.

[@nolkso]

@@nuqwestr Also, the Atlantic Charter was signed in August 1941 and Germany officially declared war on the U.S. in December 1941.

[@MrVara411]

Umm... why not interview Darryl Cooper himself and challenge all of his presuppositions? That would be more educational than these separate interviews.

[@yeshua5707]

Visited Indiana the other day, and it was like I was in a completely defeated country. There’s no continuity of culture, violence and depravity in the streets. No common language, no advantage to citizenship.

[@macallan1010]

I live in Mishawaka Indiana, and what you're saying is complete crap.

[@mattm2767]

What are you talking about? I live in Indiana. I don’t see any of this anywhere.

[@lybnychavez6953]

Besides blue cities like south bend or Gary, Indiana is really great. Plus even those areas it’s just the black areas, Mexicans keep the neighborhoods nicer

[@yeshua5707]

@@macallan1010 talking about indianapolis. I agree most of Indiana is okay

[@yeshua5707]

@@mattm2767 then spend some time in indianapolis

[@7megan7]

When your society loses the ability to distinguish between good and evil, this is what you end up with.

[@Dakinisimo]

I’ve been thinking the same thing. Terrifying.

[@vesper180]

The worse thought are those who deep down, just willfully see what they want to see, thereby actually refusing to "distinguish the difference" because it somehow serves them or their ego, etc.

[@IdonotwantaUtubename]

💯

[@rashdaniel6693]

This is one of the most dishonest discussions I've ever heard. I'd encourage everyone to go listen to his own words and not just the way they are portraying him. He has several multi hour podcasts. You can hear it straight from his mouth and decide for yourself.

[@nigelw7626]

He's just a fruit loop.He's not a Historian.

[@kylendmiller]

Exactly, Ben and Niall are lying about Cooper. It's disgusting.

[@user-kc4bv7yi6s]

Excited for this debate

[@besniklulanaj6705]

This isn’t a debate

[@billscannell93]

Tucker must be on the blow again. What is the matter with him? Aside from promoting horrible stuff, bad enough in and of itself, he sure isn't doing his own side any favors.

[@ciprianiulian6575]

He is promoting the right thing.

[@Pepestock]

Another non argument and an ad hom 😂

[@giltuito1545]

​@@Pepestockyou're literally going comment by comment to defend Tucker and the Neo-Nazi. What a time to be alive 😂

[@giltuito1545]

​@@ciprianiulian6575you said it and added a dot at the end, so it must be true 😊

[@ciprianiulian6575]

@@giltuito1545 it's a great time. And that guy is not a neo Nazi. We can challenge the fake history written by the victors.

[@feignedidentity]

History is written by the winners. That doesn’t mean the winners weren't the good guys. It also doesn't mean one should be dismissive of what the losers thought of what they were doing.

[@jamesr8584]

I reject this silly argument as if history is biased by the winners. Just pick up any US History book and it gives a fair assessment of how American treated the Natives. Even though America won, they don't sugar coat the tragedy. We live in a free society, real historians write real history, it's not state sponsored history.

[@chickenpicnicofficial2727]

The winners are always the good guys, because might makes right.

[@feignedidentity]

@@jamesr8584 That history is written by the winners doesn't inherently mean it is written incorrectly. It just means there is always the likelihood that the perspectives of the losers aren't portrayed accurately. Even if the losers' perspectives are portrayed, it's likely to be subjected to the interpretation of the winners. Knowing what the losers thought of what they were doing doesn't mean one agrees with them.

[@nuqwestr]

"History is written by the winners" is no longer true, and hasn't been for well over 100 years.

[@jjd2737]

@@feignedidentityww2 is the most documented event in history. German historians wrote about it, European historians, American, etc. Hitler wrote about his reasoning in mein kempf. We know everything about WW2. There’s no “secret narrative”. Unless you think every WW2 historian is lying. It’s convenient that the only people who try to make Hitler seem like the good guy also want to exterminate the Jews.

[@zzwest7230]

Worst guys in WW2 1. Stalin 2. Churchill 3. Roosevelt 4. Mussolini 5. Hitler 6. Tojo

[@oaktreet4335]

Speaking as an American, I believe that the free world owes a huge debt of gratitude to Britain and Churchill, who for a period of time in WWII stood alone against a massive military machine. A lot of people do not understand how much danger the world faced at that time. Churchill was the perfect leader at the perfect time.

[@faye2686]

Isaiah 5:20-23 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter! Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes, and shrewd in their own sight! Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine, and valiant men in mixing strong drink, who acquit the guilty for a bribe, and deprive the innocent of his right! Mark 1:15….Repent and believe in The Gospel. ❤ John 3:16, John 14:6

[@fatrick5004]

The most ridiculous thing I have ever heard is Niall's argument that essentially the Nazis happened due to a response to multiculturalism and thus the lesson is not to react in the way Nazis did. No, the lesson is people do not want their countries invaded by mass immigration. That is the lesson Niall.

[@MrCallmebaldy]

@@fatrick5004 right. Ben and Ferguson pearl clutching about this is why no one trusts these dorks anymore.

[@kylendmiller]

Exactly, he also said that London is completely fine and there's nothing out of the ordinary. I was there myself a few years ago. Muslim mayor. Insane crime levels. London has actually fallen. Niall is a little puppet.

[@analogeit]

Niall Ferguson is married to a somali. He wants Britain to lose its identity

[@jaypee389]

This video is obviously biased against Germans since Ben is Jewish and this man is British. This video is not PERFECTLY accurate.

[@leetimberman8860]

Churchill did the right thing in WW2. That doesn't mean that he didn't do anything bad. Like the starvation of the Indian peninsula to stay under the rule of Britain. One does not preclude the other. People are complex.

[@williamsnowden8186]

For goodness sakes! Have you learnt nothing. Churchill did not "starve"the Bengalis into submission. That famine was consequent to a typhoon, and relief was impaired by Japanese submarines operating in the Bay of Bengal and the occupation of the Malay Peninsula, from which food supplies would normally have been transported. The Second World War was raging. All countries were suffering from shortages of food. A sad consequence of conflict.

[@leetimberman8860]

@williamsnowden8186 I didn't say he personally starved the people, but he was a part of the government that tried to subjugate the Indian peninsula. That was bad. Of course, the Portuguese government did worse in the African countries that they subdued. That is not to say that Churchill was totally wrong on everything.

[@williamsnowden8186]

​@@leetimberman8860 Yes,you did.

[@leetimberman8860]

@@williamsnowden8186 for British rule. One of the cogs. You must not understand the subtleties of politics. Watch I Claudius from PBS, or read the Book of the Five Rings. By Musashi Myamoto.

[@paulietv2162]

@@leetimberman8860 Yes you did say that, why are you denying it now?

[@mark4asp]

No one said: "I wish Hitler had won WW2". What's wrong with people? Given that Germany and USSR both invaded Poland in 1939, and partitioned it, what did Britain and France do regarding the USSR? Were any ultimatums issued? It seems to me USSR won WW2; no one else. The accusation against Churchill is he continued the war against Germany for his own purposes - to allay his own vain-gloriousness. Putting aside Hitler:- by allying itself with USSR, Britain allied itself with the most murdereress regime of the 20th century. Hitler and USSR were both bad. Britain allied itself with one of them.

[@GremlinsAndGnomes]

Say what you will about Churchill but he was a massive advocate of strangling Communism in the cradle bacj at the end of WWI. Had personalities like Churchill carried the day, an evolution into a war with the Soviets might have occurred. Despite our moral rhetoric about the war, evidently a lot of practical considerations carried the day. The Brits wanted and ally in 1941. The Allies were exhausted by war in 1945 and chose peace of the fury of justice that had initiated the war. Many of the same Americans who lionized Britain's fight against Nazism as an intolerable evil also chastised Reagan for calling the USSR an evil empire. Am I calling for revisionism, no. But things do often seem murky when you begin to take all of the facts into account.

[@conservos2349]

Tucker made me so mad when he had Darryl Cooper on. All us on X are trying to defend Musk's free-speech experiment, and Tucker goes and gives Leftist anti-speech crusaders a valid point about X. It's absolutely infuriating. Having the interview was fine I guess, but he didn't push back on Cooper at all. Darryl Cooper speaking to Tucker Carlson about Churchill: "I think when you really get into it and tell the story right, and don't leave anything out, you see that he was primarily responsible for that war becoming what it did...becoming more than an invasion of Poland." Germany invaded Denmark and Norway on April 9th 1940. Winston Churchill became Prime Minister on May 10th 1940.

[@fulcifan6946]

We need a Ferguson vs Cooper debate.

[@anna-tn8mg]

No, we don't. No debates with monsters.

[@MarioAlfredo-cw4hh]

Ben shapiro x brett Cooper

[@dennisshaper4744]

Ferguson just called everyone who had a problem with illegal immigration and open birders a Hitler loving Nazi. I have interest in hearing him again

[@joshbridges9234]

@@anna-tn8mg that’s a terrible take. If Ferguson is right his ideas will prevail and discredit Cooper.

[@anna-tn8mg]

@@joshbridges9234z Sorry,, this I most certainly know well. Academics don't debate grifters.

[@whit2887]

Great show!! So glad you did this Ben!

[@jeffreylysen7647]

This lightswitch thinking is annoying. If you think one is bad, it doesn't mean the other is good. Such simple thinking

[@soluschristus5946]

Tucker has lost the plot. He should seek asylum in Russia or Iran where he would be welcomed with open arms.

[@Rejoice1631]

Close to the end of the conversation, I got the impression that Niall believed that the current “mass immigration“ is comparable to the early 19th century for both Great Britain and the United States. If that is the case then I disagree 100% with it. Because the early 20th century immigration prior to 2000 at least if not 1970 1980s possibly into the 90s, would be that most people immigrating wanted to assimilate into British and American culture not replace it as it seems they are trying to do now in the current state of mass immigration.

[@kylendmiller]

Exactly Niall is living in his little bubble and completely ignoring what's actually happening in his own country.

[@blacklupos]

Look at all the Tucker and Candice fan boys in the comments 😅😅😅 They are not the brightest fellows

[@Troyper-lu3jz]

@@blacklupos Your mafia is exposed

[@scepteredisle]

If they haven't realised that Tucker is not a good guy any more, and is in fact a fascist with hints of N@zism (this time it's not a slur...) you can't be helped.

[@riccardodigiuseppe8661]

Of course they are idiots!

[@cetepeter5431]

Churchill was not a saint, in any case...He was warmonger also before WWI...A war in which the good side was not very clear...

[@GordonCaledonia]

People are desperate for "heroes" these days so they will latch on to people who used to be reviled. Tucker was reviled until he was fired by Fox and Candace was not much of a big deal until she overnight "became" a Republican. It's all so tawdry, all so tawdry. It's all about maintaining money and maintaining attention. I don't like ANYTHING OR ANYBODY in politics anymore. It's all... tawdry, that's the word I use.

[@Dorkmaster941]

15:10 This is the literal opposite of what Cooper has said in the interview and in his most recent responses on his podcast. I really wanted to come here to learn something, but if you intentionally lie to people like this, it makes people more sympathetic to guys like Cooper.

[@sunshine6522]

If you want to believe garbage revisionism from Hitler-apologizers you have a right to do so. but don't blame others by cherry-picking one statement that you claim to be untrue out of a 40 minute segment.

[@StudyBuddy-jj5pb]

Damn, that background Ben is AAA+ tier.

[@MrCallmebaldy]

It should be an Israeli flag cause that’s his first loyalty

[@Sabad5115]

​@@MrCallmebaldyYou are so bright

[@MrCallmebaldy]

@@Sabad5115 notice you didn’t say I was wrong

[@Sinaimedve007]

An amazing episode and sound for reason. Neall Ferguson is spot on!

[@zboy2020vision]

I don’t know how anyone can watch Tucker or take him seriously after he was caught on a hot mic admitting he didn’t believe a word of anything he says and that his fans are idiots. This spiral his last year isn’t surprising he’s always been a grifter now he doesn’t have fox to fully control him and he’s gone super grift

[@ddoghfx]

I watched the whole Tucker interview with Darryl Cooper, and then I re-watched certain sections a second time and a third time. Admittedly I would have never watched the video if it hadn't caused such a furor. When he started talking about Churchill and WW II I couldn't believe my ears. I'll come back to that. It has been suggested that Tucker should be ashamed for platforming such an individual. It has also been repeated by many that he is not a real historian because he is not accredited. I disagree with the de-platforming idea. It is just a bad idea. Who gets to decide who gets a platform? Does Tucker have to know everything he is going to say before hand and then decide whether he will be afforded an opportunity to speak? In this case I do think Tucker knew ahead of time what his views on Churchill were. You can kill Tucker for that but I won't. (Really, the thing you should be most upset about is Tucker not pushing back at Cooper's most ridiculous statements.) Tucker has some strange views and he can be inconsistent - you know, like any person, especially Churchill - but I always believe Tucker makes a relevant contribution to the collective conversation we all enjoy. I have yet to find anyone I agree with on everything. He's not a real historian like, say, Niall Ferguson. I'm a fan of Mr. Ferguson, big fan. The idea that only accredited historians have a contribution to make is ridiculous. If you did that you'd be missing out on a lot. History more than most subjects is wide open to amateurs. There are fields where I want to know someone has basic accreditation but history is not one of them and I am an INTENSE CONSUMER of history. If we left history to accredited historians that did not run afoul of the official narrative we would get boring re-hashing of the same ideas with no intense investigations. It would all be pre-approved by the left wing academic institutions. Most people do not get a PhD in history and pursue that career path. Lovers of history find jobs and in a wide array of fields and keep returning to the well of history at their pleasure throughout the course of their lives. Even if you have a PhD the topic is too vast and varied to be an expert on everything or even that much of the potential material. In fact amateurs who focus in on specific areas with great intensity have a lot to offer to the field. Tucker did call Mr. Cooper the greatest American historian (or something like that) which I found over the top. Tucker has been known to go over the top a time or two. That might be an understatement. I'm an adult, I can sift through stuff and decide what I think is useful or insightful and what I think is fluff, exaggeration or just plain wrong. De-platforming is not the correct answer. Mr. Cooper gave an insight on his process of trying to see history through the eyes of all the major players on many sides. That is a healthy way to approach history and mirrors what I try to do when I view history. But you can go too far and lose the thread. Suggesting that Churchill was the villain is so ridiculous I can't even fathom how he got there. His explanations are not only wanting they make me question his judgement and whether he was following his own rules. After I watched the interview I wanted to get a transcript so that I could parse it more easily. Unfortunately it was behind Tucker's paywall. Too bad. The ad hominem attacks on Churchill point to a bias that beggars the mind. Even the most ardent fans of Churchill - like myself - concede that he was an unusual and imperfect man who made lots of mistakes. Truly, would you or anyone else survive the scrutiny if people knew everything you ever did or thought. The stories about Churchill are legendary but he wasn't an authoritarian, mass murdering dictator like a couple world leaders from that era we could mention. Cooper called him a psychopath. Strangely - and I never thought I would say this a decade ago - there are some parallels between Trump and Churchill. (Lots of differences too.) Both men were/are narcissistic. Both men would throw out some crazy ideas. Both men would allow their craziest ideas to be reigned in by the people around them indicating the ability to listen to reason. Both men exhibited a kind of courage that was unusual. Both men understood how to deal with the true dictators. Both men were upper class but not always embraced within their class because they chose to forcefully present their vision rather than parrot the party line. The idea that Churchill refused Hitler's peaceful overtures in 1940 and continued the war for personal glorification is insane. Trusting Hitler would have been the height of idiocy. This is not a mere policy disagreement. The freedom of the British people, all European peoples in fact, hinged on Churchill's obstinance in the face of Halifax and Chamberlain wanting to negotiate peace. If Churchill had succumbed - as Cooper suggests that he should have - it is very possible that Hitler could have succeeded in winning his war in the east. What would have happened after that when Nazi Germany held all of Europe. Churchill did not trust Hitler and had no reason to trust him. But it wasn't just Hitler he didn't trust. He tried very hard to keep France in the war. When France capitulated Churchill did not sit on his hands. He sent a naval force to Mers-el-Kabir on July 3rd, 1940. There was a large French naval force there that, if captured by the Axis, could threaten Britain. It could have been changed the balance of naval power and threatened Britain's survival. The French were offered four alternatives which were all rejected. Instead French Admiral Darlan promised the ships would not fall into Axis hands. Not good enough. The British opened fire on the French navy, only a week after the French surrender where they had been fighting alongside the French. (The French responded by bombing Gibralter. No one ever talks about this episode in WW II. They should.) Promises were not enough for Churchill. Reminds me of "trust but verify." Cooper made it sound like killing people in the east was just a case of bad planning by the Nazis. Wow! And Jeffrey Dahmer only ate people because he couldn't get to the grocery store by closing time. The Nazis failed to plan for winter in the Soviet Union and left their men without winter coats. They made lots of mistakes. So did we. Bad planning is part of every war, it does not excuse mass murder on an industrial scale. I wonder how many million slavs would have died if Hitler had won in the east. Over the course of ten years it would surely have dwarfed what actually did happen. I have a hard time believing that anyone who seems as detail oriented as Mr. Cooper could gloss over all of Nazi ideology by just saying that Trotsky was gone and maybe Hitler had a change of heart about invading Russia if just Churchill had just knuckled under. I could go on and on but I won't. Mr. Cooper's talk about Jonestown was interesting. There were a lot of things there that jibed with what I know of Jones but he did seem to give Jones a pass too. Considering what I heard in his WW II comments I am scared to put any stock in his evaluation of Jonestown. I know nothing of what he says about the Palestinian conflict. Part of me wants to know but one thing for sure is that I would have a hard time taking it seriously.

[@debbiestyer453]

Thank you ..well said

[@purdyday2195]

Very well said and thank you for expanding on the history. Sunlight is indeed the best disinfectant.

[@Narcil]

Excellent reply. You’re really hit the nail on the head. The problem with Cooper, who clearly has spent a tremendous amount of time studying history, is that he seems to have swallowed German propaganda entirely uncritically, while utterly dismissing the nuance and difficultly behind the wartime decisions made by the Allies facing that existential threat to the West. And that makes people wonder, “What ideas does Cooper subscribe to that would make him do that?” None of us can come up with any explanations that makes sense other than ugly ones.

[@neodutch]

This video is a feelings based presentation. Just deliver the facts and rebutt the discussion point by point.

[@SallyAlmito]

Exactly. Also, how is regurgitating German propaganda a thought crime but doing the same thing with British propaganda isn’t? I don’t have to like Churchill or Hitler. I shouldn’t have to pick a side. + We deserve to hear both sides of the story, esp after 80 something years after the war.

[@nigelw7626]

That's exactly what the actual Historian did. Did it hurt your feelings?

[@lohi172]

This episode proves why I love Ben. Even if he has some bias, say Israel, with some issues, I respect that he is passionate and willing to make a statement. Compare this video to what Michael Knowles put out about the Tucker interview. Michael, of course, had a vague, contrarian take that’s different than all or most of the other conservatives. Michael we’ll still love you , it’s ok to say “it’s ok to go with the mainstream sometimes and admit Tucker’s guest was wildly misinformed.”

[@John-bravooo]

Um where is he wrong about Israel?

[@sachinmistry1]

Churchill allowed a famine in Bengal that killed almost 4 million people.

[@kylendmiller]

Don't talk about that. Shhhh. You can't say that.

[@Aiphiae]

Agreed the interview was a mess but we've gotta be honest here: Immigration in the UK is a *massive* problem and it *IS* causing a host of issues that native born Britons never asked for.

[@chrisspencer6502]

Is Ben throwing a tantrum again about facts hurting his feelings

[@giltuito1545]

No. He's debunking crap by neo Nazis, as he should

[@AyatollahS.A.Khamenei]

RIP to Daryl Cooper, the worlds greatest historian will never recover after this dismantling of his blogspot

[@kathleenkahl]

Don’t look now but this mob attack has made his podcast number one. His subtract had huge bump of paid subscribers. Perhaps after they lied to us for 4 years about a cold vireos now want to research all sides. It’s called a red pill for a reason

[@AyatollahS.A.Khamenei]

@@kathleenkahl the world is in love with idiocy, it always has been…popularity is no argument lol

[@giltuito1545]

​@@kathleenkahlpopularity is not an argument, people love outrageous dummies.. but he isn't taken seriously by serious people (Tucker doesn't qualify anymore) and never will be

[@brandonbentley5453]

Everyone caved into Hitler and the Nazi party. Madison Square garden hosted a huge Nazi rally. Chamberlain caved into Hitler after Hitler literally wrote in Mein Kampf that he would sign any treaty and use ay diplomatic tool he could to gain power. The British Royale family was literally half German and were completely Nazi sympathizers. Parliament and European countries all had deep trading and political ties to Germany. Churchill was the one who stood up and called everyone out. FDR only entered the US into the war after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor in retaliation to the US aiding China(which is a breach of neutrality). Then after the war all the top Nazi leaders except Goering(he got bogged down trying to get all his stole loot our of Europe) and Hess(attempted to defect to England) got away, about 9000 of them, not some small handful. Remember, governments didn't stop evil, the righteous people did. The greatest generation did. 😊

[@rebelmango2141]

Remember the population was against joining until Pearl Harbor which is why FDR didn't because isolation by America First with Henry Ford were popular so it was government having hand tied by the people

[@el_killorcure]

Unfortunately Churchill and FDR/Truman stopped the evil of Nazism while saving a worse evil: Stalin and Communism. It's like budding into Alien VS Predator only to save the Alien. All of the world lost because of that (Marxism is stronger today than ever, while Nazism would not have outlived Hitler himself).

[@el_killorcure]

Churchill and FDR/Truman stopped the evil of Nazism while saving a worse evil: Stalin and Communism. It's like budding into Alien VS Predator only to save the Alien. All of the world lost because of that (Marxism is stronger today than ever, while Nazism would not have outlived Chaplin's evil twin himself).

[@NikitasVenizelos-e7g]

So 80 million people died in WW2, right? Is it fair to say it literally could not have gone worse? If we can start there, challenging how each leader handled it gets much more interesting. And if it were not for the Soviet Union, the war would much, much different. Far too much credit goes to Churchill, who was despised in England before the war after being humiliated in WW1, who was a vicious racist, and who did not consider human life valuable. He wanted to save his historical reputation, and congratulations to him, he definitely did that.

[@w.c.4818]

@@brandonbentley5453 so why didn't Churchill and the so called "righteous" people didn't accept the jews when Hitler asked them to take the jews in? Churchill repeatedly rejected the migration of the jews from Germany to England.

[@Mr.Sophisticvtion]

I first challenge Ben and Niall to listen to the entire podcast between Tucker and Daryl Cooper. I second challenge them to read the book “Churchill, Hitler, and ‘The Unnecessary War’” by Patrick J. Buchanan. I thirdly challenge them to read the book “Bloodlands” by Timothy Snyder. Cooper nor Carlson were endorsing any of the atrocities committed by Germans or the Soviet’s. They in fact condemned them quite clearly. One question I would like answered from Ferguson is how exactly Hitler could have threatened the English mainland or the English empires possessions with total subjugation?

[@Mendelmandela]

Was the first world war mainly a containment of Germany policy?? Was there a containment of Germany strategy by the united kingdom?? Was the treaty of Versailles deliberately designed to destroy Germany industrially ??

[@LatestMerch]

“It says here in this history book that luckily, the good guys have won every single time. What are the odds?” -Norm MacDonald

[@assafelron1]

You know historians are basing their books on historic evidence right? and WW2 has a huge amount of it... documents, fillms from that time, newspaprs and more, and all of them point to Hitler being a fricking monster.

[@taylorlibby7642]

Luck had sweet fa to do with it.

[@ultramagahoosierhermit2767]

Norm obviously didn't read much

[@LatestMerch]

@@ultramagahoosierhermit2767 May be he sensed the propaganda from a mile.

[@emotional_anarchist]

👏👏👏

[@justinkenny6992]

London seems really nice.. for Muslims.

[@mattboyer3385]

@@justinkenny6992 And America is even worse for the descdents of the founding stock

[@CynicalNurse54]

Eye- opening! Thank you for having this conversation!

[@ToriHalfon]

I always hated Tucker C. Proud to say I’ve never watched or listened to a single episode. The political “horseshoe” where the two extremes almost meet both have antisemitism in their core beliefs.

[@konnan442]

People have to remember, history is always written by the victors. Being a historian, is the same thing as being a climate scientists. The results are based on what the beneficiary wants them to be. You paint a picture based on the good, while ignoring the bad.

[@adrianryan5654]

Sure but that doesn’t automatically mean the history is fundamentally wrong. And comparing this to climate science is pejorative. Mainstream climate science is not scientifically and data driven, it is ideologically, politically and fake model driven. Just because the powers that be today (fascistic powers) are pushing anti science propaganda does not mean that the line can be extended back to those who were in power in the 1930/40s. One can be against Covid policy, Climate alarmist, Wokeness, unfettered immigration and simultaneous hold fast to Western values as exhibited by the people of the 1930/40s who stood up against fascism and later Marxism, both fascistic in nature and both responsible for massive human oppression, misery and death. If you are heading to the extremes of anything you are heading the wrong way. I will leave the last word to George Orwell, which effectively describes both the Woke extreme left and the emerging history revisionists extreme right, and both are, it seems to me, unwittingly working for the oligarchs: “The most effective way to destroy people is to deny and obliterate their own understanding of their history.” ― George Orwell “Power is in tearing human minds to pieces and putting them together again in new shapes of your own choosing.” ― George Orwell, 1984 “Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.” ― George Orwell, 1984

[@user-wj6dt5bq3w]

@@adrianryan5654 Britain and France didn't enter WW2 to defend Western values. Not sure where you got such an idea, both nations were simply opposed to Germany altering the balance of power on the European continent.

[@adrianryan5654]

@@user-wj6dt5bq3w I didn’t say they did but they were seeking to defend their democracies against totalitarian fascism.

[@erictaylor4937]

Cooper literally never said Hitler was right.... talk about a straw man

[@luthasunspell8365]

Asked if he would rather Hitler had won and totally conquered Europe on X, Cooper replied “I can’t imagine anything worse happening than what did happen.” Meaning, he would prefer Hitler had won over the Allies.