Why are Kim and Jimmy Going after Howard? | Better Call Saul Season 6

[@PetePeppers1]

There's some interesting stuff going on with Kim's motivations here. Let me know what you think. If you haven't seen my episode 5 preview video you can watch it here - kzbin.info/www/bejne/anzVdWZtlJl2idk Live stream will be on Tuesday this week.

[@jUppers]

All I know is that Howard deserves this revenge from Jimmy 100% Howard saying he needs help, after for so many years he was a lapdog to Chuck, is just fake. Even if he doesn't realize it, but concern coming from Howard for Jimmy is extremely virtuous. He should have had concern for Jimmy when he didn't hire him because of Chuck. Maybe this is why Kim is so pissed. Howard has done nothing but play into Chuck's evil sabotage, and Kim proper hates Chuck given to how she reacts to the tape confrontation in Chuck's house, and now Howard is the one telling her that Jimmy needs help. There were many opportunities to help Jimmy, and Howard blocked ALL OF THEM, along with Chuck. And now he wants to play the nice, concerned, good guy?? like stfu Howard pls. Is probably what Kim is thinking

[@bryce5739]

cant get enough of the BCS content! excited for tomorrows episode! will you be streaming with 1take this week?

[@Lance-Oakland]

I think we’ll find out that Howard and Kim dated at some point.

[@dondakota920]

Seems likely Kim is going to divorce him and perhaps blackmail him. She wants the money.

[@bryce5739]

@@jUppers facts

[@douglaswarden2584]

I think we ALL can agree that Patrick Fabian does a GREAT job playing Howard Hamlin. GREAT character....well played. IMO.

[@GiftSparks]

Agee- just because you would not choose to have someone as a friend doesn’t mean they are evil. Howard tries to do the right thing within the constraints he finds himself. I mean, he did offer Jimmy a job. He is not really an antagonist, which is why it is hard to have sympathy with Jimmy and Kims machinations against him.

[@GodOfVictory501]

Agreed. Patrick Fabian does a great job conveying Howard's waspy, effete, rather rarefied personality. At the same time Howard inspires some sympathy which, again, is a credit to Patrick's performance.

[@PetePeppers1]

Yeah, he does such a great job. At the beginning of 604, there's a shot of him locking his car door remotely before going into his session, and it's just a perfect encapsulation of who the character is.

[@Coolness18304]

it's pretty good, but I think it's the writing and directing that really makes him shine

[@BooksForever]

Patrick Fabian’s stitched-up buttoned-down portrayal of Howard is the perfect counterpoint to Jimmy’s style of lawyering. We need this contrast to fully appreciate Jimmy/Saul.

[@Hitman61547]

I'm still team Howard. He's no Angel, he's no devil, he's just a man. A privileged man, but a man who busts his ass and was trying to reach out and right his past wrongs. After Chuck died he was depressed and the firm was in dire straits. Jimmy gave him the kick he needed and after the time skip it's doing some of it's best business ever. He tries to help Jimmy and starts getting messed with. That being said I do like the symmetry of Howard being a reluctant participant in keeping Jimmy down alongside Chuck and Jimmy being a reluctant participant in bringing Howard down alongside Kim.

[@Enja___]

I feel like Howard is the only thing that might remind Jimmy of Chuck Maybe he just never stuck with the guy. We all know that but the reasoning could be different

[@suenebototon8287]

I’m guessing Jimmy hated the fact that therapy actually ended up well for Howard, both mentally and professionally, despite his severe guilt over the part he potentially played in Chuck’s suicide.

[@zhehaoshen3635]

you sound like him. I imagine that you are no Angel, no devil, just a man. A privileged man, but a man who busts his ass and see good in people who are like you. I'm team you.

[@sivad1025]

I agree. Kim seems much more emotionally involved in this whole thing because Howard was more directly involved in keeping her down. It feels like a grudge at this point

[@Enja___]

@@sivad1025 definitely, as mentioned in the video, she got immediately pissed off at the idea of Jimmy swaying her in her carrier, and Howard making her seem as manipulated completely triggered her to go against him

[@mrbrainchild7637]

Howard did not deserve that level of revenge. Completely insane. Watching this, I have zero remorse for Saul Goodman and the karma he received.

[@AverageAlien]

I swear he was gonna be that taxi driver from the flash forwards

[@zak35189]

Me too ...i m sort of wishing Lalo does something terrible to them

[@olemartinjansson2242]

Exactly! Both Saul and Walter has similar character arcs in their respective shows where they’re both breaking bad. When we meet Saul in BB he’s already broken bad and through 6 seasons of BCS we see just how it unfolded. Two masterpieces of shows

[@RP-mp4ow]

Throwing bowling balls on his car was already a level of revenge that was distasteful. But I've liked Howard from the beginning and think everything he did in the show had suitable justifications

[@anacarolmsc]

nor Kim

[@steadyjumper3547]

"Jimmy I'm sorry you're in pain" line sticks with me. He really cared.

[@ebutuoy2565]

I thought it was condescending

[@arunosborn3169]

@@ebutuoy2565 can be both

[@LilTitoJr]

@@arunosborn3169 condisencing care would be pity

[@arunosborn3169]

@@LilTitoJr true true

[@Proud_Troll]

I HATE THIS SHOW. IT AGGRAVATES ME TO MY CORE.

[@internziko]

The moment they revealed that Howard wanted to hire Jimmy but Chuck didn't let him was when i started to like Howard and he's made some statements that i really agree with. I'm really hoping that nothing too bad happens to him.

[@radicalxg8282]

This is the breaking bad universe we talking about sometimes good people doesnt stand a chance hope he survives somehow this whole ordeal

[@sventibaldo]

There is no way that poor Howard won't end up completely ruined and maybe even dead by suicide before the end of this show. But, hopefully those two evil psychopaths will pay for what they've done. Crossing my finger for Kim to be kidnapped, tortured and killed by the Cartel and for Jimmy to find her dismembered body in a suitcase...it would be so rewarding

[@gaybowser4967]

Considering all of the good guys in Breaking Bad came out severely mentally scarred, depressed or dead (admittedly Badger and Jo made it through but they were minor enough to not warrant inspection and for all we know they could be in prison after El Camino) I highly doubt Howard is coming out of this in a good position in the slightest. If not dead or with a ruined reputation then something even worse that could ruin him mentally... maybe even going out like his old friend Edit: so coming back to this... I was right... ffs this aged terribly.

[@theendofconfusion]

I'm sorry.

[@FutaYuuta]

OOF

[@grey-spark]

Walt: "I'm doing this for my family." Rejects Elliots offer. Cooks meth. Kim: "I'm doing this for those in need." Rejects Cliff's offer. Proceeds with con.

[@alexcorll90]

Spot on comparison. It's not about money, it's about pride for them, narcissism probably.

[@realadex9655]

Walt and Jimmy... nice comparison in BB context

[@Nodiril]

Did she really reject his offer?

[@emilmaze]

@@Nodiril not yet and honestly i don't think she will. she seemed very pleased that cliff went for it. doesn't mean it'll work out though. I'd speculate it all goes crumbling down later in the season

[@grey-spark]

@@Nodiril the moment she sent the text, yes. She put it in jeopardy.

[@shaider1982]

After episode 7, we can all agree that Jimmy and Kim went too far.

[@sanskargatla3263]

True that

[@klamur7433]

It is just a prank bro

[@codylebleu951]

When is episode 8

[@codylebleu951]

@@UltraIbuprofen thank you

[@jongrouper4814]

Nope

[@samk.4158]

I'm actually rooting for Howard. He doesnt deserve any of this, he is positive, has a good moral compass and a good work ethic. Kim and saul are out of line

[@christopherpowers3672]

100%

[@ivannunez8738]

No, he was a bas tard with kim and saul in the early season. The manipulative narrative have results i guess.

[@TV-ob1if]

I didn’t like how he treated Kim in the first season but he’s more than paid his penance for his arrogant behavior. I’ve switched to support him by season 6

[@samk.4158]

@@TV-ob1if how did he treat kim badly again? I forgot

[@thomasb.900]

Rip

[@memeteam2016]

The funny thing is, I don't think Jimmy truly enjoys his schemes because he always feels remorse. He only does them when they benefit him - the ends justify the means. However, Kim seems to genuinely enjoy the scheming. You can see it on Jimmy's face how he is scared of her when she takes a sadistic pleasure in hurting people because even though he has no moral qualms about doing it, it's never been about pleasure for him.

[@eugger3011]

I think Jimmy DID enjoy scheming people, but only when they deserved it. However, he doesn't fully believe Howard deserves everything that's coming to him. at least not to the extent that Kim does.

[@EpicGamer-fl7fn]

yeah like with the Kettlemans, i was actually just as surprised and scared of her as Jimmy was at that moment. Kettlemans were assholes but they got what they deserved, and Kim did them really dirty and could potentially ruin them for good. Even what Saul has did to them back at the start wasnt as fucked up, considering he still got them a way out, but this was straight up malicious. She's more of a Saul Goodman than Jimmy is.

[@healthinspector4827]

​@@EpicGamer-fl7fn true man, but i think she is not saul goodman, i think that kim is way far worse than saul himself. She is the true time bomb and the Jimmy mcgill that we see un breaking bad is the ashes that leave that explosion.

[@donnahickman9350]

No. They are completely the same. They feed off of each other. They both enjoy it.

[@ArlenString]

That is very true. Jimmy even goes back few times and confess that hes the one responsible so the people dont feel bad. He did it with Chuck, Irene etc. He doesnt enjoy peoples suffering when they arent guilty.

[@utopicus]

No spoilers here. But I guess we can all agree now that we wished they would have just left Howard alone.

[@queenicedcoffee4217]

They're both children in adult bodies.

[@romulus_]

I think Howard is a very capable lawyer despite the nepotism factor. Chuck wouldn't respect him if he wasn't.

[@Ballislife32]

Chuck liked him, but because he could control him. Not an ounce of respect imo

[@ashutoshtripathi.]

Yeah I can't recall a single place where Chuck seems to be respecting him.

[@junglie2]

Howard is a shitty lawyer but a great salesman.

[@romulus_]

@@ashutoshtripathi. They co-manage a respected firm that's worth millions of dollars. Chuck wouldn't do that if he didn't trust and respect his partner's acumen.

[@blankname6629]

I think jimmy and Kim would not go after him if they knew what the audience knows about his home life. His life is actually pretty sad despite all of the work success he has.

[@petterblakk]

I understand why they go after Howard, but he definetly doesn't deserve losing everything.

[@barbaraludwiczak4728]

Yes, but, unfortunately... deserves got nothing to do with it

[@BennyGLikeKennyG]

It’s because he’s a walking oxymoron, he works as a lawyer, one of the most detailed and REAL lines of work, yet Howard is only a face, he has no dreams, he has no future plans. Lawyers deal in the real practical world

[@theawaitinggargoyle]

Yes, he does because he gives out false hope.

[@friedice6535]

This is Kim's. Saul decided it was not worth it to go after Howard but Kim wanted it. Their plan to ruin Howard's career could succeed but also could go extremely wrong in the sense that it may add up to his personal issues (remember he goes to therapy due to his marriage crisis) and he could fall in a bad depression and maybe take his life thinking he lost everything. Well, I hope it doesnt go this way.

[@jdb3160]

Homeboy messed with the bull now hes getting the horns.

[@phillipbradshaw4006]

I’m going to disagree that Howard is not remarkable. The level of loyalty he showed to Chuck is remarkable. The vast majority of people in Howard situation, presented with a partner that could no longer be able to fulfill his duties, would have pushed him out. Written a fat check and washed hands his of him. But that’s not what Howard did. He did everything he could to look after him, fulfill his every need, in the vain hope that one day he would get better and return to the company. Howard is remarkable. Not perfect, but better than most.

[@Ekinlabberer]

The firm wouldn't have been able to buy out chuck. Chuck didnt want to leave and would have had legal actions against hhm. Writing the big fat check is exactly what Howard did in the End and it made Chuck kill himself. Having Chuck kinda work there was nice of him but also the best decision Business wise. (And his payment wasn't that high)

[@sallyatticum]

@@Ekinlabberer It also constituted fraud on the insurance company, which is how Jimmy got Chuck into trouble. They also didn't inform the State Bar of just how impaired and unfit Chuck was.

[@phillipbradshaw4006]

@@Ekinlabberer if you make a profit, you can always get a loan. They are a law firm so getting sued is in their wheelhouse. Chuck’s mental illness is what caused Chuck to commit suicide. The legal community is an open society, eventually everybody knows everything that is going on (see last episode of BCS) and once Jimmy exposed Chuck in open court, his value to the firm would diminish rapidly.

[@misselanys1219]

@@Ekinlabberer GMAB. Howard did those things for Howard not for Chuck. Hiding Chucks illness from clients was already malpractice. The insurance company coming into it was the tipping point. If Howard cared about Chuck so much he would have told him that retiring was in the best interests of Chuck not being sued for malpractice and savingbthe firm. Instead he threatened him whichbChuck threatened back. What you were seeing were two cobras attacking each other from two separate baskets.

[@sammiller6631]

@@Ekinlabberer No, the battery in Chicanery is what made Chuck kill himself, since his reputation was shattered by his brother from the look on the tribunal judges faces. Chuck felt his mom loved Jimmy more. His wife divorced him. Now the only people left who respected him now pity him.

[@kjellolofsson6766]

Totally disagree about Howard not being a 'remarkable' lawyer. Look at the latest episode where Erin was losing the goodwill of the Sandpiper residents who were losing patience with the timescale of the case. Within 1 minute Howard had turned things around and had re-won their trust in HHM/Curtis Main. He is a highly competent and experienced solicitor with great people skills IMO.

[@michaelpromislow844]

It seems he is doing that for himself. Erin had their interests. Howard's interest seemed to only be maximizing his fees.

[@sudo1500]

its like what jimmy said in s4 i think, 'youre a shitty lawyer but a great salesman'

[@Aace00]

He's highly charismatic, which is what is needed to run a law firm and retain clients. Not to mention I'm sure he does well in front of a jury.

[@Flexb123]

Like Jimmy said, he's not a great lawyer but he is a great salesman.

[@Flexb123]

@@sudo1500 haha I just posted this and saw yours right after. dead on the money and Jimmy is right, atleast about Howard being a great salesman

[@mrdraper4633]

I love the scenes with Howard. I also find myself defending him, constantly. He IS one hell of a guy with much integrity and character and Jimmy, who is almost always an ass, really misdirects misguided rage against Howard

[@akinsides]

yes but that doesnt explain why kim is so desperate for howards demise to the point where shed rather ruin howard than accept cliffords offer by skipping the meeting. additionally, jimmy appears to feel remorse unlike kim for howard, something we dont see often. at the hotel, jimmy seemed like he wanted to pull back and was questioning the morality of it all meanwhile kim was eager and very ready to ruin howard. same thing with the kettlemans, jimmy didnt want to use kims method of blackmail and was trying to convince them with 'the carrot'. kim on the other hand had no hesitation to use 'the stick' as soon as she saw that jimmys plan was failing. this whole howard situation is not so much about jimmy, but more about kim as we see from the flashbacks. i still do agree that jimmy was a bit of an ass towards howard and does have something to do with whatever the two are doing but we wont know till next episode. i am so ready for this mid-season finale and to finally see the culmination of the last 6 episodes.

[@RIP123]

F

[@jongrouper4814]

Integrity? And what about the speech he gave the old people, lying to them about how holding out for more money was in their best interest? They’ll all be dead by the time the case is over. He’s a scumbag

[@andrehb]

I have a bit of experience working in a 'prestige' law firm like HHM. For the commenters that say Howard is unremarkable, imo, this is what makes this character ring so *true* -- a partner at a prestige law firm doesn't need to have a "brilliant" legal mind, he or she just needs to be very capable, thorough, responsive, and have a confident way of dealing with high-value clients. As we evaluate Kim and Jimmy's actions, I don't think the creators of BCS intended Howard's qualities as a lawyer to be a factor in assessing those actions. He's human: he's gonna have his blind spots -- but beyond that, he's a fairly decent guy, all things considered.

[@sappho114]

I'm a big Howard Hamlin fan still, tbh. Patrick Fabian brings such a genuine charisma to the character that when Howard says he's trying to do the right thing - and make amends - I wholeheartedly believe it. Jimmy's backtalk and rebuttal and misdirected rage at someone who could've bonded over losing a complex touchstone like Chuck seems karmic enough as of S6. Anything more at this point just feels cruel. I feel like Kim has a much more substantial beef with Howard, but also Howard's main weakness was trusting Chuck, and following his lead. I mean, he's not a sparkly clean angel but as a man he's doing more to better himself than anyone else in the story. I also know that Kim is capable enough - and smart enough - to have settled her beef like an adult. Or a complicated civil lawsuit, if she wanted her pound of flesh. Pretty sure she could've hurt HHM's reputation pretty soundly by airing all that dirty laundry, or by threatening to.

[@rickhill3071]

Howard is a good guy for sure. But the biggest mistake from Howard and Jimmy is not having Chuck committed. Given Chuck's "condition" it was more than completely justified. In that sense it was an act of selfishness to not do so. And maybe Chuck would have gotten better and the end result would have been far better for all. Instead was a kharmic impact to HHM as a result of Chuck's condition (and a better show to watch - lol).

[@psychoticdaizyproductions569]

@@rickhill3071 heavy. That was a perspective I didn't take as heavily until you mentioned it.

[@anthonyg5805]

too bad he’s dead now

[@Epicgye]

*gets shot in head by lalo*

nice pfp, freak

[@LtFoodstamp]

What I love about this show is that the characters (protagonists) have a clear motivation based on their experiences, but the audience doesn't feel the same way. We still root for them, but also don't agree. That's a tough thing to pull off in a show.

[@darksideishere]

I root for jimmy in general but not when it comes to jimmyVhamlin.

[@julieanne190]

I have stopped rooting for Kim and Saul. By early to mid-final season of Breaking Bad, I almost couldn't tolerate watching Walter White anymore and hoped for his demise and/or death. I feel the same about Kim now. I technically do about Saul as well, but knowing his Breaking Bad future, I have to hope there is something they will do to him in the post-Breaking Bad timeline. With Nacho dead, the only character I root for is Howard, and they'll probably kill him off or otherwise destroy him.

[@Sanguinnius]

I don't root Jimmy and kim tbh when they do some stupid shit in the name of "helping people" but in reality ruining a completely innocent man,who tried to help them most of the times

[@wyskass861]

@@julieanne190 That's ides of this whole series, lest we forget. They ask us to root for who would objectively be the bad guys.

[@julieanne190]

@@wyskass861 That's what I'm struggling with though. They are managing to turn it in such a direction that I eagerly desire their demise. I liked Saul in Breaking Bad. My son, who has seen both series, tells me that Saul was evil in BB, worse than he is so far in BCS. Technically, I know that, but maybe it's seeing behind the scenes the way they plot, the way they see themselves as not sociopaths, not wicked (as Kim asked Jimmy when he made that one remark), as championing the pro bono clients. It's gross. I loved "The Godfather" I and II and even was okay with III more than the critics, (though it wasn't great). I could root for Michael Corleone more than Kim and Saul. Some how the writers have made them (and Walt) more disgusting to me than a ruthless Mafia don.

[@thatone3270]

Fuck, not only was jimmy responsible for Howard’s death, but him and Kim made his last few hours alive a living hell

[@wyskass861]

This whole series including Breaking Bad, puts the bad guys as protagonists, and asks us to work out where our sympathies lie, because we experience them. But looking at it objectively, there was no right justification for ruining Howards life. I think a lesson here is that when we spend enough time with someone, we tend to side with them despite their wrongs. The tribe is more important that objective good. While these shows are entertaining, they are a serious look at morality and emotionally punishing.

[@423985728945]

@@wyskass861 yes, great comment

[@brucegevirtzman8703]

@@wyskass861 Terrific comment.

[@Sunking210]

Even now, after the series finale and much better hindsight, Howard Hamlin absolutely did not deserve any of the shit Kim and Saul did to him. It's that same stigma we all went through in Breaking Bad where we start off rooting for the underdog main character, but then we gradually see their descent into their natural villain role. Jimmy was obviously not a good guy and there is nothing wrong with liking him, however imagine if he were a real person conning you instead. You'd hate the ever living hell out of him. It's exactly why he ends up in prison in the end to live the remainder of his life locked away, and even though he could've served a much lesser sentence, we all know he was due for a harsher punishment despite his charm and overall likability as a character.

[@xStanyyx]

After Nachos death happening in Ep 3 already I was like: jesus they really wanna bash on Howard for the rest of the final season? What the hell could be so important that they dedicate the hole season to moking Howard? Well what a way to end the Howard storyline. Howard did not deserve any of this bs. Nether did anyone else Jimmy hurt on his way.

[@gammaanteria]

Has anyone mentioned the similarity between Kim’s “it may damage him [Howard] but it won’t destroy him” and Walter’s “I knew how much to make him [Brock] sick but he’s alive isn’t he?” I guess the difference being Kim and Jimmy are co-conspiring, whereas Walter hid what he did from his partner. Also ironic that they (Kim and Walter) are rationalizing ‘half-measures’ solutions! 😀

[@megamcgee]

I’m curious what you mean by a half measure solution for Kim

[@gammaanteria]

@@megamcgee 'Half-measure' maybe not the most accurate choice of wording, but I just meant it in the sense of: 'I/we don't have to go all the way, we'll just do enough to be effective and then stop...' (This is probably a way of minimizing and rationalizing to herself the wrongdoing they are scheming against Howard, to make it easier to proceed with it...)

[@andrewgarfield9898]

I think comparing what Kim and Jimmy are doing to Walt poisoning a literal child is a bit of a stretch

[@megamcgee]

@@gammaanteria I see what you’re saying, but I’m not sure stealing a car, dressing up and framing Howard for abusing a sex worker is “just enough” 😅

[@richiecomia3696]

@@andrewgarfield9898 Dude. LOVED your acting in "No Way Home."

[@TomboTime]

I feel so bad for Howard. He is not nearly the villain everyone in the show makes him out to be. His only crime is being loyal to the wrong person, and why wouldn't he be? Chuck built his company with his father: of COURSE he's gonna see him as the pinnacle of right. But he's not so delusional that he never tried to set things right with Jimmy. When it comes down to it, none of the hate towards Howard is justified.

[@ertfgghhhh]

Everybody on the show is a serious villain...

[@moni1383]

You forgot how he treated Kim at HHM? Treating her like a slave in doc review AFTER she brought a huge client, Mesa Verde? And then stealing MV when she finally quit? For that alone he deserves a kick in the .... He absolutely thinks he's a great and "spiritual" guy but he's a buffoon (that NAMASTE plate).

[@John_Fx]

@@moni1383 that is normal at a law firm.

[@John_Fx]

Who is thinking he is a villain?

[@Matthias27182]

I'd also like to point out that it's not only understandable why Howard stayed loyal to Chuck til the end, but a great character trait of his. He and Chuck had the longest friendship, so it's good that he didn't start taking other people's words or siding with others over Chuck. Howard didn't know how bad of a brother and human being Chuck was to Jimmy behind the scenes, and it could be seen as respectful for him to have not pried into what he assumed were family matters. Finally, while he had a great deal of respect for his long friendship with Chuck, Howard was never blinded by this to the point where he wouldn't listen to reason. Howard respected Chuck more than anybody in the show, but even he knew when to take a step back out of concern for his friend's mental wellbeing, despite ultimately severing ties with him in the end.

[@Marcodin84]

Howard is the character with the most integrity in the show, maybe he doesn't understand everything at first, but he's willing to change

[@Marcodin84]

I just changed my mind on Howard seeing how he buttered the retired home clients... :( I guess everybody breaks bad in the show... :-D

[@Validity_TN]

@@Marcodin84 but at least, Howard never talked bad about anyone behind their back. Yeah, hes a greedy bastard, but at least he was trustable to his "friends".

[@jeanpaulsinatra]

I completely forgot about the Kettlemans by the time they came back. The real testament of Vince Gilligan's genius is that he created a fictional universe of freebooting sadist gangsters, ice cold psychopaths, paranoiac control freaks, and literal nazis, and make Betsy Kettleman more loathsome than all of them

[@Afflictamine]

neo nazis, not literal nazis

[@4EyedRocker]

At the end of the day we all hate karen

[@DennisNeijmeijer]

We don't usually associate with psycho's like Lalo, so it's more distant. That Betsy bitch is your neighbor, teacher or whatever Karen. And she's personal!

[@NikolaAvramov]

Well, she's more bloodthirsty than even Hector Salamanca. She just doesn't have his firepower.

[@jeanpaulsinatra]

@@NikolaAvramov Nacho: "I hate every one of you psycho sacks of shit" Betsy: "hm! Well we'll just see about that!"

[@juanjosetalerogarcia902]

Never thought this question will be answered by howard during a dramatic ending lol

[@T-roc57]

My guess would be the sandpiper deal...i don't think howard deserves any of that either but as to why that's the main reason.

[@laureanne3409]

Howard may not be a litigator and brilliant legal mind like Chuck, but he is probably the "rainmaker" for the firm, which is an essential and highly regarded role in a law firm.

[@glennjanot8128]

As Jimmy had said to him "You're a shitty lawyer, but you're a great salesman."

[@georgelionon9050]

@@glennjanot8128 Probably after his father, thats why they both were so successful, one the brilliant salesman the other the brilliant lawyer.

[@WillowJordan1979]

What's a "rainmaker"?

[@laureanne3409]

@@WillowJordan1979 A rainmaker is the person at the law firm who finds new clients. You might have heard the saying, "Make it rain."

[@glennjanot8128]

@@WillowJordan1979 In business, rainmakers are people who bring in new business or clients through their connections or their sheer skill in making deals. They make it rain money, hence the moniker

[@_barncat]

this entire series was casted so brilliantly

[@pwgdeathhawk8146]

From everything I’ve seen Howard has done nothing to deserve this treatment from Jimmy and Kim. He was a pawn used by Chuck to manipulate Jimmy, realised his mistakes and tried to make amends.

[@koolaidman6251]

Also Howard only fired Chuck because of what Jimmy and Kim did -- an elaborate, illegal scheme to make it look like Chuck is incompetent. Chuck's suicide is 100% on Jimmy and Kim.

[@DoomsdaySlayer]

Chuck knew him for who he truly was. He is a conman. Chuck may have been vengeful, but he was right about Jimmy. He does horrible things and tries to justify it.

[@r.patterson5426]

And Howard was the nicest person to Jimmy. When Chuck wanted to sue Jimmy, Howard was the one that tried to convince Chuck into not pursuing it. Kim and Jimmy are evil they are motivated by greed and their prides and they will hurt people just to get what they want.

[@butterdog2048]

I feel confident that howard will make a compromise with them, maybe show up to their house with a bottle of alcohol and have a chat. He'll land on his feet

[@brucegevirtzman8703]

Punk.

[@AverageAlien]

it's bizarre, because I thought the show hinted at him being the taxi driver far in the future when saul got a taxi home

[@JanisBebritis]

So much for landing on his feet... looked more like a face or something

[@mangcrow5738]

L

[@tinomen2657]

There's gotta be a turn in this situation. I've mentioned before that Kim and Jimmy are too smart to realize that Howard will eventually catch on to what's going on. It should be interesting to see how it plays out. Are they wanting Howard to find out for some reason? Or is Kim just so addicted to the schemes that she learned from Jimmy, that there is no stopping her? Who knows??

[@casc0006]

Chuck also prepared him for bar exam

[@HardcoreK1llar]

Kim definitely loves what she is doing, and that will be her downfall

[@tinomen2657]

@@HardcoreK1llar I kinda agree. I believe she was seduced by the schemes. Jimmy..after becoming a lawyer...used schemes to gain possible clients or get clients off. But Kim is using a scheme to destroy someone.

[@tinomen2657]

@@casc0006 chuck prepared who for the bar exam??? Jimmy took it 3 times on his own. And chuck hated Jimmy being a lawyer.

[@georgelionon9050]

@@casc0006 You mean Jimmy? No he did not.

[@gorgi__]

Howard is a chill dude, he doesn’t deserve anything

[@alandoane9168]

Namast3!

[@mangcrow5738]

L

[@neomilw4703]

There is a recurring trend in the Breaking Bad universe of people pretending to be something they are not, but it does not last forever. Kim is trying to be a good person but we see it’s not enough. She is Bonnie to Saul’s Clyde

[@schizoidtravis8116]

For me, the hate for Howard revolves around one of the messages the show conveys, “People don’t change”. The show doesn’t follow this message in a traditional sense it’s more like others won’t see you for who you are now, they’ll see you as you once were, “You’re Slippin Jimmy”, “You’re the type of Lawyer guilty people hire” there is probably more examples I can’t think of other than the ones that apply to Jimmy but I imagine that Jimmy and Kim can’t look beyond their initial thoughts of Howard, Kim only sees the boss that treated her wrong and without respect, Jimmy sees the asshole that didn’t hire him into HMM and while some things were cleared up like the reason why Howard didn’t hire Jimmy he still can’t look past on how he viewed Howard before, taking what he thought of him and still regarding it as true. It’s kind of Ironic that Howard’s true self is possibly one of the nicest character in the show yet he is getting treated the worst out of all of these characters who are seen through the “People don’t change” view and the worst he gets it from is Jimmy who suffers just as much as Howard which is again ironic.

[@GabesEdtiz]

Spot on analysis; you should write a whole paper on the show and it’s characters because I honestly don’t think anyone could have said it better

[@majik_man]

Honestly this was fascinating. I had totally forgot about child Kim 7:30. I feel Howard is getting judged a bit unfairly because he certainly attempted to atone for his behavior. It's interesting in real life they are all the best of friends and they lived together in a house off set for extended periods the three of them Bob, Patrick & Rhea. Howard's got an elitist vibe, but i sympathize for him some.

[@sammiller6631]

You sympathize for an elitist?

[@eugger3011]

@@sammiller6631 Yes. Howard may be elitist, but a lot of it has to do with him being the product of his upbringing. He tries to be a good person, but the problem is that his background keeps him out of touch with everyone else.

[@sventibaldo]

@@sammiller6631 OMG he sympathizes for an elitist! He needs to be cancelled in the name of equality!

[@sammiller6631]

@@sventibaldo elitism *is* cancelling. That's how elitism has worked for thousands of years.

[@TheDollyce]

Spot on! Thank you for delving into this subject! I kept wondering WHY as well! I was thinking "are these two people so bored that they just have to pull ridiculous Howard pranks?" So now I do understand the big picture. Thanks again!!!

[@EntelSidious_gamzeylmz]

What I think here is interesting is that from the main cast it could be definitely argued that Howard is the person who has done the least harm/bad of any form.

[@RoChede]

Super true.

[@scottfremin7850]

I think turning on Chuck over the insurance fees was a low blow for me. I’m weirdly sympathetic to Chuck (which I know isn’t the most popular opinion) so that never sat right.

[@Ekinlabberer]

@@scottfremin7850 Could you explain why you Like Chuck? Did you like that He abide by Rules and laws? That in the End He at least was a standup Citizen? Or can you Just relate to not being liked even though you accomplish a Lot and others just talk? That would be the theorys I can come up with but I would like to hear why

[@scottfremin7850]

@@Ekinlabberer i won’t go so far as to say I *like* him, but I sympathize with the fact that, end of the day, he’s right about Jimmy. Jimmy really *did* commit a felony with changing the Mesa Verde dates, and he *did* steal from the register leading indirectly to their father’s suicide. It’s kinda like Skyler in Breaking Bad, she’s an antagonist plot-wise in that she stands in Walt’s way, but she’s also usually right about him.

[@scottfremin7850]

@@Ekinlabberer and yeah, Chuck did veto Jimmy working at HHM, but we saw what happened when he went to Davis and Main - he went rogue and eventually tanked on purpose. So in a way Chuck was even right that he didn’t belong at a firm like that.

[@SuperAdamBoyd]

Holy hell man what an episode my jaw dropped i saw it coming when Howard entered the apartment as i thought it would be Lalo but then instantly thought OH NO

[@ecklectic9977]

This is something that has been bothering me since the end of the last season and I am glad someone made a video about it. This whole let's get Howard plot just seems totally unnecessary and nasty on the part of Kim and Jimmy. Even from the very beginning you could see Howard was not a bad guy. I have never sensed any real malice in him but actual thought and consideration to other characters throughout the show so far. When he found out all the things that Jimmy did for Chuck or when he told Kim why Jimmy was not hired for just two examples. He just seems to me to be a good person albeit rich and powerful. The driving force behind the plot is Kim and I am not sure that Jimmy's heart is really in it although he is going along with it regardless.

[@johnny_eth]

Well, that is exactly the kind of character building the authors want.

[@nightvolt9572]

yea it nice watch old people die meanwhile his bank accounts increases from refusing to settle

[@cynodont7391]

I think that you forgot an important scene when Howard tells Jimmy that the demise of Chuck was triggered by a problem with their insurers which is of course a direct consequence of Jimmy's visiting their office. At that point, Jimmy figures out that his brother died because of him. I was expecting that Jimmy would show some remorse and maybe go into depression but the opposite happened. His anger against Howard increased significantly (was that just before the bowling ball? I cannot remember). I am no psychiatrist but I would say that he transformed his guilt into anger or aggression against Howard.

[@sburson05]

But why is Kim pushing this plan? It doesn't make sense. And it's not like she needs the Sandpiper settlement money to do pro bono work full-time, she's doing it atm.

[@jinxthatsme2317]

@Peanut Butter It’s because she hates the way Howard treated her in the past and is seeking retribution for it. Howard put her in doc review after Jimmy aired the commercial for Davis & Maine, tried to redeem herself by getting HHM Mesa Verde, only to have Howard say "fuck you" and keep her in doc review. She was also pissed off at Howard for airing out his guilt in front of Jimmy on the day of Chuck’s death. And she was also offended that Howard assumed her decision to leave Mesa Verde was Jimmy’s doing. So, she’s always had a rocky relationship with Howard. It’s not some spur of the moment decision that the crew came up with in the writers room. This has been building up since season 2.

[@carle8267]

@Peanut Butter Seriously?... she is the only main female actor in the show and there are so many good male actors... not everything is woke culture. Her position im the show has mostly been side kick of Jimmy, god forbid she gets the front seat for a few episodes?

[@plushiepenguin]

@@sburson05 Because she got the short end of the stick when she was HHM and not always of her own fault. Almost always as a side effect of associating with Jimmy. Add the revelation that Howie has been enabling Chuck screwing over his own Brother, her on again off again boyfriend (also her by association), for years now. Yeah that resentment is bound to come to a head like when Howard patronizingly tries question her life choices.

[@Fidelio42]

The only one responsible for chuck's death is chuck i think he killed himself cause the mental condition he has drove him nuts like can you imagine hiding from the light everyday being alone most of the time Chuck's life is pretty depressing

[@gcooper642]

I really like this show. It's such high quality. Beautiful camera shots and characters with layers. You don't get that often.

[@Ace1King1]

Also no profanity and minimal sex and violence. Compare this to other popular shows like Euphoria and Bosch Legacy. In my opinion the profanity is completely unnecessary and grossly distracts from the appeal of the series.

[@gcooper642]

@@Ace1King1 Yes, I totally agree with you. I watched the Theranos series recently and there were whole sentences that were just swearing. Just why? Write some sentences or convey something with the camera, the tone of music, a look. Love the art of this series.

[@bobthebuilder6521]

If Howard were truly a terrible lawyer the firm wouldn't have lasted when Chuck died. Yes they have other talents within the firm, but if your leader is clueless that talent goes to waste. Chuck would also never respect Howard if he was completely incompetent, yet he treats him like a peer. We even see that Howard was a step ahead of Chuck when it came to their Disbarment trial. He explained to Chuck that he didn't need to take the stand due to the evidence, though of course Chuck's pride got in the way and it ended up ruining the trial. And yes Howard does play along with Chuck's request, but remember this is the Co-Founder of the entire Firm. If Howard doesn't play along then the idea of Chuck leaving the firm as a whole is suddenly on the table. You can even see Howard remorse over the fact that he needs to play along with Chuck's demands when he explains everything to Kim in his office. YES obviously Howard isn't a saint; He's mistreated Kim by putting her in doc review twice, but Kim has earnt almost every opportunity amongst every Firm in the show. She is pretty much free from Howard halfway through the show and can do what she wants. This is why what Kim and Jimmy are doing is malicious. They have other opportunities to live a successful life (primarily Kim), but they are actively choosing to bring down Howard. It's especially telling in the latest episode. When you take a step back Howard's wrong doings are really negligible compared to what Kim and Jimmy have done combined. Howard was never grudgeful or outright malicious.

[@nightvolt9572]

the firm was going down howard even said he gotta lay off people since chuck passing

[@bobthebuilder6521]

@@nightvolt9572 Its natural for the firm to go down after at tragedy like that. If you remember Howard actually starts to bounce back a few episodes after. Yes Chuck was the poster child, and significant power muscle for the firm. My point is that Howard still pulls his weight and isn't entirely incompetent. Edit: Keep in mind HHM/Chuck's reputation was severely crippled from the Disbarment trial as well. Guess who blundered that one?

[@himurahaibara1459]

I always see Howard as a good and practical person. He rarely shows his kindness to people, but he's not a jerk to his subordinates. And i think he helped Jimmy about his situation with Chuck several times just he did it behind the scene. He allowed himself to be the target of Jimmy's anger until the brother rivalry was revealed. Ofc he tends to side with chuck since he's a partner and probably the one that made HHM into a giant firm it is now. Also he's a damn good lawyer.

[@herminator1613]

Kim has always been the pushing factor in their revenge. The hotel scene when she wanted to start planning their revenge Jimmy seemed reluctant but caved eventually.

[@janninmarie8385]

At first I was fearing the thought that something bad is going to happen to Kim in the end. But after ep7, I'm okay now if she gets her good share of Karma. Howard didn't deserve what happened to him.

[@happymaker2344]

I have to say that through the episodes Howard becomes more and more sympathic. Kim was the bigger power behind the plans to destroy his reputation in the end. Because of the two scenes so far where we can see her childhood, you can see that on one hand she know whats right und is for justice life (scene when drunken mother drove) and on the other hand that what she learns from her mom that laws can be broken as long you get through with it, it is ok. Also you can see that she had to work hard in her life to become a good lawyer, which seems easier for Howard. Mike also underlines this kind of, when he says that she would be stronger than Jimmy.

[@joshuachamberlain1665]

Howard has many redeeming qualities. I think of him as one of the most noble of all the characters in the show. He legitimately felt sorrow at the loss of Chuck, and was guilt-ridden about the idea that he may have caused it. Howard has made honest and open attempts to give Jimmy the respect, opportunity, and consideration that Chuck always denied him. Howard took Jimmy's childish attacks in stride and understanding, all while maintaining his respect and consideration. What he has done in the past was done on orders as a junior partner in the firm. As the leader of the firm, he has made an honest effort to amend the mistakes of the past leadership. Howard is good, decent, law-abiding, responsible, and hard working. He is a man of substance. He is the BSC version of Jaime Lannister.

Yes, he does not deserve to be treated this badly.

[@Foreverfreeusa]

Trust destroyed by your own doing cannot ever be restored. No sympathy for Howard. He actively schemed against Jimmy. Then like a true spoiled, entitled child simply says "my bad" and expects Jimmy to just forget everything.

[@joshuachamberlain1665]

@@Foreverfreeusa I wouldn't say HE actively schemed against Jimmy so much as I would say he assisted Chuck, naively in Chuck's active schemes against Jimmy. He wanted to hire Jimmy, but Chuck wouldn't allow it... and then Chuck pretended like it was all Howard's idea. I understand why Jimmy hates Howard, and I can sympathize with him for it, but I think Jimmy's mind has been poisoned against Howard by the things Chuck had Howard do so Jimmy wouldn't realize it was his brother holding him back. Howard isn't the bad guy: he's the tool of the bad guy. Chuck is the bad guy.

[@moni1383]

Are you kidding me? Howard is a self serving, self - involved a**. He was sad to lose Chuck because Chuck was the legal brain behind HHM! Look what happens with HHM after his death. He was only accommodating Chuck's problem because of it. Not because he's such a nice guy. 😌 The way he treated Kim in the first season was beyond nasty and underhanded. She brought Mesa Verde to HHM and he continued to punish her, than stole it from her using, again, Chuck's legal chops. And he STILL underestimates her. He's so self centered he doesn't even get it. 🙄 Having a "NAMASTE" plate doesn't make him a spiritual person.

[@joshuachamberlain1665]

@@moni1383 I suppose it's all a matter of how you interpret Howard's actions. I am not kidding you when I call him the Jaime Lannister of the story. With these characters and this show, I always try to give the benefit of the doubt because of the nature of the content. When I do this for Jimmy and Kim, I can see where they are coming from, even if I disagree with their actions, but with Howard, I see a genuinely good and decent guy trying to resolve the mistakes his firm made in the past. Hate Howard if you wish... just know that Chuck was the real villain of Jimmy's story and Howard is just a convenient punching bag for him. Otherwise, I suppose we will just have to agree to disagree. As far as being "self-serving" ...well, kindly explain how a self-serving man would tap out his life savings and go into debt to save the firm that he works for when he could have gained much greater personal benefit dissolving the firm and taking his share as well.

[@sewildman50]

This is why I love this show and why Vince Gilligan has such a great vision. Life isn't all love and hate, good and bad. It has nuance and depends on perspective. I don't think Howard deserves to lose his livelihood but I can see why Kim and Jimmy are targeting him. At the same time, I have immense sympathy for all of them, and this intensifies my feelings about the plot progression. Too often, writers treat viewers as if they are stupid and won't get this kind of subtlety, so they make things as obvious as a Lone Ranger episode. On the other hand, Gilligan is a master!

[@alexgear959]

ITS NOT FUCKING GILLIGAN, ITS PETER GOULD

[@parkershaw8529]

Now, Howard has lost more.

[@sewildman50]

@@alexgear959 My mistake. Ease up champ

[@Rude_Boi]

Peter Gould writes most of Better Call Saul.

[@mattrogers4390]

The series being spread out over more than 7 years (it started in Feb. 2015) hasn't helped to keep all the nuances and particulars top of mind, at least for me. I'd forgotten a lot of these details.

[@johnny_eth]

Time to binge watch everything again

[@YUNGHOGbeats]

Howard deserved a better ending man. Its heartbreaking

[@megalinc]

Man, the amount of effort they put into that scheme was MIND-BLOWING

[@tanpat6402]

Howard felt the same thing

[@megalinc]

@@tanpat6402 that.. That's the joke

[@charlesfisher4657]

Lmao not right

[@neilsun2521]

I daren't imagine what went into it, 'cos it would just blow my head off.

[@juanjosetalerogarcia902]

This was a much needed video

[@PetePeppers1]

glad it's helpful

[@Drew791]

I'm glad you're covering this topic, because I've been wondering this myself. Even after re-watching the series I can't quite figure out the motivation behind them wanting to screw with Howard so bad.

[@user-wl7dt1uw2e]

It's because they failed on this one. You can't figure it out because the writers dropped the ball.

[@FredDurst1]

@@user-wl7dt1uw2e I think it’s because the writers want us to dislike Kim and jimmy. And it’s working for me atleast. Can’t stand either of them anymore. I hope Gene gets arrested.

[@beatrixbrennan1545]

@@FredDurst1 personally, I felt Kim's character was dry, boring and added very little to the show. I never felt invested in her and Jimmy's relationship because they seemed more like roommates than lovers. I hated watching them, they felt horribly bland to me.

[@iangrimm]

Great topic and breakdown. I got lost in the weeds on this after 5+ seasons - this is not exactly Walt vs. Gus. Thank you!!!

[@adambaird8352]

"it might be crucial for both of these character's endings" yeah you got that one right

[@brightize2651]

You should have been a Lawyer. You make a good case, BUT, I still side with Howard. Jimmy is charismatic but he can be a selfish douchebag, never forget how he treated Irene. Kim is intriguing, more to her story I believe.

[@ultraviolettas]

In Mad Men lexicon, he is (and probably thinks he is) Roger Sterling without the charm, wit or humor; a robotic WASPy Ken Doll wholesome lawyer trying to live his best life and after rewatching the series several times I love him. He has a lot of elements of Pete Campbell and his character arc too. We start out hating him and see him as cocky and entitled, but later see he’s really trying his best and is possibly the most ethical character on the show.

[@bobross1829]

Well done. Great explanation. I think you can add the displaced anger over what Chuck did to him. He cannot strike out at Chuck anymore and Howard is the face of his brother's firm that treated him so rotten. Jimmy knows now that Howard was acting the bad guy for Chuck (and how awful that must have been for Howard to do that when that was totally Chuck's problem but he could not stand up to him). Kim I think wants the money for her law practice and also wants revenge on behalf of Jimmy. But Gilligan has a pretty consistent theme throughout BB and BCS that doing bad things for "good reasons" never turns out well and leads to ruination.

[@eugger3011]

I think Jimmy might see Howard as a pussy. He had no backbone when Chuck was alive, but now that Chuck is dead and Jimmy got his license reinstated, he suddenly decides to offer him a job? Obviously, there's more to it than that, but it could be part of Jimmy's perspective.

[@sayyedzafar5704]

Watching this after S06 ep7, he definitely didn't deserve that...😔

[@oscarmaynes5667]

This next episode will blow your mind!

[@kittavares4334]

Even Howard's mind was blown away after he found out.

[@batgurrl]

Thanks so much Pete I really needed this because I wasn’t 💯 sure myself. This was so thorough and helpful☮️

[@PetePeppers1]

There's a lot of subtle stuff going on that probably won't make complete sense until we learn more about Kim's past.

[@batgurrl]

@@PetePeppers1 so very true. Everyone who has watched BCS from the start are no doubt all wondering more than anything, what happens to Kim whom Saul never mentions in BB

[@jameswallace7091]

“I’d feel bad if something happens to him” yeah you must feel really bad aha

[@SilverScale.]

Besides all the practical and Jimmy-related reasons, Kim's reason is because Howard is always patronizing and underestimating her. She's learning how much agency she really has, especially recently, with all the changes she's going through.

[@sburson05]

Still, not reason enough to destroy him. It's not believable.

[@eugger3011]

Yep. We've seen this when Howard makes "power plays" on her like at the restaurant. I think he pretty much takes credit for forming Kim into the person she is just because he paid for her schooling (or at least that's what Kim thinks of him).

[@eugger3011]

@@sburson05 Good thing that that's not the only reason they're trying to destroy him. I don't agree with what they're doing but I can at least see where they're coming from according to their characters.

[@senor2930]

@@eugger3011 paying for her school was a big thing. Nothing wrong in taking credit for it. Did she expect to get money for free? Her lack of gratitude towards him is psychopathic.

[@eugger3011]

@@senor2930 Did you forget that Kim tried to pay the loan back, but Howard wouldn't accept it? Howard wants to believe that he's a good person, which is why he takes credit for Kim's success, despite being nothing but an obstacle for her when she worked at HHM.

[@coolspider6798]

'i hope nothing bad happens to him' that didnt age well...

[@forcetheedges]

Good timing, I needed a refresher on some of these plot points.

[@bluejayblaze6887]

Definitely Team Howard, and unless something we don't know about between Kim and Howard's past comes up, that won't change.

[@moni1383]

Didn't you see enough mistreatment of Kim by Howard in the first season? I'd hate his guts forever!

[@bluejayblaze6887]

@@moni1383 And this is stuff Jimmy is aware of and know that some of it was due to his brother Chuck. Even Jimmy knows Kim wants to go further than he would for revenge, he's only complying so far to make Kim happy, just as he did before with her and Chuck.

[@HalConick]

I’m fascinated to see how the writers are going to torture and/or hero-ize Howard. They karmically reward characters who grew as people, like Jesse, Nacho, and Hank. But growth doesn’t spare characters from punishment. Howard definitely grew. His scam on Jimmy with Chuck has earned him some retribution, so he’ll probably take some hits. That scam was legal but spineless at best and the lies he told let a wound fester between two people he cared for. Since then, seems like he’s been a truth-teller, which is a rare trait on this show. His suffering and growth will give him-at least-a good death, but I think he deserves to turn the tables on Kim and Saul before whatever ending they give him.

[@AustinSmith-th3ok]

I read a theory saying kim would end up in prison over what she did to howard and that’s why she’s not in breaking bad and coupled with your idea i think it would be a reasonable guess personally. idk maybe they’ll kill off kim but i think all this stuff they’re doing to howard is gonna come back to bite them before the season is over.

[@sword4005]

@@AustinSmith-th3ok that or she bought a dust filter for a Hoover Max Extract® 60 Pressure Pro

[@nont18411]

Howard will end up in Belize.

[@joshwhalen17]

1) Patrick Fabian is negotiating the balance of his character masterfully, and there aren't enough Best Supporting Actor slots in the universe for this show. 2) It's easy for Kim and Jimmy to rationalize Howard as the mark, seeing as even the most damaging setback they anticipate will leave him in a position enviable by 99% of less privileged people. "Bruised but still standing" is the quote I think. I would guess that this plan will end much worse for Howard than anything Kim or Jimmy initially envisioned.

[@brucegevirtzman8703]

Well, I guess you got that right.

[@patriciabagby90]

Good explanation on the motivation that I was having trouble understanding.

[@kevinlawrence3105]

At least we find out what the last thing was to go through Howard's mind.

[@HnTr_VDH]

Incredible

[@asafindy]

Re: “Why not Howard?”… How about this for an answer: Howard is a human being, and Jimmy and Kim have no right to tarnish his reputation and his name (those stains don’t wash off) and harm or destroy his life. They have no right to plant (fake) drugs in his locker, knowingly spread false rumors about him, steal his car, frame him for soliciting and mistreating prostitutes or any other wacky scheme they come up with. This isn’t even a Mike vs. Hector situation, in which the latter is guilty of shooting a Good Samaritan in the face and threatening the former’s granddaughter. Howard is a lawyer and a straight arrow. I don’t care if they resent his privileged upbringing, dislike his impeccable business suits, think he was an unfair boss, hate him for being able to process grief when Jimmy could not, or whatever other petty justification they have for targeting him. It doesn’t even matter if he’s a nice guy or not (for what it’s worth, I tend to think he is). What they are doing is wrong. It is criminal and, more importantly, it is immoral. In 604, Kim asked Jimmy if he thinks they are “wicked.” Well, if people are ultimately defined by their actions and choices, as opposed to their feelings or intentions, then… yes, Kim. You are. You both are. So even if Howard might not be the “good guy” of the story or of this scenario, Jimmy and Kim, as likable as they are sometimes, certainly are not the “good guys” either. Quite the opposite, actually.

[@sweetballs4742]

It's probably the main the reason why I don't feel bad for Jimmy ended up becoming Gene because of it.... Especially if Howard's career will be f-ked because of him and Kim.

[@marknewbold2583]

But they do

[@nataliasiqueira7884]

Perfect!

[@gary7846]

because their ego was hurt by how perfect howard is compared to their dirty little criminal ego

[@williamkoppos7039]

One of the things about this one and BB was constant conflict. Everybody always seems one sentence, one word, short of ...salvaging things, saving themselves, it's tough to describe. I felt sorry for Chuck, but when he told jimmy "you never really meant that much to me"...wow. Howard has done some lousy things, but keeping Jimmy out of Sandpiper was the biggest.

[@joebruin6201]

..., but keeping Jimmy out of Sandpiper was the biggest. You are one word short :) Sorry, just messing with you. Awesome observation. The silence is loud in those cases. The audience expects a line that fits, but it never comes. It feels so real, in moments under a lot of pressure, especially when someone disappoints us, we wish to say what`s on our mind but we just stare and then leave. Also, the person that hurts us maybe wish to say something like sorry, I didn`t mean it, but they never do.

[@georgelionon9050]

At the same time Chuck was right about Jimmy.. What was lame from him was hiding behind Howard while letting Jimmy care for him.

[@Foreverfreeusa]

No, trying to get Jimmy permanently disbarred was much worse than sandpiper. He actively tried to ruin Jimmy's life.

[@lindacumberland7046]

Why did Chuck hate Jimmy so much

[@georgelionon9050]

@@lindacumberland7046 He blamed him for the economic failure of their parents.. (true or wrong we dont know)

[@SamCanuck1]

This is EXACTLY what I was looking for. Thanks!

[@harrysu7643]

it would ease howards guilt quite a bit I imagine if he found out that it was Jimmy who raised the insurance rates on chuck on HHM

[@noodlehat3250]

I love the contrast between the way Howard dresses and the way Jimmy dresses.

[@buzzsounds123]

Howard sending Kim to doc review twice to humiliate her, and keeping her there even after she landed Mesa Verda, was incredibly mean spirited. He humiliated her for no good reason. I was surprised she didn't rebel against it, although she did leave the firm. The writers don't make it clear that it's connected to why she and Jimmy are now going after Howard, but sheesh...

[@zxylo786]

That still doesn't justify it.

[@mikeg2491]

The main problem is there has been so much time between seasons it’s easy to forget why these characters have dispute to begin with. A lot different than binging breaking bad on Netflix.

[@msitaramaraju]

Still doesn't justify it. It's only a job and she can quit. Also Jimmy literally damages his brothers reputation publicly just to get her a gig , aggravates him in court and eventually baits the insurance company to hike his brothers premiums ( which snowballs into a Howard Chuck confrontation ) . Jimmy does everything he can to break his brother. Infact he is 💯 responsible for Chuck's death.

[@WillowJordan1979]

@@mikeg2491 Where are you watching from? Isn't it a Netflix original series? It's on Finnish Netflix anyway.

[@moni1383]

Jimmy is not responsible for Chuck's death. You're forgetting how Chuck and Howard stole Mesa Verde from Kim and how Chuck entrapped Jimmy into confessing ontape to falsifying the documents. Chuck and Jimmy are two sides of the same coin. They both pushed each other buttons but Chuck underestimated the seriousness of his mental condition and that's why he snapped in the end. Not to mention he refused the treatment or even acknowledging it was mental illness.

[@mblack7063]

Howard's smarmy condescension when he told Kim that Jimmy is conning her into leaving Mesa Verde pushed Kim over the edge. Kim has always set goals and achieved them on her own terms and with motives that are important only to her. Sometimes not even Jimmy understands her motives. But for Howard to treat her like an empty headed female added to the fact that she will defend Jimmy at almost any cost explains why she will make him pay. I will not be surprised if we find out Kim got back at her mother somehow too.

[@nont18411]

The condescension didn’t only come from Howard. It came from the majority of fans as well. Today, there are still a lot of fans who blame Jimmy for everything and treat Kim as an innocent victim.

[@ultraviolettas]

I didn’t see it as condescension, it seemed a little patronizing but mostly like he was treating her as a friend and colleague and was genuinely concerned but Kim viewed it as condescending

[@ultraviolettas]

@VaderxG exactly

[@GabesEdtiz]

@VaderxG so are you saying that Howard is partly responsible for the treatment that he’s being put through or are you saying that both characters have deep layers to them and it’s not as simple as victim-basing. Cause I see it more as Howard not exactly believing that neither Jimmy or Kim are capable of ruining someone’s life like that, but that Jimmy has unhealthy habits and is pushing them on to Kim, someone who he has known for quite some time

[@senor2930]

@@ultraviolettas precisely. Was just being a good friend looking out for her.

[@usquebaugh1]

Excellent analysis that serves both as "the recap I didn't know I needed" and also demonstrates just how fantastic the writing is on this show. Thank you algorithm. REALLY enjoyed this one!

[@AshGeo]

Okay I watched this 2 weeks ago. Howard in episode 7 asks Saul what he has against him and mentions these exact same reasons. It was like deja vu!

[@F4evrsoon]

These are so great, Pete, thank you!

[@PetePeppers1]

Thanks for watching

[@wills.364]

I like Howard even though he reminds me of a sleaze politician. I don’t want anything bad to happen to him

[@matthewminix5960]

Good video. But I think you missed a key part. The context of Kim's most recent conversation with Howard was indeed Jimmy's return from the desert, but it was not the danger he was in then that matters so much as it is their confrontation with Lalo (which you did not mention). Kim (not Jimmy) won that for them in the short term- but at that point she does not know what will happen in the long-term. They have gone to the hotel (which you did mention) because they are so afraid that Lalo will get more evidence and come back to get them that it is the only thing they can think to do. They both "go to work" that day, but neither is okay. And that is also why she is so frightened at the start of that conversation with Howard- BECAUSE she is afraid Howard knows something about that and is worried that they are about to be caught- and because she is already off her game (Jimmy loses a very easy case at the same time because he is also off). But when all Howard has to say is what you mentioned- the bowling balls and prostitutes, her not acting rationally in his view- she is initially so relieved that she laughs at him. And she is insulted (as you said) but now she feels the power again that she had in confronting Lalo- and confronts Howard, too. When when they become convinced that they are safe from Lalo (after Jimmy's talk with Mike), her relief brings with it hubris, excitement, and a desire to bring someone else down who has recently upset her: Howard Hamlin.

[@flaviomendonca7556]

man you realy understand the details of the whole story, tanks so much for your content

[@joeyengelman]

Incredible video!

[@MiraMiMi]

howard makes me so mad i could just smash my head on a desk and bleed out on the carpet

[@CarlM]

Well do I have some news for you...

[@eduardovergopolem8321]

I really (unfortunately for Kim) hope that their plan fails. Howard stands by Chuck till he can't anymore. He was Chuck's partner so of course he had to be on his side when Chuck prohibited Jimmy to work on the firm. When he opens up to Jimmy about Chuck killing himself, it was because Jimmy really knew Chuck better than Rebecca did (when Kim complained to him that he did not say that to Rebecca). Howard was a tough boss to Kim, true, but anything besides that? I do think he is remarkable. I also do think he offended Kim when he mentioned she left Mesa Verde because of Jimmy. But he does not deserve what they are planning. In general he is one of the good guys of the show.

[@RIP123]

RIP, didn't deserve what happened to him

[@wyskass861]

@@RIP123 As we know from Breaking Bad.. This series puts the bad guys as our protagonists, and good guys don't win. It's frustrating to see that life isn't fair.

[@sidviscious10]

I was surprised to see Kim go after Howard at 1st but kind of makes sense if you think about it.. He always treated her like a subordinate / secretary even though she finished law school and passed the bar

[@b14m23]

She was a subordinate.

[@sidviscious10]

@@b14m23 junior partner is a not a subordinate

[@b14m23]

@@sidviscious10 Partner, junior partner, others. See the chain of command?

[@sidviscious10]

@@b14m23 guess we’re arguing semantics but Howard skill as a lawyer is much lower than Kim’s. He got the job because of nepotism and is more of a salesman. That’s why Kim was able to jump to another firm so easily

[@kumoau62]

I’m actually shocked to see some comments asserting that Howard deserved some of Jimmy’s pranks. Even if he didn’t get shot, I don’t understand why anyone wouldn’t feel sorry for Howard. The guy did nothing wrong. He was being punched by both Chuck and Jimmy during the whole show for no cause of his own. Chuck couldn’t keep up with his ego, threatened Howard and then selfishly committed a suicide. His counterpart Jimmy, dumped all his guilt, remorse, and anger he felt toward his brother on Howard even though it’s obvious that he’s not the one to be blamed. I almost laughed at Kim when she accused Howard for being narcissistic even though he’s the only main character mature enough to act with common sense instead of taking out their anger on innocent people around. He serves the same role as Schwartz couple in BB. They show that rich and talented people are no more evil than the bitter underdogs. Howard’s only blunder was that he never properly pushed out Mcgill brothers from his life. The moral of the BB and BCS has been always simple. When you make shitty mistakes, not only you, but the people around you also shall be forced to pay the price.

[@petermj1098]

Howard is the Hank of the show. Both of them were decent, highly respected and self-respecting of themselves but Jimmy and Walt ruined their lives and reputation. Hank tried to expose Heisenberg as Howard tried to expose Saul Goodman. Jimmy was jealous of Howard as a lawyer the same way Walt was jealous of Hank as a man.

[@chronic2464]

i can't believe i'm just now discovering your channel and the better call saul analysis. great stuff!

[@ohkay7418]

I understand why they're going after him too he's been an instrument of people that have hurt Jimmy and his attitude against Jimmy can't be wiped away by asking him to join the firm after he treated him so shabbily but the main thing is to get that sandpiper settlement someone else just worked at the firm wouldn't it be enough to force the issue had to be at the top but no he doesn't deserve losing everything

[@Foreverfreeusa]

Yeah, there's nothing innocent about Howard. Jimmy worked his ass off for years to be a legitimate lawyer and person in society only to be blackballed by Chuck and Howard. Everybody just forgets that Howard helped and tried to have Jimmy permanently disbarred, destroying everything Jimmy worked for. Not once did Howard say, " yeah, I'm not going to help destroy a man's life over your family bs". Someone who does that to you cannot, and should not ever be trusted again.

[@thesizzaman]

@@Foreverfreeusa *Blackballed by Chuck, who used Howard’s loyalty to make him the focus of Jimmy’s ire. *Howard regretted not standing up for Jimmy when he first became a lawyer and tried to make amends with a genuine job offer. *Jimmys underhanded actions cost HHM Mesa Verde, and when he committed a felony by breaking and entering to destroy the evidence, Howard was an eye-witness. He was called at the hearing and gave an honest retelling of what happened, even being honest about how he liked Jimmy when he worked at HHM. We all rooted for Jimmy in that situation but in reality, any lawyer would be disbarred for what Jimmy did. Howard is one of the few people who could be called ‘good’ in this show.

[@earthling_parth]

2:40 in the first episode of BCS, Chuck says that Howard wants Jimmy to not use his own last name McGill but I thought it was common knowledge that it was really Chuck saying that and using Howard's name as he hates Jimmy and think it's would be an embarrassment to the McGill legacy he has created in the law circles around Southwest US. Again, not hiring Jimmy was mostly Chuck putting the pressure on Howard and Howard wanted to hire Jimmy at HHM.

[@DarinDmarkovic1]

Jimmy is an anti-hero, and we all relate to him, we've all dealt with injustices, with people who undermined us, people who doubted us, looked down us. This is why we understand Jimmy for the things he does, he realized you can't win by playing by the rules.

[@ssarkees]

Your analysis is incredible. I feel so simple minded... Thanks for clarifying everything!

[@Arkady20]

Great how this explains these niuances. I mean - you won't miss them if you binge watch the series in a day or two, but if you are like me and watch it from the premiere year after year, than you will forget this stuff. Thank you for this Mr. Peppers:)

[@giraffe357]

One thing not addressed in this video is the role of guilt in their decision to take down Howard. Featured prominently in establishing shots is Howard’s ‘Namaste’ license plate, a symbol of his emotional death and rebirth after Chuck’s suicide. Howard’s knowledge that he played a part in Chuck’s death drove him to rock bottom, but he confronted his guilt and came out the other side. Jimmy and Kim haven’t acknowledged their guilt over Chuck’s death, and deeply resent Howard’s ability to confront his guilt and work past it.

[@katec708]

ooh wow yeah that's a great point

[@touchofdumb]

The real reason behind d-day hasn’t been laid out bc it secretly doesn’t center on Howard - I think Kim is really going after Jimmy somehow. But Jimmy will flip it on her and she will be disbarred.

[@giraffe357]

@@touchofdumb a friend of mine had a similar theory on the lead up to season 6, however based on the mid season finale that’s obviously not the case.

[@touchofdumb]

@@giraffe357 How so? Bc Lalo killed Howard?

[@giraffe357]

@@touchofdumb no it’s just all of these roads leading to that conclusion. Kim is presented with a choice, take the straight and narrow road to that meeting and get her Pro Bono work, or U-turn down Bad Choice Road and take down Howard. During D-Day, as they listen to Howard’s meltdown over the conference call, Jimmy and Kim are grinding on each other on the couch. Clearly this was the intended outcome of their plan, I don’t think there’s any room for a Kim-was-scamming-Jimmy twist.

[@roxannekoller4274]

I thought that Kim was put in "Dock Review" because Jimmy ran an Ad while working at Davis & Maine without the Associates approval. And Kim didn't give Howard & Charles a heads up. Despite Jimmy pretending that he had approval, while also letting Kim think he did.

[@MisterHatred]

Posting after the finale... Hows everyone feeling?

[@davidmanzo5350]

This show never fails to shock me

[@davidmanzo5350]

Rip to the goat

[@jkorshak]

H̶a̶m̶l̶i̶n̶ H̶a̶m̶l̶i̶n̶ & M̶c̶G̶i̶l̶l̶

[@danfoxdude]

@@jkorshak IT HURTS MUCH JIMMY REALLY WIPED OUT THAT FIRM

[@dannyascuntar2483]

Kim’s gotta be the first person to use the Vacuum Service