Why Are Men Like This

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#tiktok #drama

[@AegixDrakan]

Okay, the "That's like the 'Oh, you love women, name 10 women!' 'uhhh uhh uhhh' " bit was extra funny to me, because just today I saw JoCat actually manage to name a hundred women on stream, because of that meme. XD

[@MrHat.]

Thenorthernlion speedran it

[@chetrhcp]

@@MrHat. His actress recall was crazy it took him like 6 min

[@DivinityIncarnate000]

UH UH…HITLER!

[@superhydra8873]

The name some women challenge is so unbelievably dishonest and stupid and if you unrionically use it you are a genuine moron. “No you can't name family members!!!” Is also a response they give lmao, Isn't family likely to be the most notable women in your life? If I ask a woman to name ten famous feminist philosophers they love, I guarantee you these idiots would crumble.

[@thatshadowguy1005]

"Can you name all 59 women-" "fuck, i had no idea there were that many. ...Amelia Earhart. ...uh... Doja... Cat?"

[@seaturtleninjagaming4602]

Ive seen this toxic masculine attitude Vaush is calling out ruin so many het marriages. Some men are just so terrifyingly vindictive towards women, including their wives, for no discernable reason. Hate to see it.

[@soulstealer5625]

Reminds of a post where a guy kept insulting his wife, calling her retarded and mocking her behind her back to his friends. Why the heck is with her if despises her so?

[@VeritasEspiritoria]

I do suffer of that, it's kind of difficult to control sometimes, the resentment can be pretty strong. As for what reason, in my case is due to women gatekeeping things I wish I had but could not at the time, when you are obese and autistic your interactions with women in both ways tend to be not as pleasant to say the least. It's more complex than that of course but I tried to make it short.

[@nathancourtney94]

It's not that complicated actually. Women are more valuable than men. Men eventually perceive this and get insecure about it. I can't help but feel people intentionally say they don't understand it as some kind of signal that they're somehow immune to the problem and therefore don't see it.

[@nathancourtney94]

@@VeritasEspiritoria the problem isn't complicated, your problems are complicated. I'm not trying to downplay your suffering but it's important not to conflate the sophistication of your life with the simple function of your environment that causes it.

[@ryanthompson3737]

​@@nathancourtney94Women are more important than men? And you somehow don't register that as the SAME exact toxicity that vaush is talking about?

[@afterhourscinema782]

This reminds me of my FAVORITE elementary school joke of all time, *"You like girls?? What are you gay???"* 🤣

[@superdude8168]

😂

[@améliehester6996]

Depends are they a girl admitting they like girls? 😂

[@alathmasster2189]

Oh that takes me back, the "I bet you like girls f**got"

[@doug-gimmedome69]

I'm bisexual so the answer to that is yes.

[@zhengjy5401]

what is that even supposed to mean?

[@AMR_Setsunai]

as an actual sociopath, it's not even normalized sociopathy bc sociopaths (as in, people with ASPD) are capable of loving and caring for others if we choose to do so. it's emotional stunting is essentially what it is, young men are being raised without proper guidance to manage how they feel and what they want.

[@Herpusderpus]

Yeah, lotta misconceptions about sociopaths

[@AMR_Setsunai]

@@Herpusderpus I hate sounding like a wokescold but the discourse around cluster B personality disorders is REALLY bad. like, a lot of obvious armchair psychiatrists rearing their head to make their uneducated opinions known. or people who had a bad experience and let that define their opinion even though with any other mental condition that'd be unacceptable. even people with NPD can learn to be functional and healthy members of society. I'm not saying it's common, just that people with cluster B disorders are still people and aren't a monolith. some of us do get help and some of us are, at least relatively, safe and enjoyable to be around.

[@dragonslaya16]

It took many years of actively trying to be more sympathetic towards others to undo a lot of my more anti social tendencies it can be done byt it's a lot of work

[@electron6825]

What do you mean "choose"? Is it like a switch that you can flip on and off at whim? I struggle to conceive of that as love

[@AMR_Setsunai]

@@electron6825 it's an emotion you can voluntarily choose to force yourself not to feel, yes. people with ASPD still feel empathy and emotions, we can just turn them on and off whenever we want. it's pretty useful.

[@Jazzmaster1992]

Color me shocked that people who actively disparage feminine traits are also resentful towards people who are typically the ones to display those traits.

[@abigfavor]

To be fair, I think some cishet dudes dont even like chicks. "Is it gay to be attracted to women" is a thing

[@thesuperostrich]

A straight guy being attracted to women is gay

[@Glacierlune]

@@abigfavor ya figuring this out was a bit of a mind blast. My best guess is that men are often conditioned to be terrified of being a woman/feminate. And they of course take that to be hateful to women. It's a cross between them seeing women as inferior men/failed men and just seeing feminity and womanhood as universally detestable (cause it's what would be detestable about themselves if they were like a woman) Hope that makes sense.

[@NebulaSon]

A lot of "straight" women don't like men. And I've never heard anyone said it was gay to be with a woman. Most men are obsessed with women.

[@justsomeguy6336]

That’s just autism

[@nati0598]

I think at some point men decided that love is only done by women and if you love a woman you are one and therefore gay

[@magnus_cockstrong]

People who aren't looking for equal partners shouldn't be in a partnership.

[@Sitbear]

Some people like being in equal partnerships. Some people like being dominant or submissive. Also, equal partnerships are extremely rare, by pure virtue of the fact one person is almost always more invested in the relationship than the other; in most relationships, men are more invested and women break off more often, and thus women have the true power.

[@magnus_cockstrong]

@Sitbear if you see your spouse as less than you, you are diminishing the quality of their life. Don't pretend S&M kinks are the same as relationship dynamics.

[@Sitbear]

@@magnus_cockstrong “if you believe this ridiculous strawman I made of you, then you’re bad.” Ok. Come back when you at least make a little bit of effort to understand what I was saying.

[@magnus_cockstrong]

@Sitbear nope I described you.

[@magnus_cockstrong]

@Sitbear I said equality and you appeared out of the ether to get butthurt. Don't pretend boy

[@roscuro9838]

Funny thing about the end bit, JoCat named 100 real women successfully on stream.

[@vauiarex4877]

The discourse was started with "het men and lesbians should bond over their love of women" - which I view as aspirational, like it *should* be possible and we *should* strive for a world where it's more common. But over time it morphed into an argument over if queer love is different than straight love, which, duh, of course it exists in completely different contexts, different genders and different acceptance. I don't think it was ever meant to argue het men and lesbians are literally the same - one way people can bond over something shared is examine the different angles they see it from! Learning from our experiences. As a straight man I really like seeing how else love-of-women can manifest, and learn from it. Either way, the way lots of men treat women have nothing to do with love, then we are not comparing het and lesbian love anyways. Obviously straight relationships are socially catalyzed regardless of real affection, while almost the only reason a lesbian couple would exist is for love - that's not because the love itself is different. Plus I discovered some strange lesbian - bi women infighting in the discussion, so I'm pretty sure it's a specific lesbian subculture that really wants to make sure they have nothing to do with men.

[@RiceShouldBeFluffy]

It really feels like Vaush is overcompensating for his casual misogyny jokes by going un-nuanced on men for it's own sake.

[@Smoochy1074]

​@@RiceShouldBeFluffy fr fr I want someone to make essay about it 😂 , bro used to support men lots and now does the opposite while still making misogynistic comments from time to time. Seems really manipulative to me

[@coolidgedollar2154]

One minute in, and I already don't understand this discourse at all -- and I think I'm okay with that.

[@Tester-sh1mn]

More men need to transition to become lesbians. Solved.

[@pf100andahalf]

There must be a back story that we don't know about

[@ryaneaston3487]

Me not knowing if I like anyone due to not having a long-lasting social circle: ._.

[@BingoBosnia]

That's fine too!!! You don't have to like anyone like that either to be happy. Besides, I am sure you'll be able to find people that care for you and want to be a part of your life if you keep trying

[@Xeridanus]

One way to find out if you're gay or straight is if you've had any celebrity crushes. If you haven't had any, it could mean you're asexual or demisexual.

[@ChatGPT_ChatbotTest]

​@@Xeridanus What if I don’t have any celebrity crushes but am in a relationship?

[@Xeridanus]

@@ChatGPT_ChatbotTest In that case I am not licensed to help you. Also, I'm not replying to a bot.

[@vargsvansify]

“What about Angela Merkel” is such a strange thing to write. Like, did they want to know if she counts?

[@rottenmuffin826]

It's like when the topic is about videogames and chat just starts naming games randomly. They were just naming women that exist

[@swiftwop73]

Its a famous skit on tiktok where they ask people to name a woman

[@EllaEllaAudios]

As a lesbian in one hand I wanna go like "So true so true" but I also don't think the idea of "Girls are awesome and guys are smelly" exactly fits within a framework of a complex view of gender... There's also like terfy undertones to this discourse that many people aren't really noticing

[@abbiewicker3126]

He explicitly said it’s not to do w testosterone or anything like that, I think he meant it as a sort of nurture not nature thing with how men are socialised to view women. Women can obviously be nurtured to share this view, but with lesbians already breaking out of heteronormativity, that ‘women are lesser’ and resentment stuff he’s talking about is less common. I don’t think it’s terf-y, I think it’s more of a criticism on the socialisation of men

[@synchronium24]

"I also don't think the idea of 'Girls are awesome and guys are smelly' exactly fits within a framework of a complex view of gender" No kidding. Leftist idpolers gonna leftist idpol.

[@anitaremenarova6662]

It's fine, everyone gets the point. Us men are socialized into borderline sociopathy, it has nothing to do with biology this is all a product of other men enforcing the system on others.

[@joshuaraymer1705]

People are going to reply to you going "woah he said it's social not genetic" as though TERFs don't also just argue "male socialized" people are violent and predatory

[@BingusTingus-ls4mf]

@abbiewicker3126 The rhetoric that Vaush has been using when he brings this topic up definitely seems very purposefully inflammatory to me. He keeps reiterating that it is ultimately a problem of socialization, but when he does it it seems more like a deflection rather than part of the argument he is building. Like a 13/50 but then you add the sociological explanation when someone gets mad at you. The analogy is not meant to compare scale, it's about being a better rhetoritician. And also yeah there are definitely some terfy parts about this rhetoric that suck, its not all that uncommon to find them talking like this.

[@mumblerapkilla5406]

What happened to you? 😢

[@austyntheman5623]

Fun fact he named 100 of the from memory on stream lol

[@austyntheman5623]

Jo cat I mean

[@mattiemcdoink8445]

I'm not even confident I could remember the names of 100 people in *private,* let alone in a public speaking situation like a livestream. Fun Fact: I'm good with faces, absolute crap with names in large part due to my ADHD. While my wife has Prosopagnosia and therefore literally can't recognize faces unless you've got a very distinctive(mostly derogatory) face but is *great* with names.

[@austyntheman5623]

@@mattiemcdoink8445 that's nifty, I bad with both

[@austyntheman5623]

@@mattiemcdoink8445 and yha I would fumbel if it was me on the live stream

[@JPH1138]

Good to hear it's finally getting around that those lesbian domestic abuse stats are basically worthess. I can't remember the real numbers, but it was a survey of random people with thousands of people, but the number of respondents who happened to be lesbians was somewhere around 100. The question asked was whether they had experienced relationship abuse in their lifetime, and I think most of the respondents had had a male partner in the past so it wasn't even clear if they were talking about female partners. The survey also included coercive control, verbal abuse, etc. but that didn't stop people from thinking and reporting that it meant only physical violence. The fact that the results for lesbians was surprising meant that it was the main thing reported from the survey, despite it being unclear data from a small sample size, and men who hate women have a favourite stat to bring out.

[@Iban-Underground]

To everyone who gets up in arms remember: they crucified Joecat. They put him on a cross.

[@EroticInferno]

“You actually _like_ women?? What are you?? Gay??”

[@MakNaasfalti-jh4bg]

​@@EroticInferno He likes gooning to anime characters

[@eheh6270]

I'm just so happy he's back

[@valentinchappa6702]

Women did

[@oo-vivian]

watchng vush video and strem at same time . . . ohohhoho

[@prohikikomo]

samesies!!!!

[@burning_trash]

Ngl I hate this generalization discourse especially based on anecdotes, be consistent

[@lokimiguel2452]

What

[@Xanthelei]

Vaush is definitely not an egg. He just had the MOST cis guy take on how being trans works. 😂

[@robertm9631]

How is what he said at 0:25 (that one is not innately trans or cis) in any way a cis guy take, let alone the MOST cis guy take? The take gives off very strong closeted non-binary/agender/gender fluid vibes. If someone said (like Vaush has before) that people aren't innately gay or straight I would hope that no one would find that take straight in any way.

[@Xanthelei]

@robertm9631 The fact it's so completely wrong is WHY it is the most cis take I've heard him speak. Because he absolutely wouldn't say the same thing about being gay or bi, and yet he said it about being trans - he is gay (bi?) so he knows on a personal level that you don't just become gay/bi. If he was trans and in denial, he would still also be able to comprehend that you don't get turned trans. And yes, "being gay is a choice" is absolute the straightest take one could POSSIBLY have about being gay. Not even a close race. It isn't even a closeted tell until it also gets demonized, I've had many straight cis friends sincerely believe that being gay/bi was a choice and that was totally fine, just not for them, meanwhile so many avowedly anti-gay pastors get caught with a boyfriend in a bathroom. I also want to be clear here, Vaush is 100% wrong. I didn't get a choice in being trans, and I wasn't even raised with overtly strict gender roles outside of dresses for fancy events. I spent the first half of my life basically ignoring gender, until puberty came and slapped me with dysphoria. It wasn't a choice, and it wasn't social issues. I just am a guy and was lucky enough to spend a lot of my childhood not being forced into a gender stereotype.

[@robertm9631]

@@Xanthelei Vaush has said the same thing about being gay/straight and has denied that monosexuality is a thing and has said that sexualities are made up numerous times in the past. "Being gay is a choice" is not a super straight take, as bisexuals CAN choose to only enter straight relationships and often just assume that is true for everyone else. If someone claims that it is more likely they are bi than straight. I assume you don't know much about Vaush cause you did not know he is pan, but he is also for gender abolishment (i.e. a world where everyone is agender).

[@Xanthelei]

@robertm9631 So he's just wrong. Not the first time, and honestly doesn't change my statement anyway. My entire point was he's incredibly myopic about some things when he has no first hand experience with it, and as an egg he would have that experience. Once I actually started learning beyond the trope what it meant to be trans, my hyper denial Chriatian teenage self still wouldn't have agreed with the idea that a trans person had a choice in the matter. And I've watched Vaush for about a year now, but no, I don't tend to keep tabs on the sexuality of the KZbinrs I watch. That's their personal life, I feel like it's kinda creepy to catalogue that kind of thing. I just remember he has interest in both guys and gals.

[@Xanthelei]

@robertm9631 And a secondary, seperate thing, he's welcome to be agender if he likes, I'm a guy. Abolishing gender in any meaningful way isn't gonna change that, but that's also a sort of myopic take on how people can/should interact with gender.

[@prohikikomo]

vaush ur one of the good moids ❤

[@oo-vivian]

only good straight man fr . . .

[@prohikikomo]

​@@oo-vivianhes the only good straight man because he isn't straight

[@The_Flexiloquent_Frog]

@@oo-vivian he’s actually pan

[@mrmaniac3]

@@oo-vivian yeah vaush is the straightest, and the goodest

[@oo-vivian]

@@The_Flexiloquent_Frog hes straight in spirit

[@laurapills]

i feel like the original tweet kinda implied normal het men tbh

[@WowzaBowser]

You will be picked dont worry

[@IndependentObserver]

Jokes on you, Jocat named over a 100 women, on a stream, like a week ago. The stream is recorded on youtube, the title is "JoCat Plays FFXIV Dawntrail - Part 3 - 9/6/24" he starts naming them at 2:32:35

[@kawallabair3216]

The idea that you love women is a problem to begin with. You love specific people in your life, not an abstract general concept.

[@VooshSpokesman]

Love from a Suris and Shark3ozero fan!

[@L4Vo5]

At least the origin of the bear trend was actually a conversation about mysoginy. But in this one people were getting mad over, and I quote, "i think lesbians and heterosexual men should get along over their mutual fondness for women", for not daring to consider mysoginy

[@stevezelaznik5872]

It has the same structure as what JD Vance is doing: “I told a lie to start an important conversation.” I doubt anybody who says “I choose the bear” would actually feel safer in the woods if they saw a bear on the trail. They’re lying. This is how our tribal politics goes. To show you’re on the “good” side of the debate you have to pretend to believe the lie.

[@britishrocklovingyank3491]

Learn to love yourself and all the bullshit falls away. I know who I am and I know what I know so what other people say about is meaningless. To quote Ru Paul. "If you don't love yourself how the hell can you love someone else?" and while we are at it, "Other people's opinion of me are none of my business."

[@Summonergeek]

I used to hang out exclusively at gay clubs. I hung with the lesbians. This was 20 years ago. One of them is still one of my best friends and I absolutely love her. It is about love.

[@niaxeno]

The replies here are legitimately dumb as fuck. Essentialism is not when you make a generalization, it's when you make a generalization that you imply is inherent or unchanging. No one has said that.

[@termint2113]

Thank you

[@RailheadProductions]

Finally, an actual reasonable comment in this rathole of a comment section.

[@EvanWantsJam]

Holy Hell, thank you for restoring my faith in humanity.

[@romanr9883]

The us women’s soccer team

[@LyleTheyHitThePentagon]

Men try to be normal challenge - impossible

[@bradleyrutledge]

Doing well so far in that

[@nathancourtney94]

"decent" would probably be a better word than "normal" if the typical behavior for men is unacceptable

[@katobytes]

what is normal?

[@NCC-nk1tm]

@@katobytes Are my Jedi robes normal?

[@Hype_Incarnate]

People on the internet not running this tired meme into the ground challenge - impossible.

[@TheDaltonCashShow]

Streaming and uploading at the same time

[@michaeljmyers1995]

how is that possible?

[@TheDaltonCashShow]

@@michaeljmyers1995 while I don't know how Vaush does it. As a KZbinr myself, my guess would be schedule uploads. Upload a video as private and then pre-select a time for it to go public.

[@i-love-comountains3850]

​@@michaeljmyers1995 I'll hazard a guess that there is a team of sorts. Surely he can't do all of it himself.

[@dudu28r81]

​@@i-love-comountains3850Iirc he just has his editor that cuts then uploads the vids. Vaush himself doesn't really engage with their creation much. It's why you don't really see him in comments either.

[@sammckenney8163]

He has editors

[@jaska-jalmarixvi5757]

1 tove jansson 2 my mom 3 your mom 4 angela merkel 5 angela white 6 blondie 7 joan jett 8 ella hollywood (rip) 9 10 mama theresa

[@zhouyongkang5331]

1. J. K. Rowling 2. Suzanne Collins 3. Marie Antoinette 4. Mary Magdalene 5. Anri Okita 6. Kaho Shibuya 7. Hitomi Tanaka 8. Isabella I of Castile 9. Krystal Ball 10. Margaret Thatcher

[@Xeridanus]

@@zhouyongkang5331 5-7, I see you're a man of culture too.

[@ausername8699]

I'm a straight cis guy and I recently started a bi girl. It's honestly one of the best relationships I've ever been in. We don't have this awkward barrier we feel we need to have, and she's just the sweetest and most understanding person I've ever dated. Idk, maybe guys just need to take social skills classes and date bi girls.

[@NebulaSon]

But that bi woman would never date a bi man. So no! I'm dating straight women only.

[@BiggieChungulus]

Don't blame us we're emotional 😭

[@diegomo1413]

Hot take: “hating everyone equally” (i.e. being a misanthrope) is worse than being discriminatorily bigoted. At least people in the latter category like _some_ people.

[@anitaremenarova6662]

That is indeed a hot take, I'd much rather be friends with a doomer than a hltlerite

[@drek273]

I agree

[@i-love-comountains3850]

For me it's "I'm completely unbiased with my willingness and ability to hate shitty people" when I say "I hate everybody equally" as a TealDeer.

[@i-love-comountains3850]

FWIW I also despise misanthropes which, humorously, keeps my record at 100% for 'hating everybody equally' 😅

[@Tester-sh1mn]

Hitler liked some people! ARE TOU SAYING YOU LIKE HITLER?!?! /s

[@dougmhd2006]

The deeper question (for me, at least 😊) is, "When you talk about 'love', do you mean 'genuine, lasting romantic love' or just plain 'hot, stinky hoompa-hoompa'? Enquiring minds like mine would like to know... ...OK, not really. But it would be fun to ask. Just to mess with the other person's mind.

[@botanbutton]

I was trying to explain to my male co-worker today that because men make women their whole existence is why they can't be happy. He did at least think about it. He's going through a bitter divorce and he's already hopping into possible relationships with women that were friends. Smh. I told him, "just be alone for a little while. learn about you. take care of you. hang out with your sons more. you rely on the companionship of women too much for all your mental, emotional, and physical needs."

[@FrenkieWest32]

I kind of fail to see how this is a man thing. Plenty of women do this too?

[@DJ-wl5qo]

Herp derp men bad

[@an0bserver2000]

strongly disagree with the idea that being cis or trans isnt innate and immutable. i didnt choose to be this way and my entire life people have been trying to influence me *out* of being trans, not into it. and theres a ton of data to back these claims up. whereas the idea that being trans can be the product of your environment or social situation has like... the ROGD study to back it up. and if im not mistaken vaush has gone over that and its follow up study on stream so he should know how dogwater they are. kinda disapointing.

[@sammckenney8163]

I think he's more talking about it from a gender abolitionist standpoint

[@Sitbear]

@@an0bserver2000 If I didn’t grow up in a liberal environment there is ZERO chance I’d identify as non-binary, even internally. Having options causes people to explore them.

[@hulkmt]

(the way you described) your experiences simply dont go against anything vaush said, also if gender is socially constructed, its impossible for 'transnes' to be inate, and that would obviously change somehow over time (depending from person to person)

[@an0bserver2000]

@@hulkmt please explain how gender being a social construct means you can influence people into, or out of, being trans. it really sounds like this argument is just "conversion therapy but woke".

[@an0bserver2000]

@@Sitbear you'd still be non binary. you just wouldnt have had a word for it until later in life.

[@DanuelNuel]

I sometimes wonder how bad male relationship Voish have in school.

[@markmilne765]

I don't even need to go to A.D.: 1. Hatshepsut 2. Nefertiti 3. Sappho 4. Cleopatra I 5. Cleopatra II 6. Cleopatra III 7. Cleopatra IV 8. Cleopatra V 9. Cleopatra VI 10. Cleopatra VII - Caesar's squeeze

[@bringthesalsa5310]

lmfao

[@senormacaco2834]

I like women :D

[@zhouyongkang5331]

Oh? Well, then name 10 women right now.

[@senormacaco2834]

@@zhouyongkang5331 My mom, my sister, my older cousin, my slightly less older cousin, my aunt, my other aunt, my grandma, my other grandma, my younger cousin, and Hillary Clinton.

[@zhouyongkang5331]

@@senormacaco2834 gg

[@poluv9898]

​@@senormacaco2834women in your family don't have names?

[@senormacaco2834]

@@poluv9898 We dont believe in those

[@maynardwayward12]

I LOVE MARY SHELLEY AND JENNA JAMESON

[@JohnDeBrazen]

I’ve certainly known lesbians who buy into that dynamic to be fair

[@nochillwill4667]

NGL, of course, guys don't know and / or are not capable of loving women because we can't / don't know how to love ourselves. Most guys have that part of us killed off growing up, and when your very being is disposable, what can you value?

[@katy2176-p3m]

don't most guys have moms who love them?

[@nochillwill4667]

@katy2176-p3m best case scenario, she is the only one, and that is if her idea of love isn't toxic or comes with strings attached. Worse case scenario, she is the one that killed your ability to love because she needed an emotional / mental / physical / **xual punching bag for about 18+ years more than you needed to be a functional member of society.

[@katy2176-p3m]

@@nochillwill4667 ok but unless you think every guy whos criminal has some mom we can blame, some of these guys were loved by a mother...but that wasn't enough for them? and tbh, I think it's other men teaching men they are disposable more often than not.

[@nochillwill4667]

@katy2176-p3m I wasn't bringing up criminals (to which you're correct). I was referring to the average guy who, from adolescence, was made to ignore most emotions outside of anger and stoicism. Due to this neglect of other emotions (reinforced by the patriarchy, by both other men and women), the ability to understand and use these emotions is greatly stunted. So, is it no surprise guys suck at relationships when guys aren't built for them and have to learn later under hostile conditions. It's like asking why the guy who just got out of a wheelchair a week ago sucks at running a marathon? It's kinda obvious and cruel to ask.

[@botanbutton]

@@nochillwill4667 I'm sad for most guys. I'm so glad my mom is my mom because my little brother is stellar at relationships. He was encouraged to show emotions and talk frankly about anything and everything. I'll never forget how she bought him some little mermaid pajamas. They were teal green footie pajamas with Ariel, Flounder and Sebastian covering them. He was like...6 at the time, so he loved that movie, and he loved those pajamas, and my mom loved that he loved them. She didn't shove X-men or Spiderman pajamas on him. When he would cry, he'd get held and patted, like the child that he was (me too of course lol). When he wet the bed (which was a habit he had for a while), she showed him how to remake his bed, put his clothes in the laundry basket and tell her the next day. My mom showed all forms of love to us, and now my little brother in particular is able to replicate that in his relationships, platonically or romantically. He sees women as people. It's obvious to me that his fiancé, his friends, his co-workers, ex co-workers, far away family and friends ADORE him.

[@mrmaniac3]

There's a good 7 and a half minute vid breaking down the lesbians being more abusive misconception, it's "Lesbians and domestic violence?? Is it the HIGHEST of all Couples?" by the channel "Katherine Sloan, Pride Therapy"

[@joshuaraymer1705]

That video doesn't really debunk anything at all, it just kind of worms around the statistics to get a few better sounding results. Literally the very first thing that happens in this video is Katherine stating that: 1. This statistic is lifetime (true) 2. 1/3rd of the lesbians in that statistic reported abuse from men before becoming lesbians (true) 3. If you assume that that's the only instance of abuse in their entire lifetime for all of those lesbians, then lesbians are only slightly more likely to experience domestic abuse than heterosexual couples (why would you assume this and how does this debunk the point) She then goes on to concede that lesbians do actually commit more violence but that they don't if you restrict the data to only defining violence as "severe injury" or "attacks with a knife" which like, I don't know. Sure I guess? It's still a problem.

[@rockmycd1319]

@@joshuaraymer1705So is the stat true or not?

[@joshuaraymer1705]

@@rockmycd1319 The stat that lesbians commit DV at at least the same rate as het couples is true, yes. It could be higher, but that can't be known for certain

[@mrmaniac3]

@@joshuaraymer1705 I'm wondering why you're making that assumption. That's specifically talking about IPV, as in violence perpetrated only by their romantic/sexual partners, not overall abuse. And it's only subdividing the sex of the abusive party. So about 1/3 includes male partners before they came out and 2/3 is exclusively from the actual lesbian relationships. Which makes sense, a random sample of a little less than 120 lesbians, the ones who did respond as having experienced IPV, the majority would have experienced it from only women, and some will have experienced it from either a mix, or from exclusively men. That's all that info is breaking down in that instance, so it's not measuring the prevalence/amount of IPV. You misheard/misread, so again I'm wondering why you assume what you did. Anyway moving on from that to your second point, she isn't conceding lesbians commit more violence. At this part of the video, she is talking about a different measurement/breakdown, this time talking about the lifetime prevalence of violence against the victim. For lesbians exclusively experiencing violence from partners that are women, the percent would be, as she says, ~19% (taking away the 1/3 from the breakdown of sex of partner, as that includes men and women) which is less than the hetero percent at 23.6%. The total % for lesbians is higher at 29.4% including the third, specifically meaning lesbians experience more abuse than the hetero women surveyed. The highest prevalence is among bisexual women, so that shows bi women experience more IPV than lesbian and hetero women. The lowest prevalence is, of course, lesbian women who have only had women partners. It is of course a really small amount of lesbians surveyed. After that, she talks about the table that breaks down the types of abuse experienced, and some of these types of abuse are too low to be recorded among the 118 total lesbians, including 🔪 and 🔫. That isn't restricting the data, as you can still pause and see types of abuse that were high enough to be recorded among the lesbians. It seems you have misunderstood her breakdown of the relevant survey data, which is understandable, it's a short video talking about a lot of information so wires can get crossed. No harm no foul, just make sure you take your time to understand what's being said. IPV is still a problem, and Katherine says such as a problem for lesbians, it's just not one you can say lesbians are more responsible than men for. That's important to understand.

[@mrmaniac3]

@@rockmycd1319 lesbians commit marginally less IPV than the male partners of het women, and experience more of it than het women. That's the TL;DR. and also bi women experience a lot more violence than either.

[@ASolidSnack]

God allo people are so complicated, these discourses are completely incomprehensible

[@mrmaniac3]

Love bein demi 💖

[@imbored6440]

Same.

[@i-love-comountains3850]

Allo? Sorry, I'm still learning this stuff and don't know the distinctions yet. I'm loving that we're finally putting words to these things as humans.

[@imbored6440]

@@i-love-comountains3850 "allo" are people who have the ability to experience romantic love i think.

[@mrmaniac3]

@@i-love-comountains3850 allosexual, which is an umbrella term meaning people who experience sexual attraction (and lack of identification with asexuality)

[@racerdgs]

rare actually based vaush take

[@doug-gimmedome69]

I'm a cisgendered guy who likes women. I like women so much that I refuse to talk about them the way Vaush talks about men.

[@Gloriath1]

And I'm sitting here like "Who the f*** is Mary Curry?" Marie Curie, it ain't that hard. :D Though the Ü is admittedly hard for 'Mericans/English.

[@kiwi_2_official]

first

[@NebulaSon]

So we're going to just act like alot of of straight women don't also hate men?

[@xxLittleCuteixx]

hmmm I wonder what reasons straight women would have to hate men

[@MakNaasfalti-jh4bg]

​@@xxLittleCuteixx name every man

[@crypt5129]

No shit??? That's just not what he was talking about

[@newguy7209]

​@@crypt5129 It would've been a way better direction to take the discourse tho. He's even talked about it before (when he was talking about r/deadbedrooms), so idk why he's not bringing it up again.

[@crypt5129]

@@newguy7209 He talks about it a lot, it's just not what he's talking about here. He's allowed to criticize men too and so that's what he's doing because there's something to criticize

[@sophiebourne4704]

Reddit pilled 🤭

[@madnessends2477]

God Vaush lately has been so dumb regarding this topic lately. The issue wasn’t that there aren’t differences, but rather ppl taking a completely innocuous tweet and becoming incredibly offended and whether or not the two kinds of love are so fundamentally alien and different from each other that they have NO OVERLAP and similarities. Lately Vaush has been like “um actually its fine if ppl engage in essentialism”

[@Tester-sh1mn]

The topic is dumb to begin with in all fairness.

[@truther249]

@@madnessends2477 Why does vaush do this now? I can't find a reasonable explanation other than "maybe he's just burnt out at accomodating insecure men's feelings". And this argument makes a lot of sense considering he's autistic and has had similar problems in the past where he completely misread the tone of intention of situations. So to him this is like "pathetic men try to find excuses to continue being bad" rather than "men who are insecure express their feelings (valid or not) and get made fun of and told to be better"

[@newguy7209]

To be fair, I don't get the impression that he's okay with essentialism. But I feel like he keeps steel-manning these terrible takes to a degree that is outside the scope of the original argument. What bothers me is that he doesn't do that for the male side of the discourse.

[@crypt5129]

He has never once said he's fine with essentialism, he has been very consistently against it

[@termint2113]

@@madnessends2477 There's literally nothing essentialist in saying men are misogynists. Vaush will say that Israelis are fanatic freaks and that conservatives are demons who hate you and don't care about the truth, and none of you will bat an eye even though obviously Israelis who care about Palestine and conservatives who are decent people exist. But the second he says something about men, you guys shit your pants and start screaming about essentialism. Yes, decent men exist, but they're such a minority that "men hate women" is a statement which is true.

[@sebikusik]

The tweet was essentialist, which the author clarified in replies. Vaush goes "none of this is innate" and defends a different position which noone argued against. Feels like it's just being contrarian to disagree with chat.

[@truther249]

@@sebikusik Yeah fr like what is this shit? Is this the majority of what vaush does and I've just been blind to it until now? It's jarring

[@k.jacquottez-y.561]

primo commento

[@endertuber8300]

Una vera compagna

[@ChannelMan434]

But do you loooove women? Amazin.

[@darkphoenix2]

I like women too much

[@fourthspartan5654]

The problem with the original statement is that it isn’t “misogynistic love vs lesbian love”. It’s “heterosexual/man love vs lesbian love”. There is objectively not any delineation between misogynistic men or those who aren’t. Which seems like some pretty shitty essentialism? There’s no way to read that as anything other than “straight men evil, gay women good”. Which isn’t that big of a deal, unlike misogyny it doesn’t meaningfully threaten anyone’s life. However that doesn’t mean it’s beyond criticism. Bad ideas are bad even if they’re marginal. Hence why Vaush criticizes blitler types.

[@rockmycd1319]

“Unlike misogyny it doesn’t meaningfully threaten anyone’s life” Andy Warhol would disagree 🤣

[@Sitbear]

“Doesn’t threaten anyone’s life” have you seen the deaths of despair statistics by any chance?

[@fourthspartan5654]

@@rockmycd1319 I have no idea what you’re talking about.

[@fourthspartan5654]

@@Sitbear You would need to provide evidence that it meaningfully contributed to that statistic.

[@rockmycd1319]

@@fourthspartan5654 Yeah you didn’t have to tell me that lol.

[@dumpsterfriar6732]

I heard Vaush play Fallout: New Vegas once, egg confirmed.

[@HealthyMaxwellRoth]

anything (first)

[@Glacierlune]

This is one thing I solid disagree with vaush on. Most other things I don't have strong opinions on and are mostly informational. Being trans is a large part to do with the proprioception map of your body in your brain. Sometimes it's shaped like the opposite as birth sex. Basically one of the causes of gender disphoria is the miss match between what the body reports and what the brain is expecting. This is why gender disphoria can be so disorienting. Interesting enough, trans people have a higher likelihood of phantom breast/dick of their identified gender. And less lileyhood of developing phantom breast/dick after surgery.

[@kekpustelnik2362]

Agreed 100%, I experience a phantom penis and have since I can remember, at least five years old. Vaush kind of shocked me with his take about no one being "inherently trans or cis". I do feel inherently male, it's a physcial thing, that's why I feel better thanks to hrt, because my body matches my brain better. I feel a lot less uncomfortable just exsisting now.

[@RasmusVJS]

Well, he never said that gender dysphoria doesn't exist, so unless you think that "people with gender dysphoria" = "trans people", then that isn't really relevant. Vaush goes by the definition that in order to be considered a gender, the only thing required is that you identify with that gender. And by that definition, you only "become" trans once you identify with the gender.

[@RasmusVJS]

@@kekpustelnik2362 I don't know if my previous comment was removed, but in case it was, I think it's important to differentiate between the things we associate with being transgender, and the specifics of gender identity. There are absolutely things we associate with being transgender, like gender dysphoria, that are biological. But the fact that these things makes you feel *male* is tied to the social influences you were raised around, and their prescription of gender. And by Vaush's definition of a transgender person, where the only requirement for having a gender identity is self-identifying with that gender, inherently that means that you are only that gender when you identity with it, not before, and not if you change your mind. So, inherently, the definition is purely social, not biological.

[@deur]

yeah, i think he is uneducated here a little

[@an0bserver2000]

@@RasmusVJS "identifying as a gender" is immutable. no one just chooses, or is influenced into, identifying as a certain gender.

[@joeshmoe9690]

Sauce

[@Recloste31]

I like how some guys online are like "men are *insert derogatory or insulting stuff here*". Like, you are a man too, do you do that stuff bro? Make no mistake here, you could just say conservative men and encompass like 99% of men who actually behave like this without coming off as weirdly self hatey and 'pick me' like.

[@purplewine7362]

True but vaush wants to be picked so bad.

[@truther249]

@@Recloste31 Damn it's like generalising these behaviours to all men is actually quite bad abd creates harmful stereotypes that go both ways. Oh well

[@LightGlyphRasengan]

But it's not just conservative men that come off as cruel or abusive at women. There's plenty of liberal and left leaning men that tout feminist ideas, but still have anti women behaviors. It may not be a number as big as conservatives (idk if there's a stat for this, there most likely is), but it does no one any favors to not call out men from the left side of the political spectrum when they're being abusive towards women

[@NebulaSon]

​@@LightGlyphRasenganOkay and there's plenty of women with anti male behaviors. I'm pretty sure you would still be against this if someone was saying this about women.

[@LightGlyphRasengan]

@NebulaSon suuuure, but there's still a societal power dynamic that comes into play when men are abusive. They have more power and capability to harm women than women tend to. Ya know, the statistics that show men are the perpetrators of the most harm when it comes to gendered violence? That doesn't mean men are inherently violent, again it's a societal issue.

[@sugarysweet07]

Vaush's audience suddenly going "hey, that's not fair" when he rightfully criticizes men is exhausting

[@thepicausno5561]

"rightfully criticizes men" and it's stating they are less capable of love or some weird shit.

[@sugarysweet07]

@@thepicausno5561 That's not what he said, but okay.

[@johnsmithers958]

Essentialism is bad actually and he’s doing that Also I love how he tries to portray himself as one of the few good men yet he conveniently ignores the fact that he once sexually harassed a woman telling her that he would prolapse her a*nus

[@Kickiusz]

To be fair, realizing that half of society (not to mention probably the half you're romantically interested in) have this almost innate fear of your sex, to the point you're often treated as a potential rapist despite you doing literally nothing to deserve that, is a tough pill to swallow. And I'm not saying women shouldn't prioritize their safety for the sake of some bruised egos or anything like that, I'm just saying that I get why one could have this knee-jerk reaction. But I agree, ehxausting it is.

[@Sitbear]

I mean, he provided no evidence. Women initiate most breakups and divorces, so at least statistically you’d guess that men are more invested in relationships than women.

[@blackwatch4471]

Okay what's up with Vaush and this topic. Like is he trying to prove something? He hasn't been like this before but now he's intentionally being inflammatory and dissmisive about topics around men like this. What happened?

[@methuselah8885]

Look through the comments and see how divided the response is. That's the value in talking about it. He says that the left should think of men's issues too but part of that is addressing that there might be some problems with how men are taught to behave, and that is fixable and makes the world more pleasant for everyone.

[@truther249]

@@blackwatch4471 Idk he's just been getting more dismissive towards men's feelings. One theory is that he's getting sick of "appeasing pathetic insecure men", which is almost understandable, but that is also literally his job? Because when he does stuff like this it promotes the message "men bad, make fun of them until they get better" to thousands of people who start actually believing this and cause harm? Vaush should grow up himself out of this stupid phase

[@crypt5129]

He has literally always been like this, what are you on about

[@Smoochy1074]

This is the same question I had for quite a while

[@pepelag7278]

He’s trying to impress some feminist probably. I’m not joking. Meanwhile when he was “friendly” with people like Sh0e he would be more fair about topics like this lol

[@FoxhoundIbby]

Nah, I'd love.

[@Darth_Insidious]

What even was this video?

[@robertm9631]

Unrelated clips crushed together just for the sake of posting something.

[@purplewine7362]

Vaush continuing on his pick-me boy arc

[@poluv9898]

For stating facts?

[@KissSlowlyLoveDeeply-pm2je]

abuse between lesbian couples is very high though.

[@Khornelia]

Thats not actually true, those claims originated from a misinterpretation of a study that didnt account for whether the abuse was done in a lesbian relationship because it asked wether the participants had ever experienced domestic abuse in their LIFETIME.

[@poluv9898]

They were abused mostly by males

[@drewmarteny1495]

Generic comment for the algo

[@StruggleGaming]

Now that's a wild take. Personally seems like a skill issue. 🎉

[@Bonaboo]

I love how many of these comments are proving Vaush’s point. “I started becoming resentful of women because they wouldn’t give me access to their bodies/love/friendship/time.” You don’t hear women say stuff like that. If they become resentful towards men, it’s because of actual negative behaviour.

[@sulljason]

The inverse does happen, but probably not as often. At least not as apparent in our culture. It could just go unnoticed.

[@blackwatch4471]

Literally what comment is saying that? Is it in your head? Where did you read those comments?

[@Urfin_DjusEN]

​@@blackwatch4471 shesh don't destroy their precious strawnman

[@NebulaSon]

Nobody here said that. And yes women do say things like that.

[@justsomeguy6336]

Well no it’s because women have too high standards.

[@Sitbear]

*says a bunch of sexist things* “but none of this is essential!” oh ok glad that clears it up.

[@Bonaboo]

“Sexist” lmao

[@karaltar7914]

„when you’re privileged equality feels like opression“

[@Sitbear]

@@karaltar7914 “you’re a wizard, Harry!” seems like an equally relevant response

[@karaltar7914]

@@Sitbear to you maybe, but don’t project.

[@Sitbear]

@@karaltar7914 Do you even know what projection means? Not only is what you’re saying wrong and unsupported, it doesn’t even make sense. I just said your quote isn’t relevant. There’s nothing to project.

[@sub-harmonik]

and women don't resent men? is the way we judge gendered resentment solely based on 'systemic power structures'?

[@notreal-duh]

the resentment women have towards men is a lot more complicated because some of that resentment is unwarranted, and a lot of that resentment is completely fair. it makes sense that we don’t judge it the same way

[@sugarysweet07]

This is like getting mad at POC for being frustrated at white people. I'm sorry, but after being treated monstrously throughout all of time by the power structures men built and have enacted, and continue to enforce, women are more justified to resent men than the reverse.

[@laurencedavid-raynault6880]

Wouldn't that be further argument for lesbian love being stronger on average thought?

[@dynamicworlds1]

​@@laurencedavid-raynault6880I don't think he thought about what he was saying that much...

[@trippingthelight]

I don't understand, what else would there to be resentful over other than power imbalance?

[@OscarAntonio-t4z]

Mmmm...I prefered you in your "yeah im leftist but women are annoying" phase, V

[@certifiedcyclepath]

If this isn’t satire you’re part of the problem

[@OscarAntonio-t4z]

@@certifiedcyclepath Its satire but I cant lie i'm also part of the problem lol

[@asherroodcreel640]

​@@OscarAntonio-t4zsamzies

[@june.bourque]

@@asherroodcreel640 ??

[@june.bourque]

@@OscarAntonio-t4z ??

[@AndroidAccountant]

Useless segment. Waste of time

[@RailheadProductions]

I must say, the best part of the recent videos about men is the comment sections full of "leftist/liberal" men becoming absolutely irrational and resorting to gamergate era talking points, it really is a sight to behold

[@PinocchioDread]

I’ve never heard Vaush explain why men hate women, usually because that premise is false

[@Katharoni]

There are a lot of men that hate women, obviously not all of them though. He doesn't believe that either, because he's a man. A man that loves women.

[@notreal-duh]

its caused by a complex mix of genetic and environmental factors. there is truth to the premise

[@trippingthelight]

really? iirc he goes into it all the time. especially when talking about fascism.

[@june.bourque]

? No, pff

[@anitaremenarova6662]

Hate is a strong word, incels hate women but the average man is indifferent towards them. Trophy wife is a term for a reason, most men view women as status symbols/nannies in a detached kind of way.

[@davitdavid7165]

This is why i respect lesbains so much. I can only aspire to love as well as they can

[@thepicausno5561]

Dude WTF do you mean "aspire to love like them"?? Why would you really think you aren't as capable of feeling love, are you okay????

[@davitdavid7165]

@@thepicausno5561 nah, but i just like the archetype, if that makes sense. I do agree with vaush that the hight of love knows no gender

[@rockmycd1319]

@@davitdavid7165And what is that archetype?

[@purplewine7362]

​@@thepicausno5561victim of vaush's pick-me boyism

[@jbone3777]

Calling vaush a a creep is just facts

[@markd.s.8625]

youre a weirdo just going by your visible comment history

[@anitaremenarova6662]

Calling vaush based is just facts

[@an0bserver2000]

calling vaush vaush is just facts

[@zhouyongkang5331]

Calling vaush voosh is just facts

[@paulblichmann2791]

Honestly i would have blanked out after Marie Curie. 100 years and STILL the best the female sex has ever offered.

[@poluv9898]

There were much more powerful/intelligent women. Most of them haven't got a chance to prove themselves as they were married off as literal children.

[@VagueVanadate]

I don't think I resent or despise them, at least not in an actively hateful sense. It's more ... confused, haha. Perhaps you could argue that what confuses me I don't like? But at the same time I'm attracted to them regardless? I'm not sure. I think I could be friends with basically any (straight) man, if only because he is more likely (in my experience) to have similar interests and thought processes as me. Most of the women in my life, even the ones I care deeply about, have fairly different interests compared to me and often approach problems in a way that would never even occur to me. It's not even that there is necessarily a right or wrong answer to those situations; it's just definitely not what I, my brothers, or father would do or say. This is how you end up with some women that I love and would give everything for when it comes down to it, but... don't super duper 'like' on a more mundane day-to-day time scale. It's not logical, oh well.

[@anitaremenarova6662]

Yeah I get you, the hate is born when guys like us that never had close female friends get radicalized and the simple lack of familiarity gets twisted into negative feelings to try and explain away our problems.

[@SoHungry666]

This is literally mansplaining.

[@MarshallTheArtist]

He's talking to other men about men.

[@rockmycd1319]

@@MarshallTheArtistSo mansplaining to men

[@MarshallTheArtist]

@@rockmycd1319 That's not what mansplaining is. By definition, it's condescending to women. That's the entire point.

[@rockmycd1319]

@@MarshallTheArtist The definition has changed. Get with the times boomer.

[@MarshallTheArtist]

@@rockmycd1319 according to you and no one else.

[@RHLW]

"Men arent a made certain way, its just the influence of patriarchy, etc". And yet male dominated systems just pop up again and again in different societies and time periods. Its a hell of a coincidence, I mean what are the chances.

[@deur]

"humans are naturally fascistic, again and again it pops up in different societies and times, i mean what are the chances "

[@RHLW]

@@deur Hardly the same frequency of occurence, is it? But are humans naturally "tribal", and is almost the entire worldwide history of all societies tribal? Yeah. Almost as if what youre describing is just an extreme example of a natural phenomenon.

[@deur]

@@RHLW i wonder if you can apply similar logic and find similar reasons for male dominated systems appearing

[@RHLW]

@@deur So you didnt understand the meaning behind by original comment, I see. Ok.

[@deur]

@@RHLW did i? unironically rn, can you explain please, eng is not my main language, our arguments online dont mean anything anyway, but i would prefer to understand things

[@herec0mestheCh33f]

If you get upset about this it's because you don't understand the nuance of the discourse

[@Zer0.-_]

As a cis man I have a love-hate relationship with women. There is a lot to unpack and a lot of guys have very different reasons for why they feel the way they feel about women. For me, no matter how polite, friendly, are different in my approach I am with certain types that I have always been most attracted to, they won't even give me the time of day. It tends to create resentment. It's just one of those things.

[@anitaremenarova6662]

It's not just about approach, the setting and how you look is also important.

[@Sitbear]

@@BonabooThat is not what he said. At all.

[@Zer0.-_]

@@Bonaboo I'm upset that I wasn't blessed with "Chad" looks to get the beautiful blonde athletic types and it upsets me that I cannot even get as much as a glance from them, yes. I am just upset with how superficial dating is and how some people are where they demand absolutely perfect looks. This is in the context of using dating websites, not approaching randoms unsolicited on the street Take that how you want it, but I am still a passionate progressive who fights for women's equality and rights despite my personal romantic problems with them.

[@vidyagaems4063]

Akshuly, lesbian relationships are statistically the most unstable and split up at a drop of a hat. So not loving women but just wanting a relationship with one is, in fact, very lesbian-like. Conversely, the truest love is only possible between two men. A woman can only experience this kind of unconditional, loyal love by transitioning into a man first.

[@doooofus]

didnt taylor swift come out as a lesbian in her new song "Rainbow Dress" though? the intro doesnt make a lot of sense imo

[@97hondacivic]

calling her marie curie instead of marie sklodowska-curie is cringe and lowkey sexist. she chose to keep her last name but you think that her husband's last name is more important? maybe just say "pierre curie's wife" next time?

[@nathancourtney94]

I don't think people know her name and that's the reasoning.

[@VagueVanadate]

The trouble I have is that I'm too dumb to correctly pronounce the polish with any consistency.

[@dudu28r81]

I had no idea she even had another name. Maybe that's why lol

[@rockmycd1319]

This is just a roundabout way of forcing the Polish language down everyone’s throats. Nice try stripper pole

[@melaniey.5596]

Not gonna lie, imo identifying a woman as “this man’s wife” is even more sexist than identifying them by the wrong last name. Their identity is even more subjugated to their husband by omitting their name. So I think Vaush is fine.

[@RavenDravenek]

3:06 “The Left needs this election to be a personality contest, not a policy contest…” Well isn’t that the pot calling the kettle *suddenly* black

[@MakNaasfalti-jh4bg]

2:50 I do like that we finally stop pretending that jocats goon stash is somehow a moral virtue

[@d4mterro320]

Did she pick you lil bro? Revive your channel god damn

[@whirlwhind666]

0:40 I'd be careful about framing it as purely associative. There's also a deeply personal, sometimes biological component.

[@rosestrohm7986]

This is transmedicalist talk. Gender doesn't have shit to do with biology, it's a social construct and whatever you identify as is what you are

[@whirlwhind666]

@@rosestrohm7986 But why would you wanna ignore hard evidence? Testosterone and estrogen influence not only physical traits but also how people feel and experience gender. It’s not the whole picture but to pretend biology has no role is ignoring the facts. I get the cultural pushback against biological determinism, but my point wasn’t about limiting personal freedom. I don’t want biology to define everything but I think we should acknowledge its role for the sake of depth in how we understand identity.

[@whirlwhind666]

@@rosestrohm7986 I wouldn’t call it transmedicalism because that viewpoint tends to insist on medical or biological criteria to validate trans identities which is bullshit. It’s obviously more nuanced than that. I’m just saying biology plays a role in gender, not that it defines or limits someone’s identity. Would be good if Vaush addressed the whole picture.

[@synchronium24]

Social constructionism is the one leftist axiom Vaush has yet to shed.

[@june.bourque]

@@whirlwhind666 then talk you paper tiger

[@JohnGiuglianoGiugliano]

Vaush remember how you treated Poppy?

[@crypt5129]

What is this comment meant to prove